₦airaland Forum

you need to say some thing now.

any thing u call it still means the same.,

Maryam Babangida to OBJ, Ribadu: No condition is permanent
Sunday, November 2, 2008

Out of office, but certainly not out of public view. That, in a nutshell, is the story of Maryam, the elegant wife of former military president, General Ibrahim Badamosi Babangida.




•Maryam Babangida
Photo by: Sun News Publishing


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Believe it or not, the ebony beauty is already 59 years and married for 39.

Seemingly loved and admired by all, the Asaba, Delta State indigene did not find life easy during the regime of Olusegun Obasanjo, regardless that her husband helped him to Aso Rock after a stint in jail.

When agents of Obasanjo’s government were not after her pet project – Better Life for Women – it was her bakery business, in what she described as petty jealousy. Then the anti-corruption czar, EFCC, went for her son Mohammed.

That action, Maryam recalls in this exclusive interview, was a nightmare for the family. In reaction, the former first lady put everything in God’s hand.

And today, all she has to tell Obasanjo and Nuhu Ribadu, the guy who once called the shots at EFCC, is: No condition is permanent.

Let’s look at the June 12 issue. It was another crisis altogether during your time.

June 12 shouldn’t have happened.

So what went wrong?

We were in the Villa and weren’t on the field to see what happened. Those on the field messed up.

But the buck stopped at your husband’s table.

If you are the boss, you take responsibility, good or bad. That’s what my husband did.

Were you really interested in leaving office at that period because some accounts have it that you were urging your husband to stay on?

That was the last thing I would ever do. If there was anybody that was telling him let’s go, I think I was the one. There was no need to stay on. Political manipulations, manoeuvers and all those things were not worth it. We were messed up, so what are we doing with them?

Who are the “them” that messed him up? The military or politicians?

They are there! They are there! You know the military never operated alone. It was a combination of the military and civilians.

The Abiola family is very close to the Babangida family,

They understood everything at the end of the day; they understood everybody’s role.

Do you relate very well now?

Yeah! We do. No bad feelings. They got to understand the truth. They know the truth.

At one time, it was rumoured that because of the strained relationship between the two families, Aisha, your daughter, was prevented from marrying Kola Abiola?

That’s not true. Don’t even bring it in.

But it was a strong rumour then.

I am telling you it wasn’t true. It’s just that people have basket mouth. They talk too much. Cha-cha, cha-cha without even understanding what they are talking about. Do you know there was a time that Wahala man took us to court?

Who?

This Wahala man, Gani. Haba! Haba! (Kunya).

He was trying to make a point on the Dele Giwa issue.

No, it wasn’t that. There was something that happened and he took Better Life to court. We won the case. All the women lawyers came around and said this was their case. We got to court and trounced him. Honestly, the Dele Giwa case, it’s only God’s time to reveal what happened. My husband was never part of it. We were not part of it.

It’s still an unresolved issue.

It’s the Police that should have been able to get the person or people who killed him. We were having our breakfast when the news got to us.

Will it be right to say that the Better Life Programme suffered some setbacks during Chief Obasanjo’s eight years regime?

They were jealous of Better Life. They did not want to be part of it or work with us. There was a time we translated the MDGs into Hausa, Swahili and three other languages. We invited all the agencies that have something to do with MDGs to the office. We implored them to get copies of those books and help propagate the ideas. Nigeria belongs to all of us; why are you afraid of something that is good? Why won’t you be part of something that will add value to the development of the country? Whether the idea is yours or not, provided it is good for the country, you have to support it and use the idea to move the country forward. We went round to distribute the copies of the MDGs booklets. We personally went round, sent others by post and couriers, and you can’t believe it; the response we got was marvelous. But because it was from Mrs. Babangida, everybody would say, don’t do anything with Babangida.

Why is it so?

Unnecessary envy, you know. I am suffering what they said my husband did.

What did he do?

I don’t know for them. They are just scared of Babangida (prolonged laughter).

When your Better Life account was frozen, did you make personal entreaties to the then President Olusegun Obasanjo?

Hmm, Chief Obasanjo is still alive. I think I did. That was the end.

He was not willing to do anything?

No!

What about his wife, the late Stella Obasanjo; She was still alive then?

I didn’t talk to her about it because I didn’t want to generate crisis in their family. You know they are two of a kind.

What did Chief Obasanjo tell you when you complained about your account being frozen?

He simply said, ‘Maryam, is that not public money?’ I said no, no, it is people’s money, which they donated to the Better Life (Programme).

And that was the end? Nothing beyond that?

Yeah, nothing.

What about the arrest of your son Mohammed at that time?

I have said it repeatedly that everybody will answer for his deeds. I told Chief Obasanjo that ‘your son is with Ribadu, so he’s your son, you do anything you feel like with him.’

And what was his reaction?

He said, ‘ah Maryam, I am going to ensure your son must come out. Walahi tahlai I didn’t know.’ I said well, he’s there and feel free to do whatever you like with him.

Did you also speak to other people?

Hmm, I can’t really remember now.

So, Chief Obasanjo eventually got him released?

I don’t know for him.

You don’t seem to like Chief Obasanjo all of a sudden, because your husband and Obasanjo enjoy the best of relationship. In fact, it was a known fact that your husband brought Obasanjo in 1999.

Well, what they did to my son was very unfair, very untrue. And I leave Ribadu. Ribadu will face God on this matter. And he will answer for his mischief. I am not quarreling with anybody. I never spoke to Ribadu on the matter. Even thereafter, my son saw him in the plane, and they greeted; saw him at the Hajj, they greeted. So, we are not mean people. Just leave everything to God. You think you are in a position, you think you can do and undo. When you come out, you will face your creator someday.

What is the relationship now between your family and Obasanjo’s?

Few days ago, he called. It was my line. I answered and we joked.

What did you talk about?

What are you doing with Ibrahim? Where are you? Such talks. He spoke to me and my husband.

Since he left power, your family has not paid him any visit at Ota. Could it be because of the strained relationship?

Have I been to Ota before? Have I been to Ota?

But your husband too has not?

That is a man’s world. It is their Wahala. I have never been to Ota, even when we were in Lagos, so close to Ota. I have never been there, let alone now. What’s my own?

The two families are good friends, aren’t they?

When he invites me to Ota, let us see whether I will go or not.

Now we have another President, Alhaji Umaru Yar’Adua, who is also close to your family. How would you assess his performance so far?

Me ke? eh eh! What I see in governance is that every leader will try his best for the good of the country. That’s what I feel and, according to the situation they find themselves, they will perform, based on circumstances. That’s how I feel. I am not judging anybody. They have just started. Democracy is a learning process. Of course, it will take a long time. Otherwise, I will appeal to Nigerians to be more honest and serious.

What do you think the women can do to get themselves more actively involved in politics?

Women are trying. The amount of money involved in politics is too much for women to bear. What do you want women to do?

Perhaps adopt the Beijing affirmative action.

Agreed! The women are working; they are getting there. It is a gradual process. They are doing well. All they need is for them to be recognized. We have female senators, honourable members, female ministers; they are coming up.

We had a female Speaker who was later consumed by allegations of corruption against her. And you never came out in her defense?

I never did.

Why?

Because I didn’t get the full story. I don’t speak on issues I do not have enough information. She didn’t reach out to me either. Don’t forget that I am a grand mother now. They should come reaching out to me. What am I asking for?

But you have special passion for the women?

At least, she should have reached out to me. I have my style of operation.

And what’s your style

I don’t like interfering unnecessarily. If you bring your case, we see how we can handle it, that’s it. I don’t want to be seen as if I am going to be asking for a favour.

Here is Dr (Mrs.) Maryam Babangida occupying the famed 50-bedroom apartment. Tell Nigerians, how the home looks like?

Hmm! That is an extreme extravagance, and extreme lies. What is one doing with a 50-bedroom apartment, when I have just four children and three grandchildren? Maybe more will come. So what is the 50-bedroom for? Won’t people be realistic and at least be God-fearing, for God’s sake? Haba! They want me to invite them and be opening the rooms? I will not, if that is what they want.

So how many bedrooms?

I have reasonable number of bedrooms for every member of the family. We have up to six. We have stores, my swimming pool; we have kitchen, kitchen store, laundry, etc.

Is that all?

Of course, the living rooms, that’s all!

Not up to 50 rooms?

Sebi you have entered this house. Enter and count. People are just ignorant. And ignorance is a disease. They are suffering that disease. As they get to find out the truth, they will be relieved of that disease.

What is the secret behind your compact family structure? Could it be a function of your husband’s one-man, one-wife and four-child policy of the 1990s?

We were already living together, had our family, before he talked about that. He didn’t say one wife, he said four children.

Of course, one wouldn’t expect more than one wife to give birth to just four children?

No! You can have other wives and still have four children. It was just a health programme and family planning, perhaps, to check population explosion. When he came up with that, I challenged them; why did you people say so? You people are putting me in trouble because the women were complaining.

Was that why you stopped giving birth?

Emi ke? That has nothing to do with my having children.

Was it then a matter of choice?

Maybe that is what God has destined. I should have had more. Thank God I have four. I thank God.

When you got married, your husband said as young couples, you people enjoyed your prime, going to parties and discos. How was the experience?

Yes, it was good; going out, meeting people, dinners etc.

We understand the La Kabana Club in Kaduna was a special attraction. Were you both clubbing so that you could monitor him; so that he doesn’t look the other way?

(Laughter). What’s my own? He was the one taking me. I was not taking myself.

You were a young couple then, right?

Yes, that’s how it should be. Go out together, yes. It was good. It was right. You can’t marry and bother your wife. You go places, you do things. It was good. Now we don’t have time for that; except we attend dinners.

You enjoyed your prime, didn’t you?

Why not? We did!

You are kind of shut-in now. You don’t seem to be an outgoing person any more. What could be responsible for this?

Where do you go to here? Which Nite club again? They will say I saw her here, saw her there; we have passed that age. Except if one travels abroad, we go to dinners to have some taste elsewhere.

Thank God you are 59. At times when we read stories about your health status, it bothers your admirers.

That is the story that they feed on. Who are the people fielding the stories and where are they?

Only recently, one of the soft sell magazines talked about your supposed breast cancer.

Me, breast cancer? God forbid! Sebi you are here talking to me. I don’t have their time.

Where is this story coming from?

Ask the person that wrote it to come and verify. I don’t know where they are carrying the story from. I really don’t know.

It was reported that you traveled overseas as a result of the worsening situation?

If somebody goes to oversea, does that mean it is for check-up or cancer? Is it only Maryam Babangida who travels? Is it only me that falls sick? What is their interest? Who are the people writing? Where did they get their story or information? Ask them, have they been to this house? Let them come, let’s run round my track with them together and see who is stronger.

That’s a big challenge? How do you take such false stories against your family?

I know earlier on that some people must have been paid to say such things about me. Those that are wishing somebody dead or bad, let them know that such bad wishes will return to them. They will be the ones to die now. I know death is for everybody, but they have started fading away one by one.

Do you know them?

Let them continue to carry false stories, it will return to their heads.

Why do you think anyone will wish you dead?

Do I know for them? I don’t know what I have done to them. They think I am too much (Laughter).

In terms of beauty and wealth?

All! They think I am too much for them. Haba! They see me, they say haaa, this woman, you no dey old? Listen, somebody sees you and say haba, haaaa this woman, you no dey old? What do you mean? So, they want to see me looking wretched? What is in your mind? And I keep on asking what the problem is? Why? Why?

How was your upbringing like in the good old days?

Hmm, it was good.

Did you live with your parents?

Yeah, of course.

Perhaps, your marriage was what took you away from them or you earlier stayed with your uncles?

I stayed with my aunty for just two years before she got married. Most of the time, I was with my parents.

How about your childhood friends, are they still very much around?

Yeah, but some of them are dead. They are all scattered, actually. I didn’t keep in touch as such with so many of them, because I mind my business. They are all over the place; but we have lost close contact. We were never in one place; you know the military and the transfer across the country. You hardly can settle in one place. That also affected reaching out to my childhood friends.

Do you still link up with your other family members back home in Delta?

Of course, yes. Why not?

How often?

Not often. We talk on telephone.

Thank God for GSM

Even before that, there were means of communication. They also come around. I am not too familiar with the area now.

You were once accused by some Deltans of influencing the creation of Delta State with the capital in your home town, Asaba.

Good! What is the problem? If I did, that was great.

So you actually did?

Yes, I did, Good! Good!

Was it deliberate?

Na you sabi. Se they said I did, I did. I did. Chikena!

How did you feel when your bakery was closed down by NAFDAC sometime in 2006?

It was very unfair action. It was very awful. There was nothing near the truth on what they accused us of. I never heard of anything like bread enhancer, which they said we were using. I never knew of that. And they just came and banned us. That is one of those things they tried to use against us. I told the late Stella Obasanjo, and she said “what?” And she said no, no. I said well, that’s the situation. We got all kinds of information and accusation.

So why would they close down your bakery?

Because they simply wanted to intimidate us. It was all politics.

But that was an employer of labour?

Eventually, they re-opened it.

Were there formal complaints or were you formally communicated?

No! I got my lawyer and told him, go after them. He went and met Dora Akunyili and Dora thought he was a cheap Northern lawyer. When the man started to speak on the issue, she said waoh! They later sorted the issue out; I did not personally speak to Dora Akunyili. I think I have met Dora once at Caritas University in Enugu.

And the issue didn’t come up?

We didn’t have time to talk. If she had talked, I wouldn’t have, if it was the issue. Few occasions thereafter, she was visiting Minna and they invited me for whatever she was doing.

They invited you?

Thereafter they started inviting me for their programmes.

But you should naturally participate since it was not a personal thing.

If they know that, they should give respect. If there was anything they thought was the problem, they could have discussed that with me. And let me correct it. Your approach to issues matters a lot.

Did they apologize to you later?

The lawyer, according to him, I wasn’t there really when they spoke on few occasions. They realized their mistake.

Was there any formal or verbal apology?

It will be a shame on them to do this kind of public apology; you know. The same thing they did to Mohammed (her son). It was wrong. It wasn’t good. They couldn’t come out to apologize, but they started sending messages.

You were said to have gone through all kinds of intimidation during Chief Olusegun Obasanjo’s regime. Is this true?

During Chief Obasanjo’s regime, yes, a lot.

Was it because of your husband’s presidential aspiration?

Yes, that was it.

Some Nigerians were saying your husband did not want to come back, that you were the one pushing him. How true?

Good God! What am I pushing him for?

They said you wanted to re-enact your first ladyship, the glamour and all that.

And so I should remain there forever because I am God?

But really, are you not interested in coming back?

I am not interested in coming back. For what? Instead, some other people were pushing him. When the people were asking him to contest, you just have to please the people. But I told him I am not cut out for this kind of attitude, because it is democracy, I see some crazy things, it was kind of kara wen chi. You know what that means?

No!

No discipline! Harlotism! No standard! I am not cut out for that kind of stuff.

But that’s not enough reason for you to stay out of politics. Perhaps, your participation could introduce some finesse?

Hmm, No! No!

Why? Or did you think it was not right for him to return to Aso Rock?

(Cuts in). It is not that it was not right. If God has destined he will be, he will go there. I am not one to make him. God makes, not man.

Since out of office, you have retired to Minna. What’s up?

What can I do? This is my husband’s place. And I have to make do with this place because of him.

What kind of business are you engaged in?

School, I run my school

As a teacher or administrator?

I can also claim to be a Professor or teacher there because I am always there. Because you are dealing with human beings, my attention is always there. I am always there.

What about the Girls Science School?

That’s just in my name. I am not the owner. It’s owned by government.

Is your involvement just that of charity?

Yes, some kind of intervention. I do my religious activities, helping out.

We hear you run an Islamic Foundation; is that true?

Yes, I use that for the propagation of Islam

What’s the organization like?

We preach Islam in the villages. When you go there, you will find that some of them do not have religion; they practice the traditional region. We have to preach and bring them to God. Some Christians are there; some Muslims are there too. We have to preach; we don’t force people. We try to explain religion to them and on their own accord, they can embrace it.

Have you now become an evangelist?

Well, thank God. Give them what you can, then employ a teacher to be teaching them, about the religion. Later, we move to the next village.

How do you get feedback?

I go there. We have a group. In the group, we have the Mallams, teachers, they monitor those people. They go round and we keep on expanding.

What time do you have to do all this?

I do that mostly on weekends. I go in the morning and do not get back until late in the evenings. Nigeria is big.

What is the coverage like?

It is here, in Niger State. You can’t take too much. You place emphasis on a particular area and do what you can to help them.

You have been married to your husband for 39 years. Now that you are 59, down memory lane, what do you have to say?

IBB is a strong man, and he is gentle, kind, and very accommodating. We’ve been able to understand each other. We tend to agree and disagree on issues. There are styles of operation. What is important is respect for each other.

Do you engage in shouting matches?

No, no, no. We don’t misbehave. We don’t do that, kai. It’s not in our system. We are two gentle people.

One must be hot, the other hotter; isn’t it?

Nobody is hotter. He’s strong in his own way, and I am strong in my own way. We respect each other’s feelings.

How do you take all the criticisms against your family?

Sometimes I will just run to go and show him, ‘see what they are writing. I don’t like this oh!’ He will just say, ‘no, don’t mind them, they will be tired of writing.’ And I will say, ‘this is what you keep on saying. You have to do something about this.’ He will just laugh it over.

Does it mean you get worried more than him?

You know, we women express our feelings faster than men. The man can be feeling bad, and he will not show it. In most cases, over time, I ignore all those criticisms.

How does it feel being a grandmother?

Great! Great!! Great!!! It’s one of the things one should be grateful to God, for keeping one alive to see your own grand children. It’s wonderful.

And you don’t look like a granny? What’s the secret?

Good heart. Good mind. Good goals. Be good.

What is your typical day like?

Full of activities, religious obligations, public works, household work, attending to visitors, attending to calls, attending to requests and demands, going to school, primary, secondary; traveling.

When do you wake up everyday?

Do I even sleep at night, as such? I can wake up anytime to say my prayers.

What next?

After prayers, because I am awake, I can go back to sleep for one hour.

Do you use the gym?

Occasionally, in the evening; not in the morning.

Do you do physical exercises alone or with your husband?

Well, our timings are not regular.

Is that deliberate?

No! Because I have much to do than him order than to sit down and attend to people, addressing their problems, here and there.

So you stay awake up till 12 mid-night or 1am?

It depends on what I have done during the day. It depends on my mood. My sleeping pattern is not for public consumption.

Is it true that you surf the Internet as a hobby?

Not a hobby. Go in and get what you want, and then get out. I have too much work to do.

Do you read Nigerian newspapers?

Yes, of course. I have even read before coming down (for the interview).

How do you sustain your fashion? Do you have special designers that you patronize or what?

This thing you people are talking about is gift. You either have it or you don’t. Let them leave me alone.

Do you patronize local fabrics and tailors?

I do, a lot.

What kind of designs do you go for?

I insist on making out what I want to wear.

What about perfumes?

Not particularly sticking to one.

Why?

Just like that; because I don’t want anybody to know the particular perfumes I am wearing. I go for soft, sweet perfumes. I have various types. I just go for any of them at any point in time. It’s a free world. Choose what you like.

Congratulations on your 59th birthday. It’s been a pleasure having this chat with you.

You are welcome! You have really taken my time. I have so much to do. Thank you!

Ever since former military president, General Ibrahim Babangida, left office in 1993, his wife, Maryam, has maintained a low profile. She has been going about her business and shied away from granting press interviews.

Within this period, much happened to her family. Also, much had been said about her. At a point, she was rumoured to be suffering from breast cancer and was critically ill.


•Maryam Babangida
Photo: Sun News Publishing

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The Economic and Financial Crimes Commission (EFCC) once arrested her son, Mohammed. The Olusegun Obasanjo government froze the account of the Better Life Programme, which she founded as a First Lady. In all these, she refused to talk.

However, as part of her 59th birthday, which she marks today, Mrs. Babangida has finally broken her silence. She spoke on fundamental issues, including her activities as First Lady, the Orkar Coup, which nearly claimed her life, her husband’s and those of other members of her family, her marriage with Gen Babangida and her state of health.

Mrs. Babangida spoke at the palatial home of General Babangida, in Minna, the Niger State capital.

Excerpts.

You will be 59th by November 1st 2008. Looking back at your past, what are those memorable events that you are ready to share with your admirers?

Glory is to Allah, the creator of heaven and earth. To have attained 59 years on earth is a wonderful achievement. Given our present state of health in Nigeria, it calls for real celebration for one to clock 59, particularly as I have gone through all kinds of stresses here and there, the coups, counter-coups and the likes. It’s all about a celebration of life and praising Allah for His grace, mercy and compassion on me and members of my household. There are so many things that one can reminisce about, but for sure I can’t remember all. Some of them I can recollect vividly, some, may be not.

Perhaps the memorable ones?

This is also a matter of perception, because it is mixed blessing of good and bad. First of all, I am married to a military man, and you should expect some disturbances here and there. You never can tell what would happen to him. They have tough times in their lives; coups and counter-coups. These are some of the trials we went through, but thank God, none of us was injured in those times.

At any rate, the most striking aspect of these times was the Orkar coup in 1990. That is a story I will tell another day. I will also like the narrative to be filmed also. It was a big experience on my own part. Good time, I had my baby, Halimat Sadiat in office. And then we came to power and my husband was made the President, it was something that disturbed me a bit, knowing the kind of person that he is. Whatever is destined to be is destined to be. We went through all that era and we were able to come out in peace and not pieces (laughs).

Looking back into the late sixties when you got married, how was the relationship between you and your husband consummated?

God has a way of doing wonders. As at then, he was very close to the family; I had an uncle who was his colleague. He was always visiting the house. We got interacting but there was nothing like love attached to that. It was a come and go kind of. I joke a lot with him. And suddenly he told my uncle that he really wanted to marry me. At first, they thought he was joking, but because he has been used to the family nobody objected to it; even though I had not conceded to his wish.

How did he propose to you?

He simply told me; “I want to marry you.” I said ‘no, I know your girlfriends.’ He said he really wanted my hand in marriage. I said, ‘no, no, you all are a playboy. You know, you military people better go away.’ He kept on coming to the house. He told me he saw it in a dream.

At what point did you make up your mind?

After some time actually. It took me some time to make up my mind.

Were you under pressures from parents, friends and uncles?

No, no, no. It was not an open affair. It was sort of a closed affair. It wasn’t quite a long time that I conceded.

How did you convey your acceptance to him?

I simply said ‘ok, go and do the normal thing you should do. Go through the procedure.’ He said ok, and that was it.

You knew him to be a playboy?

All of them military guys were. They were all out there enjoying themselves catching the funs of their youth.

So, how were you able to overcome that perception of him being a playboy, and now a prospective husband?

At the time we got married, he saw a new responsibility and he cautioned himself and tried to remain a nice man. (Laughs). He was busy; you know the war had not ended. Though after the war, we came over to Lagos, thereafter we went to America for a course for one year. We were busy; so we got out of the thick of the attraction.

People have said you are a strict disciplinarian and perhaps, because of your own upbringing, you have been able to hold the Babangida family together. How do you react to that?

Well, they are right. It is true. I think my upbringing gave me that strength of character to do what is appropriate and right to nurture an ideal family unit. I am the kind of person who would want to do things in a proper way. Call it being strict, and you will be right. If am involved in any issue or being a wife, I have my duties, I have my responsibilities. I have to do them well. And then, I have my kids; it’s a big responsibility bringing up children. And I am doing that, bringing on board my experiences, ensure that they attend good schools, train them on how to be good children. It’s just an aspect of me to show good examples. And so, if anybody sees me as disciplinarian, that person is right.

I was told you expelled your daughter from El-Amin International School as a show of your knack for discipline?

That is not true. She was never expelled. And that cannot be true. She was being spoilt by everybody, some kind of over-indulgence. When she gets into trouble with her mates, they don’t discipline her, so I wouldn’t take that. For me, all of them there are my children and I must take full responsibility for their good behaviour and proper conduct, so that their parents would find us worthy. I must be fair and just also. So, I insist that any student who runs foul of the rules and regulations of the school must be disciplined, including my daughter.

You were barely six years in marriage when Dimka struck. How did you feel, given your own dissonance for the military even when you are married to one?

The late Dimka was a friend of the family. I remembered a day or two to the coup; he came to the house in the afternoon and said he was hungry. He asked what I had. I answered that I was just preparing a meal. I had fried chicken and he took all. I wondered aloud, you have taken all my chicken and I have to make my soup. He said yes, that nobody was going to eat with him, that he was damn hungry. He left, only for me to hear the following day that Dimka was involved in a coup. I said wow, this is very unfair to me. There are so many stories about these military boys, because a lot of them are too close to the family. At times, they come around to eat with us; ask for money for fuel, very free with us. And then, suddenly despite such closeness, they still hide things from you.

And the coup and the counter-coup…,

(Interjects) my husband was not part of it. He went to work as usual. He didn’t know about any Dimka planning coup. He left for work and told me they were going to have a meeting that morning. I saw his driver back to the house. And I asked the driver ‘where is oga’? He said he only dropped him and he said there was a coup and he didn’t know where oga was. The children had gone to school, so I had to start thinking of bringing them back home. In such kind of confusion, you have to think fast on how to safeguard your family. The driver was going to the school to pick the children and saw him (Babangida) in an armoured carrier, standing and getting into the NBC and brought the message back home.

Keeping the home front at such moments, how was the experience?

I kept the home front stable. I had to muster the courage. I didn’t know where to go; I didn’t know what will happen next. It was some kind of confusion. It was such a difficult time. All I knew was that early in the morning, I remember discussing with a Colonel trying to get at the roots of it. Trying to make sure that my husband was okay.

You don’t seem to like military antics; but you are part of them.

I was part of them as a wife, and not as somebody who participated. It was terrible, because we were very close to these folks.

What about the other coups?

If you want us to talk about coups, coups and counter-coups, it will be a different subject matter. It is a subject for another day. But it was part of the experiences one has to share for generations to come.

Let us look at 1985-1993 and juxtapose that with your introduction of the office of first lady.

Was I the one who introduced the first lady office? I don’t think so.

But other wives of president before you were not as visible as you were and didn’t perform official state functions as you did. We are talking of the powerful Maryam Babangida.

Whether visible or not, they were first ladies operating in their own way. That was what we met. At the time we came, Nigeria was not ready for us actually. When we came into office, we were in Dodan Barracks, and for sure, the office was not befitting the status of President of the almighty Nigeria, big brother of Africa. There was no office different from the living room where we could receive visitors. That was what we met; and we had to improvise to make it more befitting; I did some gardening and tried to make the accommodation wear a befitting look. It wasn’t easy coping with the number of visitors that came in and out everyday.

I was thinking ahead of the people around me, hence I decided to improvise. Here we were, in a house that was supposed to accommodate a President. You are talking about personalities that visit you daily; Presidents, Queens and Kings, and you expect to keep them in your small space, lumped into one place. I had to personally inject my money into the renovation of the house, from the cleaning to the decoration, to the food, to everything. In fact, Nigeria owes me a lot, because if I have to say all that I did, my sacrifices, my time, energy, my money just to give Nigeria that good image and outlook; they owe me a lot.

But you are being accused by some Nigerians, particularly critics of your husband’s administration that so much money went through your office as first lady. How do you reconcile that?

It is all because they are ignorant and because I never complained. I was a good manager and could manage any little amount of money I had. I am not the extravagant person, No! I am not wasteful also. If you give me money to do something for you, I will give a full account of such money. I wasn’t brought up in a manner to take from public treasury, or trying to take what does not belong to me. No! That is for them and God. And may God forgive them because they have a very wrong perception of who Maryam is or what she stands for.

Your husband ran the government with your inputs no doubt? What kind of consultations took place at the home front? Were there areas he sought your viewpoints and or inputs?

It was just a husband and wife scenario. Of course, husband and wife do discuss, so it was not a matter of consulting. We hold discussions and tried to look at issues ahead of time. It happens in every home; ours is not an exception. A typical Northern man doesn’t do that kind of consultation you are talking about. If I were consulted before decisions were made, my husband wouldn’t have been a strong man. He is the man. He is the leader. Haba, why should he consult? Haba, haba.

But it is because you are also seen as very strong and tough?

(Laughs) It’s because people don’t really know me closely, very well. They see me from a far and conclude that I am very strong and tough.

In fact, some call you Margaret Thatcher of Nigeria.

They are quite ignorant of so many things about me. I am very simple, very straight forward, and principled and very understanding. But may be God gave me that look. As you see me, you might see a very tough person, and may be because of the discipline in me, I don’t tolerate nonsense. I don’t dwell on issues that are silly.

Let’s come back to your first lady office. Your revelation is amazing that Nigeria owes you a lot. I’ve seen published stories about how you used your office as a conduit to siphon public funds….

(Interjects) They are just ignorant. I cannot quantify my effort to give Nigeria a good outlook, good image, open doors to a lot of things.

Not many people would agree with you.

It’s because I have not been talking. I am not loud. They see me in beautiful dresses and they think that’s all. Nigeria never paid me for anything. Let me tell you how the first lady office you are talking about started.

I am interested.

There was this room, at the Dodan Barracks. Nobody was using it. I said ok, let’s get to do some renovations, adjustments and make it more habitable for us to use as a temporary office. I saw that it was not fair for the first lady to be receiving visitors in the living room when the President was also doing same. There was only one sitting room in Dodan Barracks and you cannot be receiving visitors and be doing some work at the same time. I started there and tried to give the office of the wife of the President a dignified status. Suddenly people started realizing that this woman has a role to play. She has to receive visitors, attend to other organizations, other official matters. So, where do you want us to be? When we moved to Abuja, I made sure that the office of the first lady was recognized. Nigerians should be proud of that.

Since then, it has been there and other people have been enjoying the facility. So, what is the fuss about it? Is it something I should be crucified for? Go and ask Dr. Olagunju and others who worked in that office. I had no budget for my office, even to buy stationery. I could recollect my staff complaining about not being assisted with office item and equipment. I committed my personal funds to buy all these items. At times, they gave them N5,000 to buy some stationery, and they complained bitterly saying this was not fair, bla, bla, bla…, Some people didn’t understand, until we left office before they started seeing the sacrifices we were making.

So, you were running the place with donations from people?

Which donations? It was with whatever my husband gave me and whatever I have. I am not a poor person, so nobody will say I stole government money. I never saw government money. I am just surprised when people talk about this chunk of money.

So ,you were using your personal wealth?

Yes, with my personal wealth. I was not a poor church rat before we got to government or before my husband became a President. I have my business. My husband will never allow anyone to abuse or misuse government money. I never saw it; nobody gave me. Go and ask them. The records are there. Let them tell me how much was given to my office or how much was given to me.

Let’s come to the April 22, 1990 coup when Orkar struck and you were trapped in the gunfire exchange. How would you share your experience with Nigerians?

Let Nigerians pay me. (Laughs) It is a big story and not one that could be told in just an interview. Stories about coups and counter-coups must have their own books, and films and their songs. Hmm,…, Orkar coup…, Hmm,

How did you feel when they struck?

I sensed something was going to happen when I heard of a building that got burnt; I think it was the Defence Building. When I heard the house was burnt, the late Governor of Central Bank came to the house in the morning and as he was seated, I said, ‘you people better sit up. I am sensing something.’ If he was alive, he would confirm this. Just a week after, this thing happened. I could observe that may be there was change of guards; because I was seeing strange faces and some soldiers carrying their guns to the kitchen to pick their food. At the same time, I saw the armoured tank; it was like being serviced. I never knew they were removing them. Alhaji Gambo came with somebody to see my husband. When they left, I heard a gun shot thereafter, I said oh! My God.

Was it late in the night?

Not that late, at about 11pm. I looked in the direction of the gunshot to view and saw the movement of some vehicles. When I came back, my husband was watching the television, then I told him to switch it off; that it was like we were in trouble. He got up and I put Halima on my back. The next thing I heard was kpa-kpa-kpa-kpa-kpa…… Rain of bullets. I was asking for the ADC. Everybody was on the alert. I assembled my children around me. They (coupists) were really firing. It was my first time of seeing the Bazooka. And you could also hear the armoured car firing back. It was like a real war situation. I didn’t know where the ammunition was landing. That day I knew that God loves us.

And you were still in the house watching this whole drama?

Yeah. We were caught in-between. The good thing, the ammunition were flying over the house and we learnt later that they were landing on the field.

At what point were you evacuated?

It was too dramatic. When they were getting closer and oga (IBB) didn’t want to go to anywhere. What can I do? I had this six- month-old baby at my back; what about the food, clothes and all those things that the baby required? I didn’t know how long that would last, and didn’t know where we were headed. What can I do to this child? I went up, came down. God gave me extra-ordinary strength that night. And so, the whole drama ended.

Where did you go to from that moment?

Ah, no! It’s not something that I am willing to disclose.

But your husband has given us his own account?

I was within the vicinity.

You mean, you didn’t escape through a tunnel or perhaps through an exit gate at the balcony?

That’s not true. Which gate? There were gates, so the idea of tunnel did not arise here.

So, you escaped through the gate?

Which gate? I was within the vicinity. And my distance was not too far from the Dodan Barracks itself. There were people in the Dodan Barracks. People lived there; even after the incident. I was within the vicinity.

How close?

Very close.

You mean, your husband abandoned you there and sought refuge elsewhere, as far as Ojuelegba without you?

(Long laughter)…, which Ojuelegba? The thing is that ehm, that night; I saw something that I tried to analyse later. Because the security interest was the President’s safety and nothing more.

I thought it was a matter of securing the first family?

That was what I saw that night. The President’s safety. It was later I tried to analyse it. I became uncomfortable and I said to myself, now I understand the whole concept. I got to understand the military attitude, the principal first. I started making up my mind on how to do certain things, understand certain things, and learn certain things all on my own.

When the coupists were caught, tried and sentenced to death, did you, at any time, ask that they be pardoned?

If they had succeeded in killing us that night, will I be there to plead for them?

But providence saw you pulling through and one would have thought that you lent your voice to granting the coupists clemency?

You don’t seem to realize the kind of trauma that we went through; and how one was able to rehabilitate oneself after the coup? The family and all of that? Who was thinking about the coupists anyway, after all that trauma? Haba!

Did you share similar experience on the Vatsa issue, particularly on account of Vatsa’s closeness to the family?

Just leave the military people alone. As you see them, just leave them alone. They know themselves better. Anybody who is talking and making insinuations might be ignorant of the issues, and you will not be fair to both parties. Yes, Vatsa was a close friend. In fact, what is a friend, brothers? It was the system. Given our everyday life, if one person takes first position in the class, the person who takes second will be struggling to take first the next time. It’s in the military system, just as it is in the civilian. It is a kind of competition; some kind of attitude. I don’t know what happened between the two of them oh!

You mean at the home front, the issue was not discussed and you didn’t bother to

ask?

I don’t want to go into this their matter. All I know is that greed can lead anybody into anything, if you are not grateful to your God.

Let’s come to your Better Life for Rural Women. Why did you choose rural and not urban women?

Because the rural people need help, all the attention. It is assumed that we the urban people have it. There are some rural-urban areas, no doubt, but my focus was on the rural folks, to address their plight. Don’t forget that we are all from rural background except for our children these days who don’t know anything about rural life. I was just trying to use the position God gave me to help the poor. I did my best. Some appreciated, others didn’t.

Was the idea your own initiative or that of your office?

I was thinking of what to do for the women. And I know we had so much to do to help the women. I assembled like-minded women to brainstorm. They asked me what I wanted. I said I wanted something that had to do with the rural women. We went to Lagos and that’s all. I told the women I had rural women’s background knowledge. Women expressed their needs and we used our position to talk to government to appreciate those needs. From there, government started the DFRRI issue, NDE, People’s Bank and all those programmes being put together to open up the rural areas for them to benefit from government.

I want to correct this impression. Sincerely, I fear my God and no human being. Government did not give any specific amount for the programme. It was the struggle by women for people to donate into the programme. Even the Women Centre that was built started from our little donations and contributions. Government did not even contribute at the initial stage. We started letting government to understand that this initiative was not a personal thing. So, they should help. So, my husband now said Gado Nasko (then FCT Minister) come, let’s see what these women are doing. At that time, we had no money to continue the construction. It was at that time that the government agreed to take over the structure and completed it. The money from government did not come to us directly. It was the construction company. The government was dealing with the company based on the amount of work done. Why are people then accusing us? I kept on saying God should forgive them, because they certainly don’t know what they are saying.

I understand the Better Life account was frozen during the Obasanjo regime. How true?

Yes, we had an account from day one when we launched the programme. It was expected of us to open up an account for the programme. That was how we were running the programme. We had some money after the commissioning of the Women Centre. Those who made pledges started fulfilling them later. The money started coming into the account, and of course, it was yielding interest. Then suddenly, we had to leave and the money was still in the account. We were thinking of how to use the money to run the centre. During this Obasanjo administration, when Aisha Ismail was the Women Affairs Minister, she needed money to run one health programme, and government was not forthcoming with the money for her.

The government said go and look for money anywhere you can find money, use it. She said ok, there’s money in this Better Life account, can she use? I heard so. She went to Chief Obasanjo and explained, then Chief Obasanjo said go and use it, after all, Better Life money is government money. She went and froze the account. There was even no courtesy of informing me or Mrs. Aikhomu. The next thing I heard was that they had used the money. I was really, really embarrassed. Number one, it was not government money. They would carry sins on their heads. I left everything to God. And the Cecilia Ibru woman of Oceanic Bank was aware, because she was in charge of the bank and she allowed such thing to happen without consulting me first. This is the same woman who benefited from Better Life programme. She started her Oceanic Bank in the Women Centre. We gave her space to start the Oceanic Bank. She was even calling us to be part of the bank, but I said I wasn’t interested. Go and ask her. She’s alive.

You didn’t take the bank to court?

I didn’t really have the time. Whatever God has decreed, will be. Let’s leave it at that. Let God be the judge of these people.

Who are the signatories to the account?

Mrs. Aikhomu, and two others. They are all alive. I never signed. I was never a signatory.

And the government just imposed its weight on your organization just like that?

Yeah. If we go about it legally, it would have been a question of embarrassing Chief Obasanjo, who was then the President. And that lady. And it would be seen like we were fighting the government. And they would start harassing my husband. I just left it at that.

So the matter has reached a dead end? Are you not taking any step now that Chief Olusegun Obasanjo is no longer the President?

The money is gone already. What are you going to fight for? The centre is still there. I am alive. They too are alive. We will one day account for all this. We are in this world now enjoying the nonsense we are doing.

What is the position of the Better Life now?

The position of the Better Life is that it is on its own. It is still running. We are not everywhere as before. We are still engaged in skills acquisition programme, adult literacy and several others.

At a time, you seemed to have re-energized the Better Life programme, ostensibly to get some support for your husband’s aspiration in 2007.

Well, I started the Better Life programme when my husband was in office. Whether it was re-energized or repositioned, that is their headache. People are bound to have their own faith. I just have to appeal to people to be God-fearing. Don’t say what you don’t know. Better Life programme is still on. Is my husband running for office now? It is still on.

But it appears quiet?

You can be doing your thing your own way. You don’t have to be on the pages of newspapers. We are not loud. We are doing our thing our own way. You know publicity is expensive.

How do you mean? Buying space or just making news?

Buying spaces and going to television to cover your events. It’s all money. It’s expensive.

Even for your celebrity status?

When NTA has gone commercial? Nobody is doing anything free for anybody, no matter how good your programme is.

• To be continued tomorrow

A man that God have made a sought out.

what can u say about barack obama, don't u think that he is really a God sent man.

what can u say about barack obama.

gbamiciously believe u guy.

people should stop posting on this topic there's no sense in it.

ujujoan, but pls, if i may ask, how much do a woman have that gave u the room to insult men in here, whenever i heard that a woman is spending money to her boy friend i do pinch and ask my self how much is it, because i know very well that a woman's money can never fetch me any thing because their money is like a little baby change coin. but u forget that a man even me do take a woman for a shopping and spend not less than U.S. $2500.00. at a spot still no one hears about it, then why should a woman spend a little change to her boy friend  and come out here to publicise it, forgeting that the guy is spending his hard got spam on her. How much can u use to quantify those spam that he have being spending on u without complain.

For the five state that have commence their voting now CNN have reviewed that barack is leading with four state out of five, may Almighty God who sent Barack Obama to unify the world and bring back the world economy guild and protect him with wisdom and victory. Amen.

David said and i quote,

the God of Israel said, the Rock of Israel spake to me, He that ruleth over men must be just, ruling in the fear of God, And he shall be as the light of the morning,

SAMUEL: 23:3-4. end of quote.



u know what the Americans are, they have try all they could to find a spot or wrinkles on Barack Obama to Neil him down but they could not, even a spot they did not find how much more of wrinkles, they even call him names and try all they could to step on his background but God almighty have vindicated him because he is a God send man.

People have the right to differ on political and other issues - as on this one. The problem is that some are sounding as if he sat on his lazy backside and just pumped straight to popularity. Speech or no speech, how many "average" Americans sit down and fold their arms to become senators?

pilgrim.1

God bless u and may ur days be long.

if u think that u can not do without him then drop him, but remember that he will still be better than u tomorrow no matter what.

ifygurl,  i will like to tell u to shot up, do u think that Nigerians in other countries are doing well than the Nigerians in china, and for Ur own information china is 50 time better than Nigeria. I s Nigeria a country? just tell me and why u are not living in Nigeria if the country is good for u, from 1986 Johnny them start dey waka comote from the country where u dey that time, abi u think sey nay today the country spoil, if u are opportune of having a rich man as father why can't u wait to hear the story of the ones from poor families, onye amu di nma amaghi inhe onye ibi nahu.

some guyz talk stupid things most times abi na hunger dey waiya that guy? how come of posting such stupid tread in here, are u misguided or what that in ur common sense of thinking u have the impetus to post this stupid thing in here. People like u might be too far from success, Abi u no think so?

The main cost of the problem here isn't being illegal immigrants because i new very well that they where not hostile on us those days, all this things started from 2004 when Nigerians started trooping in like flood and most guys who thought china is like other European countries become disappointed and frustrated, because there's no work to do and no money to go back even those that sale one thing or the other be for they can raise money for their tickate could not even think of going back. China was the last hope of many and it will be last thing for them  to go back while there's no money for them to start one business or the other, they started constituting nuisance here and there, looking for a way of having a meal daily. U know what most Nigerians can do, doing what is not appropriate, the things that is really against the law of the country, is true that there is racism here in China but isn't to compier then and now, they are now friendly to people than 2000-2004 and the attitude of most Nigerians have been the course of this problem, if really u can be able to reason with me.

pls, i really need ur contributions to this topic

Thank u very much for the correction

Looking into our Nigerian teenagers and their cronies, their attitude/character some times i got marveled, please, what are their secret.

Why Nigerians always talking trash about China, if Nigeria is good for u why should u ever dream of coming to China and after all if not China Nigeria would have continue wearing OKIRIKA WAKED UPS by now, if not China Nigerians would have not even afford to have a mobile phone. China have giving Nigeria what they could not even have in 50 years to come, i am living here in Guangzhou city of Gangdong province in China for good 8 years with complet documents and they have never insulted me by any means because i am living according to their rules and regulations with respect attach to it, please can any one of u say if is right to live in another country without documents . China have been a good friend to Africans and they have giving Africans valuable things unlike America and Europe who gave Africans nothing but stealling from them and sucking blood out of their body. China made things become affordable to Nigerians, things become so cheap in Nigeria today and they are too friendly. Let me inform u guys that China is a blessing to Africans especially Nigeria, like the guy that posted this tread, how dear u living in China for good 9 years as u said without a proper documents or do u want china to be like Nigeria where corruption is talk of the day, a place where nothing work, a country where the citizens have started considering hell as an option where by there's no means of immigrating to a God blessed country like China, listen, China have lifted more than three hundred millions of their people out of poverty, a country that carers for her citizens, Nigeria as a country is not up to 4 provinces in China still more than 70% of her people are living below one dollar daily and if u think that ur country carer for u why should u come to China and stay for 9 good years or do u think that China is like Nigeria where only for sectors worked, No'1, BANKS, 2, HOTELS, 3, CHURCH'S/MOSQUES, 4, PROSTITUTION, where Nigerian girls are using there private parts as a means of survival and lively hood while their boys are caring guns from house to house. Boy, u are now talking against china that had feeded u for 9 good years as u claim because u have been sent home, for good 9 years u have been living here in Guangzhou with me and when had u ever posted a tread against China. Even in United State and Europe there's a lot of deportation from there than the one in China. China is country that have been living in peace even with other nationals till when Nigerians came in and tuned the place like hell, the kind of life most Nigerians are living in here is nothing to write home about and they can never live such lives in Nigeria, even forming a lot of cults groups here, some called them self BLACK ASS, mess UP TREATERS and so on even moving with cotlasses, knifes and other dangerous weapons, stopping people on the way by harassment and collecting there money and passports, living such a useless life that Chinese people don't even know about, insulting the police beating up taxi drivers and dogging bills even having sexual affairs with married women, listen, if Nigeria is good for me why should i live in another country. Please, no one should insult China for any reason because they are right in what ever they do to us, most Nigerians are animals and bad, we need a new orientation, i have live in many countries with Nigerians they are all the same, please, just cry for ur self, ur country Nigeria and ur people. U have to bless China, they have help most of u to have food on ur tables.

JUST WONDERING WHAT LOVE WILL BE TO TWO PARTNERS WITHOUT MONEY, YES A LOVE WITHOUT MONEY HOW SWEET IT IS<><><>CAN THERE BE RESPECT AND TOLERANCE, PLS, I WILL LIKE TO HEAR UR CONTRIBUTIONS TO THIS TOPIC.

tinky. listen to me, if really u want to suprise Ur man, then it needs only but maturity to give him some thing that will expired him to a greater hight, organise a get together of 6 to 8 members only, and make a wonderful dish beyond his favorites. And the eight members should only be three of ur former boy friends which he may know or not and the other three will be his former girl friends too, then after all have eating then take a giant step for a good and wonderful introduction then kiss him to the point of no return.

if really u want the Yoruba female bleeps in helping u to actualise ur aim then how come the African/American married to Nigerian men, not even married to Yoruba's, why?

Here come's mine<>on the year of our lord<><>june 11th.

Sistawoman, u have rightfully taking a personal decision which u think that will help u and by being so tribalistic, well this is where u got it wrong<><><><>(I would love for the females to be Yoruba<><><><>and here u truly show that ur incapability's to things is nothing to write home about<><><>If you are an African American female married to a Nigerian man then please hit me up as well. all just mount to delusion, Pls, rethink.

RAMONACEE, what i really want from u is just ur advice not 4 u to mock at me please, well i will be looking forward to hear from u soon, cheerers.