raphieMontella:

likewise you...you need to upgrade your brain...
The version is too old
may science help you....

Argumentum ad hominem. People with little minds resort to this when they don't have superior argument.

Science has its place. There are so many questions that science cannot answer other than to infer.
Science cannot proof nor disproof the existence of God. It cannot proof or disproof magic. That you cannot proof Gods existence scientifically, does not mean he doesn't exist. (Argumentum ad ignorantiam)

Science has helped me a lot. It makes me understand the world around me, but it has its limitations as well.

shadeyinka:



Suppose as a lecturer, I have an amazing power of omniscience and because of that, I instinctively know with 100% accuracy students final exam scores.

Despite my omniscience, which of these two approach is OK for my final scoring and graduation requirements.
1. Should I award final certificate based on my omniscience?
2. Despite my omniscience, should I allow every student to do the examination?

The lecturer must also design the students in order for analogy to remain consistent.

mank1234:


Argumentum ad hominem. People with little minds resort to this when they don't have superior argument.

Science has its place. There are so many questions that science cannot answer other than to infer.
Science cannot proof nor disproof the existence of God. It cannot proof or disproof magic. That you cannot proof Gods existence scientifically, does not mean he doesn't exist. (Argumentum ad ignorantiam)

Science has helped me a lot. It makes me understand the world around me, but it has its limitations as well.

what you said about light is very wrong...and if you're stabilized scientifically..you'd know its wrong...its not faith...

gaelllic:


Tell us then, boy genius.

Tell us the physical mechanism by which mass attracts mass.



The taunts will come and come.

The mouths will run and run.

But a single testable phenomenon proving the theory will never arrive.

They think 'science' means 'men in eyeglasses saying clever-sounding things'.

They think 'truth' means 'stuff I heard on TV'.

upon saying that gravity keeps u from not floating when you jump?
Weight is a function of gravity....

If you had two metal balls and a flat elastic rubber...if you put the bigger one on the elastic...a curvature appears...placing the smaller ball within the dip of the bigger ball will cause the smaller ball to move towards the bigger ball..that is gravity...curvature/force...

Smallville10:
i believe in just one. But for someone like u who is confused and doesnt know which God to serve i suggest u try all because d bible says test all powers and see if they are of God. So let go d pride dat can kill you and find God quickly before its too late

Which one did you believe

gaelllic:


Oh, come now.

Do you know the mathematical probability of a single simple protein assembling by chance?

It is 1 : 10⁷⁴

A single protein.

Evidence of Him is everywhere if one is sincere

Be sincere.

Am serious joo

reallest:
Which one did you believe

test all of them den u will know

Smallville10:
test all of them den u will know

I've done dat and found dem all wanting

reallest:
I've done dat and found dem all wanting

tell GOD to direct u

Smallville10:
tell GOD to direct u

Which of the God

reallest:
Which of the God

God of all gods JEHOVAH

Smallville10:
God of all gods JEHOVAH

U can't tell me that u re serious with dis,how do u expect me to believe dat vampire

lordnicklaus:


Well, I am not "atheist". The questions you asked is the same as asking for the evidence of motion or radiation.

No, it's not.

Have you heard of a Geiger counter?

Its a device used to measure and detect radiation.

I'm sure you've seen your household technician testing sockets with a screwdriver-shaped device.

And you do know that compasses are instruments which detect magnetic fields.

Gravity cannot be detected, nor measured, nor weighed, nor leave an effect on photosensitive plates.

You are simply told its there.

raphieMontella:

upon saying that gravity keeps u from not floating when you jump?
Weight is a function of gravity....

If you had two metal balls and a flat elastic rubber...if you put the bigger one on the elastic...a curvature appears...placing the smaller ball within the dip of the bigger ball will cause the smaller ball to move towards the bigger ball..that is gravity...curvature/force...

First, I would like to congratulate you for your effort at an argument.

Please listen carefully.

For this...description to begin to be worthy of discussion you would have to demonstrate that there is indeed

a physical environment resembling your elastic sheet upon which we all live. There is not.

And even if I chose to humour you...how then is it that your little ball does not spiral around its partner in turns of diminishing length?

Why does it roll straight down the dip? Is that what 'planets' are supposed to do?

Perhaps you saw Carl Sagan perform this activity on a cable program. That is not science.

Please note my courtesy in even addressing this post, it is not empirical evidence.

If you don't know the word, look it up.

Don't be lazy or embarrassed.

raphieMontella:
Want to correct just one thing you made
..with the bible itself

keywords are bolded...
Ur explanation with wole..is the same thing m saying...since he is the singular programmer..he knows they will fail...he could have altered their program to a state of ''not-failing''...
Take note of the bolded words...
Then now apply it to pharaoh..who god hardened his heart without permission...
Then pls Read gen 15..and then pls reply that god didnt predestine pharaoh if its logically compactible..
(also stated in romans etc,,let me just give you only pharaoh...i dont want to add jesus and his killers,judas etc)
NB.reply needed

Sorry for the late reply..work exigencies.
Hm! I admit that some things are not easy to comprehend when treated as a isolated fact in the scripture.

However, I can relate the case of Pharaoh with you raphieMontella. You are an Atheist, did God hadden your heart or did you choose to be an Atheist by yourself? If you claim that God hardened your heart, you may have a case however if you are consciously in control of your choices then Irrespective of what a third party says, you are still ultimately responsible for your decision.

Do you think Pharaoh was acting oblivious of his choices? Finally, even if God hardened his heart, it has nothing to do with salvation or punishment of hell which is the issue in contention.

For Judas, there were 12 disciples, who says it must be him and not Peter or James! If he didn't love money that much, it may not have fallen upon him

reallest:

U can't tell me that u re serious with dis,how do u expect me to believe dat vampire

hilarious u... U know, i would like to date a female athiest... I am certain she'd be coverted

reallest:

Am serious joo

Perhaps you misunderstand.

Proteins are called 'the building blocks of life'.

Proteins are made of 'amino acids'.

A simple protein is made up of about 150 amino acids. Larger ones may contain thousands.

These amino acids must be arranged in precise sequence. Random will not work.

It's possible to mathematically calculate the probability of a precise sequence of 150 amino acids (a small protein) forming spontaneously.

1 : 10⁷⁴

This represents the number '1' followed by 74 zeroes.

That is to say, the 'unguided attempt' would succeed only one out of 10⁷⁴ times.

For comparison, please understand that the total number of atoms (I said atoms) in the universe is estimated at 10⁶⁵.

Please also remember that this is for just one small protein. This lottery win would have to be repeated continuously

to give you even a cell.

Purely rationally speaking, the probability of life arising unguided is zero. Conservatively.

If you don't see you don't want to see.

raphieMontella:

what you said about light is very wrong...and if you're stabilized scientifically..you'd know its wrong...its not faith...

It takes light 8.3minutes to reach earth from the sun while it takes 4years to reach us from the nearest star, Sirius.
Check out at the link below.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/education/clips/znt6n39

Devote a little of your time and watch NASATv online. If you do on a regular basis, not only will you be amazed at the orderliness of the universe, which can only be possible through careful design. Such design can only be possible by my God.

Weah96:


The lecturer must also design the students in order for analogy to remain consistent.

Suppose as a lecturer, I have an amazing power of omniscience [/b]and because of that, I[b] instinctively know with 100% accuracy students final exam scores.

Its a perfect analogy my dear. The truth there haunts you

raphieMontella:

If you had two metal balls and a flat elastic rubber...if you put the bigger one on the elastic...a curvature appears...placing the smaller ball within the dip of the bigger ball will cause the smaller ball to move towards the bigger ball..that is gravity...curvature/force...

Not true dear. What pulls the ball is elastic energy which is very different from gravitational force. You need a very massive object, a less massive object, both suspended in a vacuum to demonstrate gravity - this is very very infeasible except for space exploration agencies.

gaelllic:


Tell us then, boy genius.

Tell us the physical mechanism by which mass attracts mass.



The taunts will come and come.

The mouths will run and run.

But a single testable phenomenon proving the theory will never arrive.

They think 'science' means 'men in eyeglasses saying clever-sounding things'.

They think 'truth' means 'stuff I heard on TV'.

Your question is stupid, stop it! U are embarrassing yourself.

I pray no one answers the question. all u need is to go back to school. Simple.

maximunimpact:


It is your own apostacised understanding that needs the light of truth.......... You can go ahead and worship based on lies, i stick to the truth knowing that God is love. I suppose you are a father, can you place the hand of your rebellious child on fire for 10mins to punish him? if u feel you can't subject your child to that inhuman chastisement, what makes you think the God of love will place you in hell fire burning for eternity, i said you cos if it exists as you believe, then thats your final dwelling cos you are a SINNER.

Does this make sense?
God is the God of Everyone BUT
God is NOT the Father of Everyone

To them who believe in His name He gave the Power to become Sons of God..Jn1:12


God is Love but God is a God of Justice

shadeyinka:


Does this make sense?
God is the God of Everyone BUT
God is NOT the Father of Everyone

To them who believe in His name He gave the Power to become Sons of God..Jn1:12


God is Love but God is a God of Justice

I agree with you, God is a God of justice. Ok look at it this way: Human judges weigh peoples guilt according to the gravity of their crime, which is why sentences varies from fine to prison terms. And that's justice! Now the God that is of justice will now place all sinners in a burning fire for uncountable billions of years for sins committed in less than 100 to 900 years. Not only that, some committed less sin than others, but your believe in hell fire says that all sinners partake in same hellish punishment? does this sound like justice? Why no simply accept that the wages sin pays is death and not another life in a burning hell? God will never reward sin with life, not even in hell fire.

maximunimpact:
[/b]

I agree with you, God is a God of justice. Ok look at it this way: Human judges weigh peoples guilt according to the gravity of their crime, which is why sentences varies from fine to prison terms. And that's justice! Now the God that is of justice will now place all sinners in a burning fire for uncountable billions of years for sins committed in less than 100 to 900 years. Not only that, some committed less sin than others, but your believe in hell fire says that all sinners partake in same hellish punishment? does this sound like justice? Why no simply accept that the wages sin pays is death and not another life in a burning hell? God will never reward sin with life, not even in hell fire.

E be like say u dey fear hell.fire
Die first. Na

joe4christ:


Being a good lecturer who happens to love his students. I would rather make decisions that will favour my students than hurt them, if I were to be an omniscient lecturer, I would design my exam in such a way that it will be impossible for any of my student to fail, using the power of my ominiscience.
I would be damned to do otherwise, that will make me a sadist!

This coming from joe4christ? OK, I will explain.

What is the purpose of an examination?
Examinations are not designed to "pass all students" examinations are made to FILTER out or differentiate BTW students who meet the minimum level of understanding of a set of given lectures, instruction or coaching.

If not for this, it is not difficult to set an exam that all students irrespective of whether they studied or not pass. E.g (400L examination at a University)
1. What is your name?
2. Write down your favourite food
3. What is 2+2=

So, you see why God did not design the question so that everyone will pass.

God would have set this kind of question:
Do whatever you like, kill, rape, maim people since I love you, I will retain your space in Paradise!

God is a God of Justice in spite of His Love!

frank317:


Your question is stupid, stop it! U are embarrassing yourself.

I pray no one answers the question. all u need is to go back to school. Simple.

This brilliant contribution is surely the work of an intellectual powerhouse.

Come take me to school.

maximunimpact:
[/b]

I agree with you, God is a God of justice. Ok look at it this way: Human judges weigh peoples guilt according to the gravity of their crime, which is why sentences varies from fine to prison terms. And that's justice! Now the God that is of justice will now place all sinners in a burning fire for uncountable billions of years for sins committed in less than 100 to 900 years. Not only that, some committed less sin than others, but your believe in hell fire says that all sinners partake in same hellish punishment? does this sound like justice? Why no simply accept that the wages sin pays is death and not another life in a burning hell? God will never reward sin with life, not even in hell fire.

You know what, if I could rewrite scriptures maybe the concept of hell or lake of fire would be temporal (I.e. if I put it in there in the first place). However, no one understand why it is in the scripture and we can't explain it away.

But, some clarifications:
Time doesn't exist in the spiritual rhelm. Its just like in your dream where a 5 min dream may cover a period of 2days or more.

Although this is not clearly taught in the scriptures, I believe that just as rewards are not equal in Paradise maybe punishment in hell or lake of fire is not the same. No one knows.

In a place where time doesn't exist, 100 billion years may just pass as if it is 20 minutes and 20 minutes may pass off like eternity.

Time is a measure of linear change in events...but in the spiritual events is not linear. Events could be concurrent or overlap.

If time doesn't exist, what then is 200billion years? I hope you get the point

The lake of fire is a term to describe Gods refuse dump!
If anyone's name is NOT found in the Book of Life, he is discarded there..Rev13:8, Rev17:8


ALSO,
If your interpretation of death is correct,
1. Why did Jesus die? For His sins?
2. All the Apostles died violent deaths (except John) was it for their sins?
3. If the wages of sin is "an unconscious state" how come there is resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.
4. Why would Daniel refer to some people waking up from death to everlasting shame?

Check the definition of death I presented and see whether it conflicts

shadeyinka:





Its a perfect analogy my dear. The truth there haunts you

The designer is omniscient. Your hypothetical teacher is not a designer of his students.

Smallville10:
hilarious u... U know, i would like to date a female athiest... I am certain she'd be coverted

Well it's possible,u know why I say dat?

reallest:
Well it's possible,u know why I say dat?

i wish i do

Weah96:


The designer is omniscient. Your hypothetical teacher is not a designer of his students.

Wear96, you are more intelligent than this. Let not argument for the sake of argument twist the arm of reason. No analogy is designed to be a perfect one to one match of actions, events and reaction else the analogy solves no problem...its just a representation not a match.

Do you understand the analogy ?

donnffd:


I understand you perfectly but i would say i am still not totally convinced about your argument.

If i was going to create an intelligent car for my pleasure, i would be sure to not give it freewill because doing that, i am no longer subjecting it to my will but its own, and so if it chooses to not obey my commands, then it is well within its rights to do so.

..and the reason is because you desire a SLAVE and not a FRIEND from your car invention. Love and friendship conly occur when there is freedom of choice.

donnffd:

Now on the flip side of the coin, imagine you love a girl with all your heart, and can do anything for her but sadly she doesnt feel the same way about you, Do you lock her up in a dungeon and torture her because she doesnt love you?...only a psychopath would do that.

In this your case case above, you didn't have any right over her in the first place. You don't own her! A dog however may be a close enough example.

You bought a dog as a companion in your household and this dog reacts violently to anything that is dear to you. The least you will do to that dog is to chain it down.

You will not chain down a girl for not loving you..except something is wrong with you!

donnffd:

Look at another scenario, a queen who never shows herself to her subjects and remain hidden for the public eye claims she doesnt need anybodys love and admiration, but every sunday, all her subjects are required to show love and admiration to her with gifts, and those who do not do that are thrown into a dungeon she ordered built for that specific purpose and torture them till they die.

First, God is a Spirit and except you are in the spirit rhelm (which happens to all after we die) you cannot see Him.
BUT
Even if God was to physically appear in the Sky once a year to all men, will it make us to love Him?
Lucifer was an Arch Angel who stayed in the presence of God; did it stop his rebellion?

Trust me, as humans, a day will arrive when we would organise a demonstration against Him if we could see Him.

And again, it is about OWNERSHIP! GOD owns us! We are not independent beings who subject our wills to Him. We were created with that purpose in view.
The car analogy is validly close.

donnffd:

The idea of we being tools for God fails when freewill is thrown into the equation, because as a free agent you choose whether you want to be a tool or not, and if you are punished because you choose otherwise, then obviously the choice is there to override the freewill.

LOL!
Tools? Noooo!
A tool is a slave! Consciousness is not even required.

Love and Submission as a selection tool for ones "INVENTION" of a concious free willed ENTITY makes sense.

donnffd:

What i mean is if i offer you two choices, and one of those choices leds to a severe punishment but you are free to choose anyone, i am automatically trying to override your freewill because i am forcing you to choose the choice without punishment.

"I have set before you Life and Death...chose life that you may live" Deut30:19

We all do that for our children don't we?
..clean your bedroom result= Peace
..mess up your bedroom result =Trouble

Therefore, Clean your room so that there will be no trouble!

It is called Expo for the one you love. An objective question with just a YES or NO answer. As a teacher you tell your students :
Choose YES and I will give you full marks
NO! Is the wrong answer. If you choose it, I will mark it wrong!
In the exam hall, a student is free to choose his answer. His free will is indeed free.

To mans every action there is a consequence

donnffd:

So if God really wanted us as tools, he shouldnt have given us freewill, and if he wanted free agents to be tools for him, he shouldnt threaten with the punishment of hell because then he no longer have free agents.

Thats the paradox, bro...

As explained above, God doesn't want us as tool else we would be like the planets, the stars, atoms, laws of physics etc these are the tools and not humans