₦airaland Forum

Olubachar: The horse,the man & the son(Ketekete) - Evangelist Ebenezer Obey

E kilo fomo ode - KSA

A lowo ma jaye - Ebenezer obey

Mummy - buga

thehomer: Are you saying that you decide whether or not it was God if the dream is positive and comes to pass? This is a text book example of confirmation bias.

thehomer: How can you say I recognized the existence of evil spirits when I've already told you that based on what you believe, it could have been your devil. Personally, I think you're just having a cognitive bias. Since you're not willing to accept that, I'll like to know if you could tell the difference between a dream sent to you by your God or one sent to you by your devil.

Logic Mind: u just admitted that you are hopeless

Jack65: Cheap reason Well it might be cheap to you but for people with higher IQ its not. See that's the difference you fundies and atheists. You believe everything you read in the bible just because it says its the word of god while we diligently examine and question every extraordinary claims made in the bible. You accept every claim on faith even when your reason and common sense is screaming back at you while we listen and aply these natural gifts.

This is the age of reason, you should start making use of yours. The bible is the work of men (primitive men). It contains a lot of errors, contradictions and absurdities. It cannot be an ispiration of any god.

thehomer: No, the first sentence shows that according to your beliefs, you have no way of knowing whether or not it was actually God that answered your prayers or the devil. No I don't believe in the devil but you do. Since you do, unless you have some way of knowing that he wasn't the one answering your prayers, then you really cannot say it was God.



What is the difference? How do you know the difference while you're dreaming or when you wake up?



How does it cause the body while the sperm and the egg don't cause the body? Is the soul tied to a body so it cannot jump to another? How about the spirit? Can that one jump to another body?

Jack65: Come on man! Are you telling me that you believe absolutely that god created the Univers and its inhabitants in 6 days ?

Are you telling me you believe that gods after being please with his creation, just few generations later was angry, disapointed and regreted he created man. Then went on to flood the whole earth, killing almost everything ?

Are you telling me you believe that because Adam ate a fruit which god placed just to test him the whole of mankind is punished by the same God who allowed Satan to decive him ?

Are you telling me you believe that God can actually wrestle with a man and yet be unable to defeat that man ?

Are you telling me you believe some body can part a sea just by know his wlking stick on a stone ?

Are you telling me you believe someone can walk on water ?

Are you telling me you believe a man can just be taken up to heaven, I mean without dying by charriots ?

Come on!!!!

Jack65: Actually I have every reason to generalize, of course you can object but tell me who your pastor is and then tell me how he is signicantly deferent from the fake and corrupt pastors/MOG according to you. I guarantee you there is none whatsoever, all you have again is faith and confidence in that particular MOG.

You don't need to ask yourselves question I think you do. Are you telling me you believe absolutely in everything the bible says? Mind you, for you to be a Christian you must believe and accept the bible as the infallible word of God. Is that your position

PA1982: Handle me?
Is this an offer for a hmmmm 'special prayer' session?
What possible concern is it of yours what my beliefs are?
Have I asked yours?

My point is that posts made with sourced information are brushed aside here as being 'cut and paste', usually by YECs, oddly enough.
You know very well there are people here at Nairaland who think the Sun revolves around the Earth.
You know very well there are people here at Nairaland who think the first humans came into existence 6,000 years ago.

And you know that those who no longer believe such nonsense or were never taught it are branded atheists, whatever their religious afiliation.

Logic only has validity if it's informed. Otherwise, we're back to da Vinci's trial.

PA1982: This would be very, very funny if it weren't for the fundies who cut and paste arguments from AiG, etc.
Stop being a hypocrite!

Everyone knows that people who disagree with Fundies are labelled 'atheist', even me!
Everyone knows what you call 'copy and paste method' is simply looking up a subject, investigating and quoting.
Everyone know that what you call 'a logical manner' is to agree with you.

Stop being a hypocrite.
Get informed.

Jack65: By questions I didn't mean the type of stupid questions Christians ask atheists here on Nairaland. I mean the questions you should be asking your leaders and the so called MOG concerning your beliefs and the biblical errancies. Most of all the questions you should be asking yourselves.

thehomer: Could it not be the devil that answered when you called? Your second sentence already shows a problem. You've effectively said that whether or not your prayer was answered, God knew about. How can you be sure he knew about it if it wasn't answered? Did he tell you? If you're unwilling to test whether or not God will answer your prayer, then how do you know the last prayers you thought God answered weren't just coincidences? When one has a doubt about something, what do they do? They don't just accept it, they try to check for confirmation or act as though the doubt was absent or minimized.



How do you know that a dream you had yesterday is telling you about events 10 years in your future while the dream you had the day before was of no consequence?



The soul causes the body? How about the sperm and egg? Can your soul/spirit leave your body and enter another person's body and control that person?

Jack65: CEHCK!!! Of course most atheist were Christians or Muslims before becoming an atheist. Also you don't just call yourself an atheist, it takes some level of reasoning and questions (unanswered of course) to come to the conclusion that god does not really exist. And that reasoning leads us to actually examine the bible or koran, thereby coming to that logical conclusion.

Therefore the problem with Christianity and other revealed religions is their inabilty or should I say fear of asking questions. They simply chose to swallow everything their bible and pastor says hook line and sinker. And then blame it on FAITH!

Thank god I am an Atheist!

Deep Sight: Faith in what, Martian, I think you need to define.

You have faith yourself - in certain things. You may for example have faith in the loyalty of a loved one, no? Faith in your ability to pass an exam, no?

If you can have faith in these things, why? Its because you have experienced such loyalty, or such ability. As such you have faith. It comes from your experience.

hmmmm,word!

Now tell me, in that light - why can I not have faith for example, in my dreams - if it has been my life long experience that my dreams consistently play out in reality with precision shortly after they occur. In such a circumstance, is it not only natural that I will have faith in the consistency of my dreams?

Now, if I can have faith in my dreams, why can someone else not have faith in say, his prayers?

Now, what is the distance between faith in prayer and faith in God?

Sometimes we should not allow the excess of our critical exuberance to make us attempt to do the undoable: namely: attempt to limit the boundaries of someone else's reality.

thehomer: Several points here. How do you know that iijkjut was your God that answered your prayer? How do you even know your prayer was answered since even if it wasn't answered, you're likely to say it is a good thing. Are you willing to test whether or not your God will answer your prayer?



You believe in your God because you had a dream in which you saw some future events in your life? How sure are you that you're not just succumbing to confirmation bias? After all, how about the dreams that you had which didn't tell you anything about future events?



This sounds like a terrible God of the gaps argument. How sure are you that there is even a soul/spirit?

Logic Mind: Contradiction is the mark of religionists/atheists.

thehomer: Several points here. How do you know that it was your God that answered your prayer? How do you even know your prayer was answered since even if it wasn't answered, you're likely to say it is a good thing. Are you willing to test whether or not your God will answer your prayer?

I knew he was the one that answered my prayer because he's the one i called/asked. I knew my prayers were answered because,i received it. I'm not willing to test whether he'll answer my prayer or not because i dont doubted God.



You believe in your God because you had a dream in which you saw some future events in your life? How sure are you that you're not just succumbing to confirmation bias? After all, how about the dreams that you had which didn't tell you anything about future events?

I considered the dreams that reveal not,the future events
as non important.

This sounds like a terrible God of the gaps argument. How sure are you that there is even a soul/spirit?

Logic Mind: did your mum drop your head on the floor when you were born or do you have a genetically malformed brain as to not be able to understand a simple question?
i don't care what you want from atheists!
i just want to know what you want "theists/religions people in the house" do in stead of "arguing with all the atheists on this forum!

bigd4050: Well friend, if you actually read my post, you would see I am a Christian. If you had really read MY post, you would see I never said you were preaching to atheists. I'm saying if you would actually debate them with respect and logical points, you might actually win one over to God. I'm saying you will refine yourself, and it exposes Christians like you with a pathetic attitude. If you aren't supposed to talk to people who don't believe in God, how will you ever save ANYONE?

ea7: sigh

Logic Mind: you still haven't answered my question. Your original post was addressed to theists/religions people in the house. And my question concerns these theists/religions people in the house. Can you please let us know what you would rather have these "theists/religions people in the house" do in place of engaging atheists in arguments?

bigd4050: I am a Christian, and I disagree with the OP. There are many good reasons to debate atheists:

1) Witnessing opportunity: it is rare, but if you can actually convince an atheist that they are wrong, you have won someone over to God.

2) Honing your own personal beliefs: Why would you just want a bunch of Christians on here talking about how good God is? If you wanted that, go to church. Debating on forums is an excellent way to see if what you think stacks up against what other people think. If nothing else, it refines you.

3) It actually exposes many Christians: there are many Christians that post on this site that really have no idea what they are talking about. When they get destroyed by the atheists and the Christians for making such illogical and stupid statements, it should open their eyes. I have yet to see that on this site, but I have seen it on others. The two big ones I have seen on this site are Rastamouse and Synthsis. They might throw a good point or two out there, but most of their stuff is just garbage that shouldn't be accepted by atheists or Christians.

Logic Mind: my question was what would you rather have "theists/religions people in the house"[/i]do in stead of [i]"arguing with all the atheists on this forum!

logicboy: There is quite the compelling evidence that prayer is not effective. For you to claim that God answers your prayers shows that you're a liar and a bit delusional.

Even if God answers your prayer, then your God is biased as there are millions suffering that pray everyday, yet nothing happesn. Why should God focus on you?

Martian: Any religionist can use this line, does it mean everyone is right? If an answered prayer is evidence of a god, what makes your god special?



Can you expound on this.



What is a soul/spirit?

thehomer: Okay.
Lets begin this conversation with this question. Why do you believe in your God?

logicboy: My profile is evidence. Show me the cut and paste.

You are a liar.

2good: But everything you religious folks spread around and believe in is based on what you were indoctrinated with from birth, so what makes you any better? Also majority of Christians to be specific go to church, do away with all sense basic reasoning and accept everything fed to them by their pastors hook line and sinker and the result is what you have in Nigeria. People refuse to think and use their brain to solve problems but instead allow others to think for them. The best way to live your life is to stop bothering yourself with what other people believe in and also mind your business by not imposing what you believe on others. I was brought up in a very religious Christian home and my entire family is still extremely religious but that didn't stop me from choosing my own part which of course came with strong criticism and condemnation but I have overtime been able to put every religious bigot around me where they should be why not trying to impose my believe on others. The point is stop pushing your believe down the throat of others and then there wont be need for argument.