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MaxInDHouse:
Ọmọ i really learned a lot through the manner Michael handled him walahi talahi!

He just kept fingering his brain to divulge all he had in his brain until everything has been exhausted then apostate return to his default mode: Talks about Watchtower!

I'm telling you...the guy has nothing left to offer other than WATCHTOWER😁😁....the thing don gum for him brain....Una dey try oo....I don wash hand commot for him matter. He go see help for front.

Courz:
Your Watchtower Cult is the full definition of Confusion. Your doctrines change like weather showing your leaders are very confused. Where do they get their doctrines from? Jehovah? Is Jehovah confused? Who is your Mediator?

Ahhh...omo you really have problem oo.....I wish you well sha.

Courz:
As a JW, you are a beginner in Christianity because your doctrines are far off from the Bible especially your doctrines about Jesus. That's why what I am saying sounds like German to you. Who is your Mediator?

You are more clearly confused than me. For the very fact that you can't get Jw and watchtower out of your mouth. I am telling you to move forward from watchtower and Jw. But it seems that you are stuck there. Show me other followers of christ, you cannot. Don't you think that you might need therapy?

Courz:
Give your life to Jesus now before it is too late. He says his load is light. Watchtower's load is heavy. Jesus is the Way, The Truth and The Life Not Watchtower. No one goes to his Father except through him. The same Bible also says there is no one on earth that has been given as the way to Salvation except Jesus. If you really want to know the way, Start with Jesus. Your attachment to a religion will not save you when Jesus comes to judge the world. Only Jesus will. Infact, your relationship with Him and his Father will save you. Start working on a relationship with both of them now. Give your life to Christ.

Oga you don't know Christ. If you did, you would know and be in agreement and love his followers.

Steep:
Oga Jesus was with God before the creation of heaven and earth.
Read again Jesus was with God in the beginning not created in the beginning anyone that was not created in the beginning was not created at all.
Creation was made in the beginning, all angels, man and animals even marriage was created in the beginning, the beginning is the whole period when things were created but for the word he already was at that beginning he was not created.

So what does in the beginning when Jesus was with God refer to? Was John implying that God and Jesus had a beginning? OR That Jesus was not with God before the beginning?

Steep:
Actually Jesus is not the first to rise from the dead.
Firstborn from the dead is different from firstborn over all creation.
David was called the firstborn of the kings of the earth it does not mean David was the first king does it?

What does firstborn from the dead mean in col 1:18?
And what does firstborn over all creation mean in col 1:15?

Courz:
I have given you the Way forward. Who is the Way? Jesus! You don't understand what I am saying because you don't trust Jesus. You don't have a relationship with Him. Is Jesus not the Head of the Church? Why are you doubting him? Did Watchtower teach you to doubt Jesus?

Oga it seems that right now on planet earth you are the only one who have discovered Jesus, For the fact that you do not Even know others who have also discovered Jesus so that you can love them. I wish you well on your solitary journey.

Courz:
Do you have a relationship with Jesus? Do you trust Jesus to show you the Way? Why are you doubting him?

I will repeat myself. As for how to know who are worshipping God, you will do that search yourself with the help of Jesus by means of the Holy spirit. After all, He is the Head of the Church. Why? Because once again, we are not to advertise churches Since our attention is on Jesus. I don't know all the churches in the world. I am a Non denominational Christian. I do not have an attachment to a specific church since that's not the concern of Jesus and God. I attend any church that preaches Jesus, teaches the truth from the Bible and displays love by caring for the less privileged and needy. That is what the Bible calls Pure worship. You must not attend a popular church. Only one church cannot be True. That's not possible according to Jesus in the verses you read. Based on what the Bible says, use that to search for that church yourself. They may not be popular but they are scattered around the world.

Do you see that you don't have a way forward. So up till now you've just been going to different churches with different doctrines. Among the ones you have gone, you cannot Even be bold enough to call the name of those churches whether they are popular or not. And you are saying that watchtower is bad. But you cannot even mention the churches that you've been attending that is good. Na wa for you oo. You are even telling me to do something that you have not done. And you expect me to believe that you have found Christ and his followers? Ok no problem.

Ken4Christ:
Sure. It's liquid fire. Hell is heaven compared with Lake of fire because they have period of rest in hell. But in the Lake of fire, you will be swimming in liquid fire for the rest of your life and at the same time in unbearable torment.

What of hell and death that are put into the lake of fire?, will they also be swimming in the liquid fire for the rest of their lives in unbearable torment?

Courz:
It is good that you interpreted those verses correctly. Your Watchtower publication below interpreted those verses correctly too. This means that you are not to have an attachment or allegiance to a church or denomination. So, you can see that where you worship no longer matters to God. Wherever you choose to worship God in Spirit and Truth as long as the Church believes the same, is acceptable to God. Therefore, restricting yourself to a denomination as the Road to Salvation is wrong. This also means That Jesus is saying that JW is not the only road to Life. Unfortunately, this is what You are taught in JW. You are not taught the right way to worship because your allegiance is to your religion and not to Jesus and Almighty God. You will need to change your mindset so as to worship God correctly. Once your allegiance is to a religion and not Jesus and his Father, you are practicing Idolatry.

As for how to know who are worshipping God, you will do that search yourself with the help of Jesus by means of the Holy spirit. After all, He is the Head of the Church. Why? Because once again, we are not to advertise churches Since our attention is on Jesus. I don't know all the churches in the world. I am a Non denominational Christian. I do not have an attachment to a specific church since that's not the concern of Jesus and God. I attend any church that preaches Jesus, teaches the truth from the Bible and displays love by caring for the less privileged and needy. That is what the Bible calls Pure worship. You must not attend a popular church. Only one church cannot be True. That's not possible according to Jesus in the verses you read. Based on what the Bible says, use that to search for that church yourself. They may not be popular but they are scattered around the world.

Oga forget about watchtower and show me others apart from watchtower that I can love and worship God with according to Jesus. Why are you taking me back to watchtower?
Don't you have a way forward apart from watchtower?
Have you also asked yourself why all those churches that you've attended are not in agreement when it comes to the teaching of christ?

Courz:
Read John 4 Vs 20 to 24. Then explain to me what the verses say.

Jesus said in that verse that location to worship God does not matter. Jesus also said that his followers will Worship God in spirit and truth.
So the question remain, who are those worshiping God in spirit and truth today? Can we know them? Have you met others who worship God like the way you do? Or was Jesus saying that we can never meet people who are worshiping the father?

Courz:
What was the discussion between Jesus and the Samaritan woman?

You can tell me. I'm listening

Courz:
What was the discussion between Jesus and the Samaritan woman? Do they teach you that discussion in JW?

Oga are you the only one following christ today? If no, have you found another person following Christ like you? Where do you guys meet to worship just like Jesus disciples did after his death and resurrection?

Courz:
It is not too much. A True Christian is a follower of Jesus. That's why you are called a Christian. You are not to focus on Individuals to show you the Way because the Way is Jesus. You are to focus on Jesus. As a JW, You are too concerned about Individuals to show you the Way. It shows you have a lot of learning to do as a Christian. Do the people you follow focus on Jesus? Do they preach about the Gospel of Jesus Christ? Do they direct your attention to Jesus? Do They take you directly to Jesus? Apart from showing love, That's how you know that they are true followers of Jesus. Read your New Testament. It is all about Jesus. Read the words of his Apostles after he went to heaven. It was all about Jesus. Does the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society follow their example and take you directly to Jesus?

I am not asking for someone to show me the way.
Who are others that are worshiping God is what I am asking? Or should I not know others that are christ followers so that I can love them too as Jesus commanded me?

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Courz:
So, if you believe Jesus is the Way, The Truth and The Life, why are you looking for specific individuals to follow when you have Jesus? Are you a Christian?

Did Jesus not say people will know that we are his disciples if we have love among ourselves?
I am not looking for individuals to follow.
I am looking for those who love Jesus like myself, and we also love each other as Jesus disciples. Is that too much to ask?

Courz:
Go back to your Bible and read it. Who did the Bible tell you is The Way, The Truth and The Life?

Jesus.
Does Jesus have any true followers today? If yes, who are they?

Emusan:
You're a really olodo....only if you understand that.

You want me to tutor you like a primary school pupil, let me help you with that.

The meaning of term FIRSTBORN is what CEV actually emphasize on the last part of the translation "...superior to all creation."

That's why you won't find other translations used the term 'FIRSTBORN' since the meaning was used.

Very pathetic.

I've being answering your questions since now it's my turn.

When the scripture says "Jesus is the 'FIRSTBORN' from the dead" Colo 1:18 does it mean Jesus was the first to be CREATED from resurrection?

Note: the term in contention here is the "FIRSTBORN"

col 1:18 says that Jesus was the FIRSTBORN from the dead, meaning that he was the first one to be raised from the dead.
Now Your CEV Translation says that Jesus was not only the superior but also the firstborn son in respect to all creation. So how do you want to argue that Jesus was not the first person to be created?
Now can we also apply the word FIRSTBORN SON Or FIRSTBORN from the dead, in Col 1:18 and Col 1:15 to The God that Jesus was with in John 1:1,2?

Emusan:
You're a really olodo....only if you understand that.

You want me to tutor you like a primary school pupil, let me help you with that.

The meaning of term FIRSTBORN is what CEV actually emphasize on the last part of the translation "...superior to all creation."

That's why you won't find other translations used the term 'FIRSTBORN' since the meaning was used.

Very pathetic.

I've being answering your questions since now it's my turn.

When the scripture says "Jesus is the 'FIRSTBORN' from the dead" Colo 1:18 does it mean Jesus was the first to be CREATED from resurrection?

Note: the term in contention here is the "FIRSTBORN"

Oga stop twisting scriptures. Why did you not use the earlier translations i gave you to explain?
You went to bring scriptures that omitted firstborn.
Can we also say that The Almighty God who Jesus was with in John 1:1,2 is also a firstborn?

Courz:
God forbid bad thing for this statement you made up there! You see why your fellow JWs Call you an Apostate? You don't talk like a Christian. You don't talk like a True follower of Christ. If you really were, you would never have made the above statement. You are truly an apostate. It is blasphemy against Jesus to attribute to him what is attributed to a False prophet and Confusing doctrines that are Lies. You have once said Jesus is a Deceiver. So, I am not surprised that you are attributing what is False on or a Lie to Jesus. Satan is the Father of Lies. You JWs follow him in the same path with your New Light doctrine. Are you aware that your New Light doctrine is a License to Teach Lies as Truth?. You better go to God almighty in prayer and beg him to forgive you for this atrocious statement you just made against Jesus. You just committed Blasphemy against the King of Kings and Lord of Lords. You have no shame!

Now that you've said that JWs are liars, can you point out those who are telling the truth?

Emusan:
To have low IQ is truly a disease.

According to you "you claim that original Greek talks about just SUPREMACY but not talk about Jesus being the first creation" and you went further to ask again what does the term FIRSTBORN SON mean?

Absolutely, just leave this discussion and enroll for elementary school.

😁😁😁....you think you were wise by bringing Translations that omitted the word 'firstborn son' just to prove your point. But unfortunately your CEV Translation convinced you that Jesus is not only Supreme, but also the firstborn of creation.
But you could not dodge it because you caught yourself 😁😁. Oga you need the school more.

Emusan:
I've answered that question come with another.

Lol😁😁😁....Oga you have not answered oo....you claim that the original Greek talks about just supremacy but does not talk about Jesus being the first creation.
So please what does the 'firstborn son' in your CEV Translation mean?

[quote author=Emusan post=128488192]I've answered that question come with another. [/Greek?
Lol😁😁😁....Oga you have not answered oo....you claim that the original Greek talks about just supremacy but does not talk about Jesus being the first creation.
So please what does the 'firstborn son' in your CEV Translation mean?

Emusan:
If you have any question apart from this one, let me know!

Oga why does your CEV Translation call Jesus 'firstborn son' before saying 'Superior'?
What does firstborn son mean.
Or should we ignore 'firstborn son' because it does not appear in greek?😁

Emusan:
I provided it yesterday, or you want to deny you didn't see it.



Fixed



Yes! because there's ONE BEGINNING as we can't have TWO BEGINNINGS which you also agreed with.



That is what God's Word says not me.

"In the BEGINNING, God created the Heavens and the Earth" Gen 1:1



Both Rev 3:14 and Col 1:15 are talking about SOURCE OF CREATION and SUPREMACY OF CHRIST OVER CREATION not that Jesus was CREATED. According to Greek word USED in those verses.

Scripture is very clear that.

John 1:3 "ALL THINGS were created by HIM(Jesus) and without Him(Jesus) NOT EVEN ONE THING that was created"

"ALL THINGS came into existence through him,+ and apart from him NOT EVEN ONE THING came into existence." - NWT

Gen 1:1 "In the beginning, God created the Heavens and the Earth"

If you want to swallow your vomit that there can be TWO BEGINNINGS then come open.

Was it also in the beginning of the heavens and earth that 'Jesus was with God' according to verse 2 of your translation?
What does 'firstborn son' mean according to your CEV Translation below?

Emusan:
Yes!

And I back it up with a TRANSLATION.



Do you think as well?



Stop twisting the scripture.

You already said there can't be TWO BEGINNINGS

So discussing with you further is a waste of one's precious time.

Oga which translation did you use to back it up.....the one that is confusing you?
You are arguing that the 'beginning' in John 1:1 is the same beginning in Genesis 1:1.
So are you saying that the heavens and the earth were the first thing that God created? If yes, explain the bible verses below.
Is the heavens and earth both the 'beginning of the creation of God' and the 'firstborn of all creation' in REV 3:14 and Col 1:15?

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Emusan:
What is the usage of past tense verb "WAS" in that sentence?

Man, just go back to primary school for elementary English.

The past tense verb 'Was' is used by John to simply describe what happened in the past, which is 'the beginning'. So I don't get where you saw John saying that Jesus was 'before the beginning' in which he was talking about in verse 1.