Lukuluku69:


Paul is not only a Lawyer but a Liar too. He said that much about is lying prowess in the course of propagating his own version of the Gospel when he wrote that he lied to abound the glory of God.
He was the one that preached the Sonship of Jesus, Circumcision that God ordained for Abraham, he wrote that if anyone be circumcised, it is abominable.

He talked about Jesus without quoting him and the only time (twice) he did, there is no parallel or mention of it in the Four Canonical Gospel. He never met Jesus nor was he a disciple, yet Christians obeyed him more that those who learned at the feet of Jesus.

Was Peter deceived by Paul the “liar”?

2 Peter 3 v 15-16;
15 Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him.
16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction

OkCornel:


Was Peter deceived by Paul the “liar”?

2 Peter 3 v 15-16;
15 Bear in mind that our Lord’s patience means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him.
16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction

The question really is: why would the other disciples be afraid of Paul? Until a certain Barnabas intervened? Why are people who studied under Jesus not eat with the Gentiles? Not preach to the Gentiles until a certain Paul who was hibernating sometimes in Rome, sometimes in Arabia came along?

You see there is more to the story of Paul but I don't think you are ready to hear it

Paul was a Liar, a false Apostle who corrupted the beautiful Teaching of The Nazarene.

Lukuluku69:


The question really is: why would the other disciples be afraid of Paul? Until a certain Barnabas intervened? Why are people who studied under Jesus not eat with the Gentiles? Not preach to the Gentiles until a certain Paul who was hibernating sometimes in Rome, sometimes in Arabia came along?

You see there is more to the story of Paul but I don't think you are ready to hear it

Paul was a Liar, a false Apostle who corrupted the beautiful Teaching of The Nazarene.

Nah, none of the other Apostles were afraid of Paul neither do I believe Paul intentionally set out to deceive believers or distort the teachings of Christ.

My real grouse is with those who “canonised” the scriptures and left out the writings of other Apostles. Doesn’t really give a balanced view in my opinion…

Overwhelming inclusion of Paul’s letters when compared to the writings of other Apostles…

OkCornel:


Nah, none of the other Apostles were afraid of Paul neither do I believe Paul intentionally set out to deceive believers or distort the teachings of Christ.

My real grouse is with those who “canonised” the scriptures and left out the writings of other Apostles. Doesn’t really give a balanced view in my opinion…

Overwhelming inclusion of Paul’s letters compared to the writings of other Apostles…

The Disciples were afraid of Paul. Read the Acts very well Sir!

Paul's Letter got more mentions simply because his "own" version of events or if you like his own version of Christianity eventually won.

I have read Peter's reply to some of the issues Paul raided concerning the real Disciples of Christ and they are not palatable but they were all pared down and outrightly rejected by those who who canonized the Gospel.

In one reply, Paul was labelled Simon Magus!

Lukuluku69:


The Disciples were afraid of Paul. Read the Acts very well Sir!

Paul's Letter got more mentions simply because his "own" version of events or if you like his own version of Christianity eventually won.

I have read Peter's reply to some of the issues Paul raided concerning the real Disciples of Christ and they are not palatable but they were all pared down and outrightly rejected by those who who canonized the Gospel.

In one reply, Paul was labelled Simon Magus!

Nah...Paul isn't Simon Magus...plus I repeat, the disciples weren't afraid of Paul. Paul seemed to be the more vocal one though, going by his temperament.

I wouldn't imagine someone like Jude (the younger brother of Jesus) who has a razor sharp tongue or James (also the younger brother of Jesus and leader of the Jerusalem church) who is quite blunt in his letters be intimidated by Paul. It's laughable to be honest.

The dispute between Barnabas and Paul was over Mark...not necessarily doctrinal issues. Paul even had a change of mind on his position over Mark...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_fXHBNLHc6c

Ken Humphreys doing it

OkCornel:


Nah...Paul isn't Simon Magus...plus I repeat, the disciples weren't afraid of Paul. Paul seemed to be the more vocal one though, going by his temperament.

I wouldn't imagine someone like Jude (the younger brother of Jesus) who has a razor sharp tongue or James (also the younger brother of Jesus and leader of the Jerusalem church) who is quite blunt in his letters be intimidated by Paul. It's laughable to be honest.

The dispute between Barnabas and Paul was over Mark...not necessarily doctrinal issues. Paul even had a change of mind on his position over Mark...

I am not talking about intimidation here. By being "afraid" of Paul, the Disciples were only fearing for the Faith and the true interpretations of Jesus words. At that time no Jews can really intimidate each other moreso those of a nascent Faith.

They were afraid of Paul because of what he taught. His garbled and different teachings which was gaining ground among the Gentiles and Paul countered that with that famous Lying to abound the glory of God line. He questioned and reason that if what he taught were lies, why are people receptive to his own brand of the Gospel?

And Paul and Barnabas fell apart simply because Barnabas favoured preaching to Jews in diaspora while Paul prefer the Gentiles.

As a matter of fact, my own research showed that Paul was always paraphrasing the Jesus of the Gospel of Barnabas because Paul in all his Letters only quoted Jesus twice and those quotes can only be found in the Gospel of Barnabas and not the Canonized versions.

Lukuluku69:


I am not talking about intimidation here. By being "afraid" of Paul, the Disciples were only fearing for the Faith and the true interpretations of Jesus words. At that time no Jews can really intimidate each other moreso those of a nascent Faith.

They were afraid of Paul because of what he taught. His garbled and different teachings which was gaining ground among the Gentiles and Paul countered that with that famous Lying to abound the glory of God line. He questioned and reason that if what he taught were lies, why are people receptive to his own brand of the Gospel?

And Paul and Barnabas fell apart simply because Barnabas favoured preaching to Jews in diaspora while Paul prefer the Gentiles.

As a matter of fact, my own research showed that Paul was always paraphrasing the Jesus of the Gospel of Barnabas because Paul in all his Letters only quoted Jesus twice and those quotes can only be found in the Gospel of Barnabas and not the Canonized versions.

Can you help me with literature references from early church history shedding more light on the dispute between Paul & Barnabas which you earlier mentioned? (Paul favoring the gentiles above the Jews in the diaspora)

OkCornel:


Can you help me with literature references from early church history shedding more light on the dispute between Paul & Barnabas which you earlier mentioned? (Paul favoring the gentiles above the Jews in the diaspora)

This is my own Research now:

1. Go to the four Canons, list out the names of Jesus 12 Disciples

You will find out that the four never agreed on the exact names. You will notice that they agreed mostly on 10-11 names while they all had issues with the 12th name, which I believe was Barnabas.

2. From 1, you may want to ask why I zeroed on on Barnabas? It was on Barnabas words that Paul was admitted into the inner circle of the Disciples who were instructed to hold out at Jerusalem.

3. Download the Gospel of Barnabas and read (it won't kill nor bite) do it for knowledge sake and you will understand more about the rift between Paul and Barnabas.

For Barnabas to put in a word for Paul among the Disciples shows that he was someone very important amongst the Disciples

Lukuluku69:


This is my own Research now:

1. Go to the four Canons, list out the names of Jesus 12 Disciples

You will find out that the four never agreed on the exact names. You will notice that they agreed mostly on 10-11 names while they all had issues with the 12th name, which I believe was Barnabas.

2. From 1, you may want to ask why I zeroed on on Barnabas? It was on Barnabas words that Paul was admitted into the inner circle of the Disciples who were instructed to hold out at Jerusalem.

3. Download the Gospel of Barnabas and read (it won't kill nor bite) do it for knowledge sake and you will understand more about the rift between Paul and Barnabas.

For Barnabas to put in a word for Paul among the Disciples shows that he was someone very important amongst the Disciples

Cool, I'll have a look at the Gospel of Barnabas. I haven't explored the writings of other first century evangelists and early church fathers due to time constraint. But I'll have a look, and perhaps we create a thread to discuss this further...

But I still maintain...Paul did not intentionally set out to deceive anyone. We are pretty much seeing things circa 2,000 years after...so a lot of things might be lost in context...plus many other factors not considered etc...

On a side note, have you read the Didache?

OkCornel:
@Kobojunkie & Jesusjnr2020, I understand your point of view perfectly, which is not out of place at all.

As for Paul’s epistles, take your time to consider these points before concluding whether or not they are contradictions;

1. Target audience - Paul was a minister unto the gentiles. Each of whom had diverse cultures and different levels of understanding, unlike the Israelites and Samaritans. Furthermore, Paul’s letters were directed to address some peculiar issues in a church, which may not be an issue in another.

2. Paul’s Spiritual growth - You both can agree with me that your understanding of God improves and changes (for the better) over time.
Within the timeframe of Paul’s first letter (I’ll confirm the one he wrote first) and last letter (Timothy I think), there are things Paul learned and unlearned. These things ought to be considered. One example (not doctrinal though) was how his opinion on Mark (I think) changed from bad to good. Remember he had a bitter quarrel over Barnabas on this matter.

Look, none of the Apostles or church leaders were free from their flaws either in as much as they were genuine in heart and wholeheartedly walked with God. Peter was called out by Paul for hypocrisy at some point too, lol. Paul himself, a brilliant student of the law under Gamaliel…can be stubborn and be hot headed and very stubborn at times too…lol

3. Ultimately, it’s the Spirit of Truth that should be our ultimate teacher. The same spirit that empowered Jesus Christ to do the things he did.
1 John 2 v 26-27;
26 I am writing these things to you about those who are trying to lead you astray.
27 As for you, the anointing you received from him remains in you, and you do not need anyone to teach you. But as his anointing teaches you about all things and as that anointing is real, not counterfeit—just as it has taught you, remain in him.

1. Paul claimed to be a follower of Jesus Christ , and the mission given by Jesus Christ to every one of His followers, including Paul, is that we all go into the world(the unbelieving Jews and Gentiles) to teach the exact same Gospel, and Law of the Kingdom of God that Jesus Christ taught to us to all the unsaved. Paul had no special mission nor exemptions given to Him from the following of the New Covenant Law, Jesus Christ, as your pastors and mogs like to claim. The Law restricts us all to teaching only what is the Gospel, the Truth, using the name of Jesus Christ. Yet Paul’s letters contain less than 3% of the information on the teachings(and commandments) of Jesus Christ which make up the very Gospel we are meant to only teach in Jesus Christ's Name.

What is even more interesting is that the primary audience of most all of his epistles, were Jewish Christians, and not Gentiles.

2. Following your Spiritual growth theory there, are we then to conclude that you do submit that his letters contain contradictions and are hence not a reliable source for learning or perceiving the Gospel, Jesus Christ aka THE TRUTH of God?

The Gospels contain the Words of Jesus Christ, God's Truth since they directly quote Him of whose Word the promise is given that,"Heaven and Earth shall pass away but not a jot of God's Word and Law will pass away(or change to become a lie)". So why recommend letters that are laden with errors when Jesus Christ is the reliable source for God's Truth?

3. You are absolutely right that the Spirit of Truth aka Jesus Christ, is the one who we ought to seek all Truth from, He will never lead us to absorbing lies to begin with. So why even sit as a witness to Paul, or any of the Apostles, when you were instead called by Jesus Christ to be a witness for the Truth aka Jesus Christ?

OkCornel:


Cool, I'll have a look at the Gospel of Barnabas. I haven't explored the writings of other first century evangelists and early church fathers due to time constraint. But I'll have a look, and perhaps we create a thread to discuss this further...

But I still maintain...Paul did not intentionally set out to deceive anyone. We are pretty much seeing things circa 2,000 years after...so a lot of things might be lost in context...plus many other factors not considered etc...

On a side note, have you read the Didache?

Of course I have read the Didache and also every other "hidden" Books. The one they call the Apocrypha. Everyone of them (at least the one I come across)

I maintained that Paul set out to deceive from the onset. He was a typical Jew versed in the Scriptures but they who deliberately twist and mislead.

The Kinddom of God has been passed over his people and they would rather muddied everything and they others the part of damnation.

Read the Barnabas Account and let talk about it.

Lukuluku69:


Of course I have read the Didache and also every other "hidden" Books. The one they call the Apocrypha. Everyone of them (at least the one I come across)

I maintained that Paul set out to deceive from the onset. He was a typical Jew versed in the Scriptures but they who deliberately twist and mislead.

The Kingdom of God has been passed over his people and they would rather muddied everything and they others the part of damnation.

Read the Barnabas Account and let talk about it.

Would be an interesting discussion. Haven't studied those other books in detail as much as I would have wanted but...let's see how it goes.

Another question...the keys to the kingdom of heaven handed to Apostle Peter in Matthew 16 v 19, what's your take on this? What does it represent? Are the keys lost? misunderstood? or in the hands of believers today...

OkCornel:
Another question...the keys to the kingdom of heaven handed to Apostle Peter in Matthew 16 v 19, what's your take on this? What does it represent? Are the keys lost? misunderstood? or in the hands of believers today...

You mean the same Keys taught by Jesus Christ in His Gospel to every follower of His in even Matthew 25 vs 31 - 40 - Feed my sheep and tale care of my sheep?

Kobojunkie:
1. Paul claimed to be a follower of Jesus Christ , and the mission given by Jesus Christ to every one of His followers, including Paul, is that we all go into the world(the unbelieving Jews and Gentiles) to teach the exact same Gospel, and Law of the Kingdom of God that Jesus Christ taught to us to all the unsaved. Paul had no special mission nor exemptions given to Him from the following of the New Covenant Law, Jesus Christ, as your pastors and mogs like to claim. The Law restricts us all to teaching only what is the Gospel, the Truth, using the name of Jesus Christ. Yet Paul’s letters contain less than 3% of the information on the teachings(and commandments) of Jesus Christ which make up the very Gospel we are meant to only teach in Jesus Christ's Name.

Because they were specific to the challenges plaguing the newly established church in the various cities his epistles were directed to. Believers today are advised to draw lessons from these letters bearing in mind the historical and cultural context of the issues that were addressed in those churches.

Kobojunkie:

What is even more interesting is that the primary audience of most all of his epistles, were Jewish Christians, and not Gentiles.

I humbly disagree sir. If you check the salutations to various believers called by names towards the end of most of his epistles...these believers are gentiles. Epenetus, Ampliatus, Urbanus, Stachys, Aristobulus, Narcissus, Rufus, Asyncritus, Phlegon, Hermes, Patrobas, Hermas, Philologus, Julia, Nereus, Olympas ...all these names just in the book of Romans only...

Then of course, the Jews in the diaspora such as Andronicus and Junia... Paul's target audience was a mixed multitude of Jews and Gentiles, mostly gentiles though..

Kobojunkie:

2. Following your Spiritual growth theory there, are we then to conclude that you do submit that his letters contain contradictions and are hence not a reliable source for learning or perceiving the Gospel, Jesus Christ aka THE TRUTH of God?

Potentially (the jury is still out on this one).
Of course, Jesus Christ's teachings are ultimate...not Paul's...or any of the other Apostles.

Kobojunkie:

The Gospels contain the Words of Jesus Christ, God's Truth since they directly quote Him of whose Word the promise is given that,"Heaven and Earth shall pass away but not a jot of God's Word and Law will pass away(or change to become a lie)". So why recommend letters that are laden with errors when Jesus Christ is the reliable source for God's Truth?

My recommendation is...studying these letters with the Spirit of Truth to help one properly divide the word, rather than throw out the baby with the bath water. That's why I reiterated Peter's warning on Paul's epistles - 2 Peter 3 v 15-16, and why the Holy Spirit is the ultimate teacher (not man) - 1 John 2 v 26-27

Kobojunkie:

3. You are absolutely right that the Spirit of Truth aka Jesus Christ, is the one who we ought to seek all Truth from, He will never lead us to absorbing lies to begin with. So why even sit as a witness to Paul, or any of the Apostles, when you were instead called by Jesus Christ to be a witness for the Truth aka Jesus Christ?

Exactly. The Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth remains the ultimate standard and benchmark for Truth...

Kobojunkie:
You mean the same Keys taught by Jesus Christ in His Gospel to every follower of His in even Matthew 25 vs 31 - 40 - Feed my sheep and tale care of my sheep?

The keys that causes whatever is bound or loosed on earth...same would happen in heaven.

Matthew 16 v 19;
19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”

OkCornel:
1. Because they were specific to the challenges plaguing the newly established church in the various cities his epistles were directed to. Believers are advised to draw lessons from these letters bearing in mind the historical and cultural context of the issues that were addressed in those churches.

2. I humbly disagree on this. If you check the salutations to various believers called by names towards the end of most of his epistles...these believers are gentiles. Epenetus, Ampliatus, Urbanus, Stachys, Aristobulus, Narcissus, Rufus, Asyncritus, Phlegon, Hermes, Patrobas, Hermas, Philologus, Julia, Nereus, Olympas ...all these names just in the book of Romans only...

Then of course, the Jews in the diaspora such as Andronicus and Junia... Paul's target audience was a mixed multitude of Jews and Gentiles, mostly gentiles though..

3. Potentially (the jury is still out on this one).
Of course, Jesus Christ's teachings are ultimate...not Paul's...or any of the other Apostles.

4. My recommendation is...studying these letters with the Spirit of Truth to help you properly divide the word, rather than throw out the baby with the bath water. That's why I reiterated Peter's warning on Paul's epistles - 2 Peter 3 v 15-16, and why the Holy Spirit is the ultimate teacher (not man) - 1 John 2 v 26-27

5. Exactly. The Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth remains the ultimate standard and benchmark for Truth...

1. Newly established Churches? Such historical issues and contexts as? What are some of those issues that apply today in Non-Jewish territories?

2. Salutations at the end of his letters to a couple of gentiles doesn't change the fact that most all of his letters were addressed to a majorly Jewish audience. The many comparisons made in his letters of the Constitution of the Nation of Israel, the Law of Moses, to the doctrines he taught instead clearly outlines his reasons for addressing from to a majorly Jewish audience.

3. Paul's doctrines barely carries the details of the Gospel which is the Truth of God, the doctrines(and commandments) of Jesus Christ. If during his "spiritual growth" years, as you claim , you admit that Paul taught doctrines which could be considered inaccurate aka lies - since these teachings directly counter Jesus Christ- why do you insist the jury is still out on this?

4. Again, Peter's opinion of Paul's teachings don't change the fact which you yourself admit to, that Paul's letters do contain errors - lies - that do not correspond to Jesus Christ. Does the Spirit of Truth somehow specialize in turning these obvious lies into God's Truth?

5. Again, the Spirit of Truth is the Spirit of Jesus Christ, the one who is God's Truth and as He, Jesus Christ, explained of His Spirit in John 16, His Spirit will never lead you to that which contradicts Him. So, are you here insinuating you believe that which contradicts Jesus Christ and and Spirit of Jesus Christ is the reason for this on your part?

OkCornel:
2. The keys that causes whatever is bound or loosed on earth...same would happen in heaven.

Matthew 16 v 19;
19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”

Matthew 18 vs 18 - those very same keys, again, Jesus Christ handed to all of His followers, not just to Peter alone.

Kobojunkie:
1. Newly established Churches? Such historical issues and contexts as? What are some of those issues that apply today in Non-Jewish territories?

Fruit of the Spirit for example... Love, Joy, Peace, Self Control, etc

Kobojunkie:

2. Salutations at the end of his letters to a couple of gentiles doesn't change the fact that most all of his letters were addressed to a majorly Jewish audience. The many comparisons made in his letters of the Constitution of the Nation of Israel, the Law of Moses, to the doctrines he taught instead clearly outlines his reasons for addressing from to a majorly Jewish audience.

The Jews were just a section, most likely in the minority in the cities Paul's letters were addressed to. Your argument perhaps would have been valid if his letters were addressed to synagogues in the diaspora or addressed to the church at Jerusalem

Kobojunkie:

3. Paul's doctrines barely carries the details of the Gospel which is the Truth of God, the doctrines(and commandments) of Jesus Christ. If during his "spiritual growth" years, as you claim , you admit that Paul taught doctrines which could be considered inaccurate aka lies - since these teachings directly counter Jesus Christ- why do you insist the jury is still out on this?

The Spiritual growth theory applies to every believer. You believed in certain errors a decade ago, you've unlearned some of these, evolved and grow. Does it mean you intentionally set out to deceive anyone who preached to a decade ago with some the things you misunderstood? Same applies to Paul...(I would have included the other Apostles if they had as much letters included, you would see the same pattern at play)

Kobojunkie:

4. Again, Peter's opinion of Paul's teachings don't change the fact which you yourself admit to, that Paul's letters do contain errors - lies - that do not correspond to Jesus Christ. Does the Spirit of Truth somehow specialize in turning these obvious lies into God's Truth?

On the bolded part, perhaps you misunderstood my point. The purpose of the Spirit of Truth is to help you properly divide the Truth from errors, and personal opinions of the author of that scripture.

Kobojunkie:

5. Again, the Spirit of Truth is the Spirit of Jesus Christ, the one who is God's Truth and as He, Jesus Christ, explained of His Spirit in John 16, His Spirit will never lead you to that which contradicts Him. So, are you here insinuating you believe that which contradicts Jesus Christ and and Spirit of Jesus Christ is the reason for this on your part?

Refer to my response on point 4

Gracias

Kobojunkie:
Matthew 18 vs 18 - those very same keys, again, Jesus Christ handed to all of His followers, not just to Peter alone.

Ah...I see, good stuff.

OkCornel:
1. Fruit of the Spirit for example... Love, Joy, Peace, Self Control, etc

2. The Jews were just a section, most likely in the minority in the cities Paul's letters were addressed to. Your argument perhaps would have been valid if his letters were addressed to synagogues in the diaspora or addressed to the church at Jerusalem

3. The Spiritual growth theory applies to every believer. You believed in certain errors a decade ago, you've unlearned some of these, evolved and grow. Does it mean you intentionally set out to deceive anyone who preached to a decade ago with some the things you misunderstood? Same applies to Paul...(I would have included the other Apostles if they had as much letters included, you would see the same pattern at play)

4. On the bolded part, perhaps you misunderstood my point. The purpose of the Spirit of Truth is to help you properly divide the Truth from errors, and personal opinions of the author of that scripture.
Refer to my response on point 4
Gracias

1. What?

2. This isn't about a minority or section but instead who his letters were primarily addressed to. These letters weren't written to all inhabitants of the cities listed but instead particularly to Jewish Christians in them.

3. Decade?

Still on your Spiritual growth theory, if you admit that the information I relayed to you in past times were full of lies, why would you continue to consult those lies in search of Truth even today?

Can you weave Truth out of lies?

4. You want me to have the Spirit of Truth help me properly divide Truth from what He already revealed are lies and personal opinions in the letters of Paul?

Kobojunkie:
1. What?

2. This isn't about a minority or section but instead who his letters were primarily addressed to. These letters weren't written to all inhabitants of the cities listed but instead particularly to Jewish Christians in them.

3. Decade?

Still on your Spiritual growth theory, if you admit that the information I relayed to you in past times were full of lies, why would you continue to consult those lies in search of Truth even today?

Can you weave Truth out of lies?

4. You want me to have the Spirit of Truth help me properly divide Truth from what He already revealed are lies and personal opinions in the letters of Paul?

On point 2 - again, you miss the point. The Jews in the diaspora are not the significant chunk of the demography of the church in the cities outside of Israel.

On point 3, it’s my responsibility to diligently study the scriptures and consult with the spirit of truth, rather than accept your teachings blindly and wholeheartedly. I’d be skeptical and verify as the Berean Christians did before concluding on the matter.

On point 4, exactly…you need the spirit of truth and diligent research to filter out errors and personal opinions to get the unadulterated truth. Not just on Paul’s epistles, but every other canon of scriptures. Author’s errors and bias, translation errors etc.

OkCornel:


Would be an interesting discussion. Haven't studied those other books in detail as much as I would have wanted but...let's see how it goes.

Another question...the keys to the kingdom of heaven handed to Apostle Peter in Matthew 16 v 19, what's your take on this? What does it represent? Are the keys lost? misunderstood? or in the hands of believers today...

No key was handed to anyone. The key/s to the Kingdom of Heaven is doing obeying God's Commandments and being good to His Creatures.

Also the Term " Kingdom of God" has varied meaning chief among them is when it will be established on earth, how it will established and so on. The same Peter was called Satan by Jesus remember. Why would the Keys to God's Kingdom handed over to the one Jesus labelled Satan?

Tt

Lukuluku69:

He was the one that preached the Sonship of Jesus, Circumcision that God ordained for Abraham, he wrote that if anyone be circumcised, it is abominable.

This is just a wicked false accusation exactly like the type Jesus got from the Pharisees. And anyway you Muslims have more than proven that you are murderers just like the Pharisees.

For Mathew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter also confirmed His Sonship.

Because of he was a Lawyer, he could write A Law opinion (not legal opinion) on the Application, Scope, Jurisdiction, Execution, Exemptions and Law practice of The Law on Circumcision, the very same way Falana or I, or any qualified awyer would write about The Law abortion, marriage, divorce etc.

But of course, you Muslims must attack God in sight, whether it is Jesus o or Paul or the Bible, exactly like Satan, you must implement your evil minds.

Lukuluku69:

He talked about Jesus without quoting him and the only time (twice) he did, there is no parallel or mention of it in the Four Canonical Gospel.

How can there be a parallel when he is talking about The Law, to wit The Commandments, which all of you hate?

So, you are talking rubbish!

OkCornel:


Lol, don't bucket me with the others. The summary of my point is, I do not believe Paul intentionally set out to mislead anyone.

Rather, it's believers who more often than not misunderstand Paul's epistles...and Peter already warned Paul's letters could be tricky to understand.

And I am saying he misled no one, it is unlearned evil people who have bent his words to suit their evil desires and wishes!

Dtruthspeaker:


This is just a wicked false accusation exactly like the type Jesus got from the Pharisees. And anyway you Muslims have more than proven that you are murderers just like the Pharisees.

For Mathew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter also confirmed His Sonship.

Because of he was a Lawyer, he could write A Law opinion (not legal opinion) on the Application, Scope, Jurisdiction, Execution, Exemptions and Law practice of The Law on Circumcision, the very same way Falana or I, or any qualified awyer would write about The Law abortion, marriage, divorce etc.

But of course, you Muslims must attack God in sight, whether it is Jesus o or Paul or the Bible, exactly like Satan, you must implement your evil minds.



How can there be a parallel when he is talking about The Law, to wit The Commandments, which all of you hate?

So, you are talking rubbish!

Oga Ade calm down. Your Paul was a born liar. Read your Bible properly. He is with the Pharisees, he was a Pharisees, when he was with the Romans, he was a Roman. He was all and everything to the situation at hand.

And being a Lawyer back then simply means one who was versed in the Scriptures not your Falana or Gani as you want us believe.
He was the one who first preached the sonship of the Nazarene. Read your Bible again Paul himself said that much when he wrote that the Sonship thing was according to his own Gospel. Others didn't teach and when you find it in other Gospel later, it was an addition to fit what was in fashion.

He said he lied to abound the glory of God in Romans. He said that much. A Liar admitted to lying and here you are saying something else

Lukuluku69:


The question really is: why would the other disciples be afraid of Paul? Until a certain Barnabas intervened? Why are people who studied under Jesus not eat with the Gentiles? Not preach to the Gentiles until a certain Paul who was hibernating sometimes in Rome, sometimes in Arabia came along?

You saw it, Christ expressly said that His Bread" was for the children of the House, Mathew 15:24 until Acts 10, Cornelius, the not Jew" restated by Paul in Romans 1:16 "Salvation to the Jews first, then to the gentiles".

Yet you come to lie against him, whereas, you are the liar.

Lukuluku69:

Oga Ade calm down. Your Paul was a born liar. Read your Bible properly. He is with the Pharisees, he was a Pharisees, when he was with the Romans, he was a Roman. He was all and everything to the situation at hand.

He clearly said he was a Pharisee and a Roman, and did not hide it, so, nothing here.

Lukuluku69:

And being a Lawyer back then simply means one who was versed in the Scriptures not your Falana or Gani as you want us believe.

And if you had looked at the Scriptures with a reasonable eye, you would have seen that it is all about "THE LAW"! What you people will call "the Constitution" today.

So, nothing here.

Lukuluku69:

He was the one who first preached the sonship of the Nazarene. Read your Bible again Paul himself said that much when he wrote that the Sonship thing was according to his own Gospel. Others didn't teach and when you find it in other Gospel later, it was an addition to fit what was in fashion.

Go read again, Mathew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter were the first to say that Jesus, is The Son of God.

So you are wrong!

Lukuluku69:

He said he lied to abound the glory of God in Romans. He said that much. A Liar admitted to lying and here you are saying something else

Show the passage and see if it is not you who has a corrupted understanding of a simple thing everyone else has seen that there was no lie there.

Dtruthspeaker:


He clearly said he was a Pharisee and a Roman, and did not hide it, so, nothing here.



And if you had looked at the Bible with a reasonable eye, you would have seen that "the Scriptures" is "THE LAW" what you people will call "the Constitution".

So, nothing here.



Go read again, Mathew, Mark, Luke, John, Peter were the first to say that Jesus, is The Son of God.

So you are wrong!



Show the passage and see if it is not you who has a corrupted understanding of a simple thing everyone else has seen that there was no lie there.

For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?
-- Romans 3:7

Dtruthspeaker:


You saw it, Christ expressly said that His Bread" was for the children of the House, Mathew 15:24 until Acts 10, Cornelius, the not Jew" restated by Paul in Romans 1:16 "Salvation to the Jews first, then to the gentiles".

Yet you come to lie against him, whereas, you are the liar.

Salvation of God is for every of His creatures regardless of your ethnicity, tribe etc.

What Jesus came to preach is the coming Kingdom of God which according to him is at hand to the Jews.

He came to tell them they are to look out for it and he gave them signs of it's coming until a certain Paul came and get it all twisted.

He never came to die for anyone but to preach the coming Kingdom. The same Kingdom Daniel wrote about was what Jesus was a percussor.

And Jesus said : I am sent but to the Lost of the House of Israel and to be sure his 12 Disciples were all Jews. No be so?

Lukuluku69:


For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?
-- Romans 3:7

Romans 3 translated in ordinary Nigerian English.

1) "How is the Jew better than others? And what is the good of circumcision?

2) Answer: because it is to them that God, The Ruler of All, gave through them his Messengers.

3) So, if people do not believe, does it change anything?

4) No, it does not. Man is a liar but God is True.

5) If men being unrighteous (eg liars,) compliments God righteousness, are we going to say that God is unrighteous like us?(God, please forgive me, I am just speaking foolishly the way our stupid people talk)

6) God forbid! God is Always Righteous and therefore He has the right to condemn an unrighteous world.

7) for if the Truth of God is promoted through my lie, then why am I judged a sinner?

8 ) as some people even do say "let us do evil that good may come" (crazy )

9) So are jews better than the world? No, for we have all seen that whether Jew o, or whether Nigerian or whether Mohammedan, WE ALL SIN, THEREFORE WE ARE ALL GUILTY UNDER THE LAW OF SIN!

Its as simple as that!

No lie here. It is even rather that Paul proves that everyone one in the world is guilty of sin!

As you can see, he did not lie rather it is you who did not understand him as Peter warned.