hoodedjaystrim:

I personally think we were evenly matched, we had won all stats

TheGoodJoe:


I do not think Ndidi failed MRI due to being overage but excess training. If you read about his early days with Ugbade, you will notice how tedious the training Ndidi faced and how some players gave up because they could not deal with it.

You can see in the excerpt below, Ndidi looked even smaller than his peers while growing.

---

“Ugbade is one of the biggest names in African football,” Africa-based sports journalist Oluwashina Okeleji tells BBC Sport.

“His opinion is respected and if he speaks to you, you listen. There is no limit with him. No excuses. He is a hard trainer but will not stretch you beyond your ability.”

Still, the tough training was too much for some but, as a skinny teenager who was also smaller than his peers, Ndidi felt such a work ethic would benefit him.

‘Take the ball and pass’ – keeping it simple pays dividends
The discipline he developed from being coached by Ugbade meant he treated every game equally – competitive or friendly – and his big chance to impress the wider world came in a tournament in Nigeria, where international scouts were watching.

https://bestchoicesports.com.ng/how-nduka-ugbade-disvovered-wilfred-ndidi-europes-top-tackler-at-leicester/

---

Same thing I feel happened with Maduka Obinwa who despite being within the age limit failed the MRI scan.

seankafor:
afor ama rula

Wetin Carry you come here

do4luv14:




Afor my man, how lockdown dey treat you nah,

pls stay safe ooo

andrewbaba44:


You are always frustrated

At times I see you as a comedian at times I see you as something else

Oya as your own opinion matters ,Twale baba

benji93:
I like this one. You have just put forth an argument worth considering. Are you opining that training hard was likely the reason he failed the MRI? Nothing in that excerpt suggests that. Can you explain the correlation between hard training and MRI test negative result(failure)? Besides, the fact that he was skinny belies his age. But that guy in that blurry picture was definitely not 17, assuming that picture was from 2013. Your point is well taken though. I will take it if you can explain the correlation.
Edit: The MRI scanning process involves the investigation of the fusion of the growth plates of player's wrist. If the investigation is carried out and the result shows that there's complete fusion, then one can be 99% sure the player is over 17. So perhaps you can tell me how training hard affects the fusion of the wrist plates.

https://www.thenational.ae/sport/use-of-mri-technology-is-helping-fifa-in-age-battle-1.479733

elyte89:



We were not outplayed at all...we could av won dt match if it extended to extra time,cos it was obvious d Algerians were so tired...however, NDIDI COST US D MATCH , Not Akpeyi

Subzero047:


No they outplayed us

Afobear:



I'm dead . I have no job , no food , no savings, no vibes , all I have is nothing and my spoilt phone

TheGoodJoe:


So explain why Maduabuchi, a 16 years old boy failed the MRI test? A genuine 16 years old with his date of birth captured in the American database?

The MRI scan is a criteria Nigeria has agreed to abide by not because it is accurate in helping us find our best quality talents in the U17 age grade but it helps us limit the chances of overage players breaking into the team.

The main idea of the MRI scan is that, it is hard for an old player to pass but there is a bigger chances for young players to fail.

A lesser amount of young players fail but a high amount of older players fail. As long as we have less overage players, we are okay to lose some high quality young players to achieve this. Does not mean all players that fail are overaged.

Ndidi was groomed by a National hero from young age, watched grow. Not some old man that came out of the blues to enter U17 team. Keep in mind Nduka Ugbade became one of the U17 coaches that period.

benji93:
You don't have to remind me of what you wrote. I clearly got that. Sadly you still don't get it. How about you move on to issues you actually can understand.

TheGoodJoe:


So explain why Maduabuchi, a 16 years old boy failed the MRI test? A genuine 16 years old with his date of birth captured in the American database?

The MRI scan is a criteria Nigeria has agreed to abide by not because it is accurate in helping us find our best quality talents in the U17 age grade but it helps us limit the chances of overage players breaking into the team.

The main idea of the MRI scan is that, it is hard for an old player to pass but there is a bigger chances for young players to fail.

A lesser amount of young players fail but a high amount of older players fail. As long as we have less overage players, we are okay to lose some high quality young players to achieve this. Does not mean all players that fail are overaged.

Ndidi was groomed by a National hero from young age, watched grow. Not some old man that came out of the blues to enter U17 team. Keep in mind Nduka Ugbade became one of the U17 coaches that period.

Afobear:



I'm dead . I have no job , no food , no savings, no vibes , all I have is nothing and my spoilt phone

benji93:
Bigger chance for a young player to fail? Bigger than what? What's your reference here? Where did you get that from? How many of the Maduabuchi's can you find? A less amount of young players fail? That's quite an exaggeration. A very very small number of players younger than 17 fail, would be a better assessment. In a pool of 1000 players, do you know what 99% translates to? The MRI gets it correct for 990 players. So I will go with that. And bringing up a few cases of failure of a system in that fashion is not quite useful. You can do better. I don't understand how being groomed by a national hero, not an old man implies that Ndidi is using his correct age. Neither does the fact that a Nigerian coach leads his youth teams to advanced stages means he doesn't know some of his boys are lying about their ages. I am not questioning his performance. We are talking about his age.

benji93:
Bigger chance for a young player to fail? Bigger than what? What's your reference here? Where did you get that from? How many of the Maduabuchi's can you find? A less amount of young players fail? That's quite an exaggeration. A very very small number of players younger than 17 fail, would be a better assessment. In a pool of 1000 players, do you know what 99% translates to? The MRI gets it correct for 990 players. So I will go with that. And bringing up a few cases of failure of a system in that fashion is not quite useful. You can do better. I don't understand how being groomed by a national hero, not an old man implies that Ndidi is using his correct age. Neither does the fact that a Nigerian coach leads his youth teams to advanced stages means he doesn't know some of his boys are lying about their ages. I am not questioning his performance. We are talking about his age.

ChrisKels:


Afor is passing through hell presently, oboy as men dey cash out this covid period, my guy was so unlucky, his mgbada unfortunately contacted the virus and couldn't fight it, hence shattering my man, after all his subs and cardings

Joebie:
Ok sir I don’t understand your science of determining ages accurately by eye test

TheGoodJoe:


All I am saying is that using failing MRI as proof of a player being overage should not count because young players can also fail the test. Coupled with how Ndidi worked under very strenuous conditions with Nduka Ugbade gives a chance of him being young and failing.

Why we like the MRI is because it gives us a high chance of having a sure group of young U17 players, keeping in mind that some of the good young ones can be cut off.

benji93:
What the heck! How many actual young players failed the test? I have mentioned it, and i am mentioning it again, can you explain how working under strenuous conditions affects the result of the MRI? What kind of scientific bullshit is that? Innovative systems are not always 100% accurate, but an accuracy level of 99% is impressive. If you have a crop of 1000 players, and ten of them, whom are actually younger than 17 failed the test, the probability that you cannot get the same level of talented players in the 990, as you can in the 10 is very very low- Transcendental players aside. If in your effort to ascertain age and a very very small percentage of the talented ones fall through the cracks, that's alright. We work and survive in imperfect systems, occasional failures are not something you should frown on. They are things you should expect. That's normalcy. Moreso this one only fails 1% of the time. you have obviously run out of supports. Please just get on with something that actually needs your strength. There's no point in continuing this discussion.

hoodedjaystrim:

Nope they didn't, they were more organized but never outplayed us
Though they deserved the win

Subzero047:


Ok you have said it yourself

hoodedjaystrim:

That they didn't outplay us

TheGoodJoe:


I am going through your words and I see you adding nothing to the point. This is something I have looked into and tried to get a deep understanding.

I did not and never frowned at the MRI. I am a very big supporter of it. Your assertion up there makes it look as if I or many Nigerians frown at the MRI. I have said it is something we have accepted. I have repeatedly said do not tag those that fail the test over aged. Why? Because of the accuracy is not 100%. It is good at screening out old players but young players get caught in the crossfire.

Ndidi, growing up was smaller than his peers. I am pointing this out because you made a wild suggestion of Ndidi being 28, forgetting he grew up under the watch of a coach. The screenshot below shows it.

Finally, I am okay with MRI screenings but I tried to understand why some young African players fail the test. If Maduabuchi Obinwa was not captured at birth, he would have been tagged an overage cheat. This changed my notion of failed MRI are age cheats.

Ndidi's case sparked my curiosity because we lost a supposedly special talent in the U17 team because of the test. Today, Ndidi is one of the most hardworking players in World football, if not the most hardworking. He attributed this to the highly intense training he was put under a long period by Nduka Ugbade. That was where I drew my hypothesis and did some research.

---

Physical activity on competitive level and the skeleton

Today, there is compelling evidence indicating that physical activity affects the skeleton and the Bone Mineral Content (BMC) and Bone Mineral Density (BMD) in an anabolic way.

The first study that addressed this hypothesis showed that athletes subjected to high load activities had 10–20% higher BMD compared to the controls.

Further cross-sectional studies (note this is the MRI scan) supported this view when comparing the dominant and non-dominant arm in racket players, a study design that controlled for the genetic regulation of the BMC. The BMC was 25–35% higher among professional tennis players in the dominant arm compared to the non-dominant arm.

Reference:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2596740/

---

To give you a few enlightenment, the MRI scan is directly related to the development of the skeleton of the human body.

Ndidi being smaller than his peers and then growing huge, defeats your wild idea of 28 years.

benji93:
What the heck! How many actual young players failed the test? I have mentioned it, and i am mentioning it again, can you explain how working under strenuous conditions affects the result of the MRI? What kind of scientific bullshit is that? Innovative systems are not always 100% accurate, but an accuracy level of 99% is impressive. If you have a crop of 1000 players, and ten of them, whom are actually younger than 17 failed the test, the probability that you cannot get the same level of talented players in the 990, as you can in the 10 is very very low- Transcendental players aside. If in your effort to ascertain age and a very very small percentage of the talented ones fall through the cracks, that's alright. We work and survive in imperfect systems, occasional failures are not something you should frown on. They are things you should expect. That's normalcy. Moreso this one only fails 1% of the time. you have obviously run out of supports. Please just get on with something that actually needs your strength. There's no point in continuing this discussion.

CaptainStephen:
My neighbors 15 year nephew who came for screening failed that test, like the person goodjoe mentioned, he was born in the UK with accurate birth records.
I remember people around who heard the news were all pissed.

chidi1:


Oga, the article you brought up to support your point bears no correlation to your assertion. Bone density has no relationship to joint fussion that occurs in kids. In lay man's terms the article says THE MORE YOU EXERCISE THE MORE YOU REDUCE YOUR CHANCE OF OSTEOPOROSIS.

Also, there is currently NO test available that has a 100 percent specificity or sensitivity. All tests have false positives and/or negatives. You can only assume the validity of a test based on these numbers.

TheGoodJoe:


What are you saying? I am showing that physical activities affects skeletal formation and the article states it in black and white. I wonder how you can decipher some thing else.

---

This osteoid matrix calcifies by precipitating apatite crystals. Primary ossification centers only show minimal bone calcification density (BMD). The apatite crystal deposits are mostly irregular and structured like nets that are contained in the medullary and cortical regions. Mineralization occurs very quickly (several tens of thousands of millimeters per day) and can occur simultaneously in large areas.

Reference:
https://www.intechopen.com/books/osteogenesis-and-bone-regeneration/bone-development-and-growth

The fusion of bones has to do with ossification and there is a direct relationship with calcification which is BMD determines the degree.

The MRI is directly related to ossification. So if physical activities affects BMD and Bone fusion is about calcification, how does the article not support my point?

chidi1:


My man, don't argue on what you have no clue about. To use very basic layman's term, bone mass (the actual bone) is different from a joint (where two bones meet).

Joint ossification and fusion occurs between 15-18 years of age for boys ( although there are outliners, but in about 99% of boys complete joint fusion occurs after age 17). Ossification (laying of bone mineral content to a cartilage, to convert it to bone) is one of the process involved in fusion of joints. I read the article. All participants of the study were over the age of at least 20. It cannot be correlated to early ossification and bone fusion.

On the other hand, bone density refers to how thick a bone is. The article only says THE MORE YOU EXERCISE THE THICKER YOUR BONES ARE. In the context of OSTEOPOROSIS, we all loose bone mass the older we get (osteoporosis in layman's term is brittle porous bones; think old women with hunch back that breaks a bone after a fall). Men at baseline have THICKER bones than women, that is why osteoporosis is more common in women (women start their bone loss at a lesser bone density compared to men). This article can hence be inferred clinically to mean that with all the thick bone density acculated during your days of exercise, you are less prone to osteoporosis when you are older, as you start to loose bone mass.

TheGoodJoe:


Whether you are young or old, exercise affects bone development. Whether fusion of the shaft or wrists or any other joint. It is clear that exercise affect bone development. Simple.

Finito.

chidi1:


I think you keep confusing bone and joint definitions. Natural fusion of joints occur ONLY in kids ( that is why you cannot grow taller than you are now). Older people only get THICKER bones by exercise , which is what was study infers.