scholes0:


Why don't you tell us your own account of world history, instead of trying to puncture holes in that of other people?
A people without a philosophy, are a people with an unremarkable past.

tonychristopher:
our people say if you do not have anything to say...just whitsle instead of making a public mockery of yourself...this is what your fable just made you...you made a mockery of yourself and 7 yr old boy cant believe that...
now oduduwa

scholes0:


That is what they believe, what exactly is wrong with that?

btw: I am so curious to know what the Edo version of this story is. ..... nobody seems to know the Edo story.

tonychristopher:


Bros which ife are we talking here is it the one I passed from ibadan or its there another one

bigfrancis21:


Now the story has been modified...from falling from the sky to falling from a so-called heaven. And the half-baked truth continues its propagation.

MrPresident1:


It is bigoted people like you who for the sake of sarcasm are trying to change the narrative. Oduduwa never fell from the skies, Oduduwa came from heaven. Deal with it!

bigfrancis21:


I hope you do realize that 'heaven' is a christian concept and not a yoruba traditional religious concept and that back in the time when the oduduwa fable was constructed, the ancient ancestors were not yet exposed to Christianity to learn about 'heaven' but believed in a 'sky' or 'above' etc.?

Have you realized how you are unconsciously injecting a christian concept into the oduduwa fable that is supposed to be African traditional religious belief? Do you realize that you have unconsciously modified the story one step further just as it has continuously been done generation after generation?

MrPresident1:


You cannot crack the codes without an adequate knowledge of history and culture and religion, they are related. First free yourself of bigotry, then you will begin to see more clearly.
'Heaven' has many shades of meaning including 'sky' and 'above', it is when use is viewed in context that the circumstance of use can be unraveled. Apart from saying he came from 'Heaven', Oduduwa also said he came from the 'East'.

bigfrancis21:


So anyone who has questions or doubts about a theory is bigoted? Is that how you reason?

Second, you barely answered any of my questions but are blindly defending a folklore as some established fact while forgetting its very basic start - folklore, passed down by word of mouth from generation to generation and by due of that very fact subject to modification along the line.

Next, you are clearly defending yourself needlessly for injecting a christian concept into an ATR belief. Or maybe you have failed to realize that the concept of 'heaven' is different from 'sky' as both words mean totally different things. Now, what you have done was substitute 'sky' or whatever that was in the original version with 'heaven', and the folklore modification continues.

However, the Ife folklore leaves so much to be desired. First, Ife barely came into existence 1000 years ago - the first human civilization was in existence 3000 years earlier. Ife folklore cannot claim to give birth to the entire race when civilizations had long existed before it. Moreover, there is barely any physical proof of this other than mere word of mouth. Nothing was left in writing to prove the original existence of ancient Yoruba. and second, science has proven that no physical person is able to fall from anywhere, especially not from the sky. Oduduwa must have wandered into ancient Yoruba territory from nearby bringing with him knowledge and wisdom, and the natives presuming him to be sent from the sky, and probably giving birth to the 'fell from the sky' myth.

MrPresident1:


I intended to checkmate your sarcasm that is why I asked you to free yourself of bigotry.

Folklores get modified as they move from mouth to mouth, but the message almost always remains the same. Oduduwa fell from heaven, Oduduwa fell from the skies, Oduduwa came from heaven, are all variations of the same story, the bottom line being there was a coming, and this coming was from above.

Heaven as used in the Bible represents enjoyment, or rulership, or the seat of God. Oduduwa came from heaven, and looking at the last line of your argument (bolded), heaven represents wisdom and knowledge, therefore Oduduwa came from a thriving culture of knowledge or civilisation that bested what he met among the aboriginals of his place of sojourn.

Science proves that no man can fall from the skies yet in Igbo culture the tortoise can talk?

Oduduwa met people at Ile-ife, but the Yoruba believe that civilisation started at Ile-Ife. This is akin to the story of Adam and Eve, Adam and Eve were not the first people on earth, they were the first people to have the knowledge of God, therefore the garden of Eden (or Ile-Ife as with Oduduwa) is where civilisation spread to the world.

You will be very surprised to know that the Yoruba is the prototype of the Bride of Christ.

And as I told you earlier, truth is written in arcane language to deter the unworthy.

bigfrancis21:


What I see is you weaving more and more of christian tenets into Ife folklore, modifying the story as time goes on, reducing its credence the more.

When you mention civilization, be sure to refer to civilization of the Yoruba ethnic group. In other words, Oduduwa brought civilization to the Yoruba ethnic group. Civilization had already been in existence in the world before then. The Egyptian civilization had come and gone, so had the Roman civilization.

bigfrancis21:


When one basks in a particular theory for too long, he begins to believe it is the all and all truth. Have you ever bothered to ask yourself when the Ife civilization even began to exist and equally relate it to the beginning of man? Have you ever thought to deal with numbers?

It takes half-truth to be passed around and around until it begins to sound like the truth to everyone. The Ife folklore is one that leaves so much to be desired. Over the years, it has been packaged and passed down from generation to generation that it has begun to sound as truth to the gullible. Did you even know that Ife came into existence during the 12th (1101 to 1200) century? Did you know that the world had long existed before then? Did you know that the earth was way populated and that millions of human beings were already existing in Europe, Africa, Asia etc.? Did you know that other civilizations had long existed before Ife even did? Did you know that the black moors of North Africa crossed into Europe in the 6th century (year 711) during which civilization was taken to Europe? Did you know that the Egyptian civilization existed in Egypt way back to as early as 3000BC, that is 4200 years before Ife came into existence? Did you know that the Nri civilization is older than Ife and came into existence at about the 9th century, or 300 years before Ife did?

Ife folklore would want to have you believe that they are the cradle of civilization and how humanity started when some man fell from the sky, yet the world has been long in existence before they came into existence. Furthermore, science has proven that no man is able to fall from the sky, thus punching the Ife folklore to an extent. How can a full-grown man supposedly fall from the sky? Where is he falling from? Who pushed him down? Why wasn't the Ife folklore able to give answers to these questions the same time the man falling from the sky folklore was formulated? We have come to the age of reasoning whereby certain questions need to be asked. You don't just swallow certain things hook line and sinker just because you were told.

scholes0:


That is what they believe, what exactly is wrong with that?

btw: I am so curious to know what the Edo version of this story is. ..... nobody seems to know the Edo story.

Afam4eva:
They may have Yoruba ancestry but every olukunmi person that I have come across rings IGBO. I think its mostly a few elderly ones that still possess some Yoruba traits. Zeal of style plus is from there.

Fisfrank:
yes zeal in my mum cousin, he is from ugbodu. And not dat olukumi people speak Igbo it just like when ondo speak there dialect and speak Yoruba as general language that is why olukumi speaks Igbo mostly, I can speak olukumi well but can't speak Igbo but I hear igbo

Fisfrank:
yes zeal in my mum cousin, he is from ugbodu. And not dat olukumi people speak Igbo it just like when ondo speak there dialect and speak Yoruba as general language that is why olukumi speaks Igbo mostly, I can speak olukumi well but can't speak Igbo but I hear igbo

bigfrancis21:


Nice to meet you, an Ugbodu-related indigene, on here. Hopefully, you would be able to tell us more about the place. Which people (the old, the young, the middle-aged etc.) of Ugbodu mostly speak the language fluently? In percentage, what percentage would you say are fluent speakers?

I watched a couple of traditional videos of the Ugbodu people on YouTube and I noticed that it was mostly the elderly ones that were fluent in it, and the younger generation rendered all their traditional dances in Igbo. I noticed that the elderly ones spoke Olukumi with a strong Igbo accent and I could pick out Igbo words here and there. I also noticed that the language being spoken everywhere in the background by the people was Igbo and barely Olukumi, thus kinda going against the general perception in the media about Ugbodu being 'Olukwumi' speaking as 'major' language, when its actual status is more of an extra or acquired language some of the people, the elderly ones especially, speak occasionally. Maybe you will be able to share more light on this.

scholes0:


Say something in Olukumi, so that we can see what the language looks like.

or translate the following words.

Man-okwue
Woman-obie
Eyes-osu
Hands-owo
Head-ori
Run-are
Jump-fo
Eat-ze
Sleep-uw


Thank you bro.

Fisfrank :


Eyes-osu

bigfrancis21:


Nice to meet you, an Ugbodu-related indigene, on here. Hopefully, you would be able to tell us more about the place. Which people (the old, the young, the middle-aged etc.) of Ugbodu mostly speak the language fluently? In percentage, what percentage would you say are fluent speakers?

I watched a couple of traditional videos of the Ugbodu people on YouTube and I noticed that it was mostly the elderly ones that were fluent in it, and the younger generation rendered all their traditional dances in Igbo. I noticed that the elderly ones spoke Olukumi with a strong Igbo accent and I could pick out Igbo words here and there. I also noticed that the language being spoken everywhere in the background by the people was Igbo and barely Olukumi, thus kinda going against the general perception in the media about Ugbodu being 'Olukwumi' speaking as 'major' language, when its actual status is more of an extra or acquired language some of the people, the elderly ones especially, speak occasionally. Maybe you will be able to share more light on this.

AjaanaOka:


I thought this would be 'ozu', consistent with the sound shift from Mainstream Yoruba 'J' to Olukumi 'Z'.

AjaanaOka:


I thought this would be 'ozu', consistent with the sound shift from Mainstream Yoruba 'J' to Olukumi 'Z'.

Fisfrank:


Say something in Olukumi, so that we can see what the language looks like.

or translate the following words.

Man-okwue
Woman-obie
Eyes-osu
Hands-owo
Head-ori
Run-are
Jump-fo
Eat-ze
Sleep-uw


Thank you bro.

scholes0:


Holly molly!..
This is simply Yoruba with a few peculiarities, like some vowel and consonant shifts like J to Z KU to KW etc.
Quite interesting indeed. So are Ugbodu and Ukwu Nzu the only Olukumi speaking villages?

According to Anioma History there is a clan called the Odiani who are completely descended from Yorubas.

Fisfrank:
.

Ok bro my mum is from ugbodu why my dad is from nkwu-nzu my mum is from the ogoza quater, in ugbodu ogoza and idumu please speak fluent olukumi why the others ekwesi speak Igbo and some place too, , my olukumi name is arobumupke.........in nkwu-nzu the people that speaks olukumi mostly are the people from odo village, my dad said the odo people don't become king but the crown kings, and my grand pa from ugbodu said it ones that we originated from Yoruba land. That all have been able to find out until I come across these threads when I searched on Google. Thanks lastly also no that Rose Odika that act Yoruba movie is from ogoza, she is my grandpa younger sister daughter. There is one lady called Tina she acted in glamour girls in does days she is from nkwu-nzu, another name for nkwu-nzu is eko, the first miss Nigeria that claimed she is from Asaba, was from ugbodu too. She was shy to name her place but she was buried in ugbodu, Edie remedy of remedies is from nkwu-uzu. So I think I have giving you proof.

scholes0:
From what I gather.
7 Villages namely

Ukwu Nzu
Idumu Ogo
Oburukpa
Uburubu
Orogbuda
Ugbodu
Ugboba and

Adogo (In the Ishan Division, Edo state)

Are the original Olukumi villages.

scholes0:


Holly molly!..
This is simply Yoruba with a few peculiarities, like some vowel and consonant shifts like J to Z KU to KW etc.
Quite interesting indeed. So are Ugbodu and Ukwu Nzu the only Olukumi speaking villages?

According to Anioma History there is a clan called the Odiani who are completely descended from Yorubas.