Lukuluku69:


We condemn the Part your Jewish Overlord tampered with. Do you get it now? And we make clear the obscure point your G.Os/Pastors/ Reverend will never touch on. Understand Ye now?

I mean the one that was not tampered so that we can compare Because you people have been shouting the bible is this,is that but fail to present your evidence. you people are just joker looking for soul to destroy.

Lukuluku69:


Another misconception. To be a Prophet does not necessarily mean to "prophesy". Yes, Prophets tell the future, but it is not a standard requisition. A man inspired to preach or herald God's Will is a Prophet my friend.

so your imam is a prophet Right?

jcross19:
then can you bring the original of the fake because you can accuse someone without an evidence!!!.

It is all mixed up. So, any message that contradict each other, we throw out. That's is the way to go about it. As an example, if a verse says someone is a Concubine and another says she is a wife, both statement cannot be true so we either throw one out and admit the other. Or better still throw the two statements out. Genesis Chapter 25, the first verse call Keturah a wife of Abraham, but in verse 6 she was referred to as a concubine! God does not speak in such an inconsistent way. God don't speak thus, men do. Men with prejudice.

Lukuluku69:


It is all mixed up. So, any message that contradict each other, we throw out. That's is the way to go about it. As an example, if a verse says someone is a Concubine and another says she is a wife, both statement cannot be true so we either throw one out and admit the other. Or better still throw the two statements out. Genesis Chapter 25, the first verse call Keturah a wife of Abraham, but in verse 6 she was referred to as a concubine! God does not speak in such an inconsistent way. God don't speak thus, men do. Men with prejudice.

ahahahahahahahah you have No evidence . I have been waiting for many years to see that original bible that prophet of doom claimed is original.

jcross19:
so your imam is a prophet Right?

Another misconception. Imams are not prophet, do you know why? They are not inspired by God. Hold it, by Inspired, we muslims meant to say, they don't hear from God or His Angels. Imams leads prayers, give advice, settle dispute etc based on what was REVEALED in The Quran and the Examples in the hadeeth. Any Imam that claims he hears from God, under the Law of Islam, HE WILL BE PUT TO DEATH, if he does not recant. understand Ye?

jcross19:
ahahahahahahahah you have No evidence . I have been waiting for many years to see that original bible that prophet of doom claimed is original.

No evidence? Ok. You see my, if you care to take time out and read the Quran and hear the Muslims out, what they accuse the Jews/Christians of is the fact that in the Bible you deliberately change the words/ offer wrong Interpretations. When Jesus preach, I am sure you know that he never carry a book under his armpit. What people hear him say, they put down in a book. Abi? This sayings, people change to suit a narrative. That was the allegation.

jcross19:
I mean the one that was not tampered so that we can compare Because you people have been shouting the bible is this,is that but fail to present your evidence. you people are just joker looking for soul to destroy.

We Muslims only invite you to leave the Worship of a man for that of the Creator, be good to fellow creatures. Is that too much? Will the Worship of God, The Creator of Heavens and Earth and everything in between and doing righteous deeds destroy souls? I think not.

Lukuluku69:


No evidence? Ok. You see my, if you care to take time out and read the Quran and hear the Muslims out, what they accuse the Jews/Christians of is the fact that in the Bible you deliberately change the words/ offer wrong Interpretations. When Jesus preach, I am sure you know that he never carry a book under his armpit. What people hear him say, they put down in a book. Abi? This sayings, people change to suit a narrative. That was the allegation.

the accusation is only coming from the muslim world why other religions did not condemn it?now I asked you for evidence and you are referring me to the same Koran and hadith that claimed Bible has been uttered without evidence. so go and tell your anabi stop that trash and focus how to stop the radicalism in Islam.

Lukuluku69:


We Muslims only invite you to leave the Worship of a man for that of the Creator, be good to fellow creatures. Is that too much? Will the Worship of God, The Creator of Heavens and Earth and everything in between and doing righteous deeds destroy souls? I think not.

are you sure!don't let me dig out the story of Mohammed out of the record!

jcross19:
the accusation is only coming from the muslim world why other religions did not condemn it?now I asked you for evidence and you are referring me to the same Koran and hadith that claimed Bible has been uttered without evidence. so go and tell your anabi stop that trash and focus how to stop the radicalism in Islam.

The Accusation is not coming from other Faith simply because those other Faith never see it as their calling to Preach a Global Message. The Hindus belief is that the Hindu God (Vishnu) is for Hindus alone. The Zoroastrians have the same belief too. But to answer you logically, remember it was the seed of Abraham that the whole world will be bless! This blessing is not the Materials Junk you people hankered over. Otherwise, the majority of Asia will be in abject poverty. Coming back to the Seed of Abraham, unless you believe in the Jewish lies, Ishmael, Isaac and the 6 Sons of Ketura share in this blessing for they are SONS of Abraham. understand ye?

jcross19:
are you sure!don't let me dig out the story of Mohammed out of the record!

Please drag out the story of Muhammad and let us look at it together. I will be waiting....

jcross19:
the accusation is only coming from the muslim world why other religions did not condemn it?now I asked you for evidence and you are referring me to the same Koran and hadith that claimed Bible has been uttered without evidence. so go and tell your anabi stop that trash and focus how to stop the radicalism in Islam.

The Hindus belief in a Triune/Triad Godhead comprising Vishnu, Brahama and Shiva. The Christians belief in a Trinity. Do you honestly believe the the Hindus can critique that? Or that the Christians brought something new from what their ancestors handed down?

Lukuluku69:


The Hindus belief in a Triune/Triad Godhead comprising Vishnu, Brahama and Shiva. The Christians belief in a Trinity. Do you honestly believe the the Hindus can critique that? Or that the Christians brought something new from what their ancestors handed down?

I sincerely hope you know the Bible isn't a text book nor a scientific research book. It isn't even a religious book to be observed by religious groups. The Word of God. The Holy Bible is a spiritual Book from a spiritual Source, written by men inspired by God Himself.

So any mind who must understand what is written in the Bible must be spiritually renewed. Everything you've written here just confirmed to me that you have no spiritual illumination from the Holy Spirit of God, so you have no understanding of the Bible despite your knowledge of it.

Any knowledge of God and His Word without His illumination remains veiled to the Truth.

UceeGod:


I sincerely hope you know the Bible isn't a text book nor a scientific research book. It isn't even a religious book to be observed by religious groups. The Word of God. The Holy Bible is a spiritual Book from a spiritual Source, written by men inspired by God Himself.

So any mind who must understand what is written in the Bible must be spiritually renewed. Everything you've written here just confirmed to me that you have no spiritual illumination from the Holy Spirit of God, so you have no understanding of the Bible despite your knowledge of it.

Any knowledge of God and His Word without His illumination remains veiled to the Truth.

This Holy Spirit, my friend is he also the one that give different meaning to different Churches/Individuals that in the World today, there are over Thirty Thousand Christian Denominations each inviting everyone to it's own heresy? Take for instance Nigeria, which Church/Pastor/G.O is with this Holy Spirit? Which? You see, the Bible will not be a Text book nor a Scientific Book now simply because you do not have answers to the posers I raised in my post but it will become one when it suits a narrative.

Please take that Holy Bible of yours read and read, don't let any Suit wearing, Tithe loving, Jet flying man teach you. Your salvation depends on it. If it is the Holy Spirit that inspire Adeboye to say God came to drink Tea with him, or the one that inspired a Pastor to pour Coke on people, please count me out.

For your information, I do not attend any congregation. I read and study the Bible but the Holy Spirit inscribes the Word in my heart. My mind can only comprehend what the Spirit interpretes through my own spirit. I believe everything that comes from the Spirit by Faith and they always become reality.

Only God knows those that are truly His. Indeed there are so many falsehoods using the name of Christ. So for those "church" Pastors/G.O you mentioned, the Spirit of God within me testifies about the ones that are truly His and I thank God for that. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth, so I hope you'll give Him the chance to work in you.

Lukuluku69:


The Accusation is not coming from other Faith simply because those other Faith never see it as their calling to Preach a Global Message. The Hindus belief is that the Hindu God (Vishnu) is for Hindus alone. The Zoroastrians have the same belief too. But to answer you logically, remember it was the seed of Abraham that the whole world will be bless! This blessing is not the Materials Junk you people hankered over. Otherwise, the majority of Asia will be in abject poverty. Coming back to the Seed of Abraham, unless you believe in the Jewish lies, Ishmael, Isaac and the 6 Sons of Ketura share in this blessing for they are SONS of Abraham. understand ye?

the more you read the Koran the more you realise that Mohammed was very high on camel urine .poo is poo.

Lukuluku69, I thought you were a comparative religious analyst, but the more you’ve spoken, the clearer your identity has become. You are a Muslim apologist. Having established that fact, let me respond to SOME of your claims.

Christians are so called because they believe that Jesus is the SON of GOD, GOD THE SON, the ONLY CHANNEL to heaven and the ONLY HOPE OF SALVATION. Any other view is hogwash to us. Now, your attempts at re-interpreting the Bible have been noted, but why should Christians believe you over what the Bible actually says. The Bible is clear on the statuses of Ishmael, Isaac and the OTHER sons of Abraham. Why should I believe an Islamic interpretation that seeks VALIDATION by ASSOCIATION? Ishmael was the FIRST SEED of Abraham, but the son of his concubine and wife’s maid, Hagar. He was a product of the typical impatience bedevilling humans today, but not the SON OF PROMISE. Isaac was the legitimate heir and SON OF PROMISE. That Ismael, by virtue of his parenthood, shares in the Abrahamic blessing isn’t in doubt, but that doesn’t mean he’s now the focal point. You say the Isaiah was referring to Muhammad, we say the interpretation is totally different. Is that too difficult for a non Christian to accept? If I do a fictional piece and say the dictator in MY work is inspired by Idi Amin of Uganda, should someone else insist that my inspiration is Sani Abacha of Nigeria?

The issue of prophet-hood is another point on which Christians differ from you, Muslims. The way you ascribe that office to every notable Biblical figure is simply funny. For us, Abraham is the father of faith, so confirmed not for his perfection, but for his acts of obedience when the otherwise was more plausible; same with a couple other biblical figures. Simply put, YOUR PROPHETS AIN’T OUR PROPHETS.

Why should we even consider your views? Because, according to you, the Bible has been corrupted. Like someone has earlier stated, let’s have the original so we can make comparisons.

You deride the Holy Spirit? I can only be sorry for your ignorance. Someone has already stated so, and I repeat; He is the final interpreter of the scriptures to THE CHRISTIAN, not any General Overseer or pastor. About their suits and jets and INCREDIBLE claims, you aren’t a Christian in the first place; allow us worry over such.

I will comment more when I find the time later.

Ohibenemma:
Lukuluku69, I thought you were a comparative religious analyst, but the more you’ve spoken, the clearer your identity has become. You are a Muslim apologist. Having established that fact, let me respond to SOME of your claims.

Christians are so called because they believe that Jesus is the SON of GOD, GOD THE SON, the ONLY CHANNEL to heaven and the ONLY HOPE OF SALVATION. Any other view is hogwash to us. Now, your attempts at re-interpreting the Bible have been noted, but why should Christians believe you over what the Bible actually says. The Bible is clear on the statuses of Ishmael, Isaac and the OTHER sons of Abraham. Why should I believe an Islamic interpretation that seeks VALIDATION by ASSOCIATION? Ishmael was the FIRST SEED of Abraham, but the son of his concubine and wife’s maid, Hagar. He was a product of the typical impatience bedevilling humans today, but not the SON OF PROMISE. Isaac was the legitimate heir and SON OF PROMISE. That Ismael, by virtue of his parenthood, shares in the Abrahamic blessing isn’t in doubt, but that doesn’t mean he’s now the focal point. You say the Isaiah was referring to Muhammad, we say the interpretation is totally different. Is that too difficult for a non Christian to accept? If I do a fictional piece and say the dictator in MY work is inspired by Idi Amin of Uganda, should someone else insist that my inspiration is Sani Abacha of Nigeria?

The issue of prophet-hood is another point on which Christians differ from you, Muslims. The way you ascribe that office to every notable Biblical figure is simply funny. For us, Abraham is the father of faith, so confirmed not for his perfection, but for his acts of obedience when the otherwise was more plausible; same with a couple other biblical figures. Simply put, YOUR PROPHETS AIN’T OUR PROPHETS.

Why should we even consider your views? Because, according to you, the Bible has been corrupted. Like someone has earlier stated, let’s have the original so we can make comparisons.

You deride the Holy Spirit? I can only be sorry for your ignorance. Someone has already stated so, and I repeat; He is the final interpreter of the scriptures to THE CHRISTIAN, not any General Overseer or pastor. About their suits and jets and INCREDIBLE claims, you aren’t a Christian in the first place; allow us worry over such.

I will comment more when I find the time later.

The fact that I am into Comparative Religion doesn't deprive me of a Faith. I am not a Muslim apologist, I am a Muslim.

Christians are so called because the early Christians have traits/attributes of Christ in them that was why they were labelled as such but you will agree with me that the Christians are far and in between these days. What we have now are just Christmongers: People who noised Christ about but you hardly find anything Chrislike in them.

I know what Christians believe as regards his nature or or who his person was/is: The Veritable Son of God! As a matter of fact, the more I read Christian write-up, the more I see different things the Son of Mary represents. To be candid, I am not surprised one bit. Even while Christ walked this Earth remember he asked his own disciples to wit: who do men say I am? Matthew 16:13-16 KJV
[13] When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? [14] And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.

So, that question has been there for over Two Thousand Years now and it is still with us.

You mentioned VALIDATION by ASSOCIATION, well that is what the Christians have been doing with the Jewish Scripture from time immemorial. They have searched every Statement, every verse, every obscure point to find VALIDATION for Christ! And what has been the result, the Jews labelled him an Imposter who died as an ACCURSED.

As for Ishmael, my friend you have swallowed the Jewish lie, the bane of every Christians. Please tell me, what was Ishmael Crime that the Ever Merciful God cannot forgive him? He mocked a babe suckling! That was all! But, the Jews, that same God turn over and over in forgiveness? But this singular "Sin" of mocking a suckling baby, God will hold eternally against Ishmael.

I did not deride the Holy Spirit, but I will deride any Spirit that tell lies anytime any day. Do you know why? The Holy Spirit as conceived by the Christian mind is nothing but a lying spirit. He will tell one G.O a certain thing while he/it will tell another G.O another thing on the same matter. That Spirit, I will forever hold in derision..

As for the Scripture I quoted (Isaiah 42:1-25 KJV) read and re-read them, it speaks of no other human except the Prophet of Islam.

Ohibenemma:
I must however state, for the benefit of these wannabes, that the so-called Bible’s inconsistencies are only proofs of its diverseness and all-encompassing grasp, such that different directions and inspirations could apply in different situations. I could, but further-flogging this point could appear belabouring. And the carnal minded ones will not understand anyways.

Summarily, Christianity is in a world of her own and doesn’t need to be ratified by any other religion. Criticize the activities of some of our pastors, but that takes nothing away from the faith itself. When the Muslim is accused for the Islam-inspired terror rocking the world today, they point at the Christian crusaders of so many years ago. The crusaders may have given Christianity a bad name, but they were hardly any successful anyways and have been condemned by many true Christians till date. [b]But I await the Muslim that will criticize Muhammad for the religio-political expeditionary conquests he personally led against pagans and Christians of his day (Let’s not forget Uthman Dan Fodio); so much for a RELIGION OF PEACE! [/b]I leave the Muslims with this verse from Matthew 7:5.“Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.”

Peace.

@the Bold, please read up on Daniel 7:1-28 KJV. Also, read up on the History of the World, it will throw a whole lot of Light on your a anxiety and misgivings.

N.B. I can be of help if you need it.

Peace.

Lukuluku69:


The fact that I am into Comparative Religion doesn't deprive me of a Faith. I am not a Muslim apologist, I am a Muslim.

Christians are so called because the early Christians have traits/attributes of Christ in them that was why they were labelled as such but you will agree with me that the Christians are far and in between these days. What we have now are just Christmongers: People who noised Christ about but you hardly find anything Chrislike in them.

I know what Christians believe as regards his nature or or who his person was/is: The Veritable Son of God! As a matter of fact, the more I read Christian write-up, the more I see different things the Son of Mary represents. To be candid, I am not surprised one bit. Even while Christ walked this Earth remember he asked his own disciples to wit: who do men say I am? Matthew 16:13-16 KJV
[13] When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? [14] And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets.

So, that question has been there for over Two Thousand Years now and it is still with us.

You mentioned VALIDATION by ASSOCIATION, well that is what the Christians have been doing with the Jewish Scripture from time immemorial. They have searched every Statement, every verse, every obscure point to find VALIDATION for Christ! And what has been the result, the Jews labelled him an Imposter who died as an ACCURSED.

As for Ishmael, my friend you have swallowed the Jewish lie, the bane of every Christians. Please tell me, what was Ishmael Crime that the Ever Merciful God cannot forgive him? He mocked a babe suckling! That was all! But, the Jews, that same God turn over and over in forgiveness? But this singular "Sin" of mocking a suckling baby, God will hold eternally against Ishmael.

I did not deride the Holy Spirit, but I will deride any Spirit that tell lies anytime any day. Do you know why? The Holy Spirit as conceived by the Christian mind is nothing but a lying spirit. He will tell one G.O a certain thing while he/it will tell another G.O another thing on the same matter. That Spirit, I will forever hold in derision..

As for the Scripture I quoted (Isaiah 42:1-25 KJV) read and re-read them, it speaks of no other human except the Prophet of Islam.

I like it when you clarify your identity. It puts our CONVERSATION in better perspective - a Christian and Muslim contention.

Now, you still don't understand who a Christian REALLY is. He is not MERELY one who displays Christlike traits; I have met Muslims who are very wicked just as I've met those very kind and generous, he is one who believes that Jesus is the way, the truth and t he life, and with that at the back of his mind determines to eschew iniquity and receives grace for same. A true Christian, my friend, is both within and without. This means that not every church goer is a Christian or every so-regarded morally upright person.

Now you cited the conversation between Jesus Christ and Peter, as recorded in Matthew 16, but failed (probably mischievously) to add Jesus' conclusion on the matter. Peter called him and Jesus AFFIRMED it that He is the Son of God. Should we, His followers, rather believe you? In John 10;30, Jesus restated his divinity as being ONE WITH HIS FATHER.

Christians are seeking validation by association? No! The Gospel is an offshoot of the Law. Adam broke the first covenant between God and man, this led to his expulsion from Eden. Since then, God has sought for men who will do His will. He found such in Enoch and later, Noah, with whom He made another covenant. Then the world drifted off again and he sought a covenant more encompassing, not with just a man, but with 'a people' and found the right person to shoot this off in Abraham. Now, this covenant which was renewed with the Jews was fraught with laws, retributions, punishments and atonements, which mankind couldn't keep. And He decided to send Jesus as a one off sacrifice for the sins of the world. This ushered us into a dispensation of grace. The mission of Jesus wasn't to do away with the law, but to fulfil it by being a once and for all atonement. The relationship between the law and the gospel has been open from time immemorial and the divergent points are well established in the scriptures. Even Jesus quoted copiously from the prophets of old. That's Christianity for you. I don't know where you see us associating with Islam.

That the Jews rejected him indicates nothing. They rejected John the Baptist too. Even America rejected Martin Luther King.

On Ishmael, I don't know where the story of him mocking a babe suckling originates from; knowing about that for the first time and FROM YOU. I think that's probably what is recorded in the Koran. You say I shouldn't believe Jewish fables? I should rather believe Arabic fables, right? I understand Muhammad's historical revisionism, to the favour of his ethnicity, but I don't understand why you will expect me to believe his own which came LONG LATER, after he'd carefully studied the former. Isn't that same reason why the favourite language of YOUR God is Arabic?

"The Holy Spirit as conceived by the Christian mind is nothing but a lying spirit", yet you don't deride the Holy Spirit? Stay one side nau, oga. Is there another Holy Spirit as conceived by the Muslim mind Different G.Os may say what THEY think and ascribe it to the Holy Spirit, does that belittle the Holy Spirit himself? Do secular governments not sometimes disown statements by even their official spokespersons?

Prophet Isaiah's matter again? I thought we had gone past that. You think it talks about Muhammad, I strongly disagree. Let's move on.

Peace.

Lukuluku69:


@the Bold, please read up on Daniel 7:1-28 KJV. Also, read up on the History of the World, it will throw a whole lot of Light on your a anxiety and misgivings.

N.B. I can be of help if you need it.

Peace.

Please, can you throw more light on this? How does it relate to Muhammad's contradictory lifestyle with his religion of peace, or the lifestyles of his successors till date?

Ohibenemma:
Please, can you throw more light on this? How does it relate to Muhammad's contradictory lifestyle with his religion of peace, or the lifestyles of his successors till date?

You raised a point questioning Muhammad "Wars" on Christians and you are actually looking forward to see some Muslims justification for such. That was in the body of your post (the second post on this Thread)

To start with, Muhammad on his own did not lead any war on any Christian Nation in his life time save for an expedition against a gathering of some Christian Force of some Arabs Christians and some Greek Force to Tabuk. The other Army, on learning the approach of the Muslim force abandon camp and fled. That was it. He only fought in Badr, Uhud and the Battle of Confedrates ( the last one there was no fighting just some shadow boxing! If I can say that). In all of these battle, he fought against fellow Arabs.

It was actually his Companions that fought against the Christian Greek and Christian Rome, they fought against the Persians too, they fought against Chaldean Empire. Now this brings us to vision of Daniel in Daniel 7:1-28 KJV.

Just to paraphrase, Daniel saw Four fierce Kingdoms. These Kingdoms one different from the other fought with each other. They were referred to as BEAST. why BEAST? They rule with Man made rule and Laws. These Kingdoms held sway till God Himself raised a Kingdom that will break into pieces and consumed these Four Kingdoms.

Now, here is the Test for you, go into the History of the World, go find out who defeated the Persians and consumed their Territory, who ended the Greeks and Roman stay in all the Land God promised Abraham.

N.B. If you still have some difficulty, I will assist with detail exposition. Nairaland MODs please ease up on your banning nah. I didn't abuse anyone.

Ohibenemma:

I like it when you clarify your identity. It puts our CONVERSATION in better perspective - a Christian and Muslim contention.

Now, you still don't understand who a Christian REALLY is. He is not MERELY one who displays Christlike traits; I have met Muslims who are very wicked just as I've met those very kind and generous, he is one who believes that Jesus is the way, the truth and t he life, and with that at the back of his mind determines to eschew iniquity and receives grace for same. A true Christian, my friend, is both within and without. This means that not every church goer is a Christian or every so-regarded morally upright person.

Now you cited the conversation between Jesus Christ and Peter, as recorded in Matthew 16, but failed (probably mischievously) to add Jesus' conclusion on the matter. Peter called him and Jesus AFFIRMED it that He is the Son of God. Should we, His followers, rather believe you? In John 10;30, Jesus restated his divinity as being ONE WITH HIS FATHER.

Christians are seeking validation by association? No! The Gospel is an offshoot of the Law. Adam broke the first covenant between God and man, this led to his expulsion from Eden. Since then, God has sought for men who will do His will. He found such in Enoch and later, Noah, with whom He made another covenant. Then the world drifted off again and he sought a covenant more encompassing, not with just a man, but with 'a people' and found the right person to shoot this off in Abraham. Now, this covenant which was renewed with the Jews was fraught with laws, retributions, punishments and atonements, which mankind couldn't keep. And He decided to send Jesus as a one off sacrifice for the sins of the world. This ushered us into a dispensation of grace. The mission of Jesus wasn't to do away with the law, but to fulfil it by being a once and for all atonement. The relationship between the law and the gospel has been open from time immemorial and the divergent points are well established in the scriptures. Even Jesus quoted copiously from the prophets of old. That's Christianity for you. I don't know where you see us associating with Islam.

That the Jews rejected him indicates nothing. They rejected John the Baptist too. Even America rejected Martin Luther King.

On Ishmael, I don't know where the story of him mocking a babe suckling originates from; knowing about that for the first time and FROM YOU. I think that's probably what is recorded in the Koran. You say I shouldn't believe Jewish fables? I should rather believe Arabic fables, right? I understand Muhammad's historical revisionism, to the favour of his ethnicity, but I don't understand why you will expect me to believe his own which came LONG LATER, after he'd carefully studied the former. Isn't that same reason why the favourite language of YOUR God is Arabic?

"The Holy Spirit as conceived by the Christian mind is nothing but a lying spirit", yet you don't deride the Holy Spirit? Stay one side nau, oga. Is there another Holy Spirit as conceived by the Muslim mind Different G.Os may say what THEY think and ascribe it to the Holy Spirit, does that belittle the Holy Spirit himself? Do secular governments not sometimes disown statements by even their official spokespersons?

Prophet Isaiah's matter again? I thought we had gone past that. You think it talks about Muhammad, I strongly disagree. Let's move on.

Peace.

You see my friend, we could go back and forth on this, you present your views while I do the same. As for who a Christian is really is, I must admit I can't define because I have never been one and don't intend to be one but there are a certain qualities the Scriptures demands before anyone can wear that Tag. And from what I have read about Jesus, what he commands, what he forbids, I can boldly say, what we see today are Christmongers and not Christians. And I will leave it at that.

The Scripture I quoted touching on the Sonship of Christ, I only wanted to draw your attention to the fact that during Christ time, debates rages as to who he really is. I am not particular about what Peter thought him to be because the same Peter in the Scriptures says :Acts 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: Peter called him a man.

Leaving that altogether, it will surprise you to know that it was Paul who never saw Christ alive, was never his disciple, never learn anything from Christ that proclaim:
Acts 9:18-20 KJV
[18] And immediately there fell from his eyes as it had been scales: and he received sight forthwith, and arose, and was baptized. [19] And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus. [20] And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God.
If it was Paul that started the son of God business, why should I believe him? Can you reconcile that? 12 Disciples were did not preach it, but the this self appointed Apostle was the one preaching it?
Remember Jesus many instructions to the disciples not to make him known? Mark 8:29-30 KJV
[29] And he saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Peter answereth and saith unto him, Thou art the Christ. [30] And he charged them that they should tell no man of him.

Ohibenemma:

I like it when you clarify your identity. It puts our CONVERSATION in better perspective - a Christian and Muslim contention.

Now, you still don't understand who a Christian REALLY is. He is not MERELY one who displays Christlike traits; I have met Muslims who are very wicked just as I've met those very kind and generous, he is one who believes that Jesus is the way, the truth and t he life, and with that at the back of his mind determines to eschew iniquity and receives grace for same. A true Christian, my friend, is both within and without. This means that not every church goer is a Christian or every so-regarded morally upright person.

Now you cited the conversation between Jesus Christ and Peter, as recorded in Matthew 16, but failed (probably mischievously) to add Jesus' conclusion on the matter. Peter called him and Jesus AFFIRMED it that He is the Son of God. Should we, His followers, rather believe you? In John 10;30, Jesus restated his divinity as being ONE WITH HIS FATHER.

Christians are seeking validation by association? No! The Gospel is an offshoot of the Law. Adam broke the first covenant between God and man, this led to his expulsion from Eden. Since then, God has sought for men who will do His will. He found such in Enoch and later, Noah, with whom He made another covenant. Then the world drifted off again and he sought a covenant more encompassing, not with just a man, but with 'a people' and found the right person to shoot this off in Abraham. Now, this covenant which was renewed with the Jews was fraught with laws, retributions, punishments and atonements, which mankind couldn't keep. And He decided to send Jesus as a one off sacrifice for the sins of the world. This ushered us into a dispensation of grace. The mission of Jesus wasn't to do away with the law, but to fulfil it by being a once and for all atonement. The relationship between the law and the gospel has been open from time immemorial and the divergent points are well established in the scriptures. Even Jesus quoted copiously from the prophets of old. That's Christianity for you. I don't know where you see us associating with Islam.

That the Jews rejected him indicates nothing. They rejected John the Baptist too. Even America rejected Martin Luther King.

On Ishmael, I don't know where the story of him mocking a babe suckling originates from; knowing about that for the first time and FROM YOU. I think that's probably what is recorded in the Koran. You say I shouldn't believe Jewish fables? I should rather believe Arabic fables, right? I understand Muhammad's historical revisionism, to the favour of his ethnicity, but I don't understand why you will expect me to believe his own which came LONG LATER, after he'd carefully studied the former. Isn't that same reason why the favourite language of YOUR God is Arabic?

"The Holy Spirit as conceived by the Christian mind is nothing but a lying spirit", yet you don't deride the Holy Spirit? Stay one side nau, oga. Is there another Holy Spirit as conceived by the Muslim mind Different G.Os may say what THEY think and ascribe it to the Holy Spirit, does that belittle the Holy Spirit himself? Do secular governments not sometimes disown statements by even their official spokespersons?

Prophet Isaiah's matter again? I thought we had gone past that. You think it talks about Muhammad, I strongly disagree. Let's move on.

Peace.

Genesis 21:1-12 KJV
[1] And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken.
[2] For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at the set time of which God had spoken to him.
[3] And Abraham called the name of his son that was born unto him, whom Sarah bare to him, Isaac.
[4] And Abraham circumcised his son Isaac being eight days old, as God had commanded him.
[5] And Abraham was an hundred years old, when his son Isaac was born unto him. [6] And Sarah said, God hath made me to laugh, so that all that hear will laugh with me.
[7] And she said, Who would have said unto Abraham, that Sarah should have given children suck? for I have born him a son in his old age.
[8] And the child grew, and was weaned: and Abraham made a great feast the same day that Isaac was weaned.
[9] And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham, mocking.
[10] Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac.
[11] And the thing was very grievous in Abraham's sight because of his son.
[12] And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called.

Ishmael at 16 years was never recorded to disobey his father, neither was it recorded that he worshipped any other God besides his father God, but because he "Mocked" Isaac he was banished! Merciful Jehovah indeed.

jcross19:
the more you read the Koran the more you realise that Mohammed was very high on camel urine .poo is poo.

Is this all you can muster on the life of Muhammad?

Lukuluku69:



You raised a point questioning Muhammad "Wars" on Christians and you are actually looking forward to see some Muslims justification for such. That was in the body of your post (the second post on this Thread)

To start with, Muhammad on his own did not lead any war on any Christian Nation in his life time save for an expedition against a gathering of some Christian Force of some Arabs Christians and some Greek Force to Tabuk. The other Army, on learning the approach of the Muslim force abandon camp and fled. That was it. He only fought in Badr, Uhud and the Battle of Confedrates ( the last one there was no fighting just some shadow boxing! If I can say that). In all of these battle, he fought against fellow Arabs.

It was actually his Companions that fought against the Christian Greek and Christian Rome, they fought against the Persians too, they fought against Chaldean Empire. Now this brings us to vision of Daniel in Daniel 7:1-28 KJV.

Just to paraphrase, Daniel saw Four fierce Kingdoms. These Kingdoms one different from the other fought with each other. They were referred to as BEAST. why BEAST? They rule with Man made rule and Laws. These Kingdoms held sway till God Himself raised a Kingdom that will break into pieces and consumed these Four Kingdoms.

Now, here is the Test for you, go into the History of the World, go find out who defeated the Persians and consumed their Territory, who ended the Greeks and Roman stay in all the Land God promised Abraham.

N.B. If you still have some difficulty, I will assist with detail exposition. Nairaland MODs please ease up on your banning nah. I didn't abuse anyone.

If you want my explanation on the above chapter, I'll be copy-pasting something very lengthy and WHICH HAS NOTHING TO DO with Muhammad.

You have this History of the World in PDF form? Please I'll like to read it too.

I can't readily cite any source at the moment, but you know that Muhammad promoted a supposedly Religion of Peace by the SWORD (Against both Christians and pagans). And like you've pointed out, his companions are guilty as charged.

And it has continued till date with those toeing his lead being termed extremists. Who's an extremist really?

Lukuluku69:

Genesis 21:1-12 KJV
[1] And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken...

Ishmael at 16 years was never recorded to disobey his father, neither was it recorded that he worshipped any other God besides his father God, but because he "Mocked" Isaac he was banished! Merciful Jehovah indeed.

Now I get your point. I never took time to get into this deeply. But your attempt is yet again funny. This wasn't about God, but about HUMAN JEALOUSY. How often have we seen humans at their basest when jealous. Would you have preferred it had Sarah arranged to kill Ishmael as a result? How many women today are comfortable with another woman's child being heir to their husbands' possessions.

Now, to God's stance. He instructed Abraham to let his wife have her way, as Ishmael wasn't the son of promise; he wouldn't have come up at all had the same Sarah been more patient.

If you read on, you will see that God was actually MERCIFUL or the baby would have died of thirst in the Wilderness.

Islam is a divine fraud. The only usefulness is to fulfill prophecy about raising the anti - Christ and to mobilize an army for eventual battle of Amargedon. After rapture, muslims will suddenly wake up to the truth and curse Muhammed.

Lukuluku69:

On the status of Jesus Christ, you started off with Matthew 16:13-16, which is a more complete account and veered off to Mark 8:30, which is less FORTHCOMING to justify your argument. if this ain't mischief, let me have another name for it
Paul DIDN'T start ascribing divinity to Jesus. Matthew 16:16 shows Peter making that admission and Jesus Christ affirming it.

Ohibenemma:

Now I get your point. I never took time to get into this deeply. But your attempt is yet again funny. This wasn't about God, but about HUMAN JEALOUSY. How often have we seen humans at their basest when jealous. Would you have preferred it had Sarah arranged to kill Ishmael as a result? How many women today are comfortable with another woman's child being heir to their husbands' possessions.

Now, to God's stance. He instructed Abraham to let his wife have her way, as Ishmael wasn't the son of promise; he wouldn't have come up at all had the same Sarah been more patient.

If you read on, you will see that God was actually MERCIFUL or the baby would have died of thirst in the Wilderness.

Deuteronomy 21:15-17 KJV
[15] If a man have two wives, one beloved, and another hated, and they have born him children, both the beloved and the hated; and if the firstborn son be hers that was hated:
[16] Then it shall be, when he maketh his sons to inherit that which he hath, that he may not make the son of the beloved firstborn before the son of the hated, which is indeed the firstborn:
[17] But he shall acknowledge the son of the hated for the firstborn, by giving him a double portion of all that he hath: for he is the beginning of his strength; the right of the firstborn is his.

My friend, the above is the Law Jehovah gave Moses for the running of the State. It was Sarah that wished otherwise when she told Abraham Genesis 21:10-11 KJV
[10] Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even with Isaac
. [11] And the thing was very grievous in Abraham's sight because of his son.

Like I said earlier, you are sold on the Jewish lie, ALL Christians do.

And to your question if I would have preferred Sarah to arrange for Ishamael death, no I would not even think it, the Favours of God is innumerable. Of what use is the Junk we hankered on? And had she done that, she doesn't portray the qualities of being a wife to the Friend of God and she would be counted with Cain, the Fatricide.
:

Ohibenemma:
On the status of Jesus Christ, you started off with Matthew 16:13-16, which is a more complete account and veered off to Mark 8:30, which is less FORTHCOMING to justify your argument. if this ain't mischief, let me have another name for it
Paul DIDN'T start ascribing divinity to Jesus. Matthew 16:16 shows Peter making that admission and Jesus Christ affirming it.

I actually did that to show you the inconsistencies in the message as dictated by the "Holy Spirit" In Mathew Christ answered Matthew 16:17-18 KJV
[17] And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. [18] And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. But in Mark, he said Mark 8:29-30 KJV
[29] And he saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Peter answereth and saith unto him, Thou art the Christ. [30] And he charged them that they should tell no man of him. Why is he shy of his parentage and he charged them no to tell any man? The same "Holy Spirit" that made Mathew wrote in Matthew 4:18-19 KJV
[18] And Jesus, walking by the sea of Galilee, saw two brethren, Simon called Peter, and Andrew his brother, casting a net into the sea: for they were fishers. [19] And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men. It was the same Spirit that made Andrew a Disciple of John the Baptist in John 1-51. He was the one that made John the Baptist exclaimed: this is the Lamb of God that take away sin in John 1-51 yet made Mathew write in Matthew 11:2-4 KJV
[2] Now when John had heard in the prison the works of Christ, he sent two of his disciples, [3] And said unto him, Art thou he that should come, or do we look for another? [4] Jesus answered and said unto them, Go and shew John again those things which ye do hear and see: Has he forgot that he saw a Dove descend on him and a voice came from Heaven, saying this is my Son Luke 3:22 KJV
[22] And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.

MightySparrow:
Islam is a divine fraud. The only usefulness is to fulfill prophecy about raising the anti - Christ and to mobilize an army for eventual battle of Amargedon. After rapture, muslims will suddenly wake up to the truth and curse Muhammed.

There are hundreds of Thread here on Nairaland by Christians that says the Rapture is Hogwash. Just a figment of some deluded folks imagination. So, cursing Mohammad is not gonna happen with Muslims. As a matter of fact, your Bible says, Prayers will said for him continually, which is what the Muslims are doing everyday.

Psalm 72:1-4,9-15 KJV
[1] Give the king thy judgments, O God, and thy righteousness unto the king's son. [2] He shall judge thy people with righteousness, and thy poor with judgment.
[3] The mountains shall bring peace to the people, and the little hills, by righteousness.
[4] He shall judge the poor of the people, he shall save the children of the needy, and shall break in pieces the oppressor.
[9] They that dwell in the wilderness shall bow before him; and his enemies shall lick the dust.
[10] The kings of Tarshish and of the isles shall bring presents: the kings of Sheba and Seba shall offer gifts.
[11] Yea, all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him.
[12] For he shall deliver the needy when he crieth; the poor also, and him that hath no helper.
[13] He shall spare the poor and needy, and shall save the souls of the needy.
[14] He shall redeem their soul from deceit and violence: and precious shall their blood be in his sight.
[15] And he shall live, and to him shall be given of the gold of Sheba: prayer also shall be made for him continually; and daily shall he be praised.