₦airaland Forum

1. No one has seen God; no one can see God and live!

Exodus 33:20

But," he said, "you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live."

John 1:18

No one has ever seen God . . .

1 Timothy 6:16

who alone is immortal and who lives in unapproachable light, whom no one has seen or can see.

2. Who then did Isaiah (and others like Daniel etc) see?

Isaiah 6:5

"Woe to me!" I cried. "I am ruined! For I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, and my eyes have seen the King, the LORD Almighty."

3. Thankfully we have help!

John 12:41

Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus' glory and spoke about him.

4. Further help!

Colossians 1:15

He is the image of the invisible God

Colossians 1:19

For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him

Hebrews 1:3

The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.

5. And finally

John 14:9

Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?

Isaiah 6

1 In the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord seated on a throne, high and exalted, and the train of his robe filled the temple. 2 Above him were seraphs, each with six wings: With two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying. 3 And they were calling to one another:

“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty;

the whole earth is full of his glory.”

4 At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook and the temple was filled with smoke.

5 “Woe to me!” I cried. “I am ruined! For I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, and my eyes have seen the King, the Lord Almighty.”

Re ^^

John 12:41

Isaiah said this because he saw Jesus' glory and spoke about him.

And of course Jesus did say

John 14:9

Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?

Daniel 7:9

"As I looked, "thrones were set in place, and the Ancient of Days took his seat. His clothing was as white as snow; the hair of his head was white like wool. His throne was flaming with fire, and its wheels were all ablaze.

Micah 5:2

2 “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times.”

Revelation 1:14

His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and his eyes were like blazing fire.

2 Thessalonians 1:7

. . . . This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels.

Daniel 7:9

"As I looked, "thrones were set in place, and the Ancient of Days took his seat. His clothing was as white as snow; the hair of his head was white like wool. His throne was flaming with fire, and its wheels were all ablaze.

Micah 5:2

2 “But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come for me
one who will be ruler over Israel, whose origins are from of old, from ancient times.”

Revelation 1:14

His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and his eyes were like blazing fire.

2 Thessalonians 1:7

. . . . This will happen when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven in blazing fire with his powerful angels.

Edited

Ezekiel 1:26

Above the expanse over their heads was what looked like a throne of sapphire, and high above on the throne was a figure like that of a man.

Revelation 1

12 I turned around to see the voice that was speaking to me. And when I turned I saw seven golden lampstands, 13 and among the lampstands was someone “like a son of man,” dressed in a robe reaching down to his feet and with a golden sash around his chest. 14 His head and hair were white like wool, as white as snow, and his eyes were like blazing fire. 15 His feet were like bronze glowing in a furnace, and his voice was like the sound of rushing waters. 16 In his right hand he held seven stars, and out of his mouth came a sharp double-edged sword. His face was like the sun shining in all its brilliance.

17 When I saw him, I fell at his feet as though dead. Then he placed his right hand on me and said: “Do not be afraid. I am the First and the Last. 18 I am the Living One; I was dead, and behold I am alive for ever and ever! And I hold the keys of death and Hades.

Isaiah 43:11

I, even I, am the LORD, and apart from me there is no savior.

Isaiah 60:16

You will drink the milk of nations and be nursed at royal breasts. Then you will know that I, the LORD, am your Savior, your Redeemer, the Mighty One of Jacob.

Zechariah 9:9

Rejoice greatly, O Daughter of Zion! Shout, Daughter of Jerusalem! See, your king comes to you, righteous and having salvation, gentle and riding on a donkey, on a colt, the foal of a donkey.

1 Corinthians 10

1 For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact, brothers, that our forefathers were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. 2 They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. 3 They all ate the same spiritual food 4 and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.

Isaiah 43:25

"I, even I, am he who blots out your transgressions, for my own sake, and remembers your sins no more.

Mark 2:5

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

Mark 2:6-7

6 Now some teachers of the law were sitting there, thinking to themselves, 7 “Why does this fellow talk like that? He’s blaspheming! Who can forgive sins but God alone?”

Isaiah 44:6

"This is what the LORD says--Israel's King and Redeemer, the LORD Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.

Revelation 2:8

"To the angel of the church in Smyrna write: These are the words of him who is the First and the Last, who died and came to life again.

As with the other thread, and add also

Rev 22

1 Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb

3 No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him. 4 They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads. 5There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever.

Compare Revelation 21

22 I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. 23 The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp

^^ And add also

Rev 22

1Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb

3 No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him. 4 They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads. 5There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever.

Compare Revelation 21

22 I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. 23 The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp

^^^ And He is not only "the life"; He is eternal life who was with the Father and has appeared to us.

1 John 1:2

The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us.

^^^ I've already been called a "liar" and several things beside. But you and I have been discussing these things on the other thread, so you know where to meet me.

^^^ The above is false and has been addressed on the other thread. If you want to pursue it further, join me on the other thread.

I leave Goshen360 to handle matters here. Afterall, the questions he asked have not been answered despite the promise to address them.

Ihedinobi: @Enigma

Bro, I emailed you. Seen it yet?

Yes, sorry for lateness; I will deal with it soon.

truthislight: the word God is a title my friend.

Ok. A title for both The Father and The Son and who together with the Holy Spirit make ONE God.

Any other person or thing called "god" is a so-called god and a FALSE god.

@ italo

The claims that white is black have been made repeatedly in the last couple of weeks!

See e.g. this thread among others https://www.nairaland.com/1056361/did-god-really-die/3#12429383

andromida: @ ihedinobi on whose say so is trinity the foundation of christianity? and yes this thread is not particularly focused on trinity but trinity as I see it is a major aspect of it an please shorter epistles please

To keep it simple: if Jesus IS God and The Father Is God (leaving out The Holy Spirit for now), would you not say that is an issue at the heart {"foundation"} of Christianity?

@ Ihedinobi

Very well said.

Pastor Kun: The only reason the thread appears to be 'dying' is becos those it was addressed to (trinitarians) have not been able to summon up the courage to address the cold hard questions being raised the answers of which would show their trinity dogma to be a ridiculous, internally inconsistent and contradictory dogma.

And the Trinitarians are taking them on in the form of Goshen360; he is enough for here.

So who was the last to promise to answer questions and where is he now? Look only three posts or so above.

You could of course choose to support him; if so join me on the other thread that I linked above.

truthislight: @ Enigma, i believe you have a capacity to do a lot of Good to mankind.

You stood and defended the "bible" that it is not a RCC baby, but you are still standing for trinity because you belief it was adopted by the true church(catholic)

friend, the apostacy was already at work when the apostles were still alive. 1ce
2thessolonian 2:7

by the second (2ce) ce all the apostles that were a restrain to the apostacy had all died off.

just think about this.
Peace

You know, I've just remembered another thing!

Since God The Father Himself referred to Jesus as "O God" ----- will we say that god The Father Himself is also guilty of apostasy?

truthislight: Jesus may shear the title mighty God with the father which simply means "powerful God".

But the title almighty, alpha and omega are exclusively Yahweh's.

Peace

Well Jesus is called all these things in the book of Revelation: "The Almighty"; "The Alpha and Omega"; "The First and Last"; "The Beginning and The End".

ijawkid: . . .Kudos to enigma who has just lied that the meaning of Yahweh is Lord.....

You see why I don't waste time with you?

Well, I will let this one go but I have warned you that if you direct certain insults at me I will send you to people in your family much older than you.

In any event; yes Yahweh is translated as Lord. It was even translated as Lord over 2000 years ago in The Septuagint.

ijawkid: . . . Enigma I'm ready for you to the end.....

Sorry, I'm not interested.

Whenever I make a post, if you have a counter argument then table it.

The different viewpoints will be there for all to see

truthislight: but the word god is a title just like the title principle, chief, president, lord.etc.

In such that the ones attaining to that title still keep their personal names.

That we say that Jesus is God does not make him God almighty.

Afteral he himself said that his father is greater than him, this is reasonable in all sense.

The bible did not make a mistake when it said that Jesus is mighty God. Isaiah 9:6.

And when it said that Yahweh is almighty God. Exodus 6:3.

The fear of God is the begining of wisdom.

Let us just let what the bible say to stand without bending it.

Thank you my friend.
Peace

The fact that Jesus shares several "titles" with The Father is enough to tell us that He Jesus also is God.

Just take a few examples of Jesus' titles: "The Almighty"; "Alpha and Omega"; "The First and Last"; "The Beginning and The End"; "Mighty God"; "Everlasting Father".

Y'all will have to indulge me but these just remind me of words from a favourite hymn

Yeah, Amen let all adore Thee
High on Thine eternal throne
Saviour take the power and glory
Claim the kingdom for Thine own
O come quickly, o come quickly, o come quickly
Everlasting God come down

.

ijawkid: Please read john 17:3 and let it sink down.....

Listen to what Jesus himself had to say.....

If it would ever be of help to you.....

I know what John 17:3 says and I repeat that the apostles called Jesus God e.g. Peter, Paul, Thomas, John, author of Hebrews.

Enigma: The ONE God.. . .

Oh, and I repeat that the apostles called Jesus God e.g. Peter, Paul, Thomas, John, author of Hebrews.



PS some might have noticed my deliberate ordering of Thomas and John.

ijawkid: Which God??

The ONE God.

And I second italo's post above.

And you need to learn manners ----- fast.

Hmmm, interesting that this thread is already dying and has been shunted to page two!

Anyway, one example of a thread where the issues are being addressed is https://www.nairaland.com/1068073/frosbel-jesus-christ-re-proposition

truthislight: @ Enigma, i believe you have a capacity to do a lot of Good to mankind.

You stood and defended the "bible" that it is not a RCC baby, but you are still standing for trinity because you belief it was adopted by the true church(catholic)

friend, the apostacy was already at work when the apostles were still alive. 1ce
2thessolonian 2:7

by the second (2ce) ce all the apostles that were a restrain to the apostacy had all died off.

just think about this.
Peace

Well, the apostles believed Jesus to be God and many of them said so in the Bible e.g. Peter, Paul, Thomas, John, the author of Hebrews and so on.

Surely, friend, you are not going to accuse them too of apostasy?

truthislight: your error is because the RCC has removed the name of Yahweh in some translations and replaced it with the "WORD" lord in the OT.

Otherwise, if you had seen that the word is Yahweh you will not fall for this trap.

When paul wrote his word the shama was still carrying the names of Yahweh in all places in the OT.

This RCC action is after the death of the apostles.
Peace.

No my friend (and I mean friend genuinely nicely); your error is that you do not realise that I pointed to the original Hebrew.

In the original Hebrew: "Yahweh" = 'Lord' while "Elohenu" = 'our God';

You people really need to stop lying and maligning others and also deceiving and misleading other people.



EDIT addendum: and your reference to the RCC here is sheer nonsense; in any event I have been sticking to the NIV which is one of the two versions dictated by the rules of engagement of this thread.

Back to my earlier post about The Father and The Son both being above all.


Ephesians 4:4-6

4 There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to one hope when you were called— 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

John 3:31

"The one who comes from above is above all; the one who is from the earth belongs to the earth, and speaks as one from the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all.

As I explained further:

The Father and The Son are above all ----- together. Of course it must be so, since they are ONE; ONE GOD.

OK let us look at one way that the Bible again describes/explains it. John 14:11

Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves.