Scholar8200:

Interesting! Tell me, how do the worms in this physical Gehenna survive such burning!

Jozzy4:

despite that you still went ahead to say if that was a visible place, google gehenna ( valley of hinnom) and lets know if its a visible place or not ! cheers .

goodnews201668:


It's a valley and not everything gets to the fire when thrown inside Gehenna, hence the fire doesn't consume everything.

The worms then consume anything that the fire didn't consume just like a normal refuse dump where you have worms constantly!
Worms are ever present.

Again Jesus is not talking about hellfire, that's why he mentioned throwing of our body parts,mind you body parts like eyes,legs and so forth.
Jesus said 'cut it out' and throw into......
Than having a complete body parts and not making the kingdom.

Scholar8200:
As for the men that will be cast there, we have other parallel passages that shows they would likewise be tormented forever.

Scholar8200:
so Jesus was saying God will destroy both body and soul in an earthly Gehenna (Matt 10:,28), is that what you are claiming? And man also destroys the body on earth too??


Interesting! So the passage in Isaiah still refers to an Earthly Gehenna after we have a New Earth and Heaven? And since we bury the dead when exactly will God re-cast them to an earthly Gehenna?

Take it easy, must you MIX things up?

All these portions you are quoting has been discussed here.
Matthew 10:28 interestingly didn't mention torment as you guys want to interpret it. Jesus rather used the word fear him that can "destroy" both body and soul.
This means once a person is destroyed by God he has no prospect of life anymore!

Your second question shows you are confused or maybe you have to throw more light.

Revelations 20 is talking about a different thing entirely, however that place definitely doesn't support the false doctrine of hellfire.
And not literal fire, devil,hell and death were hurled into that lake of fire and this is not an ordinary or physical event.
What does it signify?
The Bible answered "this means the second death" unless you don't agree with the Bible or you may want to change it to suit your hellfire belief.
Simple eternal destruction, clear everything bad including the devil.
It might be hard for you to come to terms with these facts, so many other persons didn't find it easy either, I am an example.
But the by is very clear on this issue only if we take out time to examine it with the aid of the holy spirit.




So those in Revelations 20 together with the devil and the beast etc will be cast into an earthly Gehenna with a man made, unquenchable fire?

Tell me, at that time, who will be responsible for keeping the fire burning?

Scholar8200:
point is the passage definitely says the devil, beast and false prophet will be tormented but since the passage is silent on grave etc, i'll be silent too.

Using which reference? As for the men that will be cast there, we have other parallel passages that shows they would likewise be tormented forever.

Scholar8200:
so Jesus was saying God will destroy both body and soul in an earthly Gehenna (Matt 10:,28), is that what you are claiming? And man also destroys the body on earth too??


Interesting! So the passage in Isaiah still refers to an Earthly Gehenna after we have a New Earth and Heaven? And since we bury the dead when exactly will God re-cast them to an earthly Gehenna?





So those in Revelations 20 together with the devil and the beast etc will be cast into an earthly Gehenna with a man made, unquenchable fire?

Tell me, at that time, who will be responsible for keeping the fire burning?

goodnews201668:
All these portions you are quoting has been discussed here. Matthew 10:28 interestingly didn't mention torment as you guys want to interpret it. Jesus rather used the word fear him that can "destroy" both body and soul. This means once a person is destroyed by God he has no prospect of life anymore!

Jozzy4:


interesting, this beast will b tormented

" and I saw a wild beast ascending out of the sea, with ten horns and SEVEN HEADS, and on its horns ten diadems, but on his head blasphemous names"

" Now the wild beast that I saw was like a leopard, but its feet were like those of a bear, and its mouth was like a Lions mouth" - Reve 13:1,2

REALLYYYYYYYYYY?

here is the false prophet another beast too, tell me which zoo am gonna found it

"
Then I saw another wild beast ascending out of the earth, and it had two horns like a lamb, but it began speaking like a dragon. [b] It exercises all the authority of the first wild beast in its sight. And it makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first wild beast, whose mortal wound was healed.
And it performs great signs, even making fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the sight of mankind.
It misleads those who dwell on the earth, because of the signs that it was permitted to perform in the sight of the wild beast, while it tells those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the wild beast that had the sword-stroke and yet revived. And it was permitted to give breath to the image of the wild beast, so that the image of the wild beast should both speak and cause to be killed all those who refuse to worship the image of the wild beast.
" - Rev 13: 11-13

these beasts are real beasts that can be tormented ? unh ?

same reference said Babylon the great , TWO lion like wild beasts will be tormented, HOW REAL IS THAT TO YOU ?

goodnews201668:



Take it easy, must you MIX things up?

All these portions you are quoting has been discussed here.
Matthew 10:28 interestingly didn't mention torment as you guys want to interpret it. Jesus rather used the word fear him that can "destroy" both body and soul.
This means once a person is destroyed by God he has no prospect of life anymore!

Your second question shows you are confused or maybe you have to throw more light.

Revelations 20 is talking about a different thing entirely, however that place definitely doesn't support the false doctrine of hellfire.
And not literal fire, devil,hell and death were hurled into that lake of fire and this is not an ordinary or physical event.
What does it signify?
The Bible answered "this means the second death" unless you don't agree with the Bible or you may want to change it to suit your hellfire belief.

Simple eternal destruction, clear everything bad including the devil.

It might be hard for you to come to terms with these facts, so many other persons didn't find it easy either, I am an example.
But the by is very clear on this issue only if we take out time to examine it with the aid of the holy spirit.

Scholar8200:

Let's see:

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him [the beast] his power, and his seat, and great authority

Rev. 13:2

The last sentence reveals that the beast here is the Man of sin Paul mentioned in 2 Thessa 2; same is the prince in Daniel 9 now Rev speaks of 42 months while Daniel says 3.5 years do the maths and see that they are both saying the same thing and referring to the same person whose coming is after the working of satan. That is clear. Now the Lake of fire that torments eternally is the same in all parallel verses from Isaiah to Matthew, Mark, Luke and Revelations!

they are men that will be tormented afterwards.

Besides , read Daniel 7:17 and SEE that Nebuchadnezzar, Alexander the Great, Etc were also symbolized by Beasts!

Scholar8200:

Go read Revelations 20:12-15 and discern how the dead will STAND before God.

Jozzy4:


trash, see the bold , perfect description of an animal . the dragon give this animal or beast his power and authority

how then can a BEAST be MAN of sin ?



the bible said BEAST , with two horns like a lamb.

how then can a BEAST be men ?



whats your point, that the beast SYMBOLIZE men ?

Jozzy4:


thats not her question: , she said


do u believe also that the two hands, two feet s and two eyes of a man go to hell with him ?

she said if thats true, why is it that nobodys hands, feet and eyes have dissapeared in their coffin ? let me add that in most burials , the dead at kept for sometimes before the burial day . so why are these body parts not dissapearing to hell ?

Scholar8200:

The essence here is that we establish what is a symbol and what is not.
Daniel 7:17
These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth

Parallel verses show that the beast so described is a man, a ruler. While parallel verses show that the fire of torment means exactly that.
Indeed the same Revelations describes Jesus as a Lamb as it had been slain found in the midst of the Throne!

Scholar8200:

Christ there referred to the temporal and the final. Remember that the rich man lifted his EYES IN HELL AND ASKED FOR WATER TO COOL HIS TONGUE!

Scholar8200:

And what will the never-dying worms be doing? Remember the story of Lazarus that the rich man was tormented in the flame.(not an earthly gehenna).
second death-eternal torment in a lake of fire- and the devil will be involved!


While the worms will be kept alive? Dont be preposterous!



Jesus clearly said the fire will never be quenched and the worms will not die, Revelations also said they will be tormented and HAVE NO REST day or night fOREVER!!!

WHY WOULD IT TALK OF NO REST IF THEY WOULD BE CONSUMED
Revelation 14:10,11
10 the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 and the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

goodnews201668:


You seem not get it, Gehenna of Matthew 10:28 is different from the lake of fire mentioned in revelation.

They all figurative.

Gehenna is not a place for eternal torment, jesus said ones soul and body can be destroyed their.
He also talked about cutting off of one's body parts like eyes, legs and so and throwing it inside Gehenna so he is not saying that our eyes or other parts thrown inside their will be tormented.
That shows the fire symbolises destruction, in other words Jesus is saying destroy those things be it body parts that will make you loose the kingdom.

Again Revelation's lake of fire is not the same as Gehenna,
It's says hell and death will be thrown inside,
Again it's symbolic.
What does it symbolize? The Bible clearly stated it means "second death" or final destruction.

So the two portins doesn't support hellfire!

Jozzy4:


wow, Eyes and tongue, ... properties of an immaterial soul ?


this is getting interesting

Jozzy4:


that means the beast are not literal beast, the question is : how then can Symbolic beast be cast into a literal lake of fire ? if the Beast is symbolic , does that not make the lake of fire into which this symbolic beast is thrown symbolic too ?

Scholar8200:

Let's see:

2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority
Rev. 13:2

Scholar8200:

Sir, consider this:
10 the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 and the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name Revelations 14:10,11 I believe this is clear enough and agrees with both Matthew 10 and Revelations 20

DoctorAlien:


Compare Malachi 4:1,3. Can the wicked be alive and still be ashes?

Scholar8200:
Jesus clearly said the fire will never be quenched and the worms will not die, Revelations also said they will be tormented and HAVE NO REST day or night fOREVER!!!

Scholar8200:

NO, this is where parallel passages come in!

They establish the beast to be a king/ruler, man of sin, son of perdition etc but the fire to be a literal place of torment!

See below, no symbol this:
10 the same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone...11 and the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name
Revelation 14:10,11
Sealeth up the sum!

Scholar8200:

Now when the devil and the people from the four quarters of the earth try to fight after the millenial reign, this will happen and is Malachi's ref:


And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them
Revelation 20:9

This would happen before the Lake of fire judgement where all including those thus consumed will be cast into the lake of fire.

So Malachi 4 is a scene on earth, not referring to the Lake of fire.

Scholar8200:

Now when the devil and the people from the four quarters of the earth try to fight after the millenial reign, this will happen and is Malachi's ref:


And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them
Revelation 20:9

This would happen before the Lake of fire judgement where all including those thus consumed will be cast into the lake of fire.

So Malachi 4 is a scene on earth, not referring to the Lake of fire.

Scholar8200:
So Malachi 4 is a scene on earth, not referring to the Lake of fire.

Scholar8200:

Sure, Jesus said so.

Jozzy4:


Mixjanet point that Jesus said her point too. so u have no excuse.

the tongue is a material property, when a man dies , it follow him to his Grave to decompose

so tell me, which tongue are you talking about? cos have not seen a dead man whose tongue disappeared.

this Link to the other question, why are the eyes, two feet and two eyes not vanishing to hell, why are they still found in the coffin?

DoctorAlien:


Where is this lake of fire?