₦airaland Forum

RIP English.

greenPHP:
I am learning PHP but I don't really know what a PHP framework is.I have download some like yil, CodeIgniter,cakePHP but each time I install it on wamp and lunch it from my browser I will just see some writing(index bla..bla and folders which is in www of wamp) on my browser but if I Install CodeIgniter I see some writting and links after clicking some links I will see some code template of different category mainly writing in OOP(class etc) because i hear people say framework makes coding easier and faster I begin to wonder how because after installing mine I am yet to see how it could help me. I have done some serious googling but yet to fine a answer the deliver me from this ignorance
My question is
1.Is it that I am not installing it properly?
2.Is it just I library of code?
3.Is it like an IDE where I can type my code and it give me hints?
4.How will It look like if I install it properly?
Please, how do I start using framework effectively?
Please no insult I beg you.
Pardon my gun shot if any.

get a solid foundation in php first. then you can transition to framework.
you might not even need any framework for php if your foundation is Strong in d language.

larisoft:
Still I maintain:

USE WHAT YOU KNOW BEST WHERE ITS ACCEPTABLE TO DO SO

I have been among the "I Know 15 languages...I use 5 everyday" and am telling you; that might be the first step towards knowing no language at all.

Those of us here who know PHP well know that there are functions in it that call direct C functions, while there are other functions that do the same job and yet; require interpretation to execute.

As for Java; knowing the language in and out is often the difference between "slow" and "fast". For instance, do you know how performance tasking creating objects are?

and you see someone write code like this:

for(int i = 0; i < database of 10000000 entries; i++){

User johnny = new User('asd ');

if(johnny.isAboy()){

System.out.println(" I am a fool";

}

}
....


And this GENIUS programmer who was using php only an hour ago, and has done little or no OP programming would expect it to run fast.


ONCE YOU UNDERSTAND YOUR TOOL WELL; THE DIFFERENCE IN PERFORMANCE BETWEEN LANGUAGES AFTER OPTIMIZATION IS USUALLY NEGLIGIBLE PERIOD! (EXCEPT YOU ARE USING C/C++ -WHICH YOU ARE PROBABLY NOT USING ANYWAYS)

you strike it well. that is just the point.

seunthomas:
I dont need to provide benchmarks. No point reinventing the wheel. Others have done that many times. The only languages that can compete with Java like i mentioned earlier are .Net Languages.

You need to. to show us how you arrive at it.nobody is arguing that some languages are not faster than some, but many people opinion on these are subjective.language A might be faster than language B but don't be surprised that language B can outperform language A if written by programmer than knows his onion.like i said, performance depend on a lot of factors, so saying one is faster than the other is highly subjective unless you provide us the benchmark you used to arrive at the conclusion.

seunthomas:
The challenges in performance are not just in the interpretation/compilation, they also include memory management(many languages cant use the available memory on the machine efficiently, if you run a php script and a java file, check your process monitor,php will definately use more memory than Java for a single thread and for each new thread php will create another process which is very very poor design while Java or the other languages i discussed would still stay in 1 thread except explictly required to fork another process). As for facebook implementation, i used in 2012 to see how good it was. Really no much difference from the original language in terms of performance. Its only more scalable(works across multiple machines easier).

have you ever reason why lots of ISPs providing PHP server platforms at relatively cheap prices. Java is not that well catered for by ISPs because It needs lots of memory and ISPs are not ready to provide it in useful quantities because it is not economical.On the other hand, PHP runs very efficiently, even on small hardware footprints.

seunthomas:
@micodon PHP no matter the level of optimization cant outperform Java. Java has a lot of neat features that makes it very powerful and really faster.

but u rilli need to provide benchmark to prove ur point. a lot of factors contribute to language performance.

no such thing as best server side language. just use the one u r most comfortable with.

rayval:
An opinion that is often heard today is – “C has been already superceded by languages like C++, C# and Java, so why bother tolearn C today”. I seriously beg to differ with this opinion. There are several reasons for this:
I believe that nobody can learn C++ or Java directly. This is because while learning these languages you have things like classes, objects, inheritance, polymorphism, templates, exception handling, references, etc. do deal with apart from knowing the actual language elements. Learning these complicated concepts when you are not even comfortable with the basic language elements is like putting the cart before the horse. Hence one should first learn all the language elements very thoroughly using C language before migrating to C++, C# or Java. Though this two step learning process may take more time, but at the end of it you will definitely find it worth the trouble.
C++, C# or Java make use of a principle called Object Oriented Programming (OOP) to organize the program. This organizing principle has lots of advantages to offer. But even while using this organizing principle you would still need a good hold over the language elements of C and the basic programming skills.
Though many C++ and Java based programming tools and frameworks have evolved over the years the importance of C is still unchallenged because knowingly or unknowingly while using these frameworks and tools you would be still required to use the core C language elements—another good reason why one should learn C before C++, C# or Java.
Major parts of popular operating systems like Windows, UNIX, Linux is still written in C. This is because even today when it comes to performance (speed of execution) nothing beats C. Moreover, if one is to extend the operating system to work with new devices one needs to write device driver programs. These programs are exclusively written in C.
Mobile devices like cellular phones and palmtops are becoming increasingly popular. Also, common consumer devices like microwave oven, washing machines and digital cameras are getting smarter by the day. This smartness comes from a microprocessor, an operating system and a program embedded in this devices. These programs not only have to run fast but also have to work in limited amount of memory. No wonder that such programs are written in C. With these constraints on time and space, C is the language of choice while building such operating systems and programs.
You must have seen several professional 3D computer games where the user navigates some object, like say a spaceship and fires bullets at the invaders. The essence of all such games is speed. Needless to say, such games won't become popular if they takes a long time to move the spaceship or to fire a bullet. To match the expectations of the player the game has to react fast to the user inputs. This is where C language scores over other languages. Many popular gaming frameworks have been built using C language.
At times one is required to very closely interact with the hardware devices. Since C provides several language elements that make this interaction feasible without compromising the performance it is the preferred choice of the programmer.
I hope that these are very convincing reasons why one should adopt C as the first and the very important step in your quest for learning programming languages

you don't need to learn C before you learn C based languages like C++.
some of C features are even frowned at by C++. infact not all C programms can run in c++ without modification.

hardware speed are so amazing nowadays that most programmers focus on productivities instead of performances.

omoelu1:
oh! so I'm not alone. I'm tired of the thing. so bro, what gui framework do you use for python now?

try PyQt or PySide they r cool with plaform native look

you should go for MSC and start learning programming in the process. it takes at least a year to master a programming language.

Borwe:
Bro, I know about pyc. It supposed to be the bytecode compiled version of python raw code. As you said python is simple to read, understand and implement what you want while saving time. And you claim that there is no such thing as performance comparisons?

Hmmmm. Now here is where I laugh. Well you see Python bytecode or raw code all try to compile to native code at runtime, mean while native code is what c++ and c programs compile to before running. With this fact well, you see, python is going to be slower than c++ at everything due to the extra steps taken to run the program at runtime. On the other hand java is still faster than python but slower than c++ for this same reason. And if you go onto compare PHP, you will find out it's even slower than python, due to it's crappy, hence is only used on servers, Haven't seen any simple php program that runs stand alone in my life.

Now here is the reason why Java is faster than python. As you said python simplifies coding, making it easier to understand. But this simplicity causes difficulty during compile time and runtime due to it's different coding characteristics as compared to c++ or c. Meanwhile java coding is slightly similar to c++ coding, all main excecutables must have main methods, etc.. only real difference is limited memory managment on java as compared to c++ since the jvm handles everything. Now seeing that java codes are more similar to c++ codes than python will ever be the bytecode to native code process works better and faster since it is almost the same.

And what is this about different Languagess boosting tecnology?
WOW! all this many languages just try to imitate the idea java came up with, way back when you was even probably born(I know I wasnt). Python is using virtual machine to translate it's bytecode to native code, and this is one of the main characteristics of java. And java just tried to make c++ easier to learn and implement without the hustle of compiling or optimizing codes for particular machines, java would do that for you with jvm.
Picture this, Android started from back in 2006( lets make it in likes of java, hell it's main language for programming is java!!), and then Samsung, Blackberry, come up with their own versions Operating systems, which claim to be able to run android apps and do more(Make this python and all those other script languages, Ruby etc, claiming they can do what java does and more), but the down side is that they suck at performance on android apps( Yeah, I am talking about Tizen and Blackberry 10+ OS). So eventually Android is still king and this others are it's servants. )((Java rules over others why you think google didn't use python for android instead of java? because java has better performance. ))

you know u should provide benchmark to back up your rants.

language performance is debatable because language only have semantics not performance.
is like saying Arabic is faster than French.

language performance has to do with lots of factors like runtime,implementation, the coder himself & what have you.

sorting in o(n2) in Java is slower than o(nlogn) in python but then this is about implementation of a given task

up vote and down vote will be cool like stackoverflow.

HCpaul:
Answer - Question 1

All programming languages are not well mathematically oriented, as only but a few of them are fit enough in writting an operating system. Examples of mathematically oriented language include C, C++, and so on.

There has being many arguements that Java is becomming the giant of programming language, as it is used in written the android operating system. When comparing languages together, please compare with valuabe facts and not just with feasible evidence. There is no Superior language, as well as there is no Inferior language.

As a Mathematicain and the sametime a Computer Science, not just that but a physicist, electronic engineer, English advocate, a teacher, a company, and most especially, God vessel.
To me, languages that are not well mathematically well constructive can never emerge to be the best. That is why programmers are very ridicule in industry.
Since programming all started as a result of mathematical operation, languages will be meaningless by depreciating mathematics in prog lang.

I Rest my case but will continue by challenge.

1) every programming language has a design objectives.some r great for text manipulation like perl while some r great for complex mathematical computation like Fortran while some r great in system programing like c/c++

2) even those language that r not that mathematically oriented can solve most mathematical problems with third party libraries example is numpy in python
3) pls can u clarify why programmers r being ridiculed because that ur closing statement didn't not hold water at all.thanks

2) I doubt if any industry prefer mathematicians to programmers. both r about problems solving.

changecreator:
C# is the best unless u want to do copy and paste work then php is better but java is bad hosting is difficult and the language is not good for web is for small device e.g. phones,smartcard chips

why is c# d best?

javadoctor:
I hate php

why

Barywhyte:
i know it is C. in fact I don't wanna HV anything to do with DAT language. its so fvcking complex. too complex. more difficult than java or c++. c isnt for evryone

C is a subset of C++.
C++ is more complex than C.

Pythonian99:
I'd rather learn a language and be a Master in it than choose to learn 5 or 10 and remain an average joe in all!!!

learning more than one language will even make u a better Programmer.

INeedHelpAsap:
goodday, I just got some books and the offline version of w3schools but the problem is running my PHP codes, been trying to download xampp but the ISPs are really messing up,my downloads aren't always completed.....

I kindly need someone who can help me with the xampp software (and probably any.other "programming related" files)..

I school at unilorin tho 73F09FB3

u can PM me just in case .am in Ilorin,offa road GRA to be precise

IMHO python indentation is way overrated may be it is because of my adventure with c based languages.
I actually struggled with the indentation when I was learning python.Heck, python with braces would av been better

sure u can ...but only u can answer the question

asalimpo:
paul allen programmed most of basic. Don box was a very influential programmer @ ms.
If Gates makes it Allen should too.
Dont mix things up, he is being listed because of his enterpreneurial feats.

you have said it all

WhiZTiM:
Oga, calm down.....
I thought my memory had begun to deceive me.... But I doubt, the quoted are from Wikipedia (Link below)

"In the first five years, Gates personally reviewed every line of code the company shipped, and often rewrote parts of it as he saw fit."
..... Within the first five years, the COMPANY's (not just Windows) code must have exponentially grown and covered so many complex domains... That's not all ohhh

"Gates devised an algorithm for pancake sorting as a solution to one of a series of unsolved problems presented in a combinatorics.... Gates's solution held the record as the fastest version for over thirty years; its successor is faster by only one percent."

Please help me further 'unconfuse' my point...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Gates

& u think these qualify him to be in the top ten in the context of this topic?
no? he rewrote part of MS codes? how how does that make him different from other gud programmers that upgrade codes written by someone else.
he design pancake algorithm? yes thas great work right there by Bill but still hundreds of unknown programmers have also contributed to programming and its algorithms. even u as a coder can even contribute to an open source language lyk PHP and what have you. still those feats by Bill sure is legendary but its in no way enough to put him in that position. I see Bill Gates more as great entrepreneur than programmer.

Djtm:
ok, so because you've met a couple of folks with Macs you think only Africans use windows? google the percentage of systems running windows and mac in the USA only and come back here.

there's nothing to Google. yes windows is still the King in US market.but outside the enterprise domain you will be surprised that most folks use Mac even in academia same thing in Uk.thas ma experience though

Djtm:
what did you just say?

yeah Microsoft sure dominate market with overwhelming lead in enterprise .But if u have ever had an encounter with folks in developed countries especially in academia most of them use Mac infact u hardly see Microsoft Os being used

Kidstell:
Bill did not invent a language but was the first to write an operating system wit a convenient gui, though he was an intern @ his mums work place (IBM) IBM bought the software for each computer he continued to make more innovations to operating system and today every language in the world has a microsoft version eg javascript and jscript actionscript and activeX... Many more... Recently microsoft's new boss wants to stop inventing microsoft version so that others will learn to appreciate microsoft original initiative... this decision is due to the current level of appreciation people have for open source apps...
Bill also was the first code evengelist in his early twenties fighting people who stole other people code and idea...
if microsoft stops work today... Or stops being effecient... The syndrome will affect many people in the IT industry because it indirectly d source of moral... Why? Almost all programmers are using windows OS... Most of which have been cracked... Can you try that with MAC OS...
If steve jobs was in this list it will be because he was the only person who managed to compete with gates in the idea market...

what do you mean by convenient GUI? Bill did not invent GUI. the first GUI was developed by XEROX which later inspired Apple's GUI.So Microsoft was not even the first nor the second to develop GUI OS.

Microsoft having her own version of some language like Jscript for JavaScript boils down to platform thing.

In developed countries today most folks don't even use Microsoft OS, they mostly use MAC, Microsoft OS is only heavily use in Africa.

Almost all programmers using OS?

That depends on the market and location but i tell u what? working with Microsoft own languages is a nightmare for programmers because of cross platform issues,although that has reduced significantly.No serious programmers wants to be tied down by platform. Real programmers use Unix Based OS.

Bill is great, i meant one the greatest thing that has ever happened to humanity but so are those two Google guys that are performing wonders also, they even have their own languages. IMO Bill is unworthy of top ten position.

ify01:
please, can you give me a sample code?

<!DOCTYPE html>
<html>
<head>
<title></title>
</head>
<body>
<?php
$users = array('john','paul','mark','luke');
$admin = array('dan','ify','chris','jane');
if(!isset($_POST['submit1'])){
?>
<form name="trial" action="<?php echo $_SERVER['PHP_SELF']?>" method="POST">
<input type="text" name="paul" value="">
<input type="submit" name="submit1" value="Enter">
</form>
<?php
}else{
$june = $_POST['paul'];
$member = "Sorry but you are not recognized in our database";
for($i =0; $i< 4; $i++){
if($june==$users[$i]){
print "Welcome";
break;
}
if($june==$admin[$i]){
print "welcome back super admin";
break;
}
if($i==3){
print $member;

}
}
}
?>
</body>
</html>

ify01:
Thanks for replying. What do you think about the below code?

<html>
<head>
<?php
$users = array('john', 'paul', 'mark', 'luke');


$admin = array('dan', 'ify', 'chris', 'jane');
if (isset($_POST['submit1'])) {$june = $_POST
['paul'];


$members = 'Sorry,but you are not recognised in our database';}


if ($june == $users[0] || $june == $users[1] || $june == $users[2] || $june == $users[3]){print ('welcome'); }


else if ($june == $admin[0] || $june == $admin[1] || $june == $admin[2] || $june == $admin[3]) {print ('Welcome back,
SuperAdmin'); }

else {print ($members);
}
?>
</head><body>


<form name = 'trial' method = 'post' action =
'<?php $_SERVER[PHP_SELF];?>'>


<input type = 'TEXT' Name = 'paul' value = 'user'>


<input type = 'submit' value = 'enter' Name =
'submit1'>
</body>
</form>
</html>

wrapping d conditions in <for loop> would av produced a cleaner codes …too many logical operators der is just too unreadable

imo Bill Gates shouldn't be in top ten.

kalan: Yes there is.

M.Sc Production & operations Management|Business Administration|4 Semesters|N90,000.00

enjoy.

pls do u av an idea abt msc computer science tuition fees. Thanks

pls I plan to obtain unilag msc form which is yet to be out. pls anyone with computer sciences past questions?

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python, JavaScript & jquery, PHP, vb, lil bit of c++, html5,CSS
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