₦airaland Forum

MaxInDHouse:
I love this!

Note that the God of Israel has told His people that they will not be numbered:

"I will certainly deal well with you, and I will make your offspring like the grains of sand of the sea, which are too numerous to count.’” Genesis 32:12

So lesson learned: Satan took permission from God before tempting King David just as Satan took permission to tempt Job {Job 1:7-12} for Jehovah to grant it {Job 1:10} then Satan could act as if it's Jehovah who spoke to David!

In reality Satan was granted the chance to tempt David due to David's blunders! 2Samuel 11:1-27

You are just lying outright now and making things up.

Numbers 1: 19
18and on the first day of the second month they assembled the whole congregation and recorded their ancestry by clans and families, counting one by one the names of those twenty years of age or older, 19 just as the LORD had commanded Moses. So Moses numbered them in the Wilderness of Sinai:

So God told Moses to number Israel and he did.

Where does the bible say that Satan took permission from God to tempt David.? It says Yhwh tempted David and that Yhwh was synonymous with Satan. That Yhwh IS Satan. Satan tempted David.

MaxInDHouse:
Can you point to just one advancement in the way these creatures live their lives because man has achieved a lot just as the Bible God claimed when He said:

“Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth" Genesis 1:26

Only man is intelligent to the point of driving away any creature if the location is suitable for living, and man has developed technology that no other creature could do 0.000001%

This is the indisputable proof of what the Bible God claimed: He created man to become like Himself ~ Creators/inventors of new things!

https://baanchangelephantpark.com/elephant_post_17

this video in the link is particularly interesting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5sFxcxoy3Q

I don't know what you mean but man has achieved a lot. The planet is being destroyed due to the activities of some humans. There are humans though who engage in these so called advances, like many of the tribes in the amazon forest. They even walk around naked which exposes the lie in your bible that they were ashamed of unclothedness and yhwh clothed them.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBbFnU5ITuM


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5RiHTSXK2A

MaxInDHouse:
The Author of the Bible only focus on a nation (Israel) but when it comes to how all other nations get their deities this Author gave us clues if we want to know the truth {John 8:32} note how this God journeyed all the way to Egypt to free His people without a military force? But any nation can also fabricate such a story so i focus on realities that's common everywhere to compare to what this Author is saying.

So there is no mention of Yoruba deities in the bible as they only focus on Israel ba? You lied when you said the 'fallen angels' in the bible refer to Yoruba deities. then this your God that journeys from somewhere all the way to Egypt to free his people, does that mean he has his domain too, and he traveled from there to Egypt. So he too is like the fallen angles that you described who have carved out domains for themselves.

The God of Israel demanded that His worshipers should present two live goats before Him, one is to be sacrificed to Him on the spot but the other to be escorted outside the land where the former deities occupying that domain has been driven after their worshipers has been exterminated! Leviticus 16:7-10

He even receives sacrifice just like any other lesser deity. He even sends a share of the goats received to his fellow demons in the wilderness. Even those those demon's worshippers had been exterminated in a heinous act of genocide instigated by himself by his followers. See the devilishness of the character?

From this recorded event i learned that the God of Israel knows that despite He being the Creator those demons have the right to that domain as long as their worshipers are loyal to them. That's why He warned His own worshipers never to invite those demons back because they will be roaming around since they've been misplaced from their domain! Deuteronomy 18:9-13

You're talking about of both sides of your mouth now. Those demons received their goat because they have a right to their domain as long as worshippers are loyal. However you said the worshippers were exterminated so why is yhwh still sharing goats with them?

MaxInDHouse:
Can you back the highlighted with the Bible?

2Samuel 24:1

1Again the anger of the YHWH was kindled against Israel, and he incited David against them, saying, “Go, number Israel and Judah.” 2So the king said to Joab, the commander of the army,a who was with him, “Go through all the tribes of Israel, from Dan to Beersheba, and number the people, that I may know the number of the people.”

1Chronicles. 21:1

1Then Satan rose up against Israel and incited David to take a census of Israel. 2So David said to Joab and the commanders of the troops, “Go and count the Israelites from Beersheba to Dan and bring me a report, so that I may know their number.”

MaxInDHouse:
There's no other deity in Yorùbá mythology that's revered as evil one except Èṣù, all other gods have one thing or the other they can be contacted for benefits but this particular deity is only called upon for mischief.

This is false.

MaxInDHouse:
At least you agree with the common phrase so use the Bible to get the clear picture:

And the angels who did not keep their original position but forsook their own proper dwelling place, he has reserved with eternal bonds in dense darkness for the judgment of the great day. Jude 1:6

Man is the only intelligent being created to live on this planet {Genesis 1:26-28} all other intelligent beings are aliens!

Odu Ogbe Ofun:

Ogbe f'ohun fun olohun
N o f'ohun fun olohun.
Babalawo oba lo difa fun Oba
Oba ntorun bo wale aye.

translation- Ogbe give the thing back to the owner of the thing
I will not give the thing back to the owner of the thing
The babalawo of kingship divined for kingship
Kingship was coming from heaven down to earth.

Abeg which angel that did not keep it's place in heaven is called Kingship.

What is obvious is that you do not understand the rhetorical device that is used in Ifa to explain the emergence of a phenomena.
It is also obvious that you do not understand the bible that much either.


Man is not the only intelligent being on this planet. Elephants have a very high level of intelligence and so dolphins. Even more intelligent than some humans.

Maynman:
I said “previous president” not “previous president of Nigeria”.
Who was the previous holder of “president”?, then we look for previous holder of “ruler of the sky.”

President of where?

MaxInDHouse:
If you will like the Bible because that's the book that's revealing all the secrets that fallen angels have hidden from people for long!

The bible is a big book. Can you not specify which passage exactly speaks of the Yoruba deities and how they took over certain domains?

MaxInDHouse:
If you're tribalistic surely you will not feel comfortable knowing that the god your ancestors worshiped is a demon. But the Yorùbás have what is called "ORÍKÌ" through which each person knows his or her origin.

Just meditate thoroughly on the ORÍKÌ of Èṣù i'm sure you will know why Àjàyí Crowder used that name for the spirit referred to as Satan the devil in the Bible!

I'm not tribalistic so I'll be alright, thanks. Please furnish us with the Oriki of Esu and. then. explain the. parallels with Satan.

The spirit referred to. as satan in the bible is also referred to as Yhwh.

Maynman:
They are generic titles.
Who was the “previous president”?
Or you want to delve into yoruba mythology?

The previous president was Goodluck Jonathan. The current one is Buhari.

The question was for those that claim olorun is only a title. who was the previous holder of the title?

MaxInDHouse:
NO! Note that through divination those worshiping these demons have told you where they came from:

"Látìkọ̀lé Ọ̀run wá síkọ̀lé ayé"

Please, which verse in Ifa or any divination lore said that?

"Látìkọ̀lé Ọ̀run wá síkọ̀lé ayé", is a common phrase in Ifa text. It is used to refer to the origins of absolutely everything. We will hear of when Scissors left from heaven to earth. We hear of when money left from heaven to earth. we hear of when telephone left from heaven to earth.

What is referred to is the process of creation. Every created thing is brought from heaven to earth. Orun in this case reads more like potentiality. Everything makes the journey from potentiality to actuality. That's how some people interpret it to English.

MaxInDHouse:
Each takes over a territory station there and start demanding worship from the inhabitants in his domain. The truth is that all of them were former dwellers in heaven (Ọlọ́run) who has no business with the inhabitants of the earth apart from the Grand Creator who has the right to set standards for mankind.

Olú-Ọ̀run simply means the one having authority in heaven and we know that Alayé means one has authority on earth, of course Alayé are countless though they know their ranking! Mark 1:24

Please can you provide references for the claims you make above.

Maynman:
If olu-orun simply means the one having authority in heaven, and alaye means one has authority on earth, that means olu-okun(ruler of seas) and olu-osa(rulers of lagoons) are just titles like olorun(ruler of sky) and alaye!


And alaye doesn’t even mean one who has authority of earth, or you mean olu-aye?

If these titles do not refer to specific beings but to a title then many beings can succeed each other to the title. My question is, Who was the previous Olorun before the current Olorun? How long does the tenure as Olorun hold for?

MaxInDHouse:
Meanwhile Àjàyí Crowder got it right, Èṣù is Satan and his rendering of Gehenna as Ọ̀run Àpáàdì is the best, if you're ready for a open-minded discussion on those topics i'm always available here.
Cheers!

I would love a discussion about whether Esu is Satan. I posit that Esu is not Satan. What are your reasons for thinking that he is?

DeepSight:
I thank you for your several attachments and references all the same.

Deepsight sir, have you considered that many People here on Nairaland may have mental health issues?

I believe that she refers to the Satanic verses.

DeepSight:
I doubt this. Where do you get this from? This is one of the things Islam shouts most about against Christian ideas of "God the Son."

HedwigesMaduro:
Olorun means "owner of the heavens". It's a title, not a name. It means God. Olokun is also a title that means "owner or king of the seas".

Yahweh means 'I am who I am'. Unless you are not who you are you too can call yourself Yahweh Abi?

Tokunbo means 'from overseas'. However would it make sense for anybody coming from abroad to call him or herself tokunbo when there are people using that as a personal name.

The fact that a name has meaning doesn't change the fact that it is a personal identifier for specific individuals. It is a very disingenuous trick these foreign invaders are playing by distorting and misappropriating the names of Yoruba deities.

I'm waiting for them to say Jehovah is Olokun after all...

Isaiah 51:15 I am the LORD your God, who stirs up the sea so that its waves roar— the LORD of hosts is his name.

Maynman:
Olorun is another name for olodumare, the yoruba god.
God is a title not a name!

Don’t forget we have olokun too, is that also a title or a mythological figure in yoruba mythology?
And also esu is not the same as Devil/satan!

HedwigesMaduro:
"Olorun" is not a name, it's a title. It's like saying people should not call Him God because people worship some other god.

If it is just a title that means that another he can be deposed and another being can come and take over the title.

Babinski:
Eledumare or Olodumare comes from the phrase "O ní odù mà rè" meaning "the owner of the source of creation that does not become empty," "or the All Sufficient". It is clearly a descriptive title and not a specific name for the Supreme
y.

What is Odu in Christianity? Does it exist? Is it not an Ifa concept?
Does Christianity also have 16 Odu?

what nonsense! Tokunbo is a name. It is descriptive too. Bolaji is a name. it is descriptive too.

Yahweh is a name. It is descriptive too. it means "I am who I am".

There is a reason why there is no shrine or ritual worship of Edumare. Such worship is accorded only to Orisha and lesser beings.

Lesser beings such as Yhwh who requires sacrifice, has rituals, has a priesthood just like any other lesser deity.

In meeting superior religion the Hebrews later tried to separate yhwh from these lower rituals hence they later developed ideas such as the Ein Soph. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ein_Sof

The Yoruba in fact do worship and address Edumare but not ritualistically. It brings me to tears to see how far my people have come from any knowledge of themselves and of their spiritual knowledge.

Traditionally when we wake up we make Iba. That is obeisance.

For example:

Traditional Mojuba


Iba Se Olodumare Oba a rere "k" aye (Reverence to God that spreads all over the universe)

Iba Se atiyo ojo (Reverence to the dawn of the day)

Iba Se atiwo oorun (Reverence to sunset)

Iba Se ile ogeere a f' oko ye ri (Reverence to Mother Earth)

https://sites.google.com/site/theyorubareligiousconcepts/suyere-prayers/mo-juba-iba

The link is in case you think I'm. making it up. Yoruba don't do anything without praying to Edumare, without acknowledging without making Iba.

Everything you do should be done in praise of Eledumare, he is above ritual and formula and cultic worship. Live your life in worship of Edumare.

Stop equating that stupid ghoul with anything in Yoruba religion.

Babinski:
Eledumare or Olodumare comes from the phrase "O ní odù mà rè" meaning "the owner of the source of creation that does not become empty," "or the All Sufficient". It is clearly a descriptive title and not a specific name for the Supreme God.

Historically, the Yoruba worship Olodumare through the agency of the orisa; thus there is no image, shrine or sacrifice made directly towards Olodumare, who is more or less aloof from the people. As such there is hardly any specific characterization of Olodumare by the Yoruba people.

It is easy to translate Olodumare or Olorun into the Christian God for the Yoruba without much confusion albeit the Christian God brings God much closer to the people with a hand in the affairs of the people as opposed to the removed afar concept of Olodumare being aloof from the people in Yoruba belief system.

Yahweh is a specific name and not a descriptive name or title. I do not see how anyone can equate God much less Yahweh to the Big Bang. The Big Bang is an event and not an entity.

DeepSight:
Olodo. Enslaved, mindless, robotic, colomental capital olodo.

kilo fa gbogbo eyi nisin?
mindless lohun lohun

solid3:
So what's the Yoruba name for Yahweh?

What is the English name for Bolaji?

But it is not just a matter of title vs name. We see that what the Yoruba traditionally refer to as Eledumare is different in character, bearing and conduct from what the christians call God. When they are conflated it creates plenty of room for misunderstanding which is quite irksome to those who originally called their Source of creation Eledumare.

If you say it is all just a name for the source then would you be happy if scientific atheist equated yahweh to Big Bang. After all they are both the source.

There is much about Big Bang besides being the source that makes it unsuitable for equating with yahweh.

Similarly there is much about yahweh which makes him unsuitable and in fact utter irritating when equated with Eledumare.

Babinski:
Olorun means "Lord or Master of the Heavens".
Eledumare means "The Lord of the Creation and the Universe and all that is in it."
Oluwa means "Our Lord"
All the three can be simply translated as God in the English Language from Yoruba. They are not names but titles, since God itself is not a name but a title, just like King is also a title.
When Yoruba Christians sing and praise Olorun, they are praising God. They are praising God the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. They are praising Yahweh.

Yahweh is the name of God the Father in Hebrew. His name is not even pronounced by Jews out of reverence. So you it is not easy to see any song of praise by Jews with Yahweh's name being directly called due to the high revrence for the name.

Your conclusion is wrong because it is based on faulty foundations and erroneous premises. Most religions only have titles for the Supreme God and not direct names. Allah for example is not the name of the Muslim God but rather a title that translates to God in English. And it is understandable because it is difficult for you to ascribe a direct name to someone who is far removed from you like the Supreme God and with whom you have no direct interaction.

Jews historically have a level of direct interaction and affinity with their Supreme God in Judaism in a way that is absent in most religions particularly traditional religions in Africa. So drawing parallels is very difficult.

lawani:
Yes I wanted to say that because if you offer sacrifice to a specific Ogun, then you are worshipping or propitiating the head of that individual. The worship of any Orisa is the worship of Ori since that is a person that existed. It is the Oris that become exceptional that emerge as orisa or prominent Egungun. All ancestors are Egungun and the Egungun institution is to communicate with the ancestors.

Innovation is not bad per se but we should supplement hypothesising with practical experiments. When you come up with a theory, first try it out and if you do and it works then you can report the results to the rest of the world. However if you are going to just theorise blindly then there is no end to human imagination. You'll end up saying the most outlandish things and if anyone follows your theories in practice they may end up hurting themselves seriously.

lawani:
Egungun is ancestor worship which existed in Yoruba land thousands of years before the birth of Alaafin Sango but he may have added some innovations to it though but the same name is what they call it among the Igbowho may have disconnected from the Yoruba for up to five thousand years if not more.

There is a distinction between Egungun Ara Orun. and Egungun Alaso.

But you can serve the Ori of other. people.

Ifa. can. tell a man that if he wants to. prosper he should go and feed the Ori of his wife. This happens a lot. or the ori of a. child.

Meanwhile Babalawo. can help a devotee to serve his Ori. A person that wants to feed his Ori can call his friends to help him to do so.

I don't even know what you. mean when you say 'worship'. Do you mean offering of ębo?

FOLYKAZE:
Yoruba religion system is a home abode for every form of theism including atheism. The only form that breaks away or fail to fall into Yoruba religion system is monotheism because many other Gods are present.

One Ori is a deity. This deity is personal to oneself and does not need other people to gather and worship on your behalf. Orisha are been worshipped unlike Ori by more than one person. Orisha is worshipped among family, society, group and village. This cannot be the case of Ori.

However, the fact you should note here is that there is more than one deity pesent in Yoruba religion system. Deities here are infinite. This is mega-polytheism just like hinduism.

Every individual are knoted to Ori and at least one Orisha. The fact that most people dont worship their orisha doesnt mean they should ne written off.

Irunmole is a Deity. Irunmole mean Irun-Imole. Irun is irinwo which is 400 while Imale are primodial spirits. They are what you call Orisha today. The english word for Orisha is god/deity. This shows that there are more than one god been worship which makes Yoruba religion system a polytheism

Is this is a special thread for Crackheads? I'm reading all sorts of dumb assed things here.

"Eledumare is one of the irunmole but Obatala is not?"

Where did you see a shrine for Eledumare in Yoruba land, abeg?

NNTR:
Smh.
Where in Ezekiel 20:25-26 or elsewhere, in the bible, were the Israelites explicitly asked to give up their firstborns as burning offerings

Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.

Stop smoking crack you this man. Your brain is destroyed. Your soul is lost. You are insane.

NNTR:
You read back to the earlier contributions on this thread.

Start reading from the first page to see early bird contributions done before your JJC DOA contributions

_{Personal text: Jesus is not a theologian. He is God who told stories.}

Dude you made the daft request when I've already shown chapter and verse multiple times. If you want to know the passage go back to where I quoted it numerous times before. If you don't want to know that doesn't bother me either. Na you get your life.

I don't know why you are telling me to read the first page when I didn't ask you anything. Unless you've already started on your pipe very early this morning. Take it easy on the Crack cocaine.

Image123:
You do know Ahab i believe. He is not related to AIO in anyway and i don't know how Ahab is AIO's people. It's a joke that Ahab of all people is referred to as open hearted and honest.
Of course, you do know that Ahab put God's prop

PastorAIO:
Actually it is not well. Not for anyone deceived by Yhwh. It is a dangerous game to play with an entity that is given to mendacity and lying. I see my people going to yhwh with an open heart, making honest enquiries of yhwh, and being led to their destruction thereby.
'[/b]

I wondered why you were suggesting that Ahab was my people but I ignored it because I thought it was just another distraction. But I realise why you say that now. So let me explain.

Perhaps you haven't noticed but I'm a Nigerian. I consider Nigerians and africans in general to be MY PEOPLE. I refer to the deplorable state of my country Nigeria where YHWH has sunk his talons into the minds and souls of much of the population. I see the distress of the people. I hear their prayers and their pleas and supplications. I had an aunt crying in front of me wondering why my cousin, her son, inexplicably died in the prime of his youth, during morning prayers for that matter. She woke him up to pray in the morning. They got on their knees and prayed then he stood up and just collapsed.

I see the correlation between the rise of YHWH religious madness in Nigeria and the worsening conditions of the people. I take a look at the history of Yhwh's worship. I see that it is shortly after Rome adopted Christianity as it's state religion that Rome fell. As Europe embraced it Europe slipped into the dark ages. In order to rise out of this morass the europeans had to embrace humanism and curtail the influence of religion on politics and public life.

I see the wallowing in ignorance across Nigeria with the increased embrace of yhwh and I realise that we have landed ourselves in a very hot pepper soup with the worship of this ghoul. The actual text of the bible confirms that what is happening to us is what should be expected with the worship of this monster.

This is what I mean by my people going to yhwh with open heart and being led to destruction thereby.

Ezekiel 20



25Moreover, I gave them statutes that were not good and rules by which they could not have life, 26and I defiled them through their very gifts in their offering up all their firstborn, that I might devastate them. I did it that they might know that I am the LORD.