₦airaland Forum

9jacrip:
Lmao!

This man, I fncked up for taking you serious and wasting my time to engage you.



My engagement in this discussion has nothing to do with feelings but mere prevention of history distortion which seems to be your trade.

The archives say differently from what you believe in and what the website stated.

Go and read works by Lagos historian.

You seem to be very knowledgable about Yoruba history than a Yoruba for you to have stated sections of Yoruba land do not affect each other yet you took the Oba's statement of Awori Motber and Benin Father literal - yet the Awori originated from Ife but does not affect Oba of Eko/Lagos history.

You, my friend, are very confused.
Keep it moving.

9jacrip:
These are no supremacy battles, both know their places.

You seem to have a problem with interpretation.

9jacrip:
Read them and countered them adequately?

Lmao!

What both kings said were figurative.

You've not made any sense and you're the one playing with semantics here and definitely confused.

I'm done with this thread really, you're a poor history student or grad.

Keep it moving.

macof:
You are mad honestly. When ur madness is ever cured come back let's discuss without running into quick conclusions

Since all I've done on ur matter is abortive. . I have schooled you oon many past threads about Oduduwa not fitting Ekaladerhan personality
Here I schooled u on the Idejo from my first hand experience wit some of their family members

But The urge to insult yoruba history, to distort history placing yorubas under Bini is so powerful in you
I would have loved to see you claim Igbo colony of Lagos lik you do on past threads

Am done with you! Come back when you have gone to Isale-Eko and tell us the chief you interviewed

macof:
The ignorance of this Esan man is not the issue but how you try to claim authority on Yoruba and Bini is what baffles me

Oba Akiolu's father isn't Oyekan lik you posted above


If you say Bini conquered Eko because of Eleko being of Bini origin
Then I say Ife conquered Bini because of Omo'n'oba's Ife ancestry

if you can't deal wit Bini having Ife lineages sorry you can go sue them

TonySpike:
You think all the junks you posted on this thread makes you an intellectual? I guess the definition of the word "intellectual" has definitely changed if you are indeed one. It's a pity you don't know who I am in real life; if you do, you will know that you don't deserve to be my student because your analytical and deductive skills are very crappy and watery. No wonder you place yourself on a pedestal of delusion.

macof:
This doesn't dispute all I've said about Aworis. . It disputes ur earlier assertions infact

Read carefully. .
Olumegbon is among the king makers (at least a title chief in the court) of the Eleko
Aromire is land owner to the Bini lineages

tonychristopher:
why dont you open up a thrread on that and we are just trying to dissect Oduduwa fallacy and Benin influence in socio political and historical era...and there is no point sweeping these things under the carpet
have you seen my idejo postulation and what do you have to say

macof:
Lmao

Esan! No wonder
He isn't even Bini

What then is ur business with Awori - Bini connection? Absolutely nothing
if you say Yorubas are divided pls talk about ur Edo people first

Etsako are gradually losing any sign of connection to you lot. ..what wit the islam and Yoruba names they lik to bear now

Try arranging ur burning house instead of trying to divide yorubas

macof:
Smh.

Nobody says there are no Bini descendants in Lagos. .the Oba of Lagos is descended from Oba of Benin


If that's ur only problem. ..then there's no problem at all
But no it isn't. ..u still want to drag Eleko's Bini ancestry to mean Bini ownership of lagos. ..that's what you can never succeed at

macof:
the Niger deltan who thinks he knows yorubas better than yorubas
Who tries to teach Yorubas our language, Culture and history
The man who has no connection to Lagos but talks about lagosians yet dictates who can and cannot talk about them

Were ur fathers buried in lagos island?
Is ur family compound in lagos?
Is ur ancestry connected to Lagos?

Hypocrisy of the highest order

TonySpike:
This just the problem with these outsiders trying to distort Yoruba history. How can anyone in his right sense rate Olubadan as one of the foremost Yoruba kings? This is very displeasing and abominable! Ibadan did not become a full-fledged city until circa 1820s, and even then was a military garrison and launchpad base against the Northern invasion. I would really advise you, Nigerman1, to desist from distorting Yoruba history and hierarchy. I don't know the profane points you have been trying to prove, but please stay on your original topic!

macof:
Whit this I can say you are a lost course

You lik Google right? Try searching Olumegbon, Oloto and other Idejo . .since you cannot accepted anything you didn't see on someone's blog

All you nd Tony know about yoruba are from blogs and Internet articles wit all ur copy and paste
Only an Iidiot does that and declares himself authority on Yoruba history - both of you are not even Yoruba. .you have never might an Awori chieftain in your obviously pathetic lives so full of Bigotry

I repeat NOBODY DENIES ELEKO'S BINI ANCESTRY BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN EKO WAS CONTROLLED BY OBA OF BENIN

tonychristopher:
I know ... there was no common name for all Yorubas before the 19th century. As with most major ethnic groups in Nigeria, they would have considered themselves as belonging to a city-state or what we think of as sub-ethnicities today--Oyos, Ifes, Egbas, Ijebus and so on. There was no need to have a larger group name, since they were politically independent areas with their own identities. The term Yoruba originally referred only to the people of Oyo, but literate Yorubas (mostly returnees from Sierra Leone who were of Oyo ancestry) like Rev. Samuel Johnson started to use the term to refer to all the people who could understand each other's dialects. In Sierra Leone, they called themselves 'Aku' because the greeting 'Eku ishe" was common to all Yoruba-speakers, so it was a way to identify themselves as ethnically-related amongst all the other groups. Yorubas began to feel a need to identify themselves as a single ethnic nationality because of the 19th century wars against the Fulani, which forced many people into slavery or to take refuge with neighboring groups. After many of these enslaved people were able to make their way back to Nigeria, they wanted to promote the same type of group unity at home that they had abroad. Educated Yorubas like Bishop Ajayi Crowther and Rev. Samuel Johnson consulted with Hausa historians, who were literate in Arabic and had books by Muslim scholars like Ahmed Baba that mentioned Oyo/Yorubas etc. They popularized the word as a description of the whole group in books like "History of the Yorubas".

There has been speculation that the term Yoruba is originally Hausa, as you said. It's likely that it's a version of the name for a northern Yoruba-speaking groups (Yagba or Oyo) that was adopted by the Hausa, just as the term Nago/Nagot in French-speaking West Africa/Brazil/Haiti is used for all Yorubas and adapted for the group name from one Yoruba-speaking group, the Anago. These Anagos were (and still are) from modern-day Benin Republic, and they were among the first Yoruba-speaking people in Brazil, so their ethnic name was used to refer to all people that spoke the same language. However, people still specified where exactly they were from by adding their sub-group name; an Ijebu would call him or herself Nago-Jebu, while one from Ketu would be Nago-Ketu etc.

macof:
Lol have you seen this archives in Europe? Europeans now tell yoruba history better than yorubas
Man! U are lost

Oba of lagos cannot come out to say Awori - he is Awori despite his Bini ancestry
Were subjects of Oba of Benin

macof:
pls have yoyou met an aboriginal lagosian who freely used "conquerors"?

What's ur business with Eko history u this man? U can't tell me what to talk about
Tony - an Igbo is parading on the Lagos history nobody says he should quit trying to learn about Aworis
History is not a subject you keep for aborigines alone to discuss . If Others want to learn let them learn, it's the yoruba way. ..btw I am Yoruba I can discuss my Yoruba history as I want
It is you - an Edo who has no right dictating Yoruba history based on the nonsense you read from blogs

9jacrip:
If you take the king's statement literally to mean an actual man and woman then I give up on you.

Enjoy your day.



Aggressive? Yes; emotional - is getting irritated an emotion?

After providing links to support awori ownership and Benin's part and still taking the time to interpret, you should not fault me for getting irritated.

I'm out.

macof:
Academic is exactly what history is not claims. History is defined by Maturity and Not Hate
So get over ur problem with my people and open ur brain to knowledge
If you disbelief anything I tell you quickly take a trip to Isale-Eko

Read this well BINI NEVER CONQUERED THE AWORIS OR CONTROLLED AND INCH OF THE LAND having Bini descendants doesn't = Bini control
Oba of Benin never had authority in lagos. .
Eleko having Bini ancestry doesn't make Lagos a Bini conquered land. . His pilgrimage to Bini, burial in Bini doesn't mean The Awori acknowledge the Oba of Benin
All that was the Bini lineages recognizing their Bini ancestry
Same way The Ife lineages in Bini recognized their Ife ancestry - ur Oba of Benin recognize his Ife ancestry
Go sue him

macof:
You filled with Hate, even ur sources dnt agree with you yet u propagate ur Bini claim to Lagos

Lmao I am a Yoruba
Wait let an Awori slam the door to my face and tell me out oof the Awori history and land
But we know that can't happen, I have been given so much access to Awori chieftain families, many (potential) Future Idejo are my close friends

Oba of lagos (Eleko) is of Bini ancestry, nobody says otherwise but you go to insult us all by claiming Bini owns lands or conquered the Aworis

While you seek to brand urself Yoruba historian from ur favorite blogs (Edofolks) and dictate who tells Awori story
Why don't you follow ur advice and leave Awori alone ..you aren't yoruba I am, you have no access to the Idejo ...probably you've never been in Lagos

All yoruba are interwoven, does it bite to realize that Bini are alone? Even Esan don't stand with you in most cases
So you seek to divide and conquer

Sorry the ties that bind the Yoruba cannot be broken

macof:
Oh I guess lagos is Bini land
If it isn't Yorubaland pls go and tell the people Ijora, Island, Ikorodu, Isolo, Ebute-Metta etc that they are Bini and watch what happens to right there

ggo to the Aromire family to seek knowledge pls
Internet can't tell yoruba history better than the owner of Eko himself

9jacrip:
Now @ your own post: There is no supremacy tussle, it is just a case of kings wanting to stand on their twos and not necessarily defer to anybody yet knowing the roles their progenitors played in the scheme of things. For some, they want to break away from the old system of being a king under a king while still knowing their level, while for some they want to continue the system of old.

It is not a supremacy tussle to outdo each other for a position because each person knows the position of his throne, rather a tussle between new order and old order.

9jacrip:
This man, you're obviously blinded by emotions.

Are you saying Idejos do not exist and it is now being sponsored?

There are no supremacy battles between prominent families except you want to funish the thread with lists of such cases?

Say rubbish about idejo in the presence of your Benin fathered Oba Eko and see if you woulf not get your head ripped off.


Thanks for the INSULTS - keep it coming.





tony, it will be appropriate of and for you to take care of your homeboy because he is obviously losing it.

From post exchanges so far, macof, myself and others have alluded to Benin's commencement of Oba of Eko with his streamlined roles stating many sources, even his (your guy).

Yet he is going wild all over the place repeating the same things.

Now @ your own post: There is no supremacy tussle, it is just a case of kings wanting to stand on their twos and not necessarily defer to anybody yet knowing the roles their progenitors played in the scheme of things. For some, they want to break away from the old system of being a king under a king while still knowing their level, while for some they want to continue the system of old.

It is not a supremacy tussle to outdo each other for a position because each person knows the position of his throne, rather a tussle between new order and old order.

tonychristopher:
Its true , I know that supremacy tussle, do you know that not every oba in yoruba pays homage to Ooni of Ife?

9jacrip:
Reason I said the thing was poorly writ.

The same post that used the word conqueror never mentioned anything about military engagement, rather a diplomatic agreement between the two and a relationship that bolstered.

You keep sounding like a historian yet your interpretation skill within parameters of given sources is poor.

Lastly, you need to understand, in Yoruba land, the history of every section affects and it is a business of every section. I'm full blooded Ife. The Awori, the founders and owners of Lagos are Ife migrants pre-Bini empire. Onikoyi was from Ikoyi in Osun state with their compound being in Ife. So it is not a case of 'aborigines' and non-aborigines, it is the unifying ties within all Yoruba towns.

Ever wondered why all Yoruba feel uneasy when Ilorin history is twisted, ever wondered why they get reactive when Oduduwa story is tilted - even Yoruba from pre-Oduduwa period?

Read:

This prompted the Oba of Bini to constitute a war expedition led by Ado, a Bini Prince to go to Lagos and demand an explanation. This was over 650 years ago. However, on getting there, they were well received. The people were so enamored with Ado they asked him to stay and lead them. He agreed on the condition that they surrendered their sovereignty to the Oba of Bini to which they agreed.

--------------------

Surrendering sovereignty to the Oba of Benin does not equate conquest when the idejo still owned their lands and call shots as dey deemed fit with Oba Eko kinging at Eko (Lagos Island alone) which was a farm pepper where no one even lived - according to your source

Read:


Until the coming of the Bini's, Lagos's geographic boundary was what is known now as Lagos Mainland. Lagos Island, the seat of the Oba of Lagos then consisted of a pepper farm and fishing posts. No one lived there though. The name Eko was given to it by its first King Oba Ado during its early history, it also saw periods of rule by the Kingdom of Benin. Eko was the land area now known as Lagos Island where the king's palace was built. The Palace is called Iga Idunganran which, translated means Palace built on the pepper farm. Oba Ado and the warriors from Benin as well as some of the indigenous people who sought safety settled down in the southern part of Eko called "Isale Eko", Isale literarily meaning bottom, but must have been used to indicate downtown (as in Downtown Lagos).

----------------


Let me give you a tip; when reading a historical source, note bullet points and read the source thoroughly for a point at a time. After you must have dissected the work for one point then you move to the other. Apparently, you're not doing this yet to talk about 'history being academic' when for you it is emotional.

tonychristopher:
That is a blatant lie and benin influence in Yoruba is glaring

tonychristopher:
Must u be abusive

macof:
Wrong, Yoruba have no Bini influence outside eastern kingdoms close to Bini
Oba is yoruba pls
Idu is also yoruba
Eko could be but I don't speak all Yoruba dialects. .
I read once that in Ife "Teko" is Farming
Eko could be farm, farming in Awori/Ijebu

tonychristopher:
with this analysis I think Benin man was oduduwa cos they seems to have influence in Yoruba instead of Yoruba having influence in Benin hence the term oba is a Benin word just like Eko and idu

macof:
They won't search for what exposes their fallacies

To correct the popular idea that Awori are subject to Bini descendants among them
Olumegbon is always present in the process of selecting a new Eleko (Oba of lagos)
Aromire is called Onile (land owner) by the Bini lineages. .as he is the owner of their land

But Oloto don't require anybody to crown him

9jacrip:
Despite providing links to prove historical facts you still labeled me as a champion of propaganda - I give up on schooling you.


The fact that your Benin skewed history holds no water has made you shift your goal post severally but this is the height of it.

If you like, reserve your ancestor's undies, your obvious inability to connect the Oba's statement to the historical fact of Benin's minute part in Awori history tells a lot about your intelligence level. I honestly hope you're not a graduate of history, it will be am embarrassment to your alma mater and historians all over.

The Oba's statement, incase you missed it, only reiterated the historical facts.

There's no angle you try to tilt the debate to that the historical facts would not trounce you.

You can take it as far as Awori not being Yoruba then you can tell me the etymology of awo-ri, tell me about ogunfunminire and their migration from Ile-Ife. And while you're at it, keep in mind a number of Yoruba towns have their family compounds/quarters in Ile-Ife and these includes Ikire, Ikoyi, (i)Remo, Ijebu-Ife, Omupo etc

I'm willing to take the debate up a notch and rip you apart completely.

I'm waiting.

macof:
You are really not bright. . Hatred has dulled ur intellect. Try to calm urself and break free from hate, whatever offense done to you by a yoruba person can be forgiven

Nobody is denying Bini descendants in Lagos

Lagos state has Ekiti, Ijebu, Oyo, Egba, Bini, Awori, Egun, Itsekiri descendants
But let's talk Eko (Lagos Island ). .. The Island is owned by Awori - Aromire , an Idejo had his farm at the island , the site where the Bini descendants settled while he settled at Idumota - his lineage are still present there wit their palace
Oba of lagos having Bini ancestry doesn't make Lagos Bini property - it neve was, if it was the idejo cannot still be claiming the LAND- the Bini lineages in Eko don't dispute this
The Bini descendants settled in Isale - Eko, up till Enuwa where Idumota began
Aromire still holds his land
The Oba of Lagos doesn't own landed property by virtue of his ancestry, he owns only influence and respect

MrPresident1:
I have a point I am driving at, and I would want him to answer the question.

He has to tell me the 'Edo' he belongs to.