LegalWolf:


LOL! But you can spiritually understand the Quran right? Lol! You stink of hypocrisy!

I have actually rested my case with you but the potential thief has been ranting in my mentions and calling me to give credence to a thread that he created.

But just to point it out clearly here for anyone to see: As a matter of principle, I would not debate religion with someone who is fraudulent liar and a potential thief. I call him a potential thief because according to the Yoruba people (which I think he belongs to), an habitual liar is a potential thief. These are not my words but the wise sayings of the Yoruba people.

I pulled this potential thief out as a liar and I keep asking him to give me one reason why I should engage a fraudulent liar. At a point, I was asking that what gives me the comfort that if I engage him he would not lie again. Hissplendor saw the deadlock and came in between us so as to pass this potential thief's questions to me which I kept answering.

Alas! This potential thief went to forge a statement, put it in inverted comma, and ascribed it to me. And you expect me to answer any question coming out from the potential thief's mouth? He has just started wailing on his thread and he will wail more.

cc: Potential Thief TenQ

Is the Quran spiritual?

LegalWolf:


Hi Elated177,

I think the issue here stems from a different approach to religion, faith, understanding of divine being etc. Take for example, what you asked me to consider, i.e., the underlined (which do you prefer - Yhwh, Jehovah or Yhvh. I noticed you spelt it Yhvh?). I do NOT agree to that in any material respect.

See it from this angle. Will you deride a chosen vessel of the Creator who, by the power of the Creator, becomes tired, for a while, of course, after exerting some influence on the sun, when the collective soul strength of 10, 000,000 ordinary humans can't do it?

LegalWolf:

To the best of my knowledge, there is no scriptural reference in my faith to back that up. In fact, what I know (and I stand to be corrected) is that we are all equal (whether anointed or not - of course, subject to God's discretion), no nation is superior to the other (and that includes the children of Israel, Arabs, Fulani, Yoruba, Kalabari etc) amongst others. That is my conception of faith. To the extent that there may be room for divergence of opinion in other other things, but as I understand it, this is what I think complies with reason!

Whatever it was that you were trying to pass across didn't take place. What is the relevance of your assertions above to what I asked?

LegalWolf:


(underlined mine)

Now your questions raise a lot of logical problems that I would want you to consider.

Granted, the creation of man and the entire universe is no mean feat that we have never seen before. So also is the explosion of human population to over 7 billion people (and Christians to over 2 billion people) as we speak today.

Are you also an atheist?

LegalWolf:

You will agree with me that these statistical figures above are factual and have a higher probability of being true.

Are you sure you are not an atheist?

LegalWolf:

Then the issue is: if we hypothetically accept the view that after God created the heaven and earth and before there was man or even rain, he got tired. Hypothetically, what gives us the comfort that the same God would be able to say (for example) answer the prayers of 2 billion people not to talk of 7 billion people? Why did I say this: Just like the preceding premise (of something never done before), we have never in the history of the Universe have we had such explosion in human population and we cannot be so certain that our prayers/supplications would not wear him out.

The God who made the heavens, the earth, the seas and everything in them will never be inundated with the population of the world. How could you even imagine such a thing? Is the oxygen in the air complaining about the population of the world?

LegalWolf:


Okay let us take our assumption a nudge further: If we accept the view that this same God became tired after working for 6 days and rested on the 7th, hypothetically, we cannot say for certain what other WORK he is doing AT PRESENT and whether he is EXHAUSTED AND RESTING AFTER SUCH WORK OR NOT

Let me just follow your own premise. Let us say, hypothetically, of course, that the Creator gets tired after carrying out a particular work right now, his strength will still be unquantifiably higher than the collective strength of all the 8 billion humans and other supernatural entities. What am I saying? I am saying that whatever work the Creator does will still be too much for all the 8 billion humans and other supernatural entities put together. If this the case, it means that the Creator will never be in a state that he will be inundated with size of the other supernatural entities and whatever may be the population of humans on earth. Did you get my point?

LegalWolf:

Again, I can keep building on this premise of an exhausted God to construct as many bizzare examples and each will be logically sound. And even our understanding of the creator never getting tired or weak would be a ruse, don't you think?

My Scripture has made it explicitly clear to me that the Creator neither sleeps nor slumbers.

Everything you try to build on that hypothetical assertion will always crumble. The weakness of the Creator, if it exists at all, will always be unquantifiably greater than the collective strength of the other supernatural entities and all the humans earth at any time.

LegalWolf:

On the question of 'Do you believe that the God spoken of in that portion of the Scripture is the same one that you worship?' This is an interesting topic that will divert our attention. Not just that, it will distract from the post about genesis or on the thread in particular. However, the core point I will just draw your attention to is that there exists some convincing literature which suggests that Yhwh may have been interchanged for the jewish name of God at some point in Israel's history. (In fact, the name Israel indicates he who perseveres with God not Yhwh). There is even a whole lot of academic commentary on Genesis 32: 8 - 9.

You should have just answered the simple question. It will not divert our attention since it is part of the discourse. In fact, you are just being evasive. Just answer the question.

LegalWolf:

Let me give you a similitude. I was watching Professor Wole Soyinka on Youtube the other day saying that when the missionaries came to Yorubaland, they deliberately (I will say mischievously) converted a God of the Yoruba pantheon (Esu) into Satan. These are not my words byt Prof Soyinka in case you dispute it. In fact, in Yorubaland today, many people call Satan "Esu". But Esu is completely different from Satan. If, hypothetically, X from Bahia (brazil) worships Esu, it does not follow that he worships Satan and vice versa. The fact that the picture that comes to mind when Esu is uttered in Yoruba language is Satan does not mean they are the same thing.

What is the relevance of what you said to my question?

LegalWolf:

Again, I do not intend to go into this in details as it would change the trajectory of our conversation substantially. I think you should have gotten my drift from my explanation by now in relation to your question.

More like your dribbling, you mean? It is a simple question. Would you say that the God described in that portion of the Scripture is the same with the one you worship? There is nothing wrong with this question and it is relevant to the topic of discourse.

LegalWolf:

You can let me know if you need further clarification or what not. Cheers and enjoy your evening as it comes.

What clarification?
You carefully evaded all the questions. Wow!

HisSplendor:


Is the Quran spiritual?

Yes and no!

YES in the sense that it lis a satanic book that certainly would lead a person to Hell.

Qur'an 19:71-72
71. There is not one of you but shall come to it, that is, shall enter hell. That is an inevitability [already] decreed by your Lord, [something which] He made inevitable and [which] He decreed; He will not waive it. 72. Then We shall deliver those that feared Allah and leave the wrong-doers there on their knees


NO in the sense that it is the Words of Mohammed feigning to be Allah.

Qur'an 69:40
because the Quran is certainly the word of a reverent (honoured) messenger.

Because of this, Mohammed can abrogate verses in the Qur'an. Mutah and five times of prayer are examples.


If Allah dictated the Qur'an through Jubril to Mohammed, Allah should know that women don't produce sperm gushing from their ribs and men's sperm does not come from the backbone. Allah should know that there is no mountain in the sky from which hail stones are cut and hurled to the earth. Allah should know that the sun does not set in the murky waters. Allah should not legalise prostitution (Mutah) for Muslims and Allah should not reveal breastfeeding of adult men ten times by a woman (thanks to the tame sheep that abrogated the verses). Allah should not encourage a man to flirt with the wife of his adopted son and marry her to the detriment of Zaid. Allah then canceled adoption so that Mohammed's lust can be fulfilled.

The Qur'an is a book of contradictions. Can you imagine one verse canceling our another (abrogation).

TenQ:

Please can you directly ask the baby_lawyer this question he's been avoiding because TenQ beat him so bad he wept for two days straight on Nairaland?


parallel to Judges 1:19

Was Allah with Mohammed when he fought the battle of Uhud and lost not only the battle but his set of front teeth?

I won't be surprised if he starts ranting about the pain TenQ caused him rather than answering the question

Why would I do that?

TenQ:

Yes and no!

YES in the sense that it lis a satanic book that certainly would lead a person to Hell.

Qur'an 19:71-72
71. There is not one of you but shall come to it, that is, shall enter hell. That is an inevitability [already] decreed by your Lord, [something which] He made inevitable and [which] He decreed; He will not waive it. 72. Then We shall deliver those that feared Allah and leave the wrong-doers there on their knees


NO in the sense that it is the Words of Mohammed feigning to be Allah.

Qur'an 69:40
because the Quran is certainly the word of a reverent (honoured) messenger.

Because of this, Mohammed can abrogate verses in the Qur'an. Mutah and five times of prayer are examples.


If Allah dictated the Qur'an through Jubril to Mohammed, Allah should know that women don't produce sperm gushing from their ribs and men's sperm does not come from the backbone. Allah should know that there is no mountain in the sky from which hail stones are cut and hurled to the earth. Allah should know that the sun does not set in the murky waters. Allah should not legalise prostitution (Mutah) for Muslims and Allah should not reveal breastfeeding of adult men ten times by a woman (thanks to the tame sheep that abrogated the verses). Allah should not encourage a man to flirt with the wife of his adopted son and marry her to the detriment of Zaid. Allah then canceled adoption so that Mohammed's lust can be fulfilled.

The Qur'an is a book of contradictions. Can you imagine one verse canceling our another (abrogation).

Hmm. Islamic bondage is strong.

See how legalwolf is zealously defending this falsehood.

elated177:


Why would I do that?

He has been using Judges1:19 to argue that Yahweh was powerless to drive out the "God of Iron" - Ogun of the people with chariots of Iron. Every explanation has fallen on his deaf ears therefore I want to refer him to Islamic history so that he can use the same argument.

Mohammed fought a battle of Uhud and lost the Battle. In the battle, he also lost his set of front teeth.

The Question he should answer is (just like Judah) was Allah with Mohammed during this battle?

If YES : how come he lost the Battle? Is he saying that Allah is powerless?
This had been his argument since morning

If NO : It confirms that Mohammed is a false prophet.

The Question is to make him face his hypocrisy: as he is not interested in any Christian answer, he's only interested in repeating the same question endlessly.

He's been avoiding this question because, it will permanently shut his mouth.

Above is the reason!

HisSplendor:


Hmm. Islamic bondage is strong.

See how legalwolf is zealously defending this falsehood.

I expect him to start shouting about how the references I posted to the question is a lie and all the other tantrums rather than facing the truth.

You may ask him if any of the references or allegations I posted is true or not.

TenQ:



He has been using Judges1:19 to argue that Yahweh was powerless to drive out the "God of Iron" - Ogun of the people with chariots of Iron. Every explanation has fallen on his deaf ears

John 6: 43 “Stop grumbling among yourselves,” Yahushua answered. 44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘They will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me.

TenQ, you need to listen to the word of Yahushua the Messiah, whose servant you say you are. There is no compulsion in the Glad Tiding. YHVH Almighty is the only one who can draw people to his Word. The role of the saint, priest, servant, follower and messenger of YHVH Almighty is to disseminate the Truth. It is the prerogative of the hearer to either accept or reject what he or she hears. After all, at the end of the age, each person will answer for his or her actions here on earth.

TenQ:

therefore I want to refer him to Islamic history so that he can use the same argument.

Mohammed fought a battle of Uhud and lost the Battle. In the battle, he also lost his set of front teeth.

The Question he should answer is (just like Judah) was Allah with Mohammed during this battle?

If YES : how come he lost the Battle? Is he saying that Allah is powerless?
This had been his argument since morning

If NO : It confirms that Mohammed is a false prophet.

The Question is to make him face his hypocrisy: as he is not interested in any Christian answer, he's only interested in repeating the same question endlessly.

He's been avoiding this question because, it will permanently shut his mouth.

Above is the reason!

That question has no bearing on my righteous walk. His answer will not have any single bearing on my righteous walk. If you don't think so, tell me how and in what way(s) both the question and his answer will impact my righteous walk. If you do, then I may ask him.

It appears you two are in some kind of competition?

Hi Elated177

Okay let me break it down and answer all your questions in part.

elated177:

See it from this angle. Will you deride a chosen vessel of the Creator who, by the power of the Creator, becomes tired, for a while, of course, after exerting some influence on the sun, when the collective soul strength of 10, 000,000 ordinary humans can't do it?

I still fail to see it from your angle. If the Chosen vessel of the Creator implies any other thing apart from God himself, I will see it exactly for what it is. I will see it as a powerless, weak, tired and every adjective I can conjecture right now. That is what my faith teaches me and that is exactly what I will do.

elated177:


Whatever it was that you were trying to pass across didn't take place. What is the relevance of your assertions above to what I asked?

What was I trying to pass across? I thought my words were clear when I said the underlined. But for clarity, this is the underlined I meant:

" Consider this: What an anointed servant of YHVH Almighty can do spiritually and get tired is enough to cause 10,000,000 ordinary humans put together to faint if they just attempt it.

So just to answer your question again, in case you missed it, is this: I do not agree that what an anointed servant of Yhwh can do spiritually to get tired is enough to cause 10m ordinary humans put together to faint of they attempt it. Far from it. . An anointed servant of God is just like every normal human being like you and I. Simple at that!

elated177:


Are you also an atheist?

This is funny if not laughable. I quoted the population of the Universe and that of Christians as we speak today and the question you ask me is: am I an atheist? I think I need to confirm this: is this conversation based on commonsense and logic or something else? If it is not commonsensical or stems from logic, let me know so as to just keep quiet.

elated177:


Are you sure you are not an atheist?

This is even more laughable. Or are you referring to something else that I am unaware of? Or is it a mistake? As it appears to me, this part you are quoting is talking about if you agree with me that the population of the statistics of world & christian population as a high probability of being true. Again, is this conversation based on common sense?

elated177:

The God who made the heavens, the earth, the seas and everything in them will never be inundated with the population of the world. How could you even imagine such a thing? Is the oxygen in the air complaining about the population of the world?

That is why I am curious that if your own book could clearly state that Yhwh RESTED AFTER WORK, why on earth would it be far-fetched to assume that overseeing the affairs of the population of the world is a small feat?

elated177:

Let me just follow your own premise. Let us say, hypothetically, of course, that the Creator gets tired after carrying out a particular work right now, his strength will still be unquantifiably higher than the collective strength of all the 8 billion humans and other supernatural entities. What am I saying? I am saying that whatever work the Creator does will still be too much for all the 8 billion humans and other supernatural entities put together. If this the case, it means that the Creator will never be in a state that he will be inundated with size of the other supernatural entities and whatever may be the population of humans on earth. Did you get my point?

I fail to get your point, sincerely. First of, you conflated the argument and decided to mix up the point. I am unsure if this is deliberate or not but I will give you the benefit of doubt.

That said: I did not compare whatever the creator does to that of 8 billion humans and all supernatural entities put together. This is not even a point of my argument. According to genesis, at the time the earth was created, there was no human or even rain. Further, you even asked whether it is a minor thing to create any of the things he created. But what is also factually correct is that there are over 7 billion people on earth and at least 2 billion Christians. This fact (I mean the population) is something we have never seen before on earth. Therefore, if it took God Six days to create the Universe and he rested after his work, on what authority do we have that he would not rest (probably after every two days or so) when this 2 billion christians call on him?

elated177:

My Scripture has made it explicitly clear to me that the Creator neither sleeps nor slumbers.

Ohhh! I am unsure if it is ONLY your scripture of the many scriptures on earth that made this explicitly clear. But what I am very sure of is: On the 7th day your Scripture claims God created the universe, he rested from his work. The bible did not use stop, or cease, or any other language in that line (even though there are pieces of evidence in the same book of genesis that 'stop' was used). BUT HE RESTED AFTER his work

elated177:

Everything you try to build on that hypothetical assertion will always crumble. The weakness of the Creator, if it exists at all, will always be unquantifiably greater than the collective strength of the other supernatural entities and all the humans earth at any time.

.

I think the better way to couch it is every explanation you tried to build on an explicit verse that stated God Rested AFTER WORKING will crumble. If like Hissplendor, you want to deduce a 'spiritual message' from the book of genesis, that is up to you. But it is logically indefensible

elated177:

You should have just answered the simple question. It will not divert our attention since it is part of the discourse. In fact, you are just being evasive. Just answer the question.

Oh the simple question: let me put in highlight so you can see very clearly. I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT EVEN BELIEVE THAT THE GOD SPOKEN OF IN THAT PORTION OF THE BIBLE, THE ONE WHO RESTED FROM HIS WORK ON THE SEVENTH DAY AFTER CREATION, IS THE SAME GOD I WORSHIP. NEVER WAS HE, NEVER IS HE AND NEVER WOULD HE BE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! . Apart from highlight, how can I bold it and make it even more obvious? If you know any way, please let me know!

elated177:

What is the relevance of what you said to my question?

More like your dribbling, you mean? It is a simple question. Would you say that the God described in that portion of the Scripture is the same with the one you worship? There is nothing wrong with this question and it is relevant to the topic of discourse.

I think I have answered your question above, have I not?

elated177:

What clarification?
You carefully evaded all the questions. Wow!

Let me know any question I missed, please.

cc: Potential Thief: TenQ
Hissplendor

elated177:


John 6: 43 “Stop grumbling among yourselves,” Yahushua answered. 44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘They will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me.

TenQ, you need to listen to the word of Yahushua the Messiah, whose servant you say you are. There is no compulsion in the Glad Tiding. YHVH Almighty is the only one who can draw people to his Word. The role of the saint, priest, servant, follower and messenger of YHVH Almighty is to disseminate the Truth. It is the prerogative of the hearer to either accept or reject what he or she hears. After all, at the end of the age, each person will answer for his or her actions here on earth.



That question has no bearing on my righteous walk. His answer will not have any single bearing on my righteous walk. If you don't think so, tell me how and in what way(s) both the question and his answer will impact my righteous walk. If you do, then I may ask him.

It appears you two are in some kind of competition?

Although directed at a potential thief TenQ (you possibly may frown at this as you have been respectful to me so far) and not me, I think I will use this opportunity to answer your question as well.

We are not in any competition of any sort. If you notice, I have directly stopped engaging him apart from mentioning him and calling him a potential thief (with reasons given previously). What ought to be an interesting and respectful conversation about faith turned into lies, deliberate falsehoods, forgery, hypocrisy and what not. And I think the fact that he rather made it appear that he is after the truth and not to win an argument and my strong personal conviction not to engage a fraudulent liar about faith made the conversation even longer. But anyways, my conviction still stands irrespective of the tantrums he throws.

As you are convinced of your faith, I am tempted to assert that I am a 1000x more convinced on the righteousness of my path. And as neither what I will say will impact your 'righteous work' no matter how logically convincing it is. Or would it? I should suppose that neither would yours impact mine. So, it would be an endless circle of argument (to the extent that no one deliberately forges or tell lies).

In any event, I await your response and see if it meets the benchmark of logic. If it does, I may explain further. But if not, I think it will be adieu at this stage.

cc:
Tempted to call this bro a potential thief, but I should sheathe my sword for a while (unsure it will be permanent. TenQ
Hissplendor

LegalWolf:



Oh the simple question: let me put in highlight so you can see very clearly. I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT EVEN BELIEVE THAT THE GOD SPOKEN OF IN THAT PORTION OF THE BIBLE, THE ONE WHO RESTED FROM HIS WORK ON THE SEVENTH DAY AFTER CREATION, IS THE SAME GOD I WORSHIP. NEVER WAS HE, NEVER IS HE AND NEVER WOULD HE BE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! . Apart from highlight, how can I bold it and make it even more obvious? If you know any way, please let me know!

Let our discourse end on this basis. I will stick with what I have. You are free to do same.

LegalWolf:


Although directed at a potential thief TenQ (you possibly may frown at this as you have been respectful to me so far) and not me, I think I will use this opportunity to answer your question as well.

We are not in any competition of any sort. If you notice, I have directly stopped engaging him apart from mentioning him and calling him a potential thief (with reasons given previously). What ought to be an interesting and respectful conversation about faith turned into lies, deliberate falsehoods, forgery, hypocrisy and what not. And I think the fact that he rather made it appear that he is after the truth and not to win an argument and my strong personal conviction not to engage a fraudulent liar about faith made the conversation even longer. But anyways, my conviction still stands irrespective of the tantrums he throws.

As you are convinced of your faith, I am tempted to assert that I am a 1000x more convinced on the righteousness of my path. And as neither what I will say will impact your 'righteous work' no matter how logically convincing it is. Or would it? I should suppose that neither would yours impact mine. So, it would be an endless circle of argument (to the extent that no one deliberately forges or tell lies).

In any event, I await your response and see if it meets the benchmark of logic. If it does, I may explain further. But if not, I think it will be adieu at this stage.

cc:
Tempted to call this bro a potential thief, but I should sheathe my sword for a while (unsure it will be permanent.

Should my response anger and hurt you so deeply?

I am not engaging in any further discourse with you.

Let me just use this opportunity to respond to your two comments,

elated177:


Should my response anger and hurt you so deeply?

I am not engaging in any further discourse with you.

Honestly, your comment does not hurt so deeply. I will bore you If I go ahead to detail how TenQ (for the respect I have for you, I am not insulting him on this post I promise) has deliberately misrepresented the truth. He also went ahead to forge a comment, put it in inverted comma, and attributed it to me.

His strategy is a very simple one: open a thread, mention me and all others to it, misrepresent what our scriptures say, and ridicule our faith. When we try to correct him, he lies and he is adamant as to it. Even if we stop on that thread and move on with our lives, he goes ahead to open a new thread and repeats the circle.

And since I have taken on his challenge and avoided to have any direct conversation with him (while throwing jabs from afar as I deem fit), I think he is triggered. That is my personal opinion though

elated177:


Let our discourse end on this basis. I will stick with what I have. You are free to do same.

On this, I agree with you. I am absolutely pleased with what I have and you are free to stick with what you have as well.

Finally, as to you, I sheathe my tongue and fully retract the last paragraph of my previous post where I said In any event, I await your response and see if it meets the benchmark of logic... .

Thank you for your time as well and do have a lovely evening!

cc. TenQ
Hissplendor

LegalWolf:
Let me just use this opportunity to respond to your two comments,



Honestly, your comment does not hurt so deeply. I will bore you If I go ahead to detail how TenQ (for the respect I have for you, I am not insulting him on this post I promise) has deliberately misrepresented the truth. He also went ahead to forge a comment, put it in inverted comma, and attributed it to me.

His strategy is a very simple one: open a thread, mention me and all others to it, misrepresent what our scriptures say, and ridicule our faith. When we try to correct him, he lies and he is adamant as to it. Even if we stop on that thread and move on with our lives, he goes ahead to open a new thread and repeats the circle.

And since I have taken on his challenge and avoided to have any direct conversation with him (while throwing jabs from afar as I deem fit), I think he is triggered. That is my personal opinion though



On this, I agree with you. I am absolutely pleased with what I have and you are free to stick with what you have as well.

Finally, as to you, I sheathe my tongue and fully retract the last paragraph of my previous post where I said In any event, I await your response and see if it meets the benchmark of logic... .

Thank you for your time as well and do have a lovely evening!

cc. TenQ
Hissplendor

LOL! Liar


When we try to correct him, he lies and he is adamant as to it. Even if we stop on that thread and move on with our lives, he goes ahead to open a new thread and repeats the circle.

How many Questions have you EVER Answered?


TenQ beat you so bad with facts and you retaliate not on TenQ but others with feigned ignorance and stupidity. Why didn't you face TenQ you LIAR and COWARD!
I am waiting!
I'm sure you regret ever messing with me cause I am your nemeses. SHIO!

elated177:


Should my response anger and hurt you so deeply?

I am not engaging in any further discourse with you.

What ought to be an interesting and respectful conversation about faith turned into lies, deliberate falsehoods, forgery, hypocrisy and what not.

Eyah!
A conversation when one party feigned DEAF and DUMB!?
What claim about Islam was not backed up by your Islamic reference!?

Just say that you were embarrassed by the truth staring at you in the face.

LOL

Cry-cry Lying Cowardly baby lawyer!

LegalWolf:


Although directed at a potential thief TenQ (you possibly may frown at this as you have been respectful to me so far) and not me, I think I will use this opportunity to answer your question as well.

We are not in any competition of any sort. If you notice, I have directly stopped engaging him apart from mentioning him and calling him a potential thief (with reasons given previously). What ought to be an interesting and respectful conversation about faith turned into lies, deliberate falsehoods, forgery, hypocrisy and what not. And I think the fact that he rather made it appear that he is after the truth and not to win an argument and my strong personal conviction not to engage a fraudulent liar about faith made the conversation even longer. But anyways, my conviction still stands irrespective of the tantrums he throws.

As you are convinced of your faith, I am tempted to assert that I am a 1000x more convinced on the righteousness of my path. And as neither what I will say will impact your 'righteous work' no matter how logically convincing it is. Or would it? I should suppose that neither would yours impact mine. So, it would be an endless circle of argument (to the extent that no one deliberately forges or tell lies).

In any event, I await your response and see if it meets the benchmark of logic. If it does, I may explain further. But if not, I think it will be adieu at this stage.

cc:
Tempted to call this bro a potential thief, but I should sheathe my sword for a while (unsure it will be permanent. TenQ
Hissplendor

EVIDENCE of pain and anguish ALL because of TenQ!?

I marvel at your childishness!

elated177:


John 6: 43 “Stop grumbling among yourselves,” Yahushua answered. 44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day. 45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘They will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me.

TenQ, you need to listen to the word of Yahushua the Messiah, whose servant you say you are. There is no compulsion in the Glad Tiding. YHVH Almighty is the only one who can draw people to his Word. The role of the saint, priest, servant, follower and messenger of YHVH Almighty is to disseminate the Truth. It is the prerogative of the hearer to either accept or reject what he or she hears. After all, at the end of the age, each person will answer for his or her actions here on earth.



That question has no bearing on my righteous walk. His answer will not have any single bearing on my righteous walk. If you don't think so, tell me how and in what way(s) both the question and his answer will impact my righteous walk. If you do, then I may ask him.

It appears you two are in some kind of competition?

You misunderstood the situation.

I understand Islam because I was almost a Muslim myself until Christ delivered me. One of the greatness fault of Muslims is that they destroy by DECEIT and DECEPTION.

All the back and forth between you two would not have happened IF he answered the question : Was Allah with Mohammed when he fought the battle of Uhud and lost not only the battle but his set of front teeth?




I post about FACTS from their Own Literatures and the wise of them after reading up keep Quiet. LegalWolf thought that because he studied law that he can use bad gymnastics of words to bury the truth.

I won't drag you into this because obviously, you don't know anything about Islam and some Christians prefer a passive mode of evangelism especially with Muslims.

For me, reaching out to Muslims involve three steps
1. Force them to ask Questions about their faith
2. Give them opportunities to ask me questions about Christ and the gospel.
3. Use the opportunity of asking about Christ to Preach Salvation in Him to them.

Without step one, it's a brick wall!

Anyways, thanks for your time.

You might want to check out

1. https://www.nairaland.com/7335980/does-quran-use-special-arabic

2. https://www.nairaland.com/7392236/trinity-islam-muslims-cannot-explain

3. https://www.nairaland.com/7428751/how-allah-created-christianity

4. Plain IDOLATRY by Muslims in Islam?

"Indeed Allah is the best Deciever" sounds like an insult but it is a Quranic verse!

TenQ:

I expect him to start shouting about how the references I posted to the question is a lie and all the other tantrums rather than facing the truth.

You may ask him if any of the references or allegations I posted is true or not.

He has refused to answer. He's a wolf indeed.

HisSplendor:


He has refused to answer. He's a wolf indeed.

Have a beautiful day ahead.

Islam is indeed a religion of LIES by LIARS!

The average Muslim's slogan is :
Don't confuse me with the truth because have made up my mind.

Dear Mr LegalWolf,
I guess when someone's ability to comprehend simple English is low, he reads fictitious meanings into plain texts.
Who was to drive out the inhabitants of the Land? Was it God or Judah?

PART 1:
IN SIMPLE English (Paraphrased)
Judges 1:19 reads.
In spite of the fact that the Lord was with Judah, Judah couldn't drive out the inhabitants of the mountains because they had chariots of iron.

Why couldn't Judah drive them out in spite of the fact that God was with him? The reason was that Judah knew that they they had chariots of iron.

The verse assumed that Judah had the capability of taking the Land because God was with him BUT Judah thought otherwise and because of his excuse of them having chariots of Iron (which he didn't have). In other words, Judah's faithlessness prevented him from conquering the land.


You must answer the question below FIRST for us to continue!
PART TWO:
When Mohammed lost the Battle of Uhud with his set of front teeth, was Allah with him or not?

Please, straight to the answer: then we can continue else, have a nice day!

You made about 5 posts, I have gone through all and four of them are completely irrelevant.

Ideally, I should not be discussing matters of religion with a potential thief. At least, I am not the one who said an habitual liar is a potential thief. I read and heard the wise sayings amongst the Yoruba people [see: https://twitter.com/yoruba_proverbs/status/1326404292551454720?lang=en-GB]. In case you dispute this saying, you can take on that twitter handle and not me. However, this may probably my LAST direct response to you. If your response to my post is not based on logic, , AT MY DISCRETION you shall stayed ignored in perpetuity!

That said, this is my response to your interpretation below:

PART ONE

TenQ:
Dear Mr LegalWolf,
I guess when someone's ability to comprehend simple English is low, he reads fictitious meanings into plain texts.
Who was to drive out the inhabitants of the Land? Was it God or Judah?

PART 1:
IN SIMPLE English (Paraphrased)
Judges 1:19 reads.
In spite of the fact that the Lord was with Judah, Judah couldn't drive out the inhabitants of the mountains because they had chariots of iron.

Why couldn't Judah drive them out in spite of the fact that God was with him? The reason was that Judah knew that they they had chariots of iron.

The verse assumed that Judah had the capability of taking the Land because God was with him BUT Judah thought otherwise and because of his excuse of them having chariots of Iron (which he didn't have). In other words, Judah's faithlessness prevented him from conquering the land.

(all underlined mine)

First, this is laughable logic. I keep asking you what school did you finish from? We have read the entire 21 chapters, TenQ. Let us even zero it down to the specific Chapter 1.

Remember Judges 1 narrates the events after the death of Joshua (Judges 1:1)? Also, Chapter 1:17 - 18 talks about the same event and Judah's victory, is that not correct? In fact, a portion of the same verse 19 which your interpretation did not cover talks about Judah being victorious against the hill people . Go a step further to verse 20, ostensibly talking about the same event, and you will see that it was the victory of the people of Judah (in preceding verses 17 - 19) that enabled Caleb gain the land of Hebron as promised by Moses.

To drive home the point: the whole of Chapter 1 verses 1 - 36 expressly makes no mention of Judah's faithlessness. After Chapter 1 is 2, am I correct? And I suppose that they follow logical sequence. Is that correct to assume as well? If that is so, let us go on to Judges 2:6, this is what the Bible tells us:

The people served the Lord throughout the lifetime of Joshua and of the elders who outlived him and who had seen all the great things the Lord had done for Israel.

This makes perfect sense and gives and wholistic interpretation to Chapter 1 that AT THE TIME JUDAH WAS UNABLE TO DRIVE OUT THE PEOPLE OF THE PLAIN, YHWH WAS WITH THEM .

Again, let me invite you to read the following verses in Chapter 2:
10 After that whole generation had been gathered to their ancestors, another generation grew up who knew neither the Lord nor what he had done for Israel. [MY COMMENT: This is a generation of Joshua and the people who outlived him as mentioned in 2:7]

11 Then the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the Lord and served the Baals. (MY COMMENT: This is the first mention of Judah's unfaithfulness in the Book of Judges and the beginning of Judah's travails. If there is anywhere before in Chapter 1, please direct my attention to it.]

12 They forsook the Lord, the God of their ancestors, who had brought them out of Egypt. They followed and worshiped various gods of the peoples around them. They aroused the Lord’s anger .

So deriving a spiritual message from a period when they fall into disobedience to explain their defeat when they were faithful is being clever by half.

PART TWO

TenQ:

You must answer the question below FIRST for us to continue!
PART TWO:
When Mohammed lost the Battle of Uhud with his set of front teeth, was Allah with him or not?

Please, straight to the answer: then we can continue else, have a nice day!

This assumes I want to continue with you. My dear, what did I get the other time I continued with you, was it not forging a statement, putting it in inverted comma and ascribing it to me? Did you know how many times I've pulled you out for lying? I took the pains to correct your interpretation of the verse so others who have the privilege to come to this thread and come this far would see it (and as Hissplendor has once told me that I will only deceive myself if I think my response on a public forum is for the recipient).

PART THREE
You have repeated this in its variants countlessly. But I think I will just make one point

TenQ:


TenQ beat you so bad with facts and you retaliate not on TenQ but others with feigned ignorance and stupidity. Why didn't you face TenQ you LIAR and COWARD!
I am waiting!
I'm sure you regret ever messing with me cause I am your nemeses. SHIO!

To be fair you actually beat me. However, not with facts but forgery, lies and more lies and many more lies. In that aspect of forgery and telling lies, you are truly my nemeses! I think that should make you smile to bed?

Hopefully, this should be my last post in response to you and Hissplendor

If you have Histrionic Personality Disorder, I can pull up reputable professionals who would help you out. But crying in my mention is no cure. I think you understand that?

Should I say Shalom or Salaam? You pick one!

LegalWolf:
You made about 5 posts, I have gone through all and four of them are completely irrelevant.

Ideally, I should not be discussing matters of religion with a potential thief. At least, I am not the one who said an habitual liar is a potential thief. I read and heard the wise sayings amongst the Yoruba people [see: https://twitter.com/yoruba_proverbs/status/1326404292551454720?lang=en-GB]. In case you dispute this saying, you can take on that twitter handle and not me. However, this may probably my LAST direct response to you. If your response to my post is not based on logic, , AT MY DISCRETION you shall stayed ignored in perpetuity!

That said, this is my response to your interpretation below:

PART ONE

(all underlined mine)

First, this is laughable logic. I keep asking you what school did you finish from? We have read the entire 21 chapters, TenQ. Let us even zero it down to the specific Chapter 1.

Remember Judges 1 narrates the events after the death of Joshua (Judges 1:1)? Also, Chapter 1:17 - 18 talks about the same event and Judah's victory, is that not correct? In fact, a portion of the same verse 19 which your interpretation did not cover talks about Judah being victorious against the hill people . Go a step further to verse 20, ostensibly talking about the same event, and you will see that it was the victory of the people of Judah (in preceding verses 17 - 19) that enabled Caleb gain the land of Hebron as promised by Moses.

To drive home the point: the whole of Chapter 1 verses 1 - 36 expressly makes no mention of Judah's faithlessness. After Chapter 1 is 2, am I correct? And I suppose that they follow logical sequence. Is that correct to assume as well? If that is so, let us go on to Judges 2:6, this is what the Bible tells us:

The people served the Lord throughout the lifetime of Joshua and of the elders who outlived him and who had seen all the great things the Lord had done for Israel.

This makes perfect sense and gives and wholistic interpretation to Chapter 1 that AT THE TIME JUDAH WAS UNABLE TO DRIVE OUT THE PEOPLE OF THE PLAIN, YHWH WAS WITH THEM .

Again, let me invite you to read the following verses in Chapter 2:
10 After that whole generation had been gathered to their ancestors, another generation grew up who knew neither the Lord nor what he had done for Israel. [MY COMMENT: This is a generation of Joshua and the people who outlived him as mentioned in 2:7]

11 Then the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the Lord and served the Baals. (MY COMMENT: This is the first mention of Judah's unfaithfulness in the Book of Judges and the beginning of Judah's travails. If there is anywhere before in Chapter 1, please direct my attention to it.]

12 They forsook the Lord, the God of their ancestors, who had brought them out of Egypt. They followed and worshiped various gods of the peoples around them. They aroused the Lord’s anger .

So deriving a spiritual message from a period when they fall into disobedience to explain their defeat when they were faithful is being clever by half.

PART TWO


This assumes I want to continue with you. My dear, what did I get the other time I continued with you, was it not forging a statement, putting it in inverted comma and ascribing it to me? Did you know how many times I've pulled you out for lying? I took the pains to correct your interpretation of the verse so others who have the privilege to come to this thread and come this far would see it (and as Hissplendor has once told me that I will only deceive myself if I think my response on a public forum is for the recipient).

PART THREE
You have repeated this in its variants countlessly. But I think I will just make one point



To be fair you actually beat me. However, not with facts but forgery, lies and more lies and many more lies. In that aspect of forgery and telling lies, you are truly my nemeses! I think that should make you smile to bed?

Hopefully, this should be my last post in response to you and Hissplendor

If you have Histrionic Personality Disorder, I can pull up reputable professionals who would help you out. But crying in my mention is no cure. I think you understand that?

Should I say Shalom or Salaam? You pick one!

You wrote so much but said nothing. Just beating around the bush.

It's been a waste of time talking to you. You're even drawing back to past discourses just in a bid to avoid the present one.

Saying this could be your last response to us is a stale tactic. We now what people type when they're about to run away.

LegalWolf:
You made about 5 posts, I have gone through all and four of them are completely irrelevant.

Ideally, I should not be discussing matters of religion with a potential thief. At least, I am not the one who said an habitual liar is a potential thief. I read and heard the wise sayings amongst the Yoruba people [see: https://twitter.com/yoruba_proverbs/status/1326404292551454720?lang=en-GB]. In case you dispute this saying, you can take on that twitter handle and not me. However, this may probably my LAST direct response to you. If your response to my post is not based on logic, , AT MY DISCRETION you shall stayed ignored in perpetuity!

That said, this is my response to your interpretation below:

PART ONE

(all underlined mine)

First, this is laughable logic. I keep asking you what school did you finish from? We have read the entire 21 chapters, TenQ. Let us even zero it down to the specific Chapter 1.

Remember Judges 1 narrates the events after the death of Joshua (Judges 1:1)? Also, Chapter 1:17 - 18 talks about the same event and Judah's victory, is that not correct? In fact, a portion of the same verse 19 which your interpretation did not cover talks about Judah being victorious against the hill people . Go a step further to verse 20, ostensibly talking about the same event, and you will see that it was the victory of the people of Judah (in preceding verses 17 - 19) that enabled Caleb gain the land of Hebron as promised by Moses.

To drive home the point: the whole of Chapter 1 verses 1 - 36 expressly makes no mention of Judah's faithlessness. After Chapter 1 is 2, am I correct? And I suppose that they follow logical sequence. Is that correct to assume as well? If that is so, let us go on to Judges 2:6, this is what the Bible tells us:

The people served the Lord throughout the lifetime of Joshua and of the elders who outlived him and who had seen all the great things the Lord had done for Israel.

This makes perfect sense and gives and wholistic interpretation to Chapter 1 that AT THE TIME JUDAH WAS UNABLE TO DRIVE OUT THE PEOPLE OF THE PLAIN, YHWH WAS WITH THEM .

Again, let me invite you to read the following verses in Chapter 2:
10 After that whole generation had been gathered to their ancestors, another generation grew up who knew neither the Lord nor what he had done for Israel. [MY COMMENT: This is a generation of Joshua and the people who outlived him as mentioned in 2:7]

11 Then the Israelites did evil in the eyes of the Lord and served the Baals. (MY COMMENT: This is the first mention of Judah's unfaithfulness in the Book of Judges and the beginning of Judah's travails. If there is anywhere before in Chapter 1, please direct my attention to it.]

12 They forsook the Lord, the God of their ancestors, who had brought them out of Egypt. They followed and worshiped various gods of the peoples around them. They aroused the Lord’s anger .

So deriving a spiritual message from a period when they fall into disobedience to explain their defeat when they were faithful is being clever by half.

PART TWO


This assumes I want to continue with you. My dear, what did I get the other time I continued with you, was it not forging a statement, putting it in inverted comma and ascribing it to me? Did you know how many times I've pulled you out for lying? I took the pains to correct your interpretation of the verse so others who have the privilege to come to this thread and come this far would see it (and as Hissplendor has once told me that I will only deceive myself if I think my response on a public forum is for the recipient).

PART THREE
You have repeated this in its variants countlessly. But I think I will just make one point



To be fair you actually beat me. However, not with facts but forgery, lies and more lies and many more lies. In that aspect of forgery and telling lies, you are truly my nemeses! I think that should make you smile to bed?

Hopefully, this should be my last post in response to you and Hissplendor

If you have Histrionic Personality Disorder, I can pull up reputable professionals who would help you out. But crying in my mention is no cure. I think you understand that?

Should I say Shalom or Salaam? You pick one!

Dear Mr LegalWolf,
Both of us know that you will do EVERYTHING to slip out of answering the Question (a prerequisite to continuing the chat).

Can you say exactly what your response to the question is?

TenQ:

Dear Mr LegalWolf,
Deleted.....
You must answer the question below FIRST for us to continue!
PART TWO:
When Mohammed lost the Battle of Uhud with his set of front teeth, was Allah with him or not?

Please, straight to the answer: then we can continue else, have a nice day!

The Question was:

When Mohammed lost the Battle of Uhud with his set of front teeth, was Allah with him or not?

Over to you, then we move.
But I already know that this is probably your last post on this

Glad you admitted you were beaten silly by TenQ though! LOL!!

It's ALWAYS dangerous fighting the TRUTH Mr LegalWolf: you'd surely get BURNT!

elated177:


Macof, I am glad you are still active on nairaland. This thread of yours has been long here, you may have changed your views.

This is not competition, but to clear your ignorance. YHVH Almighty has no equal and doesn't compete with any.

I am a saint, priest, servant, follower and messenger of YHVH Almighty, the Creator of the heavens, the earth, the seas and everything in them, the one and only true God. YAHVEH El Shaddai created the earth and everything on and in earth, including all the ferrous and non-ferrous metals and non-metals.

To your question, I quote the below:

1 Kings 20: 23 Meanwhile, the officials of the king of Aram advised him, “Their gods are gods of the hills. That is why they were too strong for us. But if we fight them on the plains, surely we will be stronger than they. 24 Do this: Remove all the kings from their commands and replace them with other officers. 25 You must also raise an army like the one you lost—horse for horse and chariot for chariot—so we can fight Israel on the plains. Then surely we will be stronger than they.” He agreed with them and acted accordingly.

1 Kings 20: 28 The man of God came up and told the king of Israel, “This is what YHVH says: ‘Because the Arameans think YHVH is a god of the hills and not a god of the valleys, I will deliver this vast army into your hands, and you will know that I am YHVH.’”

Macof, can you see that the king of Aram and his subjects made the same wrong assumption? YHVH Almighty owns both the mountains/hills and the plains/valleys.

Macof, take note of the following:

Deut 8:9 a land where bread will not be scarce and you will lack nothing; a land where the rocks are iron and you can dig copper out of the hills.

Amos 4: 13He who forms the mountains,
who creates the wind,
and who reveals his thoughts to mankind,
who turns dawn to darkness,
and treads on the heights of the earth—
YHVH God Almighty is his name.

I believe you have gotten the message.

Here is a bonus point.

1 Kings 18:40 Then Elijah commanded them, “Seize the prophets of Baal. Don’t let anyone get away!” They seized them, and Elijah had them brought down to the Kishon Valley and slaughtered there.

El Elohe Yahshrael! Hallelu YAH!

Valleys are right between hills, these are strongholds for a mountain worshiping people like the ancient Israelites. Notice the Arameans said they should push the Israelites to the plains.. Not valley... Plains!

You will be shocked to know that the original position of yahweh is the God of the hills/mountains and of the hosts (heavenly armies ie. Stars). And there are places in the Bibel that Attest to this covertly. Think very well about that Amos 4:13 those are attributes of a mountain God. Also El Shaddai often translated as God of the most High, just means God of the Mountains.

If you want to know who the ancient Hebrews thought was the supreme being and maker of heaven and earth go and study about El Elyon


The thing is most Christians learn interpretative theology of the European Middle ages, and not the actual source.
Another example of many mistakes Christians make is to think "lucifer" is the name of the devil

macof:

Valleys are right between hills, these are strongholds for a mountain worshiping people like the ancient Israelites. Notice the Arameans said they should push the Israelites to the plains.. Not valley... Plains!

You will be shocked to know that the original position of yahweh is the God of the hills/mountains and of the hosts (heavenly armies ie. Stars). And there are places in the Bibel that Attest to this covertly. Think very well about that Amos 4:13 those are attributes of a mountain God. Also El Shaddai often translated as God of the most High, just means God of the Mountains.

If you want to know who the ancient Hebrews thought was the supreme being and maker of heaven and earth go and study about El Elyon


The thing is most Christians learn interpretative theology of the European Middle ages, and not the actual source.
Another example of many mistakes Christians make is to think "lucifer" is the name of the devil

Confusion galore. Sorry o.

elated177:


Confusion galore. Sorry o.

run along little man, this topic pass your intellect and knowledge

macof:
run along little man, this topic pass your intellect and knowledge

I laugh in Mbaise. What topic? This particular one that I have nailed or another one. Who are you calling little man? You want to resort to insult? Go and look for your level.

elated177:



I laugh in Mbaise. What topic? This particular one that I have nailed or another one. Who are you calling little man? You want to resort to insult? Go and look for your level.

. As I said, little man, just run along

macof:
. As I said, little man, just run along

Frustration always leads to meaningless name-calling.

elated177:



Frustration always leads to meaningless name-calling.

you are the frustrated one. You came to my old post of years ago after it gave you sleepless nights. I dropped more bangers and it burst your head
You haven't seen anything. I'll soon get back to dropping more knowledge on ancient Hebrews and canaanite spirituality, then you'll really be shaking