Which man is without sin can cast the first stone, our job is not to sit and criticize men and women of God but through prayer make sure that the message they receive to deliver is holy and righteous before God.
But as children of God yes in Acts, Paul talks about confront those who sin in the name of God, who are rebellious in nature, who come as wolf in sheep clothing, false prophets who declare to come in the name of the Lord but preach a message that does not recognize Jesus Christ, We are to call them out so that they do not spew words of confusion and deceit, because God cannot lead where there is confusion. As Christians when we are ministering to non Christians or those seeking to renew there faith in God our job is to not condemn them but show mercy as God has shown mercy to us, Born into sin it has almost become a natural part of our character to try and recognize what did not work for instance what Craig Lewis said in his message that didn't appear to be right, I would encourage you all to go before God in prayer, he has given us the ability to discern - the holy spirit guides and protects us- but we are not to leave it to our own understanding of what discernment means, again this is a gift from God.
So regardless of where you fall within the category of your quest/seeking for knowledge, I encourage you to go deeper, by praying, something has lead you to this website, whether by curiosity or by chance, its not an accident, I know me write her is not, because God has a plan, he knows the ending before he starts the beginning.


PS: I ask while writing your comment/opinion about where you stand in regards to Hip hop or the topic - what spirit do you feel is leading you and why?

shyannef4@hotmail.com

Just my opinion,

I understand what you are saying and agree with some of it, but not all. You cant just say hip-hop and r&b is devilish. You said something very important, you said its the 'MESSAGE' in the music. So with that being said, someone can say dont listen to any music period because even a gospel song can have a devilish message. Hip-hop is a form of art. The way that I see it, not everyone can rap. So because everyone cant rap, it must be a talent from God. If God has given you a talent, its up to you for you to use it for him, but as you said most people use it for the devel which is very true. But as you said, it's the 'MESSAGE', that in the music. If it's coming directly from God, he can get to his people in any form or fashion.

For example, God can talk to a prostitute while she is prostituting through anyone walking by on the street. My point there is that its not the form of music, 'rock, hip-hop, r&b, and so', but the message that is coming out. Thats just my opinion.

i agree too. the guy said sometimes i cud'a questioned ma self. he talked about "hip hop" meaning "booty shaking" and how people can claim to be "holy hip hoppers". dat makes sense too but i don't gotta call hip hop "hip hop". if someone's rappin in a gospel song, does dat make it bad? i think the important thing is the MESSAGE. anything cud be hip hop really. just talk with style to a beat. you can rap the ten commandments, but so dat make it evil?

Wow hommie, i don't think you are getting some things correct when u are reading them backwards. It sound a lil bit funny and crazy, are u trying to tell me to but your pop music instead of Hip-Hop hope not, because hip-hop is not a religion or association it is a way to send your message to the world, whether Jigga says somethin crazy about lucifer or 36 mafia means 666 that is what they are relling you not hip-hop. Hip-hop can't write itself nor rap itselfs, So i will really want you go on another research, C'mon now u know u can keep listening to them and keeping us update because for me am Hip-Hop till my last days
This has been a shout-out from Lil Makaveli to the public, peace
HA HA HA U GOIN' LET OF US LIKE DO U?

Damn thats one big mistake u have ener made in your life 1, the Album is the black album and the song lucifer is track #12 not eleven 2. These are the Lyrics of the song itself.
[LORD FORGIVE HIM, HE GOT THEM DARK FORCES IN HIM.
BUT HE ALSO GOT RIGHTEOUS CAUSE FOR SININ
THEM-A-MURDER ME, SO I GOTTA MURDER DEM
FIRST EMERGENCY, DOCTORS PERFORMING PROCIDURES
JESUE, I AIN'T TRYIN TO BE FACETIOUS, BUT
"VEGEANCE IS MINE" SAID THE LORD
yOU SAID IT BETTER THAN ALL
LEAVE NIGGAZ ON DEATH DOORS FOR KILLIN MY BEST, POOR HATERS
ON PERMANENT, HI-ATUS I SKATE


GO SEE FOR YOUR SELF AT : jayzonline.com or at lyrics.com

Thank God you din't mention Eminem or Xibit or DMX. . . cuz thats the only shit i relate to in hip hop. . . the rest ain't real to me, and i think this is just another conspiracy theory, everyone knows subliminal messaging DON'T work!! if it did popcorn companies would be rich (apologies) i knew jay z was messed up wit God, in one of his songs(can't remember right now) he goes " . . . Middle finger to the lord. . ." i thought that was messed up!

The word is not middle finger to the LORD but middle finger to the Law, c'mon hommies try listening good to their lyrics. Com'on y'all your can't be saying negatives things about these guys lyrics that ain't fair and kind

This is to Drea are you lost or can't find a place to preach. This post is about Hip-Hop not about jesus christ,

tell dem o!

hii u urit i lik 2 b a frend
wat good wit u down ther
lik u feel u gurl

you are all naive if you believe this nonsense,

to be honest, all you who believe in a religion are naive because you believe in something that has a very high possibilty of being untrue, their are certain things in religions that mean other religions can not exist therefore meaning if one religion is true then the other massive amount who follow a religion that is not true are following something wich is the biggest thing in their life yet is untrue, think about what im sayin,

and then to go on to say a form of music is broadcasting subliminal messages in relation to the devil is just plain silly,

peace.

Sorry it took me so long to get back but without further adue,
I dont want this to turn out to be a power struggle , This posting has to do with the spiritual downfall of listening to music - so if you didnt recognize that then you are in the wrong discussion. The truth about hip hop is a movie based off a pastor talking about the culture of hip hop in a christan context.

I am not sure why You have choosen to defend all these artist, becasue I am sure, no no I'm positive that there is no gain for you to defend these artist - why does Jay Z give you a portion of his millions to say Jay Z forever,
Now other than the usually , oh the information posted is untrue- I am hip hop till I die, I am a pretty logical person - so why do you say it is untrue and where do you get your source because I'm all into looking up this information which is an unfortunate choice that many of us opt out of. Now if it is a personal choice fine - but please dont try to offend my belief system due to your ignorance especally when you have nothing to back it up with other than smack (lip)
I am but a tool for those seeking to find there purpose before God, even to those who are complete unbeleivers. Instead of looking at what is wrong/ what doesnt suit your personally life style watch the movie and look at what is right such as the effects of not having a father in the home. How the enemy will try and blind you to get in and confuse you.
I guess I cant get too fustrated because beleive you me I was in your shoes not to long ago - but my God never fails - because he called me by name , hey you dont like this Jesus talk too bad I do

Ps here is some additional info on what hip hop is read this then you can call my name out and we can talk
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hip_hop
http://www.daveyd.com/daveyhistorylinks2002.html
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Hip-Hop
http://www.jam2dis.com/j2dhiphopdef.htm
drea

Just to go over some points a talent is a gift from God and can be a blessing to some one elese but your gift is not a way to teach,

Another point I would like to raise is that God can and will use anyone to get his msg out, but he calls for your life to be holy, Examples are when God called Saul who changes his name to Paul, he had to bury the old man and live anew in God,

Also to beleive in something is exactly what it is a belief which takes faith from the individual. The difference is that eahc individual puts there faith in may different things in may different forms. My faith is in Jesus Christ yours is in cars, money or whatever you hold dear. Silly is the fact that we cannot rap our head behind the fact that music has power to give you a message that although yu beleive you can reject you cannot, Example is given in the movie, watch part one and you will understand.

My stand point is I will not promote any kind of music, research and listen to your soucres and see where there are coming from and what they beleive , some of theses cristian artist are in the same boat , God calls you to live your life holy

Drea

Drea, I understand what you are saying. My question is what do you think of gospel hip-hop? In Act 1 verse 8, Jesus said to specifically go forth and spread the word to all nations. Not everyone can stand infront of people and start preaching the word like pastors. But I'd like to know what you think of gospel hip-hop.

Yo thanks for writing this you have inspired me to change da world of rap from cussin fightin drugs and killin to godliness Its hard though coz u wanna make it so bad but i vow to stay loyal to god while still remainin loyal to the game I am basically gonna be like t-bone the gospel rapper from callifornia

@ jduck13, check out some of my music from my debut album at http://cdbaby.com/cd/lilayo and let me know what you think.

not all hiphop is bad people, listen to this

03-surreal_and_dj_balance-each_step.mp3
http://www.sendspace.com/file/bbw1bj

All that i say
can be told another way!

What do u wanna say bout Gospel Gangstaz,Winas Phase 11,T-Bones and all them Hip-Hop gospel artistes?
You might as well crucify Mel Gibson for the movie "passion of the christ" or Jim for taking the roll of Jesus.Just want you to know Hip-Hop's changed so many lives and the fact that U don't like Hip-Hop doesn't mean U shud crucify it. Nas wazn't calling himself Jesus.U need a literary mind to understand him. Have u listened to nas' "God Love us" and in "Thug Mansion" he said
[center]"Ask the holy spirit to save me" [/center]


"God Love Us"

[Nas]
Uhh,
Uh, speak without thinkin,
speak without speakin, huh,
Feel without reachin, uhh
That's what it's about
It's about that, inner, inner love, yaknawmean?

[Chorus: Nas]

God love us hood niggaz (I know)
Cause next to Jesus on the cross was the crook niggaz (I know)
and the killers, God love us good niggaz (I know)
Cause on the streets is the hood niggaz, uhh
And I know he feel us, uhh
God love us hood niggaz (I know)
Cause he be wit us in the prisons
and he takes time to listen, uhh
God love us hood niggaz (I know)
Cause next to Jesus on the cross was the crook niggaz, uhh
but he forgive us

[Nas]
He who has ears, let him hear
And he who has sight, let him see
He who has life, let him be
See everything goes through change
Those who know don't talk
and those who talk don't know a thing
Men are born soft and turn tough
Dead lay a stiffened heart, I've been kissed by God
I've been hurt, I've been marked for death, almost ripped apart
by the beast but he missed his mark
Alone in the dark my thoughts had sparked up
when I saw my body on the floor, from above I watch it all
Yo it came to me, the pain in me
Many slain empty skulls where a brain should be
It strangely seemed, like it was a dream
but the si-rens had never woke me
Only reason I'm here now is cause God chose me
And to me, I'm only just a crook nigga
But God love us hood niggaz

[Chorus]

[Nas]
Day by day by day I sit back and pray
My thugs get packed away, in a maxi-cage
They pass away, they went off the casket way
My gats will spray, but that won't bring em back today
So long my crimies now gone for eternity
The team we got left on the set, now turn to me
Can't speak, tears in my eyes, revenge in my mind
I ride past the church where they got his body and find
they takin him to the hearse to put his body in dirt
That's it, pay my respects, wipe my tears with my shirt
Now it's time to do work, out of love and retribution
As loyalty, he would die for me, no excuses
Loadin clips up, countin bullets carefully
For self, though it feels like, he was there for me
Saw the enemy, I ate him, saw Jakes behind me
They ain't knock me, it's obvious that God's watchin me

[Chorus]

[Nas]
Jealousy in the hood, felonies in the hood
Thugs wit guns become celebrities in the hood
Yo it's beef in the hood, smoke trees in the hood
Little girls have seeds by O.G.'s in the hood
It's food in the hood, it's drugs in the hood
You can choose if you would, coke to sniff
Dope to ooze in your blood, parolees
ex-cons live in the hood, it's jobs in the hood
You can starve in the hood
Your best friends'll Bleep your baby moms in the hood
But it's good in the hood
I was raised in the hood
Was taught how to walk and duck strays in the hood
I stays in the hood, got my ways from the hood
Learned to play ball go to the NBA, in the hood
There's AIDS (uh) in the hood (WHAT?)
Our lives are the worst, on top of that, we broke
That's the main reason why God, love us the most

So Bro,don't say wat u dunno,I know Nas but i dunno bout others.Just take ur time to see and reason.Rap is not interpreted as read all da time and all those on ur list are very poetical+lyrical.Search and u'll know what they're tryna say

You know i just checked Jay-Z's lucifer out and i'm already beefing whoeva raised this topic,wrong again! I I'm sure U believe when they told you that we blacks are monkeys too! At least they got some evidence too!just want U 2 know those pastors are mortals and once they don't understand something,they ain't in 4 it. Check Jay-Z out. I'm sure U didn't do Literature in school.


[Chorus:]
Lucifer, dawn of de morning! I'm gonna, chase you out of Earth
Lucifer Lucifer, dawn of de morning,
(I'm from the murder capital, where we murder for capital)
Lucifer Lucifer, dawn of de morning! I'm gonna, chase you out of Earth
(Kanyeeze you did it again, you a genius nigga!)
Lucifer Lucifer, dawn of de morning,
So you niggas change your attitude
For they askin what happened to you]

Later he said

"Man i gotta get my soul right
I gotta get these Devils out my life"

"Lift up your soul or give the Holly ghost please"

The song's bout vengeance and he knows the Devil is Lucifer,he's the reason why we revenge and avenge.

In da last verse,he said

And if you feel in my heart that i long for revenge
Please blame it on the sun of the mournin
Thanks Again

I'm sure U know the Devil is the morning Sun

Bone Thugz 4 y'all

[Layzie]
God bless you working on a plan to Heaven
Follow the Lord all 24/7 days, GOD is who we praise
even though the devil's all up in my face
But he keeping me safe and in my place, say grace
-Crossroad

What I think about gospel hip hop, If that is what lead you to salvation that is fine but you must grow in God not in the music that may of been a tool that lead you.

The spiritual anwser is the gift of discernment - the spirit that gives you the ability to feel what is not right with God. That can only be given by God, so that is something that you would have to ask for.

and I am sorry to nit pick but I will not defend these artist, Nas beleives the black man is God - type in the search engine five percenters, he is one of the beleivers of this please dont beleive the hype just because I say hey god whats up god and all that nonesense that doesnt mean a thing ,

The devil is a deceiver and a liar , what makes u think he's not lying to you now, I am an ex hip hop head/ reggae/ old skool/ dont need to continue avid ex music listener, I am very aware of What Nas and Jay rap about , VERY aware , and sorry to say it aint good , there is a spiritual consequence to disobedience


Cant rememer the verse , but it says go ye therefor and teach, if you are blessed with a voice to sing , that is fine but that shouldnt be your means to spread the word.


Email me if anymore questions:

anderson_drea@yahoo.ca
or
shyannef4@hotmail.com

What more can i say?

I just began to read the chain letter, so this is not a response to anything else said.

LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

Every musical genra has been accused of being of the devil EVEN GOSPEL MUSIC.

The old black people liked SPIRTUALS, that was sung without music and when gospel came along it was from THE DEVIL.

I wonder how many fools really believe God is up in heaven listening to country or classical music and telling them not to play the "Black Music" it is the devils music?

Let's not be so foolish about every form of music that comes along.

There is a lot of Hip Hop Gospel music.

Just to comfort those who feel that I am only picking on a type or genre of music I am not! Any music that promotes self worship or is out rightly claim to be God or a type of God or refers to idols are included, I mostly talk about Hip Hop because it is within the context of what I know, I dont know rock and roll but I can assure you that they can be held just as liable.

and what has happen is there has been a desensitization to what is wrong and due to oh well time has past and now has been accepted - we want to believe it is okay

Soon we will be saying that it is okay to kill because of self defense or other things such as homosexuality - yeah the movie touches on that too!!!

God doesnt like disobedience and cannot look on Sin, who are we too say that we think God doesnt think about this or think about that, I would nt take him to be as simple minded as we are after all he is the creator.

tell them oooh

@drea

U can't single out Hip-Hop!

<*laughing uncontrollably. Has to stifle his mouth with his pillow so as not to wake the others in his house*>

rof-lmao times 100!!!
This has to be the funniest thread i've ever read in my muh'f.ckin' life!!!
Really exu, i don't know about you but i just can't stop laughing.

One of the funniest parts was when some mofo said after reading what dat wacko, free dropped, tears started falling from his eyes. And the mofo goes ahead to ask hot-angel for her handkerchief!!!! Rof lmao!!

Or or, oh oh, when j-ducky vowes to tune his raps to God and be a good boy scout, meanwhile on the rap freestyle threads, mah nigga's been talking about gats, killing niggas tryna run up on his clique,banging on hoes, ridin' 64 impalas,pimpin' bitches, and how ur girlfriend's been giving him some brain!!!
Jesus, this whole thread is just slap-stick funny. Frankly, it'd make a good script for saturday night live or papa ajasco!!

*still laughing his ass off*


All in all, i think this thread is one of the dumbest threads, that doesn't hold water spiritually, intellectually and historically wise.

If i can recall, the Bible tells to discern right from wrong, and even tells we shouldn't just take what a pastor says hook, line and sinker. That we should do research individually, check the scriptures. . .so we'll be sure what the pastor says aligns with the Bible.

That pastor lewis has been so erronous in most things about hiphop, slinging out more or less conspiracy theories. They sound more like plots from X-files. Mulder and scully must be green with envy by now, lol.

Without going on a rambling tangent, I find that the last comment should not only be disregarded, but if there is a way for it to be possible deleted. Sorry your pun or spin how you view this topic is funny. As stupid or wasteful as it seems you made enough time to comment,
The author offered no sense of direction and just generated doubt which the enemy uses as a mean to confuse …
If i can recall, the Bible tells to discern right from wrong, discernment is a gift from God, you don’t just pick up and say I have a gift of discernment (there is a process and steps for this gift) because if you are not lead by God you can bet your bottom dollar that the devil (let me say it so there is no confusion) is blinding you to feel that you are making the right decisions because you are relying on yourself to (discern)


and even tells we shouldn't just take what a pastor says hook, line and sinker. That we should do research individually, check the scriptures. . .so we'll be sure what the pastor says aligns with the Bible.
(I hate when people refer to this and don’t quote from the bible…I know what that tells me what does that tell you…you should be careful of the author and where there are coming from because many will come to mislead. The text that I italicized disturbs me so much spiritually…I will leave this to the author to figure out why?

This is what I know, your understanding is always limited by your self perception, instead of reducing your self to zero, your try to figure out
Why I think, Why I believe, This is not for me because… Very important concept to understand will be found in James 1:17-26 this will clarify what I said above,

Something to take away from this:
Hip Hop cannot be used as a means to bring in people or give a basis of understanding of what our reality is as black people:
Hip hop when defined is seen as a culture: a means of using rhymes, rap, break dancing, etc…
The word culture generally refers to patterns of human activity and the symbolic structures that give such activity significance.
When a culture violates the standards that are revealed in Gods word the results can be disastrous…

@drea abi na dre wannabe,

i view this whole thread as funny because for some pages, a lotta people have been saying a lotta crap about hiphop and taking what that pastor said hook, line and sinker. You said discernment is a God-given and i don't argue with that. I totally agree with it. But at the same time, neither did i say it was wholly based on our human perception. Of course not. The fact that i didn't that doesn't mean you should jump to conclusions and run your mouth about what i've to say.
While i admit i can't remember excatly where that verse in the Bible is, but it does say we should seek the truth from The Word, that we should not take everything someone says verbatim, that every spirit must be tested.

Another reason i find this thread dumb and funny is because of the many misconceptions about hiphop and the funny posts that followed.
The fact that you don't have a sense of humor doesn't mean you should impose your misery/lack of humor upon me. And it doesn't mean you should run your mouth givin' me crap about how my post was and shyt like that.

Perhaps, you should read my previous post again to understand what i meant.

Other than that, Bleep off my computer screen!

@drea abi na dre wannabe,

i view this whole thread as funny because for some pages, a lotta people have been saying a lotta crap about hiphop and taking what that pastor said hook, line and sinker. You said discernment is a God-given and i don't argue with that. I totally agree with it. But at the same time, neither did i say it was wholly based on our human perception. Of course not. The fact that i didn't that doesn't mean you should jump to conclusions and run your mouth about what i've to say.
While i admit i can't remember excatly where that verse in the Bible is, but it does say we should seek the truth from The Word, that we should not take everything someone says verbatim, that every spirit must be tested.

Another reason i find this thread dumb and funny is because of the many misconceptions about hiphop and the funny posts that followed.
The fact that you don't have a sense of humor doesn't mean you should impose your misery/lack of humor upon me. And it doesn't mean you should run your mouth givin' me crap about how my post was and shyt like that.

Perhaps, you should read my previous post again to understand what i meant.

Other than that, Bleep off my computer screen!

@drea abi na dre wannabe,

i view this whole thread as funny because for some pages, a lotta people have been saying a lotta crap about hiphop and taking what that pastor said hook, line and sinker. You said discernment is a God-given and i don't argue with that. I totally agree with it. But at the same time, neither did i say it was wholly based on our human perception. Of course not. The fact that i didn't that doesn't mean you should jump to conclusions and run your mouth about what i've to say.
While i admit i can't remember excatly where that verse in the Bible is, but it does say we should seek the truth from The Word, that we should not take everything someone says verbatim, that every spirit must be tested.

Another reason i find this thread dumb and funny is because of the many misconceptions about hiphop and the funny posts that followed.
The fact that you don't have a sense of humor doesn't mean you should impose your misery/lack of humor upon me. And it doesn't mean you should run your mouth givin' me crap about how my post was and shyt like that.

Perhaps, you should read my previous post again to understand what i meant.

Other than that, Bleep off my computer screen!