which one be rates drop to 7percent again... hope this is a joke?

These are my questions.

1. What could have caused the decline in the rates of NTB? - Demand for NTBs.
2. Can it (the rates) go up again in the nearest future and how soon? - Anything is possible but unlikely in the near term.

Magnifico2000:


The rates are really going down or is it me that have't been following the recent trends on treasury bills?

I did 2 separate bills around july for 83 and 76days tenor respectively. The rates were around 15%. Although there was a time i saw that particular tenor around 16% but i felt the rates were still going to increase but I guess i was wrong. Thank God i eventually made up my mind to go with the 15% rate.

These are my questions.

1. What could have caused the decline in the rates of NTB?
2. Can it (the rates) go up again in the nearest future and how soon?

Thanks.

Please I need some clarification on here, i invested on tbills @firet Bank. 200,000. @ 16% for 106 days. Please I want to know what my interest will be at the end of 106 days.. Principal and interest was rollover.
I nerd some help here sir.

skydiver01:
These are my questions.

1. What could have caused the decline in the rates of NTB? - Demand for NTBs.
2. Can it (the rates) go up again in the nearest future and how soon? - Anything is possible but unlikely in the near term.

The major reason for the decline in the rates of Tbills is the fact that CBN wants to cut down the rate, I mean we all saw it coming when the offered savings bonds at 13%, going forward there is the likelihood they would focus more on project targeted Bonds just like the last one for road development.

djemmy101:
Please I need some clarification on here, i invested on tbills @firet Bank. 200,000. @ 16% for 106 days. Please I want to know what my interest will be at the end of 106 days.. Principal and interest was rollover.
I nerd some help here sir.

9318.68 naira

JBM:
Hello house,

How do I buy a treasury bill if there is no branch of my bank close to me and what is the minimum tenure?

Thank you

90 days.
you may need to open another account in any bank nearest to you (FBN, maybe) and transfer your money there. A Savings account will suffice.

djemmy101:
Please I need some clarification on here, i invested on tbills @firet Bank. 200,000. @ 16% for 106 days. Please I want to know what my interest will be at the end of 106 days.. Principal and interest was rollover.
I nerd some help here sir.

Interest = 200,000*(106/365)*16% = 9293 naira

emmanuelewumi:


Try Stanbic, my bank ie First Bank does not allow one to determine his or her rate. But there rates are not bad.

Instead of my matured Treasury Bills to be in my account pending the time Lafarge WAPCO and Flour Mills right offer come up, I decided to make the money work hard for another 56 days.

One may still get the spillover of what I bought, because as at the time I bought from the secondary market over N500 million worth was available.

Pls explain the larfarge stuff, I'll love to learn more

ekunade:


Pls explain the larfarge stuff, I'll love to learn more

It is beyond the scope of this thread.

festobit:

I visited a FirstBank branch close to me to do treasury bill

I filled two forms for tbill
One for 180 days and the other 91 days.

After three days my account was deducted but the interest rate was not paid to my account as they deducted the full money.

It's almost two weeks now and I have been going to the bank, they are yet to credit me with the interest neither did they send me any email regarding the tbill I did.

I was still there on Friday and they said they would put up a memo on it.

Please is this normal or is there a fraud case here. Being a newbie, I am counting on your experience to know what to do.

I don't even know what the interest rate is or even the maturity date. I don't have any information as regards the transaction. I only know my account was deducted.

I await your urgent responses.

Thank you

UPDATE ON MY ORDEAL AT FBN TBILL

I was at the bank on Monday and demanded for my proof of investment. The guy in charge told me he would do a memo to head office and I should check back on Tuesday.

I was busy all through the week and called today to find out what was going on. When I got there I was told that interest has been paid into my account.

Here is the strange things I was confronted with
1. My money was deducted on the 19th October 2017 but on the proof of investment form given to me, the effective date was 2nd November 2017.
My question is what happened to my money since 19th October and where was is it kept. Again to the pros in the house, is this normal and if not, what do I do?

2. For the 91days investment, I was given 13% rate. While for the 182days, I was given 15.1% rate. Now my question is I thought the primary rate should be higher and not this ridiculous. I challenged the guy and he said the rate is fixed by CBN, now my worry is do CBN gives different banks different rate for a primary offer?

3. They also wrote on my proof of investment that my interest is subject to the following charges:
a. 0.125% commission
b. 0.10% per transaction per investment
c. 100naira transaction fee per transaction per investment
d. 5% VAT on commission, custody fee and transaction fees.

Please nairalanders pros in the treasury bill, all these ordeals of mine, are they normal? Because deep within me I feel those guys at FirstBank are cheating me and I want to be well advised before I take actions.

I have not done a treasury bill before, this is my first time and I did because of what you guys were posting here. So please do not ignore a brother in need of knowledge. Kindly look at my post and advise via comment.

Thank you

Ojugunrege:


90 days.
you may need to open another account in any bank nearest to you (FBN, maybe) and transfer your money there. A Savings account will suffice.

Do not go to FirstBank ooo.
My experience with them currently is a bad one.
Maybe another bank.
Read my thread before deciding on Firstbank.

emmanuelewumi:


It is beyond the scope of this thread.

then please kindly open another thread for it and enlighten us more..no knowledge is a waste..am also interested.

eanestca:


The major reason for the decline in the rates of Tbills is the fact that CBN wants to cut down the rate, I mean we all saw it coming when the offered savings bonds at 13%, going forward there is the likelihood they would focus more on project targeted Bonds just like the last one for road development.

My problem with you professionals here on nairaland is that you make ambiguous statements to simple questions that always end up confusing newbies like us.

Please always try to answer questions in clear terms so some of us can follow.

Are u implying that Tbill is no longer attractive and that investors should become cautious.

Also, is it true that the secondary tbill has more risk than the primary and if yes what are they and how can they be overcomed?

feelamong:
TREASURY BILL AUCTION 1/11/2017


91 DAYS ----13.1%

182 DAYS -----15.20%

364 DAYS -----15.6%

Please check my recent post in relation to what you posted here and comment.

Why would my money be deducted and kept for more than two weeks before it was then invested. Is this normal?

festobit:


UPDATE ON MY ORDEAL AT FBN TBILL

I was at the bank on Monday and demanded for my proof of investment. The guy in charge told me he would do a memo to head office and I should check back on Tuesday.

I was busy all through the week and called today to find out what was going on. When I got there I was told that interest has been paid into my account.

Here is the strange things I was confronted with
1. My money was deducted on the 19th October 2017 but on the proof of investment form given to me, the effective date was 2nd November 2017.
My question is what happened to my money since 19th October and where was is it kept. Again to the pros in the house, is this normal and if not, what do I do?

2. For the 91days investment, I was given 13% rate. While for the 182days, I was given 15.1% rate. Now my question is I thought the primary rate should be higher and not this ridiculous. I challenged the guy and he said the rate is fixed by CBN, now my worry is do CBN gives different banks different rate for a primary offer?

3. They also wrote on my proof of investment that my interest is subject to the following charges:
a. 0.125% commission
b. 0.10% per transaction per investment
c. 100naira transaction fee per transaction per investment
d. 5% VAT on commission, custody fee and transaction fees.

Please nairalanders pros in the treasury bill, all these ordeals of mine, are they normal? Because deep within me I feel those guys at FirstBank are cheating me and I want to be well advised before I take actions.

I have not done a treasury bill before, this is my first time and I did because of what you guys were posting here. So please do not ignore a brother in need of knowledge. Kindly look at my post and advise via comment.

Thank you

Nothing went wrong with your money. FBN deduct funds immediately you make your request.. Infact if money is not in your account at the point you are making the request, it is as good as void. That said, It seem your request was for primary market.

A request made on the 19/10 was already late for primary market investment the next date was 2/11 which you got. The rates given to you are not bad considering the CBN rates posted here yesterday.

I hope this clear your doubts....

festobit:


UPDATE ON MY ORDEAL AT FBN TBILL

I was at the bank on Monday and demanded for my proof of investment. The guy in charge told me he would do a memo to head office and I should check back on Tuesday.

I was busy all through the week and called today to find out what was going on. When I got there I was told that interest has been paid into my account.

Here is the strange things I was confronted with
1. My money was deducted on the 19th October 2017 but on the proof of investment form given to me, the effective date was 2nd November 2017.
My question is what happened to my money since 19th October and where was is it kept. Again to the pros in the house, is this normal and if not, what do I do?

2. For the 91days investment, I was given 13% rate. While for the 182days, I was given 15.1% rate. Now my question is I thought the primary rate should be higher and not this ridiculous. I challenged the guy and he said the rate is fixed by CBN, now my worry is do CBN gives different banks different rate for a primary offer?

3. They also wrote on my proof of investment that my interest is subject to the following charges:
a. 0.125% commission
b. 0.10% per transaction per investment
c. 100naira transaction fee per transaction per investment
d. 5% VAT on commission, custody fee and transaction fees.

Please nairalanders pros in the treasury bill, all these ordeals of mine, are they normal? Because deep within me I feel those guys at FirstBank are cheating me and I want to be well advised before I take actions.

I have not done a treasury bill before, this is my first time and I did because of what you guys were posting here. So please do not ignore a brother in need of knowledge. Kindly look at my post and advise via comment.

Thank you

I think point 2 and 3 are applicable to everyone. For primary offers, no one (not even your bank manager) knows exactly the CBN rates until the D-day. What banks do is to make their individual biddings based on market projections. CBN will only sell, for instance a 364-day bills worth $50 billion at an "unknown rate", the best you or your bank can do is to make a projection (guess), e.g. 13.1% and if successful, you get an interest rate of 13.1% (even if CBN eventually announces a rate of 20%).

CBN announces rates after bidding, so again, if your bank overstate a rate beyond CBN offer, your principal would be returned.

I also applied for the 364-day tenor at Sterling bank on Tuesday. I could not state my preferred rate (15.5%) cos the bank clearly informed me that I have to go with whatever the bank bids for all customers (15%). By the time CBN released the results on Wednesday, 364-days bills was sold at 15.6%. So you see I lost .6%.



Disclaimer: Don't accept the above info completely until you hear from the gurus in the house.

courage89:


Interest = 200,000*(106/365)*16% = 9293 naira

I see you o

festobit:


My problem with you professionals here on nairaland is that you make ambiguous statements to simple questions that always end up confusing newbies like us.

Please always try to answer questions in clear terms so some of us can follow.

Are u implying that Tbill is no longer attractive and that investors should become cautious.

Also, is it true that the secondary tbill has more risk than the primary and if yes what are they and how can they be overcomed?

oga if u are here to learn pls watch ur diction. improper use of words could turn around to hunt u.

besides people here volunteered to assist, u r not paying anyone.

to answer ur question, rates are going down, earlier in the year we were getting 18% while the going rates now is around 15%. then to ur questions on primary and secondary market, read from page 1 -10 of this thread. its clear u don't understand TB.

RealityShot:

65,681.81 from where?

he got 68,000 interest..
they say 25% FLAT CHARGE on INTEREST EARNED.

No LOSS here.

Who says?

The 25% flat rate charge is PENALTY for terminating it at all.
He was paid N68,000 upfront believing that he would not terminate it till maturity but after 6 days, he terminated it. He MUST also refund the excess up front he collected which when pro rated gives (N68000/170days) × (170-6)days which gives the N65,681.81.
If you were you to be correct that "NO LOSS HERE" Then I can always buy NTB of 364-day tenure today and opt out the second day and run away with whole of the up front interest meant for 364days and pay back only 25% of the up front meant for 364days so that at the end of the day, I make huge profit for terminating a 364-day NTB after investing for just 1day

My friend that's very impossible but if you are still in doubt, pls consult financial experts and you will come back to thank me.
The banks and government are not stupid.

emmanuelewumi:


He can't have small change, the interest he would have earned for the 6 days can never be up to 15k. The bank will prorate and debit whatever he earned based on the fact that they believed the investment will run till maturity from what they will pay him.

If not anybody will invest a million for 364 days at 16%. Earning 160k and then terminate after 6 days and lose just 40k which happens to be the 25% of the upfront interest.

GOD BLESS YOU.
Maybe they think government and bank are stupid

RealityShot:

i think so Sir..

it is clearly written that if he breaks his commitment in less than the stated time,

he will loose 25% of the interest he has earned so far..

so now that he has earned for only 7days out of 176days for which he got 68,000..
his total earnings is actually 2,704

therefore he will loose only 676 from the interest earned.


add the tax and its 929 only still gives a net profit of 1774

his capital WILL NOT BE TOUCHED..
therefore, NO LOSS.

PURE LIE!!! his capital will be depleted because he MUST pay back the undeserved interest he earned for the 163days he did not invest.

A trial by him will convince you. I only hope he comes back here to give testimony

freeman67:


Nothing went wrong with your money. FBN deduct funds immediately you make your request.. Infact if money is not in your account at the point you are making the request, it is as good as void. That said, It seem your request was for primary market.

A request made on the 19/10 was already late for primary market investment the next date was 2/11 which you got. The rates given to you are not bad considering the CBN rates posted here yesterday.

I hope this clear your doubts....

✌ I am relieved.

Though the interest rate is not up to my expectations.
But all the same, it's a loose cash that I don't need and I think the token is worth it.

Thanks once again for your clarifications.

zamirikpo:


oga if u are here to learn pls watch ur diction. improper use of words could turn around to hunt u.

besides people here volunteered to assist, u r not paying anyone.

to answer ur question, rates are going down, earlier in the year we were getting 18% while the going rates now is around 15%. then to ur questions on primary and secondary market, read from page 1 -10 of this thread. its clear u don't understand TB.

My brother... No disrespect meant.

I only advise that you consider some readers like me who in no distant time will also become a pro in Tbill because the journey of a thousand miles begins with one step.

Thanks all the same for taking time out to lend me a comment.

TONY56:



PURE LIE!!! his capital will be depleted because he MUST pay back the undeserved interest he earned for the 163days he did not invest.

A trial by him will convince you. I only hope he comes back here to give testimony

If I read the initial complain that brought about this explanation very well. I saw where the writer said the interest paid is still in his account... If the principal is returned to his account after the deduction of what was initially paid to him, he will have his principal intact.

It all depend on the angle anybody look at from anyways... Some of us invest with interest sometimes so we are fully aware that the interest paid upfront is not completely your until your investment matures... Without dubious mind anyone should know that incalling for termination of investment before maturity the days remaining will have to be considered.

The interest earned so far in that transaction is for 6 or 7 days as the case maybe.. The deductions will be based on that. If it is sold @ that same rate he got the day he requested, all he has to do is to just add whatever comes to his account with the initial interest he got. I believe with that he will loose nothing.

He can only loose if it sold or bought higher than what he got it initially.

freeman67:


If I read the initial complain that brought about this explanation very well. I saw where the writer said the interest paid is still in his account... If the principal is returned to his account after the deduction of what was initially paid to him, he will have his principal intact.

It all depend on the angle anybody look at from anyways... Some of us invest with interest sometimes so we are fully aware that the interest paid upfront is not completely your until your investment matures... Without dubious mind anyone should know that incalling for termination of investment before maturity the days remaining will have to be considered.

The interest earned so far in that transaction is for 6 or 7 days as the case maybe.. The deductions will be based on that. If it is sold @ that same rate he got the day he requested, all he has to do is to just add whatever comes to his account with the initial interest he got. I believe with that he will loose nothing.

He can only loose if it sold or bought higher than what he got it initially.

It appears you still haven't understood what myself and few others on this forum have been explaining.

I

TONY56:



It appears you still haven't understood what myself and few others on this forum have been explaining.

Let's assume that the N68,000 upfront paid to him is still intact in his account.

1.For defaulting, Union bank will debit his account with 25% of N68,000 = N17,000.

2.for collecting (in his account) N68,000 for an investment of 170-day tenor instead of N2,400 for 6days (because he is terminating after 6days), Union bank will equally remove N65,600(excess interest paid to his account) also from his account.

3.Assuming the investment is sold at same rate, and that other sundry deductions like tax, C.O.T, commissions, etc amount to N10,000 (may be less).

Total deductions will be N17,000 + N65,600 + N10,000 = N92,000.

4.So What he will get at the end of the day is {N980,000 which is amount invested + N68,000 upfront interest} - (N65,600 which is excess up front interest resulting from his termination after 6days - N17,000 which is penalty for terminating the investment - N10,000 which is the assumed sundry charges which could be less) =

N980,000-

Oga you really have time to explain. Me no time for long story or elaborate explanation.

The summary is that the guy will lose money from that transaction.

freeman67:


If I read the initial complain that brought about this explanation very well. I saw where the writer said the interest paid is still in his account... If the principal is returned to his account after the deduction of what was initially paid to him, he will have his principal intact.

It all depend on the angle anybody look at from anyways... Some of us invest with interest sometimes so we are fully aware that the interest paid upfront is not completely your until your investment matures... Without dubious mind anyone should know that incalling for termination of investment before maturity the days remaining will have to be considered.

The interest earned so far in that transaction is for 6 or 7 days as the case maybe.. The deductions will be based on that. If it is sold @ that same rate he got the day he requested, all he has to do is to just add whatever comes to his account with the initial interest he got. I believe with that he will loose nothing.

He can only loose if it sold or bought higher than what he got it initially.

It appears you still haven't understood what myself and few others on this forum have been explaining.

Let's assume that the N68,000 upfront paid to him is still intact in his account.

1.For defaulting, Union bank will debit his account with 25% of N68,000 = N17,000.

2.for collecting (in his account) N68,000 for an investment of 170-day tenor instead of N2,400 for 6days (because he is terminating after 6days), Union bank will equally remove N65,600(excess interest paid to his account) also from his account.

3.Assuming the investment is sold at same rate, and that other sundry deductions like tax, C.O.T, commissions, etc amount to N10,000 (may be less).

Total deductions will be N17,000 + N65,600 + N10,000 = N92,000.

4.So What he will get at the end of the day is {N980,000 which is amount invested + N68,000 upfront interest} - (N65,600 which is excess up front interest resulting from his termination after 6days - N17,000 which is penalty for terminating the investment - N10,000 which is the assumed sundry charges which could be less) =

{N980,000 +N68,000} - (N65,600 - N17,000 - N10,000)
=
N1,048,000 - N92,600 = N955,400

There his loss would be N980000 - N955,400 = N24,600.

But if the sundry charges is less, his loss will equally be reduced by the difference, but there is no way he would not lose even if he is paying N0.00 as sundry charges.

If after this very detailed explanation, you're still not convinced, then let's just await a feedback from the concerned person to prove either of us right.

emmanuelewumi:
I



Oga you really have time to explain. Me no time for long story or elaborate explanation.

The summary is that the guy will lose money from that transaction.

PERIOD!!!

emmanuelewumi:
I



Oga you really have time to explain. Me no time for long story or elaborate explanation.

The summary is that the guy will lose money from that transaction.

Thanks.
I deliberately took the pain to elaborate cause I want him to fully understand and see what we are telling him.

Sometimes I have that time

TONY56:



It appears you still haven't understood what myself and few others on this forum have been explaining.

Let's assume that the N68,000 upfront paid to him is still intact in his account.

1.For defaulting, Union bank will debit his account with 25% of N68,000 = N17,000.

2.for collecting (in his account) N68,000 for an investment of 170-day tenor instead of N2,400 for 6days (because he is terminating after 6days), Union bank will equally remove N65,600(excess interest paid to his account) also from his account.

3.Assuming the investment is sold at same rate, and that other sundry deductions like tax, C.O.T, commissions, etc amount to N10,000 (may be less).

Total deductions will be N17,000 + N65,600 + N10,000 = N92,000.

4.So What he will get at the end of the day is {N980,000 which is amount invested + N68,000 upfront interest} - (N65,600 which is excess up front interest resulting from his termination after 6days - N17,000 which is penalty for terminating the investment - N10,000 which is the assumed sundry charges which could be less) =

{N980,000 +N68,000} - (N65,600 - N17,000 - N10,000)
=
N1,048,000 - N92,600 = N955,400

There his loss would be N980000 - N955,400 = N24,600.

But if the sundry charges is less, his loss will equally be reduced by the difference, but there is no way he would not lose even if he is paying N0.00 as sundry charges.

If after this very detailed explanation, you're still not convinced, then let's just await a feedback from the concerned person to prove either of us right.

I was actually looking @ the number of days not the entire interest but now I see what you are saying.

realjidejamal:
Hello All,
Please house I invested in treasury bill secondary market at Union Bank last week, 980,000 for 176days at the rate of 14% but now I am in dire need of a lot of funds right now that's really urgent. On the terms and condition for the proof of investment I got it says( Termination of investment before maturity attracts 25% flat penalty on interest earned ) I only got like 68,000 as my interest. Please what do I stand to loose, how much will they deduct and how soon will I get my money credited back so that I can make use part of the funds and reinvest. Please help all
feelamong
freeman67
Investnow2017
dotcomnamename
opomulero

zamirikpo, good to read from you again Sir!
how have you been?

please kindly advice this fellow i quoted here.. You are the only one i know with practical knowledge on premature termination of treasury bills..

thank you.