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Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 9:59pm On Jul 08, 2017 |
true2god: Now, what logical input have you made. Let's see the logical input. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by true2god: 3:41am On Jul 09, 2017 |
JMAN05:If you fail to produce any in the next 24 hours will you accept that you are a fool and equally deceptive? 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by true2god: 3:57am On Jul 09, 2017 |
JMAN05:Can you really 'hear' yourself here? How can you take assumptions as facts in order to present your view? The phrases 'must have been' and 'she may have even' are still guess works by you which hold no water. She is not a good reference of course, but does not mean there are not thousands of women that are good reference. For the fact that JW held a stereotype view about women, using Paul's letter as an excuse, is not reasonable on the part of JW. And I'm 100% sure that if JW governing body change their view on this issue (especially if the light gets 'brighter') you will comply immediately. You should learn how to reason independently without always waiting for the 'spiritual meals' from the JW authorities in Brooklyn New York, whose cookings (the doctrines they have shunned out) is subject to changes and modifications anytime, as soon as the 'light becomes brighter'. |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by orunto27: 6:57am On Jul 09, 2017 |
Women Pastors are Big Time Witches. |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by UnchangeableGod: 10:12am On Jul 09, 2017 |
true2god:A woman can be appointed by a man to teach in the church in the absence of a capable man but a woman cannot be the General Overseer of a ministry. Thanks. |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by UnchangeableGod: 10:23am On Jul 09, 2017 |
Martinez19:The point is that a woman should not be in charge of a Congregation. However, a woman can be appointed by a man to lead in songs/praise worship, lead in prayers, moderate or teach as the case may be especially where there is no capable man available. Thanks. |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by UnchangeableGod: 10:27am On Jul 09, 2017 |
Hairyrapunzel:Your last sentence is the main point: a woman should not be in charge of a Congregation but can lead in prayers, teach or preach as directed by a man. |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by UnchangeableGod: 10:36am On Jul 09, 2017 |
Jhaytee4all:Such women you referred to are either not born again or backsliders. A true Christian woman can teach or preach under the directive of a man who should be the superior officer in the Church. Thanks. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 11:37pm On Jul 09, 2017 |
JMAN05:It's me who should have a long time ago asked you this ''What here do you not understand?'' question Forgive me. I continue to underestimate the depth of your ignorance on this subject matter JMAN05:I will make this easier for both of us Produce a list of saint/believers in the NT, explicitly and specifically addressed as pastor/shepherd JMAN05:This more the reason, why I asked you to produce where in the NT is the WORD "Pastor" itself Its common knowledge that there is no ''pastor'' in NT, and that's why I warned you not to interchange "Pastor" with ''shepherd'' but you still went ahead using ''shepherd'', knowing well that you will look in vain for the word ''pastor'' in NT JMAN05: Yes and that's why I've been pointing out that, the word ''Pastor or pastor'' is reserved only for Jesus, as a title and especially so when used as a noun Saints/believers when gifted with ''how to feed'' the flock (e.g. pastors and teachers) are carrying out function as in pastoring/shepherding verb wise and not given titles The noun and at title is for Jesus PMSL. Surely you cant be serious refuting pastor used as noun for Jesus and pastoring/shepherding used as verb in relation to saints/believers If you are, then clearly, I am no match for the level of ignorance you've so far doggedly pursued and all along been displaying The below is your 18 pitiful attempts in listing where pastor (i.e. in singular) is mentioned in NT 1/ Matthew 9:36 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - About without Jesus 2/ Matthew 25:32 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 3/ Matthew 26:31 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 4/ Mark 6:34 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of when without Jesus 5/ Mark 14:27 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 6/ Luke 2:8 Greek poimenes, English shepherds. Noun - Before Jesus' birth 7/ Luke 2:15 Greek poimenes, English shepherds. Noun - Leave to Jesus' birthplace 8/ Luke 2:18 Greek poimenes, English shepherds. Noun - Talked of Jesus' birth 9/ Luke 2:20 Greek poimenes, English shepherds. Noun - Back from Jesus' birthplace 10/ John 10:2 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 11/ John 10:11a Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 12/ John 10:11b Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 13/ John 10:12 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 14/ John 10:14 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 15/ John 10:16 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 16/ Ephesians 4:11 Latin pastoris, English pastors/shepherds. Noun - Figuratives, feeding human souls 17/ Hebrews 13:20 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus 18/ 1 Peter 2:25 Greek poimena, English a shepherd. Noun - Talking of Jesus The less people know of a subject matter, the more stubbornly they think they know it Take this as an unexpected learning opportunity See, no pastor (i.e. as in verbatim and in singular) mentioned in NT JMAN05:I dont care what KJV, all I cared about and asked you was to give me where in NT the word pastor (i.e. in singular) is used and specifically warned you in advance not to interchange the word pastor (i.e. in singular) with the word shepherd JMAN05: What else can I do here than to just laugh this off JMAN05:I cant believe you wrote this You must be working really hard to remain ignorant Go over 1 Peter 5:2 and Acts 20:28 again for proof, You'll find out that it is poimaino (i.e. verb) that's used and not poimena, (i.e. noun) that's used concerning the elders For He is our God, and we are the people of His pasture, the sheep under His care. Today, if you hear His voice: - Psalm 95:7 And you are my sheep, human sheep of my pasture, and I am your God, declares the Lord GOD.” - Ezekiel 34:31 The One and Only Shepherd (i.e. the One and Only Pastor) of souls is the self-existing all-powerful authority influence known as God I wont go further than this on God, if I do, it'll leave you squirming JMAN05:Like a fluttering sparrow or a darting swallow, an undeserved curse does not come to rest - Proverbs 26:2 You're not only now making this personal but also already gone grumpy on me and having a fit of the sulks too 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 11:38pm On Jul 09, 2017 |
JMAN05:Wetin, wetin Ko ara e da soun. Hold on to your knickers jor. Ki la ngbe gan, ti oun yedi? "They" is a singular pronoun OK, tell. Is couple singular or plural? Couple is a singular noun and so therefore the "they" referring to the anonymous, one couple, in 1 Timothy 2: 11-12,14-15 is a singular pronoun JMAN05:Here we go again making this personal What have I to do with Calvin? Rather than facing reality and recognise the truth, you're palming me off to Calvin. What are you trying to insinuate or achieve with the ''It is from your scholars'' remark? SMH Your ignorance is seriously cramping any worthwhile contribution I try putting out Just put Calvin aside, if you really want to understand 1 Timothy 2:15 or know the true and proper gist behind Paul's ''she will be saved through childbearing'' remark (i.e. the saved during the process of giving birth to children remark) I am not keen on going into details about the ''she will be saved through childbearing'' remark as it will not only take pages trying to explain but will also take a lot of time I will however advise, you look up who and what Artemis of the Ephesians (i.e. Acts 19:1-37) is Look into the alleged role she performs during child bearing (i.e. sparing, saving and protecting women from death during childbirth) and/or of her strong connection with childbirth in Ephesus There always is a point that you cross You have to move beyond a dot 2 dots at random might give you a line or pattern 3 dots joined together however will make a picture so, my friend, why not connect dots then You'll get the picture, bro, after simply joining the goddess, Artemis of the Ephesians, Genesis 3:16 and Genesis 4:1 dots together JMAN05:Yes, of course, I am saying the same thing that Paul in his layered advices, switched from the use ''men'' and ''rich or privileged women'' (i.e. he used plurals) in 1 Timothy 2:8-10 to deliberately and decidedly using ''woman'', ''man'' and ''she'' (i.e. these are singulars) in 1 Timothy 2: 11-12,14-15. You do see, accept and agree that there is a switch from plural to singular, dont you? JMAN05:Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and love and holiness with sobriety. - 1 Timothy 2:15 How is it possible you say, that ''they'' refers to women as a whole? Your assertion that ''they'' refers to women as a whole is disjointed because you arent just not following through the different and changing pronouns in 1 Timothy 2: 11-12,14-15. but also not closely connecting the switches from singular to plural as they should be ''she'' (i.e. the anonymous woman in 1 Timothy 2:11-12) will be saved . . . provided they (i.e. the anonymous man and woman couple, in 1 Timothy 2:11-12) continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control (i.e. soundness of mind) 1 Timothy 2:15's ''she shall be saved'' is a singular verb, referring to one woman that she will be saved ''if they continue'', on the other hand, is a plural verb and singular pronoun/singular they, saying if the anonymous man and woman couple of 1 Timothy 2:11-12 continue in faith and love and holiness, with self-control (i.e. soundness of mind) then the woman will be saved Why didn't Paul just use ''they'' on both ocassions, if he really was writing about/ to women as a whole? Hmm? ''she'' and “they” (i.e. the singular and plural verbs) cant both refer to women as a whole. It'll be grammatically incorrect if it did 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 8:07pm On Jul 11, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: You have issues with parts of speech. That's glaring. There isn't any anonymous couple in that chapter. Whether you are also seeing vision, I don't know. Here we go again making this personal I will look that up for knowledge sake. however, it doesn't have any connection to the discussion. There always is a point that you cross There is no connection to the discussion I find there. Yes, of course, I am saying the same thing that Paul in his layered advices, switched from the use ''men'' and ''rich or privileged women'' (i.e. he used plurals) in 1 Timothy 2:8-10 to deliberately and decidedly using ''woman'', ''man'' and ''she'' (i.e. these are singulars) in 1 Timothy 2: 11-12,14-15. I do. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, Where did you get this anonymous couple from? 1 Timothy 2:15's ''she shall be saved'' is a singular verb, referring to one woman that she will be saved What are you referring to as a singular verb there? ''if they continue'', on the other hand, is a plural verb and singular pronoun/singular they, Continue is plural verb, but "they" is plural pronoun. If you don't want to tell yourself the truth, I ll withdraw from this discussion. Why didn't Paul just use ''they'' on both ocassions, if he really was writing about/ to women as a whole? Hmm? The "they" is informing you that what he said immediately above doesn't refer to one woman, but women. His subject was role of men and women in the congregation. So, in discussing women, he used they to show that what he said above apply to all women. Some translations worded it in a way it came clearly: An American Translation says "but they will be saved through motherhood, if they continue to have faith..." A New Translation of The Bible by Moffatt says "However, women will be safely through childbirth, f they continue to be faithful..." The New Testament A Translation in the Language of the people reads: "But women will be saved through motherhood..." So that place is referring to women as a whole. If these and the commentary doesn't convince you, then let it slide. ''she'' and “they” (i.e. the singular and plural verbs) cant both refer to women as a whole. You have issues with parts of speech. It helps to consult ones note you know. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 10:32pm On Jul 11, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: The fact is, you didnt read my comment well. Thats why you think we were saying the same thing. I bolded what i meant and you were still reading what you mean inside what i meant. Its not my fault. Read well next time. The issue am after is "pastor" as a noun and not whether it is singular or plural. Your position is that the word is not applied to any other person than Christ. Although i made some error above, yet your point is not proven yet, as in, that Jesus alone has the title "pastor". There is no " pastor/shepherd" (singular) applied to a saint as you posit. You were right on that. I was wrong. That is, if we are discussing "pastor/shepherd" specifically in singular. However, stating that "pastor/shepherd" (noun) as a title is not applied to saints is wrong. Why? Eph 4:11 where you know the title pastors applied to some saints, it would be wrong to say such title is not applied to any saint because it occurred in the plural. That is very wrong. I ve seen no proof for that. Go over 1 Peter 5:2 and Acts 20:28 again for proof, You are right. Its verb. I was wrong. For He is our God, and we are the people of His pasture, the sheep under His care. There is no doubt that Jehovah is the Supreme Shepherd. However, he has also instructed some humans to shepherd His sheep. Although it occurred as a verb, one who shepherds a sheep is a shepherd. Secondly, Eph 4:11 identifies humans as such. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 11:07pm On Jul 11, 2017 |
true2god: They are not guess works, they are reasonable possibilities. She is not authorised to teach jna church service, so there are other areas in which she can teach that are not church service. No one can say which type was what she did, but what I have given are possibilities. That she taught in a church service isn't part of the options. Jesus commandment with regards to women is clear. No demon can restate that. She is not a good reference of course, but does not mean there are not thousands of women that are good reference. For the fact that JW held a stereotype view about women, using Paul's letter as an excuse, is not reasonable on the part of JW. And I'm 100% sure that if JW governing body change their view on this issue (especially if the light gets 'brighter') you will comply immediately. No gov body changes are without sound reason. If you present good proofs for your claim, my dear I will accept it, Gov Body or no Gov Body. I didn't dedicate my life to a GB. That being said, get to work and stop laziness. Give me scriptural proofs. You should learn how to reason independently without always waiting for the 'spiritual meals' from the JW authorities in Brooklyn New York, whose cookings (the doctrines they have shunned out) is subject to changes and modifications anytime, as soon as the 'light becomes brighter'. This is a logical fallacy called Ad hominem (circumstantial). The claim holds no water in a logical discussion. So grow up and learn to offer reasons for your stand instead of appealing to motives. You have your church, I can equally accuse you that what you say stems from your religious affiliation. Excuse from lazy people who can't prove there point. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 11:41pm On Jul 12, 2017 |
JMAN05:Seeing visions? My man got jokes JMAN05:Dont be too hasty to make dismissive remarks before doing your looking that up for knowledge sake JMAN05:You will eat these words Personally I would've dropped a comment after looking up for knowledge sake JMAN05:Good JMAN05:You scoop petroleum from the surface Pick up diamonds on the ground. Pearls float on water surface isnt it You've fallen victim to surface level bible reading and studying Remember particular letter Paul wrote to Timothy started at 1 Timothy 1 and not 1 Timothy 2 Paul began 1 Timothy 1, by first reminding Timothy of how he told Timothy to stay at Ephesus so Timothy can stop men teaching strange doctrines (i.e. false teaching) Fast forward 1 Timothy 1 to 1 Timothy 2, things have gone from bad to worse I'll leave you after your knowledge quest to draw in the line to the goddess (i.e. Artemis of the Ephesians), Genesis 3:16 and Genesis 4:1 dots JMAN05:What is a verb? - a word used to describe an action, condition, experience, state, occurrence and forming the main part of the predicate of a sentence such as hear, become, happen, shall be saved When a singular subject (i.e. she) gives you singular verb ''she shall be saved'' It is that singular subject, one woman, who is, will be saved JMAN05:What gender is ''couple''? Please give me an answer now "They" is a singular pronoun OK, tell. Is couple singular or plural? Couple is a singular noun, firstly, because ''couple'' has no gender Secondly, because ''couple'' here is one and so therefore the "they" referring to the anonymous, one couple, in 1 Timothy 2: 11-12,14-15 is a singular pronoun JMAN05:Why arent I surprised you're sticking to your unloaded guns JMAN05:SMH It really is true that theology does influence our translation 2 Likes |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 11:42pm On Jul 12, 2017 |
JMAN05:You might pride yourself but I never thought, think or say we were saying the same thing JMAN05:And I am telling the issue you're after is a non issue because there is no pastor (i.e. verbatim like that) in the New Testament JMAN05:110% bible correct JMAN05:I hear you. Continue upadan be calling yourselves pastor(s) then JMAN05:Learning is never done without errors Thank you for being gracious. Your honesty is admirable. but hey anytime you read saints concerning " (i.e. doing, action thing) not as a noun (i.e. title, office things) JMAN05:My brother, if you want to be called and prepend your names with Pastor, that's fine. You arent answerable to me. You wont be giving account and explaining yourself to me JMAN05:Well... JMAN05:Just because the Shepherd asked you to feed His flock in absentia, then that automatically and officially makes you a shepherd Yeah right. 2 Likes |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 6:01pm On Jul 15, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: I don't think we have anything here again to discuss. You don't posit that elders cant be called shepherds. Yes, no human should be given such as a title. But eph4:11 occurs as a noun. If you don't object to this, the discussion is done with. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 6:07pm On Jul 15, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: You haven't given any prove yet. No anonymous couple occur in the place we are discussing. I don't see the role of Artemis on what we are discussing. Only if you give relevance of your point to the issue being disccused can I reply your comments. If can't show its relevance, then the discussion is over. I can't reply to what I don't know its relevance. Check the purpose of the thread and reply accordingly. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 9:31am On Jul 16, 2017 |
JMAN05:Imagine if my hands werent gloved I have continually posited that elders CANT be called shepherds Elders are called to shepherd the flock, isnt same as, elders are called shepherds The former is whats expected of elders and not the latter JMAN05:Good you accept this. Not even Shepherd, right? At least you're consistent, in keeping slowly coming around JMAN05:There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male and female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus - Galatians 3:28 But Eph 4:11 occurs as a noun is a specious argument Pity its in plural though but then I guess that's your one and only lifeline. and no where else would you find this repeated PSML, a drowning man will clutch at a straw JMAN05:We are here to feed the sheep, not to entertain the goats but if you, now, feel like leaving, I am not going to stop you Soon you'll find that running away or hiding was futile because someday, you'll look back and suddenly know exactly all that's discussed so far 2 Likes |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 9:31am On Jul 16, 2017 |
JMAN05:The change from using plural to using singular, is the proof, that Paul is addressing an unnamed woman in 1 Timothy 2:11-12 JMAN05:You're in denial and, unwilling, though harsh it maybe, to accept reality No, not just any ordinary Artemis but talking of this particular goddess, called, Artemis of the Ephesians (i.e. this goddess, known as Artemis of the Ephesians, is that prominent enough, to be actually mentioned, at least 5 times, in Acts 19) Things are never as straightforward as we might at first imagined my friend When you put the pieces together, you will see the role of the goddess, Artemis of the Ephesians on what's being discussed Paul is debunking the woman's teaching and refusing to allow this woman a platform to spread & promote her false teaching(s) JMAN05:Unfortunately I am not big into spoon feeding grown ups You have no choice than to back out because you've ran out of steam. You're unable to piece the story together. You're in water, too deep to stand in and to make matters worse, you havent got a lifebuoy So swim back to shore, whilst you still can, before the undercurrent overwhelms you JMAN05:A pastor is a Shepherd, and women are not reckoned as such in the bible So why do some churches have female pastors. Does it mean that they don't read the bible? 1 Tim 2:11-12 - © JMAN05 The above is your intro sentence It is repeated here to highlight, there is no purpose to a thread that begins with a tautology On several fronts, the thread is DOA (i.e. dead on arrival) and shouldnt have warranted being accorded any replies Aside you starting off on the wrong foot with the tautology thing, women and men are not Shepherd The proper case Shepherd, you used in the sentence after your tautology, is used only for God and not used for humans (i.e. Shepherd is not and never used for any man or woman) You mentioned: ''some churches have female pastors'' then asked: ''Does it mean that they don't read the bible'' and ended with: quoting 1 Tim 2:11-12, obviously referrring to 1 Tim 2:12's ''I do not permit a woman to teach...'' to make a point That last sentence, above, from your intro post, too, has another faux pas So please, here is a question, I am extremely anxious for you to reply to: Do women sing songs in ekklessia, ''church'', congregation or sing songs in Jehovah Witness gatherings, where men are present? 2 Likes |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by orunto27: 10:36am On Jul 16, 2017 |
Everything is done by Faith. |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 8:03pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: Such a weak point. The context is about the role of men and women in the church. No prove of your anonymous couple. I have given different translations of the bible and a commentary that shows "they" refers to women, but no, you still see vision. You're in denial No you are the one in denial to accept the truth. You are still in a phantasm, seeing what doesn't exist. I have given different biblntranslati No, not just any ordinary Artemis There isn't any prove that this is what Paul was doing. Artemis isn't a living woman in Ephesus during Paul's day. So what are you saying?
Instead of you to go straight to the point, and offer proves, you are here exposing your ignorance. How can you use "men and women" and also used "are" and now accompany it with a singular noun? 'Shepherd is not used for any man or woman?' My op used "pastors". You agree that " pastors" refers to some saints, yet you call the op tautology. Even after quoting a phrase, you still don't see clearly. Keep shooting yourself. When Eph 4:11 used it. It was used for animals, not humans? Or you think that when the word is used for more than one human, it should appear in the singular? When someone's work is to Shepherd a sheep, that person is not the same as a shepherd? Haughtiness is blinding you. It appears that when I admitted to a mistake, you allowed that to increase your ego. You mentioned: ''some churches have female pastors'' Women are not permitted to teach in a church service, such feeding is left for men. You are here asking about singing. Don't see the connection. |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 8:20pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: If ones work is to feed the flock, he is a shepherd. Agreed? Good you accept this. Yap because Jesus condemn religious titles for his followers. (Matt 23:1-12) However, they do work as shepherds. There is neither Jew nor Greek, Being in plural doesn't make any difference. We are here to feed the sheep, not to entertain the goats Not only will you acknowledge your inability to prove that women should feed the flock, but others following the thread will see that Satan is shamed, he has fought in vain to change the commandment of the lord. 1cor 14:37,38. 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 11:33pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
JMAN05:PSML JMAN05:I hear you JMAN05:I know you've read me post that, it's true that theology does influence our translation especially theology centred around deeply held prejudices JMAN05:PSML. Did anyone say Artemis is/was a living woman in Ephesus during Paul's day? O ma se oo. You really havent a clue JMAN05:You're out of your depth mate JMAN05:I agreed to no such thing Quote me verbatim where I did so, if not then retract this statement JMAN05:Did I not warn you in advance against using plurals? Did I not warn you in advance not to interchange shepherd with pastor? JMAN05:You wouldnt like me take you on and respond to that question Someone's work? SMH. I do some many works at home, yet no one thinks I am same as a doctor, mechanic, plumber, chef, chauffeur, dry-cleaner etcetera PSML. Haughtiness ke? The truth is way more important than ego to me JMAN05:PMSL Just answer the question now. You will see the connection if you had answered So, here is the question again, that I am extremely anxious for you to reply to: Do women sing songs in ekklessia, ''church'', congregation or sing songs in Jehovah Witness gatherings, where men are present? Is it Yes or No? 2 Likes |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by MuttleyLaff: 11:33pm On Jul 16, 2017 |
JMAN05:I would have gladly agreed if there is one, just one saint in the NT called a shepherd (i.e. as in a noun form) JMAN05:So if you know that Jesus condemns religious titles for saints why then are you fariga fixated on giving saints shepherd titles or calling them shepherds JMAN05:It does make a difference, whole lot for that matter because preemptively, I did warn you not to bring forwards plurals Nothing spoilt. Maybe, another time or day, I'll share why the significance of Eph 4:11's pastor plurality and why when concerning saints, we always have plural shepherds and/or plural pastors (i.e. in verb form) Its the same reason why, by divine providence, there isnt a biblical NT recorded, singular noun pastor/shepherd used for saints JMAN05:PSML. I bet women really dont speak in ekklesia except when they get home Out of curiousty, please do indulge Give us inexhaustible examples of how the flock is fed 1 Like |
Re: On What Basis Is A Woman Made A Pastor In Some Churches? by Nobody: 12:12pm On Jul 17, 2017 |
MuttleyLaff: Both those translations and a scholar article support that the stament is about women. You refuse because it doesn't agree with your position. Calvin and others are prejudiced and you aren't cos you chose to hate truth so that women can view you as there hero. So we should follow you MOST holy interpreter. Just so that your anonymous fabricated couple can live. You are entitled to your opinion. PSML. What does this mean: No, not just any ordinary Artemis Tell me how another person will understand that statement. I agreed to no such thing When you have a detached words like "Yeah right", what do you expect? Wait, you mean you do not accept that pastors was used for some saints?? It appears I misjudge you when I saw you as being sincere. And if such quality is lacking in you, I ll stop any further discussion with you. Ask others about my method. You have better be open to accept what is true, otherwise, look for another person to discuss with. Not me. Am Not in nairaland for childish play. So eph 4:11 is not about some saints? Did I not warn you in advance against using plurals? It appears you are not here to discuss the topic of the thread. If Christ appointed some as pastors, you will with your right senses say that no human is ever reckoned as pastor? What is wrong with you. Do you have problem with English? Don't you know that pastors refer to more than one person, and that each of the persons appointed as pastor is a pastor? My dear if we are not ready to accept simple grammatical rule and what it means, we aren't ready to learn anything. If you don't want to be truthful, do you think we can ever reach a conclusion in this discussion? We will end up wasting a time we would use for something worthwhile. Please change your habit, its unchristian. Interchange pastor with shepherd? Pastor translates what in Greek? Shepherd translates what in Greek? Let's hear you. You wouldnt like me take you on and respond to that question That you enagage in this activities at times, doesn't make it your work. OK, it appears this one is hard for you. Who is a Shepherd? Answer PSML. Haughtiness ke? I presently doubt that. If someone can see "they" and call it singular pronoun, and see "pastors" in eph 4:11 and insist that no human was reckoned as pastor, it proves one of these: - you have issue with English language - you hate admitting to the truth because it kicks your boot. PMSL They sing songs, but remain silent when issue affecting the feeding of the sheep is discussed in church service. They are not authorised to challenge men, or feed the flock, but to learn in silence. 1 Like |
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