sure you may attempt to explain those away under the social and religious (islamic) norms of the time but u r leaving out the most important aspect which is where the truth comes out, the biological side of things


"With close inbreeding—between first cousins—there is a significant increase in the probability that both partners will share one or more detrimental recessive genes, leading to a 25 percent chance that these genes will be expressed in each pregnancy," says Alan Bittles, director of the Center for Human Genetics at Edith Cowan University in Joondalup, Australia.


meaning that when you marry your cousin you are putting your unborn children at a significant risk of genetic disease. You must also know that children below the age of 15 are at a greatly increased risk of obsteric problems during pregnancy. What does a child of 14(more probably ten) even know of being a wife?? remember this is the one wife mohammed was said to have taken out of romantic reasons.

muhsin:

Salam,

May Allah bless you, IbrahimB. I am very much fascinated by your answers. Keep them up.

This is one area where non-Muslims quickly take to "corner" some Muslims. And am telling you their only purpose is to do that for hearing/reading the answers or otherwise has nothing to do with their "understanding" the religion--Islam. Hmm. May Allah guide us to the right path, amin.

funny.people like you need to ask yourself y you are a muslim. i once met a muslim who insisted that 'the prophet' could not have had more than four wives because he was not lustful. such ignorance about ones own religion proves that religion is only a matter of culture for most. look at dominique who insisted that mohammed never married his cousin. is it because you were born to muslim parents and your father told you this was the right way that you are a muslim? or did you study several religions before you chose islam?food for thought

Kgdavid:

funny.people like you need to ask yourself y you are a muslim. i once met a muslim who insisted that 'the prophet' could not have had more than four wives because he was not lustful. such ignorance about ones own religion proves that religion is only a matter of culture for most. look at dominique who insisted that mohammed never married his cousin. is it because you were born to muslim parents and your father told you this was the right way that you are a muslim? or did you study several religions before you chose islam?food for thought

Food for you to “think” about; but I am satisfied and stimulated right now. Take care.

I rarely post anything in Religion section but this one seems orderly enough. I just wanna say to those who are always a slave of what trend says that trends move but God doesn't move with it. Probably it will be a crime to marry a woman less than 25 by 2304 and anyone who does that will be hanged by his scrotum. Does that mean they're right? Who made 18 the legal age for marriage and where did they get their sanction from. I'm by no means advocating marrying off kids or any such thing but all I'm saying is a measure of objectivity needs to be observed. Whilst I mean no disrespect and only wish to show how cultures get easily outdated, I'd implore any honest Christian to do some research and find out how old Mary was when she married Joseph. Don't burst a vein, it's just a question.

P.S. Whilst polygamy is accepted in Islam, it is not a must and is not seen to be a better option. As with all concessions, humans are wont to abuse.

Let me shed some light on the Prophet's marriages. Most of them are not only borne out of compassion but as examples. The people then would rarely do anything that they did not see the Prophet doing. He married a Jew and a Christian to demonstrate its permissibility. Same goes for the Zaynab that King David is so keen about. He married older women and widows. He married his best friend's daughter too. Almost all his marriages had peculiarities. As for whether he had sex with them, well, it is legal and you can assume so for it is the right of his wives over him. Any sane person will be satisfied. If you're not, well, go fall off a cliff

The life of the Prophet may be divided into four periods so far as his domestic life is concerned. Up to twenty-five he led a celibate life; from twenty-five to fifty-four he lived in a married state with one wife; from fifty-four to sixty he contracted several marriages; and lastly, from sixty till his death he did not contract any new marriage. The most important period to determine whether the Prophet was a slave to his passions is the period of celibacy. If he had not been a complete master of his passions, he could not have led an exceptionally chaste and pure life, which won him the title of al-Amin, to the age of twenty-five in a hot country like Arabia where development must necessarily take place early and passions are generally stronger. His worst enemies could not point to a single blot on his character when challenged later. According to Muir, all authorities agree “in ascribing to the youth of Muhammad a modesty of deportment and purity of manners rare among the people of Makka”.

Now, youth is the time when passions run riot, and the man who is able to control his passions in youth, and that in celibacy, cannot possibly be conceived as falling a prey to lust in his old age. Thus the first period of his life, his celibacy up to twenty-five years of age, is conclusive proof that the could never fall a prey to his passions. It should be noted in this connection that in Arab society at the time there was no moral sanction against an immoral life, so that it cannot be said that he was kept back from an evil course by the moral force of society. Profligacy, on the other hand, was the order of the day; and it was among people who prided themselves on loose sexual relations that the Prophet led a life of transcendent purity, and therefore all the more credit is due to his purity of character.

Take now the next period, the period of a monogamous married life. When twenty-five years of age, Muhammad married a widow, Khadija, fifteen years his senior, and led a life of the utmost devotion with her till she died, when he was fifty years of age. Polygamy was the rule in Arabia at the time; and the wife had not cause of complaint, nor did she ever grumble, if the husband brought in a second or third wife. The Prophet belonged to the noblest family of the Quraish and his marriage with Khadija had enriched him; and if he had chosen to marry another wife, it would have been quite easy for him. But he led a monogamous life of the utmost devotion to his wife during all that time. When Khadija died, he married a very elderly lady, Sauda, whose only recommendation for the honour was that she was the widow of a faithful companion of his who had to flee to Abyssinia from the persecution of the Quraish. The main part of his life, from twenty-five to fifty-four, was thus an example for his followers that monogamy was the rule in married life.

Now comes the third period. Of all his wives A’isha was the only one whom he married as a virgin. Her father, Abu Bakr, the closest friend of the Prophet had offered her to him when he suffered the great bereavement of losing both his wife and his uncle Abu Talib. The girl was one possessing exceptional qualities, and both Abu Bakr and the Prophet saw in her the great woman of the future who was best suited to perform the duties of the wife of a teacher who was to be a perfect exemplar for mankind. So the Prophet accepted her; but apparently she had not yet reached the age of puberty, and her marriage was consummated towards the close of the second year of the Flight.

Footnote on age of A’isha:

A great misconception prevails as to the age at which A’isha was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa‘d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr was approached on behalf of the Holy Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair, and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that A’isha must have been approaching majority at the time. Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatima, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than A’isha. This shows that A’isha must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be. This is further borne out by the fact that A’isha herself is reported to have stated that when the chapter entitled The Moon (fifty-fourth chapter) was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call. All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that A’isha could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal. And there is one report in the Tabaqat that A’isha was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of A’isha took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal, while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijra in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence there is not the least doubt that A’isha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.

In the second year of the Flight began the series of battles with the Quraish and the other Arab tribes, which appreciably reduced the number of males, the bread-winners of the family. These battles continued up to the eighth year of the Flight, and it was during this time that the Prophet contracted all the marriages which appear objectionable to the modern mind, but which neither friend nor foe looked upon with disapprobation at the time. A Christian writer says:

It would be remembered, however, that most of Muhammad’s marriages may be explained at least as much by his pity for the forlorn condition of the persons concerned, as by other motives. They were almost all of them widows who were not remarkable either for their beauty or their wealth, but quite the reverse.

Let us look the facts straight in the face. The Prophet had now in his house a young and beautiful wife in A’isha. None of the other wives whom he married later compared with her either in youth or beauty. Surely then it was not attraction for beauty that led to these marriages. We have already seen that from his youth till his old age the Prophet remained a complete master of his passions. The man who could live in celibacy up to twenty-five and still have the reputation of a spotless character, who up to fifty-four lived with a single wife and this notwithstanding the fact that polygamy was more the rule than the exception at the time and that a polygamous connection was not in the least objectionable — such a man could not be said to have changed all of a sudden after fifty-five when old age generally soothes the passions even of those who cannot control their passions in youth. No other motive than compassion for the ladies who were given this honour can be attached to these marriages. If there had been any less honourable motive, his choice would have fallen on others than widows, and under the Arab custom a man in his position could have plenty of youthful virgins.

I have said that change for the worse could not come over a man who had led an undoubtedly spotless life until he reached fifty-five. If the beauty of women could not excite his passions in youth and lead him away from the path of rectitude, how could it lead him away in old age? And what were the circumstances in which he lived in Madina during these years? It was not a life of ease and luxury that he was leading at the time; it was a life of hardness, because it was at this very time that he had to carry on a life-or-death struggle with the enemies of Islam. Huge armies came to crush him and the small band of Muslims at Madina. The whole of Arabia was aflame against him. He was not secure for a minute. Battles had to be fought in quick succession. Expeditions had to be arranged and sent. “Prophet of God! We are tired of being in arms day and night,” his companions would say to him; and he had to console them by telling them that the time would come when a traveller would be able to go from one end of the country to the other without having any arms. The Jews and the Christians were his enemies along with the idolaters. His best friends were falling sometimes in battle and sometimes by treachery. Is it possible for a man to lead a life of ease and luxury under such circumstances? Even if a man had the mind to lead a life of self-indulgence, which the Prophet according to all available evidence had not, this was not the opportune time for it. In such circumstances of warfare, with enemies within Madina and enemies all around it, with the number of Muslims being insignificantly small in comparison with the enemy, with news of assaults by the overwhelming numbers on all sides, even a profligate’s life would be changed, to say nothing of a man of avowed purity of character, which no temptation could shake, turning into a profligate.

If the Prophet’s days during this period were passed so strenuously, how did he pass the nights? He had a number of lawful wives, but he did not spend his nights in enjoyment with them. There is clearest evidence on record in the Holy Quran as well as Hadith that he passed half, and sometimes even two-thirds, of the night in prayers and in reciting the Holy Quran while standing in prayer. He would stand so long that his feet would get swollen. Could such a man be said to be taking wives for self-indulgence when the minutest details of his life as available to show us conclusively that it was a strenuous life furthest away from indulgence of any kind?

Let us now consider another point. Was any change really witnessed in the latter part of his life when he became the ruler of a state?


When the Prophet actually became the ruler of a state, the furniture of his house was composed of a coarse matting of palm leaves for his bed and an earthen jug for water. Some nights he would go without food. For days no fire would be lighted in his house to prepare food, the whole family living on mere dates. There was no lack of means to live a life of ease and comfort. The public treasury was at his disposal. The well-to-do among his followers, who did not shrink from sacrificing their lives for his sake, would have been only too glad to provide him with every comfort of life, should he choose to avail himself of it. But worldly things carried little weight in his estimation. No mundane craving could ever prevail over him, neither in times of indigence nor of plenty. Just as he spurned wealth, power and beauty which the Quraish offered him when he was yet in a state of utmost helplessness, so did he remain indifferent to them when God granted him all these things out of His grace.

Not only did he himself live the simple life of a labourer, but he did not even allow wealth to have any attraction for his wives. Shortly after their immigration into Madina, the condition of the Muslims had changed, and they carried on a prosperous trade. Their conquests, later on, went further to add to the comforts of life which the Muslims enjoyed. A quite human desire crept into the hearts of the Prophet’s wives that, like other Muslim families, they too should avail themselves of their share of comforts. Accordingly, they approached the Prophet in a body to prevail upon him to allow them their legitimate share of worldly comforts. Thereupon came the Divine injunction:

“O Prophet ! Say to thy wives, If you desire this world's life and its ornature, come, I will give you a provision and allow you to depart a goodly departing. And if you desire Allah and His Messenger and the latter abode, then surely Allah has prepared for the doers of good among you a mighty reward.” [33:28,29]

Thus they were offered two alternatives. They might either have worldly finery, or remain in the Prophet’s household Should they decide to have the former, they would have plenty of what they wanted, but would forthwith forfeit the honour of being the Prophet’s wives. Is this the reply of a sensual man? Such a man would have done everything to satisfy the whim of the objects of his affection. Nay, he would himself have desired that his wives should wear the most beautiful dress and live in comfort. No doubt the Prophet cherished great love for his wives. He had immense regard for the rights of women and was the champion of their cause. But when his wives came to him with what was apparently a quite legitimate demand to have more finery and ornaments, they were coldly told that if they would have these things they were not fit to live in the Prophet’s house. This shows beyond a shadow of doubt how free the Prophet’s mind was of all base and sensual thoughts. He was prepared to divorce all his wives rather than yield to what he regarded as unworthy of his wives — an inclination towards worldly things. It shows conclusively that the object of his marriages was anything but self-indulgence.

Let us consider once more the historical facts which led the Prophet to take a number of wives within the short space of five years from the third year of Hijra to the seventh, while before that he passed nearly thirty years of his life in a monogamous state. This period coincides exactly with the period during which incessant war was carried on between the Muslims and the non-Muslims. The circle of Muslim brotherhood was at the time very narrow. The perpetual state of war created disparity between the male and the female elements of society. Husbands having fallen on the field of battle, their widows had to be provided for. But bread and butter was not the only provision needed in such cases. intimacy-inclination is implanted in human nature, and the statesman who neglects the intimacy requirements leads society to moral corruption, ending ultimately in the ruin of the whole nation. A reformer with whom morals were all in all could not content himself with making provision merely for the maintenance of the widows. The Prophet was anxious for their chastity to a far greater extent than their physical needs. It became therefore necessary allow polygamy. This is the reason that he himself took so many women for his wives during the period when war was raging. Nearly all his wives were widows. If self-indulgence were the motive, the choice would not have fallen on widows. It would have been an enviable privilege for any Muslim to be the father-in-law of the Prophet. But the object was a noble one — the protection of the widows of his friends. In polygamy alone lay the safety of the Muslim society.

That he was peace-loving by nature is shown by the clear injunctions relating to peace in the Holy Quran:

“And if they incline to peace, do thou also incline to it and trust in Allah , And if they intend to deceive thee, then surely Allah is sufficient for thee.” [8:61,62]

The Prophet’s acceptance of the truce of Hudaibiya, though its conditions were humiliating for the Muslims, who were ready to lay down their lives one and all rather than accept those terms, is also a clear proof of his peace-loving nature. But when duty called him to take the field to save his community, he did not hesitate to take up the sword against an overwhelming majority. He acted as a sagacious general in all fields of battle and behaved like a brave soldier when opportunity demanded. He knew how to disperse an enemy in time before it had gained sufficient strength to deal a severe blow at the Muslims. And once, in the battle of Hunain, when his army was in flight owing to the severe onslaught of the enemy’s archers, he was all alone advancing towards the enemy forces, till his soldiers rallied round him. By disposition he had no inclination for war, yet circumstances arose which dragged him into the field of battle, and he then displayed the wisdom of a general and the bravery of a soldier. So by disposition he was not inclined to polygamy, living a celibate life of unexampled purity up to twenty-five years of age and a married life of a monogamous husband up to fifty-four, but when duty called him to take more women under his shelter, he answered the call of duty.

GODSON2009:

The life of the Prophet may be divided into four periods so far as his domestic life is concerned. Up to twenty-five he led a celibate life; from twenty-five to fifty-four he lived in a married state with one wife; from fifty-four to sixty he contracted several marriages; and lastly, from sixty till his death he did not contract any new marriage. The most important period to determine whether the Prophet was a slave to his passions is the period of celibacy. If he had not been a complete master of his passions, he could not have led an exceptionally chaste and pure life, which won him the title of al-Amin, to the age of twenty-five in a hot country like Arabia where development must necessarily take place early and passions are generally stronger.

im sorry sire but i totally disagree with this simplistic explanation does the fact that i started robbing people at the age of 25 or i started being a fraudster at the age of 25 absolve me of my subsequent ills and vices?
irrespective of the climate or how hot or cold it is,that is no excuse united kingdom right now is really cold that doesnt mean that i would commit fornication with another girl because my girlfriend is in nigeria you get my point? in adittion,i can catalogue a chronological list of mohammad's moral vices if you so request

GODSON2009:

His worst enemies could not point to a single blot on his character when challenged later. According to Muir, all authorities agree “in ascribing to the youth of Muhammad a modesty of deportment and purity of manners rare among the people of Makka”.

like i said that is not an excuse fore all the ills and moral vices he later got himself involved in

GODSON2009:

Now, youth is the time when passions run riot, and the man who is able to control his passions in youth, and that in celibacy, cannot possibly be conceived as falling a prey to lust in his old age.

i totally disagree a real life example is my own father,he married late and was totally dedicated to studying, didnt stop him marrying 4 other wives when he made money so that is clearly no indication whatsoever it is a sociological issue

GODSON2009:

Thus the first period of his life, his celibacy up to twenty-five years of age, is conclusive proof that the could never fall a prey to his passions.

i disagree and i have given you a real life example

GODSON2009:

It should be noted in this connection that in Arab society at the time there was no moral sanction against an immoral life, so that it cannot be said that he was kept back from an evil course by the moral force of society. Profligacy, on the other hand, was the order of the day; and it was among people who prided themselves on loose sexual relations that the Prophet led a life of transcendent purity, and therefore all the more credit is due to his purity of character.

well,the pertinent fact is that he later indulged in serial hedonism hence this cannoit be taken into consideration

GODSON2009:

Take now the next period, the period of a monogamous married life. When twenty-five years of age, Muhammad married a widow, Khadija, fifteen years his senior, and led a life of the utmost devotion with her till she died, when he was fifty years of age.

considering what khadijah was bringing to the table,if i was in that position,i will be faithful to the end as well, she elevated the life of the ordinary poor stable boy to a life of luxury and riches,she brought with that connections and networking mohammad with the biggest boys of that time so will you forfeit all that to marry another wife?i would have agreed that he was morally pious if not for all that he indulged in AFTER KHADIJAH DIED(im sure you know how powerful and rich khadijah was).

GODSON2009:

Polygamy was the rule in Arabia at the time; and the wife had not cause of complaint, nor did she ever grumble, if the husband brought in a second or third wife.

not if she was the rich and influential one,she will complain remember that khadijah was one of mohammad's protector against persecution in mecca,now imagine a woman weilding that kind of power in a time when women were not heard, that shows the level of her influence so please i dont agree she wouldnt have made trouble if mohammad had married another wife.

GODSON2009:

The Prophet belonged to the noblest family of the Quraish and his marriage with Khadija had enriched him; and if he had chosen to marry another wife, it would have been quite easy for him.

reffer to the comment above again NO.!!

GODSON2009:

But he led a monogamous life of the utmost devotion to his wife during all that time. When Khadija died, he married a very elderly lady, Sauda, whose only recommendation for the honour was that she was the widow of a faithful companion of his who had to flee to Abyssinia from the persecution of the Quraish. The main part of his life, from twenty-five to fifty-four, was thus an example for his followers that monogamy was the rule in married life.

that does not excuse the fact that he was having indiscriminate sexual liasons with multiple women many of which were not even married to him if mohammad's followers up untill the present day were to follow his examples then i assure you that the middle east and not south africa will be the hiv/aids headquarters, this is not my assertion it is in the bukhari,muslim e.t.c hadiths and i have read and studied them

GODSON2009:

Now comes the third period. Of all his wives A’isha was the only one whom he married as a virgin.

of course she was 6 years old!!

GODSON2009:

Her father, Abu Bakr, the closest friend of the Prophet had offered her to him when he suffered the great bereavement of losing both his wife and his uncle Abu Talib.

again i am sorry to keep on disagreeing with you sire,but this is not the truth,its either you are conveniently doctoring the true accounts or suffering from selective amnesia, mohammad actually told abu bakr his friend,and the man was not convinced then mohammad issued a threat of sorts and browbeated the man till he threw up his hands in exasperation,fed up and agreed, he was not totally convinced and i can post the hadiths if you so request for it.

GODSON2009:

The girl was one possessing exceptional qualities, and both Abu Bakr and the Prophet saw in her the great woman of the future who was best suited to perform the duties of the wife of a teacher who was to be a perfect exemplar for mankind. So the Prophet accepted her; but apparently she had not yet reached the age of puberty, and her marriage was consummated towards the close of the second year of the Flight.

are you kidding mehow can a 6 yrs old be best suited to perform the duties of a wife??pls tell me you r joking!!!!
Footnote on age of A’isha:

GODSON2009:

A great misconception prevails as to the age at which A’isha was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa‘d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr was approached on behalf of the Holy Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair, and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that A’isha must have been approaching majority at the time. Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatima, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than A’isha. This shows that A’isha must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be. This is further borne out by the fact that A’isha herself is reported to have stated that when the chapter entitled The Moon (fifty-fourth chapter) was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call. All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that A’isha could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal. And there is one report in the Tabaqat that A’isha was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of A’isha took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal, while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijra in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence there is not the least doubt that A’isha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.

well it depends on which hadith we want to believe isnt it?i will counter with my own sahi muslim hadith 3309

'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house at the age of nine. She further said: We went to Medina and I had an attack of fever for a month, and my hair had come down to the earlobes. Umm Ruman (my mother) came to me and I was at that time on a swing along with my playmates. She called me loudly and I went to her and I did not know what she had wanted of me. She took hold of my hand and took me to the door, and I was saying: Ha, ha (as if I was gasping), until the agitation of my heart was over. She took me to a house, where had gathered the women of the Ansar. They all blessed me and wished me good luck and said: May you have share in good. She (my mother) entrusted me to them. They washed my head and embellished me and nothing frightened me. Allah's Messenger (, may peace be upon him) came there in the morning, and I was entrusted to him.

3310 also continues,

'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house when I was nine years old.

GODSON2009:

In the second year of the Flight began the series of battles with the Quraish and the other Arab tribes, which appreciably reduced the number of males, the bread-winners of the family. These battles continued up to the eighth year of the Flight, and it was during this time that the Prophet contracted all the marriages which appear objectionable to the modern mind, but which neither friend nor foe looked upon with disapprobation at the time. A Christian writer says:

It would be remembered, however, that most of Muhammad’s marriages may be explained at least as much by his pity for the forlorn condition of the persons concerned, as by other motives. They were almost all of them widows who were not remarkable either for their beauty or their wealth, but quite the reverse.

is the fact that "a christian writer" supported this assertion enough to validate the claim?no i dont think so.
seeing as you brought christianity up,there were widows during tha time of jesus christ,apostle paul e.t.c but they didnt start marrying them,apostle paul set out a proper means for the church to take care of the old widows,and gave leave to the young widos to go out and re-marry if they so wish, none of these religious icons were reported to have married the widows so why is that of mohammad,a supposed prophet different??
and i see it as being unfairly simplistic by explaining away mohammad's action on the strenght of some negative perception of widows, are you saying all widows are old and ugly?
remember it takesa young energetic man to fight a war,so it follows that the wife will be younger than the husband,so where did your own analysis come from sire??

GODSON2009:

Let us look the facts straight in the face. The Prophet had now in his house a young and beautiful wife in A’isha. None of the other wives whom he married later compared with her either in youth or beauty. Surely then it was not attraction for beauty that led to these marriages. We have already seen that from his youth till his old age the Prophet remained a complete master of his passions.

again,that is an erroneous assumption,go and look at serial womanisers most of them are lucky enough to have beautiful wives but that doesnt stop them womanising, a recent case amongst several others is ashley cole,have you seen his wife cheryl cole??she is so stunning that she is the only white girl i will get married to if given a chance and my gf will not mind lol that has not stopped him womanising with girls who are not as beautiful as his loveli wife.

GODSON2009:

The man who could live in celibacy up to twenty-five and still have the reputation of a spotless character, who up to fifty-four lived with a single wife and this notwithstanding the fact that polygamy was more the rule than the exception at the time and that a polygamous connection was not in the least objectionable — such a man could not be said to have changed all of a sudden after fifty-five when old age generally soothes the passions even of those who cannot control their passions in youth. No other motive than compassion for the ladies who were given this honour can be attached to these marriages. If there had been any less honourable motive, his choice would have fallen on others than widows, and under the Arab custom a man in his position could have plenty of youthful virgins.

all i know is that he not only had several wives,he also had indiscriminate sexual liasons with slaves,not only this he appropriated the wif3 of his step son,even if the guy totally agreed morally and by both western and african tradition it is a taboo, besides i have earlier explained that it was not out of choice but it would have been disasterous for him to hgave angered khadijah remember the yoruba proverb that no woman will ever knowwingly and without compulsion agree to have a rival.

GODSON2009:

I have said that change for the worse could not come over a man who had led an undoubtedly spotless life until he reached fifty-five. If the beauty of women could not excite his passions in youth and lead him away from the path of rectitude, how could it lead him away in old age?

i wont dwell on this point as i have stated my stance but this is your own personal opinion.

GODSON2009:

And what were the circumstances in which he lived in Madina during these years? It was not a life of ease and luxury that he was leading at the time; it was a life of hardness, because it was at this very time that he had to carry on a life-or-death struggle with the enemies of Islam.

they were not all enemies of islam,most of them were innocent traders uncluky enough to have been caught in the cross fire.mohammad and his boys robbed and killed them for no just cause other than the fact that their fellow maccans persecuted him and his followers while resident in mecca, even during a supposedly holy month prompting wide condemnations from all quarters making him deliver a "convenient vision"where allah justified his action

GODSON2009:

Huge armies came to crush him and the small band of Muslims at Madina. The whole of Arabia was aflame against him. He was not secure for a minute. Battles had to be fought in quick succession. Expeditions had to be arranged and sent. “Prophet of God! We are tired of being in arms day and night,” his companions would say to him; and he had to console them by telling them that the time would come when a traveller would be able to go from one end of the country to the other without having any arms. The Jews and the Christians were his enemies along with the idolaters. His best friends were falling sometimes in battle and sometimes by treachery. Is it possible for a man to lead a life of ease and luxury under such circumstances? Even if a man had the mind to lead a life of self-indulgence, which the Prophet according to all available evidence had not, this was not the opportune time for it. In such circumstances of warfare, with enemies within Madina and enemies all around it, with the number of Muslims being insignificantly small in comparison with the enemy, with news of assaults by the overwhelming numbers on all sides, even a profligate’s life would be changed, to say nothing of a man of avowed purity of character, which no temptation could shake, turning into a profligate.

all this still does not justify the kind of life or the moral example he left behind and which he led his followers into even to this day, thousands if not tens of thousands of innocent children are dying everyday in the north arising from childbirth complications because of a single man who died many years ago,babies are being forced into marriage paedophilia is being committed and your religion is being used as a cover for old men who should be in prison all because of the actions or inactions of one single man who has been dead and buried.

GODSON2009:

If the Prophet’s days during this period were passed so strenuously, how did he pass the nights? He had a number of lawful wives, but he did not spend his nights in enjoyment with them. There is clearest evidence on record in the Holy Quran as well as Hadith that he passed half, and sometimes even two-thirds, of the night in prayers and in reciting the Holy Quran while standing in prayer. He would stand so long that his feet would get swollen. Could such a man be said to be taking wives for self-indulgence when the minutest details of his life as available to show us conclusively that it was a strenuous life furthest away from indulgence of any kind?

well since you seem to be so sure of your convictions concerning this what possible use has he got for amassing the number of wives??including the slave girls and also his step son's wife??

GODSON2009:

Let us now consider another point. Was any change really witnessed in the latter part of his life when he became the ruler of a state?


When the Prophet actually became the ruler of a state, the furniture of his house was composed of a coarse matting of palm leaves for his bed and an earthen jug for water. Some nights he would go without food. For days no fire would be lighted in his house to prepare food, the whole family living on mere dates. There was no lack of means to live a life of ease and comfort. The public treasury was at his disposal. The well-to-do among his followers, who did not shrink from sacrificing their lives for his sake, would have been only too glad to provide him with every comfort of life, should he choose to avail himself of it. But worldly things carried little weight in his estimation. No mundane craving could ever prevail over him, neither in times of indigence nor of plenty. Just as he spurned wealth, power and beauty which the Quraish offered him when he was yet in a state of utmost helplessness, so did he remain indifferent to them when God granted him all these things out of His grace.

no sire mohammad loved perfumes,good food and obviously women even though he asserted that what gives him utmost joy is prayers, so for you to state that he never indulged in any single form of luxury is false, you can find this in the hadiths of sahi al bukhari and muslim

GODSON2009:

Not only did he himself live the simple life of a labourer, but he did not even allow wealth to have any attraction for his wives. Shortly after their immigration into Madina, the condition of the Muslims had changed, and they carried on a prosperous trade. Their conquests, later on, went further to add to the comforts of life which the Muslims enjoyed. A quite human desire crept into the hearts of the Prophet’s wives that, like other Muslim families, they too should avail themselves of their share of comforts. Accordingly, they approached the Prophet in a body to prevail upon him to allow them their legitimate share of worldly comforts. Thereupon came the Divine injunction:

“O Prophet ! Say to thy wives, If you desire this world's life and its ornature, come, I will give you a provision and allow you to depart a goodly departing. And if you desire Allah and His Messenger and the latter abode, then surely Allah has prepared for the doers of good among you a mighty reward.” [33:28,29]

i dont know what you see as a good life but many will see mohammad's life as a good life, he spent most of his years enjoying the wealth and social status of his late wife,and then the second half enjoying the leadership and the attendant power as a religious and political leader we know he loved and used fine expensive perfumes,he loved women and loved good food and money was no object.

GODSON2009:

Thus they were offered two alternatives. They might either have worldly finery, or remain in the Prophet’s household Should they decide to have the former, they would have plenty of what they wanted, but would forthwith forfeit the honour of being the Prophet’s wives. Is this the reply of a sensual man? Such a man would have done everything to satisfy the whim of the objects of his affection. Nay, he would himself have desired that his wives should wear the most beautiful dress and live in comfort. No doubt the Prophet cherished great love for his wives.

i have addressed this

GODSON2009:

He had immense regard for the rights of women and was the champion of their cause.

no sire he didnt champion the cause of women,in fact he is the cause of women suffering untold and unimmaginable indignities and ill treatment in various islamic nations up untill the present day, if you want a list i ll avail you of his bias towards women

GODSON2009:

But when his wives came to him with what was apparently a quite legitimate demand to have more finery and ornaments, they were coldly told that if they would have these things they were not fit to live in the Prophet’s house. This shows beyond a shadow of doubt how free the Prophet’s mind was of all base and sensual thoughts. He was prepared to divorce all his wives rather than yield to what he regarded as unworthy of his wives — an inclination towards worldly things. It shows conclusively that the object of his marriages was anything but self-indulgence.

of course why wont he be prepared to divorce them when there are many more willing to replace them, he never hid his love for anything in skirts, or robes

GODSON2009:

Let us consider once more the historical facts which led the Prophet to take a number of wives within the short space of five years from the third year of Hijra to the seventh, while before that he passed nearly thirty years of his life in a monogamous state. This period coincides exactly with the period during which incessant war was carried on between the Muslims and the non-Muslims. The circle of Muslim brotherhood was at the time very narrow. The perpetual state of war created disparity between the male and the female elements of society. Husbands having fallen on the field of battle, their widows had to be provided for. But bread and butter was not the only provision needed in such cases. intimacy-inclination is implanted in human nature, and the statesman who neglects the intimacy requirements leads society to moral corruption, ending ultimately in the ruin of the whole nation. A reformer with whom morals were all in all could not content himself with making provision merely for the maintenance of the widows. The Prophet was anxious for their chastity to a far greater extent than their physical needs. It became therefore necessary allow polygamy. This is the reason that he himself took so many women for his wives during the period when war was raging. Nearly all his wives were widows. If self-indulgence were the motive, the choice would not have fallen on widows. It would have been an enviable privilege for any Muslim to be the father-in-law of the Prophet. But the object was a noble one — the protection of the widows of his friends. In polygamy alone lay the safety of the Muslim society.

the sign of a true prophet is rising above mere human frailities and indulgence,including an unquestionable moral rectitude.mohammad cannot aspire to be seen as a prophet yet indulging in what a mere normal human being will indulge in, the fact that there were a shortage of men does not mean that he should now ascribe to himself the job of taking in all these women as his own wives, why didnt he organise to assign these women to the rest of his male followers?or were they that few that the extra 12 or so women he took as wives would have been laying fallow??
if that was the only reason,what explanation do you have for mohammad having sexual relations with the female slaves,and why were his wives murmuring if this was the case??

GODSON2009:

That he was peace-loving by nature is shown by the clear injunctions relating to peace in the Holy Quran:

“And if they incline to peace, do thou also incline to it and trust in Allah , And if they intend to deceive thee, then surely Allah is sufficient for thee.” [8:61,62]

well again opinion differs on this important note, you might see him as peaceloving,but the historical accounts say otherwise, there is a record of various injuctions and actions showing he was blood thirsty by killing innocent children,women even assasination through a proxy at one point non forgiveness,intolerance e.t.c
people who know me will tell you i always provide proof of all my assertions so dont be afriad to ask me i would have provided the relevant hadiths and quranic verses but im still at work now

GODSON2009:

The Prophet’s acceptance of the truce of Hudaibiya, though its conditions were humiliating for the Muslims, who were ready to lay down their lives one and all rather than accept those terms, is also a clear proof of his peace-loving nature. But when duty called him to take the field to save his community, he did not hesitate to take up the sword against an overwhelming majority. He acted as a sagacious general in all fields of battle and behaved like a brave soldier when opportunity demanded. He knew how to disperse an enemy in time before it had gained sufficient strength to deal a severe blow at the Muslims. And once, in the battle of Hunain, when his army was in flight owing to the severe onslaught of the enemy’s archers, he was all alone advancing towards the enemy forces, till his soldiers rallied round him. By disposition he had no inclination for war, yet circumstances arose which dragged him into the field of battle, and he then displayed the wisdom of a general and the bravery of a soldier. So by disposition he was not inclined to polygamy, living a celibate life of unexampled purity up to twenty-five years of age and a married life of a monogamous husband up to fifty-four, but when duty called him to take more women under his shelter, he answered the call of duty.

this is the only assertion that i agree with in your surmission,he was a military leader who indulged in several wars both justified and unjustified and led a group of ruthless and blood thirsty leutenants who murdered at will both innocent and guilty,armed and unarmed e.t.c
he was inclined to polygamy and serial hedonism,modern theorists will see him as indulging in paedophilia and he would be in jail if he did many of the things he did them and he definitely was not a moral example worthy of emulation

ur disagreement has no basis,


i do not want u to agree anyway because in all u hv noted,there is no reasonable reason u point at, all u do is say u do not agree,

during his life with khadijat, when in history did u ever read that khadijat protected him? she only beleived and loved him, and note that khadijat gave him all d wealth she gat, putting it in his command, if he so wishes, he can decide to do what ever he wanted, but he choosed not,

in d real life situation, haven't u seen time without number when a woman gave a poor and reched guy a chance and he still went ahead to have as many wifes as he wish?

so u hv no point

bilms:

your disagreement has no basis,


i do not want u to agree anyway because in all u hv noted,there is no reasonable reason u point at, all u do is say u do not agree,

if u say so

bilms:

during his life with khadijat, when in history did u ever read that khadijat protected him? she only beleived and loved him, and note that khadijat gave him all d wealth she gat, putting it in his command, if he so wishes, he can decide to do what ever he wanted, but he choosed not,

khadijah according to the quran and hadiths was a wealthy and influential woman BEFORE she married mohammad,in adittion she used her connections to protect mohammad and his followers from persecution when islam was still young,it wasnt only mohammed's uncle who protected him go and read the historical accounts.
yes he did after the death of his wife.

bilms:

in d real life situation, haven't u seen time without number when a woman gave a poor and reched guy a chance and he still went ahead to have as many wifes as he wish?

so u hv no point

yes and i have also seen several instances where a man is given that chance and he will even get a slap in public without complaint, ask anyone to tell you what happened to one of igbinedion's daughters some years ago who married a 419 guy mohammad was simply smart enough not to rock the boat and be a good and dutiful husband to the woman that controls the purse

its clear in ur post,

khadijat did not marry mohammed as a prophet so u can see u are ignorant, how did she protect him? because she has money or influence, so did dat protect him, ?

lol



can do more search and come back here man

peace

i noticed one thing as i was reading all the above and there is a remarkable contradiction.You say mohammed married widows to fulfil their sexual and material needs and so prevent them from being wayward. how then is it that these women had to beg for better conditions and were 'coldly' refused? you say he did not have sexual relations as he spent the night praying till his feet were swollen. so sexually he could not have been doing his sexual duty and materially he was not doing much for these ladies. if all he wanted to do for them was to provide them with the bare minimum essential for survival, he certainly did not have to marry them. someone rightly pointed out that the age of marriage might be a cultural thing. yes but nature has left us with "universal guidelines" a girl of nine may not even be able to conceive and if she does, she has more than three times the likelihood of suffering serious obsteric problems. do u really think the age of nine is ideal for the pain women go through in pregnancy?

experts:

its clear in your post,

khadijat did not marry mohammed as a prophet so u can see u are ignorant, how did she protect him? because she has money or influence, so did dat protect him, ?

lol



can do more search and come back here man

peace

im sure you are either new on here or have not read my past comments on here,whydont you tell me what age mohammad married khadija and what age he started his ministry then??lol lol
whjen exactly was or did he confer the title of prophet upon himself??
thwen you will start to discover how confused you are , one thing i will tell you howqever is that mohammad's uuncle and khadijat were instrumental in protecting mohammad and his followers from harm,assasination attempts go and read your quran and you will discover the assasination attempts prompting him to escape was after the death of both his uncle and his wife

lol,

i always enjoy u contributn,

khadijat protec him, his uncle protect him,

y must combine his uncle's protection with that of khadijat,

since usaid u hv read d qur'an and hadith this much, good,

now bring one situation where khadijat have saved him

the fact that his life was sought ONLY AFTER THE DEATH OF THESE TWO PEOPLE is enough to proof my point,secondly the fact that khadijat was a wealthy and influential woman is another pertinent point like i pointed out in my comment earlier for a woman to be mentioned as being rich and influential in these days means she must have been very rich and influential considering that women are heard and not seen.

as for both the uncle and his wife protecting him what is so strange about that?
so if your wife became the vice president of nigeria you wont partake of any largesse??

@godson: « #38 on: March 02, 2010, 07:22 PM »

khadijah according to the quran

your lies are appauling. there is no place in the Quran that khadijah is mentioned. if you know, please show it to us.

and hadiths was a wealthy and influential woman BEFORE she married mohammad,in adittion she used her connections to protect mohammad and his followers from persecution when islam was still young,

you must be a bleeding liar. show us in the ahadith where Khadijah protected Muhammad and the muslims, a group that she herself is a member? supporter should not be interpreted as protector, unless the said supporter has the power to protect.

it wasnt only mohammed's uncle who protected him go and read the historical accounts.
yes he did after the death of his wife.

we know that Muhammad (as) was also protected by others, but there is that bold statement from you that Khadijah protected him, and you have the burden of proof.

yes and i have also seen several instances where a man is given that chance and he will even get a slap in public without complaint, ask anyone to tell you what happened to one of igbinedion's daughters some years ago who married a 419 guy mohammad was simply smart enough not to rock the boat and be a good and dutiful husband to the woman that controls the purse

Muhammad was independently wealthy before they were married. it is not unheard of, even today that some wives are more successful than their male spouses. that will not deter from the male role as the husband. you dont know anything about it, or you are just being dishonest? i wonder if there is a male virgin at 25 in any society, attractive, with high morall compass, and when he married, it was to a 40 year old woman, twice married, and obviously not a virgin, yet thsi powerful woman knew her role well as a wife, irrespective of the age difference? you have any opinion of why Muhammad (as) though employed by her, still provided all the needs of the household, except that it is by devine injuction and or good morality of a man who knows his role as the husband?
ibet if it was you or any of your ilk that married such a woman, your empty male arrogance of being younger, if only that will subjugate the woman to the point that that she will know that she is almost worth(less) in the relationship, as she is no more 25 years old, with all the perkiness of youth. and the same muhammad (as) did not keep a good nature with his older wife Khadijah (ra) as in your not rocking te boat statement because it was khadijah that initially proposed and you must know by now that the virgin Aisha (ra) had co-wives, though she was extremely younger and from an equally affluence family enviroment.

@kgdavid: « #40 on: March 02, 2010, 08:27 PM »

i noticed one thing as i was reading all the above and there is a remarkable contradiction.You say mohammed married widows to fulfil their sexual and material needs and so prevent them from being wayward.

thats just part of the reasons he married many. others were to keep the women from falling into the hands of vulture like men, like you who just see them for sex and nothing else. some of their marriages were to cement the alliances with many potential clans who were enemies of islam, in the fledging days, ready to fight it. since many of them outlived him, they became the storytellers of his legacy, and our mothers, etc. may Allah bless them all.

how then is it that these women had to beg for better conditions and were 'coldly' refused?

yet the women described him as having the power of 30 men? are you for real, or do you think that volume is quality? their complaint was simply that they wanted to spend more time with him. afterall, when he passed away, none of them married anyone else. that should tell you something.

you say he did not have sexual relations as he spent the night praying till his feet were swollen.

there is a time for sex and there is time for prayers. Muhammad is not like you whose existence is mere basis, almost animal like; eat and sleep and when worship, it is the wrong diety. whats your essence of being on earth?

so sexually he could not have been doing his sexual duty and materially he was not doing much for these ladies.

Jesus was not wealthy. unlike Solomon, Muhammad and jesus were not wealthy. no one of the wives of Muhammad (as) said he was not a great husband, except only by the human female nature that each iwas individually jealouse, in the same way a man who ignorantly accept one wife lifestyle, while he keeps horde of girlfriends out there, wishing the society would not shortchanged his male nature.

if all he wanted to do for them was to provide them with the bare minimum essential for survival, he certainly did not have to marry them.

did you hear anyone of them say she was not happy in the marriage because of his poverty? you call yourself kingdavid; could you tell me how david provided for his wife, including the wife of the man he killed so that he can take his wife, according to you and your Bible? shame on you to have accepted the name of an adulterer, killer, murderer, by your own standard.

someone rightly pointed out that the age of marriage might be a cultural thing. yes but nature has left us with "universal guidelines" a girl of nine may not even be able to conceive and if she does, she has more than three times the likelihood of suffering serious obsteric problems. do u really think the age of nine is ideal for the pain women go through in pregnancy?

a mere 1000m years ago, the life span of man was 24. please could you tell me what age was maturity then, if 24 was the top age, and often most died?
just the other day i saw a show on MTV, titled "16 and pregnant". they often become mothers even before 16 in the best country that the christians of the world hold on to as their pride. in the united states, there are tv programs like maury show, hosted by maury povitch where you see 12 years old or even younger girls sexually active, day in day out. if you went to Utah, in the USA, the age of marriage is even almost 10 or just above. what about the show of Jerry Springer, a former mayor of Cincinnati, Ohio, where everything goes or Steve Wilkos show, too. man, get with the program, and see how naive you are of the reality of the world, by going on Youtube. if this is today's reality, what was the reality of 1400 plus years ago? tell us man, if you lived way back then.


@GODSON2009: « #41 on: March 03, 2010, 01:46 PM »

im sure you are either new on here or have not read my past comments on here,whydont you tell me what age mohammad married khadija and what age he started his ministry then??lol lol
whjen exactly was or did he confer the title of prophet upon himself??

arrogance of ignorance. if muhammad (as) conferred prophethood upon himself, what was the need to wait till he was 40, instead of say the age of strenght between 25 and 35? afterall, jesus conferred godship on himself between 30 and 33 or maybe younger? i laugh at you in your mother tongue, whatever it is, godson. yet khadijah (ra) took him to waraqah ibn naf, the christian who said what he said. i think you should read what waraqah a true christian said about what muhammad (as) was about to become. that statement renders all you silliness as pure rubbish.

thwen you will start to discover how confused you are , one thing i will tell you howqever is that mohammad's uuncle and khadijat were instrumental in protecting mohammad and his followers from harm,assasination attempts go and read your quran

neither of these people's name appeared in the Quran as a protector of Muhammad and the muslims. we knw by ahadith that abitalib was a protector. khadijah was never a protector. you are now the one who lacks full knowledge, in the same fashion as the biblical Jsus, your god.

and you will discover the assasination attempts prompting him to escape was after the death of both his uncle and his wife

Muhammd did not leave Makka immediately his wife and or his uncle died. another person protected him, even after the death of his uncle. by the Quran and the ahadith, we know that Muhammad (as0 waited for revelation for his ZHijr, since many hijra were already made by the muslims, twice to Ethiopia and later the steady streaming of muslims to Madina from Makka. Islam of Muhammad was 13 years in makka before his own Hijr.

« #43 on: March 03, 2010, 05:49 PM »
the fact that his life was sought ONLY AFTER THE DEATH OF THESE TWO PEOPLE is enough to proof my point,

your point is so weak, since we saw that Baghirah the monk warned his uncle about the harm that could befall him, if he was taken to Syria as a young boy of say 8 or 9.

secondly the fact that khadijat was a wealthy and influential woman is another pertinent point like i pointed out in my comment earlier for a woman to be mentioned as being rich and influential in these days means she must have been very rich and influential considering that women are heard and not seen.

ridiculous ypothesis. a woman is still gender restricted even now, and in the days of Muhammad it was not different, since while Khadijah was banished to outside the city limit of Makka along with the rest of the Muslims, until the oath posted on the wall of Makka came out as it did, which was how the banishment of the muslims ended. you dont know that, or you are selective in your memory, just like Jesus of the Bible; sometimes he was god, other times he was just a prophet, yet at another a son of man.

as for both the uncle and his wife protecting him what is so strange about that?
so if your wife became the vice president of nigeria you wont partake of any largesse??

except that his wife did not protect him. why pass lies as truth godson? and a wife as president or vice president still the wife of the husband. or in your world, she becomes your husband and you are the one now wearing the skirt?

nopuqeater:

@kgdavid: « #40 on: March 02, 2010, 08:27 PM » thats just part of the reasons he married many. others were to keep the women from falling into the hands of vulture like men, like you who just see them for intimacy and nothing else. some of their marriages were to cement the alliances with many potential clans who were enemies of islam, in the fledging days, ready to fight it. since many of them outlived him, they became the storytellers of his legacy, and our mothers, etc. may Allah bless them all.

yet the women described him as having the power of 30 men? are you for real, or do you think that volume is quality? their complaint was simply that they wanted to spend more time with him. afterall, when he passed away, none of them married anyone else. that should tell you something.

there is a time for intimacy and there is time for prayers. Muhammad is not like you whose existence is mere basis, almost animal like; eat and sleep and when worship, it is the wrong diety. whats your essence of being on earth?

Jesus was not wealthy. unlike Solomon, Muhammad and jesus were not wealthy. no one of the wives of Muhammad (as) said he was not a great husband, except only by the human female nature that each iwas individually jealouse, in the same way a man who ignorantly accept one wife lifestyle, while he keeps horde of girlfriends out there, wishing the society would not shortchanged his male nature.

did you hear anyone of them say she was not happy in the marriage because of his poverty? you call yourself kingdavid; could you tell me how david provided for his wife, including the wife of the man he killed so that he can take his wife, according to you and your Bible? shame on you to have accepted the name of an adulterer, killer, murderer, by your own standard.

a mere 1000m years ago, the life span of man was 24. please could you tell me what age was maturity then, if 24 was the top age, and often most died?
just the other day i saw a show on MTV, titled "16 and pregnant". they often become mothers even before 16 in the best country that the christians of the world hold on to as their pride. in the united states, there are tv programs like maury show, hosted by maury povitch where you see 12 years old or even younger girls sexually active, day in day out. if you went to Utah, in the USA, the age of marriage is even almost 10 or just above. what about the show of Jerry Springer, a former mayor of Cincinnati, Ohio, where everything goes or Steve Wilkos show, too. man, get with the program, and see how naive you are of the reality of the world, by going on Youtube. if this is today's reality, what was the reality of 1400 plus years ago? tell us man, if you lived way back then.


@GODSON2009: « #41 on: March 03, 2010, 01:46 PM » arrogance of ignorance. if muhammad (as) conferred prophethood upon himself, what was the need to wait till he was 40, instead of say the age of strenght between 25 and 35? afterall, jesus conferred godship on himself between 30 and 33 or maybe younger? i laugh at you in your mother tongue, whatever it is, godson. yet khadijah (ra) took him to waraqah ibn naf, the christian who said what he said. i think you should read what waraqah a true christian said about what muhammad (as) was about to become. that statement renders all you silliness as pure rubbish.
neither of these people's name appeared in the Quran as a protector of Muhammad and the muslims. we knw by ahadith that abitalib was a protector. khadijah was never a protector. you are now the one who lacks full knowledge, in the same fashion as the biblical Jsus, your god.

Muhammd did not leave Makka immediately his wife and or his uncle died. another person protected him, even after the death of his uncle. by the Quran and the ahadith, we know that Muhammad (as0 waited for revelation for his ZHijr, since many hijra were already made by the muslims, twice to Ethiopia and later the steady streaming of muslims to Madina from Makka. Islam of Muhammad was 13 years in makka before his own Hijr.
your point is so weak, since we saw that Baghirah the monk warned his uncle about the harm that could befall him, if he was taken to Syria as a young boy of say 8 or 9.

ridiculous ypothesis. a woman is still gender restricted even now, and in the days of Muhammad it was not different, since while Khadijah was banished to outside the city limit of Makka along with the rest of the Muslims, until the oath posted on the wall of Makka came out as it did, which was how the banishment of the muslims ended. you dont know that, or you are selective in your memory, just like Jesus of the Bible; sometimes he was god, other times he was just a prophet, yet at another a son of man.

except that his wife did not protect him. why pass lies as truth godson? and a wife as president or vice president still the wife of the husband. or in your world, she becomes your husband and you are the one now wearing the skirt?

jazakallahu khair,

nopuqeater:

@kgdavid: « #40 on: March 02, 2010, 08:27 PM » thats just part of the reasons he married many. others were to keep the women from falling into the hands of vulture like men, like you who just see them for intimacy and nothing else. some of their marriages were to cement the alliances with many potential clans who were enemies of islam, in the fledging days, ready to fight it. since many of them outlived him, they became the storytellers of his legacy, and our mothers, etc. may Allah bless them all.

yet the women described him as having the power of 30 men? are you for real, or do you think that volume is quality? their complaint was simply that they wanted to spend more time with him. afterall, when he passed away, none of them married anyone else. that should tell you something.

there is a time for intimacy and there is time for prayers. Muhammad is not like you whose existence is mere basis, almost animal like; eat and sleep and when worship, it is the wrong diety. whats your essence of being on earth?

Jesus was not wealthy. unlike Solomon, Muhammad and jesus were not wealthy. no one of the wives of Muhammad (as) said he was not a great husband, except only by the human female nature that each iwas individually jealouse, in the same way a man who ignorantly accept one wife lifestyle, while he keeps horde of girlfriends out there, wishing the society would not shortchanged his male nature.

did you hear anyone of them say she was not happy in the marriage because of his poverty? you call yourself kingdavid; could you tell me how david provided for his wife, including the wife of the man he killed so that he can take his wife, according to you and your Bible? shame on you to have accepted the name of an adulterer, killer, murderer, by your own standard.

a mere 1000m years ago, the life span of man was 24. please could you tell me what age was maturity then, if 24 was the top age, and often most died?
just the other day i saw a show on MTV, titled "16 and pregnant". they often become mothers even before 16 in the best country that the christians of the world hold on to as their pride. in the united states, there are tv programs like maury show, hosted by maury povitch where you see 12 years old or even younger girls sexually active, day in day out. if you went to Utah, in the USA, the age of marriage is even almost 10 or just above. what about the show of Jerry Springer, a former mayor of Cincinnati, Ohio, where everything goes or Steve Wilkos show, too. man, get with the program, and see how naive you are of the reality of the world, by going on Youtube. if this is today's reality, what was the reality of 1400 plus years ago? tell us man, if you lived way back then.


@GODSON2009: « #41 on: March 03, 2010, 01:46 PM » arrogance of ignorance. if muhammad (as) conferred prophethood upon himself, what was the need to wait till he was 40, instead of say the age of strenght between 25 and 35? afterall, jesus conferred godship on himself between 30 and 33 or maybe younger? i laugh at you in your mother tongue, whatever it is, godson. yet khadijah (ra) took him to waraqah ibn naf, the christian who said what he said. i think you should read what waraqah a true christian said about what muhammad (as) was about to become. that statement renders all you silliness as pure rubbish.
neither of these people's name appeared in the Quran as a protector of Muhammad and the muslims. we knw by ahadith that abitalib was a protector. khadijah was never a protector. you are now the one who lacks full knowledge, in the same fashion as the biblical Jsus, your god.

Muhammd did not leave Makka immediately his wife and or his uncle died. another person protected him, even after the death of his uncle. by the Quran and the ahadith, we know that Muhammad (as0 waited for revelation for his ZHijr, since many hijra were already made by the muslims, twice to Ethiopia and later the steady streaming of muslims to Madina from Makka. Islam of Muhammad was 13 years in makka before his own Hijr.
your point is so weak, since we saw that Baghirah the monk warned his uncle about the harm that could befall him, if he was taken to Syria as a young boy of say 8 or 9.

ridiculous ypothesis. a woman is still gender restricted even now, and in the days of Muhammad it was not different, since while Khadijah was banished to outside the city limit of Makka along with the rest of the Muslims, until the oath posted on the wall of Makka came out as it did, which was how the banishment of the muslims ended. you dont know that, or you are selective in your memory, just like Jesus of the Bible; sometimes he was god, other times he was just a prophet, yet at another a son of man.

except that his wife did not protect him. why pass lies as truth godson? and a wife as president or vice president still the wife of the husband. or in your world, she becomes your husband and you are the one now wearing the skirt?

man this is some unnecessarily long post. anyway first i would like to remind you that now where have i claimed that sex is the basis for marriage. i simply pointed out in the article it is claimed that mohammed married to help these women with their sexual and material needs which, by obvious contradictions in the same essay, he was not doing. i did not say sex should be the priority but the article candidly says that he did not have time for sexual relations as he would pray throughout the night. You accuse me of seeing women merely as sexual objects but is it any better if you marry a woman only for the purpose of sealing a deal with a tribe? why would you have to marry someone to protect your religion? surely you can see the hollowness of such? or he married them to be story tellers as you say they outlived him to tell his story? the only one of the wives that was married for romantic reasons was aisha,a nine year old girl. life spans at that time were not 24 my friend quit exaggerating wildly. david killed and took another mans wife. fine, but david was a man, a mere man who had great power and made great mistakes and yet he repented and went on to do great deeds. i suppose you would say shame on a muslim with the name daoud?or dawda?or i guess you don't know that David is mentioned and praised in the quran do you? and you conclude by saying mohammed was not rich. of course he was. he was greatly enriched by the marriage to khadijah or you saying he squandered his fortune? man do you read? i bet you did not even read that article before you starting posting. you talk about jerry springer, ashow about depravity, as if this is the benchmark for how we live our lives. i don't know what you are talking about but an 18 year old will go to jail for sex with a 17 year old. but y dont you go and emulate the inspiring standards you see on mtv and jerry springer? how old are you?

@kgdavid: « #47 on: Today at 03:10:38 PM »  

man this is some unnecessarily long post. anyway first i would like to remind you that now where have i claimed that intimacy is the basis for marriage. i simply pointed out in the article it is claimed that mohammed married to help these women with their sexual and material needs which, by obvious contradictions in the same essay, he was not doing.

so in your world a man has to be copulating with a woman all day long before he has fulfilled his husbandly responsibilities? how about fulfilled sexuality, as appropriate to each woman's appetite? in your daily life do you just do one thing just to survive as a human being, or you do all that makes you a human being, daily; example sleep, eat, work, pray, talk to people as to advise, help, etc (just a portion of what makes a person)? now what should a prophet who receives revelations often to do; have sex only? david, you are not a king, but by your thinking a peasant!

i did not say intimacy should be the priority but the article candidly says that he did not have time for sexual relations as he would pray throughout the night.

is sex between only husband an wife restricted to nighttime? Allah told Muhammad (as) to pray part of the night, and not all night. Muhammad himself admonished a man who refused to do his own husbandly sexual responsibility with his wife. you must must learn now in case you marry, later, that in the morning or afternoon, and not just the night, you can sleep with your wife, oterwise she will find you boring!

You accuse me of seeing women merely as sexual objects but is it any better if you marry a woman only for the purpose of sealing a deal with a tribe?

i listed many reasons, just part of the whole garmut of purposes of marriages. Muhammad, was a human being dealing with humans. thats what humans do. get some real understanding of reality of life. a prophet is a human, not spirit, not angel, but lived on earth among humans.

why would you have to marry someone to protect your religion?

religion did not have to be protected. human practioners are, in the natural nature of human living. the Lord will put in place a supporter, regarless of his or her nature, believer or not to do what God wants in the live of Whom He wishes such protection. it is Allah Who actually protected, merely using the human protection, physically, so that the heart may at least all things are possibble, achievable. in the conscience of believers, they see that Allah performs miracle in the way He Wills, achieving all purposes.

surely you can see the hollowness of such?

hollowness, you said; the same mind that takes it that God Almighty is now a human being, killed just to provide salvation to doers of good along with the belief of that laughable death? there was no place that any muslim, the initial poster of that reason for relation, and definitely me, have stated that the wives of the prophet, any of them is married just for a single reason and devoid of all and any other values. afterall, no one of them remain but as a muslim, being the mothers and part of scholarship to the muslims.

or he married them to be story tellers as you say they outlived him to tell his story?

am sure that you do know that a surviving spouse even in your native Nigeria do tell the story of the passed away spouse? why do you think the case of Muhammad and his surviving wives will be different especially when Islam was oral that was later written down?

the only one of the wives that was married for romantic reasons was aisha,

only romance? as i have sai in many indirect ways, you need to have deep thinking ability. khadijah was married by the prophet for reasons including romance. so was maryam the coptic! and by the way there were other aspects to Aisha's marriage! or in your world, you do not discover other values except the first that you think a spouse possesses?

a nine year old girl. life spans at that time were not 24 my friend quit exaggerating wildly.

man research if the life expectance in just a 1000 years ago, was 24 or not. can you imagine what your life will be if you are from the pigmese of congo or the aboriginis of australia? which is older 1400 years ago or a mere 1000 years ago? if its 1000, then know that 2000 years plus ago when your god was born, lived and died, was then more recent than when Muhammad (as) lived. finally, i remember thatmary the mother of your lord got pregnant just as son as she had her first period. or do you know how long from the first period before the pregnancy of your god, courtesy of the sexual ghost? whats the age of barmitva again? how old was david when he killed goliat?

david killed and took another mans wife. fine, but david was a man,

and jesus was not a man? and muhammad was not a man? and moses was not a man? and noah was not a man? and abraham was not a man? while you say that david is a killer and corvetor of people's wives, we in Islam do not have the same opinion of him that way.

a mere man who had great power and made great mistakes and yet he repented and went on to do great deeds.

i get it. david was not a prophet in your book. but jesus was a god! but jesus was no better; he violated his own rules by abusing people and called people fools while he said earlier that a mere utterance guaranteed hellfire! jesus fought, a quality that you may say if done by another entity as being ungodly, but when jesus did it, in your book, it is a noble virtue. jesus was tempted, under the spell of satan, at least 3 time and had earlier drove him into the wilderness to yell about the coming of the kingdom of God. was that not supposed to be for human habitat, instead of yelling in the wilderness? is there any logic in that action except that one will have to consider it a lie of the bible writer, or the absurdity of jesus perception from the bible, an action that is abnormal?

i suppose you would say shame on a muslim with the name daoud?or dawda?or i  guess you don't know that David is mentioned and praised in the quran do you?

i as a muslim say that daud is a prophet, a mandated messenger of God, with a book (sabur). i do not water down his quality as you have done. credit is accorded as per the actual credit due. i revere daud, in the same way i revere jesus and muhammad, each of then is a mandated prophet of God to us humans, who lived under their prophetic office. i am living here and now, falling under prophet muhammad's prophetic office. those who lived in the time of david before the next prophet fell under his prophetic office. and so were the people who lived in the time of jesus.

and you conclude by saying mohammed was not rich.

prior to his messengership, he was wealthy a successful businessman, and the messnegership brought with it lost of wealth, etc, a reason he died poor.

of course he was. he was greatly enriched by the marriage to khadijah or you saying he squandered his fortune? man do you read?

i do read and read your entry. just because you married a wealthy wife does not make you inherit her wealth. we do not have that in islam. she will still have to be supported by you, so no, muhammad did not become wealthy on the cattail of his wife, and did not squander her wealth. what she gave she gave for the pleasure of Allah, in the sunnah of generousity. you probably think that muhammad was a money hungry gigolo type like you and yours?

i bet you did not even read that article before you starting posting.

i read your piece, man and read many of your entries before responding to this one.

you talk about jerry springer, ashow about depravity,

in america. host and guest and viewers are american citizens a country that easily intosticates your christian heart. thats the microcosm of american life and living, from urban centers to the subrubs and from coast to coast. i bet americana has a great influence in your life, regardless of where you live, today. why do i bring these shows up? just to let you know that why your nigerian mind is deluded, those who are your masters in christendom have different opinion, and yet they believe that they are better christians than you. afterall, might is power, and mercy in christianity. might is right or is that a deviation?

as if this is the benchmark for how we live our lives.

this is the benchmark of how you live your lives. afterall america is that bench mark. you are no better than the audiences or guests of these shows. they are mostly christians like you, wearing their crosses, and believing tha jesus will save them. afterall, that is all you need, and everyhing else is secondary, the reason most of you indulge in illicit sex, interest based businesses, eating of any type of meat, etc.

i don't know what you are talking about but an 18 year old will go to jail for intimacy with a 17 year old

show me a state n america where this is the ruling. the state of utah, usa has the legal age of marriage starting way below 17. ny state will not send an 18 year old to jail or prison for having relationship with 17 years old. there is other ways of making marriage possible een under the legal age set by any state; parental consent. what is the condition in the home country; are people jailed for having sexual relationship with 17 years olds? what if the 18 years old is the female?

but y dont you go and emulate the inspiring standards you see on mtv and jerry springer? how old are you?

oldenough to know reality of life that there is no cookie cutter procedure to living and life. i do not emulate these people because i am a muslim, and the repercussions are spelled out in Quran and Sunnah/Hadith. but for you a christian, those are your comrades in religion, and you have the blanket of forgivenes from jesus so anything goes for you. man, its either you believe what the bible says and you are too slow to know that you should take advantage of it, or that you subconsciously find it to be absurd, your reason for trying to live a life well above a mere belief and all sins are forgiven.

your posts are really long. first try and understand that everything i said with regards to sexual issues is related to what i saw in the original post. it was the same original poster who claimed that mohammed was rich. read his long post carefully cos u are not just opposing me but you are also saying what he has said is wrong. which of you then is right? you talk as if you believe that everybody in america is a christian or that the people on the jerry springer show are representative of americans in general. really? the people who come on that show are elements of the worst possible character.you say that the americans are our masters whom we strive to emulate, thats funny. i must first ask are you an arab? if not then the same applies to you and the arabs are your masters whom you are trying to emulate. religion has nothing to do with race. if you can claim that everybody who goes on the jery springer show is christian and that all christians are like them, then i ask you if all muslims are murders like osama bin laden and his followers? the age at which mary got married is not a fact recorded in any historical book and most certainly not in the bible. historians have only made estimates on this based on the norms of the time. anything else i have forgotten?

oh and yea i would have thought that a prophet would be very busy during the day and seeing as he prays for most of the night i just don't see where the time for sexual activity comes from especially when you are talking about eleven wives. yes he was a man but for a man who was supposed to be God's greatest messenger, don't you think he should have set at least a near perfect example? at least he should have been pure enough to leave no room for 'infidels'(like me) to find anything to fault him with. no?

@kgdavid:

you talk as if you believe that everybody in america is a christian or that the people on the jerry springer show are representative of americans in general. really?

those on jerry springer are good representatives of the majority of the americans. what you see on it is what happens in any city usa. just like most people call their elders by first names, it is the same that most americans are poor people. have you heard of ghettos and project buildings? have you heard of the off the beaten path? go to virginia, or the carolinas, or georgia, or arkansas, or olaoma, or the dakotas, utah, etc? maybe you need to go to watts in la ca, or oakand, etc. majority of american whites and blacks and spanish are poor and christians, hence jerry springer, maury povitch and others are like america!

the people who come on that show are elements of the worst possible character.

they are better christians than you nigerian kgdavid will ever be. they contribute more to the propagation of christianity.

you say that the americans are our masters whom we strive to emulate, thats funny. i must first ask are you an arab?

islam does not follow that type of setting. arab or not, islam is not an inherit religion. you become muslim and the reward protocol is different from christianity's.

if not then the same applies to you and the arabs are your masters whom you are trying to emulate.

i do not have a master but Allah. i do not emulate arabs, but emulate good muslims.

religion has nothing to do with race. if you can claim that everybody who goes on the jery springer show is christian and that all christians are like them, then i ask you if all muslims are murders like osama bin laden and his followers?]/quote]today, americans are debating the 911 issues. how much the government knows. there are alot of court cases pending that involves even the former vice president. it is not as emotional as you see it. google and youtube cases on 911. the conspiracy theory is no more a fringe idea. and so that you know, the fatwa by the english scholar, student of islam derails your question if all muslims are murderers. not all of us live in caves, where bin laden is reported to be living.

the age at which mary got married is not a fact recorded in any historical book and most certainly not in the bible. historians have only made estimates on this based on the norms of the time. anything else i have forgotten?

since you lack the knowledge of when the mother of your god possibly conceived him, and breast fed him to good strength, she being a jew was ready at 13 and for sure she was already pregnant at way before 16! thats less than 17 that you claim somebody could be thrown into jail. i think thats where the ghost that got mary pregnant at that young age, to produce your god jesus.

« #50 on: Today at 12:24:18 AM »
oh and yea i would have thought that a prophet would be very busy during the day

he was bisy day and night. he was a human being, having time to eat, socialize, visit the sick, engaged in business, sleep, and yes received revelations. he was a human being with prophetic office, like moses, noah, ibrahim, etc, oh jesus, too. the same jesus you call god slept, ate, etc. or was he not the one that dosed off in the boat?

and seeing as he prays for most of the night i just don't see where the time for sexual activity comes from especially when you are talking about eleven wives.

if his wives qualified him as a man with superior power of 30 men, from simple logic, a wife is as if she had a complete sexual experience of 30 experiences form a single man. now do you see the possibility of making 11 wives happy by suh a special man?

yes he was a man but for a man who was supposed to be God's greatest messenger, don't you think he should have set at least a near perfect example?

he had a perfect example. he had much less wives than solomon, the "wise". he had no concubines like solomon the wise. he did not kill any man and take his wife, like your name sake. he was not a confirmed bachelor like your god jesus. he did not have 1 wife like adam who only had 1 wife, the 100% of the female gender population at that time. he did not send any of his wives off to the wilderness, like abraham. all of these imperfect actions of the previous prophets are in your book, the Bible, though you deny many of them as prophet. but then Jehovah gave psalm to david, and songs of solomon to solomon the wise/ from the wisdom of solomon we must know that having just one wife is not a wise condition anymore.

at least he should have been pure enough to leave no room for 'infidels'(like me) to find anything to fault him with. no?

calling yourself infidel is on the pages of the book of timothy in the Bible. perfection is when you need to be angry you show anger without over doing it. religion of God is for humans. and God sent humans as His Messengers to mankind. the nature of mankind is what Muhammad (as) displayed, in the most perfect way. while you display ignorance of the reality of life, your religious christian pundits, men and women are in the romance section talking runch sex. birds do it and bees do it, though you are lying like a rug, denying the obvious. and you are an africans? your religious pastors in nigeria are wife swapping and its the talk of the nation. in the bible, we read about the signet ring of issac in the hand of a harlot, the wife of his son?
please dont bore me with the disciples hiding their own sexual improprieties, and who will forget paul the man who cant have sex with woman propagating about one man one wife or no wife at all?

mann some of the things you say are coming off as just plain weird. majority of americans are poor? no one denies that there are poor americans but to go as far as saying that majority are poor ? majority of americans are like those who come on the jerry springer show? what then is the point of the jerry springer show?? u even say they are better christians than me when many of those people dont believe in a god of any kind. are all americans christians? geez mann i can no longer keep up with u coz there is no logic or reasoning in your posts,only demented looking religious fanactism.

« #52 on: Today at 02:33:42 PM »
mann some of the things you say are coming off as just plain weird. majority of americans are poor?

it is reality, unless you dont know that the middle class is already shrun considerably, and it is true that 5% at most controls 90% of the wealth! Now tell me what happens to the 50% of the american population? obama and his group are trying to have them health insurance coverage, and it is because most cant buy one of their own.

no one denies that there are poor americans but to go as far as saying that majority are poor ? majority of americans are like those who come on the jerry springer show? what then is the point of the jerry springer show??

whats the point of playing soccer matches, in a society that almost everyone plays it? the same is for Jerry Springer. I see that you ignore the MTV's 16 and pregnant. well let me excite you further. have you heard of the Jersey Shore? this is the typical italian youth expectations. just like travolta's Saturday Night Fever movies. you can deny the reality, but its there to hunt.

u even say they are better christians than me when many of those people dont believe in a god of any kind.

they are definitely better than you, the one who ignorantly say you know Him, yet you made Him partly human who dies, ghost like the devil and father who cant even hold on to the authority of His Godship completely!

are all americans christians? geez mann i can no longer keep up with u coz there is no logic or reasoning in your posts,only demented looking religious fanactism.

while not all americans are christians, thank Allah for His Mercy of bringing Islam to her, we cant deny that most americans are christians! man, you are not consistent; if you know that your God is One, why make Him 3?

jazakallahu

nopuqeater:

@godson: « #38 on: March 02, 2010, 07:22 PM » your lies are appauling. there is no place in the Quran that khadijah is mentioned. if you know, please show it to us.

well then i guess khadijat doesnt exist then right??lol neither was she rich nor influential and neither did she meet and marry mohammad when he was a stable boy, ok

nopuqeater:

you must be a bleeding liar. show us in the ahadith where Khadijah protected Muhammad and the muslims, a group that she herself is a member? supporter should not be interpreted as protector, unless the said supporter has the power to protect.

she was a member by default seeing as her toyboy younger gigolo husband was the president of the new religion incoporated called islam and she protected her husnad with her money and influence,i have no time for your infantille games just tell me if this assertions are lies or figments of my imagination
1.she met mohammad when he was a stable boy
2.she was a woman of considerable wealth and influence
3.she supported her husband in every way shape and form
how exactly do you protect if i may ask,by speaking an helpful word is a form of protection or do you think it is only when she carries a sword?

nopuqeater:

we know that Muhammad (as) was also protected by others, but there is that bold statement from you that Khadijah protected him, and you have the burden of proof.

she married him when he was at the lowest point financially so unless you are telling me that mohammad never touched a red cent of her money then what is your point??that is a form of protection without even looking at any other wayshe protected him

nopuqeater:

Muhammad was independently wealthy before they were married.

really??i didnt know stable boys got paid that much, i must look into going to saudi as a stable boy

nopuqeater:

it is not unheard of, even today that some wives are more successful than their male spouses. that will not deter from the male role as the husband. you dont know anything about it, or you are just being dishonest? i wonder if there is a male virgin at 25 in any society, attractive, with high morall compass, and when he married, it was to a 40 year old woman, twice married, and obviously not a virgin, yet thsi powerful woman knew her role well as a wife, irrespective of the age difference? you have any opinion of why Muhammad (as) though employed by her, still provided all the needs of the household, except that it is by devine injuction and or good morality of a man who knows his role as the husband?

how did you come by these lofty utopian surmissions,did mohammad catalogue all this in the quran or you conjured it out of your head because i will like you to post where these assertions are in the book of confusion quran why wont a 40 years old woman obey him??how many 25 yrs old yung men married old cargos i bet she will do anything to keep the young virile man she has as a husband how did you know mohammad provided all the household stuffs were you there??

nopuqeater:

ibet if it was you or any of your ilk that married such a woman, your empty male arrogance of being younger, if only that will subjugate the woman to the point that that she will know that she is almost worth(less) in the relationship, as she is no more 25 years old, with all the perkiness of youth.

we dont mistreat women,that is the exclusive preserve of muslims as evidenced in your quran

nopuqeater:

and the same muhammad (as) did not keep a good nature with his older wife Khadijah (ra) as in your not rocking te boat statement because it was khadijah that initially proposed and you must know by now that the virgin Aisha (ra) had co-wives, though she was extremely younger and from an equally affluence family enviroment.

of course she is the old cargo who saw a young boy that she wanted as a toyboy,she got waht she wanted and he got what he wanted money influence and power

@GODSON2009: « #41 on: March 03, 2010, 01:46 PM »

arrogance of ignorance. if muhammad (as) conferred prophethood upon himself, what was the need to wait till he was 40, instead of say the age of strenght between 25 and 35? afterall, jesus conferred godship on himself between 30 and 33 or maybe younger? i laugh at you in your mother tongue, whatever it is, godson. yet khadijah (ra) took him to waraqah ibn naf, the christian who said what he said. i think you should read what waraqah a true christian said about what muhammad (as) was about to become. that statement renders all you silliness as pure rubbish.


neither of these people's name appeared in the Quran as a protector of Muhammad and the muslims. we knw by ahadith that abitalib was a protector. khadijah was never a protector. you are now the one who lacks full knowledge, in the same fashion as the biblical Jsus, your god.

Muhammd did not leave Makka immediately his wife and or his uncle died. another person protected him, even after the death of his uncle. by the Quran and the ahadith, we know that Muhammad (as0 waited for revelation for his ZHijr, since many hijra were already made by the muslims, twice to Ethiopia and later the steady streaming of muslims to Madina from Makka. Islam of Muhammad was 13 years in makka before his own Hijr.

your point is so weak, since we saw that Baghirah the monk warned his uncle about the harm that could befall him, if he was taken to Syria as a young boy of say 8 or 9.

ridiculous ypothesis. a woman is still gender restricted even now, and in the days of Muhammad it was not different, since while Khadijah was banished to outside the city limit of Makka along with the rest of the Muslims, until the oath posted on the wall of Makka came out as it did, which was how the banishment of the muslims ended. you dont know that, or you are selective in your memory, just like Jesus of the Bible; sometimes he was god, other times he was just a prophet, yet at another a son of

except that his wife did not protect him. why pass lies as truth godson? and a wife as president or vice president still the wife of the husband. or in your world, she becomes your husband and you are the one now wearing the skirt?

GODSON2009:

@nopuqueater
arrogance of ignorance. if muhammad (as) conferred prophethood upon himself, what was the need to wait till he was 40, instead of say the age of strenght between 25 and 35? afterall, jesus conferred godship on himself between 30 and 33 or maybe younger? i laugh at you in your mother tongue, whatever it is, godson. yet khadijah (ra) took him to waraqah ibn naf, the christian who said what he said. i think you should read what waraqah a true christian said about what muhammad (as) was about to become. that statement renders all you silliness as pure rubbish.

simple!the reason was because mohammed didnt aquire any political and military power of note till he got to medina no?
he was operating in mecca from a position of weakness,so he had to bide his time if he wanted to live to be in his fifties. jesus chirt on the other hand came on a divine aunction unlike your man made religion who cares about what some random person said,i will believe you if you show me waraqah in the bible if not please keep it to yourself,i can pay any homeless christian on the street 20 pounds to shout alahu akbar loooool so thats what you consider as irrefutable proof??looooooool

GODSON2009:

neither of these people's name appeared in the Quran as a protector of Muhammad and the muslims. we knw by ahadith that abitalib was a protector. khadijah was never a protector. you are now the one who lacks full knowledge, in the same fashion as the biblical Jsus, your god.

was he protected by his uncle abu talib yes or no??simply refute my particular statement and stop your needless yapping,why should i be concerned what is in the quran or hadiths when i am not a muslim neither would i ever be till i die? lacking knowledge is if i assert falsehood like you have been doing about christianity however foreever keep silent if i am telling the truth that is contained in either the quran or reputable hadiths

GODSON2009:

Muhammd did not leave Makka immediately his wife and or his uncle died. another person protected him, even after the death of his uncle. by the Quran and the ahadith, we know that Muhammad (as0 waited for revelation for his ZHijr, since many hijra were already made by the muslims, twice to Ethiopia and later the steady streaming of muslims to Madina from Makka. Islam of Muhammad was 13 years in makka before his own Hijr.

whatever all i know is that the meccans in spite of his pouring vitriol on them did not do anything to him untill he committed a treeasonable offence o trying to bring in forein invaders which is when they sought to kill him and he fled to medina so the rest of the paparazi u r chattn s got nothing to do with me outside of the fact i have just written

GODSON2009:

your point is so weak, since we saw that Baghirah the monk warned his uncle about the harm that could befall him, if he was taken to Syria as a young boy of say 8 or 9.

direct question was his life sought after the death of those two people or notsimple!

GODSON2009:

ridiculous ypothesis. a woman is still gender restricted even now, and in the days of Muhammad it was not different, since while Khadijah was banished to outside the city limit of Makka along with the rest of the Muslims, until the oath posted on the wall of Makka came out as it did, which was how the banishment of the muslims ended. you dont know that, or you are selective in your memory, just like Jesus of the Bible; sometimes he was god, other times he was just a prophet, yet at another a son of

again ignoring the irrelevance you have written a direct question was khadijat wealthy considerably and influential or not?yes or no
did mohammed enjoy of her wealth as a result of their union or not or he continued working as a stable boy after marriage??

GODSON2009:

except that his wife did not protect him. why pass lies as truth godson? and a wife as president or vice president still the wife of the husband. or in your world, she becomes your husband and you are the one now wearing the skirt?

i asked a direct question and you are answering with some irrelevance, if your wife was wealthy and influential and u were not or waqs a stable boy will you spend out of your wife's resources or you wont simple and direct!!

@godSON: i doubt if you know what manhood means. even if your wife is the wealthiest and most powerful person on earth, as a man, you should struggle for independence, hold down a job and maintain the house according to your ability. thats a man's responsibility. the reason that Muhammad (as) was still the provider, even with all the wealth of Khadijah, which was why he worked, traded and did business with Jews, etc.

if a wife after all the husband's responsibilty have been displayed, met to keep the family happy, wishes to put a million USD on the table, every week to live in the lap of luxury, that will be her choice, a sadaqah on her part.

the independence of man to carry his weight is so important that the share of inheritance is twice that of his sister, then he is supposed to provide for his sister, and women folks from what he has.

you dont know this? i think you are one of these men who take money from women. we call people like you gigolos.

lack of morality; godSON was impressing us of his upright standing because he is not warming himself up in cold London with any woman, since his girlfriend is in Nigeria. this is according to him a sign of godliness, in the tradition of his name.

let me ask you; is having a girlfriend, hopefully you sleep with her, otherwise you will never have referenced not sleeping with anyone in England, right now, a quality of great sexual moral, or lack of it? girlfriend/boyfriends are not husband and wife. there is no marital ceremony to bind you together. no witness to your contract. and am sure, you could not go to your girlfriends house in Nigeria and spend the night under her fathers roof, waing her up at night and having sexual intercourse with her, knowing fully well that her father's bedroom is next to hers and he will hear the slightest sound.

if her father is liberal (a quality of degeration of moral compass), you will not allow that for your daughter, if you are a father, since you are a conservative, family morality man? i laugh at you in lagos language (whatever it is).

if this is how you think, is it not obvious that all your value is upside down if you say Muhammad (AS) was a stable boy just before he married Khadijah (RA)? i hope you dont smoke herbs, because your statement is providing a window to such a view? Muhammad who wasa successful trader before he got married. it was his success that got the attention of Khadijah, a thorough business woman, who saw a way to improve her success. was a trade the same as stable boy? if this is the case, then a hotelier is the same as house keepers of the hotel ( i read your past posts).

Alfa olabowale welcome back from exile

nopuqeater:

@godSON: i doubt if you know what manhood means. even if your wife is the wealthiest and most powerful person on earth, as a man, you should struggle for independence, hold down a job and maintain the house according to your ability. thats a man's responsibility. the reason that Muhammad (as) was still the provider, even with all the wealth of Khadijah, which was why he worked, traded and did business with Jews, etc.

if a wife after all the husband's responsibilty have been displayed, met to keep the family happy, wishes to put a million USD on the table, every week to live in the lap of luxury, that will be her choice, a sadaqah on her part.

the independence of man to carry his weight is so important that the share of inheritance is twice that of his sister, then he is supposed to provide for his sister, and women folks from what he has.

you dont know this? i think you are one of these men who take money from women. we call people like you gigolos.

i understand you but i am not a gigolo neither do i need to be because i have my means of livelihood which mohammed didnt have .he didnt have a career but a job(big difference)hence the wealthy woman coming into his life would have been a godsent this .
you say mohammad acted in complete independence,however have you considered why mohammad never married another wife nor indulge in all the sxual vices he was later known for untill the deeath of khadijat??i bet your manly prie and chauvinistic stance will not let u even consider that your almighty mohammad could have been financially sponsored by his wife

nopuqeater:

lack of morality; godSON was impressing us of his upright standing because he is not warming himself up in cold London with any woman, since his girlfriend is in Nigeria. this is according to him a sign of godliness, in the tradition of his name.

i wasnt trying to make an impression,if i did that then i am committing a sin i was only trying to highlight the fact that it is something millions of born again christian did without seeing it as a great sacrifice it is part of being right with GOD but co-joined to other virtues

nopuqeater:

let me ask you; is having a girlfriend, hopefully you sleep with her, otherwise you will never have referenced not sleeping with anyone in England, right now, a quality of great sexual moral, or lack of it? girlfriend/boyfriends are not husband and wife. there is no marital ceremony to bind you together. no witness to your contract. and am sure, you could not go to your girlfriends house in Nigeria and spend the night under her fathers oof, waing her up at night and having sexual intercourse with her, knowing fully well that her father's bedroom is next to hers and he will hear the slightest sound.
if her father is liberal (a quality of degeration of moral compass), you will not allow that for your daughter, if you are a father, since you are a conservative, family morality man? i laugh at you in lagos language (whatever it is).

like i have severally asserted my own core beliefs and convictions come directly from the bible no more no less as far as my bible is concerned as soon as my girl friend's parents accept me and give me permission to marry their daughter including their blessings,we are as good as married,the rest of the ceremonies are just that ceremonyso she is not a casual girlfriend but my wife since i have fulfilled these secondly i would not leave my own house and then go over to sleep over at my girlfriend's house talk less of in the same room

nopuqeater:

if this is how you think, is it not obvious that all your value is upside down if you say Muhammad (AS) was a stable boy just before he married Khadijah (RA)? i hope you dont smoke herbs, because your statement is providing a window to such a view? Muhammad who wasa successful trader before he got married. it was his success that got the attention of Khadijah, a thorough business woman, who saw a way to improve her success. was a trade the same as stable boy? if this is the case, then a hotelier is the same as house keepers of the hotel ( i read your past posts).

mohammaed was a stable boy before he got married to khadijat ,let me ask you where did they meet then if he wasnt a stable boy
if mohammad was a sucessful trader how come they were suffering ,for want of food and the basic stuffs when they first got to medina??surely he wouldhave had a ot of money and not resort to raidings to survive khadijat was the mugun that paid for the invention and running of islam in the early mednan and meccan stages untill mohammad started to make his own money through the raidings and stuffs

^^^ Can I know of your source for the Prophet's history?