Sissie: In addition to what tbaba said,

The misconception you wrote about Muslims reciting the Qur'an better in Arabic.

1. Memorization of the Qur'an in Arabic language is so much easier, than memorizing it in English, Yoruba, Hausa etc. I have NEVER come across someone who memorized the whole Qur'an in another language, infact I would love to hear or read about someone who did.

you have never seen any because they made them think its forbidden to recite Quran in another language except arabic and thats exactly wht the op is pointing us towards (indoctrination at its peak)

Sissie:
If someone understands the Arabic language it would be better if he recited it in arabic, he would have a deeper and better understanding of the Quran, that's the language of the Quran.

understanding doesnt come from the type of language used but from sincerety of purpose... if i wanna learn Quran in swahili language all i need is genuine heart and the will to learn and everything else becomes easy

Sissie:
However if he doesn't understand Arabic, he can memorize the Qur'an in arabic, and read the Qur'an in the language he understands so he understands what he's reading, if he reads it only in arabic, when he doesn't understand the language, how then does he understands what he's reading?

I.e there are proverbs you hear in Yoruba language, when it's translated you might not understand it fully except you understand the language.

anything can be learn in any language... no language is superior to another (some will even make u believe that arabic will be the language of God when resurrected...SEE BRAINWASHING )

onetrack: The original Bible is not in Latin, but rather Hebrew and Koine Greek. However, those languages were not accessible to the Christians of the Western Roman Empire, and previous translations into Latin had been done in a piecemeal, haphazard fashion, and so once Christianity reached a critical mass in the west in the late 300s, a priest named (St.)Jerome was commissioned to create a single, comprehensive translation of the Bible into Latin so that people would understand it in Italy, Spain, France, etc. This version (the Vulgate) is the one that has been used by the Catholic Church ever since.

GBAM.....

Anyone praising the catholic church for using latin is quite misinformed.

However, relating this to Islam, my problem with it is the Arabicising of everything. The op only touched the surface of what I feel about Arabic culture in Islam.

-It is not only the Arabic language that is sometimes forced upon non-Arab muslims (I've had pals who couldnt speak English properly in Naija but spoke Arabic
-The veil is another part of Arabic culture manifesting in islam. The veil does not guarantee holiness or heaven
-Then there is the facing of Mecca as if God lives in Mecca only.
-Then there is the issue of Hajj which millions of muslims can't afford. Also, I would prefer if Nigerians promoted tourism in their country rather than going on hajj


This is my view on islam and arab culture

onegig: At all asking peeps to clarify what the op has said. There's a difference between when you don't understand something and you outrightly come out saying you are indeed knowledgeable and what you say is the utter truth even when you give feeble reasons and you coming out to seek knowledge about something you don't really understand.

Starting from the topic you would have noticed he was already determined about his knowledge and wasn't here for a discussion. If he had named the topic " misconception I have noticed about islam" that would have been better . But he is here to gain support for his follies as you can see him shaking hands and recieving praises from his fellow brethren who swallow what he has said hook, line and sinker without a thought as to what he had said. Tell me , who would be ready to enlighten such a lost fellow?

He's on here seeking attention and i guess he's got what he wants. At op... I guess you know your LORD is above and you would give account of whatever you do or say. So maybe you cut short this feel good mission of yours and return back to your senses.

If i had come here, praising Islam, you wouldn't say i am seeking for attention, will u? If i had said Muhammad is the greatest messenger or only the so called muslims will inherit paradise, which are contrary to what Qur'an says, u would fully support me. Then it would no longer b 'seeking attention' according to you.

Let me tell you this, am not a stray boy from down the street,who copied and pasted this. I took my time, almost a week to build this from scratch. Tbaba and co.,everybody believes are knowledgeable which i admit,but are they the only ones that got knowledge? Are they always right? Why does any muslim who oppose them automatically becomes the villain.

I didn't fabricate this, i listed enough evidences, history,verses,logic, i emphasized the worship of God alone. Why then do you hate this?

usermane:

If i had come here, praising Islam, you wouldn't say i am seeking for attention, will u? If i had said Muhammad is the greatest messenger or only the so called muslims will inherit paradise, which are contrary to what Qur'an says, u would fully support me. Then it would no longer b 'seeking attention' according to you.

Let me tell you this, am not a stray boy from down the street,who copied and pasted this. I took my time, almost a week to build this from scratch. Tbaba and co.,everybody believes are knowledgeable which i admit,but are they the only ones that got knowledge? Are they always right? Why does any muslim who oppose them automatically becomes the villain.

I didn't fabricate this, i listed enough evidences, history,verses,logic, i emphasized the worship of God alone. Why then do you hate this?

You dont know? When Tbaba posts something- they all run saying "jazakallah" like sheep.

[quote author=beejaay]

you have never seen any because they made them think its forbidden to recite Quran in another language except arabic and thats exactly wht the op is pointing us towards (indoctrination at its peak)

you do not understand what I said, I was talking about memorization, memorization is different from reciting, there are people recite in other language but have not been able to memorize the Qur'an in that language

understanding doesnt come from the type of language used but from sincerety of purpose... if i wanna learn Quran in swahili language all i need is genuine heart and the will to learn and everything else becomes easy

if you have sincere purpose in your heart, if you do not recite it in the language you understand you still won't be able to understand it




anything can be learn in any language... no language is superior to another (some will even make u believe that arabic will be the language of God when resurrected...SEE BRAINWASHING )

my point is not everything/word can be translated precisely

@usermane the way you presented the topic seem more like you stating your opinion/views, educating people about the misconceptions and leaving it at that, not up for discussion.

I do not see how it's opposing tbaba and co and being a villian, it's not like tbaba wrote about the 10 things you listed and you wrote yours opposing his. So I dont know where vilian comes in?

If you want to share a knowledge, share it, if we agree fine, if we don't we agree to disagree, afterall some of the misconceptions you wrote is have some truth in it.

The truth is so many people write "seeking attention"

usermane:
08.
PROPHET MUHAMMAD WAS INFALLIBLE AND PERFECT



I hope you are not one of those who believe Prophet Muhammad was perfect,sinnless and had knowledge of the future beyond the Final testament. Else this post is yours. An educated acknowledger of GOD shouldn't follow such an erroneous conception. To compound the problem, there are those who even consider all his sahabas(friends/companions) as perfect infallible surbodinates who should be emulated,who learned and delivered accurately the truth, who the the prophet guaranteed success in Hereafter even before their death. Yet, according to Qur'an,there were bad eggs among these companions whose identity were never exposed. (Qur'an 9:101, 63:1,33:60)


We hear numerous things about the prophet. Like many muslim said he was sinnless,he didn't make mistakes in action or decision,all his deeds were divinely inspired, even his personal opinions were divine,binding upon all muslims. According to some, he smelt like perfume, he didn't have shadow, he had instant healing powers, he could bless or curse anyone.
Look at all these. Can these be true? We 'll soon know. In as much as GOD wants mankind, to obey HIS messenger, HE is fully aware that mankind have the tendency to cross the limit, setting the messenger as an idol. That is why GOD left down verses in HIS Book to guide.

Trash this out with Al Baqir here.
www.nairaland.com/1488847/muhammad-saws-error-free-prophet
www.nairaland.com/1480939/concept-infallibility-isma

Sissie: @usermane the way you presented the topic seem more like you stating your opinion/views, educating people about the misconceptions and leaving it at that, not up for discussion.

I do not see how it's opposing tbaba and co and being a villian, it's not like tbaba wrote about the 10 things you listed and you wrote yours opposing his. So I dont know where vilian comes in?

If you want to share a knowledge, share it, if we agree fine, if we don't we agree to disagree, afterall some of the misconceptions you wrote is have some truth in it.

The truth is so many people write "seeking attention"

The accusation n bold has been repeated so many times that it is meaningless

abeg, how do we know that you too arent looking for attention.

Why do some NL muslims always question intentions rather than look at the content of a post?

@Username..

Me hate? I never do that. When the forum was even filled with hypocrites and all sorts i never hated anyone. Hate is a strong word. I like discussing and arguing on issues but the way you have come around with this is wrong. You aren't here to discuss. You came around passing a misconception about a misconception you feel you need to clear the air on. And you went on as if you were passing a fatwa.

You can go to the muslim section and see us argue but we argue to learn more. When issues come up and i have different views of things and someone brings a differing one. I clearly sit back and watch what he has said and look at the verses he has quoted. Serving God ain't about who's right or who's wrong. It's about following what is right and laid down.

The Prophet enjoys us to seek knowledge and question our religion on what we don't understand . But please ask yourself. Have you done this with an open mind. You seem like someone who's ashamed of his religion and is distancing himself from it. My wordof advise for you. Don't look at what the so called adherents of a religion do but what the religion says. Each verse of The Quran you quoted always comes with a fiqh that best explains the verses. Don't take them in isolation. That's the mistake most non muslims make. I have nothing to add i guess tbaba has tried to clear the air on things. I hope you would look at things more objectively.

Logicboy03:


The accusation n bold has been repeated so many times that it is meaningless

abeg, how do we know that you too arent looking for attention.

Why do some NL muslims always question intentions rather than look at the content of a post?

Aww did that struck a code in you, do you seek for attention too?

The attention seeking thing isn't restricted to just the religion section.

Sissie:

Aww did that struck a code in you, do you seek for attention too?

The attention seeking thing isn't restricted to just the religion section.

@Sissle, those who memorise qur'an in arabic find it easy because they recite by singing it, paying no attention to the meaning, Qur'an is not poetry. If you start singing with English Qur'an, you 'll able to memorise it too. Moreover,memorising the Qur'an is not as good as understanding it. People memorise the Qur'an and still fumble in application. Enough for you is to read and understand,u can go for extra though.

@babestell, is it the English words we have today that cannot cater for delivering the message of GOD in arabic? I can't see how anyone would incline staunchly to this view. You

I understand if everyone must memorise chapter one(7 verses) in arabic,which is quite easy due to transliteration.

usermane: @Sissle, those who memorise qur'an in arabic find it easy because they recite by singing it, paying no attention to the meaning, Qur'an is not poetry. If you start singing with English Qur'an, you 'll able to memorise it too. Moreover,memorising the Qur'an is not as good as understanding it. People memorise the Qur'an and still fumble in application. Enough for you is to read and understand,u can go for extra though.

thank you for this... its not enough for a Gardner to love flowers, he must hate weeds and pets

onegig: @Username..

Me hate? I never do that. When the forum was even filled with hypocrites and all sorts i never hated anyone. Hate is a strong word. I like discussing and arguing on issues but the way you have come around with this is wrong. You aren't here to discuss. You came around passing a misconception about a misconception you feel you need to clear the air on. And you went on as if you were passing a fatwa.

You can go to the muslim section and see us argue but we argue to learn more. When issues come up and i have different views of things and someone brings a differing one. I clearly sit back and watch what he has said and look at the verses he has quoted. Serving God ain't about who's right or who's wrong. It's about following what is right and laid down.

The Prophet enjoys us to seek knowledge and question our religion on what we don't understand . But please ask yourself. Have you done this with an open mind. You seem like someone who's ashamed of his religion and is distancing himself from it. My wordof advise for you. Don't look at what the so called adherents of a religion do but what the religion says. Each verse of The Quran you quoted always comes with a fiqh that best explains the verses. Don't take them in isolation. That's the mistake most non muslims make. I have nothing to add i guess tbaba has tried to clear the air on things. I hope you would look at things more objectively.

arguments in islamic section ke all u guys do there is behave like zombies, always afraid to offend the lord there (aka maclatinji and tbaba.. they are the lords of islamic section and all they say is final, the prophets of our time)... say anything contrary to what they say and u will be banned..

if this topic was posted on Islamic thread, almost all supporting arguments would have been banned or even have the thread banned sef....

learning ke for that islamic section DAMN!!!!! any contrary view is banned and termed anti-islamic as if they have monopoly for islamic definition

@op u get sense for posting the thread here at the general section

beejaay:
arguments in islamic section ke all u guys do there is behave like zombies, always afraid to offend the lord there (aka maclatinji and tbaba.. they are the lords of islamic section and all they say is final, the prophets of our time)... say anything contrary to what they say and u will be banned..

if this topic was posted on Islamic thread, almost all supporting arguments would have been banned or even have the thread banned sef....

learning ke for that islamic section DAMN!!!!! any contrary view is banned and termed anti-islamic as if they have monopoly for islamic definition

@op u get sense for posting the thread here at the general section

1000 likes

Hmmh, some people here misunderstand me and the topic. They say am seeking for attention,they say am lacking in knowledge,they say am ashame of my religion. But they are wrong. They only know half the truth about me.

I didn't claim to be the most learned. I never enforced anyone to believe this. I don't have to. This is no fatwa or tafsir. The verses speak for themselves. My issue is with those trying to bite off my head (Qur'an 22:72). Get a life, the sheikh is not always right, the mallam or alfa is not always right(Qur'an 9:31,34). U may not be right. Stop taking this personal or as an attack to your beliefs.

usermane: @Sissle, those who memorise qur'an in arabic find it easy because they recite by singing it, paying no attention to the meaning, Qur'an is not poetry. If you start singing with English Qur'an, you 'll able to memorise it too. Moreover,memorising the Qur'an is not as good as understanding it. People memorise the Qur'an and still fumble in application. Enough for you is to read and understand,u can go for extra though.

rise chapter one(7 verses) in arabic,which is quite easy due to transliteration.

Not everyone who memorized the Quran did so by singing it, yes people still fumble in application, memorizing it doesn't mean you automatically understand it, but it still doesnt mean people should not
memorize it, if one memorizes and understands it, and doesn't fumble in its application, that is best. We don't even need to discuss its pros.
I haven't heard/met/read about someone who memorized the English version or Yoruba version by singing it, if it's as easy as that

P.s am talking about the memorization of the whole Qur'an.

Sissie:

Not everyone who memorized the Quran did so by singing it, yes people still fumble in application, memorizing it doesn't mean you automatically understand it, but it still doesnt mean people should not
memorize it, if one memorizes and understands it, and doesn't fumble in its application, that is best. We don't even need to discuss its pros.
So why haven't someone memorized the English version or Yoruba version by singing it, if it's as easy as that

P.s am talking about the memorization of the whole Qur'an.

Fallacious thinking there, sis.

Just because we dont know someone that has memeorized it in english, it doesnt mean that there isnt someone who has.

Logicboy03:


Fallacious thinking there, sis.

Just because we dont know someone that has memeorized it in english, it doesnt mean that there isnt someone who has.

Sorry I meant, I haven't heard, met or read about one? Like I said earlier I would love to read about it.

Sissie:

Sorry I meant, I haven't heard, met or read about one? Like I said earlier I would love to read about it.

I'm sure that some can, maybe the recital of the Quran in English is not as sweet or it is less "islamic"?

beejaay:
arguments in islamic section ke all u guys do there is behave like zombies, always afraid to offend the lord there (aka maclatinji and tbaba.. they are the lords of islamic section and all they say is final, the prophets of our time)... say anything contrary to what they say and u will be banned..

if this topic was posted on Islamic thread, almost all supporting arguments would have been banned or even have the thread banned sef....

learning ke for that islamic section DAMN!!!!! any contrary view is banned and termed anti-islamic as if they have monopoly for islamic definition

@op u get sense for posting the thread here at the general section

Another fallacy from you. Tell me another new story. Mac and t Baba lord? Over who or whom? Anyways. You can languish in your grandeur delusion. I won't aid you. Am off to better things. Take care.

Who says nl Muslims do not argue with tbaba, mac and co. LOL hilarious.

Logicboy03:

I'm sure that some can, maybe the recital of the Quran in English is not as sweet or it is less "islamic"?

For whatever reason it is its not because it's less "Islamic"

Am not talking about reciting, am talking about memorizing it. but my no 1 reason would be its harder to memorize in English.

Sissie: Who says nl Muslims do not argue with tbaba, mac and co. LOL hilarious.

no....I have witnessed it too

Tbaba has his dedicated followers. Not all muslims agree with him but many do. Mac too is another guy with huge support.

I remember my time as an undercover muslim there.

Sissie:

For whatever reason it is its not because it's less "Islamic"

Am not talking about reciting, am talking about memorizing it. but my no 1 reason would be its harder to memorize in English.

Why would it be harder in English?

Logicboy03:

no....I have witnessed it too

Tbaba has his dedicated followers. Not all muslims agree with him but many do. Mac too is another guy with huge support.

I remember my time as an undercover muslim there.

You undercover Muslim? I know you love us

Sissie:

You undercover Muslim? I know you love us

Heard of abdulsaleek?

Logicboy03:


Heard of abdulsaleek?

No

Oh boy.... I really would like to understand the purpose of this thread @op. I know I am may not be all that knowledgeable as respect to deen, but do u really believe that this is doing more good than fitnah?
And I am just curious, do u know some surah in arabic or any other language? And if u do, how easy or hard was it for u. *i am not asking u these to argue, wud just like to understand u better, and u are free to ignore the questions

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