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Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:24am On Jun 06, 2019

true2god:
That's the issue when one don't understand the foundation of a text, he will only commit to memory without knowledge and understanding. It is nursery pupils that will recite 'A for apple', 'B for ball', etc. If one ask most of them to start writing the letters now, many of them can't. It is unfortunate this same scenario repeats itself among the adult Muslims.

kpele..I know it pains you that we memorized it. Why do you think we attended madrasa? It was meant to be educated or literate (able to read and write). So we have no problems writing entire Qur'an off hand

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:21am On Jun 06, 2019

true2god:
Sorry bro, during the time of Mohammed there is no any single sahaba that have all the Quran on his head, none, because the Quran had not been codified as a single book as we have today. The compilations and codification was done by Othman ibn affan (over 20 years after the death of Mohammed). In one of the hadith, an ayah was found with only ONE man (and no other person has the ayah except him) and he even threatened not to release it but did for the sake of Allah and his messenger. Not all ayah were committed to memory; some where written on Camel skin, leaves, bones, cloths, etc while some committed few random ayah to memory. And many of the sahabas that committee these few random ayah to memory were killed in the battle of yamama which galvanized the compilation of the Quran as a single text to avoid further loss of the Quran.

This informant is in your sahih bukhari (sahih bukhari 6:61:509).

try harder. Too late for you to come up with nonsense in 2019. If you burn all Quran in the world today, I'm 100% sure Muslims would produce another ones exactly as it was. We have no problems with that. Can you say the same.of Bible. Absolutely not.

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:16am On Jun 06, 2019

What else can be said when evidence pointed that they married?. She would flog you right now if she was here

true2god:
I won't call mariyya a sex object to Mohammed (out of respect) but can call her a concubine. She was a beautiful young girl, together with her sister, gifted to Mohammed by a leader of the old Byzantine Egypt, perhaps as a symbol of peace. Other materials gift, aside the two girls, were equally given to Mohammed.

Mary the copt was never listed in any Islamic source document (hadith or sirah) as one of his wives. As a matter of fact some hadith used the term 'slave for her'. The only leverage she had was bearing a son (who died shortly after) hence elevated her social status among Mohammed's wives and the society.

If she was a wife to Mohammed, Aisha and hafsa will not complain if Mohammed was sleeping with her.

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:14am On Jun 06, 2019

true2god:
I won't give much time to this propaganda and sugarcoating of facts to make Mohammed and his wives appear like a model home and family. At least, in one occasion, Abu Bakr and Umar ibn kathab (the fathers of Aisha and Hafsa) had slapped their daughters for being too troublesome and disrespectful to Mohammed. This incident is in your sahih Bukhari.

I will go with what the hadith says about their character and not with what a random Muslim apologist tells me. And if they are model wives, as you claim, both ladies (Aisha and Hafsa) will not become sworn enemies to Fatima (Mohammed's only surviving child) after the death of Mohammed. Let's leave this issue for now abeg.

now it is about his wives?. You are incredibly.

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:12am On Jun 06, 2019

worlexy:
Funny you. it's apparent that you've not read your Quran well enough.

Quran 2:28, 73 clearly states that Allah is the ONLY one that gives life and causes death and even brings the dead to life.

Quran 3:49 clearly states that Jesus gave life to a clay bird and the clay bird became a living bird

Quran 5:110 stated that Jesus Raised the Dead, Gave life to clay bird, healed the blind, healed the lepers. It also stated that Jesus was given clear proof and Holy Spirit

Note that none of this wonders and Miracle was performed by Mohammed o(yet you call him the greatest prophet and you claim that Jesus is not the son of God ) . They are exclusive to God and Jesus.

Quran 3:45 clearly started that Jesus is the Word of God(Just like in John 1:1-5)

Quran 6:73 says Allah's word(not words, which implies Jesus as stated in Q3:45) is the Truth. Compare that one with John 14:6 where Jesus said he's the way the truth and the life

If you're getting confused or doubting these words in the Quran, Allah has instructed you in Quran 10:94 that if Mohammed and Muslims are in doubt of what is revealed to you in the Quran that you should ask the Christians who have been reading the Scriptures before you.

The same Quran clearly states that it was revealed to confirm what is in the scriptures and not to abolish the Bible (Quran 2:41, 89, 91, 97 etc). So the Bible remains the reference and standard for the Quran and the Muslims.

Now to salvation, Quran 46:9 states that Mohammed is NOT something original among the messengers, neither did he know what will be done to him, as he only followed what is revealed to him.

And Mohammed didn't even know the person that revealed the Quran to him, the so called Angel Gabriel never introduced himself to Mohammed as an angel from God, it was Mohammed's wife that 'thought ' the spirit appearing to Mohammed was Angel Gabriel.

Allah never spoke to Mohammed like he spoke to Abraham, Moses and Jesus in the Quran, and even when the angel of God went to talk to Mary in the Quran, the angel introduced himself as being from God.

From these, the identity of the spirit that recited Quran to Mohammed is unknown, hence our doubt, and the good thing is that the spirit said we can confirm the authenticity of the Quran by checking the Bible, so anything in the Quran that's not in the Bible remains null and void(Quran 10:94)

On the contrary, Jesus told his followers that he knew where he was going and that he was going to prepare a place for us because in His father's house, there are mansions there (John 14:2-3) and the Quran stated that Jesus cannot lie because he was given clear proof and Pure Spirit (Quran 5:110).

The decision is yours to make now. Choose today whom you will serve.

Shalom

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 2:13am On Jun 06, 2019*

sagenaija:
You will MOST PROBABLY respond to this my post with another long-winding write up. YET you couldn't answer the question on Hafs and Warsh but said until Ramadan is over and SUDDENLY what do you come up with? The following:

just some hrs ago I referred you to previous pages on hafs and Warsh but your still came back here posting nonesense undecided

The question again:
Is it the same ARABIC word that is used in both Hafs and Warsh versions of the Koran in chapter 3:146 for “fought” [Hafs] and “killed” [Warsh]?

definitely I have answered this few days ago but you failed woefully to grasp. I told you that whether it is "fought" or "killed" are simply choice of words by translators. The Arabic word used in the Qur'an and in that verse you quoted is "Qattala" which means "to kill", "to fight".

Differences come up with how the sentences are used. So Qattala is simply the way it was revealed but the meaning doesn't change. Where changes occurs are the various signs on the arabic alphabets not the word itself. Look at this Qattala in Arabic, قَتَلَ . Zoom in to pay attention to signs on the letters. Qof ق has a sign like this hyphen (-) over it. Same with ta ت and lam ل . This is the basic pronounciation قَتَلَ. It is verb.

It may also be pronounced differently with different signs above and below the 3 letters simultaneously. This can be noun but it is still the same word "Qattala".

Are you learning something?. So zoom the screenshot. But I doubt you understand anything bcus you will return here with dumb questions.

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 1:38am On Jun 06, 2019

sagenaija:
Is there any line of Moslems that have transmitted the Koran through MEMORY ONLY without resort to the physical Koran FROM THE TIME OF MOHAMED UNTIL NOW?

it seemed you missed out of this recent Ramadan and every Ramadan. Entire Qur'an is recited offhand on salatul taraweeh. So Quran is committed to memory by many muslims. And imams don't just recite randomly but they recite every chapter accordingly from Sura Fathia to sura Nas.

Entire 114 chapters all over the world in Ramadan

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 12:56am On Jun 06, 2019*

sagenaija:
Ask yourself this simple question:
Does what I wrote up there ADDRESS any of the questions raised?

Are you in the comedy business?

These were your questions below.

sagenaija:
Let me try and use a few questions to debunk your response.
1. Is something in the memory the same as something written in a book?
2. So, is the thing in people's memory INSIDE today's Koran?

Don't think I'm a fool. I deliberately left out the rest of your posts so that you don't get worked up. Unfortunately you still got worked up

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 12:22am On Jun 06, 2019*

sagenaija:
When you BLATANTLY LIE I wonder what goes on in your head.

Sometimes I wonder too why you seem to be reasoning like a little child. Honestly.

Let me try and use a few questions to debunk your response.
1. Is something in the memory the same as something written in a book?
2. So, is the thing in people's memory INSIDE today's Koran?

Ask any muslim to recite surah ikhlas for you offhand. He/she will recite exactly what is in the Book. Ask he/she to write it down in arabic, he/she won't fail to do so. I am not talking about lazy muslim. I am talking about learned ones.

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:45pm On Jun 05, 2019

true2god:
Sunan An-Nasa'i 3411 —It was narrated from Anas, that the Messenger of Allah had a female slave with whom he had intercourse, but Aishah and Hafsah would not leave him alone until he said that she was forbidden for him. Then Allah, the Mighty and Sublime, revealed: "O Prophet! Why do you forbid (for yourself) that which Allah has allowed to you" [66:1]

Remember, he made an oath to his wives, a promise, which he couldn't keep by going back to the same slave woman his wives had created issue on. What happened next? Allah revealed Quran 66:1,

"O Prophet, why do you prohibit [yourself from] what Allah has made lawful for you, seeking the approval of your wives? And Allah is Forgiving and Merciful."

And don't forget, I told you that the Quran is nothing but the wishes and desires of Mohammed which the second incident rightly confirmed again.

Asalama lekum!

Still on Surah 66:1-5, The Hadith describing the reason for the revelation of verse 66: 4 of Quran in [url=https://www.Volume 3, Book 43, Number 648:/]Sahih Bukhari [/url] Read for yourself. This hadith is true but with understanding (Al-Ahzab 33:28-29), which has related story narrated by Umar bn Khattab(ra) which indicated wives of the prophet(saw) were astonished by luxury stuff.

"I said (to Allah's Apostle) "Invoke Allah to make your followers prosperous for the Persians and the Byzantines have been made prosperous and given worldly luxuries, though they do not worship Allah?' The Prophet was leaning then (and on hearing my speech he sat straight) and said, 'O Ibn Al-Khatttab! Do you have any doubt (that the Hereafter is better than this world)? These people have been given rewards of their good deeds in this world only.' I asked the Prophet".

So Allah SWT revealed the Ayat:

(O Prophet! Say unto thy wives: “If ye desire the world’s life and its adornment, come! I will content you and will release you with a fair release. But if ye desire Allah and His Messenger and the abode of the Hereafter, then lo! Allah hath prepared for the good among you an immense reward”) (Al-Ahzab 33:28-29).

The Prophet (SAW) wives did wish for the worldly gains, The Prophet (S) gave them the choice as stated in the Ayat above, but they always chose the Prophet Muhammad (SAW). Yusuf Ali even confirms this by saying :

" We now come to the subject of the position of the Consorts of Purity, the wives of the holy Prophet. Their position was not like that of ordinary women or ordinary wives. They had special duties and responsibilities. The only youthful marriage of the Holy Prophet was his first marriage- that with Hadhrat Khadija, the best of women and the best of wives. He married her fifteen years before he received his call to Apostleship; their married life was twenty-five years and their mutual devotion was of the noblest, judged by spiritual as well as social standards. During her life he had no other wife which was unusual for a man of his standing among his people. When she died his age was 50 and but for two considerations, he would probably never have married again, as he was most abstemious in his physical life. The two considerations which governed his marriage later were : (1) compassion and clemency, as when he wanted to provide for suffering widows, who could not be provided for in any other way in that stage of society; some of them like Sauda had issue by their former marriage, requiring protection; (2) help in his duties of leadership with women who had to be instructed and kept together in the large Muslim family, where women and men had similar social rights. Hadhrat 'Aisha, daughter of Hadhrat Abu Bakr, was clever and learned, and in Hadith she is an important authority on the life of the Prophet. Hadhrat Zainab, daughter of Khuzaima was specially devoted to the poor : she was called the "Mother of the Poor: . The other Zainab, daugher of Jahsh also worked for the poor, for whom she provided from the proceeds of her manual work, as she was skilful in leather in leather work. But all the consorts in their high positions had to work and assist as Mother of the Ummat. Theirs were not idle lives, like those of Odalisques, either for their own pleasure or the pleasure of their husband. They are told here that they had no place in the sacred household if they merely wished for ease or worldly glitter. If such was the case, they would be divorced and amply provided for."

Furthermore, Yusuf Ali states:

" They(wives of the prophet) were all well-doers. But being in their exalted position they had extra responsibility, and they had to be specially careful to discharge it. In the same way their reward would be "great", for higher services bring higher spiritual satisfaction, though they were asked to deny themselves of the ordinary indulgences of this life".

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 9:20pm On Jun 05, 2019*

Let's analyse what your problem. It is official we have put to rest Hafs and Warsh. Thats out of the way. Now we are dealing with Q66 v 1 in connection with hadith you believe is attributed to the ayah. Let's for the sake of this argument assume it is about about honey but about women.

true2god:
Please note that the hadith is not only a story but the sunnah of the Islamic prophet. It is a standard, an example, for Muslims to follow. The issue is not merely what God made, or did not, halal but the gravity is the issue involved. If the issue is honey, as most Muslims want us to accept, this issue would have been closed since, but there are two contradictory hadith that tried to explain Quran 66:1. And we can only based our conclusion using 'the principle of embarrassment'.

Oh so you are muhadith now right?. You in the position to tell us which hadith was spoke by prophet now?...continue.

Principle of Embarrassment: is a principle that is employed to validate the trustworthiness, authenticity, and truthfulness of any historical document. The principle is such that if there are 2 conflicting accounts of an event, the more embarrassing account is likely to be closer to the truth because the person narrating the incident has no reason to paint his hero in a bad light.

In a layman example, if a father goes to the public and say his son is a thief but his mum, almost at the same time, comes to counter his father by telling the public that he is not a thief, the more embarrassing account is usually closer to the truth.

Now back to the issue, the most and best explanation to Quran 66:1 is to follow the hadith below, and not the cook up by bukhari:

Sunan An-Nasa'i 3411 —It was narrated from Anas, that the Messenger of Allah had a female slave with whom he had intercourse, but Aishah and Hafsah would not leave him alone until he said that she was forbidden for him. Then Allah, the Mighty and Sublime, revealed: "O Prophet! Why do you forbid (for yourself) that which Allah has allowed to you" [66:1]

Remember, he made an oath to his wives, a promise, which he couldn't keep by going back to the same slave woman his wives had created issue on. What happened next? Allah revealed Quran 66:1,

"O Prophet, why do you prohibit [yourself from] what Allah has made lawful for you, seeking the approval of your wives? And Allah is Forgiving and Merciful."

And don't forget, I told you that the Quran is nothing but the wishes and desires of Mohammed which the second incident rightly confirmed again.

Asalama lekum!

Okay, so your issue with our prophet(saw) is that he slept with a slave or kept breaking his promises?. I am trying to figure out where you stand and what you stand to gain here. Without wasting much time, regardless of what you preconceived notion is, you seem to assume that Mariyahwas his "sex object"?. Well, whatever the secret was, what is clear was that we have evidence that Muhammad(pbuh) married Mariyah. There are sources that tell us that Mariyah was married to the Prophet. So whatever they did was their business.

Here is a documented text to prove this:

The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) contracted some of his marriages for sociopolitical reasons. His principal concern was the future of Islam. He was interested in strengthening the Muslims by all bonds. That is why he married the young daughter of Abu Bakr, his First Successor, and the daughter of `Umar, his Second Successor. It was by his marriage to Juwayriyyah that he gained the support for Islam of the whole clan of Bani Al-Mustaliq and their allied tribes. It was through marriage to Safiyyah that he neutralized a great section of the hostile Jews of Arabia. By accepting Mariyah, the Copt from Egypt, as his wife, he formed a political alliance with a king of great magnitude. It was also a gesture of friendship with a neighboring king that Muhammad married Zaynab who was presented to him by the Negus of Abyssinia in whose territory the early Muslims found safe refuge

Ibn Kathir is quoted to have said:

Maria al-Qibtiyya (may Allah be pleased with her) is said to have married the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) and certainly everyone gave her the same title of respect as the Prophet's wives, 'Umm al Muminin' 'Mother of the Believers'. Muhammad must have come in contact with many of these Copts and listened to their stories. Muhammad's friendship to Christians of Coptic faith is reflected in many aspects of his life. He is known to have had cordial relations with the Negus of Abyssinia, as indicated by the fact that he advised his followers at a time of persecution to flee there. He married a Coptic wife named Mariya, and he is reported to have advised his followers to be especially kind to the Copts of Egypt, considering them his in-laws.

(R.H. Charles, "Vitae Adae et Evae," The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha [Oxford, 1963] Volume 2, p. 294)

Other non Islamic sources list Mariya as the Prophets spouse:

http://users.legacyfamilytree.com/NorthernEurope/f110.htm

http://www.peterwestern.f9.co.uk/maximilia/pafg887.htm#26206

Interestingly you discarded Bukhari here because it doesn't suit you, right....continue

I am not done yet on Q66:1 since you chose to bring it up.

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 5:43pm On Jun 05, 2019

sagenaija:
Do we have Muhammad's Qur'an today?
Hatun discusses with a Muslim why the Qur'an Muslims have today is not the same as the one Muhammad received.

Sunan ibn Majah 1944—It was narrated that Aishah said: “The Verse of stoning and of breastfeeding an adult ten times was revealed, and the paper was with me under my pillow. When the Messenger of Allah died, we were preoccupied with his death, and a tame sheep came in and ate it.”
https://youtu.be/P66.hQUbfB4c

Fabrication! Common sense didnt tell you that if sheep ate verse of Quran written on a paper, did sheep also eat that same verse from people's memory?. Quran was committed to memory as it was revealed before written down Use your brain.

And @bold, do you even believe in Muhammad's Quran you are asking for?. I guess not

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 5:38pm On Jun 05, 2019

sagenaija:
You write "epistle" on every other matter apart from the ones you are confronted with.
You will claim you have no time but are ready to spend time on deflection of the line
of argument.

You gave NO EXAMPLE or response to answer this simple question:

Scroll down to the bottom of 15 on June 3. I replied and gave example on this subject. It is now closed bcus your buddy refused to acknowledge it just like you do or you both acknowledge within yourselves but cant responds appropriately. Case closed

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 5:32pm On Jun 05, 2019

true2god:
On Quran 66:1, you brought it up because I told you, based on Aisha's own testimony that Mohammed's lord always 'hasten to fulfil his wishes and desires' hence my conclusion that the Quran was nothing but the wishes and desires of Mohammed. And I equally told you that I go with the Maliki school of thought which explained that this ayah got to do with a slave girl called Mariya (a Coptic slave who later gave birth to a son named Ibrahim) who Mohammed usually slept with in Hafsat house whenever she is away. She (Hasfa) found out and, together with Aisha, confronted Mohammed about it while Mohammed promised never to do that again until Allah revealed Quran 66:1. If you read Quran 66: 1-5, you will see that it has nothing to do with honey bro. No wife will disrespect her husband because co-wife is giving him honey to retain their attention. The hadith of bukahri and the tafsir of ibn kathir on this ayah is ridiculous and untenable.

This is the hadith that support above argument and rightfully explained by your famous scholar Jalalayn:

Sunan An-Nasa'i 3411 —It was narrated from Anas, that the Messenger of Allah had a female slave with whom he had intercourse, but Aishah and Hafsah would not leave him alone until he said that she was forbidden for him. Then Allah, the Mighty and Sublime, revealed: "O Prophet! Why do you forbid (for yourself) that which Allah has allowed to you" [66:1]

And if, for the benefit of the doubt, we are to give the tafsir of ibn kathir a thought and his supporting hadith, what does that make of the character of Aisha? A liar who deceived and lied to her husband out of jealousy but at the same time one of the largest contributor to the hadith collections? What authority can one grade an hadith by Aisha if she had been caught lying before? If hadith collected by Hafs can be rejected based on his personal integrity, why did Sunni Muslims accept his narrations in sahih bukhari (and sahih Muslim)? And this is the reason you wrote:

'There is more to this story why the verse was revealed'.

There is nothing more to any story bro, we fully understand. Whichever tafsir who chose to use, Ibn kathir or Jalalayn, it prove one fact, the Quran is contradictory based on the fact your own tafsir and hadith contradicted each other on the interpretations of a single ayah. As a matter of honesty and truthfulness, the tafsir of Jalalayn is more credible on this issue.

Asalama lekum!

There are various reports to the story. Read below. Two narrators mentioned about honey. One mentioned about a slave woman. But are telling us one thing in common as i highlighted in my previous post - not to make halal what God made haram and not to make haram what God has made halal for oneself. That's the moral of the story.

Now read below

According to Imam al-Qurtuby in his tafsir there are several narrations which are considered as the story behind these verses:

'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) narrated that Allah's Apostle (ﷺ) used to spend time with Zainab daughter of Jahsh and drank honey at her house. She ('A'isha further) said: I and Hafsa agreed that one whom Allah's Apostle (ﷺ) would visit first should say: I notice that you have an odour of the Maghafir (gum of mimosa). He (the Holy Prophet) visited one of them and she said to him like this, whereupon he said: I have taken honey in the house of Zainab bint Jabsh and I will never do it again. It was at this (that the following verse was revealed): 'Why do you hold to be forbidden what Allah has made lawful for you... (up to). If you both ('A'isha and Hafsa) turn to Allah" up to:" And when the Prophet confided an information to one of his wives" (lxvi. 3). This refers to his saying: But I have taken honey. (This is the hadith version of sahih Muslim)
An other version where Hafsa (May Allah be pleased with her) was the woman whom gave her husband the honey. And the "conspiracy" was between 'Aisha and Sawdah (May Allah be pleased with both of them) (here a link to the version of sahih Muslim). Note in a narration of ibn Abi Malykah on the authority of ibn 'Abbas (May Allah be pleased with both of them) it was Sawdah whom gave him the honey, others narrated that it was Um Salamah.

A different story, where the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) has declared a slave (some say it's Maria al-Qibtiyah -the Coptic-) as prohibited to him. (Here a reference from sunan an-Nasa-i)

Al Qurtoby said the most sane or strongest of these narration is the first and the weakest the second and he quoted some narrations of Maliki scholars which seem to support the 3rd narration to some extent. (Here's a link to an English translation -apparently summarized- of tafsir ibn Kathir, where you may find the same narrations maybe with more details, as especially the 3rd narration quoted in tafsir al-Qurtoby is much longer than the version of sunan an-Nasa-i).

According to that either the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) declared honey as a prohibited food to him, or he has declared his slave girl as prohibited to him. Note that according the hadith he made an oath on that, and he asked the wife he was addressing when he made this oath to keep it a secrete, but she didn't keep the secrete and that is what is referred to in the verses (65:1-5).

The major meaning of the verse -you are asking about- is that one shouldn't prohibit to himself what is made lawful (halal) for him, just to get the approval of others -no matter who they are-. While the next verses are explaining what is to do if one made an oath and prohibited to himself something which is lawful to him for the same purpose (approval of others).

https://islam.stackexchange.com/questions/31259/explanation-of-at-tahrim-verse-1-661

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 5:28pm On Jun 05, 2019

true2god:
You said I shut up on the issue of Hafs and Warsh inconsistencies, hope you are not responding to the wrong person. The issue of warsh and hafs have not gone away bro because you have not proved anything concerning the contradictions in the readings.

I tire ooo. Alright, it seems you too didn't pay attention. So go back up and read what I said and example I gave you since you claimed hafs and Warsh issue is still pretty much on the table..I am done with that because you still failed to counter. My post on hafs and warch and example I gave covers whatever I have missed of your posts. So we need not go back and forth. And I know why you can't counter. It is bcuz you don't know arabic or at the least basics. You copied and screenshot those things. I have provided you with example. Help yourself, bro.

On you super heavy weight Adepoju, I will contact him again via his Facebook account and do a screenshot to you. No need of devoting much on a man who is not currently a major topic of discussion. I briefly talked about him to tell you that, despite his 'bashing for a living' (Nigerian Muslim version of David wood) activity which he lived on for over 25 years (highly experienced), he has no single experience in defending Islamic beliefs and practices, based on my last engagement with him.

bla bla bla... Just do it already. Who talks help huh

Islam › Re: ...... by Empiree: 4:15pm On Jun 05, 2019

To recap, it is all completed (at 10 people) and you have all agreed?

The total is #128,000 disbursement. Correct me if I'm wrong?.

If it is correct, just wait bcuz at any moment from today you will receive it.

Islam › Re: ...... by Empiree: 9:55am On Jun 05, 2019

Tessyy1701:
@Sheik Empiree,
I want You to confirm the following too coz I don't want to "jè gbese"

LADUNAL= 15,000
LADKUD= 15,000
TESSYY1701= 15,000
USIYARO= 13,000
TEZERDYO= 13,000
AADOIZA= 13,000
NAFIZZEY= 12,000
PRINCEEPULE= 8,000
EXCEL70= 12,000

I hope I am correct

lanrexlan is missing

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 4:55am On Jun 05, 2019*

true2god:
You have schooled me on Hafs and warsh, seriously? You are a clown bro, a mosque clown for that matter. Even your fellow Muslims reading this thread cannot comment because they are embarrassed and you said you have 'schooled' me when you admitted you never even looked at the Haf-warsh screenshots I sent you. It seems you live in a fantasy world oblivious of reality.

If you are educated, you will agree with me that most modern debates and interviews are conducted via Skype and at least you will also have the opportunity to see my handsome face. I have watched many Christian-muslim debates that are conducted via Skype, both for cost, distance and security reasons. Start thinking like a 21st century man bro! I told you I asked Ustaz Adepoju for a debate but he refused and told me 'I only do open air lectures', meaning thrashing Christianity without being challenged on his Islamic beliefs.

I still stand by my words and will happily provide my contact if you can arrange a debate between us.

Umar ibn kathab was also instrumental in some Quranic revelations, I need you to comment on their sir? I also responded to your claim on Quran 66:1, you can do me a big favour touching on that one too. Don't deflect!

Asalama lekum!

Honestly, i am tired of you. See, you are still doing what i accused you off i:e jump from one topic to another. I knew you have been posting hafs and warsh all week and I told you that the one that caught my attention the most was your last screenshot which i responded to. Since i replied to that directly you have shutup on the subject bcus you have no counterclaim. Now you embarked on surah 66:1. Yet you accused me of not being educated or professional?. But you keep jumping from one topic to another like ~~monkey~~ lipsrsealed

This is is very reason i was reluctant to respond to you guys.

I have given you example of hafs and warsh. I need not to go back to that since you can not prove me wrong. Hafs and Warsh were never problems for us muslims at all. But bcuz you have ulterior motives you found a way to confused yourself and created imaginary discrepancies in the Quran. So Hafs and Warsh drama has been put to rest now. Going back to that will culminate dishonest on your part. As for debate with Adepoju, i remembered you said you challenged him and i told to provide proof that you did but he turned you down?. You never proved it. Now you repeated the same thing. Who believes you?. As Adepoju rightly said, go live with him one on one debate in the presence of crowd. Stop using "security reason" to evade the debate. Adepoju has debated many people and no one was bombed or killed. He has debated your pastors, bishipss evangelists etc. He debated a pastor named Segun who in fact, credited adepoju for being cool despite pressures to provoke him by his christian opponents. This is the same reason ifean, malvisguy and you provided 5 yrs ago when I asked you to challenge Adepoju on one on one debate. Five years later you are still using the same old excuse and you want me to believe you?.

Sir, Adepoju had whatsapp and facebook accounts where you can easily contact him openly for the world to see. Facebook is much better. We will all see how it goes. Or better still you know his program schedules. Join him there. Stop being keyboard warrior. As for Quran 66:1, what exactly is your issues with this one?. Usually it is evangelical christians that brought this up. You copied nonsense from their websites to argue here. Jay Smith was one of those evangelical christians that always come up with this over and over again despite having been taught to them.

God knows what exactly you are thinking about this verse and i think i know what you're thinking. Whatever it is you are thinking you are dead wrong. Quran 66:1 is teaching lawful and unlawful (Law) are only the right of Allah. Not even the prophet had power to make lawful unlawful vis-a-vis. This verse is said to be talking about Honey. Hafiz Ibn Kathir says: The truth is that this verse was sent down about forbidding honey upon himself by the Prophet (peace be upon him). There is more to this story why the verse was revealed.

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:32pm On Jun 04, 2019

true2god:
Is your sheik comfortable with debate via Skype? I would like him to also convert me after our debate. I used to think you are a heavyweight but its clear you are another Anthony Joshua.

you are happy with all the trash you have been posting all weeks?. You think I had your time?. I might have it now since Ramadan is over. Isn't too late for you to call for a debate with the sheikh but when we asked you guys some 5yrs to debate acadip you were all forming local champions and keyboard warriors.

Now you are calling for a debate on Skype?. Seriously? You think this sheik have time for that?. You are still a joke like you were 5yrs ago. You feel like you have more confidence now isn't?

You have been quite since I schooled you on hafs/Warsh with example I have you. Why bro why. And now you jumped on Aisha said, Umar said

Islam › Re: Islam For Muslims: Side Talk Station by Empiree: 8:14pm On Jun 04, 2019

^^^

I always know the spot where i placed my shoes cheesy

When you see shoes all over like this means they came late grin

They hurry to match salah before rising from rukuh cheesy

Islam › Re: ...... by Empiree: 8:13pm On Jun 04, 2019

Rahimat27:
I always see myself in the midst of people praying,performing ablution.I was feeling weak one night and I dreamt that I was offered a food and after waking up I felt so energized.I can communicate intentionally in my dreams but I have a weakness I usually mistake my dreams for reality

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 8:09pm On Jun 04, 2019

Say whatever you want. TWO PASTORS EMBRACED ISLAM THROUGH SHEIKH MUYIDEEN AJANI BELLO LECTURE.

Help yourself

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=2756066551076312&id=1984023931613915&fs=0&focus_composer=0

sagenaija:
Maybe this will make you overcome your boredom :.
Mohamed your hero and role model was uncertain of his salvation - Q.46:9

You cannot be more certain than Mohamed. In other words, you are not certain of your salvation.

But Jesus Christ said "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father but through me "

You follow a man who said: "By Allah though I am the Apostle of Allah, yet I DO NOT KNOW what Allah will do to me" - Sahih Bukhari

Jesus said "Come unto me all you who labour and are heavy ladden and i will give you rest"
"To all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God"
"There is .... no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus "

Islam › Re: ...... by Empiree: 2:58pm On Jun 04, 2019

Usiyaro:
Good day Sir Empiree, replied through our past conversations in the mail. Thanks once again.
Taqabballu minnaa wa minkum
Eidkum Mubaaraq

khayr Mubarak. REPLIED, SIR

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:13am On Jun 04, 2019

sagenaija:
It's your fear about being faced with the truth of Islam.
Your fear that your bag of excuses has been thrown open for all to see.
Your fear of being faced with the contradictions in your religion.
Your fear of confronting Allah's apparent lack of historical knowledge, scientific knowledge and basic human psychology.
Your fear of the insufficiency of the Koran and therefore resort to the hadiths.
Your fear that, at the end of the day, Koran is not a plainly revealed book so Moslems live their lives on their perceived understanding of Islam because the book makes nothing clear.

at no point did you make valid sense in this thread. You boring

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:12am On Jun 04, 2019

true2god:
Do you understand simple grammar at all? I said, based on Madam Aisha's testimony, that the Qur'an is purely the wishes and desires of Mohammed. Whatever was on Mohammed's mind, that was the revelation he received. It is a simple sentence that even a kindergarten pupil will understand and it baffles me that you are struggling with this reality. Do you think it will shake your faith? No wonder you have to build a 'firewall' around your thought to ensure that no any evidence penetrates.

Don't put words into my mouth, I know you are smart. I never said the Quran is the wishes and desires of his companions (who wrote down the Quran) but the wishes and desires of Mohammed himself. It is Mohammed's personal wishes and desires that made up the Quran while Allah is just a means to an end.

Asalama lekum!

if it is "purely wishes and desires of muhammad, why then muhammad cautioned himself in the Qur'an that he wishes and desires?.

Example Q 66:1

O Prophet, why do you prohibit [yourself from] what Allah has made lawful for you, seeking the approval of your wives? And Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.

Did he forget to removed that from Qur'an?

How about this Q73:1

O you who have wrapped up in your garments!

It was his wishes too?. Be sensible, man.

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:07am On Jun 04, 2019

true2god:
Christian Prince was born and raised in Egypt; an Arab by birth. He speaks Arabic as his first language and he had read the Quran from chapter 1 to chapter 116. He speaks, writes and understood Arabic better than you. He has a scholarship in Islamic theology hence makes him an authority in Islam. What's your qualification in Islamic theology? What scholarship do you have in Arabic language?

Muslims always make a demand that 'show me the Arabic Quran' and 'Islam can only be understood in its original Arabic'. Well, Christian prince obviously meet your stiff criteria, why didn't you bother watch the video? Will it shake your faith? Of course that's the greatest fear of any Muslim hence Allah, in the Quran, asked you guys never to ask questions so that you won't lose your faith. Why did Allah ask Muslims never to question their beliefs if he (Allah) is so sure of himself? That's to tell you that Allah has a very weak argument to defend Islam hence his admonition in Quran 5:101:

O you who believe! (Do) not ask about things if made clear to you, it may distress you and if you ask about it when the Quran is being revealed it would be made clear to you. Allah has pardoned [about] it, and Allah (is) Oft-Forgiving, All-Forbearing..

The Quran is very clear here, if Muslims are too inquisitive (on Islamic-related matters) it may cause them distress and eventually make them lose their faith in Islam. I fully understand your fear. Your guys, 'Tintinz' and 'usermane' have opened their mind, questioned Islam and have decided to leave for good. These are same people that I have debated, here on Nairaland, for more than 5 years.

Asalama lekum!

that he speaks Arabic, that he's Arab by birth, that arabic is his first language, and that he has read Quran are NOT PROOFS. Hear what Qur'an says

“And We send down of the Qur’aan that which is a healing and a mercy to those who believe (in Islamic Monotheism and act on it), and it increases the Zaalimoon (polytheists and wrongdoers) nothing but loss”.

[al-Isra’ 17:82]

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 12:33am On Jun 04, 2019

sagenaija:
Can you see what caught your attention in all that I wrote?
Virgins! Only that!

I am 100% certain that you're pained that you've not been able find anything to refute Christian Prince.

Sorry ehn! Pęlę!

you think I watched any of those video?. I didn't for your information. Why?. Because he's just exactly like David Wood, Michael Licona, Tommy Robbison etc

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 11:10pm On Jun 03, 2019

^^

see what i an talking about?/ And you expect me to take you guys serious? Whats 72 virgins gotta do with this?. Goes to show you that you only rely on hearsays CP. 72 virgins ko, 100 deflowers ni

1 Like

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:33pm On Jun 03, 2019

true2god:
It is very ridiculous for you to say you never looked at the screenshots. This is to say that your response so far had been based on blind argument, without looking at the evidences presented to you whether they are true of false. I think you need to apologize if you are not an arrogant man.

The different diacritical marks you talked about, does it have effect on the meanings of the ayah where there are different marks in the Hafs and Warsh Quran? Look at surah alfathiha (1:4), Hafs used 'owner' while Warsh used 'king', do they mean the same?

Look at surah albaqra ayah 10 (ayah 9 in Warsh), do they have the same meaning?

Apologise? that will be next world. When you two kept posting things without proper focus, i had no time to read details until your last screenshot that caught my attention but i did know you have been talking about Hafs and Warsh all along. So now, it is obvious with this reply of yours that you really have no knowledge of Hafs and Warsh afterall. You most likely just got the idea from those evangelist guys. I have provided you with examples of Hafs/warsh now. If you understand simple arabic you wont find it difficult to understand

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 10:12pm On Jun 03, 2019

true2god:
I still maintain my points, based on what Aisha (not you because Mohammed did not know you):

Narrated Aisha: I used to look down upon those ladies who had given themselves to Allah's Apostle and I used to say, "Can a lady give herself (to a man)?" But when Allah revealed: "You (O Muhammad) can postpone (the turn of) whom you will of them (your wives), and you may receive any of them whom you will; and there is no blame on you if you invite one whose turn you have set aside (temporarily).' (33.51) I said (to the Prophet),
"I feel that your Lord hastens in fulfilling your wishes and desires."
(Sahih Bukhari 6:60:311).

The key words I want you to pick are: YOUR WISHES AND DESIRES.

And?. you dont have wishes and desires?. Your point exactly?.

Now back to the argument and based on Aisha's testimony, most ayah of the Quran are wishes and desires of Mohammed. If that's the case, it was Muhammad's wishes and desires for his scribes to write down the Quran in Arabic, unless you can prove to me that there was another major languages people spoke in the Arabian peninsula, at the time of Mohammed, aside Arabic. You don't need any God to tell you that Mohammed's Quran will be written in Arabic; it is just a commonsense for any rational mind to grasp.

And when you bought up ayah where Mohammed was asked to 'say' and 'say", it does still change the fact that virtually all what we have in the Quran are Mohammed's wishes and desires. I didn't say so, Madam Aisha bint Abu Bakr did after much observation on the pattern of Mohammed's alleged revelations.

smh..do you understand anything at all? whats wishes and desires of companions to write down what prophet dictated for them?

Islam › Re: 10 Sharia Laws Retarding Scientific Growth by Empiree: 8:06pm On Jun 03, 2019

tintingz:
The barbaric practice and beliefs in the Qur'an and Hadiths are corrupting the souls of majority Muslims.

my question is, does usermane agrees with his statement @bold?.

Let's see where he stands since he's now in the cycle of disbelievers?

Christianity Etc › Re: Christian Prince Explains Islam by Empiree: 7:53pm On Jun 03, 2019

sagenaija:
If you don’t follow what your opponent in a debate is saying, it means you either lack the capacity to engage in it in a MEANINGFUL WAY or you do not even know why you are involved in it in the first place.

You call what others write “epistles” which you “don’t bother reading”. Then why engage in the first place? So, when you respond, what are you responding to?
And are you so sure that you don’t write “epistles” yourself?

The answer to the above is simple: You are afraid that it will SHAKE a foundational issue in your Islam. In Islam you are not allowed critical reasoning or to reason in any logical way. In Q. 5: 101 you are to ask no question. Questions lead to TRUTH. But apparently you don’t want the truth.

So, you refuse to read because it may expose you to the truth.

I have focussed on ONLY one thing for a while here YET you are still asking me to “quote chapter and verse in question in ARABIC text only … … bla, bla, bla”

Does that make sense even to you?

Maybe it makes sense if all you want is actually for us to be going around in a circle and moving nowhere.

This may be part of your tactics – “Let me wear them out so that when they quit I can shout ‘You have been refuted’, ‘You ran away!’.

Have you told us your understanding of “killed” and “fought” – Q.3:146?
Do the two words mean the same thing? Are the two the same word in the Arabic?

true2god posted screenshots including the very same verse I am referring to and you are still asking for screenshots. Didn’t you see those ones he posted also? Do you now see why I said you are SELF-DECEIVED and DECEPTIVE?

Even without screenshots, if I gave you a Koran reference don’t you have a Koran to read from? In these days of ACCESS to information wouldn’t you even have it in your phone? Is GOOGLE not even there to make things simpler?

You want to be a smart aleck who knows NOTHING of the field you think you can pride yourself so much in.

The ARABIC of the verse I am referring to has been posted in this thread. The issue with it has been highlighted. It is either that Ramadan is making your brain not to work correctly or it’s your usual DECEPTION TACTIC.

If you simply answered a simple one sentence question would there be need for an “epistle”? Maybe we should resort to a “hadith” to explain the question!

Is ARABIC a human language? Yes! Can a word in the ARABIC language be communicated to someone who understands ONLY a different language? Yes! Do Moslems today communicate Islam to people of other languages in their languages? Yes!
Is Islam preached in say, Yoruba language? Yes! So, what is the fuss over ARABIC?

The question again:
Is it the same ARABIC word that is used in both Hafs and Warsh versions of the Koran in chapter 3:146 for “fought” [Hafs] and “killed” [Warsh]?

see why we are not on the same page?. See why you keep going in cycle?. I told you that you quoted English and then concluded we have two versions of Quran. Scroll up to the Qur'an you cited. For ref, let me quote you

Have you told us your understanding of “killed” and “fought” – Q.3:146?
Do the two words mean the same thing? Are the two the same word in the Arabic?

I told you that translators used choice of words but you still repeated it. I'm so bored right now. I told you to screenshot Arabic text but you brought English up again. This is why I'm reluctant to read your post. You are repeating yourself everytime

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