Submission is good and should not be confused with slavery or oppression of women. The man contributes, the woman also contributes but the man makes the final decision and it must stand. If it goes wrong, he will lead the family to tackle the problem. That is what it is about. It is not that bad.

I don't know why people hate western ideas though. The internet is western, the TV is western,the phone is western, the car is western, the plane is western, education is western, malaria drug is western, vaccines (polio, etc) are western, shirt and tie are western too. I am an extremely proud African but what have Africans invented? Even our culture is biased. We have a culture that supports female focal place mutilation,suppresion of women sexuality,bosom ironing,despoil, killing of child witches, a woman calling her husband's teenage younger sister "aunty", denying a widow of her late husband's inheritance, child/forced marriages, etc. Our culture has its good and bad sides.

When you see something good appreciate it. Women empowerment is good. Though the West has taken the women right issue too far especially in the area of divorce settlement.

Even God that is the MASTER CONTROLLER and the HIGHEST AUTHORITY is a FAIR GOD. The God that created the elephant is the same God that created the sugar ant. He does not support women oppression all in the name of submission.

invisible!:

@chy-baby, herein lies the contradiction, how can a woman with very high degrees and too much knowledge respect anyone, talk less of his husband that she sees his 'kini' every night? The high pursuit of knowledge by women is a problem on its own, in the end the kids suffer, the society gets more misfits growing up and yet things are not better than they were when our grannies lived.

Invisible I am not trying to antagonize you but women desperately need education. Education is power, freedom, light, etc. I know so many Igbo people in their 40s/50s who were beneficiaries of Awolowo's free education scheme, they still bless the man(his spirit cos he is dead) till today anytime they remember him. Education is goooooooood!!!

Illiterate and poor women face a lot and they feel that they have to take it and that there are no alternatives e.g. bosom ironing, battery, the practice of younger brother marrying his late elder brother's widow, etc. Education will greatly help in this regard.

Also, if the man dies suddenly (maybe quite young) or falls sick for some time and the woman is not educated how will she gather resources or get a good job to comfortably take care of their kids? Remember she also has to have the time and energy to train them not just provide their needs alone.

Not saying illiterate people cannot train their kids very well but that if the woman is well educated and has a good job or potential, it makes things a lot easier for her as a widow.

Missy B:

What's the thread talking about-
''Is the fight for Equality ruining marriages'' or ''Is feminism ruining marriages''?
As it's obvious, everyone is presenting  the  woman as  the only subject craving for equality - Which is not always the case.
What's [gender] equality, if I may ask?
Shey one of both genders has to be superior to the other, before the other strives to become equal - Simply put; The struggle for equality sets in, only when there's superiority. No- ? Agreed?
Now, I ask - Is any gender inherently, beyond all doubts, superior to the other? Yes? Why? What's the yardstick of superiority?

NOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!
I support submission but mind you submission is not about being a servant but about alignment . The only reason why God commands a woman to submit is NOT because she is not capable of being a LEADER (Deborah in the Bible, Margaret Thatcher, etc) but because of ORDER AND HARMONY within the family.

Afterall if the man dies won't the woman step in as the new head? I know several widows who have done this successfully.

invisible!:

Nature made it so, the book of Genesis repeated the same points, women should just submit to men for peace to reign, any other thing is against the whole laws. Women now work, not because some men cannot provide for their families but because they are now insatiable. Some will even want the men to sit at home and babysit! There will be peace in this world when women revert to their nature ascribed roles.

Everyone was made to work to fulfill destiny(see verse below) but women may have to take career breaks to nurture their children.

Gen 1:26-28 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."

27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; [b]male and female he created them.

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

PROV 31 THE VIRTUOUS WOMAN
13She(R) seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands.
14She is like the ships of the merchant; she brings her food from afar.
15She(S) rises while it is yet night and(T) provides food for her household and portions for her maidens.
16She considers a field and buys it; with the fruit of her hands she plants a vineyard.[/b]17She(U) dresses herself[e] with strength
   and [b]makes her arms strong.
18She perceives that her merchandise is profitable. Her lamp does not go out at night.
19She puts her hands to the distaff, and her hands hold the spindle.
20She(V) opens her hand to(W) the poor and reaches out her hands to the needy.

I BELIEVE IN A WOMAN SUBMITTING TO HER HUSBAND. DO YOUR PART WHETHER HE DOES HIS PART OR NOT. But it is left to the woman to marry a good man who will love her back with everything.

TeskyMan:

On the above quote, i guess you are sharp and smart lady, your method will work for you and will make you enjoy your marriage for long.

Back to the Post, there is no shortcut to the method prescribe by nature. I remember what a man of God said - In Gen Gen 3:16  Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.

[b]One, GOD made the statement that , Woman, thy desire shall be to they HUSBAND Alone not only that, HE shall RULE over you. Please whats the meaning of RULE OVER YOU. This is the point in the Bible that gets me afraid. God said it affirmatively, even if u have B.Sc, M.Sc, M.Phil, Phd, Professorship e.t.c You Husband RULE not might RULE or temporarily rule, it said SHALL RULE over you. This is the portion of the Bible that feminism seems to correct in a carnal way and the end point is Divorce.[/b]I have been marriaged over 4 yrs, I respect my wife alot and she respects me too. I have always being doing something, not only to my wife but also to people i meet for the 1st time. I crave respect for myself. How do i do it? I try as much as I can to consiouly respect anyone I meet for the first time be it a Man or Lady, by so doing they have no choice than to receiprocate. Some people take advantage of that but I have a way of dealing with such people maturedly. I bet you it REALLY WORKS for me.

If you can respect your Boss in the Office, Military men for being armed, Robbers for being Fully armed, Pastors for being spiritual and finally elderly people outside so then, why can't you respect your husband who LOVES you more than anyone mentioned above. If not for anything but for PEACE, for the CHILDREN and DESTINY of both of you.

Why are some men so insecure?Damn, thank God there is no marriage in heaven. That verse you quoted is/was a CURSE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and THE RESULT OF SIN

The same way God cursed women to be having pain during childbirth. Haba so a curse is now good. I lost an aunt who died at childbirth as well as several other women close to me. So thattt is good!!!!!!! Are you a christian at all? Have you heard of Gal3:13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree." and that death came through Adam but life came through Jesus.

Pleaseeeeeeee there is a difference between when God curses and when he blesses. Go and do more bible study. Twisting the Word of God just to massage your egos??

So all the curses of poverty, disease, death, famine, natural disasters that came through Adam'S SIN are good!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please do your possible best for your father. Explain to him whenever you cannot help out. I guess your parents (like other good Nigerian parents just assuming) must have stressed themselves out to give you the best start in life.

Most parents I know will withdraw the last kobo in their bank accounts to pay their children's school fees if need be or even borrow or even offer themselves as labour. Some will happily go without luxuries.

You may never know the amount of sacrifices he made for you. Training you was his responsibility but if he didn't what would you have done? He could have decided to spend his money on booze or women or even abandon you. But he invested in you and saw it through to the end. There are lots of irresponsible fathers but sometimes you find out that their children still honour,pamper and spoil them.

You should be able to reciprocate not just to receive their full, whole-hearted blessings(which is sooooooooooooooo important) but to serve as examples to your future kids. You should not be stingy with your father. He shouldn't lack anything you can give or that you can sacrifice.

It doesn't matter if he is right or wrong. First help him then advise him. Anybody can make wrong investments or even be unlucky.Remember whatever you intentionally do to your parents, your kids will surely do the same to you. Shikena.

Women serving men is a cultural thing where I come from (Yoruba). Maybe because women are better at handling food and presenting it nicely and also generally anything food (cooking or serving) is seen as a woman's specialty. Women will take the time to pick as many pieces as possible and the best for their husbands

There is nothing wrong with it. So far the man is not commanding the woman like a servant. Also, several Yoruba homes I know have special chairs,plates and cups, etc for the father of the house.

And some people do get offended if you sit on their husband's seat or mistakenly use his plate, etc. The father always get served first whether he is around or not and the father must always eat the best. Nothing wrong with this.

But it is not common to everybody. Some homes are freer so to say. That said I think it is NOT compulsory. But if the man likes it or culture demands it, it is advisable.  On the Bible issue (for people that are xtians), I will say that reciprocity is what the Bible is trying to pass across about love. There is no benefit in serving a man who cannot serve you (except you are trying to convert him).

If you pamper a man then you can expect to be pampered in return. To whom much is given much is expected. Though one person is likely to outdo the other(most likely the woman).

A clock needs two hands to function, one cannot work alone as there will be no time. For the two hands to be clean, the left must wash the right and right must wash the left.

The Bible says to the man, you must love your wife, won't the woman love her husband too? Abi how many men will want to marry a woman that does not love them but is only interested in money, or in becoming a Mrs to avoid the cultural stigma of spinsterhood? And it says to the woman, you must respect your husband, won't the man respect her too? The main thing is reciprocity, nothing wrong with husbands and wives loving and respecting each other.  

But as the head of the home, the man needs special respect in order to assume his authority because there cannot be two captains in a ship lai lai. The ship go sink. One must lead, one must follow and it has nothing to do with slavery.

After all if the Bible asks us to submit to outsiders out of reverence for Christ, how much more our wives if we truly love Christ and are ready to sacrifice anything including our egos and pride for Him?

Christ had no ego thats why He died N.A.K.E.D. on the cross for those who hated him, those unborn and those who may not accept him or be able to reciprocate. He laid down everything.

How many men quoting scriptures can die like that for their wives? Because the Bible said love your wife LIKE Jesus did for the church and gave His life. Thats why a lot of disciples could lay down themselves to be torn into two,flogged to death, imprisoned , etc for the sake of the gospel.

In an ideal situation , husband and wife should be trying to outdo each other with love. But the reality is it is not easy. Sometimes only God deserves the highest love in our lives, the type you do with careless abandon, like I don't care whether you love me, I just love, loove, looove, loooove you

The thing I don't understand is why some men live/survive/exist on women's respect. Whether she serves you or not, are you not still the head?Why do men need women to respect or validate them (I mean like master-servant) before they can feel happy? Maybe I am wrong sha.

Anyway the universal and biblical golden rule is do unto others as you want others to do unto you since spirit has no gender, there is no male or female spirit. You serve him, he serve you in kind or in another way. My 2p


@poster , Leilah carry go, keep serving and treating your husband like your lord till you grow old and I trust he will treat you likewise

Every woman that wants to marry whether African or not should know how to cook. Infact I would say everybody but men can be exempted. I mean what will a woman that cannot cook feed her husband and children with? Mama put, mcdonalds or what? All these junk reduce immunity, lifespan and cause numerous diseases. Home made food is the best. Any food that doesn't take time to cook is always inferior to the one that takes time and energy. And what will such a woman teach her daughter?

The only thing is while women prepare through their entire lives for marriage by learning to cook, housekeeping behaviour etc, men just sit and undergo NO preparation whatsoever. Most are ill-trained for marriage and they think a woman should do everything. Sometimes all they want to do is jump on a woman in the night whether she likes it or not. No sensivity or tenderness. They should be trained in these areas too. That's why women only allow sex for childbearing after that they lose interest. Sorry for going off topic a little.

Just tired of men who love complaining about woman and who are no mariage material either. Most of them think only their manliness and pocket is enough and they are already trained to be leaders from heaven.

@AngelRalph, thanks

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Poster, I am sure its just your church or the ones you have been to and not all cos my church has tall men  Btw what does this have to do with worshipping God? See I don't know about you but with God all human beings are equal. In other words only your spiritual height counts with God.

Also, whether you are mad or blind or lame or deaf or dumb or mutiliated or disfigured or bleeding or an slowpoke/imbecil.e or an albino or a Siamese twin (two people joined together) or short or not really beautiful or fat or charcoal in colour or you are a (damaged) woman whatever everybody is welcome to the presence of God. God welcomes everyone and hangs out with all who want Him. He cares about every soul. Nobody chose how he or she will be created or whom he or she will be born to or in which country whether Australia or Afghanistan, whether Sudan or Spain.

When Jesus came to the world, the blind, the people with withered hands and legs, the crippled, the sick, the dead (Lazarus, etc) and so on were those He[b] focused on and transformed[/b]. He performed so many miracles to change these people's lives. That is what love is, so be like your Father and leave the short men alone

AngelRalph:

Marami, let me first stress the fact that life is not fair. Some were born rich, the others were born poor. Some need to go thru hell b4 they could achieve meaningful things in life, while the others have meaningful things (breakthrus, if u will call it dat) thrown at them. So, some have it easy while some have it tough. But doesn't EVERYONE still have a cross to bear?

Therefore, life seems a battle ground, and it's a survival of the fittest. But it wasn't so before Adam's fall in the Eden. Mn had ALL things easy then. Sin came and so did toil and strain. God says to Man, hencefort, you will now work and suffer for every comfort you will ever desire for yourself Gen 3:16-19.

Jesus came so that we can redeem the very thing dat Man lost in Eden, Life in God (Rom 6:23). Jesus says, I come that you might have life and to also have it more abundantly John10:10. So, Jesus came to give us life and life more ABUNDANTLY. This means, suffering afflictions should not be for a follower of Christ, we should enjoy daily breakthrus.

Does life abundantly come without a strife? Not at all, u must fight for it. Because Jesus also says, Since d time of John d baptist, d kingdom of God suffers violence and the VIOLENT take it BY FORCE (Matt.11:12). What's d kingdom of God? Those are d good things u want in life and even in eternity at last.

So, the question is, Do you really want what you want or you can do without it? If u really NEED the breakthru u desire, then u must fight for it and be VIOLENT about it, or else it will just be a mere wishful dream to be carried to d grave (I forbid dat for u).

My point is, u must BE DETERMINED TO FIGHT AGAINST WHATEVER WILL HINDER YOU.

Personal convenience must go while u fast and pray. It's a time of necessary sacrifice. FAST FROM THE NIGHT OF ONE DAY TILL 6PM OF THE 2ND DAY (dat is one day, if u repeat it the following day it's 2 days and so on) My dear, there are some breakthrus u won't get UNTIL u join fast to your prayer Mark 9:29.

Some don't want a break at all from the eating and drinking, and even their self indulgences and yet they want miracles to happen. Do u know some will even still continue in their sins of womanizing, stealing in offices, cheating etc and will still be complaining God didn't hear their prayer Isaiah 59:1,2; Rom6:1,2.

Therefore, prepare to give what it takes for victory and abstain from sin. Now coming to your specific question, Anyone working in any place can fast and pray whereever they are, the matter depends on how desperate u are in getting your problems solved. You will not die. If u have history of ulcer, consult your doctor and see if u can fast till 12pm instead of 6pm.

Bank environment is a tense and busy place so u may not have too much luxery of reading Bible, but u can pray ALL dat time in your heart while working and God Who is faithful and MERCIFUL will hear u. The Bible says, 'For the eyes of the Lord run to and fro throughout the whole earth, to shew himself strong in the behalf of them whose heart is perfect toward him.' (2Chron. 16:9).

Also, u can make use of early morning or 12am to 1am praying and Bible reading time. In traffic holdup while going to office u can read Bible and pray. U can get bible study manuals like Our Daily Manna to GUIDE in prayer and in Bible study.

I hope I've been able to help a little thru d help of the Holy Spirit. U can ask me any question further later and I will be glad to of assistance.

Goodluck and God bless u.

AngelRalph, you are a real angel. Thanks, I gained a lot from this. Please I have three questions:

1. Please does God give somebody free money for example after paying tithe,you get a 1million naira contract? Or one has to work for every penny?

2. Why is it that when somebody is doing the wrong thing spiritually and does not know, one can get punished for this? For example, maybe I don't know that if I speak in tongues the devil cannot intercept my prayers and I am not in a church that preaches this. Then my prayers keep going somewhere else and I don't know why I can get answers to my urgent needs and God does not bother to tell me. And maybe I have not studied my Bible to that level. Why will God allow you to suffer unnecessarily, just be looking at you and not tell you what you can do to change this?

3. A member of Pastor Rick Warren's church was despoiled on the day she gave her life to Christ. She said this as part (negative) of her testimony (which was positive at the end). Why?

Na wa for all you men looking for escape routes from this trap. Are you rapists, why are you afraid? Na wa for these African men with too much testoterone. I don't think you know what raped women go through.

Na wa oh. People who are legal in the UK, even people with UK degrees are finding it difficult to get common menial jobs talkless of well-paying jobs now you want to come and join illegals. Have you heard that the Conservatives are in government and that they might start paying people to fish out illegals? Please try another country like Australia and New Zealand where they are looking for people before they also get filled up.

You can use visitors/temporary visa to enter New Zealand and and then try to look for jobs as I was told by their government official at a Working Abroad Seminar.He also said that if you get a job then the work permit will be arranged. But check the New Zealand govt website yourself.

Mind you these jobs are for highly educated and highly skilled people with nothing less than 5yrs experience cos they have people there too, British, American, Russian, Spanish, etc. Not only you is interested in New Zealand So you have to be highly educated and skilled, if not stay in Naija or try Ghana/other good African countries (do your own research properly).

Don't come to the UK and become illegal unless you want to really suffer, curse the day you were born and curse God and start wondering what you came to do in life. Its that bad. I am not lying. UK is not really different from Nigeria apart from the infrastructure and security and sanity of living. But it is worse than Nigeria because here there is no atom or molecule of mercy. Nobody cares. You can still come as a tourist and really enjoy your holiday maybe some 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 years time if you look somewhere else now. A word is enough for the wise.

Outstrip:

Tell me why this is so hard for people to comprehend. My dear there is nothing you have said that somebody with common sense will not be able to gather. I work very hard myself. I have a lot going on that I know I will be fine on my own with ot without a husband. I wrote my goals a long time ago and I have achieved some and some I am still working on. I know though for a fact that if I had not gotten married and had children I would be further along on those goals. That is okay with me though because my children still are my biggest accomplishment. The whole point is that two people make a decision to create a life together and in many cases you will just give up somethings because you know that that is the only way that the marriage will work or there will be peace in the home.
Before I started working for myself I did not contribute anything to my 401K (not a dime) because it was not matched for the first year. My husband though contributed the max because it was being matched. These are the little sacrifices we make in marriage. If the marriage falls apart I know that the money in his retirement account will be split evenly because this system works. The extra money that would have gone into an unmatched retirement account was bring used somewhere int he home and I was glad to do it because I have no reason to worry that I would be left in the cold.
I am sure if this man was this succesful that he spent a lot of time away from home and his family had to pay the price. The wife obviously had to deal with his infidelity over and over again but she stayed because she wanted to save the marriage. The man on the other hand basically feels like he just has a baby machine in the house that he promised to love and protect forever and he can just walk out of the picture when he feels like because he has an itch he needs to scratch
When you break those vows you should be prepared to pay dearly for it. Since people do not even consider God in anything anymore the law needs to step in and teach them a lesson. She could have married someone else but you came in and made promises that you broke over and over again. It is beyond shameful that people will come in here and call her a gold digger.

Ma sista, I feeeeeeeeeel you die!!! No mind those men. But I don't think she will get anything though. Our laws are still very primitive. Thats why I said if I were her, I would leave all to God. Cheers anyway

She certainly deserves some compensation and I am not talking about child support  . It may not be anywhere near 1billion though. Lets look at this from the woman's perspective. Women give up sooooooo much to get married and stay married. I am sure the man married her because she was not not as rich as he was at the same time. Now she supported him, emotionally, physically, sexually (to release business tension), spiritually (fasted and prayed endlessly for him) and so on. She fed him well, encouraged him, stood in the gap for him atimes anytime he travelled, tended to his physical needs, took care of his in-laws, shared his fears and troubles, served as his back, dealt with miscellaneous in the house, managed housekeep money, made her lifestyle to fit his, stayed awake for him several times, etc.

Because of this he was able to build on what he had and make more. Men with good wives make it better than men without because a good wife will effectively take care of the home front and the children so that the man can concentrate on his business. She did all the babysitting (if he was abroad he may have done part of it) and all the housekeeping so he could wake up easily, eat good meals (that made him sharp), wear clean clothes,  go to work relaxed and come back to a cosy home. The woman kept the house cosy/cool for him.

Also marriage sort of limits women's destinies. They can't reach their full potential. They have to sacrifice part of it. MEN DON'T SACRIFICE ANYTHING. THEY HAVE IT ALL  . Childbearing and childraising reduces women's productivity/productive life.Tending to the husband's needs (soooo compulsory) also does the same. Most Nigerian women once married turn their back on any personal stuff and live solely for the husband, kids and in-laws. Very few women have managed to combine career and family successfully.

They have to be there at all times for the husband, kids and in-laws whether they like it or not and whether it is convenient or not. Women give more in marriage than men do and gain less. Men gain well-behaved, well-brought-up kids (thanks to the mother)  since in Africa men own the children. Men also gain a fully productive and fully supported life. They do not adapt to the wife, its the wife who adapts to the whole setup and sacrifices a lot.

Also, from the womb, women are made to prepare for marriage  . "you better learn how to cook", "You better respect your junior brother cos he is a man", "You better dress well so that men can call you" etc. They have to be perfect But men do not have any preparation. No pressure. Also women are told not to be too rich or too brilliant or too tall   so that men will not see them as uncontrollable. So women actually lower their productivity in order to get married.

Some people believe women should not use a car or live in their own houses before getting married. So the poor girl has to be trekking about so that men will "seeee" her. A lot of female doctors cannot even use their titles before marriage because it looks too big for them e.g. Dr Miss Yar' Adua looks somehow as men will be scared of her. And they do not get married easily because of their "too high intelligence" .Its not me ooo, I have heard several of my male colleagues say that.

Now tell me after all this, pls if you are a man put yourself in this woman's shoes for a second (pretend that you are a woman, don't worry it won't happen ) won't you do more? Then after suffering with her husband (even if she has her own wealth or potential e.g.CFA, PhD she has to bury it for the sake of her husband's ego) he dumps her for a common housemaid. Imagine the humiliation, side talks, insults this woman would have endured at the hands of this housemaid, her family and the public. The housemaid now shares her husband with her, matrimonial bed, etc. She now has to start her life again. Upon all he is denying her her child despite knowing that the child will do better with her.

If I was her, I would leave him to God. If he escapes retribution on this earth, he will not escape afterwards. God is not partial.

I do not think that doctors should be forced to treat people if it will land them in jail. So many doctors that I know personally who treated gunshot victims have paid dearly for it. The policemen often arrest the doctors and sometimes nurses, maltreat them in custody, close down the hospital or vandalise medical equipment and demand for huge amounts of money. If the doctor cannot afford it or does not know people who can help, he spends longer time in their custody.

There are many small doctors just managing to survive. It is not all doctors that are rich. Also, they have to compete with native doctors, healing pastors and deal with so many patients (typical Nigerians) who do not want to pay for treatment. Most hospitals are run on generators almost 24hours.

Nigerian doctors especially private practitioners have been pushed to the wall because of all these. Also, sometimes if the victims are really armed robbers, doctors may be risking their lives or maiming of their bodies if they tell the police as the robbers may retaliate. On the other hand, the police will give the doctor hell and may even brand him as an accomplice if the doctor does not inform them.

Its always better for the gunshot victims to be referred to government hospitals. The main culprits here are the extremely greedy, cruel and barbaric policemen, not the doctors. This is from what I have seen. I think Nigerians should stop blaming the doctors and instead fight for how to get a better police force and a better emergency service. Remember the policemen DO NOT obey any rule.

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Please what makes one to fart ALL the time (no beans) and what is the solution?Thanks.

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Swine flu is in Ghana and Zimbabwe already. May God help us. Amen.

http://www.vanguardngr.com/2009/08/21/swine-flu-hits-zimbabwe-ghana/

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