Pelecius:


I think I only asked you to show us how speciation would lead to increased complexity, yet you are referring to my post which clearly argued opposite of what I asked you to do.

Just provide the evidence, then I'll easily believe evolution and all this your back and forth will cease.

I'm not trying to sound informed (it's your fantasy, I believe). I am expressing what I know is consistent with the reality and even providing empirical evidence for them.
Till date, you have done nothing than wonder how I don't buy into your fallacy of equivocation. And mostly use adhominem when you don't have rebuttal.

You said we have evidence for speciation and later ask for empirical evidence for evolution when speciation is already the final process of an evolving specie. It’s a stupid question.

Evolving organisms will eventually go through speciation and then these new specie continue evolving.

Image123:


Maybe i'm not that experienced sha, but i've never seen anyone find Jesus this way. Maybe you'll be a first , who knows? Keep seeking all day.

Someone either convinced or encouraged or motivated him or something like that to find another person(Jesus) whose existence as the savior of humanity is only accounted for in a book that makes no sense to LordReed as he calls it a jumbo.


What else

Workch:
You said we have evidence for speciation and later ask for empirical evidence for evolution when speciation is already the final process of an evolving specie. It’s a stupid question.

Evolving organisms will eventually go through speciation and then these new specie continue evolving.

Why are you tackling that guy?

HellVictorinho:


Why are you tackling that guy?

Because he’s proudly portraying false knowledge of something he knows nothing about.

Workch:
Because he’s proudly portraying false knowledge of something he knows nothing about.

Is Google not helping matters

HellVictorinho:



Someone either convinced or encouraged or motivated him or something like that to find another person(Jesus) whose existence as the savior of humanity is only accounted for in a book that makes no sense to LordReed as he calls it a jumbo.


What else

Hello Victor, how are you feeling today. Jesus Christ still loves you too.

1Sharon:


Can't your god come and fight for himself?

He's coming, wait for it. Revelation 19 that is.

HellVictorinho:


Is Google not helping matters

He tried googling but still didn’t understand. A lot of people also do not know how to sieve online information.

1Sharon:


You want to pretend like Jesus and God have the same personality?

They are both God, welcome to life.

Image123:


Hello Victor, how are you feeling today. Jesus Christ still loves you too.

Whatever that is supposed to mean

I know how I feel

But nobody has been able to explain how Jesus is related to anything


When I asked God to intervene in my family issues some years ago

It only got worse


Now I have questioned God out of my head

LordReed:


Where in what you screenshot did you mention divine nature? You wrote being and attributes, we now come to where his being and attributes have changed then you now introduce divine nature because the Jesus humanity clearly shows that this so called unchanging god actually changed according to your previous definition.

How have I shifted ground? It was you brought up the Jesus humanity not me. I asked you for places where the god's unchanging nature was mentioned and you listed verses. I treat what you wrote and then you start accusing me of shifting ground, that's so hilarious. May be next time don't write what you know will introduce holes to what you are saying.




You analogy does not correspond because according to you the one of the attributes of the god is agelessness and immortality, if Jesus aged and died then this was more than just adding a new part to an existing system. It will be more akin to removing the body of a brand new Mercedes sedan and replacing it with beat up old Volkswagen Beetle and then claiming no change occurred to the Mercedes when quite plainly you are no more looking at a Mercedes.

Adding humanity enabled him to negate at least 2 of his previous attributes but somehow to you it is not change and I am the one with the cognitive dissonance. LMAO!



I am quite willing to be proved wrong, you have not done so. I asked you what you meant by unchanging you pointed to ageless and immortal then also pointed to a place where he aged and died, you proved yourself wrong not me.

The bad thing with you is that you intentionally omit things so as to change context, and then you'll latch on the out of context part.
I wrote that I used ATTRIBUTES and NATURE interchangeably. And since I knew what you'd do, I wrote that before you protest, a site "free thesaurus" also combined the words together. You clearly omitted that part so you can make your case.

I didn't just accuse you, I showed how you've done that most times. First of all, the background was to show how changing one's mind on something (decision making) is not same as changing one's attributes. You deflected it from that, since the person has no answer in the first place and tried to resolve change of mind which leads to change of behaviour. I responded that that is not what Bible meant by God not changing. That it's about his being and attributes (divine nature)

Now, your analogy just show your desperation in convincing yourself that I must be wrong. Jesus would likely be called hybrid of God and man (since he added humanity to himself) just as I gave a hybrid car analogy the other time.
One of the characteristic of a combustion engine car is that it uses fuel. This does not change even if an electric source is added to it. The engine wasn't COMPLETELY replaced by electric source. So was Jesus. He added humanity to himself (I don't know why I am repeating what I've said just because someone is bent on convincing himself of being right).
If attributes of the power source is that battery will run down and finally end it's cycle, it doesn't change that of the engine. So is the fact that Jesus died IN FLESH but was ALIVE IN SPIRIT (all these have been explained, but you have blinded yourself with prejudice)

Ageless and immortality are not the only attributes of God. My response to your "client" showed that. But of course, you will ignore them so you can sit on what seem to help your case.

HellVictorinho:



Whatever that is supposed to mean

I know how I feel

But nobody has been able to explain how Jesus is related to anything


When I asked God to intervene in my family issues some years ago

It only got worse


Now I have questioned God out of my head

Errmmm, He's God remember, not your remote control. He's Sovereign.

Image123:


Errmmm, He's God remember, not your remote control. He's Sovereign.

Are you in my head?


I said I don't think about what God can do or will do anymore

Pelecius:



Now, your analogy just show your desperation in convincing yourself that I must be wrong.

Lol, not exactly though. He's not here to convince himself, he's here to convince you. His duty here is to sow doubts in your mind and make you think God is not that wise after all, just like Eden.

Image123:


He's coming, wait for it. Revelation 19 that is.

Lol.

HellVictorinho:



Are you in my head?


I said I don't think about what God can do or will do anymore

Ecc 9:4 KJV For to him that is joined to all the living there is hope: for a living dog is better than a dead lion.

Pelecius:
Jesus would likely be called hybrid of God and man (since he added humanity to himself) just as I gave a hybrid car analogy the other time.

One of the characteristic of a combustion engine car is that it uses fuel. This does not change even if an electric source is added to it. The engine wasn't COMPLETELY replaced by electric source.

A hybrid is a change. And you'd need to change quite a lot for the type of fuel a car uses to change, or you might be filling a Tesla with petrol.

So, what's the moral lesson of this story?
Believe all you want but you can't take away the fact that there is a one true God.

rosalieene:
So, what's the moral lesson of this story?
Believe all you want but you can't take away the fact that there is a one true God.

He is probably the Hindu god

Workch:
ok now I think I should help you so you don’t keep embarrassing yourself and you don’t go out saying this nonsense.

These are the major components of evolution:
1. Mutations
2. Changing environment conditions
3. Recombinations.
4. Adaptions.
5. Speciation.


Now to put them together in a statement; Mutations and recombinations within a population of organism, leads to variations in gene pool. The changing environmental conditions selects the gene that is adaptable at any point in time. Accumulated mutations and recombinations over time in a constantly changing environment leads to speciation. That’s simply evolution.


The moment any population living organism starts portraying any of this components, it has already started evolving.

I don’t know if you can comprehend this but I will try harder to explain.

Speciation is like a part of a car, evolution is the car. Speciation cannot work independent of the whole car.

You see why I have been making fun of you all these while? It’s impossible to believe in speciation without believing in evolution because speciation is the final process of all evolving specie that has adapted to changing environmental conditions over time.

It’s either you don’t understand speciation, evolution or both.

Finally, someone tries to answer the challenge (just that he didn't really do that).
I repeat, equating evolution to speciation is false equivocation. So you should be the one to not embarrass himself by using such fallacy.

You just showed that speciation ONE of the few COMPONENTS used to explain evolution, just as glue one of the types of adhesive. We've been telling the "learned" one for some days now.

Now, to address your points.
You didn't really answer the question of how speciation would lead to increased complexity (from a simpler life, e.g. a bacterium to a higher one such as fish; as Darwinists interpret the fossil records).
You only explained diversity, which I talked about that this is the major talking point of Creationists.

The moment any population living organism starts portraying any of this components, it has already started evolving.
This is where you begin to expose ignorance again.
You mentioned 4 things and said if population portrays ANY of the components, it has start evolving. Now, humans have accumulated mutations and population geneticists say that we keep accumulating them, does that translate to us evolving, O "learned" one?

I don’t know if you can comprehend this but I will try harder to explain.
Speciation is like a part of a car, evolution is the car. Speciation cannot work independent of the whole car
He then acts funny again
O "learned" one, there are parts of a car that can work independent of the whole car. The battery is part of it. It can work in another device which is not a car (to explain that speciation is not exclusive to evolution worldview)

You see why I have been making fun of you all these while? It’s impossible to believe in speciation without believing in evolution because speciation is the final process of all evolving specie that has adapted to changing environmental conditions over time.
Your self delusion is amazing. Was I the one who was equating a component to the whole system?
And just like your analogy, it's possible to know the use of batteries and not limit oneself that it's a component of cars ONLY. It can be used to as components of inverter system (not the inverter circuit o).
So, I know speciation and in fact, creation scientists predict rapid diversification at some past, which has been verified empirically.

It’s either you don’t understand speciation, evolution or both
So far, you have been the "learned" one who equated component of a system to the system

Pelecius:

Finally, someone tries to answer the challenge (just that he didn't really do that).
I repeat, equating evolution to speciation is false equivocation. So you should be the one to not embarrass himself by using such fallacy.

You just showed that speciation ONE of the few COMPONENTS used to explain evolution, just as glue one of the types of adhesive. We've been telling the "learned" one for some days now.

Now, to address your points.
You didn't really answer the question of how speciation would lead to increased complexity (from a simpler life, e.g. a bacterium to a higher one such as fish; as Darwinists interpret the fossil records).
You only explained diversity, which I talked about that this is the major talking point of Creationists.

The moment any population living organism starts portraying any of this components, it has already started evolving.
This is where you begin to expose ignorance again.
You mentioned 4 things and said if population portrays ANY of the components, it has start evolving. Now, humans have accumulated mutations and population geneticists say that we keep accumulating them, does that translate to us evolving, O "learned" one?

I don’t know if you can comprehend this but I will try harder to explain.
Speciation is like a part of a car, evolution is the car. Speciation cannot work independent of the whole car
He then acts funny again
O "learned" one, there are parts of a car that can work independent of the whole car. The battery is part of it. It can work in another device which is not a car (to explain that speciation is not exclusive to evolution worldview)

You see why I have been making fun of you all these while? It’s impossible to believe in speciation without believing in evolution because speciation is the final process of all evolving specie that has adapted to changing environmental conditions over time.
Your self delusion is amazing. Was I the one who was equating a component to the whole system?
And just like your analogy, it's possible to know the use of batteries and not limit oneself that it's a component of cars ONLY. It can be used to as components of inverter system (not the inverter circuit o).
So, I know speciation and in fact, creation scientists predict rapid diversification at some past, which has been verified empirically.

It’s either you don’t understand speciation, evolution or both
So far, you have been the "learned" one who equated component of a system to the system

dumb, there’s nothing like increase complexity in evolution. That statement was created by dummies like you

We said that countless times still the thick skull can’t absorb it.


Speciation and creation in one statement?
How does that work?

Pelecius:

Finally, someone tries to answer the challenge (just that he didn't really do that).
I repeat, equating evolution to speciation is false equivocation. So you should be the one to not embarrass himself by using such fallacy.

You just showed that speciation ONE of the few COMPONENTS used to explain evolution, just as glue one of the types of adhesive. We've been telling the "learned" one for some days now.

Now, to address your points.
You didn't really answer the question of how speciation would lead to increased complexity (from a simpler life, e.g. a bacterium to a higher one such as fish; as Darwinists interpret the fossil records).
You only explained diversity, which I talked about that this is the major talking point of Creationists.

The moment any population living organism starts portraying any of this components, it has already started evolving.
This is where you begin to expose ignorance again.
You mentioned 4 things and said if population portrays ANY of the components, it has start evolving. Now, humans have accumulated mutations and population geneticists say that we keep accumulating them, does that translate to us evolving, O "learned" one?

I don’t know if you can comprehend this but I will try harder to explain.
Speciation is like a part of a car, evolution is the car. Speciation cannot work independent of the whole car
He then acts funny again
O "learned" one, there are parts of a car that can work independent of the whole car. The battery is part of it. It can work in another device which is not a car (to explain that speciation is not exclusive to evolution worldview)

You see why I have been making fun of you all these while? It’s impossible to believe in speciation without believing in evolution because speciation is the final process of all evolving specie that has adapted to changing environmental conditions over time.
Your self delusion is amazing. Was I the one who was equating a component to the whole system?
And just like your analogy, it's possible to know the use of batteries and not limit oneself that it's a component of cars ONLY. It can be used to as components of inverter system (not the inverter circuit o).
So, I know speciation and in fact, creation scientists predict rapid diversification at some past, which has been verified empirically.

It’s either you don’t understand speciation, evolution or both
So far, you have been the "learned" one who equated component of a system to the system

you always answer your questions and still don’t get the answers.

budaatum:


A hybrid is a change. And you'd need to change quite a lot for the type of fuel a car uses to change, or you might be filling a Tesla with petrol.

Tesla is not the only prototype that was ever made, and I was talking about electric vehicle like Tesla. Rather, hybrids that uses both combustion engine and electric source. Though, in reality, there's a redesign of the whole system, but I used that as an example in it's crude form such that the new electric power source does not change the characteristics of the combustion engine; such as using fuel.
It was clearly explained, with objections in mind

Image123:


Lol, not exactly though. He's not here to convince himself, he's here to convince you. His duty here is to sow doubts in your mind and make you think God is not that wise after all, just like Eden.

I guess so. It could be easy for gullible ones or those who are looking for reasons to actually rebel (just as Eve did). It turns out that he keeps shifting grounds

LordReed:


I wanted you to clarify what you meant by genetic complexity and used a case where extra genetic information is present in an organism that we are familiar with but for you that is changing the context. What a joke.

Complexity doesn't enter the evolution equation, its you shoehorning in an obvious foreign concept and when asked to clarify you get all defensive. Do you know what you are talking about or are you just pulling stuff out of your theological grabbag?

used a case where extra genetic information is present in an organism that we are familiar with but for you that is changing the context. What a joke.
You see what I have been talking about? Did I accuse you of using down syndrome question as changing context? I laugh.
I maintained that your case was the original attempt and you asking another question afterwards, after seeing that your case was invalid was your attempt to still stay afloat.
You ended up bolding a question I have discussed several times while leaving your failed case. Yet you were emphasizing on the bolded. That was what I called ripping out of context.
You can do better next time

Complexity doesn't enter the evolution equation, its you shoehorning in an obvious foreign concept and when asked to clarify you get all defensive
You can tell that to Darwinists who used the fossil record to explain how organisms increase in complexity.
Secondly, I wasn't forcing it into evolution. It's something that's obvious, whether to an evolutionist or Creationist.
I wasn't being defensive in it's proper term. I only showed how you were changing grounds since your attempted mockery question failed in it's task.

Do you know what you are talking about or are you just pulling stuff out of your theological grabbag?
I smile
Like I said, tell that to the interpretation of fosiil records. And of course, there shouldn't be need for punctuated equilibrium

Workch:
dumb, there’s nothing like increase complexity in evolution. That statement was created by dummies like you

We said that countless times still the thick skull can’t absorb it.


Speciation and creation in one statement?
How does that work?

Smiles
Let's assume you are right, show us how speciation explain the levels in the fossil record (the term is from simpler to higher life form)


Like I said, don't limit yourself in believing that batteries are components of cars only. I hope the "learned" one understand the message sha.

Workch:
you always answer your questions and still don’t get the answers.

Do you know what the call question begging fallacy, O "learned" one?

This plenty talks won't happen if our "intelligent" one have knowledge of or can apply logic

Pelecius:

Do you know what the call question begging fallacy, O "learned" one?

This plenty talks won't happen if our "intelligent" one have knowledge of or can apply logic

I don’t think you do yourself.

You want to teach me about fallacies? Lol You don’t even understand whatever you say. Begging the question fallacy is when the body of your argument already assumes that your conclusion is correct instead of supporting it.

An example of begging the question fallacy is “god exist because the Bible said he exist ”. How is this an equivalence to whatever I typed here.

Maybe you think when you use those terms, it makes you sound intelligent

You are dumb at everything, even recognizing fallacies

Pelecius:


used a case where extra genetic information is present in an organism that we are familiar with but for you that is changing the context. What a joke.
You see what I have been talking about? Did I accuse you of using down syndrome question as changing context? I laugh.
I maintained that your case was the original attempt and you asking another question afterwards, after seeing that your case was invalid was your attempt to still stay afloat.
You ended up bolding a question I have discussed several times while leaving your failed case. Yet you were emphasizing on the bolded. That was what I called ripping out of context.
You can do better next time

Na wa for this guy sef. E bi like say english dey hard you for night. I already explained that the Down Syndrome reference was to give you opportunity to clarify what genetic complexity means which you still haven't done by the way.

Complexity doesn't enter the evolution equation, its you shoehorning in an obvious foreign concept and when asked to clarify you get all defensive
You can tell that to Darwinists who used the fossil record to explain how organisms increase in complexity.
Secondly, I wasn't forcing it into evolution. It's something that's obvious, whether to an evolutionist or Creationist.
I wasn't being defensive in it's proper term. I only showed how you were changing grounds since your attempted mockery question failed in it's task.

My goodness! Do you even know what the Theory of Evolution states? For the love of Mercury it discusses diversity not complexity. WTH are you getting complexity from?

Do you know what you are talking about or are you just pulling stuff out of your theological grabbag?
I smile
Like I said, tell that to the interpretation of fosiil records. And of course, there shouldn't be need for punctuated equilibrium

You see you now. You've introduced another thing then when we get into it you'll say it was me who changed the subject. What has punctuated equilibrium got to do with what we are discussing for Andromeda's sake? More grist from your theological grabbag I guess.

Workch:
Malaria is very easy to eradicate with the proper mentality and political will to invest in research. We can make and release GM male mosquitoes with the gene that passes to the offspring to kill female progeny at larval stage, it has proven to be very effective in Europe and U.S.

But here we are, Africa can’t solve any problem because they are overly religious and it affect their sense of reasoning. They prefer importing antimalarial drugs and the developed world know this hence they won’t solve the problem for us.

Since I came back to Nigeria, I have not practiced, there’s almost nothing like research in biochemistry in Nigeria. It’s virtually non-existent.

I think Nigeria continues in this extended twilight of quasi-development because we only have a few people who 'wake' up, and groggily lay about shaking others who are asleep still, all with sleepy eyes asking when breakfast will come.

Now by 'wake' I intend no inclinations towards your academic 'enlightment' as regards your post, but more generally in terms of technology, nation building ideas, "OT" as it is named in the streets.
More Inclined towards yourachievements.

There are no research centers why not attempt to start one, for the 'cause' ofcause.

We nerd more people awakened and gathering sticks, fetching water, not just waking others.

Pelecius:

The bad thing with you is that you intentionally omit things so as to change context, and then you'll latch on the out of context part.
I wrote that I used ATTRIBUTES and NATURE interchangeably. And since I knew what you'd do, I wrote that before you protest, a site "free thesaurus" also combined the words together. You clearly omitted that part so you can make your case.

Go look at when you first mentioned divine nature and see whether you said you are using it interchangeably. Also you post the results of your Google search because I didn't see what you were talking about.

I didn't just accuse you, I showed how you've done that most times. First of all, the background was to show how changing one's mind on something (decision making) is not same as changing one's attributes. You deflected it from that, since the person has no answer in the first place and tried to resolve change of mind which leads to change of behaviour. I responded that that is not what Bible meant by God not changing. That it's about his being and attributes (divine nature)

Once again going back using another person's line of conversation to answer me. How many freaking times do I need to say I was not arguing on behalf of someone else and that I was exploring my own arguments with you? Are you a forgetful clutzy or what?

Now, your analogy just show your desperation in convincing yourself that I must be wrong. Jesus would likely be called hybrid of God and man (since he added humanity to himself) just as I gave a hybrid car analogy the other time.
One of the characteristic of a combustion engine car is that it uses fuel. This does not change even if an electric source is added to it. The engine wasn't COMPLETELY replaced by electric source. So was Jesus. He added humanity to himself (I don't know why I am repeating what I've said just because someone is bent on convincing himself of being right).
If attributes of the power source is that battery will run down and finally end it's cycle, it doesn't change that of the engine. So is the fact that Jesus died IN FLESH but was ALIVE IN SPIRIT (all these have been explained, but you have blinded yourself with prejudice)

You are the desperate one here. A Volkswagen Beetle body on a Mercedes chassis is not a hybrid? Do you even understand the words you use for Andromeda's sake? I already asked you is Jesus still human, is he still carrying a human body? Is that not more akin to the case of a Beetle body on Mercedes chassis? Very clearly here a body was changed.

On the subject of ALIVE IN SPIRIT, is this a divine attribute, are all spirits not ALIVE IN SPIRIT?

Ageless and immortality are not the only attributes of God. My response to your "client" showed that. But of course, you will ignore them so you can sit on what seem to help your case.

I don't care about your response to someone else, that is not my conversation with you. Make your responses to me and not to someone else's argument.

Ageless and immortality are the ones you pointed out to me and are the ones that were negated by Jesus' birth, life and death. How can what is fully divine die when the attribute of agelessness and immortality according to you did not change and was fully present?

Workch:
It’s no surprise that I am an atheist, but one thing people don’t know about me is that I was a Christian for 28years. Yes 28years.

I was not just a Christian, I had full membership in my church and was a member of the choir. I was born into a Christian home, we had morning and evening devotions everyday as a child. My dad personally tried indoctrinating us a lot, we read the Bible every single day and then he explains but seriously even as a child a lot of the stories didn’t add up but I was scared that I was being blasphemous.
I remember a day my dad was teaching us about Noah’s flood and then we got to that point where god said he’s using the rainbow as a sign to remind humanity that he would never destroy earth with flood. Even as a 9years old, that part didn’t make sense to me, because I see it in the news frequently of flood destroying farms, properties and even killing people. I asked my dad and he didn’t give me a reasonable explanation.
As a teenager, I started teaching Sunday school to kids in church, I taught them that god never change but in my mind, I wasn’t convinced because while reading the Bible, there many instances of god changing his mind and even regretting his decisions. I always think about it that the god of Old Testament seems different from what is portrayed in the New Testament, something changed. I kept a lot of things to myself because people around were so religious and would quickly rebuke me for such reasoning.
As time goes on, I joined the choir, I learn drums and keyboard, I sang choir ministrations and even wrote songs for my church choir. All these while, it wasn’t clear, I was just scared to come out fully.

I got admitted into the university to study biochemistry. Being someone that is very inquisitive, I started asking so many questions in respect to the relationship between living organisms. After having background knowledge in genetics, molecular biology and biological metabolism, it was clear that every living thing are the same basically. At this point, I didn’t even understand the theory of evolution properly but I had seen the a fairly clear picture. I had to go back and then study the theory of evolution properly (took weeks), because the impression I had from secondary school was that an ape turned into human. Our biology teachers, just like every other biology teachers in Nigerian schools, were so bad at teaching the theory of evolution. Seems like a lot of them didn’t even understand it.

Fast forward, I graduated, I still believed god existed. since after I properly studied the theory of evolution, I started holding the notion that God presided over evolution and the Bible is somehow consistent with the theory of evolution. This idea was born out of the sheer fear of not wanting to sound blasphemous to my beloved ones. After I graduated, I started reading wide, I didn’t like physics in school but I started reading physics (specifically quantum and astrophysics), I discovered about Big Bang theory, theory of relativity, string theory etc, it took a lot of time before I could grasp them but when I did, it became clearer that the Bible is not consistent with anything in reality.

It was difficult for me to accept this truth because I didn’t want to be seen as a blasphemer, not until I had the opportunity to run my masters degree abroad in clinical biochemistry. I met with lot of renown and brilliant people in the field of biochemistry. They were realistic in their beliefs and will not believe anything unless you can back it with evidence. I became bolder with time, we shared ideas as I studied. Th society gives everyone liberty and I was very free to come out clean with my realistic traits. A lot of my lecturers didn’t believe in god. I became a full fledged atheist in Europe by the time I finished my program.


Today, I have done several works and I still keep reading to find the truth, so far I haven’t seen anything consistent with the Christian God. I am back in Nigeria and trust me, I don’t have lot of friends for this reason. I have just two friends and they are both agnostic ( I made them agnostic because they are open minded and also brilliant Phd holders in biochemistry).

I scanned through this thread and I was just smiling all through. Though, it is time consuming to read word for word all as I do not even have the time, but I got the general gist.

Bro, too many insights in this thread. Hmmmm! Here are points for you:

1. Most religious people esp moslims and christians are zombies. Oh! I am a christian though. It is sad most don't even question the Bible. Nigerian christianity and Islam is something else. But I dont blame them. I know the reason after many years. And I really felt deeply pained when I discovered this truth.

2. Science , evolution, big bang theory, etc. are not complete too. There is more. The way God (I noticed you use "g" for Him....lol) works is mysterious. Hmmmm. I have a feeling that He will allow Jeff Bezos, Elon Musk and Richard Bradon build homes in the outer space this time. Do you know that this is the parable of the Babel Tower another attempt? And then, the game will change. I read it somewhere one moniker told you that Bing bang theory was actually theist theory but was hijacked. It is deep bro. God always use the plan of the enemy to fulfill prophesies. Just like the story of the death and resurrection of Jesus. Anyway, it doesn't make sense to the physical man. It's ok.

3. I passed through these stages too. The thing is that our Sunday school teachers dont know these things too. Our pastors too do not know.

4. Now, there is a NL who is an atheist, he is LordReed. It will be nice to share thoughts with him. Some months ago, he wrote that there seems to be in existence some gods. And I shouted "that's it". This man is getting it. He is hungry for the truth. Cos like me too, I did not want to throw away my childish memories too fast. I struggled hard to go against my background. And this same reason is why you opened this thread. You want to convince yourself that there is no God. You are looking for more answers. But these ignorant powerless christians will just start cursing you when they are in serious need of deliverance and help. Mumu people in bondage under their evil pastors. I pity most of them. If they are free, Nigeria will be prosperous. How can they say God is great and they know Him and they are lavishing in poverty. They cry on Sundays but they are still poor. Imagine. And they will be the first to shout hell fire. Mumu people.

5. Religious people will not help you. Rather, they will abuse you. I abused people too and I have been abused. But such strategy only hardens the heart. Meanwhile, just be soft hearted. The moment you are strong hearted, that's it. You will never discuss it again. That you opened this thread means you are not fully an atheist. You are still looking for answers.

Next Step
I am glad you are back to Nigeria. Hmm. Bro, if you can pick D.K. Olukoya genetically research papers (really I dont know how but I read mostly all through his office in Yaba, the research center there). Do you know D.K Olukoya? The enemy must die fire pastor. The pastor who brought "die by fire" to Nigeria. Now, how can a genetics expert who was trained in the UK (first class brain) with genetically papers published by science journals be a "die by fire" person and at the same time published accepted scientific papers about genes. You too know that all these you are saying are about genetical engineering and science. Science is the theory and revelation, while the engineering part is the practical and process of implenting it. Aging cause has been detected and engineers are working on it. Soon old age will be regarded as a disease. For a start research "Telomere and Aging". Perhaps you know it cos I see you are good in finding facts.

Bro, your answers are in the abstract. The next step is the one many of us took. The great Wole Soyinka took this path too. And I keep telling all that, you will abandon science bros if you take this path. You will. Lord Reed is about to, but may not be a christian. You will belong somewhere if you take the next step. However, the right way is the christian way if you can detect it. I know because I researched all other ways very well. I didnt fall into the traps the likes of Wole Soyinka fell. After promoting atheism for some parts of his youthful years, and he returned home, Wole became an ogun worshipper.

Take it easy. May the Lord direct your steps. Please, stop arguing with people here. It may not make sense but still say silent prayers to that God you feel doesn't exist now. It helps.

Bro, when you meet someone (a complete illiterate without access to technology or internet) who you know doesnt know your background, meet you the first time, and starts downloading your past and future, you will sit up. Where is big bang? When you see mysteries in Naija you will know. See, people are zombies to religion because there is power and mysteries in the traditional setting which used to oppress them. And it is not opened to all. Only tiny set of people have access to it. And they keep protecting it from the public. You mess with these set, they waste you. And majority have access to what can still protect them from these powers ....hmmmmm. they cannot have a reasoning brain. They will be a zombie to that savior. Go an learn about rural life in Naija. Find out from grassroot communities. You think say the likes of Ayo Fauose, the former Ekiti Gov who is a grassroot politician but always promoting his spiritual wife is a fo.ol? So, you think the likes of late Harry Akande, Dehinde Fernandez, Chinua Achebe, and the one who is still alive ...prof Wole Soyinka did not study deep like you? Did they not belong somewhere? Bro....you are a kid. Small kid no sabi juju (voodoo, he dey call am vegetsble)

Bro...soul traveling is real. That space Bezos, Musk, Bradson wasted billions of dollars to travel is an easy journey to high rank Benin travellers. Have you not heard of Benin Airways? Yet, you dey talk about big bang theory. Reporting physical in the spiritual is real. Your answers are in the abstract world. Forget the stories in the Bible which have been manipulated. The Bible was tampered with many times. Yet, the Bible is still the answer. You must know how to read it. Mysteries and codes are in it. The Bible is an open secret but many do not know how to unlock the gems in it. That's a story for another day. One of the real things is that book in the Ark of God. Bro....if you lay your hands on it, hahahahha. I know about it cos I have Jewish friends. Bro, follow Reno Omokri and you will start reading mysteries. The guy is travelling like me too. He went to Turkey and Isreal. See, I started travelling when my pastor said he gained so much in traveling. Na American white man oooo, no be Naija. Have you read the link of Isreal to Yoruba people? Ibo has a link too, but not the way these Ipob and useless threads on NL are promoting it. Bro, go and research who the real Queen of Shebbah who married King Solomon was.


Bros, a beg start history. Leave big bang for now. Combine history with it. Dont be a one sided person so you dont regret it later. Add history. Bro...you will be shocked. If possible visit your root. I always tell my British, American and Canadian friends always saying ...my daddy or mommy is Nigerian, I am Nogerian too. Na lie. FEM in the words of Davido. Which Nigerian are they? I have assisted some to find their way home despite these security crisis. See, nothing like insecurity in Nigeria if you know your way. Even as at this moment, the American govt is discouraging US citizens from visiting Nigeria. I laughed when a friend who is trying to get his Nigerian passport in the US but unsuccessful due to the corruption there, but also doesnt want to come without any passport cos he knows those in the airport at the point of entry are ma.d set of people will .ake life terrible for him. He wanted to take Nigerian visa on his American passport at least to visit, despite he went to tje US at 31 years and have stayed for close to 30 years there. In fact, this is what I always advise even Nigerians do. Travel home with the Nigerina visa on your foreign passport. And go report yourself to the embassy. Even you have the Nigerian passport, stop using it to travel to Nigeria. E get reason now.

Anyway dont let me bore you. Na experience a dey talk from. May God lead you to Himself again.

Goodluck sir!