I like how you gave a thorough context pertaining to the "why's" of the concept of judgment. This (and your other post) was written beautifully.

Emeraldicon:


“It is appointed that human beings die once, and after this the judgment” (Heb 9:27). The scriptures have made it abundantly clear that once you die comes judgement. This is a judgement between you and your creator. If your name is not found in the book of life you know immediately your destination. This judgement is what is refered to as individual judgement. At death the spirit is separated from the body and it's the soul that's judge immediately.

The final judgement will come when Christ returns, that's when the body and the soul will be reunited and the entire world will be judged.

. “There is nothing concealed that will not be revealed, nor secret that will not be known. Therefore whatever you have said in the darkness will be heard in the light, and what you have whispered behind closed doors will be proclaimed on the housetops” (Lk 12:2-3), Jesus warned. When the Lord comes again, St. Paul declared, “He will bring to light what is hidden in darkness and will manifest the motives of our hearts” (1 Cor 4:5).

Why must this reckoning be public? When we confess all the details of our lives before Christ and the rest of the human race, and when others do the same in our presence, we will all be forced to recognize and admit the full effects on others of what we have done and what we have failed to do. Justice requires such recognition and admission.

Yet mercy plays a role here as well. To face the truth and confess it, drinking the cup of shame all the way to its dregs before a watching world, will be a painful reckoning. But for the friends of God, it can serve as part of the purging process necessary to prepare them for heaven.

At the same time, on that day God’s friends will find it easier to forgive. As the full picture of their lives is unveiled, they will finally come to appreciate the struggles of those who offended them: the burdens they had to carry, the wounds they suffered from the sins of others and the limitations placed on them by circumstances hidden to view.

Another important consequence of this public judgment is that it will reveal to everyone the love and wisdom of God’s providence in all things. How many times in this life, when adversity tests us, are we tempted to wonder whether God really cares for us, or whether He truly knows what He’s doing? In the Last Judgment, we will be able to see all the factors in God’s determinations, all the aspects of His plan.

On that day we will be able to say to Him: “At last I understand; Your dealings with me finally make sense to me. When bad things happened, I needed faith to trust that You had not abandoned me. But now my faith has become sight.”

Justice demands that divine Providence be vindicated. The general judgment provides such vindication.

Just do a simple Google search about the two kinds of judgement and you can come to your conclusion if there are or not.

konamide:
■That is my understanding of the quoted verses. Before the death, burial and resurrection of Christ, there was no criteria for eternal judgement cos God's yardstick for judgement is Christ (John 5:22).
■So at the point of His death on the cross, He appeared to those in the grave at that time (hell- more like a reception for all that had died as at that time waiting for the time Jesus would be manifest as David described, "Thou shall not leave my soul in hades" in the book of Psalms. It was at that point in time that the saints were resurrected to life and the evil ones condemned.
■To his question, after the victory of Christ on the cross, once a man dies, he can now be judged cos the yardstick for eternal judgement is now available which John described in John 3:18: He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. I rest my case... May the Lord grant us understanding of His word by His Spirit...

1. If you considered that verse in the context of John 5 vs 19 - 29, you will find that Jesus Christ wasn't in fact speaking of His own death but of that of those who belong in His flock since it is the sheep that will hear the voice of the Shepherd, not the Shepherd Himself.

2. Peter, in 1 Peter 1 vs 19 20, records that Jesus Christ preached to the spirits that had been imprisoned from the time of Noah, so it is faulty reasoning to conclude by that that Jesus Christ went to all those who were in hell at the time of His death. So, what other scriptures back this claim of yours that Jesus Christ went to see persons such as David in the grave when He died?

3. If Jesus Christ is, as you say, the Judge, and the Judge Himself declared that there will be no judgment until He returns to judge the goats and sheep in His Kingdom, how can there be any judgment prior to that to come? I mean who is it to sit as a judge immediately after a person dies?

Kobojunkie:
1. If you considered that verse in the context of John 5 vs 19 - 29, you will find that Jesus Christ wasn't in fact speaking of His own death but of that of those who belong in His flock since it is the sheep that will hear the voice of the Shepherd, not the Shepherd Himself.

2. Peter, in 1 Peter 1 vs 19 20, records that Jesus Christ preached to the spirits that had been imprisoned from the time of Noah, so it is faulty reasoning to conclude by that that Jesus Christ went to all those who were in hell at the time of His death. So, what other scriptures back this claim of yours that Jesus Christ went to see persons such as David in the grave when He died?

3. If Jesus Christ is, as you say, the Judge, and the Judge Himself declared that there will be no judgment until He returns to judge the goats and sheep in His Kingdom, how can there be any judgment prior to that to come? I mean who is it to sit as a judge immediately after a person dies?

I am explaining the verses in context and not even talking about the forms or types of judgement.
1. I believe the verses were not referring to flocks with Jesus as the Shepherd. I am just explaining the verses mentioned in context:
The "dead" in the bible does not just mean physical seperation from the body as we know it but sometimes refers to the fallen state of man as God said to Adam concerning the forbidden fruit - eat and die but they didn't die physically.
So looking at the verses in context, the dead refers to the state of unbelief which is the fallen state of man but the moment anyone believes the word, He/she is given the life of Christ which was clear in verses 24 and 26.
Verse 25 had Jesus talking about that present time as concerning the dead (physically alive but without belief in Him as the Son of God) hearing and coming alive. Just to butress this point-
Ephesians 2:1- And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;
Ephesians 5:14- Wherefore he saith, Awake thou that sleepest, and arise from the dead, and Christ shall give thee light.
Verse 28 had Jesus talking about a time to come (which I believe happened at His death, burial and resurrection) where those who had died in the fallen state would have the opportunity to hear His voice same way those physically present did as at verse 25. This was the one I gave 1 Peter 3:19 to support as you asked in your second point.
2. I already gave my supporting verse (John 5:28) in the first point above but I would suggest reading from the verse 18 of 1 Peter 3.
3. There is a judgment that exists already if you look closely at the verses in context evening going back as far as John 3:13-19.
Jesus Christ is not just the expression of God's love but He is also the judgement of God as far as faith is concerned.
John 3:18- He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
John 5:24- Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
The moment a man refuses to believe in Jesus while He hears the word, He is condemened already which means He is already judged as far as eternity is concerned. This is a totally different conversation from that of judgments that would happen after rapture or when one dies physically.
Your faith or lack of it while you're physically alive is a judgment on its own.
I hope you get my point as regarding judgement now as I am not even talking about judgements of after physical death or when Jesus comes again even though your faith or lack of it while alive is the basis for those judgments that are to come.
May the Lord grant us understanding of His word even by His Spirit in Jesus name .

konamide:
■Verse 28 had Jesus talking about a time to come (which I believe happened at His death, burial and resurrection) where those who had died in the fallen state would have the opportunity to hear His voice same way those physically present did as at verse 25. This was the one I gave 1 Peter 3:19 to support as you asked in your second point. I already gave my supporting verse (John 5:28) in the first point above but I would suggest reading from the verse 18 of 1 Peter 3.
■ The moment a man refuses to believe in Jesus while He hears the word, He is condemened already which means He is already judged as far as eternity is concerned. This is a totally different conversation from that of judgments that would happen after rapture or when one dies physically. Your faith or lack of it while you're physically alive is a judgment on its own.
■ I hope you get my point as regarding judgement now as I am not even talking about judgements of after physical death or when Jesus comes again even though your faith or lack of it while alive is the basis for those judgments that are to come. May the Lord grant us understanding of His word even by His Spirit in Jesus name .

1. What is recorded in Peter's letter says nothing regarding the judgement expressed in John 5 vs 19 - 29, what the OP asked.

2. John 3 vs 16 - 21 speaks of the judgment that existed on all those He was sent to — the condemnation of sin which is death according to Deuteronomy 30 vs 15 - 20 — before Jesus Christ came into the picture. And yes, that is what is restated in the first parts of John 5 vs 19 - 29. However, what you claim in bold does not seem to compute at all given that Jesus Christ was quite clear that eternity only belongs to those who believe in Him. But here you suggest that those who don't believe in Jesus Christ are judged eternally suggesting they also acquire eternal life even though they do not believe at all. Basically, what you have said is that If Mr. A does not believe in Jesus Christ today, Mr. A still gets eternal life by virtue of being condemned eternally. Consequently, if Mr.A were to change his mind regarding Jesus Christ at a later date — he decides he believes in Jesus — since he has been eternally condemned, there is no hope for him in Jesus Christ.

3. I get what you are attempting to assert but I am saying this assertions aren't really supported by even the scriptures you quote.

Kobojunkie:
1. What is recorded in Peter's letter says nothing regarding the judgement expressed in John 5 vs 19 - 29, what the OP asked.

2. John 3 vs 16 - 21 speaks of the judgment that existed on all those He was sent to — the condemnation of sin which is death according to Deuteronomy 30 vs 15 - 20 — before Jesus Christ came into the picture. And yes, that is what is restated in the first parts of John 5 vs 19 - 29. However, what you claim in bold does not seem to compute at all given that Jesus Christ was quite clear that eternity only belongs to those who believe in Him. But here you suggest that those who don't believe in Jesus Christ are judged eternally suggesting they also acquire eternal life even though they do not believe at all. Basically, what you have said is that If Mr. A does not believe in Jesus Christ today, Mr. A still gets eternal life by virtue of being condemned eternally. Consequently, if Mr.A were to change his mind regarding Jesus Christ at a later date — he decides he believes in Jesus — since he has been eternally condemned, there is no hope for him in Jesus Christ.
3. I get what you are attempting to assert but I am saying this assertions aren't really supported by even the scriptures you quote.

You clearly don't understand my points so far especially with your reply to my second point. So, I would rest here:
What I meant with my statement is that if a man believes, He is saved from eternal condemnation and has eternal life but if he refuses to believe, he is condemned already which means he doesn't have eternal life.
That salvation (freedom) from condemnation based on his belief or outright condemnation based on unbelief is a judgment on it's own.

konamide:
■You clearly don't understand my points so far especially with your reply to my second point. So, I would rest here:
■What I meant with my statement is that if a man believes, He is saved from eternal condemnation and has eternal life but if he refuses to believe, he is condemned already which means he doesn't have eternal life.
■That salvation (freedom) from condemnation based on his belief or outright condemnation based on unbelief is a judgment on it's own.

1. I actually understand your points but what I am saying is that they are not buttressed by scripture.

2. In scripture, the condemnation of sin is Death which has been in existence long before Jesus Christ came into the picture is not eternal in nature -- it is of this world - Genesis 3 vs 19 . Also, something you miss is that all those who will end up in Hellfire when Jesus Christ returns and judges all also have eternal life and as such believe in Jesus Christ, meaning that believing in Jesus Christ does not preclude one from eternal damnation in Hellfire.

3. Jesus Christ said, "I have not come to condemn but to save". What you just said contradicts this that was said by Jesus Christ, does it not?

Eviana:
I like how you gave a thorough context pertaining to the "why's" of the concept of judgment. This (and your other post) was written beautifully.

Thanks. God bless you

Image123:


Okay Jo, thank you for teaching me.

Ha , teach Keh? I know you knew its just oversight