₦airaland Forum

Ileke-IdI:

Maybe you can teach me personally some aspects about your culture and I can do the same.

jason12345:
okay, i get it. but why don't you unite with them and see each other as one

Even the Ibibio are not united. lol

The Ibibio should include the Efik and Annang as ONE GROUP, because the share the same heritage, culture, and language but because of clan rivalry, they see themselves as separate groups.

I can understand Efik and Annang quite easily.

Ileke-IdI:
awww, thanks.

@post
will be back for more Yoruba culture.

Your welcome.

Yoruba culture is so beautiful!

From the clothing and cultural practices. Wonderful indeed.

And very beautiful Yoruba women. Lord have mercy!

Very beautiful pictures Ileke-Idi!

DapoBear:
Heh, I see. Hrm, I was in PH for one month visiting some family, is that city Igbo? The language they spoke sounded different to me.

I grew up in Port Harcourt. Igbo is the most widely spoken language in that city. Plus Port Harcourt's original name was Igwe Ocha. Frankly, the entire East speaks Igbo. Ijaw communities converse in Igbo, Ibibio and also other groups.

DapoBear:
That is the lovely thing about demographics, though. North America was not founded by the white man, but is part of his territory now. If you have enough people move en masse to a region, you can make it your own. Lagos is ours now, regardless of whether it was so in the past.

If we go by that thinking, than Igboland is much larger than the map I uploaded portrays!  

Now let me give you a what-if scenario. If Lagos becomes 80% Igbo, would that make it Igboland. By that line of thinking of yours, that would mean it is part of Alaigbo.  

I have been targeted by becomerich!

DapoBear:
Fair point. "Grab" I guess is controversial language. It is no secret that ideally I'd want Kwara and Western Kogi state in Yorubaland. Neither of these two regions are considered currently part of the Southwest.

Hrm, perhaps it is bias against the Igbo that causes your own aspiration to incorporate your kin in other regions into Igboland? I don't know. Though you must admit that if we Yoruba constantly talked about incorporating Warri somehow because of the Itsekiri, it would seem like a "landgrab." Are the Iwerri likely to join you guys, if they were given the option?

Now you are understanding the Igbo point of view. Don't you want to unite all Yoruba-speaking people? We Igbos have that same view.

We wish to unite with our brethren in Benue State, Delta State, Kogi State, Cross River State and Rivers State.

I have never hid my desire for a united Igboland. Igboland doesn't stop at the River Niger.

jason12345:
all the political positions would be filled by igbos and you cannot deny that!!! we would be marginalised in biafra. it would ust be a mini nigeria with the east acting as the north in present nigeria!!!!

bini people and yorubas can never fight!!! we have a common ancestry to the yorubas!!! at the worst scenario, we would dialogue!

jason12345,

I would suggest you learn about the history about why the Mid-West region was created as someone suggested. So now you are Bini? I thought you were Itsekiri? lol

And I think you are a participant of this Igbophobia, which is rampant in this nation unfortunately.

DapoBear:
Honestly, whoever you can convince to join Biafra in a fair poll supervised by some suitable external organization (e.g., the United Nations), find by me.

I'm not trying to restrict your shine, if you can convince the entire South-South to join you, more power to you.

Just don't try to do it by force, or through warfare. And of course, don't go trying to claim Lagos, or any part of Yorubaland. If you don't do those things, then we don't have any beef.

Well if many people in Nigeria share this point of view, then Nigeria would be a better place.

We Igbos are not a forceful people. We are very egalitarian by nature. That is why we say "Igbo enwe eze." We Igbos have no kings.

Remember Lagos is not Yorubaland. It was founded by the people of the former Benin Empire. lol

jason12345:
so you want us to leave nigeria and become a minority in your biafra?? what would then be the difference in nigeria and biafra? you have to understand that for biafra to succeed it has to occupy and take over some of the land that does not belong to biafrans

Why would Yoruba become a minority in Biafra?   Yoruba population is larger than Igbo population by a few million I believe. Frankly, I would want the Yorubas have their own Odua nation. But make sure that Lagos belongs to the Bini people.

Biafra could succeed even if it was landlocked. Look at tiny little Switzerland. Or even Singapore. Actually, smaller populations is easier to manage.

DapoBear:
Chyz, let's be realistic. If you Igbo want to secede, and you only take your 5 core Igbo states with you, you'll have created a state doomed to fail (well, let me not say doomed, but with a much smaller probability of succeeding.) Landlocked from the sea, not much economic activity within its borders. So your primary hope is to grab a significant portions of Delta and Rivers.

At least, if I were a Biafran, this is what I'd be trying to do.

So do you see the issue here? Biafra cannot come to be without taking parts of the country that are not considered core Igbo. Personally though, if you can convince Rivers to follow you, I have no problem, no skin off my back. I just don't think the Ikwerre Igbos are very likely to want to roll with you. Why share their money with you, basically? What incentive do they have?

If you can take Rivers though, I think Biafra could be a strong country.

Biafra's only problem was some Ijaw and the Annang. That is it. Ogoni were stalwarts of Biafra, Ibibios/Efik fought on behalf of Biafra.

Biafra would not just include the 5 core Igbo states. It would include parts of Delta State, most of Rivers State, Akwa Ibom and Cross River State. And some parts of Kogi and Benu state where native Igbo populations reside.

I always wondered about the Idoma, but that is for another thread. Many Idoma bear Igbo names and vice versa. And southern Idoma language is very similar to Northern Igbo dialects.

Basseti:
I really dont take Michael Steele seriously for some reason    And most importantly, the republican caucus dont take him seriously, so lets leave Mikey out of this thread  

We can discuss the situation of the black Republicans. Remember it was Republican Party that freed the slaves. The party of Lincoln still has those roots.  

I actually agree with many aspects of the Republican Party. I would consider myself a conservative.  

That is another discussion. Let us stay on topic o!

DapoBear:
Do you know who or what Banjo is? Banjo is the equivalent of Michael Steele, or any of these black Republicans. Guys like him are political tools, and are never supported by their own people.

Heck, if a white man wanted to start a "Enslave Yorubaland" party, he could very likely find a foolish Yoruba and pay him lots of money to be its figurehead.

Don't bring up Banjo and use him to justify invading West, unless you can also prove that he had the support of the Yoruba consensus. By and large, I've very rarely seen the Yoruba consensus get something wrong. If they say something is wrong, they are usually correct.

Interesting that you compared him to Michael Steele. I actually met Michael Steele. He is a nice Catholic man. Just because he is a Republican, Black Americans see him as a "Uncle Tom," which is foolish. But that is for another debate.

And now many Yorubas are complaining about Nigeria. Banjo tried to free you all, but was treated as an outsider. I am pretty sure Banjo is smiling now in death, knowing that he has been redeemed. I don't want to sound tribalistic by this post, but I do not want to hear any Yoruba complaining about Nigeria. You all had your chance, but you chose to stay. That is way I feel about it.

DapoBear:
It is what it is. Awolowo believed in the concept of total war (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_war). General Sherman used the same tactics in the American Civil War against the South. It was used in WW1 and WW2 as well. This is something that has been done repeatedly throughout history, as a tool of war.

In general, this is the story in Africa. If you want to start a war, it isn't going to be some fairy tale, King Arthur-esque chivalrous duel. It will be bloody, there will be despoil, plunder, and very likely genocide.

Look, this is EXACTLY why Awolowo did not want armies in his lands! He is not some sort of romantic fool who has read to many King Arthur stories. He knew that war in Yorubaland would DEVASTATE our people.

That you compare him to Hitler makes me love the man more. He has sacrificed his honor and reputation (at least, among non-Yoruba) to save his own people from a terrible fate. I only hope that one day I can be as wise and courageous as he was.

If your people cannot admit to the wrongs of Awolowo. We will never see eye to eye with your people. That is the sad fact. I will always consider this man as pure evil.

Do you see Germans who give praise to Hitler? No. They do not even want people to mention the man's name. In the history books, there will one day be stories of the Biafran Genocide. It took many years for people to recognize the Armenian Genocide and we shall wait for our turn as well. I will tell the stories to my children, and they will pass it on. It will never be forgotten.

One day, you will see Awolowo's name next to Hitler. I cannot wait till that day. And any supporter of him is no friend of mine. That is why he had the fitting death by suicide. A broken man. . .

Dede1:
There were Yoruba extractions that fought on the Biafran side. Soldiers such as Banjo, Ademoyega, Adeleke and Oyawole should be remembered. However, there were few Yoruba people of extraordinary personalities such Lt Col Ayo Ariyo who was 2ic in 3MCDO in Calabar in 1967 resigned his commission in Nigeria army instead of fighting Biafrans. Also, Ijebu Ode Peasant Farmers Association that violently protested Gowon’s stay in Lagos while commanding Nigerian soldiers to fight Biafra. Yes, Wole Soyinka who spent the three years of the war in prison in Kaduna for opposing the war. You must understand that these fine personalities were just drop of water in the ocean.

Thank you for this post.

jason12345, do you have a problem with these descendants of Oduduwa. They fought on behalf of Biafra or protested against the injustices committed against Biafra.

Seems like this is the perfect time to bring this post up.

DapoBear:
Long live Biafra. And may Biafra rise again. But hopefully you will not attempt to send armies of conquest westwards towards Yorubaland. If you can come up with a way to realize your dream that doesn't involve invading our lands, then it is much likelier to succeed. After all, I'm not really sure anyone in this day and age (certainly not the Yoruba) is really that opposed to Igboland seceding. Just don't try to landgrab the Delta (and the Ikwere by and large seem to be trying to disassociate themselves from the larger Igbo polity, so this probably wouldn't be very successful anyway) , choice parts of the Southwest, and very likely Biafra can come to pass.

Let us not discuss the Ikwerre (clearly Igbo sub-group). Many Ikwerres are starting to wake up. Especially in my generation. I went to school with many Ikwerre in Port Harcourt. I did not even know that many were Ikwerre, because we conversed in Igbo and names were Igbo. Very confusing people.

Let us not forget that Biafra was a multi-ethnic country. A named coined by an Ijaw man. Igbos, Ogoni, Ijaw, Ibibio, Ekoi all fought on behalf of Biafra. We all know Ojukwu's second in command was not an Igbo man. Two of my mother's brothers fought on behalf of Biafra and they are Ibibio. They saw intense fighting in the state that now known as Cross River.

All Biafra wants is the land East of the River Niger and the Anioma Igbo of the former midwest region.

jason12345:
EZE, pls read my link and also DAPOBEAR'S comment above and tell me what the igbos would have done if the yorubas did that to them.
THANK YOU

Lets be honest with ourself. Banjo was ahead of his time as well. He saw Northern domination as a wrong, and he tried to free his people. We Igbos supported him in his dream of freeing Yorubaland from Northern domination. This same domination that continues to this day.

This man should be treated like a hero.

The Igbos would have understood what the Yoruba were doing, if this was the other way around. Since many of our people were killed in the pogroms up North. We would have celebrated you all as liberators and joined you all in your struggle against the North.

DapoBear:
See, think about how foolish this sounds, on the face of it. The Yoruba elite are responsible for the Yoruba, not the Igbo. It is like complaining that your uncle is looking after the interests of his kids before he looks after you! Why is it your uncle's responsibility to pay for your college education before that of his own kids? Makes absolutely no sense; when did the Yoruba elite become the daddy of the Igbo?

Regarding Awo, yes, from the perspective of the Igbo and the suffering they endured, he certainly can be viewed as an evil man. War is a nasty, ugly thing. And in Africa, it is no holds barred, genocide, starvation, despoil, etc are all valid weapons in such wars here. But just because Awo had no qualms in using those weapons doesn't make him an evil man. If you and I get into a fight, and it is a fight to the death, I'll use ANY weapon at my disposal to win. I will gouge out your eyes if necessary, I will break a bottle and use that as a weapon. You don't get style points in life-or-death struggles, the only thing that matters is who wins.

I'd rather have a leader like Awolowo who will do ANYTHING to win rather than some pompous jackass who abides by some foolish, medieval code of chivalry that increases the chances of defeat. War simply is brutal and should be avoided if possible. But if you start a war, then you should do anything you can to win it, especially as the consequences for losing wars in Africa are so brutal.

Awolowo is to Igbos, is like Hitler to the Jews. We will forever rain curses on this man.

In this day and age, there is a type of etiquette that should govern the laws of war. You do not target civilian populations. These defenseless populations are not like soldiers. What justification do you have to despoil a young lady, killed children and elderly. Only a DEMON would support such actions. I would not even wish that on my own enemy's people. If I have a beef with you, I will target you, not your family.

I do not want to get into a Nigerian Civil War debate, but needless to say, the dream of Biafra is still on the mind of many Easterners. Biafra was not perfect, but it was far better than Nigeria. If only it had succeeded.

Dede1:
I hope you are not being delusional with this inconsequential Fela stuff? Fela did absolutely nothing in support of Biafra. He was in London enjoying himself out of Nigeria’s coffer.

I am just saying that there were Yorubas who supported Biafra. Wole Soyinka was thrown in prison for his support of Biafra. We cannot forget Yoruba activist like this.

Let us be honest with ourselves. And we should never forget about Biafra.