₦airaland Forum

MuttleyLaff:
"Jesus replied,
"Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
- John 3:3

Harshirama, since we seem to have switched from real and unreal believer(s) to now "born again", please tell, that is, I mean, factually speaking, what, according to Jesus and is in the Bible speaking, is and/or was Nicodemus born again to your understanding of reading that John 3:2-3?

Harshirama, also what was the comment made by Nicodemus, as in, what was his intro question and the reason, he gave, for coming up to the clandestine meeting in the dead of the night or wee hours of the morning, he had with Jesus?. Lastly, why is Jesus saying "truly truly I tell you" and talking about "no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again" to Nicodemus' John 3:2 blunt and opening remark, huh? I am sure, you're aware, that Jesus, always does this, He responds to what lies at the heart of something or somebody. Jesus in John 3:3, responded to what was in the heart of nicodemus by telling Nicodemus that no one can see and confirm all that Nicodemus has said about Him and say that the miraculous signs are evidence that God is with Jesus except that person is born again. Isnt that so? Isnt that the words of Jesus and/or what He said about "born again", the phrase originally known as born from above or born from on high?

In fact, scoffers, mockers, cynics, pagans etcetera dont, never see and never will see anything good about the kingdom and that's because they are not born again, they are not born from above, and so are not spiritually rebirthed. It's more the reason, we have atheists, it is because regeneration has not taken place in them and this why they rubbish and/or never want to acknowledge any demonstrations or power of the kingdom of God. They dont believe who Jesus is, that He is God and that the miraculous signs are evidence that God is with Jesus

Compare that verse to this

Now when they heard this, they were acutely distressed and said to Peter and the rest of the apostles, “What should we do, brothers?” Peter said to them, “Repent, and each one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
So those who accepted his message were baptized, and that day about three thousand people were added.
Acts 2:37-38, 41

MuttleyLaff:
"Jesus replied,
"Truly, truly, I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again."
- John 3:3

Harshirama, since we seem to have switched from real and unreal believer(s) to now "born again", please tell, that is, I mean, factually speaking, what, according to Jesus and is in the Bible speaking, is and/or was Nicodemus born again to your understanding of reading that John 3:2-3?

Harshirama, also what was the comment made by Nicodemus, as in, what was his intro question and the reason, he gave, for coming up to the clandestine meeting in the dead of the night or wee hours of the morning, he had with Jesus?. Lastly, why is Jesus saying "truly truly I tell you" and talking about "no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again" to Nicodemus' John 3:2 blunt and opening remark, huh? I am sure, you're aware, that Jesus, always does this, He responds to what lies at the heart of something or somebody. Jesus in John 3:3, responded to what was in the heart of nicodemus by telling Nicodemus that no one can see and confirm all that Nicodemus has said about Him and say that the miraculous signs are evidence that God is with Jesus except that person is born again. Isnt that so? Isnt that the words of Jesus and/or what He said about "born again", the phrase originally known as born from above or born from on high?

In fact, scoffers, mockers, cynics, pagans etcetera dont, never see and never will see anything good about the kingdom and that's because they are not born again, they are not born from above, and so are not spiritually rebirthed. It's more the reason, we have atheists, it is because regeneration has not taken place in them and this why they rubbish and/or never want to acknowledge any demonstrations or power of the kingdom of God. They dont believe who Jesus is, that He is God and that the miraculous signs are evidence that God is with Jesus

Though, Nicodemus believed in Jesus, he wasn't born again yet as the work of salvation wasn't complete. The Bible says Jesus was the firstborn of the dead(not physically, but spiritually) meaning he died both physically and spiritually but God raised him up

alBHAGDADI:
Do you even know what the will of God truly is? Perhaps you think it's dos and don'ts. .

Look, the will of God is to believe in Jesus. Nothing more, nothing less.


John 6:40
And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Another related verse
1 Tim 2:4
who desires all people to be saved and come to full knowledge of the truth.

MuttleyLaff:
"¹¹I will no longer be in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to You. Holy Father, protect them by Your name, the name You gave Me, so that they may be one as We are one.
¹²While I was with them, I protected and preserved them by Your name, the name You gave Me. Not one of them has been lost, except the son of destruction, so that the Scripture would be fulfilled. "
- John 17:11-12

"Truly, truly, I tell you, whoever hears My word and believes Him who sent Me has eternal life and will not come under judgment. Indeed, he has crossed over from death to life."
- John 5:24

alBHAGDADI, what is the correlation between eternal life and everlasting life? Is there any distinction or difference between eternal life and everlasting life?
Isnt eternal life, something that has to do with spiritual existence after death of the body, as in meaning, continued life after death, hmm? Now if God promises one and all everlasting life, when and how does the "will not come under judgment" disclaimer strays in, to deny, disqualify, deprive, rule or knock one out of the promised eternal life and/or everlasting life?



alBHAGDADI, What kind of believer was Judas? Or did Judas, not at all, believed in Jesus? Did Judas never and not for a moment ever believed in Jesus? Did Judas at no time believed in Jesus?

content208, I am sure is of the opinion that Judas was not a real believer, do you say same alBHAGDADI? Let me, before you start labelling me, as reasoning like a biblical illiterate, quickly say, I am just curious and only was asking ni ooo, lol.
cc Bnimz

Judas wasn't a believer, none of the disciples were born again at that point. Remember Jesus died and resurrected and still had to explain the fulfilment of the scriptures to them after that. That was when they became born again

content208:
Then you are sayings God was lying when he instructed Ezekiel in Ezekiel 18:24, right?

Abeg, I'm tired of coming to NL, if you can drop your WhatsApp number, let's chat

content208:
Then you are sayings God was lying when he instructed Ezekiel in Ezekiel 18:24, right?

Was Jesus lying in John 10:28 too. Abraham practically lied more than once in the old testament, yet he was still called righteous. All men throughout the Bible have had their own failings, which is why only the sacrifice of Jesus makes us perfect

content208:
Lolz. Good back and read with a better understanding.

Maybe you should also ask yourself how many sinful churhc goers can have the same opportunity that the guy had.

All you've been saying is sin sin sin. So do you mean all those who believe eternal security are sinful, or do you think the sacrifice of Jesus isn't enough to save you eternally?

content208:
The thief made ammend in the last minute. He didn't die in his sin. This is different from the issue at hand.

We are talking here about those who claim to have received salvation but still wallow in sin. The thief you mentioned doesn't even apply here at all

Which amend did he make, he didn't even ask for forgiveness, he only asked Jesus to remember him in paradise, which means he believed Jesus was the son of God

content208:
Oga, you lose eternal life if you take God's salvation for granted. You can't be in sin and expect that you will make heaven, especially if you are commiting wilful sin.

Confessing Christ as Lord with mouth is not enough; you must also do his will.

Even from the grammar sef, it's very obvious, lose, salvation and eternal don't go together

content208:
If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth.

1John 1:6.

The real believer is not he who just confesses, but he who confessed and does God's will.

You stop believing in your heart the moment you dabble in willful sin

Where is willful sin in the verse you quoted, I explained what a believer is and you're saying something else. Instead of giving thanks to God for giving us eternal life, you're saying sin up and down

content208:
If we claim to have fellowship with him and yet walk in the darkness, we lie and do not live out the truth.

1John 1:6.

The real believer is not he who just confesses, but he who confessed and does God's will.

You stop believing in your heart the moment you dabble in willful sin

What about the thief on the cross that entered paradise, which will did he do before he died. Of course a believer should do God's will, but what makes you a believer is when you receive the gift of salvation

content208:
What's the definition of a believer? One that has confessed Jesus as Lord sometimes ago or one that is living the life of Christ and doing his will?

Because if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and thus has righteousness and with the mouth one confesses and thus has salvation.
Romans 10:9-10

1StopRudeness:
Oh...a more comprehensive explanation....I’m clear now...thanks

You're welcome

1StopRudeness:
Harshirama.. could u explain what Jesus meant in Rev 3v15-16.....it was my counter that it was possible to be in Christ and later not be in him because of not remaining on fire...
I asked albhagdadi, but he claimed I was speaking nonsense cos I did not agree with his idea that Christ was speaking to the church building and that he wasn’t referring to persons which makes up the church and the body of Christ the same time....
This confused me cos I ddnt get how jesus could be warning a church but the warning that he would spew them out isn’t for the people that made up the church.... do I have some light to this

That verse refers to those in between true Christianity and ordinary religion.

Revelation 3:16-17
So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I am going to vomit you out of my mouth! Because you say, “I am rich and have acquired great wealth, and need nothing,” but do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind, and naked,

i.e those who depend and believe on their own works.

1StopRudeness:
Harshirama.. could u explain what Jesus meant in Rev 3v15-16.....it was my counter that it was possible to be in Christ and later not be in him because of not remaining on fire...
I asked albhagdadi, but he claimed I was speaking nonsense cos I did not agree with his idea that Christ was speaking to the church building and that he wasn’t referring to persons which makes up the church and the body of Christ the same time....
This confused me cos I ddnt get how jesus could be warning a church but the warning that he would spew them out isn’t for the people that made up the church.... do I have some light to this

I give them eternal life, and they will never perish; no one will snatch them from my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one can snatch them from my Father's hand.
John 10:28-29

content208:
But according to you, eternal security mean freedom to sin. Why are you contradicting yourself?

Freedom to sin? Can't you read your Bible? Eternal security means freedom from sin, a believer should not lust after the flesh. He who has died has been freed from sin according to the Bible. We were dead spiritually before Christ raised us up through salvation. We'll also be recreated bodily at the rapture

content208:
The Holy Spirit leaves your life if you commit willful sin. As a sinner, you have stained the Temple of God, which is your body. The Holy Spirit cannot reside in filth. This is why sinners are easy preys to satanic manipulation because they are weak and empty consequent of sins.
The eyes of God cannot behold iniquity.

Can you point out any scriptures that suggest the holy spirit can leave a believer?

The holy spirit dwells in the believer's recreated spirit, while the believer's spirit dwells in a body which was why he said your body is the temple of God. You need to read your Bible more

content208:
Are you saying I can go into armed robbery after I have confessed Jesus Christ as Lord?

Then if I want to commit sin, all I need to do is to first go and accept Jesus as Lord and then go and be enjoying sin. Is that the kind of Christianity you are practicing and propagating?

Most of the things you even wrote up there are speaking against your new-found idea about Christianity.

Accept Jesus and go into armed robbery now, if that's what you want to do. Any Christian that uses this doctrine as a front to commit sin is foolish

content208:
Christianity is not by church membership; Christianity is a way of life. If your way of life opposes the scriptures, you are not a Christian; you are just a church member or a church goer.

Have you ever asked yourself why the scriptures said judgement would begin from the church?

You can't be in sin that grace may abound.

Do you know another meaning of Grace? It is the Spirit of God. If you are in sin, the Glory and Grace of God will leave you because the eyes of God cannot behold iniquity; that's what the scripture says.

We'd be judged based on how far we fulfilled God's calling.

If what someone has built survives, he will receive a reward. If someone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss. He himself will be saved, but only as through fire.
1 Corinthians 3:14-15

content208:
Christianity is not by church membership; Christianity is a way of life. If your way of life opposes the scriptures, you are not a Christian; you are just a church member or a church goer.

Have you ever asked yourself why the scriptures said judgement would begin from the church?

You can't be in sin that grace may abound.

Do you know another meaning of Grace? It is the Spirit of God. If you are in sin, the Glory and Grace of God will leave you because the eyes of God cannot behold iniquity; that's what the scripture says.

Eternal security doesn't mean freedom to sin, so get the scriptures right. Only Christians who want to sin willfully think this is a license to sin. Once you know Jesus has paid the full price for our sins, you know sin has no power over you and you won't be motivated to move after the flesh. People mention obvious sins like adultery, stealing etc, and do not mention sins like disobedience to the holy spirit, not loving your fellow brethen, etc.

content208:
Christianity is not by church membership; Christianity is a way of life. If your way of life opposes the scriptures, you are not a Christian; you are just a church member or a church goer.

Have you ever asked yourself why the scriptures said judgement would begin from the church?

You can't be in sin that grace may abound.

Do you know another meaning of Grace? It is the Spirit of God. If you are in sin, the Glory and Grace of God will leave you because the eyes of God cannot behold iniquity; that's what the scripture says.

So if you sin as a Christian now, the holy spirit will leave you and come back later?

content208:
1 John 3:8: He who commits sin is of the devil.

If you have been saved before but go back into sin, the scriptures says your end is worse than your beginning.
Stop lying to yourself because you enjoy commiting sin.

Why are you taking eternal security as a license to sin? Don't you have the holy spirit?

For sin will have no mastery over you, because you are not under law but under grace.
Romans 6:14

For God achieved what the law could not do because it was weakened through the flesh. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and concerning sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is your life because of righteousness.
Romans 8:3, 10

Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? For you were bought at a price. Therefore glorify God with your body.
1 Corinthians 6:19-20

Everyone who resides in him does not sin; everyone who sins has neither seen him nor known him.
1 John 3:6

All unrighteousness is sin, but there is sin not resulting in death. We know that everyone fathered by God does not sin, but God protects the one he has fathered, and the evil one cannot touch him.
1 John 5:17-18

content208:
So, Kenneth Hagin is now your Bible? Who are you following now? Kenneth Hagin or God? Gospel of Convenience or Gospel of Truth? Read Ezekiel 18:24.

A wise Christian will investigate each of the teachings from these pastors to find it if it agrees with the Gospel of Truth before you just swallow it. Have you learned anything from the people of Berea at all?!



Kenneth Hagin will not be there when you are suffering the consequences of your sins after this life. There is nothing like hyper-grace. Stop deceiving yourself because you still want to be enjoying sin.

You can't eat your cake and have it.

You're so obsessed with sin o, whenever this doctrine is mentioned, people always mention sin. Eternal salvation is mentioned severally in the new testament.

And when you heard the word of truth (the gospel of your salvation) – when you believed in Christ – you were marked with the seal of the promised Holy Spirit,
Ephesians 1:13

So by your logic, God removes the holy spirit from a Christian if he should fall in sin, or what do you mean?

content208:
You and I will go to hell if we commit intentional sins. Stop deceiving yourself.

Committing intentional sin and expecting grace to abound is an abberation. "You can't be in sin that grace may abound" or has your pastor torn away that part from the Bible they read to you in your church?

Stop making excuses for sin. The Bible said "No sin befalls you other than that which is common to man. And God will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you can bear, but will make a way so that you can overcome the temptation."

You will go to hell if you commit intentional sins.

To answer the question of a Christian who willfully sins, such Christian will suffer the effects on Earth but will be saved. If you read some of the books written by Kenneth Hagin, he mentioned some pastors who died young because of disobedience but still made heaven

Why didn't some of the Israelites get to the promised land? It was simply because of unbelief. Abraham and other patriachs had their own failings but we're still counted as righteous before God in Hebrews.

content208:
It isn't by work but by faith. You are called to believe in Christ. And believing in him is synonymous with doing his will. If you say you have faith and still commit intentional sins, you are only deceiving yourself. God is not mocked. You will reap what you sow. "To him that noeth to do good and doeth it not, to him it is a sin"

If you don't do his will and do iniquity, you will end up where the workers of iniquity end up. There is no two way to it.

You've brought works into it again. Salvation is a gift, God won't take it from you. And the verse about sowing and reaping refers to walking in the flesh and walking in the spirit. Those who are born of God do not walk according to the flesh

content208:
You and I will go to hell if we commit intentional sins. Stop deceiving yourself.

Committing intentional sin and expecting grace to abound is an abberation. "You can't be in sin that grace may abound" or has your pastor torn away that part from the Bible they read to you in your church?

Stop making excuses for sin. The Bible said "No sin befalls you other than that which is common to man. And God will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you can bear, but will make a way so that you can overcome the temptation."

You will go to hell if you commit intentional sins.

Bro, Jesus paid the full penalty for past, present and future sins. Whoever is born again is alive spiritually and belongs to God. The Bible says the Holy spirit is the seal (assurance) of our salvation, unless you believe God will take the holy spirit from you.
And for the Bible verse you quoted, God is not involved in sin neither does he tempt any man, we're all tempted by our own desires in the flesh

Only carnal Christians believe eternal salvation is a license to sin. They still believe they justified by "not sinning" and not the sacrifice of Jesus. The holy spirit is the seal of our salvation. Our job here is just to preach the gospel and walk in the spirit

Bnimz:
You missed the main question in that my post bro.

Let me ask again in a clearer way

You have insisted that there are sins that a Christian CANNOT commit....

Alright, cool. Let me agree with you on that one.

Now, with that settled,

I would like to know exactly what sins a Christian CAN commit and still be a Christian according to your theology.

Cos hey, you agree that it is not possible to live a life devoid of sin afterall.

Let me make this easier for you..

A Christian falls into temptation and commits adultery.. during the sex act, he has a heart attack and dies instantly... Heaven or Hell?

A Christian is at a shopping mall in Texas. Someone calls him, he doesn't want to say where he is, so he lies about his location... A mass shooter enters and starts killing people, he is one of the people killed. .... How far, Heaven or Hell?


You have one "big" sin up there and one "small" sin up there... Please tell me which one a Christian can commit without any risk.

Bear in mind, If you say it is impossible for a Christian to do any of the two, then it means you are saying a Christian cannot sin...

Lying, adultery, disobedience, and Co are works of sin. After Jesus had died and resurrected, the only sin that leads to hell is unbelief in the finished works of Christ. God doesn't record or keep account of any sin we commit in the flesh. The only way a saved Christian can go to hell is if he deliberately and willingly rejects Jesus sacrifice.

Heb 10: Someone who rejected the law of Moses was put to death without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
29 How much greater punishment do you think that person deserves who has contempt for the Son of God, and profanes the blood of the covenant that made him holy, and insults the Spirit of grace?

content208:
If you commit sin after being saved, you will go to hell. Simple. The consequences of sin (before or after salvation) is death. Let's stop deceiving ourselves.

You're hell bent on going to heaven based on your own works just like the Pharisees

Praivit0:
I said he was saved just liked John the Baptist was saved, I never used the word born gain, so don't twist my statements to prove your perversion.
I'm very careful of what I type.

What's the difference between saved and born again? Remember Jesus still had to preach the gospel to those who were dead already after he died

content208:
If you commit sin after being saved, you will go to hell. Simple. The consequences of sin (before or after salvation) is death. Let's stop deceiving ourselves.

That means you're going to hell according to what you mean.