Deadlytruth:


That is a stupid escapist response in denial of responsibility. Nigeria is far larger, more populated, more diverse and far more complex than Ghana and every other West African country to recover from a destroyed foundation so soon.
That there was military rule in other West African countries doesn't justify its introduction to Nigeria. From Independence we purposed and destined ourselves to be greater than all those countries, so why should we have immitated their retrogressive ways while calling ourselves the Giant of Africa and their big brother who should have set the example of nation building?
Only a very stupid people would rationalize a stupid action of theirs with the claim that everyone else once did it.
Did the US we were hoping to be like ever have military coups?
We are not even really talking about the Jan 15 1966 coup which was just a treasonable offence against the state but that Ironsi destroyed and violated the very first ever mutual agreement we ever all consented to as our terms of coexistence thereby sowing the seeds of the perpetual distrust that has held us back and made it difficult for Igbos to get the exit they so desire as those who are supposed to work with them to get it don't trust them as good potential allies given Ironsi's treacherous dealing with Nigeria on their advice.

The same South Africa which made that saying you quoted also set up Truth and Reconciliation Committee to look into the past with the purview of addressing the mistakes made at the foundational stage before they as a people could get past their first and have a future together. So we must address the Ironsi blunder which Igbos must first admit and apologize for in the spirit of truth before we can either move forward as one country or part ways. Anything short of that will not be tolerated from Igbos.

gaskiyamagana:

Just as Jonathan have it in 2015.
Another loser is loading.

jafol:

Yes and we love him like that. ATIKU is also a jihadist and hero to ipob christians. Anything else?

gidgiddy:


You never had any foundation to begin with. You are just a product of the British enforcement of ethnic groups against their will into A colonial project called Nigeria. Bynthe time the British were preparing to go, you so called 'Nigerians' were already masacaring each other in a clear sign that we are not meant to be together. When the British left in 1960, the killings continued. The census crises, 1964 election crises and operation wetie of 1965. Nigerians were killing themselves in huge numbers and the military stepped in January 1966, but people l8ke keep saying that Nigeria was fine until the first coup when there was already fire on the mountain.

Then this first coup, people like Major Ademoyega, Captain Adeleke, Lt Oyewole and It Egbiko were all Yoruba participants. So what percentage of the coup was Yoruba?South Korea had Military coups, today they are a generation ahead of Nigeria. Ghana had Military coups , today Ghana is a success story in Africa. You people are still moaning and blaming the first coup 52 years later

Even when the Igbos you are complaining about declared their independence and went their way, you Nigerians declared war and fought to bring Igbos back into the fold

The history of Nigeria had finally proved to even a blind man that Lugard made a catastrophic mistake bringing us together in 1914. We are more divided today than in 1960. It is now time to call a spade a spade, conduct a referendum and allow those who have been choking in unholy union to exit and start afresh

Deadlytruth:


First and foremost, I am not Yoruba and it is actually ill-informed to think that whoever is intelligent enough to discern that Ironsi's Unification Decree destroyed Nigeria must be Yoruba. By always so insinuating you Igbos actually unduly credit Yorubas with superiority of mental faculty over those of all other Southern tribes.
Per the bolded, all Nigerian tribes had immediately after the amalgamation realized and admitted that fact. Only you Igbos chose to deny the obvious in preference for living under the illusion of the fraudulent 'one-Nigeria' created in the greedy imagination of your father Azikiwe who colluded with the same British you now so much deride to sabotage all other tribes' calls for a reversal of Lord Luggard's blunder at a time it could have been peacefully and bloodlessly done if you Igbos had cooperated. But in your selfish hidden agenda already foreshadowed by the earlier declarations by your kinsmen Zik and Charles Onyeama that it was just a question of time for some Igbo gods to give the British contraption over to you Igbos dominate and totally own, you did all you could to encourage the sustenance of the colonial enforcement which you never agreed it was despite knowing deep down in your mind that it actually was. who therefore was most guilty of knowing that Nigeria was not fine and could never really become fine but preferred to believe the contrary if not you Igbos?
The pre-independence massacres and disturbances could be ascribed to the fact that Nigerians were yet to produce a constitution by themselves and for themselves. But at independence, we successfully did that and we all mutually consented to it. However, problem started again when you Igbos colluded with the North to produce a coalition government which began to undermine key aspects of that constitution by way of aiding and abetting the anti-constitutional acts of Balewa like the undue interference in the purely internal affairs of the Western Region. At that point you Igbos didn't realize that all was not well. But once your collusion with him eventually emboldened Balewa to rig censuses and elections to such a degree of brazenness that boomeranged againt you Igbos yourselves, you suddenly realized that Nigeria was a colonial contraption and rather than sponsor a motion to restore your earlier rejected secession clause to enable you get out, you rather tried to seize power through a coup with the purview of making your own constitution and imposing it on Nigeria. While that appeared to have been successful under your kinsman Ironsi, your earlier realization that Nigeria was a colonial contraption waned again and gave way to domination agenda inspired patriotism in pursuit of which you almost killed an Ijaw man who dared declare the secession you later hypocriticaly started asking for. You even went as far as quickly and unilaterally adjusting the constitution once more to make the Anti-secession Decree. Ironsi, on your behalf, toyed with the constitution as it pleased you in your dubious pursuit of your domination agenda, and all that while you cheered in him on because Nigeria was still fine in your eyes. But once Ironsi was kicked out by your old friends and allies, the Hausafulanis, beating you to your domination agenda game, Nigeria again began to appear as British enforcement in your eyes.
This is the ever shifting opinion of you Igbos about the legality of Nigeria. So who really takes you seriously?

gidgiddy:


This going back what happend 50 or 60 years won't help anyone in 2018. We all need to join hands and get government to conduct a referendum so that those who still believe in the Nigerian dream can continue, and those of us who are tired of Nigeria can exit

gidgiddy:


This going back what happend 50 or 60 years won't help anyone in 2018. We all need to join hands and get government to conduct a referendum so that those who still believe in the Nigerian dream can continue, and those of us who are tired of Nigeria can exit

Chemcrown:


The seccession (referendum) clause that would have been in the constitution that Zik rejected, the regional system of government that Ironsi stylishly abolished.
And again, we are even divided on what Ibo really want: are they really interested in referendum or are they atikulating now?
Gidgiddy, are you atikulating or no referendum, no election?

SouthEastFacts:

Atiku fought Sharia with his life while the yoruba moslems' hero was banned from entering USA for 15 years for fanaticism.

Deadlytruth:


First and foremost, I am not Yoruba and it is actually ill-informed to think that whoever is intelligent enough to discern that Ironsi's Unification Decree destroyed Nigeria must be Yoruba. By always so insinuating you Igbos actually unduly credit Yorubas with superiority of mental faculty over those of all other Southern tribes.
Per the bolded, all Nigerian tribes had immediately after the amalgamation realized and admitted that fact. Only you Igbos chose to deny the obvious in preference for living under the illusion of the fraudulent 'one-Nigeria' created in the greedy imagination of your father Azikiwe who colluded with the same British you now so much deride to sabotage all other tribes' calls for a reversal of Lord Luggard's blunder at a time it could have been peacefully and bloodlessly done if you Igbos had cooperated. But in your selfish hidden agenda already foreshadowed by the earlier declarations by your kinsmen Zik and Charles Onyeama that it was just a question of time for some Igbo gods to give the British contraption over to you Igbos dominate and totally own, you did all you could to encourage the sustenance of the colonial enforcement which you never agreed it was despite knowing deep down in your mind that it actually was. who therefore was most guilty of knowing that Nigeria was not fine and could never really become fine but preferred to believe the contrary if not you Igbos?
The pre-independence massacres and disturbances could be ascribed to the fact that Nigerians were yet to produce a constitution by themselves and for themselves. But at independence, we successfully did that and we all mutually consented to it. However, problem started again when you Igbos colluded with the North to produce a coalition government which began to undermine key aspects of that constitution by way of aiding and abetting the anti-constitutional acts of Balewa like the undue interference in the purely internal affairs of the Western Region. At that point you Igbos didn't realize that all was not well. But once your collusion with him eventually emboldened Balewa to rig censuses and elections to such a degree of brazenness that boomeranged againt you Igbos yourselves, you suddenly realized that Nigeria was a colonial contraption and rather than sponsor a motion to restore your earlier rejected secession clause to enable you get out, you rather tried to seize power through a coup with the purview of making your own constitution and imposing it on Nigeria. While that appeared to have been successful under your kinsman Ironsi, your earlier realization that Nigeria was a colonial contraption waned again and gave way to domination agenda inspired patriotism in pursuit of which you almost killed an Ijaw man who dared declare the secession you later hypocriticaly started asking for. You even went as far as quickly and unilaterally adjusting the constitution once more to make the Anti-secession Decree. Ironsi, on your behalf, toyed with the constitution as it pleased you in your dubious pursuit of your domination agenda, and all that while you cheered in him on because Nigeria was still fine in your eyes. But once Ironsi was kicked out by your old friends and allies, the Hausafulanis, beating you to your domination agenda game, Nigeria again began to appear as British enforcement in your eyes.
This is the ever shifting opinion of you Igbos about the legality of Nigeria. So who really takes you seriously?

3rdeyeNigeria:


However sad and shameful, this your submission appear almost right except for one single error which we Nigerians are always guilty of.

Anytime I hear an educate fellow using the terms "your kinsman", "Your Son" I get disappointed.

They was no time Igbo tribe uniformly made (or agree to make) those decisions Zik, Aguiyi Ironsi, Nzougwu made.

They were individual, independent, humans, power hungry... They made an exclusive decision.

It would be so grossly unfair and stupid to judge your whole tribe for an action you individually took.

And then they was no internet and free flow of information as it is now therefore 98% of Igbos never knew what was really happening.


My point is say No to generalisation and grouping.

3rdeyeNigeria:


However sad and shameful, this your submission appear almost right except for one single error which we Nigerians are always guilty of.

Anytime I hear an educate fellow using the terms "your kinsman", "Your Son" I get disappointed.

They was no time Igbo tribe uniformly made (or agree to make) those decisions Zik, Aguiyi Ironsi, Nzougwu made.

They were individual, independent, humans, power hungry... They made an exclusive decision.

It would be so grossly unfair and stupid to judge your whole tribe for an action you individually took.

And then they was no internet and free flow of information as it is now therefore 98% of Igbos never knew what was really happening.


My point is say No to generalisation and grouping.

Deadlytruth:


Unfortunately you couldn't see that the person I responded to started the generalization and I only gave it back to him in his coin.
However, contrary to your position, Zik was voted into the parliament by Igbos to represent and lead them just like every other political leaders of the time.
If Igbos didn't approve of Zik's myopic position on those issues, then why didn't they recall him despite the process was even easier under colonial era than now?
Please recall as well that Ironsi's Unification Decree was a product of advice from his nearly 100% Igbo advisory committee headed by the Professor Nwabueze now chanting restructuring all over the place.

Chemcrown:


I want to believe that you are joking with this assertion. Whether the people are/were aware or not, all actions taken by a legislature is the action collectively taken by his/her constituency (reason they are called representative),
otherwise he or she will be recall.
Now that we have internet, What is the MAJOR response of ibos on Kanu's call for seccession and what is the MAJOR voice that Atiku is selected as the presidential aspirant for the opposition party.

gidgiddy:


Referendum dies not need to be in the constitution before it can be used. Referendum was been conducted in Nigeria in 1959, 1961 and 1963 with any referendum clause being in the constitution. Parts of Adamawa, Taraba and Bornu states are part of Nigeria because of referendum. Even Britain gave Scotland referendum in 2014 without referendum being in the British constitution. The only thing required to hold a referendum is a resolution of the National Assembly. So anybody thinking that there must be some sort of secession or referendum clause in the constitution before referendum can be conducted is ignorant .

Atikulating? I'm talking about the freedom of my people. Nigeria is not going to get better no matter who is in Aso Rock and God knows that Atiku and Buhari are just ad bad as each other

3rdeyeNigeria:


Is Kanu a legislator
Who made Kaduna Nzogwu a legislator

See, let me tell you "write this my quote down".

Soon another Igbo man would rise, most probably from obscurity and do something dangerous, risky, huge for 100% personal gain without zero recourse to his fellow neutral tribesmen living peacefully all over the country then people like you instead of catching that particular Igbo man and skin him alive till he bleeds to death you would conviniently blame the whole neutral Igbomen and attack them that their son, their kinsman did this and that....

This single action would lead to the second Civil war.

Save it somewhere.

And obviously I would not be with you in Your low IQ and tribalistic Nigeria now or during that period of self inflicted turmoil.

3rdeyeNigeria:


Understand this very important fact.
An average Igbo man (both in politics, paliarment or Main market) does not act to promote his tribe. He thinks about himself, his family, then his community rarely about his tribe or tribesmen.
They is no emotional connection.

Someone like Awolowo built schools, gave free education, he always wanted to push the Yoruba race forward... People like Zik actions were for personal gain Igbo race is not in their dictionary.

Same as current South East Governors, they have conveniently endorse Buhari since June which from current indication it is not a near popular decision and they are on their own as usual.

Let me ask a very dangerous.
God forbid, let say one of those governor (like Rocha.. God forbid) , out of personal intrest and greed conspire with some coupist and they murder the president. People like you would say it was Igbos, your son, your governor that kill him.

Then if people like us say that the governor acted on his own and should be treated as an individual murderer, your type would say why did "we" not impeach him.

Like I said, Everyman should be judged for his own sin. That's only when Nigeria can develop.

Chemcrown:


Point of correction, never recourse to insult because nobody can monopolise it.
I am referring to your low IQ utterance.
Now to the discourse, we can all see the jamboree and dances along embrace by the populace with respect to Kanu ranting. If Kanu eventually entered Abuja and brought back the head Buhari as promised, you want the people to believe that it is the single action of Kanu and not the ibos.
Then there is no moral justification for the ibos for blaming the Yorubas for the actions of Tinubu, Awolowo (betrayal issue). And you will never see any Yoruba man castigating their actions likewise, the Hausas. When someone is a public figure, he becomes people's voice EXCEPT the people come out to reject him enmass.
Lastly, I don't take insult lightly and I can throw decorum to the wind if I see a challenge.

Thanks.

Deadlytruth:


The example of instance you gave is not really analogous to the case in question. The difference here is that Okorocha's possible conspiracy with soldiers to kill the president would definitely not be known to the public to warrant other tribes asking why didn't Igbos impeach him while he did it. But Zik's advocacy against secession clause and his one Nigeria sloganeering were all out in the open with his fellow Igbos in the parliament cheering him on and terming him a nationalist while helping him hang the 'tribalist' label on the necks of those who chose to face the reality of the non-workability of Nigeria.

Chemcrown:



4. What was done then was not referendum (although a kind) but plebiscite - meaning what is conducted to determine change in sovereignty. Not a referendum leading staying alone. note if it is not conducted by that time, the people will still be under their respective protectorate.

5. Finally, it was the UK and not the Britain that permitted the referendum in Scotland and there is referendum bill in Scotland law which is not binding in the general law of UK.
THANKS A LOT BRO.

chiteny:


The highlighted word is why we fall prey to these politicians. The one in power also promised $1 = N1

thirdi:


Without sounding biased restructuring is not division it means fairness justice and equity

FunkyAlhaji2015:

What is your understanding of restructuring?

gidgiddy:


Wether you call it referendum or plebiscite, it is still a situation where people are voting to leave one political situation for another. Nigeria did not have any laws on referendum or plebiscite when it gained Northern British cameroon. If they had no law to gain, how can they have laws not to lose territory



The UK is the same thing as Britain. The UK is just the name that reminds people that Britain is made up of 3 united kingdoms. Britain has no laws on referendum but the British parliament granted Scotland a referendum based on the fact that the Scottish parliament had passed the same vote. The UK also used referendum once again in 2016 to leave the EU

3rdeyeNigeria:


Nnamdi Azikiwe is guilty as charged, same as those half baked educated Igbos on the parliament.

Now my point... My grandfather was alive then, he was a community head. He wasn't educated.

He was more involved in his local domain politics till the counter coup progrom started.

It was the wake up call.

He was never part and parcel of Zik arraingment, Zik grew up in the north, started his political career in Lagos.

Him and his fellow political jobbers from the east never made any popular decision nor decision that would promote the Igbo tribe as you are painting it.

If you say Zik made mistake in insisting on one Nigeria that was not workable out of lust for power , you are right 100%
But if you say "Igbos" made the mistake because the son, their daughter, their adoption son, their kinsman, their legislator Who is an independent Soul, human being made a decision out of personal greed it makes every Igbo man complicit because they share one tribe (perhaps to your philosophy one brain and one conscience) then they is a problem somewhere.

3rdeyeNigeria:


I never said you had low IQ, far from that.

What I said was, which is infact statistically true that Nigeria and Black Race are just too tribalistic, it goes beyond Yoruba and Igbo. They was a Hutu and Tsuti (if am correct) genocide Etc.

Back to the discourse..

I have a friend from Bayelsa that bitterly told me that he Hated yoruba's... (true story)
I askd him why? , he said they betrayed the south, voted Buhari bla bla bla.

I then ask him if he had seen the final Inec result of the election? He said no.

I open my phone then and showed him..

In Lagos about 500k lagosians voted GEJ against 700k Buhari
Same as other states it was marginal, PDP even won in Ekiti.. Yoruba actually voted for GEJ also.

I have to school him on the error and danger of generalisation and falacy.

Nigerians and Africa must develop our intelligence Quotient to a point where we judge people base on their individual action or comment not based on stereotype or what someone somewhere did.

That some not-too-expose people are hating your tribe and you as an individual for what Awolowo did (which is the problem am talking about) not based on your actions or words is wrong (totally) and you joining them to do it is like playing in the mud with pigs.

Kanu was insulting everybody, the best option was to handle him as an individual without making it seems it was a war against Igbos... Igbos would had thank Buhari for it.

Immediately it becomes a scheme to attack Igbos, neutral Igbos in the north hustling Everyone closed rank... And that single act elevated Kanu.

Lastly, Group like IPOB have become radicalized, go to facebook, you see how they insult anyone that tries to caution their extreme approach. soon now or later the would become violent instead of Nigeria to isolate finely first and flush out IPOB( because a neutral Igbo don't want succession) rather they would as usual group them as Igbos... Then you see neutral Igbos joining ranks with IPOB fanatics to defend themselves from Nigeria fanatisim

Xander85:
Now this is a measured and well-articulated response to the secession issue! No threats of unleashing third world war on anyone and telling them they're enslaved in 'one Nigeria' whether they like it or not! Which person that considers himself a freeborn will accept such nonsense!?

Things are the way they are today in Nigeria primarily b'cos there's a certain section of the core northern elite that see Nigeria and its resources as their personal property and other Nigerians must kow-tow to their every whim and caprice! This is partly as a consequence of Islam that frowns on the religion and its adherents being subordinate to secular laws like the constitution and having to answer to non-adherents like Christians for instance!