follypimpi:

Dudu is AW paying u in cedis to be stickin up for him like this.

Cedis? Na so AW be baba ijebu reach?

debosky:

HOW OLD was Silvestre when Arsenal signed him? He signed at 31, after being out for nearly A FULL SEASON with injury. Silvestre was washed up when we signed him - he was behind Rio, Vidic, Evans and even O'Shea for a CB position. What else would you define as washed up? He was completely out of reckoning with France, what else do you need?  

Depends on how you look at it, he had been in and out of action for a long time but there was nothing concrete to suggest he couldn't put his injury woes behind him. prior to his injury troubles he played 44 games for Manure when they recaptured the title in 05/06 season and was missing from early 06/07 to late 07/08 while we bought him beginning of 08/09. For such a well decorated player it looked a bargain at .5m.

debosky:

It is unbelievable for you to compare Silvestre who had been out for nearly a whole season to Gallas who played regularly for us for over half the season. There is NO JUSTIFICATION at all for not holding on to Gallas - if you are willing to give 35 year old Sol a one year deal, why isn't Gallas who is still regularly featuring for France being offered a 2 year deal?
Wenger is simply stubborn - if he gave him 2 years, we might be able to sell him on for £5m just like Chelski did for Carvalho right now.

We could also end up stuck with him winding down his contract like Silvestre, Sol still looked good, hasn't had any recent injury (except if a big tummy has become an injury) and on the strength of last season's performance is still going strong, I'm sorry but I can't say the same for Billy.

debosky:

Gallas that still featured at the last WC is what you are comparing to Silvestre?  
Dudu you go to some astonishing lengths to justify bad decision making by the gaffer - this is yet another example of it.

How would you rate his performance at the world cup? going by your prior arguments, beaten by both Mexico and SA who are lightweights in international football, should any sane coach buy him now?

A signing that shows what a genius Arsene Wenger is at spotting talents that same way he saw the talents in Silvestre

1) FRANCIS JEFFERS

Everton to Arsenal - £8 million (2001)
Arsene Wenger has earned this infamous tag as someone who is very taut with his money. Perhaps this is not surprising when you consider his market failures from 2001 where he spent £16.5m on Francis Jeffers and Giovani van Bronckhorst. The former was undoubtedly the biggest transfer flop of Wenger’s Gunners reign. The skinny Scouser, 20 at the time, had only scored 18 goals in 49 games for Everton but somehow warranted an £8m fee despite non-existent technical and physical skills. He was tagged by some as the English version to Italy legend Pippo Inzaghi, a “fox in the box”, but was way out of his depth at Highbury. Hit the back of the net just four times in 22 appearances during two years before being loaned out and eventually sold. Has struggled with smaller teams ever since, and at 29 he is currently without a club.

Another example is David bentley

Who was described as

The 25-year-old strikes a nice connection, and whips in an inviting cross now and then, but what else can he do? He can’t dribble, he has limited pace, strength or physical attributes, he rarely scores, and he is mentally vulnerable. In two seasons at White Hart Lane, Bentley has made just 37 league appearances, many of them as substitute, with just three goals and four assists.

http://www.goal.com/en/news/2377/top-10/2010/08/10/2064072/top-10-ridiculously-overpriced-british-players-of-all-time

I don reach stage wey I go go another sabbatical like Akola jare . . .

how can I be here debatting SILVESTRE of all people ?      

dayokanu:

Delusion is an integral part of being a GAYYner, Imagine someone saying Silvestre looked decent at any point in his career

Why does DK speak from both sides of his mouth? to quote Sauron, do you know that Silvestre is more decorated than any living Munich player? And please stop clogging up the thread with those posts, we've seen them before.

duduspace:

We also conceeded goals like crazy with him in the side, he was there when we were thumped 3-1 by both Chelsea and Manure.

I am not doubting that - but there was a clear degradation of our defensive results with him OUT of the side. You can't deny that - Wenger rated him so highly he rushed him back from injury.

Individual career paths differ, it shows strength of character that he is doing better with old age, he could have missed out for a lot of reasons while younger including political upheaval in Bosnia (can't recall how many popular Bosnian players I know). We can only go with his recent performances and they have been impressive. He is also meant to make up the numbers not necessarily a main stay, which is why I think it might not go through now that Montpellier are talking a lot about money.

Bosnian violence had NOTHING to do with his issues - he was playing in Croatia as far back as 2001, 9 years ago, moved to Russia over 6 years ago so nothing has stopped him from moving elsewhere. By what measure do you deem him impressive? He neither finished in the CL positions, neither did he make the Team of the Season in Ligue 1. The only reason Montpellier are calling for a lot of cash is because we spent so much on Koscielny.

All I know is that his reviews are good and for a CD to be tagged the player to watch for any side shows remarkable performance, in a game that focuses so much on goals.

Puhleeze - being rated in a crap side like Montpellier is no proof of ANYTHING. The rating in itself is very subjective and not corroborated by anything else, no awards, no accolades, no trophies, NOTHING.

Lai lai, not since Arsene has taken over this team have 6 first teamers been out of pre-season. Infact missing pre-season is usually a precursor to losing your first team position (have you so soon forgotten the Flamini and Gilberto debacle). Since I've been following Arsenal pre-season (since 03/04) never have 6 first teamers not appeared at all during pre-season matches and most of our pre-seasons have included 1 or more losses (though I must point out we've also never conceded up to 5 goals in a single match during pre-season)

The injured players in preseason for 2009 were  Rozzi, Nasri, Djourou, Eduardo, Fabianski and Walcott. Those are the ones I can remember and that is already 6.

Maybe, but it is amazing what you can come up with when you have a doomsday oriented perspective, Almunia has taken us to within 4 points of winning the PL as our first choice keeper in the past and wasn't in the worst lot of GKs we had until now, wouldn't you have called Almunia a proven PL keeper prior to last season?

You are comparing apples with oranges again - we don't even have 3 fit CBs and all our goalkeepers are useless. This is not a matter of a doomsday perspective at all. We have the worst goal keepers in the EPL top 8 that is a DISGRACE.

Everyone is hyping Joe Hart now but do you know exactly what sort of season he will have next?
Maybe, but he's just coming off an impressive season for both club and country, those are good enough antecedents for a backup CD.

Hart is quality - it's been known for a while now; NONE of our keepers have had a season as good as Hart so there's no comparison. Spahic with one good season AND Koscielny with one good season is a recipe for disaster. We have too LITTLE top level experience. Forget Djourou, cos he will be injured all season long.

So you count Smalling as proven?? pray what has he done to merit such a tag? if you ask me I think we dodged a bullet with that transfer, and you have an injury prone Rio too. What had Ivanovic won before moving to Chelsea?

Who is calling Smalling proven? He is the lowest on the pecking order but at least has EPL experience, but you are OK with TWO of our 3 main CBs (agian JD is out of it) with little or no experience at the top level?  

same thing Spahic won (the Russian cup with Locomotiv Moscow). He is also captain of his national squad if that doesn't show character I wonder what does.

How old was Ivanovic? Was he in decline like Spahic is at over 30??   What are you comparing?   Ivanovic was 23 when he was in Russia, not 30+ like Spahic is now. When Chelski bought Ivanovic, they had Terry, Carvalho and Alex, THREE quality CBs [/b]so they could afford to take a risk. We have [b]ONLY ONE proven CB and you want to take TWO risks?  

We had Silvestre who had won everything winnable with Manure and where did that end up We can only go by his recent performances and the reports are good.

A washed up Silvestre who has just spent a season out injured is not a good reference point - that was doomed from the start. We are talking about getting the likes of Mexes, Jagielka, heck even Upson would be a better deal than Spahic due to his EPL experience. One risk in Koscielny (still young and developing) I can accept, but two? Especially one not reaching good form till 30 (maybe to secure one big pay day?)

The reports are not saying anything of value, the only reason he has come up is because of self marketing to Arsenal - he isn't even attracting attention from French clubs, he's not in the team of the season, he's never played in a quality side apart from one season. That is not any proof of anything. If anything Spahic potentially worse than Silvestre who at least has experience to fall back on - this guy has NOTHING except a history of playing in backwater leagues.

Now na to siddon look a la Uncle Bola.

Silvestre?There is no reason on earth and beyond that justified his signing.

duduspace:

Why does DK speak from both sides of his mouth? to quote Sauron, do you know that Silvestre is more decorated than any living Munich player? And please stop clogging up the thread with those posts, we've seen them before.

This statement puts the M in moronic. Oshea is also more decorated than Fabregas.

Because Silvestre has won more medal as a sub means he is up to 5%?

kay_pumpin:

Now na to siddon look a la Uncle Bola.

Silvestre?There is no reason on earth and beyond that justified his signing.

Have you ever seen hindsight being wrong? I hadn't become regular on Nairaland about the time that transfer went down, but I'll be very glad if someone can point me to a thread where anyone of you here kicked off when he was transferred. That would make me better respect your position.

duduspace:

Have you ever seen hindsight being wrong? I hadn't become regular on Nairaland about the time that transfer went down, but I'll be very glad if someone can point me to a thread where anyone of you here kicked off when he was transferred. That would make me better respect your position.

There is a time-frame so that should guide you in digging for thread. . . .God help you.

Silvestre?He's not worth my posts and effort so i wouldn't even go there.

Next?

Why are we debating a player evryone is happy has left.
The important thing is to bring in an able defender.
More important is that we refine our approach to defense.
We had to good defensive combo in gallas and verm last season yet we conceeded enough. The whole team needs to be more defensively awarem what worries me however is that by what I've seen pre-season we are yet to achieve that.

kay_pumpin:

There is a time-frame so that should  guide you in digging for thread. . . .God help you.
Silvestre?He's not worth my posts and effort so i wouldn't even go there.
Next?

All I'm saying is no one here could have predicted Silvestre's stint would turn out the way it did. If anyone did, let them prove it. At the time Silvestre was bought, he looked a bargain for .5m anyone who comes to grandstand saying I told you so now is only taking the mick.

dayokanu:

This statement puts the M in moronic. Oshea is also more decorated than Fabregas.
Because Silvestre has won more medal as a sub means he is up to 5%?

I know your favorite pastime is rewriting history, Silvestre was a guaranteed starter prior to his injury and still started in the QF of the UCL against Roma on return from injury.

This is his Manure record:

1999–2000 38
2000–01         47
2001–02    51
2002–03         54
2003–04         46
2004–05         50
2005–06         48
2006–07         21
2007–08          6

or is DK's definition of a sub one who plays over 40 games per season for his club?

Truth be Told
When a scummie friend of mine sent a text that we just signed Silvestre, i thought,his P.A had access to his phone and was playing pranks on 'oga's' friends.
I logged on to arsenal.com and there he was smiling with an Arsenal jersey
A scummie in an Arsenal Jersey
I woke up the next day and checked and the story was still there
That was when I believed.

HNIC:

Truth be Told
When a scummie friend of mine sent a text that we just signed Silvestre, i thought,his P.A had access to his phone and was playing pranks on 'oga's' friends.
I logged on to arsenal.com and there he was smiling with an Arsenal jersey 
A scummie in an Arsenal Jersey
I woke up the next day and checked and the story was still there
That was when I believed.

Your reasons were not football or performance related but sentimental, I'm sure some people also belly ached when we bought Big Sol from Tottenham or when we swapped Gallas for Cashley (though that must have been tempered by his prior tapping up behaviour though).

duduspace:

Your reasons were not football or performance related but sentimental, I'm sure some people also belly ached when we bought Big Sol from Tottenham or when we swapped Gallas for Cashley (though that must have been tempered by his prior tapping up behaviour though).

Naah
Big Sol was gonna walk straight into our team.
Gallas was gonna walk straight into our first 11
Silvestre was just gonna be an 'extra tyre'.
No way he coulda displaced Kolo or Gallas
Would have felt better if it was Ferdinand or Vidic
Not someone who was on his way to Citeh or was it Sunderland and then jumped at the offer to come to London.

HNIC:

Naah
Big Sol was gonna walk straight into our team.
Gallas was gonna walk straight into our first 11
Silvestre was just gonna be an 'extra tyre'.
No way he coulda displaced Kolo or Gallas
Would have felt better if it was Ferdinand or Vidic
Not someone who was on his way to Citeh or was it Sunderland and then jumped at the offer to come to London.

But then the idea wasn't to displace those 2 I think but to provide backup and competition and if Big Sol didn't have his initial nervous breakdown, would Gallas really have been a shoe in for first choice CB with his being unable to tie down a CB position at Chelsea?
Anyone would have preferred any of those 2 you mention but at what cost? was Arsenal bouyant enough at that point in time to pay 20+m for Rio?

follypimpi:

Is only Dudu that thinks Sylv was a good signing,AW love take silly risk and it will keep costing us.Don't be too surprised if converts SONG into a CB with Denilson Pairing Diaby + FAB4.I can assure you until we sign a GK + an EPL experienced strong defender,Emirates cup will be our only trophy this season,Mark my word.If we WIN anything this season i will gladly give u a sum of £200 cash,

Everyone knows he is not a good signing now with hindsight, at the time he was bought, he was a bargain at .5m. You were getting a multiple trophy winner playing at the top end and just getting into his 30s. There was nothing at that time that suggested Silvestre wouldn't be a solid backup for at least another 2-3 years.
A lot of people are still clamouring for Sol at 35+

follypimpi:


Is only u + AW that would take quantity over quality and call it good Bargain,Bramble woulda costed less and done a betterjob than Slyv,Now bite me.

This is strange, where did biting creep into a discussion about football? are you Mike Tyson in disguise?

follypimpi:


Is only u + AW that would take quantity over quality and call it good Bargain,Bramble woulda costed less and done a betterjob than Slyv,Now bite me.

i got this image in my mind scary thought

^^What the heck!

Mukina please take that picture down.

@muki

That pic is scary, why did yu have to mess up my sleep tonite? Your plan has worked I'm stayin off this thread for a while until that pic scrolls off. Let me go and watch our boys of the moment play for the 3 lions.

duduspace:

Have you ever seen hindsight being wrong? I hadn't become regular on Nairaland about the time that transfer went down, but I'll be very glad if someone can point me to a thread where anyone of you here kicked off when he was transferred. That would make me better respect your position.

You want evidence? Take your pick

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-16992.20608.html#msg2685948

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-16992.20640.html#msg2687202

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-16992.20704.html#msg2693310

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-16992.20736.html#msg2693659

No one here wanted Silvestre, we all HATED his guts, but since he became an Arsenal player, we decided to support all the same, only to be proven right in the end.

Selling Silvestre to Arsenal was the best DEAL SAF ever made.

Debo . . .U can now see that some people only live in d present forgetting there was a past, Silvestre wey we hate pass even as a scummie ?

See wetin trophylessness dey cause.

When I say trophylessness brings delusion una go dey make noise, Se as duduspace felt Silvestre was Nesta incarnate.

and Nasri is Messi

duduspace:

A lot of people are still clamouring for Sol at 35+

Sol at 35+ is better than Silvestre at 33, despite not playing footie for half a season - that should be enough of an answer for you.

Secondly, Sol is an Arsenal legend. . . .he won trophies with us, so apart from his performances, we have history with him hence there is greater affinity for the player.

Regardless of all that, we all saw the desire and drive in Sol at 35+, while some other squad members were content with strolling around - that fire and desire isn't something you can easily find, hence the reason Sol is valued.

Go back to the threads - you'll see why anyone with a brain in his head couldn't fathom letting go Gilberto who could also play at CB at 31 due to signing a new deal, but instead carries a Utd reject and brings him in.

That was probably one of AW's worst transfer moves, coupled with Bischoff.

debosky:

Sol at 35+ is better than Silvestre at 33, despite not playing footie for half a season - that should be enough of an answer for you.

Secondly, Sol is an Arsenal legend. . . .he won trophies with us, so apart from his performances, we have history with him hence there is greater affinity for the player.

Regardless of all that, we all saw the desire and drive in Sol at 35+, while some other squad members were content with strolling around - that fire and desire isn't something you can easily find, hence the reason Sol is valued.

Go back to the threads - you'll see why anyone with a brain in his head couldn't fathom letting go Gilberto who could also play at CB at 31 due to signing a new deal, but instead carries a Utd reject and brings him in.

That was probably one of AW's worst transfer moves, coupled with Bischoff.

What?? ?? ?? Did Bischoff score five own goals??

eldee:

What?? ?? ?? Did Bischoff score five own goals??

Dr Kitaun:

Debo . . .U can now see that some people only live in d present forgetting there was a past, Silvestre wey we hate pass even as a scummie ?

Thanks for the blast from the past Dr. Kit, I must admit there was a lot of discontent at the time about buying him, but mostly for sentimental reasons attached to him having played for Manure before and losing Gilberto to the over 30 rule prior to buying him.

The only 2 people who gave strong footballing reasons were eldee and Cesc04 and I must admit they were spot on in their assesment of his injury situation. Debo sat on the fence and I didn't see a post from Dr. Kit (no offence meant o, I might not have looked well enough and a lot of posts from others indicated yu would be miffed at the very idea). My thought at the time was that he was a good bargain for a backup CB with the versatility to cover the LB position and hindsight shows it was a wrong decision though at a cost of 750K not a costly one.

That is precisely why I'm backing Arsene's call on Billie G (in case we've all forgotten that is what kicked this debate off), his injury might not have been as long as Tweety's but some signs last  season were not good and once bitten twice shy. I also understand Debo's view on Spahic but his recent performance have been impressive and give reasons to suggest a good buy, there was a lot of brouhaha about Vermaelen's antecedents and height last season but he proved his mettle.

I choose not to believe that Arsene has suddenly decided to go tight fisted just for the sake of it, the same man who broke an English wage record to sign Big Sol at the height of his powers will not suddenly decide to go for bargain buys and internal development without good reason.