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Conversation With An Atheist - Islam for Muslims - Nairaland

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Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 7:19pm On Jul 14, 2012
Recently I had a conversation with an atheist; It went like this (not exact words)

Tbaba1234: So muslims believe in many parts of the stories in the bible...(tbaba rabbles on)

Atheist: What we atheists say is that its completely filled with words of man... Just their imagination on how the god is like...

Tbaba1234: What if i can prove to you that it is not just words of men?

Atheist: 1. Please go ahead and prove to me that any of the religions in this world today are not the imaginations of people who lived during the time they got created.

2.Also, prove to me that god exists and is watching and controlling our every move and thought. Prove to me if you can that the so called "words of god" are actually words of god and not words of men who wrote those texts.

Tbaba1234 : Provides a background for the Discussion, No complicated stuff... He stops... Most of what i said and more can be found here: https://www.nairaland.com/972776/amazing-quran-pre-ramadan-study-interactive

Atheist: gives a background of how he developed skepticism for faith and religion.... Long story... (Shirk and worship of men was a major factor)

Tbaba1234: Gives a mini tawhid (Oneness of God) lesson... '. In Islam, we do not give the attribute of God; who is uncreated to created beings... No rocks, No stones, No humans.'

Tbaba1234: Now goes into how the Quran can not be a work of Man.... How it is beyond the capacity of men...

Atheist: ....... (silence)

Haven't heard from Atheist since.... May Allah grant him Hidaya... Please make dua that Allah guides him...

Get involved!!... Give dawah to your neighbour in the best of ways....
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 9:50am On Jul 15, 2012
tbaba1234: Recently I had a conversation with an atheist; It went like this (not exact words)



Tbaba1234: Now goes into how the Quran can not be a work of Man.... How it is beyond the capacity of men...


I keep asking you to show how the quran can not be work of men and you have failed to do that. . .
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 10:01am On Jul 15, 2012
mazaje: I keep asking you to show how the quran can not be work of men and you have failed to do that. . .

Read through my thread: https://www.nairaland.com/972776/amazing-quran-pre-ramadan-study-interactive

It is only for the open-minded.... Read,think deeply and sincerely ask for guidance... Do not derail the thread though....
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 2:44pm On Jul 15, 2012
tbaba1234:

Read through my thread: https://www.nairaland.com/972776/amazing-quran-pre-ramadan-study-interactive

It is only for the open-minded.... Read,think deeply and sincerely ask for guidance... Do not derail the thread though....

Is that your evidence to show that the quran can not be the work of man?. . .Interesting grin
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 5:19pm On Jul 15, 2012
mazaje: Is that your evidence to show that the quran can not be the work of man?. . .Interesting grin

That does not even begin to describe how incredible this book is, it is just a taste, a tip of the iceberg.... cool
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by dalaman: 8:31pm On Jul 15, 2012
Subscribing. . .
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 8:32am On Jul 16, 2012
tbaba1234:

That does not even begin to describe how incredible this book is, it is just a taste, a tip of the iceberg.... cool

Incredible?. . .I don't see it that way at all. . .I see very normal stuff that was written by normal human beings, but we will always disagree I know. . .
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 8:52am On Jul 16, 2012
mazaje:

Incredible?. . .I don't see it that way at all. . .I see very normal stuff that was written by normal human beings, but we will always disagree I know. . .

ok... I can't help those who choose to be blind..
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 1:50pm On Jul 16, 2012
tbaba1234:

ok... I can't help those who choose to be blind..

Blind?.....A christian will say the same about you for failing to "see" that the bible is the word of god. . .But really if that is your evidence to show that the quran is a miracle and could not be written by men then i can only shake my head. . .
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 5:28pm On Jul 16, 2012
mazaje: Blind?.....A christian will say the same about you for failing to "see" that the bible is the word of god. . .But really if that is your evidence to show that the quran is a miracle and could not be written by men then i can only shake my head. . .

You have obviously not read through it, a few glances maybe, you have not given it much thought either... The evidence provided there does even begin to describe the Quran, but it is a start .... When i say blinded, i mean you have allowed arrogance and prejudice to define what you read.... Anyone who reads and reasons with an open mind would realise that this could not have been produced by a man, it is that simple really.... How many more excuses can you provide to explain it? It is difficult when you build up walls around yourself.

I presented just a few to your atheist brother and he was dumbfounded... And he is a very smart person...
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 6:35pm On Jul 16, 2012
tbaba1234:

You have obviously not read through it, a few glances maybe, you have not given it much thought either... The evidence provided there does even begin to describe the Quran, but it is a start .... When i say blinded, i mean you have allowed arrogance and prejudice to define what you read.... Anyone who reads and reasons with an open mind would realise that this could not have been produced by a man, it is that simple really.... How many more excuses can you provide to explain it? It is difficult when you build up walls around yourself.

I presented just a few to your atheist brother and he was dumbfounded... And he is a very smart person...



Pls make your presentations here, I truly went through the entire thread(most of it) because I had little work to do in the office today and saw nothing that could not have been written by men therein. . .All i saw you do was hail the quran as the greatest book without really showing how.
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 9:21pm On Jul 16, 2012
I will not go too far, i will give you just one included in the write-up.... Then you will tell me something that a human has made that is even close...

Palindromes are sentences and words that spell front and back the same way like wow, race car... The Quran has palindromes... One ayah (usually translated as verse) is a palindrome as a sentence on its own...

Surah Muddathir ayah 3 is a palindrome

the sentence is:

رَبَّكَ فَكَبِّرْ

look at it more closely:

رب ب ك ف ك ب ب ر

It means

'declare the greatness only of your Rabb(Lord)'

Your challenge is simple, provide a sentence palindrome from all of what humans have created in any language, that makes as much sense as this one ayah..... Thank God we have Google..

Some famous palindromes include:

T. Eliot, Top Bard, Notes Putrid Tang Emanating, Is Sad. I’d Assign It A Name: Gnat Dirt Upset On Drab Pot-Toilet

No, Mel Gibson Is A Casino’s Big Lemon

Swap God For A Janitor; Rot In A Jar Of Dog Paws

Read more: http://www.toptenz.net/top-10-palindromes.php#ixzz20opi7uG3

As you can see they make little sense.... This is just one ayah....
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 10:25pm On Jul 16, 2012
tbaba1234: I will not go too far, i will give you just one included in the write-up.... Then you will tell me something that a human has made that is even close...

Palindromes are sentences and words that spell front and back the same way like wow, race car... The Quran has palindromes... One ayah (usually translated as verse) is a palindrome as a sentence on its own...

Surah Muddathir ayah 3 is a palindrome

the sentence is:

رَبَّكَ فَكَبِّرْ

look at it more closely:

رب ب ك ف ك ب ب ر

It means

'declare the greatness only of your Rabb(Lord)'

Your challenge is simple, provide a sentence palindrome from all of what humans have created in any language, that makes as much sense as this one ayah..... Thank God we have Google..

Some famous palindromes include:

T. Eliot, Top Bard, Notes Putrid Tang Emanating, Is Sad. I’d Assign It A Name: Gnat Dirt Upset On Drab Pot-Toilet

No, Mel Gibson Is A Casino’s Big Lemon

Swap God For A Janitor; Rot In A Jar Of Dog Paws

Read more: http://www.toptenz.net/top-10-palindromes.php#ixzz20opi7uG3

As you can see they make little sense.... This is just one ayah....




Tbaba, you and Hamza Tzortis keep making this claim about the unique literature of the Quran but it can only be understood in classical Arabic!

Tbaba, how many western atheists understand Arabic?


However, from a skeptical point of view, languages are different. Palindromes in English are just anomalies and would hardly make sense. "Madam sees pop"
Arabic might have more sensible palindromes because of its sentence structure or syntax.


A good example in the difference in languages is "double negatives" that hardly make sense in English but makes sense in Portuguese.

eg " I havent never done nothing to nobody". ---senseless

I havent done anything to anybody------ makes sense


Another Quranic miracle debunked by Logicboy. grin
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 10:39pm On Jul 16, 2012
^ Palindromes in any language hardly make sense ... It is not peculiar to english... Even in Arabic...

The discussion is about palidromes... It is simply enough challenge... Give me a palindrome in any language with as much content as the one above...

Why all the grammar? Logicboy is a clown...
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 12:40am On Jul 17, 2012
tbaba1234: ^ Palindromes in any language hardly make sense ... It is not peculiar to english... Even in Arabic...

The discussion is about palidromes... It is simply enough challenge... Give me a palindrome in any language with as much content as the one above...

Why all the grammar? Logicboy is a clown...



Why are you hiding behind Arabic? Are you saying that palindromes in Arabic do not make sense?

Or are you saying that the Quran puts sense into Arabic?
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 12:58am On Jul 17, 2012
tbaba1234: I will not go too far, i will give you just one included in the write-up.... Then you will tell me something that a human has made that is even close...

Palindromes are sentences and words that spell front and back the same way like wow, race car... The Quran has palindromes... One ayah (usually translated as verse) is a palindrome as a sentence on its own...

Surah Muddathir ayah 3 is a palindrome

the sentence is:

رَبَّكَ فَكَبِّرْ

look at it more closely:

رب ب ك ف ك ب ب ر

It means

'declare the greatness only of your Rabb(Lord)'

Your challenge is simple, provide a sentence palindrome from all of what humans have created in any language, that makes as much sense as this one ayah..... Thank God we have Google..

Some famous palindromes include:

T. Eliot, Top Bard, Notes Putrid Tang Emanating, Is Sad. I’d Assign It A Name: Gnat Dirt Upset On Drab Pot-Toilet

No, Mel Gibson Is A Casino’s Big Lemon

Swap God For A Janitor; Rot In A Jar Of Dog Paws

Read more: http://www.toptenz.net/top-10-palindromes.php#ixzz20opi7uG3

As you can see they make little sense.... This is just one ayah....


Here are some palindrome i got from wikipedia. . .

1.Was it a car or a cat I saw?

2. "A Toyota's a Toyota.

3. Step on no pets.

4. "Eva, can I stab bats in a cave?"

If compared to the ayah that says "declare the greatness only of your Rabb" you will see that they are at par. ..
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 2:12am On Jul 17, 2012
mazaje:

Here are some palindrome i got from wikipedia. . .

1.Was it a car or a cat I saw?

2. "A Toyota's a Toyota.

3. Step on no pets.

4. "Eva, can I stab bats in a cave?"

If compared to the ayah that says "declare the greatness only of your Rabb" you will see that they are at par. ..


grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin


MY lord, where is the content in

1.Was it a car or a cat I saw? - how can you mistake a car for a cat..... zero content, zero application grin grin grin grin grin

2. "A Toyota's a Toyota. ... No it is a honda .. grin grin grin grin grin grin

3. Step on no pets..... What is the this applied?... where is the content grin grin grin grin grin grin

4. "Eva, can I stab bats in a cave?" No. you can stab them outside a cave.... Zero content.... where can this be appliedgrin grin grin grin grin grin

Oh my lord, you should have just found an excuse or even ignored the question instead of making me laugh my head off this night.....

I am talking of a palindrome with real content... 'Declare the greatness only of your Lord' - has content... It has a real application, It fits perfectly into the discussion it was applied, It gives useful information of an action that can be applied and that can lead a man's life. ... a toyota's a toyota? Really ...... LOL>>>>>

Oh my lord... Do you need a definition of content??....

Alright, I see why you won't even see truth even if it is directly in your face... I will leave you here......

*Sorry but it was just too funny...
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 5:43am On Jul 17, 2012
mazaje:

Here are some palindrome i got from wikipedia. . .

1.Was it a car or a cat I saw?

2. "A Toyota's a Toyota.

3. Step on no pets.

4. "Eva, can I stab bats in a cave?"

If compared to the ayah that says "declare the greatness only of your Rabb" you will see that they are at par. ..



Ah, you fell for the invincible strawman attack!

Did you not notice that the English translation of his verse is not a palindrome? Tbaba is hiding behind Arabic.
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 5:49am On Jul 17, 2012
^hehe ... Give me one in your local language sef....

The best palindrome in arabic before Islam means

'The whale mouth is open"...... grin grin grin grin and it took them months of trial and error to come up with one......

Arabic palindromes are as senseless as english palindromes..... I am not hiding behind anything ..... Arabic palindromes also make little sense...
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 6:07am On Jul 17, 2012
tbaba1234: ^hehe ... Give me one in your local language sef....

The best palindrome in arabic before Islam means

'The whale mouth is open"...... grin grin grin grin and it took them months of trial and error to come up with one......

Arabic palindromes are as senseless as english palindromes..... I am not hiding behind anything ..... Arabic palindromes also make little sense...


Tbaba, you're very lucky that I can not speak Arabic. Keep hiding behind Arabic


However, what does this say about your religion? Not to be rude but isnt there some sort of xenophobia involved here? Are you telling me that Arabic is a holy language compared to others?

A real miracle would be that the English translation is also a palindrome. Furthermore, "palindrome" as a word was coined by an English man in the 17th century.
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 6:10am On Jul 17, 2012
I just read parts of Mazaje's story to atheism....

I feel sad that he could have been a muslim;

I hope you find your way back and you find what you need to convince you of the truth.....
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 6:43am On Jul 17, 2012
tbaba1234: I just read parts of Mazaje's story to atheism....

I feel sad that he could have been a muslim;

I hope you find your way back and you find what you need to convince you of the truth.....



I watched a film in which a british man was teaching some native indians about Jesus Christ. When, the British man said that Jesus christ died for people's sins, the Indian chief said that Jesus was a fool because Jesus death showed that he was powerless on earth and reinforced the might of the Roman government.

The moral of the story is that when trying to convince people about your religion, try to use simple logic and believable stories. You have not one day ever made a good case for Islam to a non believer. Yes, you know how to inspire the muslims here on Nairaland but you offer nothing to the unbeliever or the doubtful muslim.


Do you really expectme to believe that the Quran miraculously improved Arabic language?
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 7:08am On Jul 17, 2012
Cheers01:
Do you really expectme to believe that the Quran miraculously improved Arabic language?


The Quran is the standard for the Arabic language; Even a honest arab christian will tell you that.... The Quran took ownership of the language.... Trust me, you will never in your life read anything that would affect you psychologically as the Quran if you understand it, NEVER!!... sometimes even when i read casually, i am mesmerized, stunned, amazed or in tears. This is coming from someone who has read various kinds of books from many fields of knowledge.

Alhamdulilah (All thanks and praise to Allah), Allah has helped some doubtful muslims clear their doubts from my posts... I have also been fortunate to speak to a few non-muslims who have developed a better understanding of Islam- Some who might even be close to becoming muslims if Allah wills... Different things appeal to different people,...Anyone with arrogance, pride or just a stubbornness to reject will reject, no matter how clear the proof is...

I try to use common sense in all of my discussions with disbelievers....
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 11:53am On Jul 17, 2012
tbaba1234:


The Quran is the standard for the Arabic language; Even a honest arab christian will tell you that.... The Quran took ownership of the language.... Trust me, you will never in your life read anything that would affect you psychologically as the Quran if you understand it, NEVER!!... sometimes even when i read casually, i am mesmerized, stunned, amazed or in tears. This is coming from someone who has read various kinds of books from many fields of knowledge.

Alhamdulilah (All thanks and praise to Allah), Allah has helped some doubtful muslims clear their doubts from my posts... I have also been fortunate to speak to a few non-muslims who have developed a better understanding of Islam- Some who might even be close to becoming muslims if Allah wills... Different things appeal to different people,...Anyone with arrogance, pride or just a stubbornness to reject will reject, no matter how clear the proof is...

I try to use common sense in all of my discussions with disbelievers....


It all goes back to the point of xenophobia. As someone that is learning my local language after realising the damaging effect on my local tradition and culture from accepting European language of English and religion of christianity, you have to be kidding me with Arabic. Your argument is not logical. You are saying that for me to be closer to God, I have to learn Arabic? That my local language and English are quite limited in fully understanding Allah in the the Quran? You praise Arabic language when your country is neither of Arabic heritage or an Arabic speaking country.
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 12:06pm On Jul 17, 2012
Have I been banned here or what?
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 12:33pm On Jul 17, 2012
mazaje: Have I been banned here or what?


What is with the hidden comment?
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by Cheers01: 1:47pm On Jul 17, 2012
Tbaba, I need you input here as most muslims i know are not really scared of the dark;

https://www.nairaland.com/992457/atheist-afraid-dark
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by mazaje(m): 10:19pm On Jul 17, 2012
What is it with my hidden post, I already provided palindrome that is at par with what is written inside the quran in the Tamil language. . .I wonder why the post is hidden. . .
Re: Conversation With An Atheist by tbaba1234: 11:15pm On Jul 17, 2012
mazaje: What is it with my hidden post, I already provided palindrome that is at par with what is written inside the quran in the Tamil language. . .I wonder why the post is hidden. . .

You chose the wrong language... There are very few (hardly any) true palindromes in the tamil language what you have are semi palindromes; they use syllables not letters, We have to compare oranges with oranges not mangoes with oranges...... The letters in their 'palindromes' do not read the same forward and backwards. The structure of the script does not allow for complete or true palindromes... Well, they still call them palindromes abi.... undecided. grin. I gave you a true palindrome not a semi palindrome... I have seen many of the best true tamil palindromes and none compares... Unless you want me to start looking for 'syllabic palindromes' in the quran as well so we can compare grin grin... If that is what your hidden post is about, then it is another fail...

I won't give you a challenge, if it was that easy... wink wink

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