Hi dear, I'll address your updates later in the day. Cheers

OkCornel:
@Providence388

If you're lumping up everything together as the "Law of God"... read up Hebrews 10 v 11-12;

11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

Then tell us what Law has been changed, because I believe that verse 12 is also making reference to God's Law which a necessity brought up the need to change from.


Also read Hebrews 8 v 13;
In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.

If you read the entire chapter of Hebrews Chapter 7, you'd find that its speaking of the PRIESTHOOD.
The only change that was made in the law, was the change from tithing, offering and sacrifices offered by the Levitical priesthood to a priesthood which is ENDLESS (v. 16), UNCHANGEABLE (v. 24), HOLY, HARMLESS, UNDEFILED, SEPARATE FROM SINNERS, AND HIGHER THAN THE HEAVENS (v. 26).

Hebrews Chapter 8 is referring to God finding fault with "them" (them = Israelites), and making a New Covenant with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. God is very specific here, this is not the church, but His own people. The covenant wasn't made with the "church" it was made to the Israelites. Gentiles will be grafted in the Covenant, of course, but this is God's protocol (Israelite first, then the gentile).

A time will come when the New Covenant is fully established. When that happens, the Law shall go forth out of Zion and every man will have the law written in their hearts. We will embody or fulfill the law, just as Christ did, without people like "me" teaching you all that the law was never "done away with". You'll all walk in it without any teaching or preaching or Bible study amongst each other. There won't be any preachers or pastors or 5-fold ministry in the Millennial Reign. Notice the Old Covenant is "ready" to vanish away, it hasn't completely disappeard yet, nor has the New Covenant been completely fulfilled yet. The day we stop having "church" is when the Old Covenant completely vanishes away. Until then, we still got these laws.

But be of good cheer, the law ain't a bad thing, remember?
Don't let these pastors deceive you, are you gonna believe them or God? (1 John 5:3)

providence338:


If you read the entire chapter of Hebrews Chapter 7, you'd find that its speaking of the PRIESTHOOD.
The only change that was made in the law, was the change from tithing, offering and sacrifices offered by the Levitical priesthood to a priesthood which is ENDLESS (v. 16), UNCHANGEABLE (v. 24), HOLY, HARMLESS, UNDEFILED, SEPARATE FROM SINNERS, AND HIGHER THAN THE HEAVENS (v. 26).

Hebrews Chapter 8 is referring to God finding fault with "them" (them = Israelites), and making a New Covenant with the House of Israel and the House of Judah. God is very specific here, this is not the church, but His own people. The covenant wasn't made with the "church" it was made to the Israelites. Gentiles will be grafted in the Covenant, of course, but this is God's protocol (Israelite first, then the gentile).

A time will come when the New Covenant is fully established. When that happens, the Law shall go forth out of Zion and every man will have the law written in their hearts. We will embody or fulfill the law, just as Christ did, without people like "me" teaching you all that the law was never "done away with". You'll all walk in it without any teaching or preaching or Bible study amongst each other. There won't be any preachers or pastors or 5-fold ministry in the Millennial Reign. Notice the Old Covenant is "ready" to vanish away, it hasn't completely disappeard yet, nor has the New Covenant been completely fulfilled yet. The day we stop having "church" is when the Old Covenant completely vanishes away. Until then, we still got these laws.

But be of good cheer, the law ain't a bad thing, remember?
Don't let these pastors deceive you, are you gonna believe them or God? (1 John 5:3)

So for almost 2,000 years, the old covenant is still "ready" vanish away, and the new covenant is yet to be fulfilled?

Interesting...

OkCornel:



So for almost 2,000 years, the old covenant is still "ready" vanish away, and the new covenant is yet to be fulfilled?

Interesting...

OKCornel,

For almost 2,000 years Jesus was ready to return.

Revelation 3:11
"I am coming soon. Hold fast to what you have, so that no one will take your crown."

Revelation 22:7
"Behold, I am coming quickly. Blessed is the one who keeps the words of prophecy in this book."


If you understood what the New Covenant was, you'd know it hasn't completely been fulfilled YET.
Don't take my word (or anyone else's) for it. Just read what the Bible says about it.


A New Covenant (Jeremiah 31:31-34)

[i]Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: 32Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: 33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.[/I]"

ETA: oops, I added book, chapter, verse above. The author of Hebrews quoted from this in Hebrews Chapters 8 and 10. G'nite!

providence338:


OKCornel,

For almost 2,000 years Jesus was ready to return.

Revelation 3:11
"I am coming soon. Hold fast to what you have, so that no one will take your crown."

Revelation 22:7
"Behold, I am coming quickly. Blessed is the one who keeps the words of prophecy in this book."[/I]

If you understood what the New Covenant was, you'd know it hasn't completely been fulfilled YET.
Don't take my word (or anyone else's) for it. Just read what the Bible says about it.

A New Covenant

[i]Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah: 32Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD: 33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more."

Please put the book and verse you quoted the new covenant from. I need to check out something.

I may be wrong, but I thought one of the Apostles said it was already fulfilled.

Please bring the out the book of the prophet it was quoted from. Then I'll check if any of the Apostles also made reference to it as regards fulfillment.

So we can be clear on whether it's partially or totally fulfilled

Thanks.

We'll continue from there tomorrow, if you don't mind


I also want to check with you on your thoughts concerning the Earthly temple spoken of in Revelation and its connections with the Law (if any at all)...

Just to be clear, don't interprete my response as sarcasm.


Bonne nuit!

providence338:


I do it because these are our APPOINTMENT DAYS WITH THE LORD.
These are HIS feast days.
Not jewish feast days.
But HIS feast days (Lev 23:4)

I would encourage you to do a simple google search on the spiritual significance of these feast days.
Including the Sabbath.
It's not the 7th day for no reason.
There's 7 feast days. 7 is a very powerful number in the realm of the spirit.

If you had an appointment with your boss...you would go.
If you had an appointment for a job interview... you would go.
If you had an appointment with your doctor...or lawyer..you would go.
LGA chairman? Governor? President? Absolutely.


But an appointed time, a holy convocation with the Most High?
The Creator of the heavens and the earth?
Nah.. my pastor told me that its "done away with" and its only for those fake jew...even though there's no scriptural proof whatsoever to prove this.
Instead I'll partake in occult observances like Nimrod's b'day and the s*x fertility cult rituals of Ishtar/easter, hereby indirectly worshipping satan who laughs at me every time I do it....

were is the instruction from the bible for Christians to observe this feast days? Spiritual or not whether they be Gods feast days or not. Why are you doing them and were is the command for Christians to do that.

providence338:





The quote above was my reply to you in a previous post.

I'll reiterate the fundamental message in Paul's writings which has confused many in the modern church.

The LAW can't save you. Only grace through faith in Jesus can.

Thus you can't attain salvation from the Law.

But because of our love and sincere gratitude of Christ's forgiveness for our sins, we desire to do absolutely EVERYTHING he says, commands and instructs. Torah means "instructions".

We don't question it. We just do it. With child-like faith.

So when God says "REMEMBER" the Sabbath, and the apostles were instructing the gentiles to do the same, I don't really question it.

I just do it. And have never felt more "free" in doing so.

It all makes sense now.

Tithes and offering is part of the law.

Ask your pastor to explain how the law was "done away with", but we're still instructed to "bring the full tithe into God's storehouse".

pls madam where does the bible say we should observe the law because of our salvation. The sabbath has been done away with. Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days.

providence338:


A commandment is a command.

I just proved above where every disciple, apostle, prophet and Yahshua Hamashiach himself kept these commandments. And encouraged the gentiles to do the same. (Acts 15:21, Gal 6:2)

In other words, the early Christian church, comprised of Israelite and gentiles alike, were all observing the LAW (look it up).
They were NOT having the conversations we are having now.
Or questioning if the laws were "done away with".

Even everyone's favorite, Col 2:16, is a complete BACKWARDS interpretation by the modern church.
Paul is ENCOURAGING the Colossians Gentiles to KEEP THE FEASTS, and not let their pagan friends DISCOURAGE THEM. Like how you all on this board are doing right now.

Let God be true and every man a liar.

lol madam I think you are the one lying here col2:16 is quit explicit and clear for any one yo understand verses 17 says its a shadow of things to come, You are the person trying to twist it.

providence338:


The scriptures you put up don't help YOUR CASE.
You can't just throw up scriptures without examining the ENTIRE STORY AND PLACING THEM IN ITS PROPER CONTEXT.

If you read the entire book of Galatians (or preferably, the entire Bible for that matter), you'd know Paul couldn't possibly be preaching AGAINST the law. How could he if he followed it? And encouraged the Galatians to FULFILL THE LAW OF CHRIST (Gal 6:2)

The poor man WENT OUT OF HIS WAY TO PERFORM THE NAZARITE VOW in front of his fellow Israelites just to PROVE HE KEPT HE LAW! (Acts 21:24) Because thy kept bearing false witness against him. Just like the modern church is today. In their gross IGNORANCE.

Mehn...SMH

I notice you continue to IGNORE the passages proving Paul KEPT THE LAW.

Until you address the passages where...

Paul kept the feasts days - Acts 18:21, 20:16, 1 Cor 16:8 (READ THE KJV)
Performed the Nazarite Vow - Acts 21:24
Believed in all things in the Law and Prophets - Acts 24:14
Defended himself from false witnesses, stating he kept the Law of the Israelites - Acts 25:8
PRAISES AND DELIGHTS IN THE LAW - 1 Tim 1:8, Romans 7:12
Acknowledged twice we know what sin is from the law - Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7
That grace does NOT nullify the Law - Romans 3:31, Romans 6:15
That the law is SPIRITUAL (not carnal) - Romans 7:14, Romans 8:2
That Paul himself proclaimed he's under the LAW OF CHRIST - 1 Corinthians 9:21
And because he exhorted gentiles to imitate Christ - (1 Cor 11:1, 4:16), (Phil 3:17), (1 Thess 1:6)
HE THUS INSTRUCTED GENTILES TO FOLLOW THE SAME LAW: Gal 6:2, Acts 15:21

....then the scriptures you posted in Galatians REMAIN INSUFFICIENT.


Go back to the drawing board...

the fact that Paul kept the feast days was not a command for Christians to do so.
I believe this was just a one off act to pacify the jews same thing with acts 21:24. Notice that they had to encourage him to do it so as to pacify the jews who were accusing him of preaching against the law of moses.
Again this was a one off act. Paul in all his letters never admonished Christians to do as he did.

You want to purify your self like Paul? Then you have to go to the temple in jerusalem to do so, you want to observe the day of penticost like Paul?, Or observe the feast days?, then you have to go to the temple in jerusalem to do so otherwise your wasting your time.
But there aint no temple in jerusalem today why?, because God destroyed it. Why?, because he doesn't want the old system of worship. Why?, because we can now attain the throne of grace through christ who died for us.

providence338:
@EMILO2STAY:

I observe the laws the best way I can. And so do you....as do most believers. They just don't observe it to the full...b/c we've all been lied to.

I don't kill, steal, hate, covet, commit adultery...even in the heart. I try not to anyway.

Furthermore, once I gained understanding that God's laws weren't done away with, I did away with the Babylonian folly days of christmas & easter.
Those are NOT IN the Bible.

I began to observe the Passover, Pentecost, Tabernacles, etc.
Those are IN the Bible.

I also began to observe the Shabbat. This day is very important to God. It never changed. There are New Testament scriptures that prove this.

Last, I did away with unclean foods. I stopped eating catfish, crayfish, shrimps, crabs, etc which really hurt. I cooked a lot with these foods, but I now understand these are unhealthy meats as they're the ocean's bottomfeeders.

I don't eat pork anyway, I can totally understand why God prohibits it. They're the bottom feeders of the land...they literally eat anything, their meat is literally TOXIC. They're not meant for human consumption.

ps -- Why don't you subscribe to Christ's supposed b'day? And what are your views on the Biblical sabbath?

who lied the bible?. As the unclean foods, that is your choice but do not judge any one who eats any of the above mentioned.

I do not subscribe to christ bday as I know that has a pagan root.
Concerning the biblical sabbath, the bible says the sabbath was made for man and not man for the sabbath. in other words you have the control of the sabbath you can choose any day of the week as your sabbath this is one of the reasons why the bible says christ has set us free from the bondage of the law.

EMILO2STAY:
were is the instruction from the bible for Christians to observe this feast days? Spiritual or not whether they be Gods feast days or not. Why are you doing them and were is the command for Christians to do that.

(sigh)

You're asking me questions I've long answered.
I observe the feasts because they're GOD'S APPOINTED TIMES.
These are His Holy Convocations, a holy assembly with His children.
This did NOT CHANGE with the New Testament. Just ask Yahshuah.

If you don't want to observe God's appointed times, that's your decision.
There are those of us who choose to do it because we demonstrate our love of God by keeping His commandments. (John 14:15)
It's really just that simple.

EMILO2STAY:
pls madam where does the bible say we should observe the law because of our salvation. The sabbath has been done away with. Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days.

I'll continue to repeat myself:

I observe the Law because all the righteous people of the Bible did. Even the gentiles did so...once they came under God's covenant. Despite what we've been taught, God's covenant NEVER changed...
I don't know how many times I've told you...THE EARLY CHURCH OBSERVED THE LAW. LOOK THIS UP.

About the sabbath..if it was "done away with", WHY were the gentiles joining the Hebrews in the synagogues on the sabbath? (Acts 15:21)?
WHY is it still acknowledged even during the end-times tribulation? (Matt 24:20)?
WHY is Yahshuah saying we will observe it in the millennial reign? (Isaiah 66:23)?

EMILO2STAY:
lol madam I think you are the one lying here col2:16 is quit explicit and clear for any one yo understand verses 17 says its a shadow of things to come, You are the person trying to twist it.

You make absolutely NO sense.

This same Paul who taught the gentiles THE LAW day and night.... (Acts 28:23)
And instructed them to learn THE LAW of Moses in the synagogues on the Sabbath.... (Acts 15:21)
And encouraged them to imitate him, thus keeping THE LAW, as he himself imitated Yahshuah....(1Cor 1:11)

would not now turn around and DISCOURAGE the gentiles from keeping THE LAW in Col 2:16.

First, it would contradict the strong and consistent pattern of Paul exhorting the gentiles TO KEEP THE LAW
He never once DISCOURAGED them from doing so.
So either Col 2:16 GOES COMPLETELY AGAINST Paul's habit of exhorting THE LAW to the gentiles, or you don't understand the writings of Paul.

Second, the Colossians gentiles can NOT be dissuaded from feasts they never kept, nor familiar with in the first place.
Doesn't make sense, now does it?

the fact that Paul kept the feast days was not a command for Christians to do so. I believe this was just a one off act to pacify the jews same thing with acts 21:24. Notice that they had to encourage him to do it so as to pacify the jews who were accusing him of preaching against the law of moses. Again this was a one off act.

the Bible said Paul performed the Nazarite Vow to pacify the Israelites.
He didn't keep the Mosaic Law to pacify the Israelites.

He was zealous of the Law and doing that already.

Paul in all his letters never admonished Christians to do as he did.

Um...yes, he did. He told the Christians to initiate him several times. (1 Cor 11:1, 4:16), (Phil 3:17), (1 Thess 1:6)

You want to purify your self like Paul? Then you have to go to the temple in jerusalem to do so, you want to observe the day of penticost like Paul?, Or observe the feast days?, then you have to go to the temple in jerusalem to do so otherwise your wasting your time.

Or, I could just follow God's simple command of observing the feast days just as He commanded at Mt. Sinai. Was there a temple in the wilderness? How long did they observe the feast days before Jerusalem was even established? The Israelites were in the wilderness for 40yrs, with no temple or city, but still managed to please God enough by doing just as he said. Furthermore the Sabbath was known and observed by them long before Moses. So your point is not valid.

But there aint no temple in jerusalem today why?, because God destroyed it. Why?, because he doesn't want the old system of worship. Why?, because we can now attain the throne of grace through christ who died for us.

[/quote]

First, you're confusing tearing the veil with destruction of the temple. 2 different events.
God destroyed the temple via the Romans, due to the Israelites' disobedience.
What you're referring to is God tearing the veil because we're no longer under the Levitical, but Melchizedek priesthood.
This happened 30 years BEFORE Paul.

By your logic, Paul should have abandoned the "old system of worship".
However, he and every apostle, disciple and believer were still observing the Law, 30 YEARS AFTER THE TEARING OF THE VEIL.

So should I believe you? Or believe Paul?

EMILO2STAY:
who lied the bible?. As the unclean foods, that is your choice but do not judge any one who eats any of the above mentioned.

I do not subscribe to christ bday as I know that has a pagan root.
Concerning the biblical sabbath, the bible says the sabbath was made for man and not man for the sabbath. in other words you have the control of the sabbath you can choose any day of the week as your sabbath this is one of the reasons why the bible says christ has set us free from the bondage of the law.

I don't judge any Believer who doesn't follow the law.
God was blessing me before He revealed to me that HIS Law was never "done away with".
I see Him blessing countless others as well.


Remember how this whole conversation got started in the other thread.
All I'm saying is God is going to start waking up His remnant church in these end times.
The church that will escape the tribulation, and enter the wilderness (sorry, no pre-tribulation rapture here, folks).
This is the church that most resembles the early church.

Was this church observing easter? christmas? Holding Sunday as the Sabbath? Eating unclean meats?
Or were they listening to the teachings of Paul, who taught them the LAW day and night? (Acts 28:23)
And holding a holy convocation on the SABBATH learning the LAW OF MOSES? (Acts 15:21)

The law is not "bondage". How can it be "bondage", yet called delightsome, not grievous nor burdensome at the same time?

For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are NOT BURDENSOME (1 John 5:3)

Either the Bible is a lie, or you don't know how to rightly divide....

providence338:


(sigh)

You're asking me questions I've long answered.
I observe the feasts because they're GOD'S APPOINTED TIMES.
These are His Holy Convocations, a holy assembly with His children.
This did NOT CHANGE with the New Testament. Just ask Yahshuah.

If you don't want to observe God's appointed times, that's your decision.
There are those of us who choose to do it because we demonstrate our love of God by keeping His commandments. (John 14:15)
It's really just that simple.

you are not addressing the question.
the question is were is it given as command in the scriptures for Christians to keep observing the the laws of moses after they have accepted christ.

providence338:


I don't judge any Believer who doesn't follow the law.
God was blessing me before He revealed to me that HIS Law was never "done away with".
I see Him blessing countless others as well.


Remember how this whole conversation got started in the other thread.
All I'm saying is God is going to start waking up His remnant church in these end times.
The church that will escape the tribulation, and enter the wilderness (sorry, no pre-tribulation rapture here, folks).
This is the church that most resembles the early church.

Was this church observing easter? christmas? Holding Sunday as the Sabbath? Eating unclean meats?
Or were they listening to the teachings of Paul, who taught them the LAW day and night? (Acts 28:23)
And holding a holy convocation on the SABBATH learning the LAW OF MOSES? (Acts 15:21)

The law is not "bondage". How can it be "bondage", yet called delightsome, not grievous nor burdensome at the same time?

For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are NOT BURDENSOME (1 John 5:3)

Either the Bible is a lie, or you don't know how to rightly divide....

you are just blabbing.

19 Though I am free and belong to no one, I have made myself a slave to everyone, to win as many as possible.

20 To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law.

21 To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law), so as to win those not having the law.

22 To the weak I became weak, to win the weak. I have become all things to all people so that by all possible means I might save some.

23 I do all this for the sake of the gospel, that I may share in its blessings.

1 Corinthians 9:19-23