₦airaland Forum

essegis:
My brother na really adventure oo. I actually bought 3 types of batteries after watching a lot of YouTube on set ups and performance.

1.) 57 modules of Nissan Leaf
2.) 6 packs of BYD batteries
3.) 100 cells of 38120 LFP

Guys, the last set of these batteries just came in. I can now start building. Too bad I'm still stuck at work and would also have to do a basic build on the first run. No BMS, breakers or isolators. These will come in when Corona allow economy start to move freely again.

For now my people need an alternate source of power so my old remaining DC fuses would just have to do for the time being.

mctfopt:
I've seen like two of the chargers fail under one year. I know the chargers are always the issue, funny it continues its work as an inverter.

One of the reasons I now go for external chargers. Over the years I have packed and condemned inverters with either bad chargers or bad inverters. Going together is NEVER a good combination.

Cheap Chinco "Reliable" I bought since 2016 is still doing the job, no chargers attached.

mctfopt:
Super interested to see the end product of this your awesome system. You went all in on LFP

I am more eager knowing I bought all used modules. With the over ratings on LFP I'm still expecting some years from these set ups. If I can get them I will be the happiest man on earth.

Even if I don't get them it will be treated as a learning curve and I can only improve from here on in. As for Lead Acid? I think we have divorced finally.

essegis:
My brother na really adventure oo. I actually bought 3 types of batteries after watching a lot of YouTube on set ups and performance.

1.) 57 modules of Nissan Leaf
2.) 6 packs of BYD batteries
3.) 100 cells of 38120 LFP

Guys, just got the delivery of the 2nd set of batteries in today. What's left now is the 38120 cells. Too bad I'm still locked up at work. Hopefully, I will get down to some working when I finally get out.

Ojeysky, as the BYD don come early so I might actually be picking up that 24v charger you got. Hope you are still game. I cannot top balance these guys cell wise while I was actually expecting the 38120 cells before these. Courier say na Corona cause them to come anyhow, who am I to argue?

ojeysky:
https://www.nairaland.com/390522/solar-energy-complement-fta/747#89842978

Buses still get to Lagos from Ekiti, delivery is at your own cost

Lets do this

ojeysky:
If you are still interested I can now sell the 12v I kept for myself

Abeg that spec again. Price. And how do you plan to get it down to Lagos?

dahaz:
Pls what direction is best to place a solar panel?
Note: am not an installer just been curious.

In this country its best to place them tilted towards the south. Your angle of inclination is also best if slight, let's say not greater than 15°.

I hope this helps.

ojeysky:
I have no experience of how these particular cells perform but from what you've stated above, I will suggest that if going parallel is your only option, then do parallel at cell level first before you then put them in series so you have one large bank of 24v instead of multiple(6) banks/strings of 24v in parallel.

Thats the plan my brother, e no easy. Thanks.

JUO:
you can never tell let him try

Okay oo

ojeysky:
Is having 8p of strings not too much? I think it's usually better to reduce parallel strings as much as possible so weaker strings don't kill the stronger sets.

This is a different angle I was not aware of so let me state the facts. David Poz had 8 modules which he connected 4 in parallel then the 2 sets in series to give a 48v system (4p2s). He then connected the individual cells of a string in parallel, that is for 4 batteries at a time.

I am buying 6 batteries and would want to connect them all in parallel for a 24v system. So the cells of all 6 batteries I will be connecting in parallel, how do you see this?

Actually, during the capacity test of the batteries David alluded to the parallel cells helping and adding an extra 1kwh to the system. If I don't do this I will have to buy 6 BMS & 6 active chargers to be able to run my system oo. Abeg that no be small money. QNBBM costs in excess of $150 each.

bbally:
oga no be so oooooo. he asked me those particular questions which I tried to feedback but honestly, my questions are for the house. i will definitely appreciate yours or any member's input.
thank you

I have already done that. Actually I think I was the only one who answered your 2nd question with all the facts. You can go back the previous page and read it then let me have what you think. Well done.

remizvxcq:
I have been doing some research with AC & DC coupling of solar into a Victron inverter-charger.
Using a Fronius Primo 4-6-1-Light for AC coupling, and a Victron MPPT 150/70 (thanks, Saipro!) for the DC coupling.

Will be reporting some of my findings in due course.

For now, I can predict that this sort of system has incredible potential to generate significant electricity at low costs and high reliability into the utility grid, if backed with
# a feed-in-tariff for solar prosumers and
# distributed energy storage systems

Shuu!!!!

Abeg you dey live for Nigeria? You want to feed the grid in which country?

remizvxcq:
Did you ask an earlier question? About how David Poz rearranged his collection of 8 packs 24v (25,2v) BYD in the video : Parallel Cells in Big LiFePO4Battery Modules. He found some weaker cells in the modules. What I think is this>>

There are 7 cells inside each of the BYD modules.

In his earlier video: davidpoz-20191211_ Series Connecting 24v Modules into a 48v Battery Bank, he did a (7s)2s4p arrangement. So he had a bank of 4 batteries, each consisting of 2 units of 24v modules, each of which contained 7 cells in series.

In the later video: davidpoz-20200207_ Parallel Cells in big LIFePO4 Battery Modules, he basically broke open the modules and connected the individual cells in a 4p2s7p arrangement. So he had a bank of 7 batteries, each consisting of 8 cells. Each of the 7 has 4 modules, each with 2 cells in series.

I hope this helps

Yeah but I finally figured it out. David Poz was a big influence in my purchase of the BYD batteries. I have watched his videos and set ups countless times.

The batteries actually have 8 cells, not 7 like you mentioned and he connected his in 48v set up. I will be connecting mine in 24v set up then parallel all the individual cells like he did. This will help me eliminate having multiple BMS as system will be one big pack.

His capacity test was a failure though and people actually complained about the batteries especially as they didn't meet up the rating by battery hookup. I have bought them so will just have to deal with what I see when it arrives. If not for COVID-19 I'm sure it would have been here. Thanks though.

See my diagram of what I think is the parallel connection he did.

kiekie1:
Fairly used 200ah gennex batteries & 300w high quality poly panels"uncommon 72 cells" loading at 27k....Limited stock!

Condition: All in good condition. Interested buyers can carry out their brief test

Location: Abule-egba , Lagos but can be waybilled to any state as usual under buyers expense !


Feel free to contact me backstage asap if keenly interested as usual


Contact,
Smartcell global services
CALL::: 081-350-31951
WHATSAPP::: https:///2348170385620

How many of these panels dey for this limited stock so?

bbally:
Oga ceaser, thanks for the response.
the inverter in the link is different from mine.
my solar panels is 2nos of 100watts connected in parallel because my inverter is 12volt system, so my 2nos of 100ah too is connected in parallel.
my inverter has internal cc with 30a or 50a charging options.
the clamp meter I was about to borrow around is 20amp and when I used it was reading 0.2 or something.
attached is the inverter pic and spec sheet.

Looks like you have a select few you actually wanted to answer your question. My own is you for don direct am straight to them instead of asking the house. Enjoy.

bbally:
thank you my brothers in the house for your response, I really appreciate.
here are some of the answers to the questions raised to the best of my understanding:

1, the batteries are new and labeled GEL (if it the same as lead acid, honestly I don't know)
2, my set up is 12volts, the 2batteries and 2 panel s are both connected in parallel.
3, I will try my best to upgrade towards 600watts as suggested as fund permit
4, the setup was done in March before the lockdown.
5, the inverter has these options: DOD 50% or 80%, NEPA charging 10A or 20A, SOLAR charging 30A or 50A
so, am presently set it at 20A NEPA, 30A solar, initially at 50% but now 80% as NEPA don go awire.
as my panels are undersized, so if am using my electronics during the sunlight does that means the batteries will not be charged at all?

I have a free 24v panel from a friend, can I connect it my existing system to increase the watt from the solar by changing the old panels to series to give 24v/100watts.

I planned to incorporate a mppt which I ordered from AliExpress but is still in transit due to lockdown.
attached pictures are my present setup and intended mppt from AE.

Let me see if I can do a little justice to this.

GEL is an offshoot of Lead Acid technology so you can categorize them as same.

Solar don't do anything apart from charging your batteries. So if you use your appliances in the day time the question is, is your draw more than what is entering into your battery from the panels? If it is then you are not charging the batteries at all. I think someone used the analogy of water tank to explain this.

Yes, you can connect your friends panel but do all in series as you will be having 3 dissimilar panels. Even if you don't use it I will still advise you change your present panel set up to series connection. If you agree to use your friend's panel make sure you cross check the Vmax of your CC to the summation Voc of the 3 panels and they don't exceed it.

Also, if you decide to use your friend's panel you cannot use this AliExpress PWM anymore as it's strictly 12v. I will advise you save a little & pick up a small MPPT, it will give you better flexibility.

I hope this helps. The house can still help join mouth.

bbally:
hello house I have a dilemma concerning my step up, I have a BTS HYBRID INVERTER 1200VA (720W), 2*100Ah GBM DEEP CYCLE (12V,200AH), 2*100W (12V,200WATTS) with DOD of 80% and my average load is between 150-200watts.
if there is good NEPA supply, the backup last average 6-8hrs but if supply is poor the back up reduce drastically to around 3hrs.
I am surprised as I expected it to be charged by the solar panels when the power supply is poor or not available so as to have constant back up time.
my questions goes thus:
what is it that is not right in my step up?
how can I measured the amps from the solar panels?
does anyone have an idea about the efficiency of the GBM battery type and my inverter?
any other suggestions and advice is welcome.
thanks

Something missing here is the charge current of your hybrid. If you look at your battery you're actually running a 12*200 = 2400wh system. If you use an 80% DOD (which is not advisable for Lead Acid but inevitable in Nigeria) it means you always need to refill 2400*0.8 = 1920wh back each time.

Looking at your solar panels of 200w working at full efficiency they will take 1920/200 = 9.6h to fully charge your batteries. Now here comes the funny part, abeg no vex as I list it.

This 9.6hrs is peak sunlight.
We don't have that on a daily basis.
Usually it's between 4-5hrs for say we dey Africa oo.
So it will take your panels 2-3 days alone to charge this battery.
One thing no one will tell you is solar panels are not efficient.
They are not efficient at all don't worry.
Its advisable to oversize your build to take care of this inefficiency.
Yours is grossly undersized.
Again the charge current of your MPPT is not mentioned.
The full battery you have been seeing is mainly from NEPA oo, those guys are still important even in their no light matter.

Try and improve your charging system though as already ascribed by kiekie1.

ojeysky:
Complicated delivery options has made the cells to still be with me, but I have kept it busy while it's me. Though cells came with max of 0.003v difference, it has been balanced irrespective. For now I have delivery option through bus to Abuja, Akure, Onitsha and Lagos, other location will be via GIG logistics and their shipping is between 12 to 15k.
Still available for sale!

I see front the pix you're top balancing them.

eleojo23:
The way to bypass that is to pay for the items one by one. For instance, if you need 5 units, add one to cart, pay for it then add another one, pay and so on.

I'm thinking of this approach too oo. But as Ojeysky said cumulative is cheaper that's why I shock.

ojeysky:
Yes I see your point on that, but there is also the situation where you already have a bank and want to let your internal BMS do the balancing but due to the low current of most of them, charging at low current will also be important... Though that takes longer process but may be the only option for those that don't want to decouple. On the other note, cumulative shipping reduces as you increase quantity.

You sure about this cumulative shipping so? Except you don't use the AliExpress recommended shipping methods oo.

Yesterday I was browsing around them, saw an item with like $1 shipping, no wahala. As I dey increase the quantity e dey go up small small. I just say let me try 10 & gbam, shipping went up to above $100. Even the MakeSkyBlue MPPT, shipping for one na like $12 for two $100. Funny eh.

ojeysky:
Oh okay you meant top balancing a single cell, I thought you meant for the battery bank. Fyi the 12v can be adjusted from 2.9v not from 1v

https://a.aliexpress.com/_dV44IOp

For top balancing, you connect all the cells in parallel and charge them to full. That way they all attain full volts the same time time and stay there.

I know it's from probably 2.5v but even the 24v charger doesn't do that na. Thanks for the link though. With the shipping I'm seeing so you sure say you make any cash at all so? Well, good to have humanitarians like you around. Na to organise award give you for end of the year

ojeysky:
Yes if your system is 12v but if 24v then the 24v serves better

For top balancing you don't even need it at 12v, you need the top volts of individual cells which is about 4.2v depending on owner.

As the 12v charger could be adjusted from 1v upwards that was what made it the only option for the top balancing.

You never still share the link though.

ojeysky:
12v version sold only 24v left

The 12v would have been of more use to me for Top Balancing. Too bad I missed out. Can you kindly share the link?

ojeysky:
So I have just received delivery of adjustable voltage and current Lithium charger, and I got 2 spares each 12/24v for anyone interested.
12v - 50k, 24v - 70k.
Picture shows an LFP cell charging at 3.56v

What's the max current?

ojeysky:
Okay I think you didn't get the point:

280v 8A on a 450v CC
130v 24A on a 150v CC

Where is the risk more than the other?

The 280v is well within the 450v capacity of the CC so you got no issues.

As for safer, both of them go shock you. Common 8A on your panels if e leak you go feel am for body. Just continue to follow the rule of higher bolts from panel to CC & you got no issues.

chris81964:
The 250 V 100 amp Victron on works up to 48V batteries. The advantages are fewer strings because you can connect more panels in series. You also can use thinner cables because you can run lower current. Your higher voltage minimizes loses if you are far from the array.
I have used both and honestly I pick the 250 100 any day over the lower voltage. Fewer strings means fewer breakers.

Thanks for buttressing my point.

ojeysky:
I think it's important to mention, it's high PV low current so my array is 280v but at 8A, I don't think the risk will be lower if it's 120v at 24A

The risk will actually be higher both to humans and your wires, more current flow.

Abeg did you arrange 280v on a max 150v CC?

adrusa:
I disagree Sir. The higher voltage CC are for higher nominal voltage systems. There are inverters with nominal voltages of 90v and 180v. These are the ones for which high voltage CC are made and they are expensive because of the electronics needed to handle that high voltage, not so that someone with 12v system can run PV voltage of 250v.

And as to my friend, yes it is current, and VOLTAGE. Voltage drives high current. The higher the voltage, the higher the current it is able to drive through any system when resistance is constant. V=IR. So, for a human being or anything at all, 100V is more dangerous than 10V. Yes, it is the current that kills, but it is the high voltage that drives the current.

Finally, I have once been told that there is an MPPT sweet spot for your panel voltage vs your system voltage, I really can not lay my hands on the details now. But I remember that while high voltage may reduce your installation cost, two much of a difference between your PV Voltage and your battery voltage put extra stress on the conversion electronics in your charge controller. Don't forget that an MPPT CC is basically a DC-DC converter and the higher the difference between the voltages the higher the work needed to be done by the converter and the greater the loss and the likelihood to have a fault.

But again, you must maintain a balance between safety and cost. Unless my inverter system requires it, I will not do high voltage.

We learn everyday bro. That's why a maker will make a CC and rate it for 12/24/48 & give you different parameters to make all function because they know it can handle it. If it would not handle they would tell you straight ahead. I have not seen the spec sheets for the 250v CC though so I no fit talk.

If you read my initial post I'm sure I stated volts are directly proportional to current and I've been trying to think about it I think solar is the only (or one of the few) where the inverse proportionality is preferred. Baba, if you have 2000w of panels na still 2000w oo.....whether you install all in parallel or series. To save yourself the headache just do it & max the volts to the best of your CC.

adrusa:
And may I remind us all of Murphy's Law; if anything can happen, it will probably happen one day.

This law is particularly relevant in electricity. Look at your system and see what may go wrong. Then try to minimise the chance of it going wrong, and the consequences of it go wrong.

These are two different things. Chances can be minimised, but consequences are more difficult to minimise. So, your best bet is to try to avoid it happening at all.

And to repeat. Work with the minimum voltage that will do the job adequately, no need to play fast and lose with danger to prove some useless points.

I started my inverter adventure with 2 batteries, so I was doing 24v. I later realised that I can reduce the stress on my wires by going 48v. So, I went to 48v.

With 24v, my panels didn't need to be more than about 70/80v for MPPT. For 48v, I don't need more than 150v. So, these are the voltages you will find in my house, except 220v AC.

A friend almost lost a limb not long ago while doing DIY. He was working with his panels when his spanner mistakenly breached the negative and positive terminals. The spanner was amputated instantaneously. Somehow, his hand wasn't touching the spanner at the point of contact. He was safe, but he was shaken. He stopped messing around his installations since then.

So, gentlemen and ladies, let us be safe. Take the necessary precautions.

Get a rubber shoe to wear while working with electricity.
Get appropriate level gloves for your voltage.
Avoid touching naked wire as much as possible.
Use breakers to ensure that powers are cut off before working on your system.
Use only the minimum voltages that work for your system.
Stay safe.

Nice write up. But in my small knowledge of solar and electricals I believe its better to max your voltage output from the panels into your CC in order to reduce its current draw thereby also reducing your wire sizes.

There is a reason why the higher voltage CC is more expensive than the lower more conventional one. That's because power handling capability will be more using P=IV while also reducing your current further and making your connections safer. There was a 450v Victron I saw, man it was damn expensive else I for use am for all my connections oo. Voltage from your panels into your CC has little or absolutely nothing to do with your system voltage.

As for your friend, what happened to him was caused by current and not voltage. Whenever you short a live circuit, it's the current that hurts. The reason voltage is more referred to is because its usually directly proportional to current. Anyway, bridging batteries is a common occurrence in solar systems and can actually make you confess all your sins if you see it so na to try as much as possible to do your jobs in a safe way. Batteries can also not be isolated as they always pack a charge. Best thing is to insulate your hand tools and cover the battery terminals.

theoilguy:
Useless panels.. Degrades significantly after one year of production.. Not worth the time and effort...

Stick to tier 1 panels like Canadian solar if money is no object.

Las las, u ll be glad you did.

Solar panels are too cheap to manufacture and sell for you to be rating them this badly. And Felicity is beefing up their name in the industry.

I don't know though maybe it's your set up or you were just so unlucky to buy total trash but solar panels with 25yrs warranty should do better than you stated. Always go to the market with your multimeter when buying panels.

ojeysky:
Cool, is this the Nissan leaf? Will be interested to hear your setup experience

Yeah, this is the Nissan Leaf full pack I was talking about. You see the crate? That was what was charged for shipping into the country. Weight actually much as my people had to dismantle it to even fit put am inside motor first first. Sienna could not carry it.

Took like 8 people to drop it on the floor. On YouTube it was never explained to be this heavy oo.

essegis:
Invoice sent March 23rd. I sure e for don reach if no be for uncle Coro.

Guys e don land oo. Fully on site now. Too bad I'm stuck at work for a couple of long weeks. Can't get to working it till I'm done.