parisbookaddict:


All christain majority countries have anti-slavery laws.. inculding atheist countries such as china....however islamic countries do NOT have anti-slavery laws because it against the quran..the latest islamic calipjate ISIS TRADES SLAVES and sex slaves...Empiree ur defense for islam is both comical and appalling. .

Empiree:
Honestly, this is reason you need to shut up. Imagine atheists quoting endlessly from bible's justification of slavery by quoting whatever. It makes sense to them but as christian you will try to defend it, isn't ?.

I can go on and quote bible and proof it supports slavery regardless of your defense. But i have better sense than that . There's reason op opened this thread because she recognized clearly that christian colonization of Africa has greater disadvantages on Africa than anything else. Because your conscience hunts you is the reason you people attack islam here.

And no, i wasn't running away. it's late here.

Empiree:

Christian views on slavery are varied both regionally and historically. Slavery in various forms has been a part of the social environment for much of Christianity's history, spanning well over eighteen centuries. In the early years of Christianity, slavery was a normal feature of the economy and society in the Roman Empire, and this persisted in different forms and with regional differences well into the Middle Ages.[1] Most Christian figures in that early period such as Saint Augustine, accepted slavery as an inevitability whereas some, such as Saint Patrick (a former slave), were opposed to it. Both the Old Testament and New Testament treat slavery as a given, to the extent of (in the case of the Old Testament) laying down regulations for its "just" practice. Historically this has presented a challenge for Christians advocating against slavery. Generally speaking, up until the 18th century Christianity accepted slavery, but had no public opinion for or against it. Eighteen centuries after the birth of Christianity (in the context of a particularly savage and rapacious slave system), the abolition movement took shape across the globe, groups who advocated slavery's abolition struggled to use Christian teachings in support of their positions. Instead they turned from the specific references to the practice in the tradition to a more general appeal to concepts such as 'the spirit of Christ', and textual argumentation.[2]
The issue of Christianity and slavery is therefore one that has seen intense conflict. In the eighteenth and nineteenth century debates in the UK and the US passages in the Bible were used by both pro-slavery advocates and abolitionists to support their respective views.

The video provides proper understanding of "slavery" in islam. And what's the countries you mentioned up there got to do with islam?. I dont know why you people trying to cover up slave trade established the name of Christianity that affected the whole. Too late for you to come up with bogus excuses. You basically trying to indict islam. smh for you man

AllNaijaBlogger:




There is slavery in the bible but it is old testament.

We christians are under new dispensation with Christ and the New testament. The New Testament said that there is neither slave nor free in the light if Jesus Christ. We are all humans.


The difference between you and I is that I do not deny the unsavoury parts of the bible.

You in the other hand tried to deceive me by not showing how the Quran deals with the issue of slavery.

Others have even shown how wrong you are on Arab slavery.



You need to learn how to dicuss.

true2god:
The catholic church and europe engagement in slavery has nothing to do with christianity. There is nowhere in new testament scriptures where slavery was encourage. Jesus, the mediator of the testament did not practice or encourage slavery. Reference to slavery was made in the judaism old testament of the Jewish scripture.

They (christian europe) were doing it purely for commercial and economic interest and not following after the footstep of Jesus as regards slavery.

Empiree:
i knew you would come with that silly excuse. New Testament was an invention by Tom, Dick and Harry. How's NT superior over OT when it's clearly written ...Jesus said:

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.Matthew 5:17

“It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid.” (Luke 16:17)

[size=15pt]“Did not Moses give you the law, and yet none of you keepeth the law” (John7:19)[/size]

Silly excuse yet you still carry Old Testament under your arm. You still use it when you wan to support Israel. You still use it when you want quote some good stuff. But when it comes to applying the LAW...you quickly and hypocritically turn away from it with silly excuse "Oh that's Old Testament". Nonsense.

You used Old Testament to commit crimes against humanity. You used it to achieve your civilization and robbed primitive people. After you done and satisfied yourselves, you then claim your God is now peaceful. No more violence. Crusade is over etc. In order to hide filth you invented "New Testament". What a load of crap!

true2god:
[quote author=AllNaijaBlogger post=30967115]
The catholic church and europe engagement in slavery has nothing to do with christianity. There is nowhere in new testament scriptures where slavery was encourage. Jesus, the mediator of the testament did not practice or encourage slavery. Reference to slavery was made in the judaism old testament of the Jewish scripture.

They (christian europe) were doing it purely for commercial and economic interest and not following after the footstep of Jesus as regards slavery.

AllNaijaBlogger:


There is slavery in the bible but it is old testament.

We christians are under new dispensation with Christ and the New testament. The New Testament said that there is neither slave nor free in the light if Jesus Christ. We are all humans.


The difference between you and I is that I do not deny the unsavoury parts of the bible.

You in the other hand tried to deceive me by not showing how the Quran deals with the issue of slavery.

Others have even shown how wrong you are on Arab slavery.

You need to learn how to dicuss.

Empiree:

In the past few months, the world has witnessed horrific accounts of the enslavement of thousands of innocent Yazidis and other religious minorities by ISIS partisans in Iraq and Syria.

In a recent article in its online English-language magazine, ISIS ideologues offered legal justifications for the enslavement of these non-Muslim non-combatants, stating that “enslaving the families of the kuffar [infidels] and taking their women as concubines is a firmly established aspect of the Shariah or Islamic law.”

The article argues, based on a variety of Shariah sources, that ISIS partisans have a religious duty to kill or enslave members of the Yazidi community as part of their struggle [jihad] against their enemies.

This argument is plainly wrong, hypocritical and astonishingly ahistorical, relying on male fantasies inspired by stories from the days of imperial Islam.

It is also an affront to right-thinking Muslims everywhere and a criminal perversion of Islamic law, particularly its primary source, the Glorious Quran.

Jurists around the world acknowledge that there is now a universal consensus recognizing an irrefutable human right to be free from slavery and slave-trading.

This right, like the rights to be free from genocide, torture, racial discrimination and piracy, has become a bedrock principle of human affairs. ISIS seeks to remove Islamic jurisprudence from this universal consensus by citing Quranic verses that recognize the existence of chattel slavery.

Citation to Quranic verses on chattel slavery at first blush seems to make this point because the Quran, like other religious texts, accepted the existence of chattel slavery as a fact of life at the time of its revelation.

It is also true, however, that the Quran established an entirely new ethic on the issue of slavery and ISIS’s selective use of certain Quranic texts to justify contemporary chattel slavery ignores this fact.

First, consistent with the new ethic, the emphasis in all of the revelations on slavery is on the emancipation of slaves, not on their capture or the continuation of the institution of slavery. (See, for example, verses 2:177, 4:25, 4:92, 5:89, 14:31, 24:33, 58:3, 90:1-12.)

There is not one single verse suggesting that the practice should continue. Further, the Quran makes no mention of slave-markets or slave-trading and it repeatedly exhorts believers to free their slaves as an exemplification of their piety and belief in God.

Perhaps the best example of this emancipatory ethic is chapter 90, which is explicitly addressed to the Prophet Muhammad. It posits that there are two roads one can take in life and that the “high road” is the one that leads the righteous human being to free slaves.

The Prophet followed this exhortation, exhibiting a great solicitude for the material and spiritual condition of the slaves in the society around him. His example inspired his companions to emancipate thousands of slaves and, in an oft-quoted statement, he remarked that he would meet the man who “sells a free man as a slave and devours his price” on Judgment Day.

This is an explicit condemnation of trafficking in free human beings.

It is true that there are reported examples from the Prophet’s life that describe him as giving and receiving slaves and he even used slavery as a tool of conquest in war.

He freed all of his individually owned slaves and the wartime circumstances in those reports were very unique, involving specific people who engaged in war or treachery against him.

There is only one Quranic verse, 47:4, that authorizes capture of prisoners of war and it does not permit slavery, ordering military commanders to either free the prisoners gratis or hold them for ransom.

Enslaving a prisoner of war is therefore arguably illegal and certainly enslaving a non-combatant is likewise an Islamic crime.

Many forget that, for hundreds of years, Muslim imperialists and slave-traders illegally raided non-combatant villages in Eastern Europe, West Africa, East Africa, India and Southeast Asia, plundering, pillaging and capturing and raping women and children with impunity under pretextual jihads.

It seems that the ISIS ideologues want to revive this shameful legacy.

Traditionalist interpreters conclude that slavery is lawful in Islam simply because there is Quranic legislation regulating it, suggesting an implied permission.

Even the traditionalists must acknowledge, however, that all of the Quranic verses on slavery arise in contexts that overwhelmingly encourage emancipation.

Why is this? It is because the Quranic intendment contemplated a gradual disappearance of chattel slavery.

This is exactly what has happened in history. ISIS refers to the disappearance of chattel slavery in the Muslim world as an “abandonment” of the Shariah.

This is wrong. Rather, the verses contemplate the advent of a slavery-free society through the vehicle of emancipation.
http://www.loonwatch.com/2014/11/isis-says-islam-justifies-slavery-what-does-islamic-law-say/

You know, your Bible contains scores of verses that mention slavery. But no where does it ever condemn the practice, per se.

true2god:
@ Empiree,

The espistle of Paul to the ephesians and the corinthians you mentiones did not say anything about slaves but servants. Paul was drawing an analogy on the need for authority to be respected, using the relationship between a master and a servant to drive home his points.

You can read the places you referenced in the book of ephesians and corinthians for a better understanding. They are written in a simple and plain english.

Empiree:
FACTS:

*Did slavery or slave trade exist before prophet Muhammad(Allah's peace and blessings be upon him)? YES

*Did Jews and Christians preceeded Muhammad? YES

*Did Jews and Christians have enough grace to abolish slavery before Muhammad? YES

*How many years? 600 years (six decades)

*Did they abolish slavery within that period? NO

You can not deny these obvious facts. Any wonder why slavery is not recorded much in New Testament?. It's because writers delibrately left it out. How in the world slavery existed before Muhammad and during New Testament era and nothing recorded regarding slavery?. That's hell of culprits. Ancient Jews and Christians had 600 yrs to abolish slavery but Peter, Paul, Mathew, Mark, Luke and John were busy fabricating stories about three-headed gods and left out slavery part.

You can't deny slavery existed between demise of Jesus (peace be upon him) and advent of Muhammad(peace be uphon him). Why did they leave out slaveery trade in NT?. Slavery recorded in the OT didnt just happen by accident. It happened because Jews, christians and Pagan Arabs all traded slaves. If you deny this, I ask you why was this event not recorded in NT?. Are you saying Jesus was just sitting around and ignored like it didnt exist?

Ancient Jews and Christians waited for 600 yrs for arrival of Muhammad to abolish what they started. Muhammad was sent to the whole world (of seen and unseen, living and non living things, animals and plants etc). And he delivered the message within 23 yrs period and at the same time had to deal with the mess created Jews and Christians of old. But Mathew, MARK, LUKE AND JOHN are not prophet sent by God. They had no job to do. So why did they not talk about slavery?. Why all of a sudden NT barely gives reference to slavery?. So why are you saying christianity has nothing to do with slavery. That's false. And now you want to blame prophet Muhammad?.

European christians of course did not start slavery but they pursued the same agenda in different fashion (i:e through secularism) but same agenda of christians of old. They too quoted Bible at some point duriing their dirty business. And all the Arab and muslim countries you mentoned ealier that were forced to end slavery, they themselves were under colonianism of European christian slave traders and masters. They were not independent.

AllNaijaBlogger:




Did Muhammad stop slavery? No
Did Islam abolish slavery? No
Do islamic countries use Islamic law to rule abolish slavery? No
Do islamic countries use secular law to rule abolish slavery? Yes


Both christianity and islam have issues with slavery, my friend. We have both abolished it. No religion between the two is better. Stop trying to compare islam as if it has had a better record.


This is my last post here. slavery is outdated, let us each face our own religions in tolerance and peace.

Empiree:
The real reason Paul, Peter, Mathew, Mark, Luke and John made little or no reference to slavery in New Testament was because Old Testament was used to achieve their christiandom, christian civilization etc. They massacred and destroyed primitive people to get to the top. After they achieved everything they wanted, they now claimed their God is now peaceful. That He has renounced violence. That same God now transformed to three headed-god and he's peaceful and loving in New Testament. That's bu'llshit if you ask me.

But in the Old Testament, he is violent, detroyer, He was just killing men, women and children. He killed killed and killed and intimidated people. He then went for rehab and came out smiling, loving, caring, "no more crusade" bla bla bla after he already achived everything by violence. And almost everything about his violence past barely recorded in New Testament. In Old Testament, he had sword of Achillies, shield and armor and wore 'abaya'. After he came out from rehab as "nonviolence", he puts on suit and declared "no more crusade" after he already destroyed people's lives. And now he wants Muhammad to deal with the mess he created. Nosense

true2god:
@ Empiree,

You need not be angry. Neither Jesus nor the apostles (John, peter, james, philip, barthilomew, james, paul, mathias etc) partcipated nor traded in slaves. Why do you want them to right on evil they never participated or practiced (tho' there was slavery at that time)?

Mohammed, and his sahadas, (companions) on the other hand fully engaged in slave trade. The hadith and the quran (a supposedly litearal words from allah) [s]fully endorssed slavery and prescribed how to have sexx with female slaves.[/s]

Dont blame me, blame mohammed and allah for not doing the right thing. You wont take my points rational as long as you take allah serios.

true2god:
@ Empiree,

You need not be angry. Neither Jesus nor the apostles (John, peter, james, philip, barthilomew, james, paul, mathias etc) partcipated nor traded in slaves. Why do you want them to right on evil they never participated or practiced (tho' there was slavery at that time)?

Mohammed, and his sahadas, (companions) on the other hand fully engaged in slave trade. The hadith and the quran (a supposedly litearal words from allah) fully endorssed slavery and prescribed how to have sexx with female slaves.

Dont blame me, blame mohammed and allah for not doing the right thing. You wont take my points rational as long as you take allah serios.

Empiree:
Thank you liekiller for giving me oppportunity to contribute on your thread. Very interesting. I dey enjoy am.

malvisguy212:
muhammed is a false prophet;

Qur'an 69:44-46 And if he (Muhammad)
had forged a false saying concerning Us
We surely should have seized him by his
right hand (or with power and might),
and then certainly should have cut off
his life artery (AORTA). [Hilali-Khan]

So if Muhammad had been a false
prophet and a liar and a deceiver, we
know how Allah would've killed him—
Allah would've cut his aorta. As long as
no one severs Muhammad's AORTA
Guess what?

Sahih al-Bukhari 4428 The Prophet in
his ailment in which he DIED, used to
say, "O Aishah! I still feel the pain
caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and
at this time, I feel as if my AORTA is being cut from that poison."

Meaning he is a false prophet
Note:this is from Islamic source

malvisguy212:
muhammed is a false prophet;

Qur'an 69:44-46 And if he (Muhammad)
had forged a false saying concerning Us
We surely should have seized him by his
right hand (or with power and might),
and then certainly should have cut off
his life artery (AORTA). [Hilali-Khan]

So if Muhammad had been a false
prophet and a liar and a deceiver, we
know how Allah would've killed him—
Allah would've cut his aorta. As long as
no one severs Muhammad's AORTA
Guess what?

Sahih al-Bukhari 4428 The Prophet in
his ailment in which he DIED, used to
say, "O Aishah! I still feel the pain
caused by the food I ate at Khaibar, and
at this time, I feel as if my AORTA is being cut from that poison."

Meaning he is a false prophet
Note:this is from Islamic source

true2god:
Empiree will accuse you of quoting a 'weak' hadith as long as it doesn't speak well of Islam.

To butress your point, I have certain questions and answers.

Did christian europe participated in slave trade? Yes.

Did muslim arabs participated in slave trade? Yes.

Have christian europe apologized for that slave trade crime? Yes.

Have muslim arab apologize for that slave trade crime? No.

Have european authors written books condemning the slave trade era? Yes.

Have muslim authors written books condemning arab roles in slave trade? No

have the european christians done many films demonizing\condemning slavery? Yes.

Have muslims done any film demonzing and condemning slavery? No.

REASON: Any attempt by any muslim\arab at doing the above will be an indirect indictment against the islamic prophet who fully and actively participated in slave trade.

true2god:
Empiree will accuse you of quoting a 'weak' hadith as long as it doesn't speak well of Islam.

To butress your point, I have certain questions and answers.

Did christian europe participated in slave trade? Yes.

Did muslim arabs participated in slave trade? Yes.

Have christian europe apologized for that slave trade crime? Yes.

Have muslim arab apologize for that slave trade crime? No.

Have european authors written books condemning the slave trade era? Yes.

Have muslim authors written books condemning arab roles in slave trade? No

have the european christians done many films demonizing\condemning slavery? Yes.

Have muslims done any film demonzing and condemning slavery? No.

REASON: Any attempt by any muslim\arab at doing the above will be an indirect indictment against the islamic prophet who fully and actively participated in slave trade.

true2god:
A piuos muslim (e) will do anything (likeignce) to protect the honour of the islamic prophet moahammed.

true2god:
[size=4pt]will accuse you of quoting a 'weak' hadith as long as it doesn't speak well of Islam.
To butress your point, I have certain questions and answers.
Did christian europe participated in slave trade? Yes.
Did muslim arabs participated in slave trade? Yes.
Have christian europe apologized for that slave trade crime? Yes.
Have muslim arab apologize for that slave trade crime? No.
Have european authors written books condemning the slave trade era? Yes.
Have muslim authors written books condemning arab roles in slave trade? No
have the european christians done many films demonizing\condemning slavery? Yes.
Have muslims done any film demonzing and condemning slavery? No.
REASON: Any attempt by any muslim\arab at doing the above will be an indirect indictment against the islamic prophet who fully and actively participated in slave trade.

davidylan:


you vigorously deny the existence of any god, but feel absolutely outraged when someone exposes the bankruptcy of your "scientific" alternative.



You howl about the silliness in religious blind faith, but have no problem in blindly believing what you read on atheists blogs, dressed up as "science" that you have never tested and have no clue if its true or not.



You laugh at religious people, but have no problem bowing at the altar of false science.



You wax lyrical about the "atrocities" of religious people, but turn bright red when anyone dares to remind you of the genocide committed by your favorite atheist leaders.



you laugh at the idiocy of religious beliefs, yet believe that the earth just magically appeared out of nowhere.



You spend your life ferreting on blogs to find little loopholes in religious beliefs (you are not even smart enough to come up with a list of your own, shame), but have no problem believing that you are a product of primordial soup.



You bat no eyelid at destroying religious people, yet whine that you're being condemned to a hell you claim not to believe in anyway.



You waffle on about modern science, yet ask you to explain how a simple theory is responsible for modern man and you start huffing and puffing.



You revile religious people for defining 0.01% as a high success rate, yet believe that a 1 in a zillion statistical chance that primordial soup will form RNA is "modern science".



you continue to perpetuate the laughable dribble that you know more about the bible than christians even though your "knowledge" is severely limited to copy-pasting weblinks... wonder what you would do if google did not exist.

lol... you whine about religion, yet virtually all your angst is always against christianity and nothing else... wonder why.

Feel free to set up a thread just to talk about pure science, no religion... see how long you last.

Liekiller:


of course I could. I'm actually a biologist. But I won't. It's not my job to teach you biology. I would go through the effort if it weren't such a waste of time. But you are not willing to look at and understand the evidence because your mind is made up that it can't be true because it contradicts your belief. You are free to believe whatever you wish of course. It's just funny that you keep asking for evidence (even though it's all published and there for everybody to see) but don't need any evidence to support your own belief.

ribbit:
even if you tell these people that oxygen is the reason why they live...they will ask creative stupid question like bring oxygen or there is no evidence that they need oxygen but god to live when it is so obvious that they... need oxygen to live...

since you didnt discover oxygen or carry out some scientific experiment on oxygen means the whole idea is stupid.... theists101

its as a result of years and years of brainwashing... they will never think outside the box but bible written by drunk barbarian after sleeping with 13 years old girl.

ribbit:
lmao ... this is creatively dumb


mr false science

ribbit:
even if you tell these people that oxygen is the reason why they live...they will ask creative stupid question like bring oxygen or there is no evidence that they need oxygen but god to live when it is so obvious that they... need oxygen to live...

since you didnt discover oxygen or carry out some scientific experiment on oxygen means the whole idea is stupid.... theists101

its as a result of years and years of brainwashing... they will never think outside the box but bible written by drunk barbarian after sleeping with 13 years old girl.