₦airaland Forum

I believe OBJ would have failed the test.

I wonder why the fake prophet was mistaking Mary for Miriam . . . .?

Dont think you can dodge my question because I know muslims who are still wondering about this fallacy that Abraham built the kaaba. You may care to check this: http://free-minds.org/forum/index.php?topic=14268.0

For the last time, where are your pre-islamic evidences that Abraham built the kaaba?

@ olabowale; You want to force a falsified response down my throat? I dont just believe in fairy tales

You are making no meaning, why cant you explain what you are quoting?

Dont you know Miriam was Aaron's sister? mohammed was confusing mary for miriam!

In all your long narratives, which are fairy tales as far as am concerned, you have not been able to give me the answer to what I asked you: 'Pre-islamic/pre-koranic evidences that Abraham built the kaaba with Ishmael'.

The kaaba was built by pagan arabs for the worship of they over 300 gods!

Why are muslims afraid of archeological findings in their area? simply because it will expose the lie called koran and islam!

So Mary was given Mirian's name?

You mean you have no evidence other than koranic verses?. I told you plainly that all the fairy tales from the koran were written over a thousand years after the purported events occured!

How do you expect me to accept those writings in preference to the records that were taken at about the time the actual events occured?

The koranic verses are just jumbled up fairy tales, invented to cover up the exclusion of Ishmael from the Abrahamic covenant with God.

jobless man . must you post in every thread to be famous

Who is jobless and is more famous for useless, numerous, abusive and totally unnecessary posts on NL than that boy from Niger Republic, abuzola?

This man, if i talk bastard into your skull

English language, na wah!

don't blame of being disrecpectful, mind yo business, you hear ?

Better improve on your English before you come abusing an elder.

If is a proof to his faith and the faith in resolve in Allah that the young wife with a young baby accepted their fate, as Ibrahim (AS) return to the main house! The events of their lives a short time later, for mother and son, became the part of hajj that are the running between the two mountains called Saffa and marwa. later as the event of slaughter of a son by Ibrahim was being carried out and the ransome that followed became the jamrat or the stoning of the devil, who was tempting mother, and also temptempted father so that the dream of a prophet would not be fulfilled! And the ransome became the slaughtering of animal the day after Arafat!

Ishmael was never the covenant child. The covenant child was Isaac. I asked you to give me evidence of where all your fairy tales were recorded but you could not, instead citing the koran which was written over a thousand years after the purported event occured!

Now that I have established clarly that Ibrahim was in Makka where his young wife and the apple of his eye settled in, I wil now give you the proof that after the flood of Nuh (AS), and upon Ismail becoming a child in the age that he can help his father, they built the Kaaba and Ibrahim called mankind to make Hajji, vis a vis, there is a place around the Kaaba, in the general (NE) of the black stone (E), known as "Maqam Ibrahima" position of Ibrahim!

You mean Abraham left sarah to live with Hagar??

Just give me the evidence and stop yapping!!

My reasoning is not deranged. Far from it! There used to be a time that people was made to believe that the earth was flat. The powerful Church, took the position and killed plenty of people who had a different opinion! Today, after so many centuries that the Churched prevailed and executed many, that archaic belief is now disbelieved. But yet this now discarded church position used to be the only truth and was long the standardized belief of what the earth is!

How is this related to my question?

So if one follows your above idea, about Ibrahim, who was not a Jew and not a Christian

Surely, he was a muslim

the yong wife of this old man

See why I say your reasoning is deranged? you now refer to Abraham's slave girl as his wife, but you were busy defending mohammed that the other women that were attributed to him were slave girls. What a warped reasoning

. . . and the arguments continues . . .

The talk still continues . . .

na wah for english, broda!

Self-contradictory Quranic verses

Which one is correct?

• Quran-2:256: There is no Compulsion in religion…. OR

• Quran-9:29: Fight those who do not profess the true faith (Islam) till they pay the poll-tax (jiziya) with the hand of humility.

• Quran-9:5: Then, when the sacred months have passed, slay the idolaters wherever ye find them and take them captive, and besiege them and prepare for them each ambush….

• Quran-47:4: When you meet the unbelievers in the Jihad strike off their heads….

• Quran-2:191: And slay (kill) them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have turned you out such is the reward of those who suppress faith.

• Quran-8: 65: O Apostle! Rouse the believers to the fight…(against) unbelievers.

Very often apologetics claim that, Islam is a religion of peace and there is no compulsion. Yet, punishment of an apostate in Islam is, of course, death penalty.

Historical blunders in Quran

In several Suras the Qur'an confuses Mary the mother of Jesus [Miriam in Hebrew] with Miriam the sister of Aaron and Moses, and daughter of Amram which is about 1400 years off.

Sura:19:27-28---“At length she brought (the babe) to her people, carrying him (in her arms), They said: "O Mary! Truly a strange thing has thou brought! "O sister of Aaron, thy father was not a man of evil, nor your mother a woman unchaste!"

Sura:66:12—And Mary, the Daughter of Imran, who guarded her chastity, and We breathed into (her body) of our spirit; and she testified to the truth of the words of her Lord, and of His revelations, and was one of the devout (servants).

Why Mountains were created (?)

In the following verses, Quran claims that mountains were set on the earth so that the earth never can shake when human being dwelt in it.

(Quran- 21:31): And We have set on earth firm mountains, lest it should shake with them.

(Quran-16:15): And he has cast the earth firm mountains lest it shake with you…

(Quran-31:10): He created the heavens without supports that you can see, and has cast onto the earth firm mountains lest it shake with you… It is clearly understood that Quranic author was completely ignorant about the geological reasoning for existence of mountains. He saw that mountains are huge and heavy. So, He (Allah) thought mountains actually prevent Shaking (Earthquake) of the earth. Fact is, this particular reason for existence of mountains is a direct contradiction with modern geological knowledge. Geology proves to us that movement of tectonic plates, or earthquake itself causes mountains to be formed. Besides, we know very well that, every year several dozens of earthquakes happen on earth. Then what is the result of Allah’s promise? Can we believe that, Mountains are there to prevent earthquake? (11) Sun and moon rotates/travels?)

Quran never said everything in the universe does move/rotates, but Quran always said SUN and MOON moves/travels. Quran never ever said that, the earth moves or travels. And this is an open challenge to all Mullahs to disprove my assertion. Like all other religious books, Holy Quran believed Geo-centric theory and earth was considered center of the Universe. Only recently, no more than two decades ago, scientists learned that Sun also moves through the galaxy taking all the Planets with it. Fact is Allah was not stating real Sun’s movement, (which is, just one circle of Solar galaxy by 226 millions of years) but He (God) was stating Sun’s daily movement which was believed for millions of years until Copernicans time. Allah’s assertion of “settled place” or “an appointed time” was about the daily Sun rise and Sun setting. Following verses will prove that very clearly:

Quran-39:5: “He created the heavens and the earth (in true proportions) ; He makes the Night overlap the Day, and the Day overlap the Night; He has subjected The Sun and Moon (to his law); each one follows a course for a time appointed.” Here each one clearly refers to Sun & Moon (in the previous sentence), and not everything in the Universe as wishful apologists claim.

Quran-31: 29: “Seest thou not that Allah merges Night into Day and He merges Day into Night; That He has subjected the sun and moon (to His law), each running its course for a term (time) appointed.”

Quran-21: 33: “It is He who created The Night and Day, And the Sun and Moon; each of them Swim (float) along in its own course.”

Ayats mentioned above could be found over and over, again and again almost in every other pages of Quran. Because, Quranic author, standing in the open Arab desert saw very well that, every morning SUN is rising from the East and gradually (appointed time or fixed time) setting to the West, and as a result, day and night follows. Allah truly mentioned this wrong knowledge (sun moving) of pre-historic people. Every time Allah mentioned sun & moon, He mentioned day & night, as if, it is due to sun’s movement day and night follows. Allah also saw, both the sun and moon are traveling seemingly at the same sky area and He was amazed how come they do not collide or how come sun can not catch moon(?) That was the sun’s movement Allah was talking about, which cave people could have said millions of years ago or a boy of five can say that very accurately. Is not it? Who does not see Sun’s movement from east to west?

Sky/Heaven is hanging without pillars and Mountains are placed to prevent shaking (?)

Quran-31:10: He hath created the heavens (Skies) without supports (pillars) that ye can see, and hath cast into the earth firm Mountains/Hills, so that it quake not with you; and He hath dispersed…,

Modern science tells us- whole thing around the earth is space and there is no boundary even we go Billions of Trillions of miles in all direction. Questions are: When there is no sky above us then how in the world, question of pillars comes? What was the need of pillars? Do we really have a roof above us? Is there anything called above or bellow in true sense? Are mountains there to prevent earth from shaking? Readers can read a Sahi Bukhari Hadiths about Ascension of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) to heaven (Miraz story) where these seven skies (seven firmaments) have been well recognized and described.

Seven heavens (seven firmaments (?)

(Quran-67:3-5): He who created the seven heavens, one above the other….And We have adorned the lowest heaven with lamps…

(Quran-71: 15-16): Do you not see how Allah has created the seven heavens one above the other, and made the moon a light in their midst, and made the Sun as a lamp.

(Quran- 41:12): And He completed the seven firmaments (heavens) in two days and assigned to each heaven its command; and We adorned the lower heaven with lamps (Sun), and rendered it guarded…

Quran teaches us that there are seven heavens one above the other (in layered; there are many sahi hadiths in support of this superstitious belief) and that the stars are in the lower heaven, but the moon is in the midst of the seven heavens. How come moon is furthest object than stars? How come SEVEN firmaments (layers)? Modern science tells us that, actually there is no such thing Sky or any roof over us, it is only a space with no known boundary at all. These verses simply reinforce the ancient idea of ROOF over us which is called SKY, is not it? We know very well the word CANOPY stands for a tent in the desert, and Canopy always must have a roof over it to protect from Sun’s heat.

My humble questions to the readers, please tell me how come Allah is telling us that He decorated lower heaven (Sky) by stars? Are stars situated at the lower sky? Modern science tells us that, stars are (most) furthest object from our solar system. Sun is the nearest star for us. Does Quran tell us that the SUN is also a star? Answer is a BIG NO. Allah says Sun is a lamp/torch for the earth. Am I right? Do you see how much science here?

Why Allah created Stars(?)

Quran gives us more scientific knowledge by telling us that the stars were created by Allah as missiles to throw at the devils:

Quran-67:5: And We have (from of old) adorned the lowest heaven (sky) with lamps, and We have made such (Lamps as) missiles to drive away Satans (Evils)…

Quran-37:6-8: We have indeed decorated the lower heaven (sky) with (in) the stars, (for beauty) and for guard against all obstinate rebellious Satans. So they should not strain their ears in the direction of the Exalted Assembly but be cast away from every side.

Thus, the stars are nothing but missiles to throw at devils so that they may not eavesdrop on the heavenly council. Heavenly council? Here Quran is actually talking/describing about falling (shooting) stars (Ulka, Dhumkathoo). Superstitious minds of Quran believed that the sky is the roof (seven firmaments) over the earth where kingdom of Allah situated and there in Allah’s kingdom daily assembly (Allah and His Angels) sits to discuss how to run Allah’s business on earth. So, Allah does not want Satan to listen Allah’s secret conversation with His Angels (readers please see page-1191of Maulan Yousuf ali’s Shanrnazul#. 4037-4038 for more interesting story about this). DOES THIS AGREE WITH MODERN SCIENCE?

Quran wonders why/how Sun and Moon do not collide/catch each other (?)

Above Quranic Ayat (36:40) is telling us that---Sun can not catch/overtake/collide with Moon; Or, Night can not oustrip the day, Or, darkness of Night is covered by Day light; and Day light is covered by Darkness of Night. By any means, Allah did not try to tell us about the SHAPE OF THE EARTH as some apologists want us to believe. This will be a ridiculous thinking. Allah actually wanted to tell us that, Night’s darkness is covered by Day-light and vice-versa. This observation does not take a divinity to determine. Any human being can see it clearly, even cave people observed it millions of years ago.

Quran told us lots of sciences here. Where is the sun and where is the moon situated? Can anybody tell me how they could collide/meet/overtake each other? Are the sun and moon neighbors to each other? If I walk in the streets of Dhaka, and my brother walks in the streets of Los Angeles, shall we overtake/collide/catch each other?

Allah is indeed a great scientist. I have the answer for this error: Ancient people saw (bare eye observations) Sun and Moon traveling from east to west (and west to east) seemingly in the same Sky area or same path, yet they do not collide or catch each other and causing day and night etc. People in the 7th century hardly could imagine that all of these phenomena are simply due to Earth’s rotation and NOT by Sun’s rotation. Sun is stationary for Earth, because earth is stuck in the sun’s Gravity, like we are stuck in earth’ gravity. Quran never say any where in the whole Quran that, THE EARTH ROTATES. Quran maintained Geo-centric theory in every respect. Earth was considered center of the Universe. Perhaps Allah could not feel Earth’s rotation, because like humans Allah was also stuck with earth’s gravity.

A resting place for sun WAS CONFIRMED BY SAHI HADITHS

Sahih Bukhari Hadiths: Abzur Ghifari (ra) narrated: one day Prophet Mohammad (pbuh) asked me, “Abzar do you know after setting where does Sun go?” I replied, I do not know, only Allah’s apostle can say better. Then Prophet (SA) replied, “After setting, the sun remains prostrated under Allah’s Aro’sh (Allah’s throne) and waits for Allah’s command for rising again in the East. Day will come when sun will not get any more permission from Allah to rise again and Qeyamot (dooms day) will fall upon earth”.

Please see page # 1133 of Bengali Translated Quran by Maulana Muhiuddin Khan to see this Hadiths for yourself. You can find this Hadith in Sahih Bukhari Sharif. The Saudi King selected Maulana Muhiuddin to Translate Quran and millions of translated Quran have been distributed throughout the whole world. And 100% of all Bangladeshi Mullahs/Karis/Hafezes believe them by their heart.

Can anybody tell me what is it? Can any Islam loving Brother tell us what is it? Does it tell us about the destroyed Sun after 15 Billions years later? Answer is a big NO! Fact is, it was the superstitious belief of ancient people reflected in the Quran and Hadiths by Allah. A 10 year old boy would not tell such fairy tale story today.

Allah’s Days Equal to 1000 Years or 50,000 Years (?)

Quran-22:47: Verily a day in the sight of the Lord is like a thousand years of your reckoning. Quran-32:5: To Him, on a Day, the space whereof will be a thousands years of your rekoning Quran-70:4: The angels and the spirit ascend unto him in a day the measure whereof is Fifty thousands years. So, which one is it ? Is the day of Allah equal to 1,000 earth years or 50,000 earth years? (3) Sun-set and Sun-rise (?) Koran teaches us that the Sun sets in a muddy spring

Quran-18:86: “Till, when he (the traveller Zul-qarnain) reached the setting-place of the Sun, he found it going down into a muddy spring…” Quran- 18:90: “Till, when he reached the rising-place of the Sun, he found it rising on a people for whom We had appointed no shelter from it”. There are serious scientific errors here. Firstly, it is scientifically accepted fact that, the Sun never goes down in a muddy spring or clear spring. Secondly, this seems to presuppose a FLAT Earth, otherwise how can there be an extreme point in the West or in the East? A sunrise there would be basically just the same as at any other place on this earth, at land or sea. It would still look as if it is setting “far away”. It does say, that he reached THE PLACE where the Sun sets and in his second Journey the place where it rises. Does any body need to go near rising or setting places to observe—sun-set or sun-rising? (4) A resting place for Sun: (?) Interestingly, wishful Mullahs claim that this resting place means the ultimate destruction of the Sun. Sorry, brothers you are dead wrong. Look what Quran says in the following Ayats:

Quran-36:38: And the sun runneth on his course for a period determined for him; that is the decree of (Him). That is the measuring of the Mighty, the Wise. Quran-36:39: And for the moon We have appointed mansions till she return like an old shriveled palm leaf. Quran-36:40: “It is not for Sun to overtake the moon, nor doth the night outstrip the day. They float each in an orbit.” (This they clearly meant for the Sun and Moon only).

Maulana Yousuf Ali’s Tafsir: “The Arabic word “Mustaqarr” may mean (1) a limit of time, a period determined or (2) a resting place or quiescence; (3) a dwelling place. I think, the first meaning (a time period determined) is best applicable here. But some commentators take the second (a resting place). In that case, the simile would be that of the SUN running a race while he is visible to us, and taking a rest during the night to prepare himself to renew his race the following day. His (SUN) stay with the antipodes appears to us as his period of rest.(page:1178, Sura-36,by Yousuf Ali)”

In the Ayat above (36:39), Quran tells us that, moon gradually changes its shape and eventually (till she return like an old shriveled palm leaf) becomes very thin (wear off Moon) like dried date leaf (crescent- shaped). Only Mullahs can tell us how much sciences are in this Ayat!

Numerical contradictions

There are many numerical contradictions in the Quran. God cannot make an error in doing simple calculations. How many days did it take to create Heavens and Earth?

(Quran-7:54): Your guardian-Lord is Allah who created the heavens and earth in Six Days (Quran-10:3): Verily your Lord is Allah, who created the heavens and earth in Six Days (Quran- 11:7): He it is Who created the heavens and earth in Six Days Quran-25:59: He Who created the heavens and earth and all that is between, in Six Days

The above verses clearly state that God (Allah) created the heaven and the Earth in 6 days. But the verses below stated-

(Quran-41:9): Is it that ye deny Him who created the earth in Two Days ?

(Quran- 41:10): He set on the (earth) Mountains standing firm high above it, and bestowed blessing on the earth, and measured therein all things to give them nourishment in due proportion, in FOUR DAYS…

(Quran-41:12): So He completed them (heavens) as seven firmaments in Two days and … Now do the math: 2(for earth) + 4(for nourishment) + 2 (for heavens) = 8 days; and not 6 days

Quran-4:11-12 and 4:176 state the Qur'anic inheritance law. When a man dies, and is leaving behind three daughters, his two parents and his wife, they will receive the respective shares of 2/3 for the 3 daughters together, 1/3 for the parents together [both according to verse 4:11] and 1/8 for the wife [4:12] which adds up to more than the available estate. A second example: A man leaves only his mother, his wife and two sisters, then they receive 1/3 [mother, 4:11], 1/4 [wife, 4:12] and 2/3 [the two sisters, 4:176], which again adds up to 15/12 of the available property.

In these verses above one can see the total property after adding all distributed parties adds up more than the available property, i.e., totals become more than 1 which are: 1.125 and 1.25. How come? A gross mathematical errors, is not it?

(1) God created the Heaven first or, the Earth first (?)

Which one was created first? As you will see in the verses below, Allah at one time says that Earth was created first and another time He says that the Heaven was created first.

(Quran-2:29): It is He who hath created for you all things that are on Earth; THEN He turned to the Heaven and made them into seven firmaments (Skies)….

(Quran- 79:27-30): Are you the harder to create, or is the heaven that He built ? He raised the height thereof and ordered it; and He has made dark the night thereof, and He brought forth the morning thereof. And after that, He spread (flattened) the earth

Now, does it match modern science? Do you believe that, Earth was created first, and after that, God created Heaven? Does modern science tell us that?

My post:

What a white lie? where was it documented that Abraham built a mosque with Ishmael? to which year was the document dated? not wishful thinking Olabs, not wishful thinking!

Olabowale's response:

@Nezan: Quran is evident enough, a revelation by the Lord of all creations. Read about the Kaaba in the Quran and googllle it for books and references from the Arabs.

@olabowale; you see how deranged your reasoning is? Abraham existed hundreds of years before. Everything he did was recorded in the Jewish Torah. Know you come and tell me that you believe that he built a mosque with ishmael which the koran recorded over a 1000 years after the purported event occured?

Since Abraham's life was recorded in the Torah without this event, it is totally correct to refer to this record, written over 1000 years after Abraham lived as a forgery.

islam and the deceptions continues . . .

God took Jesus to heaven where he awaits until the day of judgment when he will return to earth (3,55). Muslim traditions teach that Muhammad died not knowing if he would be judged worthy to enter Paradise - where God has already placed Jesus. Muhammad is Dead and buried in Saudi Arabia. Jesus is alive both with God in heaven (paradise) and in Spirit with his followers on Earth. (Koran 3,55;4,158,159)

This is the great difference between Jesus and Muhammad according to the Quran/Koran. Jesus is alive in Heaven with God and Muhammad is dead and buried. IN MEDINA, SAUDI ARABIA, STILL AWAITING GOD'S JUDGMENT.

muslims are a very funny bunch. the foundation of islam itself was raised on the bricks of deception and hypocrisy!

I believe very soon, olabs will publish his own hadeeths