I must belong to the other 5% then. I believe oil did more damage to Nigeria than good. How can true federalism mean more money from Abuja? How does that work?

Including sending you to university almost FREE OF CHARGE? Or you think education is that cheap?

shymmex:

I was raised in London, and I still live here. Minority don't make up to 10% of the UK population.. Blacks are only visible in London, and probably Birmingham, and we're not upto 2% of the population, FACT!!!

London, which has the largest minority population in the UK, we're not even upto 15% of the population of London.

It isn't a big deal, trust me on this. Certain towns in the UK are probably overwhelmingly minority. Nevertheless, for somewhat obvious reasons, this isn't a security risk, something that keeps the UK up at night

We can talk about this in another venue if you like...but hopefully you can fill in the details or do some reading of your own to understand why it isn't an issue.

ekt_bear: @shymmex: I don't think it is an issue of whether one sees anything "good in Africa" or not.

As an investor, you want to put your money where it will get good returns, and the government won't meddle to destroy your profits if you are successful, or otherwise sabotage you.

By the way.. MTN and Vodafone's massive success in Nigeria. To you, does that make people more likely to invest or less likely?

I am not saying that finding investors is trivial. I just think that it is doable, if you put certain things in place.

Vodafone didn't invest in Nigeria because they couldn't get the licence for free...

You may use MTN's success as a yardstick - but that hasn't enticed big mobile network companies like Tmobile, three, verizon etc. to invest in Nigeria. The bulk of the phone service companies in Nigeria are still from the middle east and asia - why is that?

ekt_bear:

It isn't a big deal, trust me on this. Certain towns in the UK are probably overwhelmingly minority. Nevertheless, for somewhat obvious reasons, this isn't a security risk, something that keeps the UK up at night

We can talk about this in another venue if you like...but hopefully you can fill in the details or do some reading of your own to understand why it isn't an issue.

The only place in the UK that's overwhelmingly minority is Bradford, with Pakistanis - but they're put in check 24/7, trust me... They watch them all the time...

shymmex:

I believe SW can thrive on industralization,

Anyone can thrive on industrialization, but the real question is where will the initial capital come from? SW isnt South Korea remember? Dont mind all these diasporans jare. Some of them have no idea what they are talking about. Without that 'oyel" money we are all fu/c/ked! I repeat Without that 'oyel" money from Abuja we are all F/u/c/k/ed/

agriculture, and developing the other natural resources we have.

How much money can agriculture bring us in this day and age? In no time, we will be back to living like our fore-fathers, in huts and windowless buildings.

shymmex:

I was raised in London, and I still live here. Minority don't make up to 10% of the UK population.. Blacks are only visible in London, and probably Birmingham, and we're not upto 2% of the population, FACT!!!

London, which has the largest minority population in the UK, we're not even upto 15% of the population of London.

You just identified 99% of your problems. I made a comment on another thread that almost all the ethnic bigots on NL are Nigerians who live abroad and have been cut off from their identities, so they think of ethnicity in the same way they think of their allegiances to their street gangs.

Fortunately for those on the ground, it is not so.

A yoruba man can walk into the middle of the road in Warri and haul insults at Ijaw, Urhobo and Itsekiri languages or traditional dress... Absolutely nothing will happen, in fact people would laugh at him at worst. The very same thing can happen in Lagos, Ibadan, Enugu or Onitsha.
The foolishness on NL is caused by folk like you who simply wouldn't buy a ticket to pay a visit.

In 1999,2000 or so, Tinubu found a foreign partner (Enron) to supply electricity for Lagos State.

This is just 1-2 years after Nigeria was in a military dictatorship, mind you.

Why was Enron interested? To make money!

Why was Tinubu interested? To provide electricity for his state!

So both sides win. Nobody loses.

Investment is not a zero-sum game. Both sides can win.

Now if Tinubu was able to do this in 1999...how much more can we do in 2012 in Yorubaland?

Like I said...I'm not too worried about the future of the SW in a post-Nigeria setting.

What we need to work for is for Nigeria to split apart.

shymmex:

Vodafone didn't invest in Nigeria because they couldn't get the licence for free...

You may use MTN's success as a yardstick - but that hasn't enticed big mobile network companies like Tmobile, three, verizon etc. to invest in Nigeria. The bulk of the phone service companies in Nigeria are still from the middle east and asia - why is that?

Those big mobile companies won't invest in Nigeria because the climate is already saturated and there's not much to be made here when you consider the available competition. That's the reason why most mobile network companies that invest in Nigeria come from relative third world countries.

shymmex:

Vodafone didn't invest in Nigeria because they couldn't get the licence for free...

You may use MTN's success as a yardstick - but that hasn't enticed big mobile network companies like Tmobile, three, verizon etc. to invest in Nigeria. The bulk of the phone service companies in Nigeria are still from the middle east and asia - why is that?

That is factually inaccurate. Vodafone was outbid by MTN and Econet.

strangerf: How much money can agriculture bring us in this day and age? In no time, we will be back to living like our fore-fathers, in huts and windowless buildings

You're wrong. Agriculture single handedly took Portugal to where it is today.

How much money can agriculture bring us in this day and age? In no time, we will be back to living like our fore-fathers, in huts and windowless buildings.

You can make a sh1tload of money doing agric. 30-40% ROI per year depending on what sector you focus on.

The problem with (Western-style, industrial) agric is that though it is very profitable, it doesn't create enough jobs...

Obviously nobody will be living like their forefathers unless you mean subsistence farming or something, lol

shymmex:
The only place in the UK that's overwhelmingly minority is Bradford, with Pakistanis - but they're put in check 24/7, trust me... They watch them all the time...

Then you have answered your own question.

There are certain things that one can do in a sovereign state that one cannot do in Nigeria as things are today..

Beaf:
You just identified 99% of your problems. I made a comment on another thread that almost all the ethnic bigots on NL are Nigerians who live abroad and have been cut off from their identities, so they think of ethnicity in the same way they think of their allegiances to their street gangs.

Fortunately for those on the ground, it is not so.

A yoruba man can walk into the middle of the road in Warri and haul insults at Ijaw, Urhobo and Itsekiri indegenes... Absolutely nothing will happen, in fact people would laugh at him at worst. The very same thing can happen in Lagos, Ibadan, Enugu or Onitsha.
The foolishness on NL is caused by folk like you who simply wouldn't buy a ticket to pay a visit.

The bolded part just made me laugh. The irony is that, Nigerians out here see ourselves as NIGERIANS before tribe... We all grew up together, supporting one another against the caribbeans.. If you knew how difficult it was to be a Nigerian, or Africa in London - back in the 90s, when I was in secondary school - you would know there are no tribalists out here... No one cared about your tribe - it was always Nigerians versus Jamaicans - every friday after school..

We all joke about the tribe thing, and it's nothing serious - and the Nigerian community in the UK, is close knitted - even in colleges and universities.. We all stick together...

I'm not even a tribalist - I just like to get involved in the tribal banter, it's nothing serious.

ekt_bear: In 1999,2000 or so, Tinubu found a foreign partner (Enron) to supply electricity for Lagos State.

This is just 1-2 years after Nigeria was in a military dictatorship, mind you.

Why was Enron interested? To make money!

You need to learn more about ENRON and their interest in Nigeria. It has nothing to do with making money. It was all about fooling investors. They knew the Nigerian project was a failure. Why did they hand over the project to Merrill Lynch for five months? There is a reason why Obasanjo railed against Enron .

Stop making shytt up Ekit Bear, Stop!

strangerf:

That is factually inaccurate. Vodafone was outbid by MTN and Econet.

That's not the issue here - the issue is that Vodafone is bigger than both MTN and Econet combined. So, why didn't they put their money where their mouth is - if they were really interested in investing in Nigeria?

shymmex:

The only place in the UK that's overwhelmingly minority is Bradford, with Pakistanis - but they're put in check 24/7, trust me... They watch them all the time...

Crap.
Huge swathes of London have overwhelmingly minority populations. Parts of North/North West London are almost entirely Indian, other parts have very high Jewish populations (Edgeware, Golders Gree, St Johns Wood), Edgeware rd has a high Arab population and then there's Brixton, Peckam, Tooting etc.

ekt_bear:

Then you have answered your own question.

There are certain things that one can do in a sovereign state that one cannot do in Nigeria as things are today..

Bradford is just a small city, and it's of no use to the UK.. Lagos on the other hand, is where most of the new Oodua republic's money would come from - and how can you put people who are about 50% of the population combined in check - without infringing on the rights of your own citizens?

Wtf are you talking about fstranger.

If the project was unviable and a fraud and in your words "a failure", then why is it still running today?

You do realize that it provides a big fraction of Nigeria's current power production, right?

Lmao

OK. So you just googled "Enron power barge lagos" probably. Then came across this Merrill Lynch thing.

Well since you are googling, also type in "AES power barge lagos."

Once you finish, report back to us how much of Nigeria's current electricity production comes from that partnership Tinubu made with Enron (and later AES).

You are a bit of a dumbass dude..

shymmex:

Bradford is just a small city, and it's of no use to the UK.. Lagos on the other hand, is where most of the new Oodua republic's money would come from - and how can you put people who are about 50% of the population combined in check - without infringing on the rights of your own citizens?

Bro, chill. We got this. Ain't a thang. Seriously. Your energies would be better invested in worrying about other aspects of this proposal

Beaf:
Crap.
Huge swathes of London have overwhelmingly minority populations. Parts of North/North West London are almost entirely Indian, other parts have very high Jewish populations (Edgeware, Golders Gree, St Johns Wood), Edgeware rd has a high Arab population and then there's Brixton, Peckam, Tooting etc.

Bwahahahahahaha!!!!!

You're a joker - you need to go out more... Brixton isn't even blacks dominated anymore... Southwark (which includes peckham) is white dominated - if you leave peckham, and hit dulwich, bermondsey, elephant and castle, and a few other parts.. Have you been to places like Clapham, Streatham, Sydenham, Eltham Even South London where you have loads of black people is not black dominated, aside from a few places like peckham, and arguably lewisham...

Don't even talk about West London, North West, and North London - that's white dominated... East London has the largest black population in London, yet they are not majority.. A trip outside London would show you that blacks are probably not upto 1% of the population... I have been to places in Essex and Kent - and I didn't see a single black person in their town centre...

Aight..I'll be back later.

ttyl

ekt_bear:

You can make a sh1tload of money doing agric. 30-40% ROI per year depending on what sector you focus on.

The problem with (Western-style, industrial) agric is that though it is very profitable, it doesn't create enough jobs...

Obviously nobody will be living like their forefathers unless you mean subsistence farming or something, lol

You are right. It is not so labour intensive anymore if mechanized, but very profitable nonetheless.

strangerf:

Anyone can thrive on industrialization, but the real question is where will the initial capital come from? SW isnt South Korea remember? Dont mind all these diasporans jare. Some of them have no idea what they are talking about. Without that 'oyel" money we are all fu/c/ked! I repeat Without that 'oyel" money from Abuja we are all F/u/c/k/ed/

Says who?

Initial capital can come from the same place it came from for Dubai, Korea, Singapore, Taiwan, and for pretty much everybody else...investors who want to make money because you've presented them with a mutually beneficial opportunity.

Have you even looked at Nigeria's GDP data before you concluded that anyone is fvcked? You do realize that most of the growth over the past 5 years in the economy has been the non-oil sector? That the oil sector is flat? And for obvious reasons, will be flat going forward (at least, there are limits to how much it can grow)?

Look, if you are going to talk about issues like this, please at least make sure that you are more informed of what the #s look like before you open your mouth.

I could see if Korea or Singapore were the only countries on earth who went from 3rd world to 1st.

But we have Korea, Singapore, China, Taiwan, Dubai on the march, Brazil on the march, India on the march, and probably others that I've forgotten.

Are we too stvpid to do what others did?

Even if you believe that you yourself are too stvpid, I am not

ekt_bear:

Says who?

Initial capital can come from the same place it came from for Dubai, Korea, Singapore, Taiwan, and for pretty much everybody else...investors who want to make money because you've presented them with a mutually beneficial opportunity.

This is all nice and dandy on paper. The problem is nothing gets done on paper. Reality is far grimmer that what you wrote up there.

Have you even looked at Nigeria's GDP data before you concluded that anyone is fvcked? Y[b]ou do realize that most of the growth over the past 5 years in the economy has been the non-oil sector?[/b] That the oil sector is flat? And for obvious reasons, will be flat going forward (at least, there are limits to how much it can grow)?

What non-oil sector? From your father's backyard farm. I have the data. The only non-oil sector that is doing well is Telecoms. GDP is going up, unemployment is going up as well, does that tell you anything?

Look without oil, WE ARE ALL f/u/c/k/e/d!

Lol.

So a little puzzle for you, o thou dimwitted Fstranger.

Here are some facts:
a) The non-oil sector is ~60% or so of Nigeria's economy. Roughly that order of magnitude.
b) Nigeria has averaged, what, 7-8% GDP growth over the past 4-5 years?
c) During that same time period, the oil sector of the economy has been flat.
d) You claim that the only non-oil part of the economy that has grown is telecoms.

So how big is the telecoms sector as a fraction of Nigeria's economy? 30%? 40%

I guess everyone in Nigeria either is in the oil business or selling recharge cards

This is the problem when people who don't reason well start trying to figure out policy.

Stick to whatever you are good at...leave this for others to handle, my numerically illiterate friend.

strangerf:
GDP is going up, unemployment is going up as well, does that tell you anything?

Lmao.

You do realize that population growth affects unemployment, right?

If your population grows at 3% per year, economy at 8%, unemployment won't necessarily fall unless the sectors of your economy growing also create lots of jobs.

Given that Nigeria produces very little electricity...

See, a lot of these seeming "mysteries" that you have such difficulty figuring out would be a lot clearer if you sat down for 3 minutes to do some thinking.

strangerf:

This is all nice and dandy on paper. The problem is nothing gets done on paper. Reality is far grimmer that what you wrote up there.

Reality will of course be grim with people like you, whose only contribution to discourse is "without oiled we are fvcked!"

LMAO @ Ekt bear and Fstranger

OMG

ekt_bear: Lol.

So a little puzzle for you, o thou dimwitted Fstranger.

Here are some facts:
a) The non-oil sector is ~60% or so of Nigeria's economy. Roughly that order of magnitude.
b) Nigeria has averaged, what, 7-8% GDP growth over the past 4-5 years?
c) During that same time period, the oil sector of the economy has been flat.
d) You claim that the only non-oil part of the economy that has grown is telecoms.

So how big is the telecoms sector as a fraction of Nigeria's economy? 30%? 40%

I guess everyone in Nigeria either is in the oil business or selling recharge cards

This is the problem when people who don't reason well start trying to figure out policy.

Stick to whatever you are good at...leave this for others to handle, my numerically illiterate friend.

You know what you have up there is wrong?

Stranger has made some valid points. Let's now throw away the baby with the bath water. Without oil, all regions in Nigeria will experience a backlash and it will take a long time for some of them to recover.