skelewu74:

well nursing is a very Good profession. I married a nurse. They are not dummies. They have actually suffered for their RN and need to be appreciated and not looked down upon.

But nurses are not independent. They cannot make a decision concerning the patient, and must carry out the doctor's order.

That's for a Good nurse anyway. You cannot be a Good nurse without that.

Quite interesting to know you married a nurse.however,you would do yourself and others who share the same idea of nurse being subservient to doctors a whole lot of favour to get informed of nursing care process
Am sure having been educated on what it is,you would realise nurses occupy the centre stage in decision making process in patients
care.

Rilamaka:


http://www.uhb.nhs.uk/board-of-directors.htm

That's a NURSE led hospital in England, so Mr consultant pediatrician what's your point? Can you name any hospital in Nigeria that can stand shoulder to shoulder with that hospital that has a Nurse as the CMD?

Please stop embarrassing yourself. You are clearly egotistic nothing else.

Hmmm, shakehead. He even thinks we run the same system as uk. Doesn't even know that nurses are not entitled to the post of CMD in uk.

He doesn't even know that the link he posted above is a link to an NHS "Foundation " Trust and that in such a foundation, post of CEO is the one left open to anyone.

This is what a foundation trust is in the uk NHS:

//NHS foundation trusts,

first introduced in April 2004, differ from other existing NHS trusts. They are independent legal entities and have unique governance arrangements. They are accountable to local people, who can become members and governors. Each NHS foundation trust has a duty to consult and involve a board of governors (including patients, staff, members of the public, and partner organisations) in the strategic planning of the organisation.They are set free from central government control and are no-longer performance managed by health authorities. As self-standing, self-governing organisations, NHS foundation trusts are free to determine their own future.They have financial freedoms and can raise capital from both the public and private sectors within borrowing limits determined by projected cash flowsand therefore based on affordability. They can retainfinancial surpluses to invest in the delivery of new NHS services.

Foundation trusts are overseen by Monitor.//
http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/thenhs/about/Pages/authoritiesandtrusts.aspx

The post of CMD of that foundation is occupied by a doctor:

//David Rosser, Executive Medical Director

David trained at University of Wales College of Medicine and did his basic specialist training in medicine and anaesthesia in South Wales before becoming a research fellow and lecturer in Clinical Pharmacology at University College London Hospital.He joined the Trust in 1996, became lead clinician for the Queen Elizabeth Intensive Care unit in December 1997 before becoming Group Director and then Divisional Director of Division One in 2002.Dr Rosser was also Senior Responsible Owner for Connecting for Health’s e-prescribing programme, providing national guidance on e-prescribing to the Department of Health. Dr Rosser took up the role of Medical Director in December 2006. He has executiveresponsibility for IT and Quality.//

Nigerian hospitals are not a foundation, and we don't have CEOs as managers. They are set up for medical services, and teaching hospitals for teaching doctors, medical services and research. They are DEPENDENT on government, as it's not a business or a foundation (in fact still receiving intervention funds from the government ). We run hospitals through directorates - medical, nursing etc, and with an overall CMD.

timowale:
Quite interesting to know you married a nurse.however,you would do yourself and others who share the same idea of nurse being subservient to doctors a whole lot of favour to get informed of nursing care process
Am sure having been educated on what it is,you would realise nurses occupy the centre stage in decision making process in patients
care.

My dear, you are not independent. You are mid-level practisioners. You are not allowed to do a lot of things. So if you think you are independent, maybe that's on a web page or inside your books.

You are responsible to the doctor. I wonder why I am telling this to a nurse. Are you not supposed to know this?

phantom:
from your link,
Dame Julie Moore, Chief Executive

Julie is a graduate nurse who worked in clinical practice before moving into management. After a variety of clinical, management and director posts, she was appointed as Chief Executive of University Hospitals Birmingham (UHB) in 2006.

UHB is recognised nationally and internationally for quality of care. It has 1250 beds, £700m turnover, 8000 staff, treats over 800,000 patients annually and has a £545m Private Finance Initiative (PFI) new hospital building which opened on time and on budget in 2010. UHB hosts the Royal Centre for Defence Medicine and with the University of Birmingham, UHB was cofounder of Birmingham Health Partners, a partnership for health research. The National Institute of Health Research (NIHR) Centre for Surgical Reconstruction and Microbiology was opened at the Trust in 2011. UHB operates the Learning Hub, which helps long term unemployed people back into work. In 2012, UHB was awarded a grant from BIS to establish a £24m Institute of Translational Medicine to rapidly develop new health technologies and contribute to economic growth of the region and country.

UHB is recognised for its expertise in clinical IT systems, informatics, PFI projects and education of clinical staff. Because of this UHB is involved in several projects in countries throughout the world, including Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Oman, Kuwait, Abu Dhabi, Australia, Libya, Sweden, India and China.

Julie is an Independent Member of the Board of the Office for Strategic Co-ordination of Health Research (OSCHR) and a member of the following bodies: the International Advisory Board of the University of Birmingham Business School, the Court of the University of Birmingham, the Faculty Advisory Board of the University of Warwick Medical School. She is a founder member and past Chair of the Shelford Group, ten leading academic hospitals in England.

In April 2011 she was asked by the Government to be a member of the NHS Future Forum to lead on the proposals for Education and Training reform and in August was asked to lead the follow up report. In September 2013, in recognition of the high quality of clinical care at UHB, Julie was asked by Secretary of State to lead a UHB team for the turnaround of two Trusts in special measures following the Kehoe review.

She has spoken at numerous national and international conferences including appearing on same programme as President Clinton in 2012 and undertaken many interviews on TV, radio and in the press, internationally, nationally and locally.

Julie was made a Dame Commander of the British Empire in the New Year’s Honours 2012. In 2013, she was awarded an Honorary Chair at Warwick University, was included in the BBC Radio 4’s Woman’s Hour list of the 100 most powerful women in the UK and was included in the HSJ lists of the most influential leaders and in 2014 as one of the top ten CEOs. She has Honorary Doctorates from the University of Birmingham and Birmingham City University.




she is a nurse but has extra degrees or training in MANAGEMENT.
she is not the chief executive of that hospital based solely on her nursing degree.
if you want to copy,do it fully. dont copy the part that supports your arguement without looking at the big picture

Excuse me I can see that you are not intelligent. Did you see the words CLINICAL I highlighted it for you. Obviously she would not just be the Chief executive just like that, (for some reason only doctors in Nigeria think that they are qualified to jump into management positions just because they have medical degree, is that not laughable? And for you to base ur arguement on that, pfft what more can i say? Mediocrity and small thinking at its highest peak!)

For someone who has such an ambition to move up, you definitely have to gain more training in management which means deviating a little bit from her NURSING background because her role is becoming "Less Clinical" and more managerial.

So in future if you want to point out an error in judgement or dispute the relevance of an article (such as the link I posted), try to understand what their point is before doing so.

I don't think you have the capacity but I will try to spell it out for clarity sake since you are dumb.

Her background is NURSING and I posted this link so you could see with your eyes and expand your line of reasoning that positions as such as this, are not doctors' birth right as you stated clearly that it's not right for someone from other disciplines to lead the hospital.

This link my proves you wrong and among other things goes a long way to show that you are a narrow minded individual who does not see anything beyond what's already in place.

Be it a medical doctor or whatever, who goes all the way to the top without taking management courses? That only happens in Nigeria, so u see u r argument is deeply flawed even more than the decaying health sector in Nigeria headed by power grabbing, incompetent and disgustingly greedy doctors who feel that being at the top is their birthright.

Get it right fo.ol.

skelewu74:

Hmmm, shakehead. He even thinks we run the same system as uk. Doesn't even know that nurses are not entitled to the post of CMD in uk.

He doesn't even know that the link he posted above is a link to an NHS "Foundation " Trust and that in such a foundation, post of CEO is the one left open to anyone.

This is what a foundation trust is in the uk NHS:

//NHS foundation trusts,

first introduced in April 2004, differ from other existing NHS trusts. They are independent legal entities and have unique governance arrangements. They are accountable to local people, who can become members and governors. Each NHS foundation trust has a duty to consult and involve a board of governors (including patients, staff, members of the public, and partner organisations) in the strategic planning of the organisation.They are set free from central government control and are no-longer performance managed by health authorities. As self-standing, self-governing organisations, NHS foundation trusts are free to determine their own future.They have financial freedoms and can raise capital from both the public and private sectors within borrowing limits determined by projected cash flowsand therefore based on affordability. They can retainfinancial surpluses to invest in the delivery of new NHS services.

Foundation trusts are overseen by Monitor.//
http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/thenhs/about/Pages/authoritiesandtrusts.aspx

The post of CMD of that foundation is occupied by a doctor:

//David Rosser, Executive Medical Director

David trained at University of Wales College of Medicine and did his basic specialist training in medicine and anaesthesia in South Wales before becoming a research fellow and lecturer in Clinical Pharmacology at University College London Hospital.He joined the Trust in 1996, became lead clinician for the Queen Elizabeth Intensive Care unit in December 1997 before becoming Group Director and then Divisional Director of Division One in 2002.Dr Rosser was also Senior Responsible Owner for Connecting for Health’s e-prescribing programme, providing national guidance on e-prescribing to the Department of Health. Dr Rosser took up the role of Medical Director in December 2006. He has executiveresponsibility for IT and Quality.//

Nigerian hospitals are not a foundation, and we don't have CEOs as managers. They are set up for medical services, and teaching hospitals for teaching doctors, medical services and research. They are DEPENDENT on government, as it's not a business or a foundation (in fact still receiving intervention funds from the government ). We run hospitals through directorates - medical, nursing etc, and with an overall CMD.

I thank you for your wonderful observation, firstly noting that the highest position in the NHS is left open for "Anyone" and not just the doctors. (But your beloved doctors seem to think otherwise.)

Secondly the CMD (Chief Medical Director) is a doctor understandably so, what else do you expect? A nurse is the CNO (Chief Nursing Officer) and they are both heading their various departments in that trust . I hope you get that right.

Now if you look at the flow chart you will see (or maybe you forgot to observe) that both the CMD and CNO are under the CEO who happens to be a Nurse! Now I don't think any doctor in Nigeria would like that, no way! Afterall that's what they are fighting for.

My point? That anybody can be the CEO/Chairman of a medical organisation/hospital as long as they have the right training, skills, experience and are competent to do so and not because they are "doctors" or own a medical degree.

Lastly I am a "she" you also failed to observe that.

DIDNT RILAMAKA SEE THIS:

skelewu74:

Hmmm, shakehead. He even thinks we run the same system as uk. Doesn't even know that nurses are not entitled to the post of CMD in uk.

He doesn't even know that the link he posted above is a link to an NHS "Foundation " Trust and that in such a foundation, post of CEO is the one left open to anyone.

This is what a foundation trust is in the uk NHS:

//NHS foundation trusts,

first introduced in April 2004, differ from other existing NHS trusts. They are independent legal entities and have unique governance arrangements. They are accountable to local people, who can become members and governors. Each NHS foundation trust has a duty to consult and involve a board of governors (including patients, staff, members of the public, and partner organisations) in the strategic planning of the organisation.They are set free from central government control and are no-longer performance managed by health authorities. As self-standing, self-governing organisations, NHS foundation trusts are free to determine their own future.They have financial freedoms and can raise capital from both the public and private sectors within borrowing limits determined by projected cash flowsand therefore based on affordability. They can retainfinancial surpluses to invest in the delivery of new NHS services.

Foundation trusts are overseen by Monitor.//
http://www.nhs.uk/NHSEngland/thenhs/about/Pages/authoritiesandtrusts.aspx

The post of CMD of that foundation is occupied by a doctor:

//David Rosser, Executive Medical Director

David trained at University of Wales College of Medicine and did his basic specialist training in medicine and anaesthesia in South Wales before becoming a research fellow and lecturer in Clinical Pharmacology at University College London Hospital.He joined the Trust in 1996, became lead clinician for the Queen Elizabeth Intensive Care unit in December 1997 before becoming Group Director and then Divisional Director of Division One in 2002.Dr Rosser was also Senior Responsible Owner for Connecting for Health’s e-prescribing programme, providing national guidance on e-prescribing to the Department of Health. Dr Rosser took up the role of Medical Director in December 2006. He has executiveresponsibility for IT and Quality.//

Nigerian hospitals are not a foundation, and we don't have CEOs as managers. They are set up for medical services, and teaching hospitals for teaching doctors, medical services and research. They are DEPENDENT on government, as it's not a business or a foundation (in fact still receiving intervention funds from the government ). We run hospitals through directorates - medical, nursing etc, and with an overall CMD which must be a doctor. Get it?

Rilamaka:

Excuse me I can see that you are not intelligent. Did you see the words CLINICAL I highlighted it for you. Obviously she would not just be the Chief executive just like that, (for some reason only doctors in Nigeria think that they are qualified to jump into management positions just because they have medical degree, is that not laughable? And for you to base ur arguement on that, pfft what more can i say? Mediocrity and small thinking at its highest peak!)

For someone who has such an ambition to move up, you definitely have to gain more training in management which means deviating a little bit from her NURSING background because her role is becoming "Less Clinical" and more managerial.

So in future if you want to point out an error in judgement or dispute the relevance of an article (such as the link I posted), try to understand what their point is before doing so.

I don't think you have the capacity but I will try to spell it out for clarity sake since you are dumb.

Her background is NURSING and I posted this link so you could see with your eyes and expand your line of reasoning that positions as such as this, are not doctors' birth right as you stated clearly that it's not right for someone from other disciplines to lead the hospital.

This link my proves you wrong and among other things goes a long way to show that you are a narrow minded individual who does not see anything beyond what's already in place.

Be it a medical doctor or whatever, who goes all the way to the top without taking management courses? That only happens in Nigeria, so u see u r argument is deeply flawed even more than the decaying health sector in Nigeria headed by power grabbing, incompetent and disgustingly greedy doctors who feel that being at the top is their birthright.

Get it right fo.ol.

have i insulted you in anyway? I thought we were having a civil debate? na wa o! anyway I will not return fire.

read the post above this from skelewu.
she is chief executive not because she is a nurse BUT because she's also got administrative training and experience.

Rilamaka:

I thank you for your wonderful observation, firstly noting that the highest position in the NHS is left open for "Anyone" and not just the doctors. (But your beloved doctors seem to think otherwise.)

Secondly the CMD is a doctor understandably so, so is the CNO. I hope you get that right. Now if you look at the flow chart you will see (or maybe you forgot to observe) that both the CMD and CNO are under the CEO who happens to be a Nurse! Now I don't think any doctor in Nigeria would like that, no way! Afterall that's what they are fighting for.

My point? Great that anybody can be the CEO/Chairman as long as they have the right training, skills, experience and are competent to do so and because they are "doctors" or own a medical degree.

Lastly I am a "she" you also failed to observe that.

You couldn't understand what you are reading. Could this also be the way you approach other issues too, especially this one?

That thing is not NHS trust; It is a Trust Foundation. That's why I made it clear to you. There are normal NHS Trust, and NHS Foundation. It is in the foundation that you can see all that abberation that you are counting as though it were norm in the UK.

Anything that is a foundation will have a CEO that can be just anybody.

Our hospitals are not foundations.. OK?

Sorry for taking you for a "he"

Rilamaka:

I thank you for your wonderful observation, firstly noting that the highest position in the NHS is left open for "Anyone" and not just the doctors. (But your beloved doctors seem to think otherwise.)

Secondly the CMD is a doctor understandably so, so is the CNO. I hope you get that right. Now if you look at the flow chart you will see (or maybe you forgot to observe) that both the CMD and CNO are under the CEO who happens to be a Nurse! Now I don't think any doctor in Nigeria would like that, no way! Afterall that's what they are fighting for.

My point? Great that anybody can be the CEO/Chairman as long as they have the right training, skills, experience and are competent to do so and because they are "doctors" or own a medical degree.

Lastly I am a "she" you also failed to observe that.

she is the chief executive NOT because she is a nurse.that is the point.
doctors are saying that in the teaching hospitals the post of CMD should be left to doctors like in your link.

phantom: have i insulted you in anyway? I thought we were having a civil debate? na wa o! anyway I will not return fire.

read the post above this from skelewu.
she is chief executive not because she is a nurse BUT she's also got administrative training and experience.

You still missed the point! Who becomes a manager without undertaking a managerial post? Nigerian doctors of course lol!

You guys are funny. Smh. Of course she had to take the management course thats what people in civilised countries do Mr! Did u understand anything I wrote at all? Smh

Rilamaka:

You still missed the point! Who becomes a manager without undertaking a managerial post? Nigerian doctors of course lol!

You guys are funny. Smh. Of course she had to take the management course thats what people in civilised countries do Mr! Did u understand anything I wrote at all? Smh

madam take a deep breath and relax. your link shows that apart from the chief executive there is a medical executive director who is equivalent to our CMD.
that is why I still think there should be an overall executive in our teaching hospitals who can be anyone with a management training.

[quote author=phantom]she is the chief executive NOT because she is a nurse.that is the point.
doctors are saying that in the teaching hospitals the post of CMD should be left to doctors like in your link.
[/quote

Well that's because the CMD is the highest position available at the moment in Nigerian hospitals and I agree with other disciplines when they dispute that only doctors should be apointed as CMD's.

The CMD in Nigerian hospitals is equivalent to the Chairman in the NHS Trusts' in UK and like I have stated a million times over, someone should not be appointed CMD just because they are doctors.

That's all I am saying and please don't turn this into a circus for dissecting what CMD means and what it doesn't mean because at the moment Nigerian hospitals do NOT have Chairmen as the Number one official in any hospital organisation and I bet if they had something as such as that, the doctors will also be clamoring to make that position peculiar to their profession.

I hope we are clear on this?

phantom: madam take a deep breath and relax. your link shows that apart from the chief executive there is a medical executive director who is equivalent to our CMD.
that is why I still think there should be an overall executive in our teaching hospitals who can be anyone with a management training.

Thank you! That's all I am saying but until then, the position of the CMD is still equivalent to that of the Chairmen in NHS Trusts' and should not be exclusive to doctors. That's the point.

Like you don't know that all doctors are fighting for is to always occupy the number one position in any hospital, but that should not be the case.

Thanks!

skelewu74:

You couldn't understand what you are reading. Could this also be the way you approach other issues too, especially this one?

That thing is not NHS trust; It is a Trust Foundation. That's why I made it clear to you. There are normal NHS Trust, and NHS Foundation. It is in the foundation that you can see all that abberation that you are counting as though it were norm in the UK. Mi

Anything that is a foundation will have a CEO that can be just anybody.

Our hospitals are not foundations.. OK?

Sorry for taking you for a "he"

I should say that all I can see is a strong display of projection. What do you think is the norm in the UK? I live and work in the UK and I can boldly tell you that be it an NHS Trust or NHS Foundation, the number one position isn't always occupied by a doctor. The CMD yes, and that's why there is a CNO too! And overall they answer to someone above them.

Speaking of projection it's you who do NOT understand what you read and hence cannot make an empirical deduction from what I wrote in the previous post.

The position of the CMD in Nigeria is equivalent to that of the Chairman in any NHS hospital be it "Foundation or Trust" and like I said initially it isn't always occupied by someone because they own a medical degree but because they are well trained, have skills and experience and are competent to run the hospital.

If Nigerian hospitals are to have Chairmen as the number one officials the doctors would also want to make it peculiar to their position and hence the reason for the link I posted.

Anyone can run the hospital if they are competent to do so regardless of their background! Now that's not too difficult to understand.

PS: The hospital I work for is headed by a Nurse who happens to be the Hospital Director, and it's a private hospital, so what are we talking about? Does it stop doctors from working in that hospital? No!

skelewu74:

You couldn't understand what you are reading. Could this also be the way you approach other issues too, especially this one?

That thing is not NHS trust; It is a Trust Foundation. That's why I made it clear to you. There are normal NHS Trust, and NHS Foundation. It is in the foundation that you can see all that abberation that you are counting as though it were norm in the UK.

Anything that is a foundation will have a CEO that can be just anybody.

Our hospitals are not foundations.. OK?

Sorry for taking you for a "he"

Rilamaka, YOU HAVEN'T RESPONDED TO THIS OBSERVATION I PUT TO YOU UP HERE.

I said that link is a link to a NHS Trust FOUNDATION; NOT A NORMAL NHS TRUST.

Anybody can be a CEO of a foundation. If I were the owner of LUTH, I could put anybody there as the CEO. If I Bill Gates founds an hospital, do you think he cannot put you, a nurse, or an archaeologist there as the CEO of that foundation? That doesn't have to do with how things are run normally.

Our hospitals are not a foundation, OK? There are foundation aspects of some teaching hospitals e.g. UCH has Alaanu Foundation, that has a separate CEO but the same CMD as UCH. Do you get?

phantom[b:
]have i insulted you in anyway?[/b] I thought we were having a civil debate? na wa o! anyway I will not return fire.

read the post above this from skelewu.
she is chief executive not because she is a nurse BUT because she's also got administrative training and experience.

No sir and I am really truly sorry for calling you a fo.ol.

I am not a big fan of name calling and that was my mistake so let's carry on with our civil debate. I'm really sorry about that.

I like how you said that the hospital you work for has a nurse as the Hospital Director. AND IT'S A PRIVATE HOSPITAL.

That's exactly the point. It's a private business. It's not anybody's concern. That's exactly what foundations too signify. INDEPENDENCE. I highlighted that to you previously. NHS Trust Foundation are INDEPENDENT of the government, can determine their own future and plans.

Is that settled?

skelewu74:

Rilamaka, YOU HAVEN'T RESPONDED TO THIS OBSERVATION I PUT TO YOU UP HERE.

I said that link is a link to a NHS Trust FOUNDATION; NOT A NORMAL NHS TRUST.

Anybody can be a CEO of a foundation. If I were the owner of LUTH, I could put anybody there as the CEO. If I Bill Gates founds an hospital, do you think he cannot put you, a nurse, or an archaeologist there as the CEO of that foundation? That doesn't have to do with how things are run normally.

Our hospitals are not a foundation, OK? There are foundation aspects of some teaching hospitals e.g. UCH has Alaanu Foundation, that has a separate CEO but the same CMD as UCH. Do you get?

I understand where you are coming from but at the same time disagree with you completely.

Teaching or training hospitals are not for training doctors exclusively neither do doctors work there exclusively.

Everything medical is patient centered that's what make a hospital move forward. All disciplines are independent and at the same time interdependent which means that no one discipline is more important or Lord over other disciplines. Hence my strong disagreement over doctors owning the right to run a hospital because it's a training hospital.

If a doctor owns a hospital he can run it, but if the government is paying his salary such as everyone else in that hospital the only way he can be ahead of the other disciplines is salary wise which is an undisputed fact.

But to tell me that they deserve the exclusive right to occupy the CMD position is a no no to me, because the Nigerian government operates on a level system so telling me that a level 200 nurse is not as eligible as a level 200 doctor to become the hospital's CMD is complete bullshit.

Get it?

skelewu74: I like how you said that the hospital you work for has a nurse as the Hospital Director. AND IT'S A PRIVATE HOSPITAL.

That's exactly the point. It's a private business. It's not anybody's concern. That's exactly what foundations too signify. INDEPENDENCE. I highlighted that to you previously. NHS Trust Foundation are INDEPENDENT of the government, can determine their own future and plans.

Is that settled?

No thats not the point, the point I was trying to make is this be it an NHS or Private hospitals (In England) as long as you are competent, you can run the hospital regardless of your background. That's my point.

Got it?

Rilamaka:

I understand where you are coming from but at the same time disagree with you completely.

Teaching or training hospitals are not for training doctors exclusively neither do doctors work there exclusively.

Everything medical is patient centered that's what make a hospital move forward. All disciplines are independent and at the same time interdependent which means that no one discipline is more important or Lord over other disciplines. Hence my strong disagreement over doctors owning the right to run a hospital because it's a training hospital.

If a doctor owns a hospital he can run it, but if the government is paying his salary such as everyone else in that hospital the only way he can be ahead of the other disciplines is salary wise which is an undisputed fact.

But to tell me that they deserve the exclusive right to occupy the CMD position is a no no to me, because the Nigerian government operates on a level system so telling me that a level 200 nurse is not as eligible as a level 200 doctor to become the hospital's CMD is complete bullshit.

Get it?

You are still using the word CMD, and so you wanna tell me how you want a nurse to be the Medical Director? Is that even done in uk where you are working? There are directors of nursing services, which no one contests with nurses. It also has a school of nursing attached, and nobody contests directorship with nurses. Our hospitals run medical services. It is a medical facility deserving of a Medical Director.

skelewu74:

You are still using the word CMD, and so you wanna tell me how you want a nurse to be the Medical Director? Is that even done in uk where you are working? There are directors of nursing services, which no one contests with nurses. It also has a school of nursing attached, and nobody contests directorship with nurses. Our hospitals run medical services. It is a medical facility deserving of a Medical Director.

Yes the hospital I work in, a nurse is the Medical Director. Lol! In England everything is about equality as long as you have the skills and prove that you are competent to take up the position the sky is your limit men.

Don't sound surprised Nigeria is a very very stereotypical country so I am schooling you darling.

That's why you see me arguing with you every step of the way, anything is possible with the right skills, training and experience, someone's background shouldn't hold them back. That's how things are been done in progressive areas.

I hope I have made myself clear.

PS: I was very very very surprised the day I found out that my hospital director was a Nurse because like every other Nigerian I was thinking that he was a doctor. You can imagine the shock... It's not anybody's exclusive reserve to lead the hospital.

Rilamaka:

Yes the hospital I work in, a nurse is the Medical Director. Lol! In England everything is about equality as long as you have the skills and prove that you are competent to take up the position the sky is your limit men.

Don't sound surprised Nigeria is a very very stereotypical country so I am schooling you darling.

That's why you see me arguing with you every step of the way, anything is possible with the right skills, training and experience, someone's background shouldn't hold them back. That's how things are been done in progressive areas.

I hope I have made myself clear.

PS: I was very very very surprised the day I found out that my hospital director was a Nurse because like every other Nigerian I was thinking that he was a doctor. You can imagine the shock... It's not anybody's exclusive reserve to lead the hospital.

Can you please give us the name of the "CMD" nurse.

I like to learn new things.

Rilamaka:

Yes the hospital I work in, a nurse is the Medical Director. Lol! In England everything is about equality as long as you have the skills and prove that you are competent to take up the position the sky is your limit men.

Don't sound surprised Nigeria is a very very stereotypical country so I am schooling you darling.

That's why you see me arguing with you every step of the way, anything is possible with the right skills, training and experience, someone's background shouldn't hold them back. That's how things are been done in progressive areas.

I hope I have made myself clear.

PS: I was very very very surprised the day I found out that my hospital director was a Nurse because like every other Nigerian I was thinking that he was a doctor. You can imagine the shock... It's not anybody's exclusive reserve to lead the hospital.

You are committing the same blunder over and over again, and I keep correcting you. A PRIVATE BUSINESS YOU ARE WORKING IN DOES NOT HAVE ANY BEARING ON WHAT WE ARE SAYING.
IF MY FATHER OWNS A LEGAL FIRM, EVEN AS I AM NOT A LAWYER, I CAN BE THE CEO. It's our business. My friends father owned a hospital in my town. Even as we were students back then, after his father's demise, he assumed the Director of the hospital. He was a student of Electrical Engineering.

Wouldn't it be inane to want to use this as a yardstick for running the affairs of public institutions?

Or what exactly are you saying? If it were the norm in uk to put non medically competent individuals as medical Director of medical facilities, then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide many links to those hospitals (not a foundation) And if so, then why a nurse, and not a geologist or theatre artist?

alakid:

Mr. Lab scientist, please answer the following questions.
1. If Robert kock was a botanist and Pasteur was a chemist, why did you send scientists(the real ones) eg microbiologist, physiologists and biochemists out of the lab?

2. Can you carry out an autopsy?

3. Can you do bone marrow biopsy?

4. Can you run a metabolic/endocrine clinic?

I can go on and on!
Just forget it, a Pathologist is pure class compared to a PhD lab scientist.

Mr, there are advances in medical sciences, the curriculum was evaluated and it was clearly understood that being a Generalist-Scientist will entail the filling of pre-existing knowledge gaps. B.MLS was borne on that premise. It is an Internationally recognized degree.

http://www.unb.ca/academics/programs/undergrad/fr/medical/
https://www.qut.edu.au/study/courses/bachelor-of-medical-laboratory-science
http://www.massey.ac.nz/massey/learning/programme-course-paper/programme.cfm?prog_id=92410

Let me ask you a simple question. How do you expect someone with just a degree in physiology to understand the isolation of different Vibro sp and biotypes?. How do you expect someone with a degree in microbiology to carry out the principles and procedures of microtomy, fixation, and the study of hemoglobinopathies in the lab. Use your head now. If he fails in his duty, won't your allo-guys be the first to ridicule him and call him demeaning names? Won't you be the first to call for his head if does a wrong cross-match and kills a patient with a wrong pint of blood.

Stop pretending you are fighting for them, some of them have become industrial and public analysts and they are very smart to understand that you are simply looking for cheap allies to carry your baggage in your war against Scientists. Trust me they are not fooled by your "fake sympathy".

As for running autopsy and what not, i work within the ambit of my profession, i don't cross lines like you lots. I won't do the job of a pathologist in morbid section, have never claimed to. I also do not expect you a pathologist to do my job, it is illegal can only be seen as quackery.

yeah any links proving that nurses head PUBLIC hospitals in the UK or the US would be very much appreciated

skelewu74:

You are committing the same blunder over and over again, and I keep correcting you. A PRIVATE BUSINESS YOU ARE WORKING IN DOES NOT HAVE ANY BEARING ON WHAT WE ARE SAYING.
IF MY FATHER OWNS A LEGAL FIRM, EVEN AS I AM NOT A LAWYER, I CAN BE THE CEO. It's our business. My friends father owned a hospital in my town. Even as we were students back then, after his father's demise, he assumed the Director of the hospital. He was a student of Electrical Engineering.

Wouldn't it be inane to want to use this as a yardstick for running the affairs of public institutions?

Or what exactly are you saying? If it were the norm in uk to put non medically competent individuals as medical Director of medical facilities, then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide many links to those hospitals (not a foundation) And if so, then why a nurse, and not a geologist or theatre artist?

Stop okay!!! Just stop it. You actually ignoring the point I clearly made in the previous posts puts you in the same category as power hungry and myopic Nigerian individuals.

I thought you were reasonable and enlightened but you have decided to continue to hold on to me stating that the hospital I work for is "Private" and for that reason a Nurse or any other person can be on charge.

Are you an unrepentant egotistical backward individual or are you just incredibly stupid? I have told you times without Number that in Hospitals in the UK both NHS and Private hospitals the No 1 person in charge is not always a doctor and as a matter of the fact the position is NEVER reserved for any one based on their discipline.

Is it that you don't understand simple English? Or that you can't make empirical and objective deductions or that you are amazingly slow?

What the fvck man, don't pick "my statements" that seem to support your argument whilst missing the main point. WTH

skelewu74:

You are committing the same blunder over and over again, and I keep correcting you. A PRIVATE BUSINESS YOU ARE WORKING IN DOES NOT HAVE ANY BEARING ON WHAT WE ARE SAYING.
IF MY FATHER OWNS A LEGAL FIRM, EVEN AS I AM NOT A LAWYER, I CAN BE THE CEO. It's our business. My friends father owned a hospital in my town. Even as we were students back then, after his father's demise, he assumed the Director of the hospital. He was a student of Electrical Engineering.

Wouldn't it be inane to want to use this as a yardstick for running the affairs of public institutions?

Or what exactly are you saying? If it were the norm in uk to put non medically competent individuals as medical Director of medical facilities, then it shouldn't be hard for you to provide many links to those hospitals (not a foundation) And if so, then why a nurse, and not a geologist or theatre artist?

I have replied to this message but it seems to have disappeared.

How do u mean blunder? You are the one who is completely misunderstanding me and who actually needs to be corrected over and over again and to be honest I am getting tired of repea ting myself.

Is it that you don't understand English or that you lack the ability to make empirical deductions in other to come to an objective conclusion or that you are incredibly slow?

I don't know if it's the need to protect bruised ego that makes you stubbornly cling to this "one example of me working in a private hospital that's headed by a Nurse" whilst ignoring the bigger picture and missing the whole point (or you would like me to think so).

The point I was trying to make right from my first post is that all the hospitals in the UK, NHS or Private do not reserve the number one position for anyone because they have medical degree instead one can run the hospital if they "possess the skills, are trained and are competent to do so!"

One can be the number one personnel in any hospital in the UK regardless of their background and in Nigeria the no 1 position in the teaching hospital is usually the CMD which is equivalent to the Chairman of any NHS hospital and Medical/Hospital Director in any private hospital respectively. Now that's my fvcking point.

I didn't think u were this slow... men...

Blunder, because I sighted the private hospital I work for as an additional example? And you jumped on that? really? Didn't you read my first post? Can't you understand that I was expanding? Giving more examples? Jesus Christ!

dumodust:
Me pained... hahaha...nigger stays in his corner in the lab and whines about his role like he knows anything... what the heck are u talking about bottles? Everyone knows about the green(edta), yellow etc if an intern makes a mistake that is his business but you havent talked about even 5% of what is in his brain that u dont know So your specialty is to know bottles now? Hahaha.., If I started writing letters from where I am about u quacks, there will be a long line from my office to the gate waiting to beg me.
and negro... we are not at the same level, I graduated aeons ago, a super specialist in my field and guys like u beg me for favours so shut your recently graduated ass and quit talking about elementary sample bottles like if they are supposed to be important,they are even colour coded to the forms...psst. See olodo that hides away in the lab, someone that is not even noticed when important decisions are being taken, I dont discuss with lab technicians... I have chemical pathologists, etc to talk to... buzz of, mechanic and bottles...lol
consultant mls my foot , go and tell them that in private international labs like pathcare and clina....lol

Lmao!, Bruises all over your boyish ego,

I'll have you dragged on the ground all over this thread, and i mean it.

You say you are super-specialist? . let me have a good laugh for a sec.

Oh come on! 200L medical students will cover their faces in shame at your horrible level of grasp and brain power. Just read up the babbles you stringed up there.

My specialty is not just to know bottles, i pointed out that a Med. lab assistant is even more qualified than your puffy goons with empty skulls in technical lab matters and was able to school your stethoscope-hanging types who can't bend down and learn.

You say you are a "super-specialist"?, brother the signs are not there. What am i saying? Whatever is in an empty gourd is more valuable than what's in that cranium you carry up there. Everyone can see that.
I want to still believe the wardguys are more intelligent than this so desist from calling yourself one and dragging them in thick mud with you. Ok?

Boy, I've asked your seniors who claim to know everything in the lab few 200L questions but with their high population and supposedly "high I.Q" here, none have been able to even attempt. I'm damn sure if it were a question about sample bottles and PCV(an assistant's job), they'll pounce on it.

I'll reproduce it here

----> "Why do we preferably run H-D
method on wet mounts?, Can you
also tell us the role of trimethoprim in
the constitution of S-medium for
isolation of microaerophilic, catalase-
variables?".
............................................................................................................................................................................

Now Mr fake, attempt it and prove to us you are an "Ultra-super-specialist" or go hide in your classroom, till you pass your first ever "in-course". Bloody scamp!

ziga:

Can you please give us the name of the "CMD" nurse.

I like to learn new things.

Embrace Google baby...

ziga:

Can you please give us the name of the "CMD" nurse.

I like to learn new things.

And I know as a Nigerian living in Nigeria (as it seems) you may not be able to understand the full implications of company policies. But if you do that makes my job easier as a result I can't go about spilling my hospital's director's name on social media just because I want to prove a point.

Google baby and you will improve your existing knowledge.

YourHealthlabs:

Mr, there are advances in medical sciences, the curriculum was evaluated and it was clearly understood that being a Generalist-Scientist will entail the filling of pre-existing knowledge gaps. B.MLS was borne on that premise. It is an Internationally recognized degree.

http://www.unb.ca/academics/programs/undergrad/fr/medical/
https://www.qut.edu.au/study/courses/bachelor-of-medical-laboratory-science
http://www.massey.ac.nz/massey/learning/programme-course-paper/programme.cfm?prog_id=92410

Let me ask you a simple question. How do you expect someone with just a degree in physiology to understand the isolation of different Vibro sp and biotypes?. How do you expect someone with a degree in microbiology to carry out the principles and procedures of microtomy, fixation, and the study of hemoglobinopathies in the lab. Use your head now. If he fails in his duty, won't your allo-guys be the first to ridicule him and call him demeaning names? Won't you be the first to call for his head if does a wrong cross-match and kills a patient with a wrong pint of blood.

Stop pretending you fighting for them, some of them have become industrial and public analysts and they are very smart to understand that you are simply looking for cheap allies to carry your baggage in your war against Scientists. Trust me they are not fooled by your "fake sympathy".

As for running autopsy and what not, i work within the ambit of my profession, i don't cross lines like you lots. I won't do the job of a pathologist in morbid section, have never claimed to. I also do not expect you to do my job, it is illegal can only be seen as quackery.

So we are in agreement that an MLS is an MLS and a pathologist is a pathologist, no more saying you own the Lab!

skelewu74:

My dear, you are not independent. You are mid-level practisioners. You are not allowed to do a lot of things. So if you think you are independent, maybe that's on a web page or inside your books.

You are responsible to the doctor. I wonder why I am telling this to a nurse. Are you not supposed to know this?

That's the most ludicrous thing I have ever heard about nursing. Is that what "your wife" tells you at home? Do you by any chance know the history and inception of Nursing? Like I said earlier on being married to a nurse doesn't mean you know jack about Nursing. Please try to gain some knowledge before to come here to display your ignorance.

Even doctors don't say this about nurses. "Nurses are responsible to doctors?" *smh*.

FYI : Nurses do not and will never answer to doctors, Nursing is an Independent and at the same time an interdependent profession that answers to nobody but their direct superiors.

If your wife studied Nursing properly she would tell you that a typical nursing intervention adopts the doctor's prescribed medications as a last resort. Get some education man.

You can start by asking your wife to describe some nursing theory to you, even rudimentary ones as such as Florence Nightingale.

Nursing has never and will be never be about carrying out doctor's instructions, got it?