₦airaland Forum

12 “Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to everyone according to what he has done. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.

14 “Blessed are those who wash their robes, that they may have the right to the tree of life and may go through the gates into the city. 15Outside are the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.

16 “I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.”

The angel said to me, "These words are trustworthy and true. The Lord, the God of the spirits of the prophets, sent his angel to show his servants the things that must soon take place."

16 “I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.”

12 “Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to everyone according to what he has done. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.

14 “Blessed are those who wash their robes, that they may have the right to the tree of life and may go through the gates into the city. 15Outside are the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood.

16 “I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.”

frosbel: I throw the question back to you and say, how come mere men who had a beginning were referred to as gods.

"I said, 'You are "gods"; you are all sons of the Most High.'" - Psalm 82:6

frosbel: Jesus is god if that's what you want to hear , he is not GOD as in Jehovah.


Indeed he is god in his own right and by implication, if we spell it in caps GOD , good by me , if not , fine. My point has always been consistently stated over the past week that Lord Jesus is not Almighty GOD or Jehovah.. . .

frosbel: Obviously this is Jesus Christ, simples !!

"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."

17 When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And He placed His right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, 18 and the living One; [size=14pt]and I was dead[/size], and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades. 19“Therefore write the things which you have seen, and the things which are, and the things which will take place after these things. 20“As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

17 When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man. And He placed His right hand on me, saying, “Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, 18 and the living One; [size=14pt]and I was dead[/size], and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades. 19“Therefore write the things which you have seen, and the things which are, and the things which will take place after these things. 20“As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.

frosbel: I throw open a challenge to all Nairaland Trinitarians .

Can you show me anywhere in the Bible where Jesus Christ is referred to as ALMIGHTY ?

"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."

I say it without the least hesitation, whoever calls himself the universal bishop, or desires this title, is, by his pride, the precursor of Antichrist, because he thus attempts to raise himself above the others. The error into which he falls springs from pride equal to that of Antichrist; for as that Wicked One wished to be regarded as exalted above other men, like a god, so likewise whoever would be called sole bishop exalteth himself above others....You know it, my brother; hath not the venerable Council of Chalcedon conferred the honorary title of 'universal' upon the bishops of this Apostolic See [Rome], whereof I am, by God's will, the servant? And yet none of us hath permitted this title to be given to him; none hath assumed this bold title, lest by assuming a special distinction in the dignity of the episcopate, we should seem to refuse it to all the brethren.

"I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty."

Ubenedictus: u are certainly mixing stuff up. Orthodox donot refer to themselves as "orthodox catholic church" to put the word "catholic" there would imply that they are in full communion with the roman see.

Ubenedictus: u are certainly mixing stuff up. Orthodox donot refer to themselves as "orthodox catholic church" to put the word "catholic" there would imply that they are in full communion with the roman see.

The Eastern Orthodox Church, officially called the Orthodox Catholic Church and commonly referred to as the Orthodox Church, is the second largest Christian church in the world, with an estimated 300 million adherents, primarily in Eastern and Southeastern Europe.

Ubenedictus: nothing easy there, go and check that thread, all the protestant ran away without even saying goodbye.

Many of the Eastern Fathers who are rightly acknowledged to be the greatest and most representative and are, moreover, so considered by the universal Church, do not offer us any more evidence of the primacy. Their writings show that they recognized the primacy of the Apostle Peter, that they regarded the See of Rome as the prima sedes playing a major part in the Catholic communion—we are recalling, for example, the writings of St. John Chrysostom and of St. Basil who addressed himself to Rome in the midst of the difficulties of the schism of Antioch—but they provide us with no theological statement on the universal primacy of Rome by divine right. The same can be said of St. Gregory Nazianzen, St. Gregory of Nyssa, St. Basil, St. John Chrysostom, St. John Damascene . . . .

It does sometimes happen that some Fathers understood a passage in a way which does not agree with later {addendum: Roman Catholic} Church teaching. One example: the interpretation of Peter’s confession in Matthew 16:16–19. Except at Rome, this passage was not applied by the Fathers to the papal primacy; they worked out an exegesis at the level of their own ecclesiological thought, more anthropological and spiritual than juridical.

I believe that the East had a very poor conception of the Roman primacy. The East did not see in it what Rome herself saw and what the West saw in Rome, that is to say, a continuation of the primacy of St. Peter. The bishop of Rome was more than the successor of Peter on his cathedra, he was Peter perpetuated, invested with Peter’s responsibility and power. The East has never understood this perpetuity. St. Basil ignored it, as did St. Gregory Nazianzen and St. John Chrysostom. In the writings of the great Eastern Fathers, the authority of the Bishop of Rome is an authority of singular grandeur, but in these writings it is not considered so by divine right

chukwudi44: Hypocrite I am still waiting for you to discuss the church fathers views on key catholic doctrines.Afterall you claimed to be a catholic you should not shy from it.

chukwudi44: Nope pal orthodox split from catholicism only during the east-west schism of 1054 CE.

Zikkyy: Are you saying you don't agree with the un-bolded part? the part that has to do with frosbel being a protestant



There is no way you are dragging me to that thread i reject it IJN

on second thought maybe i might have something to say just as long as it has nothing to do with who canonized the bible. i am quite sure that was done by my great great ...... great grandfather

Ihedinobi: Quite right, sir. I am immensely conflicted by this guy. I do not want to ignore him but I really cannot see how being a Christian he could say things like this. Making sense of it is incredibly difficult for me. I pray the Lord has mercy upon him and delivers him from this increasing foolishness.

frosbel: 1. No Semantics, the Trinity is a pagan doctrine

2. Jesus Christ is fully divine, so we agree here

3. Jesus Christ is GOD , or is he not, and yet God is one this is the mystery.

Let's see how Paul put it.

"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." - 1 Timothy 3:16

This verse jumped at me about God's spirit, a very good explanation from the bible.

1 Corinthians 2:9-14 "But as it is written: "eye has not seen, nor ear heard, Nor have entered into the heart (mind) of man the things which God has prepared for those who love Him." :10 But God has revealed [them] to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. :11[u] For what man knows the things of a man (how can man know or think and understand and perceive and have consciousness of "self" except (through) the spirit of the man which is "IN" him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God[/u]. :12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit which is from God, that we might know the (spiritual) things that have been freely given to us by God. :13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. :14 But the natural man (the natural mind) does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know [them,] because they are spiritually discerned."

Ihedinobi: ^^^^ says the man who demands that God be small enough to fit into his intellect. Do you even know what blasphemy is, Frosbel? You really spout a lot of ignorance and confusion. . . . .

Edit: I see that there is still quite a bit of confusion in your perception of these things. It gives me hope. If you can say that Jesus is divine or deity because His Father is while swearing that the Father and the Son are not both God, there may still be some hope. Because the two things are contrary. Only one of the two is true and the other is false. They cannot both be true.

frosbel: Because God is not 3 but 1 , expressed as the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

The concept of Trinity , where we have a godhead with the Father as the head, Son in the middle and Holy Spirit at the bottom is just plain false and not at all biblical.

Jesus Christ is the express image of the person of GOD , He is the radiance of God's glory, He is the Alpha and Omega , he is GOD.

"The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven." - Hebrews 1:3

He only became a little lower than the father because he humbled himself as a man to die for our sins. This is the great mystery.


You will ask me , if Jesus was GOD , then where was the father.

Answer :

"If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?[/b]Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works."


"And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: [b]God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory." - 1 Timothy 3:16

"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." - Isaiah 9:6


Look at this striking comparison between Christ and God , from the new testament and old testament.

New Testament :

"The hairs of his head were white, like white wool, like snow. His eyes were like a flame of fire, 15his feet were like burnished bronze, refined in a furnace, and his voice was like the roar of many waters." - Revelation 1:14

“As I looked,thrones were placed,and the Ancient of Days took his seat;his clothing was white as snow,and the hair of his head like pure wool;
his throne was fiery flames;its wheels were burning fire.A stream of fire issued and came out from before him;a thousand thousands served him,
and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him;the court sat in judgment,and the books were opened." - Daniel 7:9

Zikkyy: The churches listed above were originally part of one catholic church(i think ). it's either they still catholic or they are protesting even if you claim you are not protesting, i don't see how frosbel can escape the categorization. Beig an ex-catholic, i believe he left in protest That makes him a protestant.

Six of the eight incomplete lines of GJW recto are so closely related to the Coptic GTh,
especially to Sayings 101 and 114, as to make dependence virtually certain. A further line is derived
from Matthew; just one is left unaccounted for. The author has used a “collage” or “patchwork”
compositional technique, and this level of dependence on extant pieces of Coptic text is more plausibly
attributed to a modern author, with limited facility in Coptic, than to an ancient one. Indeed, the GJW
fragment may be designedly incomplete, its lacunae built into it from the outset. It does not seem
possible to fill these lacunae with GTh material contiguous to the fragments cited. The impression of
modernity is reinforced by the case in line 1 of dependence on the line-division of the one surviving
Coptic manuscript, easily accessible in modern printed editions. Unless this impression of modernity is
countered by further investigations and fresh considerations, it seems unlikely that GJW will establish
itself as a “genuine” product of early gospel writing.

A New Testament scholar claims to have found evidence suggesting that the Gospel of Jesus's Wife is a modern forgery.

Professor Francis Watson, of Durham University, says the papyrus fragment, which caused a worldwide sensation when it appeared earlier this week because it appeared to refer to Jesus's wife, is a patchwork of texts from the genuine Coptic-language Gospel of Thomas, which have been copied and reassembled out of order to make a suggestive new whole. . . .

"I think it is more or less indisputable that I have shown how the thing was composed," he said. "I would be very surprised if it were not a modern forgery, although it is possible that it was composed in this way in the fourth century."

His paper claims the work was assembled by someone who was not a native speaker of Coptic, which is a polite way of saying that it is modern.

etc etc etc

A British scholar has called the ancient papyrus claiming that Jesus had a wife a 'fake'.

New Testament scholar Professor Francis Watson of Durham University says the fragment, which caused an international sensation this week, is a collage of texts from the Gospel of Thomas, copied and reassembled out of order.

etc etc etc

plaetton: ^^^^^
Have you ever heard of the Council of Macon?
Here is a link.

http://www.churchinhistory.org/pages/booklets/women-souls-1.htm

The story that the Council of Macon decreed that women do not have a soul is untrue. This article traces the growth of the myth.

Contrary to popular myth, the Synods of Macon undertook no discussion on the subject of whether or not women had souls, or whether or not women were human.

One does not to hope ever to be free of the myth . . . .

And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.