₦airaland Forum

uplawal:
some people with thier foolishless sha

Are you saying we should do more than the required said by Allah

Hymen,pls just scram

Isn't it funny that Allah that did not intervene in the killing of fellow muslims in North Africa,will some how punish you for breastfeeding your baby for 3 extra days ?

We ascribe everything to Allah. . . .duh !

Lagosboy:
Long time sister , just a point of correction here as Allah did not say suckle for two years but "Suckle UP to 2 years". A woman could breastfeed for 6 months and some 1 year and some full 2 years.

And God knows best

Suckling for 2 years and 3 days nko ?

Haram ?

zayhal:
The initiator isn't a muslim. I don't think any muslim would ask such question or put up such poll.

Before criticizing ,please take time to read this Qu'ranic review.

http://www.imaan.org.uk/faq/QuranFAQ.pdf

What are your thoughts on this guys.

No insults please,respond theologically

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12486003

20 February 2011 Last updated at 07:38 GMT
[center]British gay Muslims seek Islamic weddings

By Adrian Goldberg
Presenter, 5 live Investigates[/center] 

Like many gay people, British gay Muslims are pursuing marriage


British gay Muslims are joining the global fight for equality and seeking gay Islamic marriage. The BBC's 5 live Investigates speaks to one couple about their 'nikah' - a Muslim matrimonial contract - and asks how they balance their sexuality with the Islamic faith.

"We met about three years ago, at an iftar - a breaking of fast during Ramadan.

"I think a lot of Muslims find that time of year very spiritual and very enlightening, and so I think that's why our relationship developed, because we spoke about our faith."

"Eventually we went on a date."

Asra recalls the first time she met her partner, Sarah, three years ago. The gay couple, who are also Muslim, are one of a growing number of gay, British Muslims who have cemented their relationship with marriage - Islamic marriage.

Asra fondly remembers the moment Sarah proposed to her.

"After the first date, which was about an hour, Sarah casually asked me to marry her."

Sarah interjects.

"I think it was more like four hours, after dinner, coffee and walking. I didn't really plan it, but it just really seemed like the way it was between us, I should try and keep it as pure as possible.

"That may sound strange being lesbians, but it felt like we should do it the most honourable way we could."

The Muslim way

Asra and Sarah decided upon a 'nikah' - a Muslim matrimonial contract. Whilst nikahs have traditionally been the reserve of heterosexual Muslims, Asra and Sarah were aware that other gay Muslims had followed this route and the couple decided to investigate further.

Continue reading the main story “Start QuoteIt's still very difficult for me to tell my family about my life being a lesbian. They know I am a believer, they know I am religious, but going as far as saying I am a lesbian is quite hard”
End Quote Asra, gay Muslim
"A few friends said you don't really have to have an official Imam, but you need someone who is knowledgeable enough about the Qur'an to do it. Fortunately, one of our friends was, and she offered to do it. She's a lesbian herself, and she said we could do it in her home."

Three months after the proposal, the big day came. Asra wore a white shalwar kameez - a traditional Pakistani outfit - and Sarah a pink dress.

"I wanted to wear leather, but Asra wouldn't let me," she sighs.

"We got rings from Camden market, and we drew up contracts - we got a blueprint off the internet of a heterosexual contract and we both looked at it separately, to see if there were things we wanted to change."

"I remember I put about the dog - that if we broke up, Asra wouldn't steal the dog."

Asra rolls her eyes and adds "we also did a dowry, of £5. It was a symbolic thing and we've still got those £5 notes."

In attendance were six friends, who also acted as witnesses - "and a cat," says Sarah.

The short ceremony was conducted in Arabic, and additional duas - prayers - were read and the marriage was essentially no different from the nikahs performed for straight Muslim couples all over the world.

There is growing visibility of gay Muslims in Britain, although not all are confident about coming out
But the Islamic faith vehemently rejects homosexuality, and the fact this nikah was for a gay couple is highly offensive to the majority of Muslims - including Asra's own parents.

"It's still very difficult for me to tell my family about my life being a lesbian. They know I am a believer, they know I am religious, but going as far as saying I am a lesbian is quite hard," Asra says.

"I remember thinking this is the only time I am going to get married, and my family weren't there.

"That was constantly going through my mind - I am having an Islamic nikah, doing as much as I can through my faith, but my family weren't there."

However, Sarah's relationship with her family is quite different.

"Because I wasn't born a Muslim - I converted five years ago - I think my family is quite accepting of my sexuality. But sometimes it seems like they are waiting for me to grow out of being a Muslim."

Gay Muslim voices

Sarah and Asra know their marriage is unorthodox, and the idea of a gay nikah would be rejected by the majority of Muslim scholars, but Sarah says it is nobody's business.

Continue reading the main story “Start Quote By not allowing same-sex couples to wed, there is a direct attack on the Qur'an's message that each person has a mate who is their 'comfort and their cloak'”
End Quote Imam Daayiee Abdullah
"It is between me and God, and when we got married it was not ideal, but we were doing our best."

However, there is a small but growing voice within the Muslim community representing gay people, with the emergence of British gay Muslim support groups such as Imaan and Safra Project.

One of the key advocates of Muslim gay marriage is the American Imam, Daayiee Abdullah - who himself is gay. He has performed a number of gay nikahs in America and has also advised gay British Muslim couples on how to perform the ceremony.

He reasons that to deny gay Muslim couples the right to a religious union, goes against teachings in the Koran.

Speaking to 5 live Investigates, he says: "Since Islamic legal precedence does not allow same sexes to wed, Muslim societies make it a legal impossibility within Islam [but] by not allowing same-sex couples to wed, there is a direct attack on the Koran's message that each person has a mate who is their 'comfort and their cloak'."

It is not just within the Muslim community that gay Muslim couples such as Sarah and Asra have encountered hostility.

"I feel there's Islamaphobia within the gay community. It's something that really worries me," says Sarah.

Continue reading the main story LISTEN TO THE FULL REPORTYou can hear the full 5 live Investigates report at 2100 GMT on Sunday, 20 February on BBC 5 live
Download the 5 live Investigates podcastPost comments on our Facebook pageTweet the 5 live Investigates team
Asra recalls a particularly unsavoury incident.

"There was an occasion at gay pride once where one of the marchers turned around and quite crudely said 'we didn't know pride was allowing suicide bombers on the march' - it was really shocking to hear it from a fellow gay marcher."

But according to Sarah, it's not just Muslims who are rejected by the gay community.

"I think there's a deep-rooted assumption in the secular queer community that you can't be gay and believe in anything, apart from yourself or materialism."

Acceptance
However, gay unions are being integrated into wider British society even more - and the government recently announced plans to allow churches in England and Wales to host civil partnership ceremonies.

Ministers have pledged greater equality for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people, but said no religious group would be forced to host the ceremonies.

The Church of England has said it will not do so. Quakers have welcomed the plans, with support also expected from Unitarians and Liberal Jews. But what about the Muslim community?

"Homosexuality is not considered a halal way of living at the moment, so of course there's going to be an extreme reaction to a gay nikah. So, as a community we have to get tolerance before we can even attempt acceptance of marriage," says Asra.

But she is hopeful for the future.

"I certainly know younger gay Muslims that are out to their families and their families are absolutely fine with it.

"Same-sex nikahs are still a contentious issue, but all I can say is I have done it, and I am completely comfortable and content with my faith and hopefully people will think 'well, let me try and get to that place'.

You can hear the full report on 5 live Investigates on Sunday, 20 February at 2100 GMT on BBC Radio 5 live.

l

There's also support for LGBT muslim community

http://www.imaan.org.uk/

http://www.safraproject.org/

Dear Ify,
Please do not take offence.

Ma'sallama

ifyalways:
^Ofcourse she is.It was just recently that i discovered she was not a muslimah.@Hymen,i just have to add this;It was not a very smooth journey at first for us.My mum especially kept giving me instances of all the crime in the world that was somehow tangled with Islam(according to her),im a model,deciding to give up that was tough,friends were lost initially though now everyone has gotten over it as Islam did not change who i am but rather it changed how i view life and react to issues.I however think i have an advantage been that I and my husband embarked on the journey together,im guessing it wud be more complicated it i were single or it was just 1 of us converting.The best part of it is that God is great and he alone at the best and appointed time wud find you,clear all doubts(believe me,i had thousands of them then)direct and lead u to the truth.

Dear Ify,
I find it slightly amusing that you shared your parents concerns with your conversion and not your own experience. Did you hav a nasty experience with chriistians/christianity or what?

uplawal:
And who are the muslims worshipping IFA,you know what,you better mind your mouth less Allah himself deal with you,what do you mean by some muslims deifying Orunmila and them not coming into Islam in full submission,you are just ignorant,thats all i can say,dnt let me say more than this ok,how many muslim have you seen worshipping Orunmilla with Allah and who told you they worship IFA?You just like giving false notion about things,and you claim you know things,get it right and clear,that muslims dnt worship Orunmila,as their shahada is already broken if they done that,so whats your problem ,why dnt you get other examples instead,hisses .

Incase you are still ignorant,IFA is a religion just like christianity,judaism,all in thier distorted form,and worshippers refusing to accept the Quran as their last message or maybe not aware of its authenticity,each religion still claiming they are still intact just like OLAADEGBU,DAVIDLYAN,OSISI,and co would claim,and more over most of all the oracles youre badmouthing may be among the elites of paradise incase you dnt know,except the ones that truly claimed divinity that will go to hellfire,except you wanna claim Jesus(pbuh)would go hellfire(naudhubillah)because the christians made him thier god,get it right,its the same thing to whoever deified Orunmila with Allah because he was meant to be just a messenger,all done against thier will.And dnt ever assume or conclude uplawal worshipped idol ok,even if i had the opportunity knowing my ancestor's religion does mean i worship Idol,or does worshipping OLOHUN means worshipping idol,just like you worship OLOHUN now.

Someone seems to be losing it o !

Lagosboy:
I have personally met Yvonne and held discussion with her at length. She was kidnapped by the Taliban which is a reason for her not to become Muslim but she did not become Muslim while in captivity but many months later when she arrived in the UK after reading the quran.

About lauryn please hymen never judge people like that as it is only Allah that knows the intention of everyone. Bankrupcy and conversion don't have any links and she does not have to be Muslim to get oil sheikh to give her a penny.

Anyway let's leave all these people and focus on ourselves, more importantly the few issues holding you back from the shahada.
N.b could you please drop me an email? Lagosboynl@gmail.com

OK. I'll try. . . .

And yvonne was kidnapped by the Taliban

Ever heard of the 'Stockholm Syndrome' ??

This is not to say people will not convert for reasons of piety (or perceived piety). The point Im making is that we should not automatically attribute the conversion of previously godless people to Islam as a sign that Islam is good or bad for women.

People accept faiths based on personal conviction and circumstances.

Hello LB ,
Thanks for your email.

I get your point. However you must realise many ,many muslims convert to christianity and other religions as well.

I personally know 2 saudi christian women,although they are still recorded as muslims because Saudi govt doesn't recognise conversions and all saudis are supposed to be muslims .

If Islam (or muslim majority countries) permitted people to come out openly about their conversions you would see many going the other way as well.

Lauren is hardly a good example my dear,reading between the lines ,she probably converted to get some sympathy from the oil shiekhs converted in September declared bankruptcy in Dec ). People have different personal problems we can never explain,though they may come out to say things to make others feel good.

Booth appeared at the Islam Channel's Global Peace and Unity event on October 23, 2010, dressed in loose clothing and with a hijab, declaring: "My name is Lauren Booth, and I am a Muslim".She explained that she converted to Islam in mid-September, 2010, after her visit to the Shia Fatima al-Masumeh Shrine, sister of eighth Shia Imam Ali Al Rida in Qom, Iran.

Personal bankruptcy In December 2010, Booth filed for bankruptcy. Among other things, her ­insolvency means she will have ­difficulty using a credit card, she cannot be a company director for up to 15 years, cannot run a ­company, is forbidden to stand as an MP, and there may even be problems over her bank account.One of her creditors is her half-sister, Cherie Blair.

I'm sorry ,I don't need to be 'begged' to become a muslims and I apologise if I gave the impression I needed it.

I have many muslim friends & read the Koran regularly,but have my reservations on some aspects of Islam,which is why I frequent this section.

This is an open forum ,where people should be free to share their opinion & seek clarification where required.

We shouldn't take things too personal.

Sweetnecta:
^^^^^When Hymen converts, hopefully this year, since she doesnt come across as someone arrogant or hard at heart, I will be eager to read her reason for "reversion". It will be a delightful experience for her and my prayer is that she tastes it and get hooked on it.

May Allah not make her the likes of Abu Lahab, who despite knowing the truth ignored it. May Allah not bring the like of Abu Jahal into her life, being a barrier for her not entering Islam. Amin.

The best in your life is yet to come, and it shall know it when it arrives as you enter Islam, enjoining what is good and forbidding evil.

Enter Islam completely and abhor the ways of the evil one for he is indeed an open enemy to you.

Which 'evil one' ?


Are u saying all non-muslims worship the devil

ifyalways:
Kpele,I wish i can say more.My husband is a nlder so hes bound to read whatever i type.
Im looking forward to your own testimony and besides,the greatest of all miracles and testimonies which is what i hope you come to experience asap is the one of God revealing himself to you and directing your steps to the right path.
@Navfav,no hard feelings bro.

I hope your husband is not my LagosBoy o

uplawal:
@Hymen,are you so not-so-smart in thinking?and who told you the Quran is for only Arabians?like the xtians say,people perish cos they lack knowledge.The Quran is for the whole mankind,not only arabians,so where have i copied the arab?i thought you must have been better after studying the Quran,but all i can see is here is total waste of energy of whoever teaching you,the Quran you are reading is supposed to have illuminated your mind but instead its causing more darkness because you have hatred for the religion inside you,while you pretend as if you really wanna know its essence and become a muslim.did you know all mankind is addressed by Allah in the Quran and not specifically only Arabs,the people that are not jew and are not christians are refers to by Allah as sebians in the Quran.Whatever the yorubas practiced before now,was once Islam given by Allah only to worship one God,without associating partners with him,before it got corrupted.Pls go and learn more shogbo.

If na so muslims dey behave . . .I'd rather stay where I am.

However I do have really good well behaved friends that are muslims.

uplawal:
@hymen,which thread did you see me cursing,odabi pe omu shepe?have you read thru my replies at all or maybe you read upside down too?pls show me where i cursed or was it not IFY that was cursing me?you've just showed how shallow you are,pls gerrout .
If i may ask,what made you think am omoalata?you dnt even know me,yet youre judging me,atleast 3 people know me on this forum and one of them knows me well,why no go and make enquiry if am in any way the way you thought i am,and btw is it not even better to be omoalata than to be "omo olosha"(armedrobber)child like you,pls think well before you talk next time.

You see ,you are already cursing.

Awon omo alata ni won ma'n tete binu,wo de ma'n tete shepe

Follow the Holy prophet's directions my dear & may Allah guide you as you do so.

Do spell checking next time.

Your analysis is quite porous my dear. Women convert for many reasons. I have posted a thread on 'Love Jihad ' before https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-419370.0.html

In addition ,some may do it to rebel or find solace when it seems their world is coming apart.

Just like many muslims also convert to christianity or atheism. You can never conclude the reasoning behind people's personal choices.

Its just like the popular statement 'there are 1.5 billion muslims' in the world

It means absolutely nothing. We have over 2 billion hindus and buddhists (idol worshippers),so does that mean anything.

The fastest growing religion in the world is atheism .

namfav:
whao,i didn't know you were muslim, im sorry for the arguments we had before (ifyalways) and asa my sister

So you only argue with non-muslims

uplawal:
@IFY,i now understand,you cant read,for crying out loud,did i ever mention anything like preparing for war to fight enemies
when they dnt fight muslims?you've just been busy reading upside down these days,incase you dnt get it right,PLS OPEN YOUR EARDRUM WELL THIS TIME,I MEANT MUSLIMS SHOULD BE PREPARED FOR WAR WHEN THE ENEMIES ATTACK THEM AND NOT THEM ATTACKING THE ENEMIES FIRST.

And as for your useless curseprayer,and you think thats what islam taught you to do to a fellow sister?
Did you ever know its not right for muslim to curse fellow muslim?am sure you know right,you just showing your leftover christian attitudes you kept somewhere,keep it coming,that shows how ignorant you are.And for you to think Allah(God)will answer such curse you placed upthere,you must be a joker then,probably reversing back to the sender because you inwardly planned cursing a fellow muslim sister,go learn how to read and assimilate well,then comment,but why comment again?i thought you promised not to qoute me or comment on my post?SHIOOR.

@Olanajim,you dnt have to teach Seun his job,he knows it better than you ok,if he wants it,he will definately put it there,if you dnt like a post as a result of hatred or dislike for the poster,pls it does not cost you a thing to passover it without replying,GBOROMIDELERU OSHI.

Uplawal,are u okay? On one thread you are all nice and reasonable . , on another you're fighting and cursing like a market woman (omo alata ) .

Take e easy now ?

Islam is all about peace. Let the teachings of the prophet be your guide my sister.

azharuddin:
I was talking about the Quranic verse. Sister hymen when u highlighted u missed something. Here i ve done it properly.

Thanks for the clarification bro.

uplawal:
@Hymen,what blood are you pleading?when Jesus is not even dead?

And by the way,was jesus sent to you or your generation,or are you a jew?and have you cared to know about the history of where your forefathers came from,what they did,who and how they worship God,and stop claiming jewish heritage,try and learn your own,its better,learn your forefathers way eventhough its no more invogue now,rather than learn another race religion thats even corrupted manytimes before it came to you,stop branding(EBU/COUNTERFIT)

You dnt have to be bothered if am shia or Sunni,boths are muslims,I AM PRACTICING MUSLIM WOMAN PERIOD,and about IFA,its my business and not yours ok,atleast am happy i know my heritage,and how my forefathers worship God before i even accepted the last message(Quran) eventhough have been a christian all my life practicing corrupted version of what was not sent to my anscestors or my generation.You cannot claim to be jew when youre not.

Very funny,as they say lokk at pot calling kettle black. Granted Im trying to copy the jewish people. E wo nko ? Are you arab ? Why follow the arabs?

Sango was probably the last messenger (not Mohammed)

Lovely topic,lets keep it civil,please.

I know many really good muslims ,so we shouldn't generalise.

Also different people have different interpretations of the holy texts.

I have a few comments however :

vedaxcool:
The mere facts that a lot of women in the Libral west are accepting Islam points to the facts that Islam is very much women friendly.

The mere fact that a great number of teenagers are taking up smoking means cigarettes are largely good 

vedaxcool:
Islam gave women the right to inherit during a time when inheritance by women ws not condoled, even divinereal masters in the west only gave women the right to inherit around the 16-17century.

When did 'west' become a religion ? 

azharuddin:
Yes ofcourse you can. But there is special reward for saying it in Arabic as it is from the Quran. Its mentioned in the hadith. Also in the english sentence "In the name of Allah,most gracious,most compassionate" contains only one of Allah's name. In 'Bism[b]illah[/b]i-r[b]rehmaan[/b]-ir-raheem' there are included the names 'rahmaan' and 'raheem'. Gracious and compassionate are just translation and will not suffice for the actual words. Just like 'Azhar' means [i]light [/i]in english. If you call me light i wont respond will I.

Hmmm. Does this mean Allah favours those whose mother tongue is arabic ?

Because they seem to at an advantage IMO .

sad,sad. . .I was looking forward to your testimony so as to learn a thing or two.

Hi Ify,
Please see this thread : https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-594534.0.html

Dear Ify,
I'm really curious to know what led to your conversion to Islam.

From your posts,you are a 'pastor's daughter'?

Can you just share with me how you became a muslima.

Thank you.

uplawal:
@Congoshine,dont let it suprise you,i for one i wont dispute IFA at all,the only thing that will make me argue about it is because people have raised gods with the only true God alongside with it,infact,The IFA itself,i dnt think is corrupted but only peoples ideology is corrupted to have made them join the oracles(messengers)with Allah,The way IFA'S verses recited is the same way with the Quran,infact,you get emotional with both when recited,ORIGINAL IFA IS SO PURE and undiluted like the Quran,but i cant really speak for now,maybe the men and jinn have corrupted it making people to worship others with God,Allah,Olodumare,Olohun.As av not really learned IFA,but i think personally that Jesus and Muhammad(pbuthem)were also mentioned in it,it might also have talked about the advent of the prophet,and the commandment to follow him as the last messenger,infact,when i hear little children recite IFA'S verses,sometimes i feel like crying,cos its awesome,IFA requires no human sacrifice to appease Almighty God,it also preaches doing good and forbidden evil in things,I say all these,because i was once OMO IFA,I ONCE HAVE THE ILEKE IFA TIED WITH THE (PALMNUT)on my waist,though i cant remember the name of my IFA,cos then when we were called to IFA,i felt something so cool and tranquility withing us and we are so happy the verses being recited to us and then followed by prayers upon prayers to Olodumare and not any idol in between,then celebration follows,we ate and drank and all were happy,

And to some people that might think,oh its only poor people or local people that do Ifa,its a palin lie,well do do people of different fields and walks of life do it,they they wont advertise it,millions of doctors,professors,pastors sef,get opon IFA(tray &Opele) in their cupboard,i can say IFA is as real as the Quran only that people have done evil justice to it.Even then ,we were christians but then IFA MADE sense to us than Christianity of paul (not INJEEL) though,in those days,cos the corruption of the Bible will not make you feel the essence of it,the tranquility Allah sends with it,but we just had to follow because its invogue and society approves it,why wont they approve it sef,when the white men had brainwashed better path of thier brain.

Blood of Jesus

uplawal , you haven't confimed if you are Shia or not ,now its IFA. . . .

God have mercy

I think LagosShia(aka Karbala,,KwaraShia & numerous other aliases ) should be on the list as well.

You may not all agree with his school of Islamic thought,but he seems to know his onions & is definately an asset to the ummah at large

Hi all . . . .been really busy .

LB,please can you tell me Islam's take on life after death. With particilar emphasis on those that lived & died before the Holy Prophet Mohammed (pbuh).

Thank you.

uplawal:
Yes lol,what if you hear my hubby recite Quran and giving you translation/meaning of every word that he recite immediately without going and checking for Ibn Khathr?me sef trip for my hubby anyday antime and thank Allah to bless me with such man,am not showing off though.

Glad to know u're happily married.
I wish you a blessed marital life. How are the children?

uplawal:
Trying to toast Lagosboy lol ,just joking o,though he might not mind second wife o

lol!

uplawal:
@Hymen,its not a threat anyway,its its an advice,if you think am bringing dogma as you said,
Check
these surah 84:29-35
Surah 39:54-56
Surah 18:105-106
Since you said,am giving you dogma which in anyway dont exist in Islam but in other religion and mostly christianity which is the facets of it is full of dogma,now you know the fact from dogma.

Also,you dnt have the right to silent lagosshia just because he knows what he should know as a muslim,if you say so,that means you have to silent all knowledgeable muslims too including Lagosboy,because for crying out loud,Lagosshia has done nothing,he hass not boasted in his writtings,so why would you wanna silent him?Lagosshia is merely doing what he is commanded to do by Allah and the messenger,we are commanded to read,seek knowledge and make use of it and even teach others,so my dear,its fun and excitement when a muslim wanna or make others that dnt know about the religion know better.dnt be biased ok,since its not only lagosboy that knows Islam here.

The line in red is dogma. Check your dico if u need more clarification.

I have nothing against LagosShia,on the contrary I really want to know more about Shia Islam.

Wha i was saying was that I was responding to his posts.

Lagosboy:
Allah is God, Olodumare, Ubangiji,Chineke, Olohun , Arahman and so many other names in different countries and culture.

Now to your query of belief in olodumare and not subscribe to arab culture, we have to make a distincton between islam and arab culture. All I am talking about here is islam and nothing to do with arab culture and as a matter of fact the way olodumare was worshiped in yoruba land was the same way Allah was worshipped by the pagan arabs before Muhammad. The worship of Allah through deities and intermediares like Ifa, sango, lat, uzzaa etc The belief in Allah is one and accepting to worship him without associating partners to him is what makes you a muslim.

That is what we term as tawheed, which is oneness of God without lesser deities or partners.

Regarding your quest for some info abt shia, could you ask ?

You are blessed with a special and unique gift of communication. I kind of envy Alhaja sha 

Reading your posts comes across as 'omi tutu' 

As per my ques on shia ,it has to do with marriage & I need a shia lady's opinion.
God knows best.

tbaba1234:
Aunty, read the verse na!!, it is pretty simple

With all your 4+2 = 8, mutually exclusive sequencing of vectors abi na quadratic equation

Brother ,I have read the Qu'ran many times & I know what Im saying.