Bidam: let the scripture also speak for itself on this matter...

Or is it only I and Barnabas who must work for a living? Who serves as a soldier at his own expense? Who plants a vineyard and does not eat of its grapes? Who tends a flock and does not drink of the milk? Do I say this merely from a human point of view? Doesn't the Law say the same thing? For it is written in the Law of Moses: "Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain." Is it about oxen that God is concerned? Surely he says this for us,doesn't he? Yes, this was written for us, because when the plowman plows and the thresher threshes, they ought to do so in the hope of sharing in the harvest. If we have sown spiritual
seed among you, is it too much if we reap a material harvest from you?…Don't you know that those who work in the temple get their food from the temple, and those who serve at the altar share in what is offered on the altar? In the same way, the Lord has commanded that those who preach the gospel should receive their
living from the gospel. (1 cor 9 v. 6-11, 13-14; NIV)

In addition, Paul goes so far as to say, "The elders who do good work as leaders should be considered worthy of receiving double pay, especially those who work hard at preaching and teaching" (1 Timothy 5:17, GNT). Some translations read, "double honor"(KJV, NIV, etc.), but this is clearly wrong, since the very next verse says, "For the Scripture says, 'Do not muzzle the ox while it is treading out the grain,' and 'The worker deserves his wages'" (v. 18, NIV). The context is about money, or paying the ministers what they deserve.

9icetoo:
That which paul was talking about i believe was not TITHE! He was talking about offerings. Offerings you give out of free will. He wasnt talking about any ten percent bruhaha. Please. Be properly guided.

St.Ola:


Oops @ penticost. I believe you typed that in error. That's a Christian event.

Candour:

haba gun and cutlass? even the apostles disputed but it didn't result in fisticuffs.Acts 15:7
i just DECORUM will be maintained

St.Ola:


Yes that's true. I reckon Christemmbassey was referring to the Jewish pentecost feast celebrating the giving of the law (ten commandments) on mount sinai. I was referring to the descent of the holy spirit on the disciples that happened on a pentecost day, and is celebrated in Christianity for that particular significance.

Among pastors there is a terrible abuse of using law tithing to place the church back under the condemnation of the law. This must be stopped (Titus 1:11). Jesus taught the church of Paul’s dispensation a better way of giving without the law.

Below are some reasons you should stop law tithing.

1. We are not under the law of tithing
Tithing was part of the law. We are no longer under it. (Rom 6:14)

2. The law of tithing is weak
A required tithe does not change the heart or the action. (Mat 23:23, Gal 4:9, Rom 8:3)

3. The law tithe is beggarly
Law tithing always requests more. It is not a gift. It is merely fulfilling an obligation (Gal 4:9)

4. There is no Levitical priesthood today
The most popular tithe today is the tithe that went to the Levitical priesthood (Num 18:21). There is no Levitical priesthood today.

5. The pastor does not replace the priest
Preachers and teachers in the body of Christ church are not priests. Christ is the only mediator (1 Tim 2:5).

6. We do not inherit Israel’s land
The tithe given to the Levites was because they had no land inheritance (Numbers 18:21).

5. There are no more temple sacrifices
Since Christ paid it all there is no need to pay (tithe) someone else to do this service.

6. The local church does not replace the temple
Know ye not that you are the temple of God not your building! ( 1 Cor 3:16)

7. The church does not observe required feast day celebrations
It was three times a year in Deut 16:16. At certain feast days is where the tithes would be offered. One tithe even allowed you to stay home and spend it on what you desired (Deut 14:26).

8. Law tithing requirements were greater than 10 percent
Deut 14:28 is one example of the tithe on the increase every 3 years that was above the regular Levitical tithe. There are other required offerings also according to Mal 3:9.

9. Christ has given the church all spiritual blessings
Those blessings are in heavenly places in Christ (Eph 1:3)

10. God provides all our needs without tithing
Phil 4:19 says your needs are supplied according to his riches in glory in Christ. What you need is not physical it is spiritual.

11. Law tithing obligates the doer to the entire law – Gal 5:3, James 2:10

12. Peace with God is attained without tithing - Romans 5:1

13. We work to provide for our needs in this dispensation
Paul makes it clear that if we don’t work we don’t eat (2 Thess 3:10). Mat 6:11 and Mal 3:10 are not effective today. If we do not provide for our own today we are “worse than an infidel (1 Tim 5:8 )

14. The tithe was required
Giving today is not “of necessity” (2 Cor 9:7). This is an important distinction between generosity and obligation.

15. The law tithe places you under a curse
If you do not continue tithing then you can be cursed (Gal 3:10)

16. Christ has redeemed you from the law of tithing
Law tithing represents ignorance or negligence of Christ’s cross (Gal 3:13, 1 Cor 1:17, Gal 2:21).
“I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain. ” – Gal 2:21

Editor’s note:
This resource is not intended to dissuade giving generously to the Lord’s causes. God loves generosity as a reflection of your thanksgiving to Him. While this resource explains why Paul’s doctrine teaches you to stop law tithing, God does not teach lesser generosity.
“Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver.” – 2 Cor 9:7

christemmbassey: BIG ERROR, 'PENTECOST' has NEVER been, CAN NEVER be and WILL NEVER BE a christian event. Pls read ur bible. Love and Peace.

kramer:

Do you then know why the church didn't take tithes? Because from what I understand it wasnt practiced in earlier churches (and am sure they knew better) before the Catholics brought it back centuries later.

Goshen360: your puffed up attitude no wan make me answer you..shey you don claim say na you sabi scripture pass..ok even if i answer..you go stilL fInD one way twist am to suIt your "BIG EGO".THATS NOT THE SPIRIT OF HUMILITY MY BROTHER.











Bidam, please don't dodge what you requested that I show you from scriptures o and be answering with thise below o,


I'm waiting for an answers after I have answered you question o or them go sabi me and you for this forum\thread.

alexleo:

SHUT UP MY FRIEND! YOU ARE JUST VOMITING TRASH. IF I TALK ABOUT MY CHURCH ON NAIRALAND WHY DOES IT MAKE YOU MAD. YES I OPENED A THREAD ABOUT MY CHURCH AND WHAT ABOUT IT? NOSENSE. AND SINCE THEN U VE BEEN THE ONE WRITING ABOUT MY CHURCH EACH TIME I CONFRONT YOUR FOOLISHNESS AND REBELLION. EVEN WHEN I POST ON ANY TOPIC YOU LL QUICKLY MENTION MY CHURCH. OF COURSE ITS SUCH AGENTS OF SATAN AS YOU WHO THINKS HE KNOWS THE BIBLE MORE THAN OTHERS THAT I LL CONTINUE TO CONFRONT WHEN YOU DISPLAY YOUR BIBLE MISQUOTING AND MISINTERPRETING MADNESS.

Goshen360: The most dangerous Christians are those who MIX Judaism with Christianity under the New Covenant. Such are one of the major problems facing Christianity since the foundation and time of the Apostles till now. They quote Malachi 3:10,

Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it.

and many of them still live in debt. Many of them are still far from what the promises of the blessings in this verse alone brings. Many of them are still borrowing from friends and families. Many of them can't feed on what the love to eat but whatever that is available is what they eat. Hmmmmm, God is NOT a liar! If God said in this verse, He will open the windows AND POUR YOU OUT BLESSINGS....that will translate into THERE SHALL BE NO MORE ROOM OR SPACE TO RECEIVE SUCH BLESSINGS and you've paying tithe without any of this evidence, it means something is wrong somewhere, if you believe God is not a liar.

Do you even understand the potency of the promise of blessing contained here in the text? Why then are you paying tithe for years and still, people have not seen that you don't have no room or space to contain much blessings. We should have seen that you do no have space anymore for parking your cars, you should not have got space for your private jets, there should be no space or room for storing these blessings to the extend of no room for it anymore. If these is not happening as evidence of the blessings poured out, it means either God is lying or something is wrong somewhere but we are certain, God is NOT a liar!

What then 'could' be wrong? Such people who obey one part of the law and don't obey the other are actually the ones operating under curse, not blessings.

GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995)
Certainly, there is a curse on all who rely on their own efforts to live according to a set of standards because Scripture says, "Whoever doesn't obey everything that is written in Moses' Teachings is cursed." - Galatians 3:10

You cannot pick one thing from the law and keep it, leaving others and expect to be blessed. This is why Christ fulfilled the law and launched the Grace under the New Covenant. The Grace of our Lord Jesus under the New Covenant affects every aspect of our lives including our money\finances. Hence, we don't give because we are under a LAW to give, we give because we HAVE the GRACE to give.

Goshen360:

Okay sister, lemme start by stating the basic of our teachings.

We accept the Grace based giving as taught in the New Testament - that is, sharing our income and resources with God's people, the church and the worship places for the advancement of God's kingdom and in keeping up with our other social\family\living responsibilities. This Grace based giving and sharing can be any percentage as a man purpose in his heart to give and we believe therein lies God's blessing because as the earth remains, seed time and harvest shall not cease.

We reject the teachings of 'fixed' or 'legalized' (according to the law of Moses) or 'compulsory' and 'mandatory' of 10% of Christian's monthly income kind of giving called by the name 'tithe'. We believe Hebrews 7 in the entire context ended the Moses law of tithing, that is, tithing according to the law of Moses and tithing before the law of Moses while the teachings of Christ and the Apostles released Christians to free will giving.

This is the simple tenets of our Christian teachings here under Grace and herein we teach the truth of God's word for the Church. The above, if expanded contains bible truth and consistence from Genesis to Revelation. Thank you!

---

christemmbassey: in addition we are NOT AGAINST GIVING TO 'PASTORS', you can give 10% or 100 of whatever but dont call it tithe odawise ud be puting a condemned thing(law of Moses) over and above TREASURE(GRACE) and that is profanity. Remain blessed.

alexleo:

Now we see a confused house here. While two of you agree to freewill offering. A confused and rebellous frosbel kicks against any kind of giving in the church from the posts he has been putting here and cartoons. You people should go and harmonise your stand and spare us the discordant tune. And mind you- we aint gonna stop giving our tithe and offering. Save yourself the stress Goshen360 and christembassy. As for the confused chap(frosbel), let him keep wallowing in his utter foolishness and rebellion. His little mind will be telling him that he is converting A WHOLE LOT OF PEOPLE into his anti-tithe and anti-giving in the church madness when he is actually not doing a pinch. PITY.

Bidam: MAL 3:10..YOU QUOTED..POINT OF CORRECTION OGA GOSHEN..THE BLESSINGS THAT SCRIPTURE IS TALKING ABOUT IS NOT LIMITED TO MATERIAL POSPERITY BUT THE OVERALL WELLBEING OF A BELIEVER..IN MY LITTLE EXPERIENCES AND WALK WITH GOD I KNOW OF TITHER WHO GOD HAS BLESSED WITH ABUNDANCE HEALTH, WISDOM,DIVINE IDEAS, REVELATIONS,TIMELESS PRINCIPLES ON WHAT TO DO AND WHAT NOT TO DO..ETC..ETC..ANOTHER TRANSLATION SAYS FLOODGATES OF HEAVEN..SO YOU SEE..THE HEAVEN KISS THE EARTH WHEN BELIVERS USE THIS SCRIPTURAL TIMELESS PRINCIPLES.

Goshen360:



You mean those blessings promised therein are NOT what will translate into the point that THERE WILL BE NO ROOM TO CONTAIN such blessings Is that what you're saying? When do you or people need room to contain health, wisdom, ideas? The blessings promised in that verse alone make it clear that it is blessing when blessed will translate into a position whereby there will NO MORE SPACE TO CONTAIN SUCH OUTPOURING OF BLESSINGS. Let me remind you using scripture to interpret scriptures, the BLESSINGS (such as promised in malachi 3:10) maketh RICH and adds no sorrow. You see, blessings TRANSLATES into RICHES.....and let me parallel with another scriptures, "And Abram was very RICH in cattle, in silver, and in gold. Genesis 13:2. You telling us Abraham doesn't need space or room to keep his cattles? When Malachi says, there will be NO ROOM to contain such blessing....We all understand English bro.

frosbel:

One of the reasons my wife and I left deeper life was sitting under a 'curse' every Sunday morning when it came to tithe and offering time.

The Pastor's wife will always not forget to make us aware that non-tithers were under a curse. Not until now did we realize how demonic this teaching was , no wonder many churches are void of God's presence with all these doctrine of demons presented as TRUTH.

The moment I began to challenge the pastor meekly on this doctrine among others, my days were numbered in their organisation. You cannot challenge and remain.

No one can buy GOD with money.

Goshen360: ^^^

You no fit talk ni? Prophet Bidam! Abi una wan go do copy and paste again ni? Anyways, I dey here dey wait you sha.

Goshen360:



You mean those blessings promised therein are NOT what will translate into the point that THERE WILL BE NO ROOM TO CONTAIN such blessings Is that what you're saying? When do you or people need room to contain health, wisdom, ideas? The blessings promised in that verse alone make it clear that it is blessing when blessed will translate into a position whereby there will NO MORE SPACE TO CONTAIN SUCH OUTPOURING OF BLESSINGS. Let me remind you using scripture to interpret scriptures, the BLESSINGS (such as promised in malachi 3:10) maketh RICH and adds no sorrow. You see, blessings TRANSLATES into RICHES.....and let me parallel with another scriptures, "And Abram was very RICH in cattle, in silver, and in gold. Genesis 13:2. You telling us Abraham doesn't need space or room to keep his cattles? When Malachi says, there will be NO ROOM to contain such blessing....We all understand English bro.

Bidam: network no forget say na naija i dey..instead of make una come repair this country with the wisdom wey God give una..una go hide for oyibo country dey talk about being your brodas keeper..God dey watch una sha...

Bidam: network no forget say na naija i dey..instead of make una come repair this country with the wisdom wey God give una..una go hide for oyibo country dey talk about being your brodas keeper..God dey watch una sha...

Bidam:

The bleSsing is talking about "capacity"..anYtime you read that scripture connect it with..deut 8 :18..it's God that gives power to create wealth..it's NOT by our efforts like the gentiles...just like seed time and harvest time is a principle..IT applies to malachi...except a grain of wheat falls down and dies it abides alone..give and it shall be given unto YOU..good measure pressed down shaken together and RUNNING OVER shall men give to your bosom..that reminds me..wHen Jesus was talking about in my fathers house are many maNsions..wat do you think he meant? IS IT LITERAL MANSIONS? we all know that spirits do not dwell in mansions made by human hands...and point of correction to have physical cash doesn't connotes riches in the kingdom. i can be rich with divine ideas...which will LATER ON TRANSLATE INTO PROSPERITY IF UTILISED TO THE GLORY OF GOD...DON'T forget satan also gives wealth..remember he tempted Jesus..he is still the god of this world and the accuser of the brethren..agreed CHRIST has redeemed us from the curse of poverty but knowledge alone is not enough without the application of the right keys to unlock the prosperity of the kingdom..giving to GOD IS THE WAY OUT OF POVERTY..YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, MIND AND SOUL THEN YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOUR SELF..remember it did not say the less priveledge first or widows first like all of you are saying..the BIBLE SAYS LOVE THE LORD FIRST...IF I GIVE MY TITHES TO JESUS..THAT SHOWS I LOVE HIM FIRST.

Bidam: network no forget say na naija i dey..instead of make una come repair this country with the wisdom wey God give una..una go hide for oyibo country dey talk about being your brodas keeper..God dey watch una sha...

gzib: @ frosbel, i don't remember when i didn't read my bible at least 2 days consecutively. I always do my brother. For your information i use to talk and speak against men of God until i got convicted to search the words the preachers are preaching BY MYSELF.i am not saying that all they preach i agree with, even the church i attend i don't indulge in things that i am not convicted and otherwise stated in the bible. i have studied most controversial issues in church from the bible and the part that changed my mind about tithes was spoken by JESUS Himself in Matthew 23:23. If KJV is hard to understand try other versions. Tithes should be paid to church, if the pastors decided to use it for anything else other than the right thing then it is for God to judge and not me. I have done my part. I also do good deeds to people that are less privileged that i know or i don't know. God will help us (all) to do the right thing because there is a way that seemeth right to us at the end it leads to judgement.
Thanks my dear friend Frosbel

Goshen360:

Bidam, stop 'spiritualizing' blessing in Malachi 3:10. The effect of that blessing promised there is PHYSICAL. I don't want to go into concordance and Hebrew meaning of the words now but take a shot from one translations,

Darby Bible Translation
Bring the whole tithe into the treasure-house, that there may be food in my house, and prove me now herewith, saith Jehovah of hosts, if I open not to you the windows of the heavens, and pour you out a blessing, till there be no place for it.

Goshen360:

As una dey talk to Christemmabassey for the other thread say na because he no dey pay tithe na eim make 'devourer' dey chop him network......so you wey dey pay tithe sef, devourer don reach ya side ni You dey see ya life? I know say na tithe wey you wan dey collect for your prophetic ministry na eim make you dey greedy dey twist scriptures like this. So devourer dey chop people wey dey pay tithe network too? I thought you guys are armed\immuned from the devourer ni

Bidam:
.the BIBLE SAYS LOVE THE LORD FIRST...IF I GIVE MY TITHES TO JESUS..THAT SHOWS I LOVE HIM FIRST.

Zikkyy:

How did you achieve the giving? You go heaven go drop ya tithe?

Bidam: SO WHAT DO YOU WANT ME TO DO? CARNALISE THE SCRIPTURES? WHATEVA PLACE/ROOM/STOREHOUSE/BANK BALANCE CALL IT WHATEVA YOU LIKE..THE SCRIPTURE IS TALKING ABOUT DIVINE IDEAS, WITTY INVENTIONS AS A BLESSING TO ME..IT ALSO TALKS ABOUT MATERIAL WEALTH NO DOUBT..BUT THATS THE BEAUTY ABOUT GOD HE USES FOOLISH THINGS TO CONFOUND THE WISE.

Bidam: I think say you no go show for this thread..youR love for me is TOUCHING.

Bidam: no mind christemmbassey the pretender...na correct tithe payer he be na..na my bro...you no say i be prophet na...i don see im vision for the heavenlies..