tintingz:
Oh yeah, Mr. Tu'baba this is what we tell the non-muslims, it is not new to me as I've defended this with the Christians in the past. The terror in the hadith's is NOT different from that of old testament bible. In fact I knew this as a Muslim then(even many Muslims too) I just defend the hadith for whatever sake. Ofcos there are times early Muslims fought for self-defense and there are many times they went conquering nations just for them to accept Allah, Muhammad (SA) and Islam, the hadith Albaqir posted is an example.

And NOTE my post here was not about Islam but the so called hadith.

And forcing people with terror to accept Islam is part of good thing? Go and read the hadith with open mind, I've done that and they don't make any sense to me.

What gave birth to boko haram, ISIS, Al-shabab and co?

Which context again? Those words are plain and clear like guguru and epa, read the hadith Albaqir quoted again imagine a Prophet said to be "mercy to mankind" made this statement "I've been made victorious with terror". I will accept this statement if it was Adolf Hitler.

And was the Quran not completed?

OK thanks.

Demmzy15:
His case is just pathetic, whenever he sees no one is falling his Shia propaganda, he quickly shifts to just misguide. If you don't subscribe to my shi'i teachings, then you must be misguided at all cost.

AlBaqir:


You better don't develop Armageddon of the brain with your "albaqir-shia imaginary thinking".

# Gbogbo yin sun ekori sibikan naa ni.

# Kuffar waging war with Muslim, and Muslims defending themselves with orders from the Quran as you and brothers posted those beautiful ayah. I don't have any problem with that. And that has never been my point of submission as you want the worlds to believe.

tintingz:
Real brainwahed program and it obviously happening till date.

Thank God many south-west Muslims here in Nigeria don't know about this brainwashed program , we would have end up like the northern part of Nigeria.

Sissie:
people have conquered people all over history for different reasons.

Religion, Democracy, Colonialism, etc etc.

Really we could chose to go along sunni shia divide anytime anyday. however there are things we can all agree on.

What is wrong in conquering people during that time to accept islam, lets note the conquering happened during early muslims, not neccesarily during the time of the Prophet. They fought wars during the Prophet's time and it was mostly for self defence. and during war you let your enemies fear you. this is standard.

during any war, either when the mongols were conquering lands, it was done striking fear and terror into people.


Now we all can agree ISIS and the rest arent muslims and they arent at war either. they are animals and there is more than just religion regarding ISIS, this is a fact.

AlBaqir:


# Madam, nobody is questioning the defensive wars Muslim fought against the Kuffar. In fact that's not even the subject matter at all.

# The truth is post-Nabi era was full of blood and terrorism at the hands of Muslims disturbing the peace of the world in the name of Islam and the Prophet. They justify these acts with various ahadith some of which have been posted above.

# Saying ISIS, BOKO HARAM etc are not Muslim is a way of running away from the truth. Are they pagan or christian or Jew? They are Muslims no doubt about that. And all their atrocities (terror attack, slavery, child forced marriage, etc) are justified by what is written in "Islamic" books of jurisdictions. Here's one out of many:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reliance_of_the_Traveller

AlBaqir:


You better don't develop Armageddon of the brain with your "albaqir-shia imaginary thinking".

# Gbogbo yin sun ekori sibikan naa ni.

# Kuffar waging war with Muslim, and Muslims defending themselves with orders from the Quran as you and brothers posted those beautiful ayah. I don't have any problem with that. And that has never been my point of submission as you want the worlds to believe.

AlBaqir:


# Madam, nobody is questioning the defensive wars Muslim fought against the Kuffar. In fact that's not even the subject matter at all.

# The truth is post-Nabi era was full of blood and terrorism at the hands of Muslims disturbing the peace of the world in the name of Islam and the Prophet. They justify these acts with various ahadith some of which have been posted above.

# Saying ISIS, BOKO HARAM etc are not Muslim is a way of running away from the truth. Are they pagan or christian or Jew? They are Muslims no doubt about that. And all their atrocities (terror attack, slavery, child forced marriage, etc) are justified by what is written in "Islamic" books of jurisdictions. Here's one out of many:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reliance_of_the_Traveller

Sissie:
there are hadiths i disagree with or better put i don't understand its context etc. and some i have come to understand are best understood when explained.

Some are often twisted similar to how some muslims twist the some verses, until a muhadith explain better and u will be like ohhhhh.

is al baqir saying he agrees with all the Al kafi? because i can give myself jb and go and start finding faults in it, i am sure i will see. when you look at something with the mindset of finding faults, you will see faults thats how the human mind work

AlBaqir:

[s]

Millions of Africans were enslaved by the Arabs under
that aspect of the so-called "Islamic" law.

The interesting part is: every Islamic country has abolished
slavery, declaring it a criminal act. By contrast, most of
these so-called "Islamic" clerics still consider it permissible
and humane.

Secondly, Islamic scholars definitely promote child marriage and NONE of them has ever directly condemned slavery.

They believe that it is part of the Shari'ah. Let me do it this
way. I am sure you are aware that most Islamic scholars
believe that the world is divided into two parts only:

1. Dar as-Salam (peace zone): This refers to countries under Shari'ah rule.

2. Dar al-Harb (warzone): This refers to every country with
no Shari'ah government.

If you study some books of Islamic jurisprudence, it is said
that anyone you kill in the warzone territories (e.g. Europe,
America, etc), you are excused. OK. Let us say some
Muslim fundamentalists decide to wage war against a
warzone country "to bring Islam" to them. If the warzone
country loses the war, all the males in it are either
massacred or enslaved, and the women are turned into sex
slaves. These are rulings you find in books of Islamic
jurisprudence (if you care to read any).

As for child marriage, most Islamic scholars believe that it
is perfectly OK to have sex with an 8-year-old child-bride.
Ask any of them to condemn the practice and he will
instantly excommunicate you from Islam.

Personally, I reject these interpretations of Islam and the so-called "authentic ahadith" upon which they are based.[/s]

Sissie:


what brainwashed program. you need to go and reset your brain.

the northern part of nigeria has so many things the south west can learn from and vice versa. dont let tribalism blind you. even with the high level of education in the south there are so many things lacking starting from the family unit.

Sissie:


one and two i agree with.

three point. yes they arent muslims, they may say they are and justify with the islamic books. that still doesnt make them muslims, because we all know thats not what the books say, and theyve stepped over the limits. they dont justify with hadiths only, they also justify with quran. you and i can both atleast agree thats not what the Quran says,

even thou ISIS subscribe to the sunni creed, if we look back at history we will see the shias and sunnis has there contributions. even in today syria, sunnis and shia have both contributed, so we can do that blame game all day

i dont really on wikipedia too much anyone can edit, if yu have another link pls share

Sissie:
is @tintingz no longer a muslim ni? he sounds like he isnt?

he said "In fact I knew this as a Muslim then(even many Muslims too) I just defend "

tintingz:
The brainwash program we see causing mayhem, chaos in the northern part of Nigeria.

What I posted is/was just the plain reality, I apologize if it sound tribalism, I'm not a tribalist.

The thing is, the religious orientation in the south-west is different from that of north, although there are religious discrimination in the west but the north is way higher.

Mosque and church in south-west can be in the same compound, vicinity without no clash, people live in harmony, in the north it is a different story. Why this in the north? Is it because of the preachings they pass to the northern people or what?

Southwest people marry each other like my mum she was a christian before she married my Muslim father, imagine having christian family and Muslim family.

Sissie:
@albaqir even till today there are people who hide under islamic laws to do all sorts. but we all can agree its not islamic but cultural. they think there is no divide between islamic and cultural law, and a good example is how women are treated.

there are lots of cultural laws that have been painted with religious brush
this we can agree on.

Sissie:
people have conquered people all over history for different reasons.

Religion, Democracy, Colonialism, etc etc.

Really we could chose to go along sunni shia divide anytime anyday. however there are things we can all agree on.

What is wrong in conquering people during that time to accept islam, lets note the conquering happened during early muslims, not neccesarily during the time of the Prophet. They fought wars during the Prophet's time and it was mostly for self defence. and during war you let your enemies fear you. this is standard.

during any war, either when the mongols were conquering lands, it was done striking fear and terror into people.


Now we all can agree ISIS and the rest arent muslims and they arent at war either, i mean real war, because who are they fighting against? they are fools and thats me being mild they are animals and there is more than just religion regarding ISIS, this is a fact.

AlBaqir:


Heh...bro. E be like say you no know wetin dey go on again in the southwest. We now have a lots of troglodytes. There are lots of fatawa manufacturers declaring anything and anybody that doesn't follow their idea "Bid'ah".

# Today, many youths in various higher institutions are following these troglodytes in the name of Sunnah.

# One of them, Jabata has publicly declared that if he has power today, he will excommunicate or kill all the "Bid'ah-tists." E even declared his thugs very ready.

Those in Ibadan can also tell a lot about another troglodyte called Abu Ibeji. These are blood thirsty vampires ready to kill anybody in the name of Islam. And obviously they have "justifications" galore in the book of ahadith and fatawa of the Salafs.

tintingz:
And if you study these Dracula Muslim leaders either they are not from southwest or study outside southwest.

AlBaqir:


They have brought "cave-thinking" and backwardness to
humanity, destroyed livelihoods and nations, and spread
terror and hate across the globe.


# Narrated Abu Huraira:

Allah's Messenger said, "I have been sent with the shortest expressions bearing the widest meanings, AND I HAVE
BEEN MADE VICTORIOUS WITH TERROR (cast in the hearts of the enemy), and while I was sleeping, the keys of the treasures of the world were brought to me and put in my hand."

Sahih al-Bukhari 2977


# Narrated Ibn 'Umar:

Allah's Messenger said: "I have been ordered (by Allah) to
fight against the people until they testify that none has the
right to be worshipped but Allah and that Muhammad is
Allah's Messenger, and offer the prayers perfectly and give
the obligatory charity, so if they perform that, then they save their lives and property from me except for Islamic laws and then their reckoning (accounts) will be done by Allah."

Sahih al-Bukhari 25

tintingz:
The brainwash program we see causing mayhem, chaos in the northern part of Nigeria.

What I posted is/was just the plain reality, I apologize if it sound tribalism, I'm not a tribalist.

The thing is, the religious orientation in the south-west is different from that of north, although there are religious discrimination in the west but the north is way higher.

Mosque and church in south-west can be in the same compound, vicinity without no clash, people live in harmony, in the north it is a different story. Why this in the north? Is it because of the preachings they pass to the northern people or what?

Southwest people marry each other like my mum she was a christian before she married my Muslim father, imagine having christian family and Muslim family.

AlBaqir:


# I agree with you 100% but am afraid that doesn't move a troglodyte.

# For example, child marriage (8 - 9 year old child). What's your take on it, sincerely. Both Shia and Sunni have authentic ahadith that a 8 - 9 year Old child is ready for marriage.

tintingz:
So you support early Muslims conquering nations? Do you know the meaning when a group conquer another group and keep slaves?

Terror comes with violent, destructive(which is the same as terrorism) so saying Prophet Muhammad(SA) was a mercy to mankind is irony, it should be a terror to mankind(from hadith perspective)

And lastly, ISIS ARE MUSLIMS.

tintingz:

What gave birth to boko haram, ISIS, Al-shabab and co?

"I've been made victorious with terror". I will accept this statement if it was Adolf Hitler.

And was the Quran not completed?

OK thanks.

Sissie:


wat you are saying and wat tintingz is saying is different at least to me. dont let the shia and sunni divide block that

Demmzy15:
[font=serif]Lol, so the kuffar can always be on the offensive while Muslims should be on the defense (!?) You see why I saw your thinking is messed up? What's wrong if Muslims go on offensive against some of the kuffar especially when it is known they're dangerous?