CoolUsername:
CM Punk making Roman Reigns look strong at a game in Chicago.

but why will WWE even consistently tell Punk to "make Roman look really strong". They made wrestling popular but no one can convince me that they didn't ruin it.

ValeeLove:
let's pretend that WWE didn't do that for a desperate attempt at ratings for NXT. It was a bad idea from the start and I mentioned it. Nobody truly wins in things like this but una no wan listen.
Meanwhile where is the 1 million ratings she popped for one night; does it still exist after then? THINK LONGTERM.

NXT Ratings have been trending slightly upwards since last year. Even if you call the ratings "fake" or whatever, WWE always has some popular talent without much to do on the main roster that can be put into an NXT storyline, so how fake will it be at that point?

ValeeLove:
but why will WWE even consistently tell Punk to "make Roman look really strong". They made wrestling popular but no one can convince me that they didn't ruin it.

They wanted the guy that they had chosen to be the future face of the company to look strong in defeat. Oh no, the horror! CM Punk was so salty about this even after John Cena made him look strong during their feud.

Furthermore, wrestling is doing quite fine and is probably the best it has been since the late 00s. We have WWE doing its best work in a long time, we have a big money prospect in AEW and their ROH cross-promotional stuff, we have TNA still going strong, we have NWA Powerrr getting a TV deal with CW, we have a decent indie circuit, and we even have mudshow cringe like GCW. Not to mention the NJPW, Choco Pro, and Stardom in Japan and the whole Mexican wrestling circuit. We also have WWE increasing the talent pool with the PC, they now target ex highschool and college athletes with talent like Bianca Belair, Tiffany Stratton, Sol Ruca, and even Logan Paul come to mind. Wrestling fans are eating good.

Same Punk who beat the entire shield in a 3 on 1 handicap match? Wwe is doing fine by earnings and merchandise sales but you'd rather stick to being finnicky about everything. Yes, there's always room for critique as exemplified in Purple's recaps but when you're renowned for always 'fed bad'. it gets exhausting. Even Jim Cornette on his podcast/youtube gives em their flowers when due.
There's plethora of alternatives out there.
You could always switch to MMA or Boxing if prowrestling isn't scratching your realism itch.

ValeeLove:
but why will WWE even consistently tell Punk to "make Roman look really strong". They made wrestling popular but no one can convince me that they didn't ruin it.

samistry:
Same Punk who beat the entire shield in a 3 on 1 handicap match? Wwe is doing fine by earnings and merchandise sales but you'd rather stick to being finnicky about everything. Yes, there's always room for critique as exemplified in Purple's recaps but when you're renowned for always 'fed bad'. it gets exhausting. Even Jim Cornette on his podcast/youtube gives em their flowers when due.
There's plethora of alternatives out there.
You could always switch to MMA or Boxing if prowrestling isn't scratching your realism itch.

I know a fellow goofy when I see one.

Fellow SC_jerker acknowledged

CoolUsername:


I know a fellow goofy when I see one.

CoolUsername:


They wanted the guy that they had chosen to be the future face of the company to look strong in defeat. Oh no, the horror! CM Punk was so salty about this even after John Cena made him look strong during their feud.

Furthermore, wrestling is doing quite fine and is probably the best it has been since the late 00s. We have WWE doing its best work in a long time, we have a big money prospect in AEW and their ROH cross-promotional stuff, we have TNA still going strong, we have NWA Powerrr getting a TV deal with CW, we have a decent indie circuit, and we even have mudshow cringe like GCW. Not to mention the NJPW, Choco Pro, and Stardom in Japan and the whole Mexican wrestling circuit. We also have WWE increasing the talent pool with the PC, they now target ex highschool and college athletes with talent like Bianca Belair, Tiffany Stratton, Sol Ruca, and even Logan Paul come to mind. Wrestling fans are eating good.

you don't need to ''make anybody look strong". If you're strong it will show. Imagine trying to make Brock look strong, lol. Wrestling should be organic; flexible. WWE ruined it with their excessive booking and marketing.

Forget the rest. NJPW has been on a deep decline since the pandemic. AEW (though had a big show in the UK) has been suffering from low attendance; it's comical at the moment. WWE, oh they are pretty good at marketing but they can't hide how bad they are currently. They've barely made any new stars, they need to bring back legends and old-timers to pop numbers and they depend so much on the Saudi shows. And the biggest proof of all; a much younger UFC beats them in size and quality. Ask people what they think first when they think WWE and you'll hear the "old names". In summary WWE is a lot of brilliant marketing built on already established reputation with less substance to show (how can you explain pipeing noise).

"Talent like Bianca Belair", okay o. All I know is you can't teach talent and passion.

CoolUsername:


NXT Ratings have been trending slightly upwards since last year. Even if you call the ratings "fake" or whatever, WWE always has some popular talent without much to do on the main roster that can be put into an NXT storyline, so how fake will it be at that point?

we're not kids here. Remove the main roster guys completely and let's see what they make on a weekly. We already know what the number is so forget this argument.

samistry:
Same Punk who beat the entire shield in a 3 on 1 handicap match? Wwe is doing fine by earnings and merchandise sales but you'd rather stick to being finnicky about everything. Yes, there's always room for critique as exemplified in Purple's recaps but when you're renowned for always 'fed bad'. it gets exhausting. Even Jim Cornette on his podcast/youtube gives em their flowers when due.
There's plethora of alternatives out there.
You could always switch to MMA or Boxing if prowrestling isn't scratching your realism itch.

when people tell you "I watch for the story" or "it's entertainment", you know there's a problem. WWE ruined pro-wrestling like that. They made it silly, goofy and inauthentic. These are facts. I'm not saying they aren't selling merch, Disney is too, but that doesn't make it pro-wrestling. I don't have much of a problem with them currently cos they've cooled down on that storyline. All I'm saying is that they ruined wrestling and it's a fact.

ValeeLove:
we're not kids here. Remove the main roster guys completely and let's see what they make on a weekly. We already know what the number is so forget this argument.

Don't use your assets to maximise profit?

Not how business works.

ValeeLove:
when people tell you "I watch for the story" or "it's entertainment", you know there's a problem. WWE ruined pro-wrestling like that. They made it silly, goofy and inauthentic. These are facts. I'm not saying they aren't selling merch, Disney is too, but that doesn't make it pro-wrestling. I don't have much of a problem with them currently cos they've cooled down on that storyline. All I'm saying is that they ruined wrestling and it's a fact.

And you are still wrong.

Pro wrestling was already "ruined" in the 80s when WWE had to admit it was fake to state regulators. It has always been "silly" and "goofy", The Undertaker literally debuted from a coffin back in 1984.

Wrestling was never ruined, you just never liked it.

AEW acquires new upcoming talent after Sting's untimely retirement.

Purple wen crown jewel, Nxt or Raw reviews?

If what I'm hearing is true...poor Keith Lee

CoolUsername:


Don't use your assets to maximise profit?

Not how business works.

guy, you're a WWE fanboy, I know. But this isn't America where company partisanship reigns supreme. We over here in Naija have bigger things to worry about , so let's leave the fantasy for those who are actually close to the wrestling companies. Wrestling is silly! I didn't say this, other people did. It's a well known fact. And that exactly is my point - it shouldn't be. The silliness is the reason original NXT wrestlers can't draw (since it became 2.0), the gimmicks, excess scripts - you name it - have all been the reason for their downfall. Now they need good ratings to attract sponsors and brands in this new merger and they can't because wrestling (atleast in 2023) is silly - known fact. They now import wrestlers and actual stars that have no business being on that roster to be there, even if it's their asset can we atleast agree that it's an act of desperation and it's because the current crop of talent are not that good. Come to think of it, if the developmental guys aren't that good and can't make money for the company; where does that leave the future of the company? Leave company partisanship for actual Americans and face reality; wrestling today is bad.

ValeeLove:
guy, you're a WWE fanboy, I know. But this isn't America where company partisanship reigns supreme. We over here in Naija have bigger things to worry about , so let's leave the fantasy for those who are actually close to the wrestling companies.

I like pro wrestling as a whole, not just WWE. However, since AEW internet marks are so tribalist. I will continue to make posts trolling them from time to time.

ValeeLove:

Wrestling is silly! I didn't say this, other people did. It's a well known fact. And that exactly is my point - it shouldn't be. The silliness is the reason original NXT wrestlers can't draw (since it became 2.0), the gimmicks, excess scripts - you name it - have all been the reason for their downfall.

"Wrestling is silly." Oh what an insight! Welcome to 1990.

I, like most wrestling fans, don't give a damn about that. I just want to be entertained after work. If I wanted something serious, I'd go watch Channels News.

NXT 2.0 is a developmental brand, different from Black And Gold which tried to be a third brand. The roster is full of younger wrestlers rather than indie veterans. Also, they don't draw like Raw or Smackdown for the same reason the Championship doesn't draw like the EPL. However, they still draw more then every other wrestling show excluding Raw, Smackdown, and Dynamite.

ValeeLove:

Now they need good ratings to attract sponsors and brands in this new merger and they can't because wrestling (atleast in 2023) is silly - known fact. They now import wrestlers and actual stars that have no business being on that roster to be there, even if it's their asset can we atleast agree that it's an act of desperation and it's because the current crop of talent are not that good. Come to think of it, if the developmental guys aren't that good and can't make money for the company; where does that leave the future of the company? Leave company partisanship for actual Americans and face reality; wrestling today is bad.

Now, I don't know the details about their sponsorship revenue but I always see that they have sponsored segments, ad spot , and sponsored matches. I see them promoting new games, movies and series all the time. Not to mention, their deal with the Saudis.

Are you sure of this claim that you're making?

samistry:
Purple wen crown jewel, Nxt or Raw reviews?

WGA strike is over, Purple is now a part-timer.

What are the chances that CM Punk returns?

CoolUsername:


I like pro wrestling as a whole, not just WWE. However, since AEW internet marks are so tribalist. I will continue to make posts trolling them from time to time.

now you're rolling in the same mud with them. Kudos.

CoolUsername:

"Wrestling is silly." Oh what an insight! Welcome to 1990.

I, like most wrestling fans, don't give a damn about that. I just want to be entertained after work. If I wanted something serious, I'd go watch Channels News.

you used 'silly' and 'entertained' in the same sentence, that says it all. Vince sold you guys (and he's good at it) a bill of goods and y'all bought it. Brock is silly. A billion dollar company is silly, wow you've got a hell of a mindset going on.

CoolUsername:

NXT 2.0 is a developmental brand, different from Black And Gold which tried to be a third brand. The roster is full of younger wrestlers rather than indie veterans. Also, they don't draw like Raw or Smackdown for the same reason the Championship doesn't draw like the EPL. However, they still draw more then every other wrestling show excluding Raw, Smackdown, and Dynamite.

this one is English; is Becky, Cena, Taker, Cody, and every other main roster guy that appear on that show an act of desperation, yes or no?!

CoolUsername:

Now, I don't know the details about their sponsorship revenue but I always see that they have sponsored segments, ad spot , and sponsored matches. I see them promoting new games, movies and series all the time. Not to mention, their deal with the Saudis.

Are you sure of this claim that you're making?

There is nothing to be sure here. They need good ratings to please sponsors especially with this new merger. Having sponsors isn't the same as keeping them. Fox is pulling out for the same reason, Ari Emmanuel is saying they're not profiting for the same reason, so I know what I'm saying.

ValeeLove:
now you're rolling in the same mud with them. Kudos.


you used 'silly' and 'entertained' in the same sentence, that says it all. Vince sold you guys (and he's good at it) a bill of goods and y'all bought it. Brock is silly. A billion dollar company is silly, wow you've got a hell of a mindset going on.

Yes.

Why is this so hard to understand? Rowan Atkins became a multi millionaire and legend by making the goofiest slapstick humour possible. Yes, silly things can be entertaining.

ValeeLove:

this one is English;

Well actually, it's statistics. NXT's ratings have been trending upwards since last year.

ValeeLove:

Is Becky, Cena, Taker, Cody, and every other main roster guy that appear on that show an act of desperation, yes or no?!

It is a method of bringing attention to your B-show. You use old stars to momentarily pop the ratings in hopes that a portion of the new audience stays. Looking at the stats, it seems to have worked.

ValeeLove:

There is nothing to be sure here. They need good ratings to please sponsors especially with this new merger.

They have good TV ratings for the streaming era.

ValeeLove:

Having sponsors isn't the same as keeping them. Fox is pulling out for the same reason,

They have already secured a deal with USA.

ValeeLove:

Ari Emmanuel is saying they're not profiting for the same reason, so I know what I'm saying.

I'm going to need a source for that because official sources say otherwise.

https://corporate.wwe.com/investors/news/press-releases/2023/02-02-2023-210607072

Unless, of course, you think WWE is lying to investors.

CoolUsername:


Yes.

Why is this so hard to understand? Rowan Atkins became a multi millionaire and legend by making the goofiest slapstick humour possible. Yes, silly things can be entertaining.

comedy isn't silly it's a serious business. That being said, wrestling isn't comedy - so if you say Rowan made his money by doing silly things then what is silly about Brock Lesnar bashing somebody's head in with his huge fist? How is pro-wrestling in any way likened to Comey I ask. Good comedy isn't silly or goofy, it's logical and intelligent.

CoolUsername:

Well actually, it's statistics. NXT's ratings have been trending upwards since last year.



It is a method of bringing attention to your B-show. You use old stars to momentarily pop the ratings in hopes that a portion of the new audience stays. Looking at the stats, it seems to have worked.

is it an act of desperation, yes or no?! I don't have the time to go into detail with you but bringing main roster guys to compete with dev guys is a lazy move to get ratings. Again, how do we trust the dev guys to take over the company when they can't even draw on their own. It's no wonder the dev guys do nothing when they eventually get called up. No one that came from the NXT right now is doing anything of worth. Tell me when I'm telling lies.

CoolUsername:

I'm going to need a source for that because official sources say otherwise.

https://corporate.wwe.com/investors/news/press-releases/2023/02-02-2023-210607072

Unless, of course, you think WWE is lying to investors.

it's true he already did some press release for that. He said TKO Isn't making as much profit as they anticipated and he's going to be relying on strategies to make some - something like that.

ValeeLove:
comedy isn't silly it's a serious business. That being said, wrestling isn't comedy - so if you say Rowan made his money by doing silly things then what is silly about Brock Lesnar bashing somebody's head in with his huge fist?

Brock Lesnar dancing with mariachi band during his feud with Eddie Guerrero was comedy. Brock Lesnar's backstage segments with Kurt Angle were always comedic. Brock Lesnar customising the MITB briefcase as a boom box and dancing around the ring was comedic.

Grown half-naked men pretending to fight each other will always be an inherently silly concept. Deal with it.

ValeeLove:

How is pro-wrestling in any way likened to Comey I ask. Good comedy isn't silly or goofy, it's logical and intelligent.

Who decided that, my guy? Good comedy is whatever makes you laugh. Sometimes I want to listen to the funny social critique of George Carlin or Dave Chappelle and sometimes I just want to see Akpororo make funny noises.

ValeeLove:

is it an act of desperation, yes or no?! I don't have the time to go into detail with you but bringing main roster guys to compete with dev guys is a lazy move to get ratings.

I don't know why you're hung up on this. Maybe it's because you need to cling to your narrative that WWE is secretly failing. But that's just pure cope.

ValeeLove:

Again, how do we trust the dev guys to take over the company when they can't even draw on their own.

They were already drawing more than every other wrestling show excluding Raw, Smackdown, Dynamite, and maybe Rampage—who they were on neck and neck with.

ValeeLove:

It's no wonder the dev guys do nothing when they eventually get called up. No one that came from the NXT right now is doing anything of worth.

If you're talking about the most recent draft picks, mostly true. Only Zoey Stark, Grayson Waller, and Santos Escobar seem to have direction. If you're talking about NXT drafts in general, then false.

CoolUsername:


Brock Lesnar dancing with mariachi band during his feud with Eddie Guerrero was comedy. Brock Lesnar's backstage segments with Kurt Angle were always comedic. Brock Lesnar customising the MITB briefcase as a boom box and dancing around the ring was comedic.

it's funny how the least favorite parts of Brock's menacing career is what you mention. Do you have more? For 1 comedy Brock you show me, I'll produce 10 serious dangerous Brocks that people were actually interested in.

CoolUsername:

Grown half-naked men pretending to fight each other will always be an inherently silly concept. Deal with it.

they wear tights cos it's a sport and so they can move around easily, same thing with boxers and MMA fighters (are they silly too?). They aren't pretending to fight, they act, like in movies, and also hit each other a bit to show realism. There's nothing silly about legimately getting punched in the face, bleeding and getting concussed. All that shows it's a serious business and should be treated as such.

CoolUsername:

Who decided that, my guy? Good comedy is whatever makes you laugh. Sometimes I want to listen to the funny social critique of George Carlin or Dave Chappelle and sometimes I just want to see Akpororo make funny noises.

guy our world is run by logic. I don't know what you're thinking trying to defend your point so badly, because even entertainment is logical. It's why movies have critics and it's also why people walk out of theatres when the movie makes no sense, as simple as that. Pu7pl3 comes here every week to critique wrestling shows. He wouldn't do that if he believed wrestling was naturally stupid, as you claim. What then would be his justification for critiquing the shows. Stop being sentimental because of WWE.

CoolUsername:

I don't know why you're hung up on this. Maybe it's because you need to cling to your narrative that WWE is secretly failing. But that's just pure cope.

Ari Emmanuel did a press conference (or sort) discussing that. Look it up.

CoolUsername:

They were already drawing more than every other wrestling show excluding Raw, Smackdown, Dynamite, and maybe Rampage—who they were on neck and neck with.

at what time? Atleast not anymore. They need main roster guys (who have no business being there) to get consistent big numbers (this is true whether you admit it or not). It's really bad when Becky is boasting about consistently defending a developmental belt. Imagine CR7 boasting t of winning developmental trophies at this point in his career. She doesn't even belong on that roster. Dev belts are for dev wrestlers, but I guess WWE doesn't use logic anyway.

CoolUsername:

If you're talking about the most recent draft picks, mostly true. Only Zoey Stark, Grayson Waller, and Santos Escobar seem to have direction. If you're talking about NXT drafts in general, then false.

NXT drafts in general abeg. These ones you've mentioned haven't made any impact. If WWE needs stars, they get from other brands like AEW, Impact, ROH and NJPW. It's funny how WWE no longer knows how to make stars that they have to import them.

ValeeLove:
it's funny how the least favorite parts of Brock's menacing career is what you mention. Do you have more? For 1 comedy Brock you show me, I'll produce 10 serious dangerous Brocks that people were actually interested in.

Comedic acts help the crowd get invested in people, e.g., Sami Zayn. Even serious shows have funny moments. Wrestling gives us that variety and not every single big wrestling show our there has its comedy acts. You are flat out wrong and it is now obvious that you don't understand pro wrestling as an artform

ValeeLove:

they wear tights cos it's a sport and so they can move around easily, same thing with boxers and MMA fighters (are they silly too?). They aren't pretending to fight, they act, like in movies, and also hit each other a bit to show realism. There's nothing silly about legimately getting punched in the face, bleeding and getting concussed. All that shows it's a serious business and should be treated as such.

Wrestlers pretend to fight and either don't make contact at all is try to mitigate contact as much as possible. It's 2023, everyone knows this. Stop being a mark.

ValeeLove:

guy our world is run by logic. I don't know what you're thinking trying to defend your point so badly, because even entertainment is logical. It's why movies have critics and it's also why people walk out of theatres when the movie makes no sense, as simple as that. Pu7pl3 comes here every week to critique wrestling shows. He wouldn't do that if he believed wrestling was naturally stupid, as you claim. What then would be his justification for critiquing the shows. Stop being sentimental because of WWE.

I think wrestling is stupid and I love it that way. Every single wrestling promotion I have ever seen has comedy in it. Show me the successful wrestling promotion without comedy acts and where everything is taken completely serious at all times.

Also do you think comedy movies don't get critiqued? I don't know what you're going on about with this argument.

ValeeLove:

Ari Emmanuel did a press conference (or sort) discussing that. Look it up.

Lol, lmao even. There was a slight dip in revenue because Vince McMahon got exposed for being a perv. WWE is not failing, this is absolute cope.

ValeeLove:

at what time? Atleast not anymore. They need main roster guys (who have no business being there) to get consistent big numbers (this is true whether you admit it or not). It's really bad when Becky is boasting about consistently defending a developmental belt. Imagine CR7 boasting t of winning developmental trophies at this point in his career. She doesn't even belong on that roster. Dev belts are for dev wrestlers, but I guess WWE doesn't use logic anyway.

This is like talking to a brick wall. I literally posted a graph showing the ratings of the major wrestling shows from November 2022 to October 2023 and you obviously didn't look at it because you're really just here to spout off IWC talking points. They have consistently been 4th or 5th and, more recently, 3rd or 4th.

ValeeLove:

NXT drafts in general abeg. These ones you've mentioned haven't made any impact. If WWE needs stars, they get from other brands like AEW, Impact, ROH and NJPW. It's funny how WWE no longer knows how to make stars that they have to import them.

If you don't consider Grayson Waller featuring on almost every Smackdown since his arrival or Zoey Stark becoming number one contender in the 6 months since the draft as making an impact then too bad.

Why do you care, though? You claim not to watch anyway.

ValeeLove:
it's funny how the least favorite parts of Brock's menacing career is what you mention. Do you have more? For 1 comedy Brock you show me, I'll produce 10 serious dangerous Brocks that people were actually interested in.

Comedic acts help the crowd get invested in people, e.g., Sami Zayn. Even serious shows have funny moments. Wrestling gives us that variety and not every single big wrestling show our there has its comedy acts. You are flat out wrong and it is now obvious that you don't understand pro wrestling as an artform

ValeeLove:

they wear tights cos it's a sport and so they can move around easily, same thing with boxers and MMA fighters (are they silly too?). They aren't pretending to fight, they act, like in movies, and also hit each other a bit to show realism. There's nothing silly about legimately getting punched in the face, bleeding and getting concussed. All that shows it's a serious business and should be treated as such.

Wrestlers pretend to fight and either don't make contact at all is try to mitigate contact as much as possible. It's 2023, everyone knows this. Stop being a mark.

ValeeLove:

guy our world is run by logic. I don't know what you're thinking trying to defend your point so badly, because even entertainment is logical. It's why movies have critics and it's also why people walk out of theatres when the movie makes no sense, as simple as that. Pu7pl3 comes here every week to critique wrestling shows. He wouldn't do that if he believed wrestling was naturally stupid, as you claim. What then would be his justification for critiquing the shows. Stop being sentimental because of WWE.

I think wrestling is stupid and I love it that way. Every single wrestling promotion I have ever seen has comedy in it. Show me the successful wrestling promotion without comedy acts and where everything is taken completely serious at all times.

Also do you think comedy movies don't get critiqued? I don't know what you're going on about with this argument.

ValeeLove:

Ari Emmanuel did a press conference (or sort) discussing that. Look it up.

Lol, lmao even. There was a slight dip in revenue because Vince McMahon got exposed for being a perv. WWE is not failing, this is absolute cope.

ValeeLove:

at what time? Atleast not anymore. They need main roster guys (who have no business being there) to get consistent big numbers (this is true whether you admit it or not). It's really bad when Becky is boasting about consistently defending a developmental belt. Imagine CR7 boasting t of winning developmental trophies at this point in his career. She doesn't even belong on that roster. Dev belts are for dev wrestlers, but I guess WWE doesn't use logic anyway.

This is like talking to a brick wall. I literally posted a graph showing the ratings of the major wrestling shows from November 2022 to October 2023 and you obviously didn't look at it because you're really just here to spout off IWC talking points. They have consistently been 4th.

ValeeLove:

NXT drafts in general abeg. These ones you've mentioned haven't made any impact. If WWE needs stars, they get from other brands like AEW, Impact, ROH and NJPW. It's funny how WWE no longer knows how to make stars that they have to import them.

If you don't consider Grayson Waller featuring on almost every Smackdown since his arrival or Zoey Stark becoming number one contender in the 6 months since the draft as making an impact then too bad.

Why do you care, though? You claim not to watch anyway.

CoolUsername:


Comedic acts help the crowd get invested in people, e.g., Sami Zayn. Even serious shows have funny moments. Wrestling gives us that variety and not every single big wrestling show our there has its comedy acts. You are flat out wrong and it is now obvious that you don't understand pro wrestling as an artform

it's true, it's the comedy, and absolutely nothing to do with his wrestling and acting skills. I wonder why comedy didn't work for Santino, Hurricane and other comedic wrestlers that you don't even know because they weren't even successful enough to have their names remembered. Nice job deflecting the Brock Lesnar analysis. Brock is a widely known realistic fighter and the worst moments in his career was doing those few comedy stuffs (I wonder why). Nobody thinks of comedy when they recall what made WWE great. They think Austin and The Rock, Hogan and Andre; all serious stuffs. There is entertainment in wrestling, but it's not silly, it is serious. If it was silly, no one would watch it, except if they were dumb of course.

CoolUsername:

Wrestlers pretend to fight and either don't make contact at all is try to mitigate contact as much as possible. It's 2023, everyone knows this. Stop being a mark.

so where do the consussions come from if they weren't making contact. Where do the receipts come from. What about the legitimate injuries since the wrestlers are just petting each other in the face.

CoolUsername:

I think wrestling is stupid and I love it that way. Every single wrestling promotion I have ever seen has comedy in it. Show me the successful wrestling promotion without comedy acts and where everything is taken completely serious at all times.

wrestling is not stupid; or atleast shouldn't be. If it was then there is no basis to watch it, cos only a stupid person can watch and enjoy a stupid show. Are you stupid? Again, comedy isn't stupidity, good comedy is logical and intelligent. My argument still remains that, even though I like comedy, it doesn't belong in wrestling and it's not an excuse to refer to pro-wrestling as silly just because you're too scared to admit that a lot of things Vince McMahon sold you guys makes no sense.

CoolUsername:

Also do you think comedy movies don't get critiqued? I don't know what you're going on about with this argument..

I believe I already answered this.

CoolUsername:

Lol, lmao even. There was a slight dip in revenue because Vince McMahon got exposed for being a perv. WWE is not failing, this is absolute cope.

I don't even know if we're talking about the same thing, but I know what I've told you. And I never said WWE as a whole was failing, my main point was NXT. I just used that to explain my point. I'll just say WWE being significantly lesser than UFC which they are far older than is a sign that their show is heavily flawed. But that's another discussion for another day.

CoolUsername:

This is like talking to a brick wall. I literally posted a graph showing the ratings of the major wrestling shows from November 2022 to October 2023 and you obviously didn't look at it because you're really just here to spout off IWC talking points. They have consistently been 4th.

with or without main roster guys? You're the one deflecting. Your graph is correct, no one is disputing that; but like I said before, admit it's a sign of desperation from WWE to consistently introduce main roster guys on the dev show. I used an example of CR7. Very logical, but you completely deflected to continue the boring tale about graphs meanwhile you consistently refuse to answer the question. That's not a debate, it's not even a discussion.

CoolUsername:

If you don't consider Grayson Waller featuring on almost every Smackdown since his arrival or Zoey Stark becoming number one contender in the 6 months since the draft as making an impact then too bad.

Why do you care, though? You claim not to watch anyway.

Grayson Waller? The prospect I had so much hope for and my fears for him came to pass because WWE doesn't know how to do anything. They eventually turned him to Miz 2.0. No, that's not a success.
Anybody can be no 1 contender, the script just has to say so. Whats her crowd reaction like? Atleast Knight is getting some. What's the ratings when she's on TV? That's how you know a real star. I have nothing against her, but I don't trust WWE to know how to properly present a wrestler in 2023.

ValeeLove:
it's true, it's the comedy, and absolutely nothing to do with his wrestling and acting skills. I wonder why comedy didn't work for Santino, Hurricane and other comedic wrestlers that you don't even know because they weren't even successful enough to have their names remembered. Nice job deflecting the Brock Lesnar analysis. Brock is a widely known realistic fighter and the worst moments in his career was doing those few comedy stuffs (I wonder why). Nobody thinks of comedy when they recall what made WWE great. They think Austin and The Rock, Hogan and Andre; all serious stuffs. There is entertainment in wrestling, but it's not silly, it is serious. If it was silly, no one would watch it, except if they were dumb of course.

Danhausen was very successful in the indie circuit, with his merch always selling out quickly on PWTees. He's a pure comedy act.
For all the comedic acts that didn't make it, there are several "silent badasses" who didn't make it either. Now let's look at another thing you said, Hulk Hogan would literally "Hulk up" in the middle of the match and no-sell his opponent's offence like an anime character. The Rock refers to himself in this person. Mick Pholey would oscillate between hardcore sicko and absolute goofball throughout his career.

Also, I like how because you personally didn't enjoy Brock Lesnar's comedic segments, they are now objectively the worst moments of his career. His segments with Kurt Angle are remembered fondly by fans. You are a just a guy trying to pass his personal opinion off as fact.

ValeeLove:

so where do the consussions come from if they weren't making contact. Where do the receipts come from. What about the legitimate injuries since the wrestlers are just petting each other in the face.

Hahaha. Do you really think concussions are by design? Concussions and other injuries are mishaps that occur. Have you ever been in a fight in your life? Do you know what happens when an exposed closed fits meets a face full-on? Blood, swelling, broken noses and possible concussions, like when Nia Jax accidently punched Becky Lynch. Do you see wrestlers leaving every match with black eyes and busted noses? That's because they either hit light glancing blows or whiff completely.

ValeeLove:

wrestling is not stupid; or atleast shouldn't be. If it was then there is no basis to watch it, cos only a stupid person can watch and enjoy a stupid show. Are you stupid? Again, comedy isn't stupidity, good comedy is logical and intelligent. My argument still remains that, even though I like comedy, it doesn't belong in wrestling and it's not an excuse to refer to pro-wrestling as silly just because you're too scared to admit that a lot of things Vince McMahon sold you guys makes no sense.
I believe I already answered this.

You're being an absolute nerd right now. "Ooh I'm so smart, I don't want comedy in my fake fighting". "Fake fighting shouldn't be silly because I said so." "Good comedy has to be intelligent." "Only stupid people like stupid shows." "Now excuse me as I go and watch a guy in a dinosaur mask fight a guy that cuts his his forehead with a blade weekly."

Like I said, show me the wrestling promotion that has no comedy or silliness. Or just admit that you don't enjoy pro wrestling, and go and watch Khabib hug another man for 20 minutes.

ValeeLove:

I don't even know if we're talking about the same thing, but I know what I've told you. And I never said WWE as a whole was failing, my main point was NXT. I just used that to explain my point. I'll just say WWE being significantly lesser than UFC which they are far older than is a sign that their show is heavily flawed. But that's another discussion for another day.

WWE is not UFC, pro wrestling is not and will never be MMA. Deal with it.

ValeeLove:

with or without main roster guys? You're the one deflecting. Your graph is correct, no one is disputing that; but like I said before, admit it's a sign of desperation from WWE to consistently introduce main roster guys on the dev show. I used an example of CR7. Very logical, but you completely deflected to continue the boring tale about graphs meanwhile you consistently refuse to answer the question. That's not a debate, it's not even a discussion.

It is a pointless question. What is my business with the emotional state that WWE execs were in when they decided to make a business decision (which seems to be working)?

Older talents compete for these belts to legitimise the titles and the other competitors they face. Tiffany Stratton Vs Becky Lynch was a career-defining moment for Tiffany Stratton. Now, whenever she gets into the main roster, they can call back to her epic battle with one of the greats and present her as a major threat. It is literally win-win for the younger talent but I guess haters gon hate.

ValeeLove:

Grayson Waller? The prospect I had so much hope for and my fears for him came to pass because WWE doesn't know how to do anything. They eventually turned him to Miz 2.0. No, that's not a success.
Anybody can be no 1 contender, the script just has to say so. Whats her crowd reaction like? Atleast Knight is getting some. What's the ratings when she's on TV? That's how you know a real star. I have nothing against her, but I don't trust WWE to know how to properly present a wrestler in 2023.

Wow, you had hopes for a guy on a show that you don't watch? Tell me more!

It's been 6 months since the draft. Not even The Rock, Stone Cold or John Cena made it big 6 months into their main roster careers. I'm sure you know this. This is not a legitimate concern.

CoolUsername:


Danhausen was very successful in the indie circuit, with his merch always selling out quickly on PWTees. He's a pure comedy act.
For all the comedic acts that didn't make it, there are several "silent badasses" who didn't make it either. Now let's look at another thing you said, Hulk Hogan would literally "Hulk up" in the middle of the match and no-sell his opponent's offence like an anime character. The Rock refers to himself in this person. Mick Pholey would oscillate between hardcore sicko and absolute goofball throughout his career.

and where's Danhausen today? He isn't even a wrestler. That's like worst example you could bring up. Hogan was serious, same as The Rock. Seriousness was what people remembered them for and definitely not goofiness. If there ever were, then it was minimal and it got overshadowed by their actual serious work in the ring. There is no basis for argument here. Meanwhile my bone to pick with you, is you saying pro-wrestling is and should be goofy. And I've already established that you can't use comedy to back up your point because it takes an intelligent person to make people laugh. The word "goofy" in itself is a negative word and I still don't understand why you choose to stand by this baseless argument of yours, asides the fact that Vince has reconfigured your thinkings. Again, if pro-wrestling were goofy and stupid as you insist then there's no basis for Pu7pl3 to come here every week to critique each show. A goofy show doesn't need critiquing because there's no basis of logic to do that. Hell, no one should even watch a goofy show. I think you need to re-evaluate your life's choices.
Don't deflect or avoid my questions again. Answer them directly, squarely, logically and drop every form of sentiment what so ever.

CoolUsername:


Also, I like how because you personally didn't enjoy Brock Lesnar's comedic segments, they are now objectively the worst moments of his career. His segments with Kurt Angle are remembered fondly by fans. You are a just a guy trying to pass his personal opinion off as fact.

no one thinks of backstage comedy segments when they think of Brock and Angle, they think of Mania 19 and the Smackdown 30 minutes Iron Man match. Comedy is good, it just doesn't belong in wrestling. I already mentioned that before.

CoolUsername:


Hahaha. Do you really think concussions are by design? Concussions and other injuries are mishaps that occur. Have you ever been in a fight in your life? Do you know what happens when an exposed closed fits meets a face full-on? Blood, swelling, broken noses and possible concussions, like when Nia Jax accidently punched Becky Lynch. Do you see wrestlers leaving every match with black eyes and busted noses? That's because they either hit light glancing blows or whiff completely.

you said they don't make contact so I'm asking, how do they get injured so much if they barely make contact as you claimed. I say they make contact, but with minimized impact, so that if someone makes too much impact it may lead to an actual injury. It's not a movie, it's pro-wrestling.

CoolUsername:


You're being an absolute nerd right now. "Ooh I'm so smart, I don't want comedy in my fake fighting". "Fake fighting shouldn't be silly because I said so." "Good comedy has to be intelligent." "Only stupid people like stupid shows." "Now excuse me as I go and watch a guy in a dinosaur mask fight a guy that cuts his his forehead with a blade weekly."

Like I said, show me the wrestling promotion that has no comedy or silliness. Or just admit that you don't enjoy pro wrestling, and go and watch Khabib hug another man for 20 minutes.

really? You think so little of me. No wonder you're so hot. You think I'm speaking only against WWE? I'm speaking to the whole wrestling community. You can let your guard down now, I'm not here to witch-hunt your fav company. I'm speaking about the whole industry.
Atleast Khabib is making money doing real, logical, non-goofy stuff.

CoolUsername:

WWE is not UFC, pro wrestling is not and will never be MMA. Deal with it.

But they got bought by UFC though. I don't even want them to become UFC. I just want wrestling to become logical. I want what you might want to call a sports based product. There is a reason why people have been yearning for that for years. There is a reason WWE adjusted their wrestling matches and patterns over the years to suit that phrase. There is a reason why many fans jumped on the AEW bandwagon after Tony Khan promised a sports based product. There is too much entertainment going on in wrestling and especially WWE today. It needs to reduce so the sports aspect of it can shine.

CoolUsername:



It is a pointless question. What is my business with the emotional state that WWE execs were in when they decided to make a business decision (which seems to be working)?

Older talents compete for these belts to legitimise the titles and the other competitors they face. Tiffany Stratton Vs Becky Lynch was a career-defining moment for Tiffany Stratton. Now, whenever she gets into the main roster, they can call back to her epic battle with one of the greats and present her as a major threat. It is literally win-win for the younger talent but I guess haters gon hate.

It should be your business, the why is more important than the what. If your fav company makes decisions motivated by the wrong reasons, that spells doom for them. So why did they bring Becky to NXT? A desperate attempt at ratings, as simple as that. It wasn't to elevate any rookie, it wasn't so that a career defining moment is created for any rookie; it was simply a desperate attempt at ratings. The same reason they brought Judgement Day, Cena, Taker, Cody, New Day, Rey and the rest; a desperate attempt at ratings. The more I think about it the more I realize that the show is slowly less becoming about developmental wrestlers and the main roster guys are stealing the spotlight from the up and comers. Yes, it's true. If the top guys want to truly help the main roster guys then they should help train and give them advice. As simple as that. Going down to the DEVELOPMENTAL (hope you know what this word means) brand to win titles will eventually cause more harm than good as Becky's value has significantly dropped for participating with the dev brand too much and at the end losing to a dev wrestler. It's appalling. Back in the day if you were drafted to ECW (still part of the main roster) it was a downgrade, now imagine voluntarily participating in a DEVELOPMENTAL brand only to lose to a developmental wrestler. No amount of sentiment you spill can make sense of that decision.

WINS AND LOSSES MATTER.

CoolUsername:

Wow, you had hopes for a guy on a show that you don't watch? Tell me more!

It's been 6 months since the draft. Not even The Rock, Stone Cold or John Cena made it big 6 months into their main roster careers. I'm sure you know this. This is not a legitimate concern.

Since you keep going back to this matter I'll explain for the last time. I DON'T FOLLOW WWE. I can't remember when last I watched a full WWE show. If there isn't anything good on TV, sure I'll give them a chance, but I don't watch nor like WWE. I don't follow them. It's that simple. I am though, a pro-wrestling fan so it is still my duty to know what's going on in the pro-wrestling world generally. I follow trending news in the wrestling world and if I hear that WWE did something good on their programming, I can go check it out to see if it's truly good or not. But know that I don't follow WWE. It's that simple.
That being said Grayson Waller and all the other newbies are people I wish the best for, but I don't trust WWE in 2023 to know how to present a wrestler, especially a new one. I mean look what they did to Johnny Gargano. They turned him into a comedy actor immediately he debuted on the main roster, and now he's irrelevant. Grayson (who used to be my favorite prospect) is now Miz-lite and doing nothing of worth on the main roster. Now they are seeking how they can get talent from AEW and make big names out of them, what about their own NXT guys, aren't they good enough. WWE isn't that great company anymore. I realized this years ago. For some of you guys it's this Bloodline thing that is sharking you and I just laugh. Has the story not bombed now? What is almighty Sami Zayn doing now? Storylines don't work in wrestling. Even as an AEW fan I say the same thing even after the 2 year long story of Adam Page. At the end he was a bad champion. Storylines don't work brother. Deal with it.