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What do you know about Sowore? What do you know about Atiku? If you are informed, the choice is clear. This is an ignorant statement! The facts are out there, investigate yourself and stop this way of thinking. torino88: |
I hope you live through what comes next if your Atiku eventually wins. People who do not care about you and are trying to turn Nigeria to their private property. It is evident that Nigerian youths do not want to live a good life. Keep voting for the likes of Atiku and Buhari but complain no more of the life you have been given and the opportunities you have. If Sowore is still active at this time to election and all you have to say is that someone planted him, I sincerely wish you the best. Your eye go soon clear! naijapips02: |
I have to be blunt with you. Facebook is a metaphor for 'the next big thing'. Why do you people refuse to reason? Does he have to explicitly tell you that's a metaphor? vizkiz: |
Well, that is debatable. Why do you like ignoring logical questions and arguing trivial questions? I have asked you so many questions and this is the one you chose to respond to? Who cares if it was led by Yaradua or Jonathan.What did you gain from the one lead by Obasanjo and Atiku for 8 years? No electricity, bad roads, no reliable transport system, no subsidized health care, how may of them were able stay in Nigeria for health-related issues? You are here defending criminals who have stolen/looted your future! Which one of them has provided you with a life you could be proud of as a Nigerian citizen? Their kids school abroad and they buy properties abroad with stolen money and you are here clamoring for them. Are you not suffering? Are you not disadvantaged and disenfranchised? What kind of life are you living that makes you think PDP/APC will improve it? Are both parties not of the same politicians decamping everytime? It is time to honestly answer these questions for yourself and start thinking of the kind of life you deserve to live and not the ones you have been given because I think you believe what has happened in the last 20 years in Nigeria is normal! Your rights are being violated and all you can do is clamor for those who violated it in the first place. Enough is Enough! Open your eyes, hears and mind, that's the only way you can comprehend what I am saying at this point without being defensive. Please note sincerely, I do not write this for you to respond. Go and think deeply on what is really happening to you as a Nigerian citizen! soulpeppersoup: |
Now, I understand you. All the best! soulpeppersoup: |
Also, you have not responded to my question on the essence of the debate? What is the essence? If it is not a sales pitch, what determines the outcome? Before making further comments, remember that it is as a result of the failures of the PDP-led governments(which Atiku was part of) that made Nigeria vote for an old APC candidate. If PDP had made our lives better, we would not even have considered APC! talk of Buhari soulpeppersoup: |
It seems my posts are out-of-sync. So, kindly respond to what I have mentioned here logically. I also enjoy an intellectual conversation. So, please do not ignore what I am saying to simply go on-and-on about the debate! What two? No right-thinking person with conscience will even consider voting for Atiku/Buhari at this point. I will only support any debate, if Buhari and Atiku will debate Sowore. He is the only one who really has what it takes. Everyone else is just doing lip service. Imagine since 1999 no clean water, no electricity, no security, no shelter i.e internal displacement, government worsens every four years for the past 20 years and you think we take Atiku and Buhari seriously. We are done with them! Now, I see what you are doing here. You are now referring me to Atiku in order to get to know his plans? So, why are you saying we should vote for him when you don't even have a clue as to how he plans to run his policies (if any) within his government? This is why Nigerians have been enslaved for so long: people simply regurgitate what other people say without finding facts and truly developing their convictions. soulpeppersoup: |
What two? No right-thinking person with conscience will even consider voting for Atiku/Buhari at this point. I will only support any debate, if Buhari and Atiku will debate Sowore. He is the only one who really has what it takes. Everyone else is just doing lip service. Imagine since 1999 no clean water, no electricity, no security, no shelter i.e internal displacement, government worsens every four years for the past 20 years and you think we take Atiku and Buhari seriously. We are done with them! Now, I see what you are doing here. You are now referring me to Atiku in order to get to know his plans? So, why are you saying we should vote for him when you don't even have a clue as to how he plans to run his policies (if any) within his government? This is why Nigerians have been enslaved for so long: people simply regurgitate what other people say without finding facts and truly developing their convictions. soulpeppersoup: |
Win or lose by doing what exactly? What is the process that determines the outcome? We are still expecting you to elucidate some of Atiku's plans for developing our country. Clear plans with timelines and figures (estimates) and not promises. soulpeppersoup: |
And what is the essence of the debate? Is it not to sell yourself to the Nigerian people (who have the voting power)? We are still expecting you to elucidate some of Atiku's plans for developing our country. Clear plans with timelines and figures (estimates) and not promises. soulpeppersoup: |
Please bore me! State these things precisely because our future depends on it. We do not need vague promises. Besides, Atiku's interaction has not been verified by any USA (government) entity. Even his so-called townhall meeting was disrupted. If you know better than everyone else, kindly clarify. I hope you now see that he was absent for the much-publicized NEDG/BON presidential debate. PDP and APC: No ideas, no vision, just power hungry! Hopefully, you now understand when we say they do not care about you (as you may have thought). Those present in the debate all have other things to do with their time. I say this knowing he (Atiku) was at the venue! It was an opportunity for him to really showcase his intentions and not play politics, which he has failed to do. Nigerians will vote for the next president not Buhari! soulpeppersoup: |
Finally, I found someone who wants to talk facts and logic. Before I make my case, you must understand and agree (with the benefit of hindsight) that both APC and PDP-led governments have not given serious considerations to our fundamental human rights (which Atiku has been part of for 8 years). When I say fundamental, I mean, in 2019 electricity, clean water and housing should not be a problem for common citizens. Not to talk of functional education and transportation systems (and infrastructures). From your argument, Sowore's propositions can not work in Nigeria. Please tell me what incremental steps Atiku will be taking when he takes office? Would you encourage people who have been victims to Boko Haram and other attacks vote for PDP? Boko haram did not start in 2015, it started when PDP was in power, and what did they do? One of the main reasons for voting Buhari in (in the first place) was to manage and solve the problems that overwhelmed PDP and created more problems. And we can both agree that Buhari has also failed! So, now back to Sowore: He is not about grand ideals but practical solutions to our problems. The concept of 'Revolution' comes from the fact that Nigeria needs to go in another direction if it is indeed going to make any progress whatsoever. Since 1999, both PDP and APC have proven incompetent. Unless you are not disadvantaged in some way by these people, there is no reason to still expect them to care about you. THEY DO NOT CARE! My final point: if you want to be realistic, tell us what makes Atiku's ideas better and more realistic than Sowore's? Do you even know what is inside Atiku's manifesto? If you do, please mention them here to enlighten everyone. hedonistic: |
What ideas is Atiku proposing to better the lives of common citizens and take Nigeria on the path of prosperity. Please highlight them here for all to see. soulpeppersoup: |
I think you are entitled to your opinion without insulting people. Even if you strongly believe he will lose (which I doubt), the least you can do is truly engage people with ideas, compare Sowore's ideas to Atiku's ideas and Buhari's ideas and see which one makes more sense to you. Maybe after then, you might show the man some respect! We are talking about our future here not APC vs PDP! BLACKdagger: |
And where has that lead us? is this the Nigeria of your dreams? hush15: |
Reading some of your posts it is almost believable that you have been paid to say these things because nobody with conscience will vote for Atiku or Buhari. You complain of bad and corrupt leaders year-in year-out, you have a right to live a good life! So, stop acting as if your life does not matter because it should be clear by now (to you) that you don't matter to Atiku or Buhari. They will only remember you again in 2023. Be wise. Why is this so difficult for you to understand? The same fate that met the northerners (regarding terrorism) will meet any other region if such arises. They can't even guarantee your safety! BLACKdagger: |
He was schemed out of the debate, period! Please don't be ignorant. ogawisdom: |
I think this is why Nigerians are being enslaved. Who are those doing these calculations? Just vote for who you believe should be President. Do you think either Buhari or Atiku's presidency will give you a dignified life? really? If you have been paid, please stop misleading Nigerian youths. This is our future, and we deserve better than Atiku and Buhari. If Sowore does not win, it is because of people like you who keep regurgitating this. It is irrational to think like this as a youth! I'm sorry to say this. But you have to start thinking of the life you want to live in Nigeria and not PDP vs APC. We are done with them! SalamRushdie: |
We are taking this out of context. But to indulge you again, what characterizes the Apartheid regime? We are equally being violated and systematically gamed. Don't you get it? People are dying everyday and our government can't protect us or they don't care. Only a select few are enjoying the resources of this country. People are internally displaced? Can you draw some similarities? Do I have to keep repeating this? On transferrable skills. If that mattered in governing Nigeria, then Buhari should have been the best President, since he has 'transferrable skills'. Our past leaders had what you termed transferable skills ask yourself this: why are we in this mess of a country? since you think it makes a difference. So, you really have no point here also. It is clear that those with the 'so-called experience' have delivered nothing to the citizens. Why do you want to keep rewarding them with more promotion. Not that it matters at this point, but his activism could also count for experience. For example, when what was most important to Nigerians was having a democratic rule and taking our government from the Military, who do you think was part of the youths that lead the protests while your so-called experienced leaders were hiding? The democracy you all enjoy since 1999 was fought for by Sowore and his peers (as the SUG president) and it is on record. You can verify this with a little investigation. None of your current crop of leaders have been more engaged with Nigeria politically over the last 30 years. Quote me! Nobody is blindly supporting Sowore. If you ask me, I think you are the obstinate one, failing to heed reason. With regards to funding, I think you have not seriously been engaged with the state of affairs in Nigeria. We have guaranteed revenue generation from oil but we do not even need to go there to be able to fund most of what he proposes. Nigerian FIRS made over 5trn last year, Jamb made trn, port authority disclosed that they made some money. It goes on.... What is Nigeria's budget? 8trn or thereabout. I do not even need to got to the Oil sector. Do you see the reasoning surrounding this? Revenue from only FIRS alone has covered more than half of the budget (you can verify this). So, the idea going around that there are no resources to cater for most of these things is largely deceptive. And for economic theorists who always believe things will not work since they don't like the ideas of the Man in question, I have one thing to say: Practicality is what matters, not what you think the ideal situation should be. In fact, let me ask you, which of his alternatives (Buhari and Atiku, specifically) provide us sound economic policies that you so much resonate with? Clearly point this out to the readers. If you are attacking Sowore for what he lacks, kindly point out which of the old guards is better in that aspect and state your reasons. Since you firmly believe they can do a better job. Attacking his personality is what you are all accusing Sowore of doing! Isn't that hypocritical? I am ready to debate you to any length and I will not insult you! Sterope: |
Thanks for your response. I am glad we are having this discussion. Mandela was a national president of the ANC Youth League and lead protests against Apartheid government. His activities were within the the confines of the ANC party, which in reality was a movement to end Apartheid rule. Kindly cite the public offices that Mandela held before becoming president. I think keen readers will appreciate that. Further, policies of restorative justice addressed the concerns of South Africa. This is why we need to shift our critical thinking from reasoning by analogy to reasoning with fundamental truths. Solutions to Nigeria's problem are not going to come by simply copying what worked in other countries especially with regards to corruption. Although we are both fighting oppression, the problem Mandela addressed is quite different from what we are plagued with in Nigeria. There's was racial and ours is that our fundamental human rights are not taken seriously. We the citizens are taken for granted and expected to be alive through the next four years when it is time for another election. No one cares which lives were lost, what government failures and obsolete policies were responsible....you know no one asks provocative questions that poke the conscience of our 'so-called leaders'. Hence, no one is held responsible. Which is why men like Atiku and Buhari still have the courage to contest for an election in Nigeria. Now, you compared Sowore to Mugabe and in the same space and attacked the feasibility of his manifesto. Then you said Sowore has unresolved issues. All this shows is that you have a bias for the people who have looted this country its is current state. So no problem here. Then proceeded to say that our country relies on corruption and say we will suffer. The simple way to address you assertion here is this: If you have good transportation system(air and rail for example), 24/7 electricity, subsidized health care, good hospitals, take care of the retired workers, provide assistance to the disenfranchised, you will gradually reduce corruption at the lowest-level. The most corrupt people are the poliitians who continue to steal despite all they have stolen. So, a good & guaranteed quality of life reduces anxieties or need to steal for the future (for civilians). For politicians, we can agree that Sowore is disruptive and outspoken on his plans to make our past leaders pay for their crimes (since looting is a crime). There is no way we won't tame corruption to a reasonable level. He has the guts! Then you said "A true manifesto will not read that a Youth corper salary's should be increased to N50k or propose to create jobs out of thin air (are you forgetting that our private companies thrives because of corruption).". His proposal for what to pay workers and on job creations are well thought-out! For concreteness, funding 1000 entrepreneurs in 774 local governments across Nigeria is not a vague plan. It is doable! Building houses across the country implicitly creates more jobs. Bringing 200k health professionals from abroad to improve our health sector is feasible. Training 160K teachers to send back to schools to give our kids quality education is also possible.And the mininmum wage of 100K is retained within Nigeria as opposed to the billions stolen by politicians and used to purchase and invest in properties outside Nigeria... I can't possibly write his full manifesto here, so excuse me. The aforementioned are all practical solutions. You can not reform a country that is impoverished and lacking integrity-based institutions. No reform will be effective if the human resources in charge are not properly incentivized and monitored. So cutting bureaucracy down, for example is abstraction over a functional system. Without a functional system, you can not reform anything. And what are the main components of any functional system? Yes, humans/workers/citizens. If you don't address the human component, you are going no where. Then, you say he is very petty, belittle his accomplishments with Sahara Reporters (a registered company), and say he does not have enough experience. This is your real position. We could have started the conversation from here - meaning that you just wasted my time. Sterope: |
Someone has to clarify things for those who reason by analogy. I have other things to do, but it is painful and disappointing to see that the pride and dignity of our youths have deteriorated to this level. To make things worse, the conditioning that things cannot drastically change is quite common here. I am passionate about my country's development, we are the most populous Black nation in the world. We should be respected and not denigrated by anyone, anywhere on this Earth. SouthWestBlood: |
Nigeria is difficult to govern? Is this a fact or an assumption? Which national research or consensus can you cite? What metrics are required for a country like Nigeria? Can you briefly point out some of the complexities that someone like Sowore cannot tackle. It is not a crime if he is not a billionaire. So, he should go ahead to contest for chairmanship, loot and come back with more of the same. I am really getting tired. I know I have tried with you. I can't go beyond this. You simply don't get it and it's shocking! Please do not complain that you have bad leaders in Nigeria because it is clear that you do not know what a dignified life really is. You are free to continue with Atiku/Buhari. And after the next four years do not complain of the life you have been given, because you were one of those who were slow to get it. I know it will become clearer as time goes on. All the best. Kellibae: |
Going by your logic, if you have never held position of power you are unfit to rule. Now answer this: Which local government did Mandela govern before becoming the President of South Africa? The most stabilizing force that nation has ever seen. What was Mandela's experience? Yet he took the country from an Apartheid State to a Democratic State. Second, Obama was derided as a community leader, spent 6 months as a Senator, lead for 8 years and took America out of recession. These are genuinely men of character! I hope you now see the flaw in your reasoning (logic). You are saying he is narcissistic. Simply put, he is self-centered. This is false and derogatory. Sowore is a respected and an accomplished man. In fact, history will remember him whether he wins or loses this election. He has opened our eyes to the modern enslavement by our oppressors who still want us to continue worshiping them while they turn our country to their private property. I wish you well and pray you don't end-up a victim of bad governance from Atiku and Buhari. What should victims of Boko Haram say? People who die at public hospitals due to lack of proper management and infrastructure? People internally displaced within their own country? I can continue ... Sterope: |
Your statement holds true only if leading a nation to prosperity requires certain rhetoric. We need people who will deliver results not orators. If showing respect to those who have robbed us of what remains of our dignity is the character you want from your next president, then you still don't get it. What is so special about Nigeria? We are not the giant of Africa...so? Even Ghana is doing better than us. A country of over 180m where more than 70% is in poverty. This means people are not informed enough to understand what 'living a dignified life is' and I am beginning to think you are one of them (with due respect). Kellibae: |
Honestly, I think I should be the one asking you if you have heard him talk before. Like how many of his conversations have you listened? If you follow even his live sessions on Youtube and watch the intelligent conversations he holds and you are of a practical mind, you will fully grasp what this is about. It is more than Sowore. It is the fight for our future. Please stop reasoning by analogy (with due respect), do your investigations yourself and develop your convictions when presented with facts. Please, stop regurgitating what is of an unenlightened mind. If you have been abroad or lived outside Nigeria, then you will know why people abroad prefer Sowore to any of the candidates. Are you telling me you have more exposure than them? It is simply because they have seen how governments work. Most people in Nigeria think the current conditions that we are living in is normal. It is not! And with regards to your argument on looting, I think you will prefer Atiku and Buhari to continue looting and give excuses as to why nothing is working. Because if you grasp the full extent of what possibilities you could have in a country like Nigeria, you would risk having a young and energetic candidate like Sowore. We are really lucky to have him in our lifetime. He is the only one saying what everyone is afraid to say and you think a guy like that is doing that simply to loot. Why do you think people are afraid to speak harshly against past leaders? It is because they can be harmed. Sowore knows this and still goes ahead (placing his life at risk). What more do you want from him? I seriously pray by the time you realise the flaws in your reasoning it won't be too late. Lastly, on sentiments: They are statements made to spur some sort of emotion. That's a basic definition. Now, when people/parties campaign and they make statements, do you think these statements are not made to manipulate people emotionally? This is what democracy is about at the ground-level. So, everybody uses sentiments, some people are just better at it than others! Kellibae: |
I beg to differ. There is an assumption you are making: that APC and PDP can't be defeated. What makes you so sure? because other people are saying the same thing? Is it because you know they will try to rig? Just play your part. Why is this so difficult to understand? (with due respect) davecris: |
I understand that you do not like the man. You have called him all sorts, what crime has he commited really? Is it because he is not the son of a rich man? Is it because he is not sanctified by our current political leaders? Whatever you think he has done, he has given people in the diaspora and within Nigeria a genuine hope for a prosperous Nigeria. You may not know this. If anything, what will you gain byvoting Atiku or Buhari? is it because you have not been a victim of the insecurities in the country? Are you not disadvantaged and disenfranchised (even if you have shelter and food)? A lot of Nigerians have become homeless in their own states. Nigerians are dying as a result of bad governance (bad roads, no subsidized healthcare, few good and responsive hospitals, clean water, bad educational system...). Which of these basic rights have they provided to you their citizen? Why do you think anything will change with them? Answer these questions honestly and develop concrete convictions of the life you really want to live in Nigeria. You deserve to live and enjoy in a country that works in your lifetime and the time to start is now!. If you still feel any different, feel free to put out your concerns. Kellibae: |
If Nigeria is not a sane society and you genuinely believe that the fight is between Atiku and Buhari. Going with your logic, how then do you believe that your vote will count toward your candidate (Atiku)? I think you still genuinely believe that APC and PDP governments will be different with politicians decamping both ways. Even Atiku is from APC. If you are hoping that your vote counts in an insane society like Nigeria (your words), then you can hope for a better future when you cast for Sowore. There is nothing left for us in this country as citizens. What will you seriously lose by voting Sowore? davecris: |
I think you are the one being derogatory towards Sowore and you also making allegations. Please state precisely/accurately what he has said/done in this debate that makes you think less of him. It is crucial for you to point this out explicitly, so you don't come off as ignorant. Otherwise, you probably have bias for the current leaders. jaxxy: |
Is it until we start losing our loved ones due to bad governance that every body will understand what this fight is about? what should the families of the abducted girls say? You think they would be happy with Buhari/Atiku? The victims of herdsmen attack?, relatives of soldiers who died because this current government is not on the war front in the best possible shape? Leadership experience has little to do with character, you should be looking for people with character! We as citizens don't have anything to fallback on, what do you have to lose by voting for Sowore? Sterope: |
Just one question: What allegations? So it is not a known fact that our crop of political leaders are thieves/looters? Please don't claim ignorance! jaxxy: |
I hope you think deeply on what I am about to say. The leaders from APC and PDP that have been pleasant and presidential have lead to the country to its current state. If being blunt is uncouth, then I believe that is sheer ignorance. If you fully understand the damaging effect that our current leaders have done to our psyche, dignity and moral values, you will consider his statements mild. I'm surprised you are not angry with the status quo. Are you not suffering? Are you safe? Do you have healthcare? Don't you know at least one person who has been a victim of bad governance since 1999? the list goes on... davecris: |
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