₦airaland Forum

LifestyleTonite:
He is not cos ''by their fruit ye shall know them''.

Stop whining like it's only muslims that are helping. If checked, the percentage of help coming form the muslims won't be more than 5%. Compared that to the amount of help and aid that Christians have been giving to islamic countries for centuries..

Again, why are you talking about islam here?. The topic is about a famous christian man called Joel Osteen who can not provide help to victims of natural disaster. Soon after this debacle is over, and the man starts preaching good things again, you gonna say "he is a man of God"

LifestyleTonite:
Don't you understand. Governments are the ones to deal with certain offenders, not we Christians in a certain sense. The law of Christ is for us to love one another and to carry each other's burden. If you love a sinner, you won't kill that sinner but preach to the sinner. If he fails to repent, when he dies, he will face Judgment. Example was when the mob wanted to stone that woman accused of adultery, Jesus stopped them and showed them that a sinner cannot judge another sinner. Moreover, if you stone her to death, how will she repent of her sins? What if she was wrongly accused like we saw a comedian killed in Ikorodu after he was mistaken for Badoo member? You know nothing about the law of Christ.

Galatians 6:2 states, “Carry each other’s burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ”

Yeyeman, so why is Joel Osteen obligated to serve victims?. Isnt that govt responsibility?. In a secular society, govt is not concerned about moral law. This is where religious law sets in. Secular govt dont punish for fornication, homosick, etc. But they punish for killing and theft. So are you saying your Jesus has no moral conduct?. No rules and regulations?. Just preach and preach to offenders?. Have you not don that and what have you achieved?. Women still go to church almost naked and listen to "word of God".

yeye

LifestyleTonite:
He is not a true Christian cos he disobeyed the command of Master Jesus by not loving fellow Christian who needed help.

John 13:34-35

“A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.”

Like it or not, he is a christian. You only want to attribute good things to christianity. Anyways, sounds like muslims are more christians than christians themselves. It is muslims who shelter hurricane victims.

An2elect2:
A true Christian hears his master's voice and follow him but a wolf won't John 10:27

The master said He is the only way, his sheep obey. Dogs, pigs like Joel osteen won't.

Talk is cheap. Quotation is cheap. If famous and richest nigerian pastors and bishops that you people hallow all the time were tested like Joel Osteen, they would fail as well. But i wonder if you would suddenly claim they aren't christian?. That brings this question; do you actually have true christ followers at all?

An2elect2:
I agree with you. He is not under any obligation to help because he isn't a Christian just a phoney one

@bold is your opinion

He is a true christian

^

You are the ONLY NL-member that i ever I talked to with zero sense.

LifestyleTonite:
The punishment comes at the Judgment Day. If you decide to punish such people now, your own sins will prevent you cos you are not holy as well. That in no way endorses or encourages such sins.

CONTRADICTION!

You just contradicted yourself. So why did you quote that verse of yur bible about Jesus's law?. Laws are meant to be implemented right here on earth. If we are to apply your level of reasoning, then, you have no right to kill ritualists, thieves, so called witchcrafts whom you subjected to jungle justices when yourselves aren't free of all the accusations. Also you have no right to blame terrorists. Get the logic?. Keep deceiving yourself

LifestyleTonite:
@Last sentence

where did we say Jesus ordered everyone to do as they pleased?

Your christian doctrine is self sufficient to explain that to you. What is Jesus's law of punishment of blasphemy, adultery, fornication, killing and murder, homosexual. Answer this please. You have said Jesus has laws so answer am

AbuUthaymeen:
SUFI SHIA have been killing muslims tey tey . . shia keep murdering muslims in iran and other areas. . sufi have been murdering our scholars. .till date.. they sent abu ibeji to pris0n and shave his beared, beat, assassination attempt, lies, court orders, curses, vonoodoo,.,s(jabata,yusuf and our other scholars) and so many taunts. .em kill many of our scholars. . . AND WE NEVER TOUCH ANYONE OF U NOR SUE U TO COURT, NOR LIE, NOR KILL. .ALL WE DO IS TO EXPLAIN . . . .aw0n keferi oShi. . always aligning with authorities. . . .4ll

why u de vex

LifestyleTonite:
He's under an obligation to accommodate such people as long as he calls himself a Christian.

Galatians 6:2

2 Carry each other’s burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ


It is this Christian virtue that makes Christian Europe to accept muslim refugees, otherwise the continent would have shut its doors in retaliation to how Islamic countries persecute the few Christians in their country.

If i may ask you, what's islam and muslims have to do with this?. Why did you bring this in?.

Anyways, he is under no obligation. What you said is under religious and moral conviction. If he chooses not to he is not blameworthy under constitutional laws. But he may be sinning and morally bankrupt from religion perspective.


I am surprised that you talked "law of christ". I thought christians said Jesus eradicated laws and everyone is free to do as pleases?

^^^

Such loan stands 80% chance of being declared total loss.

The only ones who can possibly loan (charity) such money would be family and friends who truly love him with understanding that they actually give the money away. Or God sent fellow.

Besides, some people misused the word "borrow" to refer to lender. You dont say "borrow me money". This is incorrect.

The proper phrase is lend me money. Or loan me money. The one receiving the money is "borrower" nau.


Me personally, if someone in that situation asks me this question, I rather give him half of it for free to sort out the rest. I won't even think about loaning money to him

Nma27:
You better explain yourself young man. Why would I want part of his wealth?

my point was clear. dont drag it. was just pulling ur leg.

With all decades of sermons, preachings, pleadings, to steer clear from this kind of festivities, even muslim musicians like Wasiu soddiq, many alfas's warnings, these people continue with this nonsense

Ancestors ko, successors ni

Nma27:
Which fair share? I entered d ring with him

Lol, i meant you wanted part of his wealth

Next thing you hear soon is "Osteen denies report closing doors on Hurricane victims".

And they would arrange "victims" he "helped" to speak to the media. It is politics .

Fact is. He is under no obligation to accommodate victims of natural disaster

Nma27:
This man is sooo extravagant. Finish the money and b looking for another fixed match. I pray they knock u out next time. Iti

u jealous bcus u don't get to get your fair share, abi

.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RN83jwY4gUA

FriendNG:
@Em.piree to me the hadith is even clear. It only waive Jumuah but keep silent on Zuhr. Therefore Zuhr stands except if any other authentic hadith made it clear that both Jumuah and Zuhr are waive then no problem.

To a slave Jumuah can be waived if his master ask him no to but Zuhr stands.

The reason those ahadith that silent on zuhr are uncomfortable for me is the conclusion of Imaam Ash-Shawkaanee(ra). I hope you read what he said?. I dont blame him. His reason was right in that context but i just dont buy it.

In case you missed it, he said since Juma'h is obligatory as zuhr, it means zuhr is waived. Lo ba tan. And indeed, silence of those ahadith creates some doubt and or Ikhtilaf.

AbuUthaymeen:
AS LONG AS THEY ARE KAFIR, I WILL ALWAYS CALL THEM KAFIR. . ITS PART OF ISLAM. or u want to tell me that making takfir is in n0t in islam?

pikin

FriendNG:
This is too long.

If you perform Eid, you may not perform JumuAh but you have to perform Zuhr in place of JumuAh.

This is really my opinion up there. I doubt if op himself read his posts. If he did, he would have understood my point at outstart. I took my time to read everything. The first opinion (with complicated ahadith) is very unreliable in my view. Thats why i said "bunch of ahadith" which abdelkabir misunderstood to mean rejecting hadith. smh.

I doubt abdelkabir read everything in the op. He would have spotted my point. The first opinion led by Imaam Ash-Shawkaanee in his famous work, 'Naylul-Awtaar vol. 6, p. 423, which says (as posted up there):

Absenting from Jumu'ah is permissible for whoever has attended 'Eid prayer and he is also free not to observe the Zuhr prayer.

I dont buy that ^. This opinion of his is based on some of the complicated ahadith first posted by op. So i don't understand why yazach would say this is my opinion. That got me thinking if he read his own posts. People need to read man. It is not long. Or maybe they read but did not understand it. Preponderant Opinion supported by Saudi committee makes sense. That's what i supported from the out-start. So i still don't understand why they only pick on "bunch of hadith" to mean i reject hadith. I don't need story about Quran and hadith came from the same source. We all know that. My point is, if anyone offers Eld but skips or waives Jum'ah and zuhr base on those confusing ahadith up there is deceiving himself. Such a person owes salat zuhr. In that case i was correct when i said "bunch of ahadith". DOn't know why that's issue

My post early aligned with Saudi committee, as posted above. They indirectly disregarded those complicated ahadith based on clear evidence of obligatory zuhr salat from Quran.

Growing up, some ppl uses to say butcher of rams during Eid adha gets neck

I guess bcus meck got some meat

Obe ti so

There is actually lots of blessings in accepting and using skin instead but that's hard for the butchers

It is economy situation that caused this. God punish poverty

pannyman:
He's alive but doesn't seem to be finding things funny.

you funny

.

The bird is too damn serious

^ LOL


Anyways, this is best position

. Whoever performed Eid prayer, and then performed the Jumu'ah prayer does not have to perform Zuhr again

because on a normal Friday, obligatory congregational (juma'h) salat substitutes zuhr anyways.



I dont even understand this:

• Whoever attended neither 'Eid nor Jumu'ah prayer must observe the Zuhr prayer.

Zuhr is obligatory anyways if one misses Jum'ah



These ahadith dont suggest substitution

9. 'Abdur-Razzaq in his Musannaf (and Ibn Abi Shaybah, with similar wordings) recorded on the authority of 'Alee ibn Abi Taalib (may Allaah be pleased with him) that he said, when a 'Eid fell on a Friday during his reign, "He who wishes to witness Jumu'ah with us can do so and he who wishes to stay back at home can do so."

this doesn't suggest Eid substituted Juma'h or zuhr. Same applies to no.6 to 8. Obligatory salat stands that day (zuhr).

Newnas:
Of course this is a false claim.
Some people were known to be seekers of truth but they erred in some matters that were ambiguous to them due to the place and time they lived. Example of such people are Ibn Hajar, Soyootee, Imam Shawkaani, Imam Nawawiyy and (I hope) Sheikh Adam al-Ilori.

Some of those kind of people were opurtuned to meet guided scholars who would explain the truth to them but they insisted on their error. Such scholars or people have no excuse: he is an innovator or sinner or disbeliever depending on the type of his deviation.

On the other hand many of them didn't anyone to explain to them such the aforementioned. And some met someone and they were blessed with repentance. The last two categories are not to be rebuked.

Now, if a person insists and persists on his innovation even after it had been explained to him and continues till death such person should be left to what he has pushed forward for himself. Talking negatively about the dead is a detested act except if there's some greater benefit.

These are one of the reasons why the people of sunnah avoid discussing Sheikh Adam.



AlhamduliLLaah, you aknowledge that calling upon the dead is shirk. You should now be writing and speaking against it. it starts from me and you.

There is no absolute truth with anyone. You still hallowing your supposed scholars of truth. Thats the problem right there bcus of the title you gave them. You will forever see them as absolute and other opinions are irrelevant. Thats quite manifested here.

And ofc, they would avoid talking about Sheikh Adam(ra). They don't have his charisma. They are pikin. Sheikh Adam(ra) and his contemporaries like Sheikh Mustapha Ashile etc met with Saudi shuyukh in their lifetime. They challenged them on their "protestant" approach to islam.


As for condemning people calling or making sacrifice to the dead, you first need to zero any affiliated ahadith. And it is common sense that no one should offer sacrifice to the dead. Again, i cant confirm market women you talk about. I hope you didnt make it up buttress your point. I would imagine Sheikh Adam's burial ground is better secured than that

^^

Rubbish?. The weak ahadith said it is not necessary to offer jumah or zuhr. "That Eid is enough". You dont see implication of that?. First, you need to establish if eid is mandatory or not. Jumah or zhur is obligatory and there is no difference of opinion about that. But eld is rather sunnah (naflat) with wide opinions of scholars as to whether is it obligatory or not.

So eld is prefered sunnah. If a muslim should miss it for whatever reason, he/she is only missing the benefits. But you have no reason to dump zhur even if you have valid reason, you still offer it at later time. And when i said eld is not even in Quran, doesnt mean i am condemning it. Was only telling you in the context of this discussion that it is rather naflat and can not be substituted for jumah or zuhr. period

^^

Abeg, take your level of reasoning elsewhere. So now this is how you start telling people obligatory jam'ah and zuhr is not necessary on this day. Besides, going by your first paragraph have implications. It means many fabricated ahadith too are welcome since they are "wahi". I wonder why you categorized hadith then.

I am not even talking about "don't pray eld". We talking about neglecting jama'ah or zuhr for eld. Which is weighty?.

Later opinion with strong references are prefered. There is no skipping Jum'ah or salat zuhr bcus one offers Eid. A simple methodology defeats first opinion, in the sense that, no matter how "authentic" hadith can be, can never ever refute Qur'an. Salat Jum'ah and daily salat zuhr have strong evidence directly gleaned from uml-kitab.

Therefore, the first opinion with bunch of so called ahadith are either daef or mawdu. You better offer Juma'h or zuhr for safety reason. Eld is not even mentioned in the Quran. It is only prefered sunnah

Wala'hu alam

alBHAGDADI:
aminu.santi veda.xcool . . Frie.dNG emp.iree abdelk.abir ril.wayne001

pls read the story to see the EVIL Islamic PRACTICE

Worry more about you and your people
https://www.nairaland.com/4015056/pastor-tony-obo-arrested-calabar