capnies:
■ THEY SLEEP WAITING FOR RESURRECTION

Resurrection as specified under what Covenant?

capnies:
■ THERE IS NOTHING LIKE HELL, FOR ANY HUMAN DON'T LISTEN TO THIS SADIST PASTORS WHO DON'T READ THE BIBLE. DO YOU KNOW THAT JESUS WENT TO HELL WHEN HE DIED.?

Jesus Christ said He was in the grave for 3 days.

Kobojunkie:
Where did God tell you ---before Jesus Christ and the Law of Moses showed up ---that everyone born after God's judgement against man would go?

In general speaking Gen. 3:19 is clear and simple. When humans die they return to dust or grave. But then the bible doesn't speak about a resurrection for babies. Nowhere in the bible indicates whether a bible will be resurrected. Whether the baby was given birth to, whether the baby died as still birth or whether a miscarriage. There's no need to be dogmatic. We leave the matter to God to decide if he will resurrect babies or not.

capnies:


THEY SLEEP WAITING FOR RESURRECTION

You are right. When humans die, they are in a dead sleep awaiting resurrection. No wonder Jesus compared the death of Lazarus to mean sleep.

LilBlaze24o:
■ In general speaking Gen. 3:19 is clear and simple. When humans die they return to dust or grave. But then the bible doesn't speak about a resurrection for babies. Nowhere in the bible indicates whether a bible will be resurrected. Whether the baby was given birth to, whether the baby died as still birth or whether a miscarriage. There's no need to be dogmatic. We leave the matter to God to decide if he will resurrect babies or not.

It seems you are not working your brain at all in this. Genesis 3 vs 19 - 24 clearly says they are returned to the dust i.e. they cease to exist. Since humans are not created with Eternal Life(also known as an afterlife) they cease to exist when they die. Once they die and that breath of life leaves, a man is nothing but dust. Look again.

16 Then God said to the woman, “I will cause you to have much trouble when you are pregnant. And when you give birth to children, you will have much pain.
You will want your husband very much, but he will rule over you.”
17 Then God said to the man, “I commanded you not to eat from that tree. But you listened to your wife and ate from it. So I will curse the ground because of you. You will have to work hard all your life for the food the ground produces.
18 The ground will grow thorns and weeds for you. And you will have to eat the plants that grow wild in the fields.
19 You will work hard for your food until your face is covered with sweat. You will work hard until the day you die, and then you will become dust again. I used dust to make you, and when you die, you will become dust again.”
20 Adam named his wife Eve. He gave her this name because Eve would be the mother of everyone who ever lived.
21 The Lord God used animal skins and made some clothes for the man and his wife. Then he put the clothes on them.
22 The Lord God said, “Look, the man has become like us—he knows about good and evil. And now the man might take the fruit from the tree of life. If the man eats that fruit, he will live forever.”
23 So the Lord God forced the man out of the Garden of Eden to work the ground he was made from.
24 God forced the man to leave the garden. Then he put Cherub angels and a sword of fire at the entrance to the garden to protect it. The sword flashed around and around, guarding the way to the Tree of Life. - Genesis 3 vs 16 - 24

Read again what God said after declaring how death was to come on man in verse 19. Man never had eternal life from His beginning. So how could he continue in the grave if he had no afterlife/Eternal life to begin with?

Kobojunkie:
It seems you are not working your brain at all in this. Genesis 3 vs 19 - 24 clearly says they are returned to the dust i.e. they cease to exist. Since humans are not created with Eternal Life(also known as an afterlife) they cease to exist when they die. Once they die and that breath of life leaves, a man is nothing but dust. Look again.
Read again what God said after declaring how death was to come on man in verse 19. Man never had eternal life from His beginning. So how could he continue in the grave if he had no afterlife/Eternal life to begin with?

I did agreed with you. Humans die, they cease to exist, they return to grave or dust.

But then the bible holds a resurrection hope of those who are in the grave.

LilBlaze24o:
■ I did agreed with you. Humans die, they cease to exist, they return to grave or dust.

But then the bible holds a resurrection hope of those who are in the grave.

In Scripture, a resurrection(Eternal Life) is only promised by God to those under Covenant with Him, those who have been certified righteous according to the standard that is His Law(of Moses for instance). So how do you go about proclaiming resurrection for a dead newborn or even a stillborn, born outside of God's agreement?

Again, I urge you to look closely, and digest carefully, what God said in Genesis 3 vs 16 - 24.

LilBlaze24o:
■ You are right. When humans die, they are in a dead sleep awaiting resurrection. No wonder Jesus compared the death of Lazarus to mean sleep.

Lazarus was an Israelite born under the Law of Moses and described as one loved by Jesus Christ and if you visit John 15 vs 1 - 14, you will find that it is the righteous that are loved by Jesus Christ. Are all humans like Lazarus?

No! As thou slowest so thou shalt reap... No man dies for another man's sin.

Kobojunkie:
In his book, The Descent of Man, Charles Darwin wrote : “Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge.”

Regurgitating the same foolish narrative fed to you by religious folks doesn't impress me at all. Crafting questions based on them... irritating. Go back through the book for your own self, read, and gain an understanding of what is in fact detailed. Then we can meaningfully dissect these things.

Saying God ordering people to murder other people is me regurgitating narratives. But, i see you barking somewhere just now, that you state the bible as is without "interpretation magic", or whay was it you used?

You can't explain why such an other exist from a loving god. But, you must find a way to appease, the cognitive dissonance. Even sprinkle a few lies here and there.

kkins25:
■ Saying God ordering people to murder other people is me regurgitating narratives. But, i see you barking somewhere just now, that you state the bible as is without "interpretation magic", or whay was it you used?
You can't explain why such an other exist from a loving god. But, you must find a way to appease, the cognitive dissonance. Even sprinkle a few lies here and there.

Cognitive dissonance seems more like what you keep battling with there as your many attempts at discussing scripture leave me wondering if you are on something.

You are told "God is Love" implying that everything God does is done out of love, after all, God is Love. What does this mean? It means even when God sent the snakes to kill the complainers among the children of Israel, it was God's Love in action.

4 The Israelites left Mount Hor and traveled on the road that goes to the Red Sea. They did this to go around the country of Edom. But the people became impatient.
5 They began complaining against God and Moses. The people said, “Why did you bring us out of Egypt? We will die here in the desert! There is no bread and no water! And we hate this terrible food!”
6 So the Lord sent poisonous snakes among the people. The snakes bit the people, and many of the Israelites died.
7 The people came to Moses and said, “We know that we sinned when we spoke against the Lord and against you. Pray to the Lord. Ask him to take away these snakes.” So Moses prayed for them.
8 The Lord said to Moses, “Make a bronze snake and put it on a pole. If anyone is bitten by a snake, that person should look at the bronze snake on the pole. Then that person will not die.”
9 So Moses made a bronze snake and put it on a pole. Then when a snake bit anyone, that person looked at the bronze snake on the pole and lived. - Numbers 21 vs 4 - 9

Yes, those snakes were sent by love to destroy those people. Why you have yet to grasp this is beyond me. Why you then think it sensible to attack me for casting down the bold lies you formulate instead is also beyond me,

---

God is Love. The features of Love are all that God does.
▪︎ When God created man, that was love in action
▪︎ When God cursed man after he rejected God's Original plan, that was love in action
▪︎ When God denied man eternity, and let him go fend for himself on this here world, that was love in action
▪︎ when God killed the firstborn of Egypt, that was love in action
▪︎ When God drowned Pharaoh's army in the sea, that was love in action
▪︎ When God killed over 10,000 Israelites in one day out in the desert, that was love in action
▪︎ When God constituted the Nation of Israel and ratified the Law He gave as the National Constitution of the Jewish state in the Land of Israel, that was love in action
▪︎ When God commanded the annihilation of the enemies of the nation of Israel,that was love in action
.....
▪︎ When God sent two bears to maul 42 boys who stood against His prophet, a message to all in the land of israel, that was love in action
....
I can go on and on but the long and short of this is God is Love and so everything God does is love.

Kobojunkiee:


Cognitive dissonance seems more like what you keep battling with there, as your many attempts at discussing scripture leave me wondering if you are on something.

From what I read down there, I'm also starting to wonder same, kobo.

You are told....

by whom? I ask because I certainly know the bible is not univocal, so "God is love" has nothing to do with Old Testament. This is when you put words in the author's mouth, kobo. Plus, as you've told me in the past,

" I have never said your Bible is the Word of God. Never once!"

I'll advise we take the "bible" to court since it has gotten to the extent that you have to cut and join pieces of it, for it to make sense.

God is Love..
I can go on and on, but the long and short of this is God is Love, and so everything God does is love.

Then, it also means, I now have to demand for you definition of "love." https://www.nairaland.com/6956257/why-people-believe-god-even/4#117566129

I'm trying to understand what this means in my small unkwoledgable head. If I beat my wife to a stupor, can I equally claim that she didn't do as instructed or she offended me; hence, I beat her out of love?

Why is this important? Having witnessed and survived the dangers of religion, I have to be very wary of anyone who claims to understand the same faith, even if it is in a different light. Some believe women are lesser than men, like Paul, and make laws in society that stops women from getting political offices, and what have you. Do you see my point? If you believe God commits this atrocities out of love, then, how do i know you won't wake up one morning, pick a rifle, enter my home, and claim "God said I should kill you"? If God can do it in the past, what's stoping him from doing it now? If daddy G.O says God says he should take tithes and buy cars, on what grounds do you have to call his bluff?

kkins25:
■ From what I read down there, I'm also starting to wonder same, kobo. by whom? I ask because I certainly know the bible is not univocal, so "God is love" has nothing to do with Old Testament. This is when you put words in the author's mouth, kobo. Plus, as you've told me in the past, I'll advise we take the "bible" to court since it has gotten to the extent that you have to cut and join pieces of it, for it to make sense.

■ Then, it also means, I now have to demand for you definition of "love." https://www.nairaland.com/6956257/why-people-believe-god-even/4#117566129 ...

Stop posting gibberish! It is annoying!

2. What do you think God is love means?

Kobojunkiee:
Stop posting gibberish! It is annoying!

2. What do you think God is love means?

I asked you first. Logic isn't gibberish.

kkins25:
■ I asked you first. Logic isn't gibberish.

I don't see the logic in any of what you stated though.

Again, you are told God is love yet you came back asking me to define love. No be damage be that?

Kobojunkiee:
I don't see the logic in any of what you stated though.

Again, you are told God is love yet you came back asking me to define love. No be damage be that?

I know there's something calles simile,juat like men are pig, doesn't make men pigs does it... What is love? Then, do you understand love from God's point of view or yours?

kkins25:
■ I know there's something calles simile,juat like men are pig, doesn't make men pigs does it... What is love? Then, do you understand love from God's point of view or yours?

The statement God is love implies that He is the embodiment of that which is called Love. Everything He does and says is love. So, what part of this are you struggling to wrap your mind around abeg?

Kobojunkiee:
The statement God is love implies that He is the embodiment of that which is called Love. Everything He does and says is love. So, what part of this are you struggling to wrap your mind around abeg?

Why is it so difficult, on your part, to define what love is. If God is love, did God tell you that himself, or you read it somewhere.

kkins25:
Why is it so difficult, on your part, to define what love is..

God is Love! That is the definition that is given to you. He is the standard that is love so anything that falls short of God is not love.

Kobojunkiee:
God is Love! That is the definition that is given to you.

No. Please, don't miseducate me. That is an attribute ascribed to god. Not the definition of love. Plus, FYI, I don't take in what's given to me without X-raying it first. If not, I'll be in one cele church shouting "holi Micheal, wa lo da, baba wa lo da re"

kkins25:
■ No. Please, don't miseducate me. That is an attribute ascribed to god. Not the definition of love. Plus, FYI, I don't take in what's given to me without X-raying it first. If not, I'll be in one cele church shouting "holi Micheal, wa lo da, baba wa lo da re"

In Scripture, God is set as a Standard.

For instance, the command "Be ye Holy even as God is Holy" suggests that Holiness is as defined by God Himself. Yes, they are attributes but they also set God as the standard for each of those attributes. These ideas are as specified in His Law which is the contract He makes with men. So if you are looking for a dictionary meaning of love here, then stop wasting your own time.

Kobojunkiee:
In Scripture, God is set as a Standard.

For instance, the command "Be ye Holy even as God is Holy" suggests that Holiness is as defined by God Himself. Yes, they are attributes but they also set God as the standard for each of those attributes.

This is abstract. To make such a claim, you have to assume that

1) Your concept of Holiness is the same as that of God.
2) You understand God to be completely holy from having observed him from time immemorial.
3) That whatever God does, is counted as holy, irrespective of the pain or contrasting view of others.

What's you're saying is, according to scripture, no matter what actions are performed by God, God is holy. Then, this posses even greater room for greater philosophical questions:
1)Does God count himself holy?
2) Since the scripture is the handy work of man,don't you agree that there might be "holiness" bias?
2) What is holiness, and that word was coined based on who's perception of reality?
3) Is God actually GOD? Or is God GOD to a particular group of people who deem him GOD even if they admit the existence of other Gods who also deem themselves GODs?
4) Among the Gods, is this particular God considered holy? that will take us back to boldened questions asked earlier on.

These ideas are as specified in His Law which is the contract He makes with men. So if you are looking for a dictionary meaning of love here, then stop wasting your own time.

More questions, what contract? with which men? Certainly not me. Certainly not 99.9% of the jews who have never heard God or seen him as we are reminded by James the just. What we have are documents written by a handful of people, rewritten by another hand full of people, to push a narrative that is based on their capabilities to understand and interpret life. Why then must I make such a bold claim, that "According to scripture"? Is Scripture the breath of God? or just the ink of men? Tell me.

kkins25:
■ This is abstract. To make such a claim, you have to assume that
1) Your concept of Holiness is the same as that of God.
2) You understand God to be completely holy from having observed him from time immemorial.
3) That whatever God does, is counted as holy, irrespective of the pain or contrasting view of others.

What's you're saying is, according to scripture, no matter what actions are performed by God, God is holy. Then, this posses even greater room for greater philosophical questions:
1)Does God count himself holy?
2) Since the scripture is the handy work of man,don't you agree that there might be "holiness" bias?
2) What is holiness, and that word was coined based on who's perception of reality?
3) Is God actually GOD? Or is God GOD to a particular group of people who deem him GOD even if they admit the existence of other Gods who also deem themselves GODs?
4) Among the Gods, is this particular God considered holy? that will take us back to boldened questions asked earlier on.

Has anyone ever informed you before that you like to argue meaninglessly?

You are told by God that you must be Holy even as He is Holy and this is the best you could come up with in terms of a rebuttal? Yuck!

Kobojunkiee:
Has anyone ever informed you before that you like to argue meaninglessly?

You are told by God that you must be Holy even as He is Holy and this is the best you could come up with in terms of a rebuttal? Yuck!

Argue meaninglessly? here you are again, claiming that the words written in the bible are the words of God. This contrasts arguments you made in the past..

Kobojunkiee:
I have never said your Bible is the Word of God. Never once!

So tell me, kobo, how can you say, "You are told by God..." Did you Ghostwrite the bible, or were you the angel that inspired its authorship? I never heard God. So why do you want to procaim on my behalf that i was told by God?

You shapeshift on several occasions to justify your arguments. That's why I often bring up cognitive dissonance, because, it marvels me how you're able to repress the trauma from holding onto contrasting views like "God said" and "According to the scriptures as portrayed by the authors."

Aren't you being a hypocrite when you accuse me of regurgitating what I've been about biblical doctrines? Especially when you justify the same atrocities of God that won Hitler the title of a maniac with "God is Love."

Come on, kobo, if anyone is looking like a man with a white face and red nose, it's most certainly you.

kkins25:
■ Argue meaninglessly? here you are again, claiming that the words written in the bible are the words of God. This contrasts arguments you made in the past..
■ So tell me, kobo, how can you say, "You are told by God..." Did you Ghostwrite the bible, or were you the angel that inspired its authorship? I never heard God. So why do you want to procaim on my behalf that i was told by God?

In the book, the character who those words are attributed to and who is said to have spoken them is God, so what is wrong in saying "you are told by God"? You really like arguing meaninglessly.

If you don't want to believe that in fact the Words are the words written are the words of the God of Israel, that is fine by me but stop asking these stewpid questions.

3. Some of us quote Superman and the Hulk in our daily lives yet you choose to have a stick up your arse when I say , as is written in a book, "God said "? Again, enough with the stewpid nonsense!

Sweetvie:

The movie gave me goosebumps and a whole new Vista to the fate of unborn and new born babies in the afterlife when they die.
You should watch it.

Boo3nity:
■ The movie gave me goosebumps and a whole new Vista to the fate of unborn and new born babies in the afterlife when they die. You should watch it.

Who gives babies an afterlife?