Gbola5:


They fight in formation as light infantry,
equipped with short spears, swords,
round shields, and distinctive spiked
caps. They fight fearlessly and obey
without question.

Lol. Am pretty sure their spears are long. And like I said, their fighting style suits wars not kitchen fights.

Did any one else hear "Khaleesi i'll be your Dragon" in that Tony Montana remix. You should go hear it,i thought i did.

Can't wait for season 6 to start so we stop hearing stuff like

"but it didn't happen like that in the books",

"The books are better",

"The books",

"The books",

"The books".

gj22:


Lol. Am pretty sure their spears are long. And like I said, their fighting style suits wars not kitchen fights.

Some unsullied served as house guards.

gj22:
Can't wait for season 6 to start so we stop hearing stuff like

"but it didn't happen like that in the books",

"The books are better",

"The books",

"The books",

"The books".

Do lets. You think the show will still be cool ?

Gbola5:


Do lets. You think the show will still be cool ?

Well it will certainly be judged on the strength of its own plots, not how it compares to the books. That should be good.

Gbola5:


Do lets. You think the show will still be cool ?

Dude, are you aware of how much you're beginning to sound like some spoilt petulant child crying foul because the other kids won't play by his own rules?

Barristan Selmy is dead, Jorah Mormont has greyscale, and the Sons of the Harpy are super fighting samurai-ninjas. Live with it. Hopefully, soon Jaime Lannister and Bronn the sellsword and Dolorous Edd and Stannis Baratheon and Melisandre will all die too (and maybe Rickon Stark too, cos hey who likes a noisy brat?). And then you will have enough reasons to shout "death for shock value!" and tear your eyes out.

kay9:


Dude, are you aware of how much you're beginning to sound like some spoilt petulant child crying foul because the other kids won't play by his own rules?

Barristan Selmy is dead, Jorah Mormont has greyscale, and the Sons of the Harpy are super fighting samurai-ninjas. Live with it. Hopefully, soon Jaime Lannister and Bronn the sellsword and Dolorous Edd and the Onion Knight and Melisandre will all die too (and maybe Rickon Stark too, cos hey who likes a noisy brat?). And then you will have enough reasons to shout "death for shock value!" and tear your eyes out.

Your the one sounding like such.

VALAMONGOULIS!!! I haven't watch the season 5 yet due to my busy schedule, I just want to know what happened to the remainder of Ned Stark's children, Stanis Baratheon, and please someone should tell that Cercei Lannister is dead.

Gbola5:


No. Selmy is still alive an is leading the attack against the Yunkai'i. The actor is also a book reader and was angry he was getting cut, because he wanted to play that part in leading the attack against the Yunkai. Where Barristan was all badass, "Sound the attack".

Waoh! ! Really??

Gbola5:


Outsmarted by Cersei, yeah right. Why should he have obeyed Renly. What Renly was planning was wrong. You think the game of thrones is so important ? I dont know, but some o' you seem to misunderstand the 'Ned'. I've always said it, that those who understand the 'Ned' are more rational than does who dont.

Dunno wat you mean by Ned and rational relationship. All I know is dat in life one has to be wise as a serpent cos many ppl are ready to decapitate you if you dull yourself.

Eh gbola5 , you realize a lot of things have diverged from the books so your predictions might not b valid.

Personally im hoping for the northern red wedding for the boltons and freys, would b so much awesome as the north remembers. Cant describe how much i want this as d show has diverged big enough for this to happen.

On Ned stark i understand him and that is he is fool, an idiot beyond compare, oh he is honorable but he is an honorable idiot. A disgrace to every stark before him.
he was fostered in vale where he learnt jon arryn as high as honor bullshit without learning d practical aspects to it. Even jon arryn wasn't as stupid as ned.

Ned forgot he was a stark who really are the kings of ruthlessness. They didn't keep the north for thousands of years by being honorable, they did it by being the meanest bad guys and ready to end your family which they did a couple of times. The boltons were afraid of the starks to put things in perspective then came ned wit his honor bullshit and his biggest moment of idiocy, telling cersei his plans. Who does that? Really he deserved to die. You know what a stark would have done? He would have thrown her into the dungeons and have d lannister men in d city arrested/killed. Also wen ur gods send u a sign like a stag killing a direwolf, a creature that hasn't been seen that south in centuries, you listen dammit and not dismiss it as superstition.

long rant but i really really despise ned and don't start me on his unbelievably stupid son but for that i blame his tully wife. The tullys are d most useless family in westeros after all.

sage1000:
Eh gbola5 , you realize a lot of things have diverged from the books so your predictions might not b valid.

Personally im hoping for the northern red wedding for the boltons and freys, would b so much awesome as the north remembers. Cant describe how much i want this as d show has diverged big enough for this to happen.

On Ned stark i understand him and that is he is fool, an idiot beyond compare, oh he is honorable but he is an honorable idiot. A disgrace to every stark before him.
he was fostered in vale where he learnt jon arryn as high as honor bullshit without learning d practical aspects to it. Even jon arryn wasn't as stupid as ned.

Ned forgot he was a stark who really are the kings of ruthlessness. They didn't keep the north for thousands of years by being honorable, they did it by being the meanest bad guys and ready to end your family which they did a couple of times. The boltons were afraid of the starks to put things in perspective then came ned wit his honor bullshit and his biggest moment of idiocy, telling cersei his plans. Who does that? Really he deserved to die. You know what a stark would have done? He would have thrown her into the dungeons and have d lannister men in d city arrested/killed. Also wen ur gods send u a sign like a stag killing a direwolf, a creature that hasn't been seen that south in centuries, you listen dammit and not dismiss it as superstition.

long rant but i really really despise ned and don't start me on his unbelievably stupid son but for that i blame his tully wife. The tullys are d most useless family in westeros after all.

Woah you got it all wrong. If others aren't willing to play by the rules that doesnt mean you shouldn't. King's Landing is a very bad place and the level of corruption is beyond imagination, now if someone comes in and tries to do things differently and is betrayed, because of power players trying to gain power and advantages. The so called Game of Thrones is a corrupt, destructive and bad political system to the core, and its not something worth being good at. Ned understood doing the right thing instead of the smart thing. Sure he got killed, but it was because of LF wispering in Joff's ear. So did Stannis to a certain level. He knew that the rot in Aerys' and Robert's reign started with Varys, if you blame Ned you should also blame Robert for not scouring the court clean, of people like Varys who was supporting a claimant from far away, LF who was embezzling money, both of whom wants an all out war, Pycelle for being a puppet of the Lannisters, and Cersei, who wants to be king and wishes to have been born with a cock, Janos Slynt a rogue, and so on, that was what Stannis vowed to do, that was why LF betrayed Ned. You might think the likes of Cersei, Tywin, etc are winning now, but such victory as the game of thrones brings is only short term. At this point in the story the game doesnt matter any more because every body is devastated. And you mean to call Ned a fool? I'll handle that in my next post.

sage1000:
Eh gbola5 , you realize a lot of things have diverged from the books so your predictions might not b valid.

Personally im hoping for the northern red wedding for the boltons and freys, would b so much awesome as the north remembers. Cant describe how much i want this as d show has diverged big enough for this to happen.

On Ned stark i understand him and that is he is fool, an idiot beyond compare, oh he is honorable but he is an honorable idiot. A disgrace to every stark before him.
he was fostered in vale where he learnt jon arryn as high as honor bullshit without learning d practical aspects to it. Even jon arryn wasn't as stupid as ned.

Ned forgot he was a stark who really are the kings of ruthlessness. They didn't keep the north for thousands of years by being honorable, they did it by being the meanest bad guys and ready to end your family which they did a couple of times. The boltons were afraid of the starks to put things in perspective then came ned wit his honor bullshit and his biggest moment of idiocy, telling cersei his plans. Who does that? Really he deserved to die. You know what a stark would have done? He would have thrown her into the dungeons and have d lannister men in d city arrested/killed. Also wen ur gods send u a sign like a stag killing a direwolf, a creature that hasn't been seen that south in centuries, you listen dammit and not dismiss it as superstition.

long rant but i really really despise ned and don't start me on his unbelievably stupid son but for that i blame his tully wife. The tullys are d most useless family in westeros after all.

They did get that reference in the books, i remember Cat telling Ned of what the stag and direwolf symbolism meant. Ned was as much Stark as Starks get, and the north loved him because he was a good just and fair lord, and was always visiting his bannermen, hearing out smallfolk. He cared. He was brought up by Jon but so was Robert hey. He was still a Stark regardless. And like the Starks he did his own killings. And the Starks werent the kings of ruthlessness, if so noone would like them as they do, there were good and bad and great ones but i dont get why you use ruthless. What was the saying? When there was a Stark in Winterfell, a maiden girl could walk on the kingsroad in her name day gown and go unmolested, and a traveler could find food and warmth at any tavern. So i dont see your point. If they were ruthless, people wouldnt be dragging in the snow to save the "NED'S" girl, like they did in book 5 and hope they will in the show. They wouldnt be trying to smuggle Rickon so that they can name him king, if there were kings of ruthlessness, maybe the Bolton's whose words are, 'OUR BLADES ARE SHARP', and even they still had their good and bad ones. Ned commanded respect and love from his bannermen, dined with them, got to know them, and not ask them to just die for him, a thing he thought Robb, was a good battle commander and always lead in the frontlines, and even his enemies feared him, even Roose. I dont see how he deserved to die, and LF or Varys dont. And there are different definitions for honor, theres a difference between 'you honor me, my lord', 'oh, the honor', which is like the Arryn saying and Ned's type of honor. If you say you've read the books then you should know Ned's isnt the former. Its more of a being able to look yourself in the mirror quality for Ned. Doing what is right mostly than what is smart, is one reason why the North loves the Starks. This is why i say most people who understand Ned are more rational, you say you understand him yet.... Even book characters dont understand, and some are unreliable narrators. Now hold on im not through yet. The part about King's Landing.

Now you act like he was just plain stupid, and everything you say he should have done is wholly based on hindsight, which is 20/20, and is a wrong way to judge people. Now i'll talk about the cases where you think Ned bleeped up and how his personality plays in. He takes the position of hand not just to investigate Jon Arryn, but also to protect his broda Bobby B. He knows the kind of people in king's landing, which is full of viper's and snakes. The thing's he should be faulted for arenot the things you mention. Now he should have brought a large number of guards with him, that is one. He discovers the secret he thought Jon Arryn died for, and now he knows if he tells Robert, Cersei, Jaime, and the children, would all be murdered with not even a second thought. Now this is an instance where his feelings play in. The murder of children is something Ned cant abide by, like the murder of Rhaegar's children and the planned murder of Daenerys, are examples that show us Ned can defy his monarch because, you dont kill children for the problems you think they are going to create, you kill them if they do create these problems. Ned also happened tn lose his sis, something that affected him, she was also young. In his mind he knew he shouldnt tell Cersei, he knew it was treason, but just because of her kids he was willing to let her escape. Another thing you can fault him for(which is based on hindsight, but still plausible) is that he underestimated Cersei's love for power and overestimated her love for her children, a chance which any loving mother would have taken. Cersei somehow manages to kill Robert, and when Ned had a chance to tell him, he would rather have his broda Bobby B. die in peace, than to let him know he died fatherless, hence he changes the will instead. Now something you can also fault him for is he should have changed the comm. of the City Watch to someone he can trust, but asks LF to do it for him. Now some say he should have been Joffrey's regent like LF suggested, and why because he was Tywin's grandson? Because you cant go against Tywin. Ned would rather have the rightful heir than the most powerful( now LF betrays Ned to Cersei, because he was willing to support Stannis, a man who was going to remove him from office who was going to let his work go to drain, that's why he suggested Joffrey or Renly, because he knew he could thrive under them. But once again this isnt right). Which leads to Renly.

Now what Renly was suggesting was a power play for him to seize the children and take the throne because he had a few men at KL. I wont say Ned knew his motives. But if Renly became king, rather than Stannis because he had the most men and is popular, it only furthers something called 'might makes right' which is a bad system of Ruling because it only leads to civil wars. And plus if he became king, what is to stop people from future generations from doing the same. That the most powerful and not the next in line should be king. If such a person was king, he would have to be onlook out for anybody who tries to oppose him because power isnt constant. That's why theres a line of succesion, and breaking such, would break the social contracts that existed in such society. How does that play with Ned ? It was what LF and Renly was suggesting, and all for their personal gains. Now you say he should have arrested her but there's a legal process for that and the person is going to need proof. Now Ned was a principled man and stuck with his principles till his death, he didnt change because he would gain a reward in return, he didnt rule because he was going to make himself mighty, but because it was his duty. Ned was going to be allowed to take the black, but for the meddling of LF in Joffrey's ears. A sad thing about this series is not that the Ned lost his head, but that people blame him for everything that happened after, and that to some he's only going to be remembered as a fool. RIP Ned Stark, The Quiet Wolf.

Now Robbs a different case but not today. What the show did to his character was potray him as a love sick puppy willing to break any vow for some fine ass. And they also made him a hothead. Still he doesnt get the credit he deserves.

^^^
Wow... Did anybody read all that?

kay9:
^^^ Wow... Did anybody read all that?

Did you ?!

kay9:
^^^
Wow... Did anybody read all that?

yea i did
make some solid points, 'unpopular' in today's world.

I really want to use this opportunity to thank the writer of those post above. U really saw the show from a different perspective. Thanks for the information and for being different

Gbola5 Okay wow, that was really long.

First of all when I say ruthless I don't mean cruel. I mean ruthless in the way they dealt with their enemies and how they crushed them. The Starks as a whole excluding were loved and feared by the north. The North follows strength and that was the major reason the starks ruled for as long as they did with both honorable kings and dishonorable kings. On the religion thing, the symbolism there is almost the equivalent of an angel appearing to a christian and telling him to do something. That is the level of which seeing a direwolf is considered by the followers of the old gods, now seeing a direwolf killed by a stag after giving birth to six puppies, common. How much of that can be a coincidence and Ned dismissing like he died well showed his vale upbringing showing where such things like the old gods are considered superstitious nonsense.

Ned stark was a good man but he was a fool. You see you can maintain your honor and still do what is smart. The whole be as wise as a serpent and gentle as a dove thing from the bible explains that point best. Ned stark's foolishness comes from him expecting everyone to act as honorable as he is. You say he knows the kinds of people in kings landing yet he expected honor from them. He trusted Baelish after Baelish even told him not to and he trusted Cersei. Again he could have handled that situation in a lot of ways, off the top of my head he could have arrested Cersei and sent the children to Casterly rock before Robert came back. That way his honor is kept and he has saved the realm a lot of heart ache.

As for the issue of proof. He had all the proof he needed to prove bastardry. The book of Maesters was seen then as conclusive proof as according to it whenever a Baratheon is married with a Lannister, The Baratheon genes always wins out. Now this is not the modern era you can do blood test so that information is basically all the proof needed and he had it.

On the Renly situation, you realize might makes right is the entire basis of the feudal system practiced in the medieval era right. Him supporting Renly would have stopped the clusterfuck that was the War of Five kings from happening because Tywin would bend to protect his grandchildren that were hostages and Stannis won't be able to raise enough men to fight a war against the rest of the realm. Now I'm not saying this was the right or honorable decision cause by law Stannis was the rightful heir but this path would have led to the least shedding of blood. I'm not saying this was what he should have done because most of this is from hindsight. This is just to prove that yes in those times Might did indeed mean Right.

kay9:
^^^
Wow... Did anybody read all that?

Omo, I did o, but how Bobby Brown take enter the matter na?

...but also to protect his broda Bobby B...

ApexTitan:


Omo, I did o, but how Bobby Brown take enter the matter na?

Gbola5:


Did you ?!

Nope. Me and a bunch of other guys trashed out the "Was Ned Stark A Fool?" conundrum years ago... But it certainly didn't take us this many words.

If you must know though, Ned Stark was indeed a fool - a brave, strong, honest, and honorable fool. See, I'm a practical man and I'll give you a practical example. Imagine you happen to capture Shekau of Boko Haram but he suddenly escapes... You have a gun in your hands as you watch him get away, but you don't pump him full of bullets because it is actually against the law to shoot an unarmed man. And so you let Shekau the leader of Boko Haram to escape. Please tell me, are you a fool or not?

Bobby B. is a fan nickname for Robert Baratheon. Like Eddard is called the "NED".

kay9:


Nope. Me and a bunch of other guys trashed out the "Was Ned Stark A Fool?" conundrum years ago... But it certainly didn't take us this many words.

So what was the conclusion, that Ned was a Stark fool or not?

sage1000:
Gbola5 Okay wow, that was really long.

First of all when I say ruthless I don't mean cruel. I mean ruthless in the way they dealt with their enemies and how they crushed them. The Starks as a whole excluding were loved and feared by the north. The North follows strength and that was the major reason the starks ruled for as long as they did with both honorable kings and dishonorable kings. On the religion thing, the symbolism there is almost the equivalent of an angel appearing to a christian and telling him to do something. That is the level of which seeing a direwolf is considered by the followers of the old gods, now seeing a direwolf killed by a stag after giving birth to six puppies, common. How much of that can be a coincidence and Ned dismissing like he died well showed his vale upbringing showing where such things like the old gods are considered superstitious nonsense.

Ned stark was a good man but he was a fool. You see you can maintain your honor and still do what is smart. The whole be as wise as a serpent and gentle as a dove thing from the bible explains that point best. Ned stark's foolishness comes from him expecting everyone to act as honorable as he is. You say he knows the kinds of people in kings landing yet he expected honor from them. He trusted Baelish after Baelish even told him not to and he trusted Cersei. Again he could have handled that situation in a lot of ways, off the top of my head he could have arrested Cersei and sent the children to Casterly rock before Robert came back. That way his honor is kept and he has saved the realm a lot of heart ache.

As for the issue of proof. He had all the proof he needed to prove bastardry. The book of Maesters was seen then as conclusive proof as according to it whenever a Baratheon is married with a Lannister, The Baratheon genes always wins out. Now this is not the modern era you can do blood test so that information is basically all the proof needed and he had it.

On the Renly situation, you realize might makes right is the entire basis of the feudal system practiced in the medieval era right. Him supporting Renly would have stopped the clusterfuck that was the War of Five kings from happening because Tywin would bend to protect his grandchildren that were hostages and Stannis won't be able to raise enough men to fight a war against the rest of the realm. Now I'm not saying this was the right or honorable decision cause by law Stannis was the rightful heir but this path would have led to the least shedding of blood. I'm not saying this was what he should have done because most of this is from hindsight. This is just to prove that yes in those times Might did indeed mean Right.

But didnt things change later on. What if Ned was the revolution. I guess because of what I
believe. I was raised christian
but am an avowed atheist
now. I believe some things are
bad for society and humanity
as a whole. I believe in
humanity and its potential to
be better and I think Ned does
too. Right is also a misnomer
it implies Ned never made
mistakes, this is blatantly not
true but his intentions are good
and he tries to do right which
makes all the difference.

Oh and Ned was Religious. I think Stannis would have made a good king. People didnt like him i think because of their ambitions, something which he wouldnt allow. The war was going to happen regardless, because Stannis would not allow Renly, an Balon was already planning an invasion on the north. these are all factors Ned didnt have any control over.

ApexTitan:


So what was the conclusion, that Ned was a Stark fool or not?

Sorry mate, you quoted me while I was modifying. But yes, he was indeed a fool - his honor notwithstanding.

What do you mean by saying, the symbolism is there. There are direwolves beyond the wall,does that mean they have to be a religious symbol. Oh and that was kind of like a spoiler of what happened in the books you know. But i do recall Cat telling him about it.

You're not a fool when people still continue fighting for your memory. Ned's way works in the long run. While the monsters win the short run, when they die, their legacy dies with them. Go look at Tywin. He tried to build a legacy with fear, treachery, deceit, ruthlessness, and after he dies, his legacy died with him.