₦airaland Forum

budaatum:
Shame on you, where do you get the idea that satan can appear as light?

I, buda, categorically mock you, sc!

I welcome your mockery after I studied the Atheists Training Manual, it help me understand why mockery is so very important to an Atheist.
I am but an insignificant grain of sand in the greater scheme of this magnificent creation made possible by the creative power of God through his Son Jesus Christ with verifiable evidence of the work done daily worldwide by the amazing Holy Spirit to effectively support Christians faith that Jesus' words are based on verifiable evidence.

There are also sufficient evidence of the reality of Satan's fake light.

Seun:
Can’t we deal with the actual topic?

Seems atheists here can't, they trying to debate me on whether morality is subjective or objective because I brought up the fact that they believe it subjective and an invention of humanity. Which they openly said they agreed with.

rekinomtla:
Go read my post again or just quote (or misquote like before) where I said atheist are ok with people abusing them or their children. I strongly advise you to stop tackling strawmans when replying to someone.

Are you suggesting there is a difference between your statement that atheists believe that "there's nothing objectively wrong with murder, rape, pedophilia etc," and, 'atheists are ok with them and their children or those of others being murdered and raped'? If sc had said the above, I know where to put him, he is stupid like that, but I have no reason to believe you are stupid like he is!

I, however, see no difference in both statements, despite the insertion of the word "objective" in one. As I said in a previous, "murder, rape, pedophilia", done to or doing to, is wrong, period, whether subjective or objective, and claiming atheists or anyone, for that matter, sees it any other way cannot even be what you believe about us or anyone!

Claiming that "atheists see nothing objectively wrong with murder rape and paedophilia" is the straw and a lie and is silly, as it implies that an atheist can unilaterally decide that it isn't wrong for them to murder and rape or be murdered and raped, and I insist, it's not your belief that we don't see nothing wrong with it! Anyone would assure you that is not true, if you do believe it, and the law of any country would definitely have something to say about it too!

You and I have never engaged, rekinomtla, least not as far as I can recall, so I might be wrong about you or not know how you reason. Please let me know if and how your belief runs counter to the above just so I know.

True, by it's fruit is it known.

Is that not you and your fruit, rotten as it is, in the dustbin?

ScienceWatch:
I welcome your mockery after I studied the Atheists Training Manual, it help me understand why mockery is so very important to an Atheist.
I am but an insignificant grain of sand in the greater scheme of this magnificent creation made possible by the creative power of God through his Son Jesus Christ with verifiable evidence of the work done daily worldwide by the amazing Holy Spirit to effectively support Christians faith that Jesus' words are based on verifiable evidence.

There are also sufficient evidence of the reality of Satan's fake light.

rekinomtla:
Seems atheists here can't, they trying to debate me on whether morality is subjective or objective because I brought up the fact that they believe it subjective and an invention of humanity. Which they openly said they agreed with.

Is it possible for us to approach this topic from a different perspective ? We all know that no evidence will lead to consensus so we should not labour to convince but for the sake of polite conversation we may contribute facts that point beyond mere logic or coincidence we have Theists and Atheists to entertain.

Example 1

Deaths of Famous People Who Mocked God, Here are some men and women who mocked God:
John Lennon (Singer):
Some years before, during an interview with an American Magazine, he said: “Christianity will end, it will disappear. I do not have to argue about that. I am certain. Jesus was ok, but his subjects were too simple. Today we are more famous than Him" (1966). Lennon, after saying that the Beatles were more famous than Jesus Christ, was shot six times.

Tancredo Neves (President of Brazil):
During the Presidential campaign, he said if he got 500,000 votes from his party, not even God would remove him from Presidency. Sure he got the votes, but he got sick a day before being made President, then he died.

Cazuza (Bi-sexual Brazilian composer, singer and poet):
During A show in Canecio (Rio de Janeiro), while smoking his cigarette, he puffed out some smoke into the air and said: "God, that's for you." He died at the age of 32 of AIDS in a horrible manner.

rekinomtla:
I suggest you stop reading articles by atheist apologists such as Garry Goldberg. Even a Wikipedia page does better job than him. Like him you confusing objective morality with absolute morality.

And I suggest you consider what you post. Below is from your own wiki selection

Moral objectivism: There is a fact of the matter as to whether any given action is morally permissible or impermissible: a fact of the matter that does not depend solely on social custom or individual acceptance.

Please show me how you come to the conclusion that makes you believe that "atheists believe that there's nothing objectively wrong with murder, rape, pedophilia etc"!

Can these tradegies all satisfy atheists strong beliefs in the god of coincidence?

The man who built the Titanic:
After the construction of Titanic, a reporter asked him how safe the Titanic would be. With an ironic tone he said: "Not even God can sink it" The result: I think you all know what happened to the Titanic.

Marilyn Monroe (Actress):
She was visited by Billy Graham during a presentation of a show. He said the Spirit of God had sent him to preach to her. After hearing what the Preacher had to say, she said: "I don't need your Jesus". A week later, she was found dead in her apartment.

Bon Scott (Singer):
The ex-vocalist of the AC/DC. On one of his 1979 songs he sang: "Don't stop me, I'm going down all the way, down the highway to hell". On the 19th of February 1980, Bon Scott was found dead, he had been choked by his own vomit.

budaatum:
True, by it's fruit is it known.

Is that not you and your fruit, rotten as it is, in the dustbin?

Let's settle this once and for all. You should borrow Butterflyle0's radioactive dustbin for a long term solution.
What are your thoughts on this ?

Let's appeal to those that mock God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Come tell of your feelings and physical experiences. Come do this in the spirit of the topic.

Lagos Nigeria(IN 2017)
A group of friends, drunk, went to pick up a friend. The mother accompanied her to the car and was so worried about the drunkenness of her friends and she said to the daughter holding her hand, who was already seated in the car: "My Daughter, Go with God and May He Protect You.

" She responded: "Only If He (God) Travels In The boot/ Trunk of this car, because Inside Here....It's Already Full "
Hours later, news came by that they had been involved in a fatal accident, everyone had died, the car could not be recognized what type of car it had been, but surprisingly, the trunk was intact. The police said there was no way the trunk could have remained intact. To their surprise, inside the trunk was a crate of eggs, none was broken.

ScienceWatch:
Let's settle this once and for all. You should borrow Butterflyle0's radioactive dustbin for a long term solution.
What are your thoughts on this ?

There's no need to borrow a dustbin. You're rubbish after all, there's no point keeping you.

Just throw yourself in the bin and the usual way rubbish is discarded would get rid of you.

Can this topic achieve its lofty purpose ? I hope it can . The servere limitations imposed atheists should temporarily be scraped.
They are often condescending as they mock Christianity. They insult God, call him a tyrant, refer to Christianity as mythology, baseless, a fairytale, compare God to invisible pink unicorns and Santa Clause, etc. Unfortunately, this is all too typical of atheists and if they want to be taken seriously at all, they need to stop being so rude and crude because they do nothing to further discussion.
Attacking the Christian God and accusing him of immorality is immensely problematic for atheists who have no objective standard of morality yet are quick to judge. We see their inconsistency even if they don't.

Let's find a different perspective on this incredible topic.

budaatum:
There's no need to borrow a dustbin. You're rubbish after all, there's no point keeping you.

Just throw yourself in the bin and the usual way rubbish is discarded would get rid of you.

Thank you for your reply. I must admit you came up with a creative and cost effective solution. My way of getting rid of myself would be way more expensive. I was thinking of Cryogenics.

You can use https://www.nairaland.com/4603041/atheists-theists-morality-subjective-objective for the discussion on morality.

Seun:
You can use https://www.nairaland.com/4613159 for the discussion on morality.

I strongly think you pasted the wrong link

Seun:
You can use https://www.nairaland.com/4603041/atheists-theists-morality-subjective-objective for the discussion on morality.

will it be immoral for Christians to get unlimited data for less than N4000.

budaatum:
There's no need to borrow a dustbin. You're rubbish after all, there's no point keeping you.

Just throw yourself in the bin and the usual way rubbish is discarded would get rid of you.

While we figure out evidence, would you be prepared to agree that where there is NO-GOD, there is no charity ?

Apart from the fact that Christianity runs the largest charity in Africa, another study was conducted to show the correlation between religious people and charity
http://www.pewforum.org/Religion-News/Religious-people-make-better-citizens-study-says.aspx
http://articles.latimes.com/2007/jun/16/local/me-beliefs16

This led an atheist, Hattersley, to criticize his fellow atheists for their lack of effort in relief effort: “You don’t hear of “Atheist Aid” rather like Christian aid, and, I think, despite my inability to believe myself, I’m deeply impressed by what belief does for people like the Salvation Army… I often say I never hear of atheist organizations taking food to the poor”..


This is a brief extract of WinnerO1's other incredible topic - The Hateful Language Of Atheism And Its Possible Effects On Society.

Is this self absorbed atheism another way to protect their selfishness ? Atheists believe that the poor oppressed and needy must fend for them selves.

Seun:
You can use https://www.nairaland.com/4603041/atheists-theists-morality-subjective-objective for the discussion on morality.

My apologies for going off topic. And to you too rekinomtla for using the word "silly" in response to you. It was immoral of me and I'm sorry.

budaatum:
My apologies for going off topic. And to you too rekinomtla for using the word "silly" in response to you. It was immoral of me and I'm sorry.

What is our world coming to ? Budaatum a mocking atheist apologising to Rekinomtla a true Christian for immorally calling him "silly." Does he really think true Christians fall for cheap psycho?

To be honest, this thread achieves nothing.

#peace

hopefulLandlord:
I strongly think you pasted the wrong link

Thanks. Corrected. https://www.nairaland.com/4603041/atheists-theists-morality-subjective-objective

budaatum:


You said you were once an atheist! It would seem to me that you were the worst sort of atheist, and even though you now claim to be a Christian, nothing much seems to have changed and you've only changed labels. I swear to God, if you were still an atheist, buda would just go and accept Jesus Christ as her Lord and Saviour because I don't think buda could allow herself to share an ideology, or religion with your sort! You are just that deplorable!
I know you are very likely to fob this off with "buda, an atheist, talking God", so let me tell you a story.

One day the disciples said, "Master! Master! That person over there is not one of us but he is preaching and healing in your name!"

I would be most grateful if you tell me the conclusion of my story so that it can be known whether any of this has gone into your thick skull.

Your Lord the God Almighty will bless you accordingly, even I can assure you of that.

Christ lives !!!
I really appreciate your mockery and insults Budaatum because your Atheist Training Manual teaches you thus. I at least feel that it is good that you are vomiting over me and therefore having a brief respite from mocking and insulting the Christian God and Jesus the beloved Messiah.

My conclusion:
I saw you fake an apology to a true Christian for calling him silly. Are you try to make history. Other atheists would not take kindly to that.
It seems your attacks on my person are fueled by my open support and admiration for the incredible work done by WinnerO1 to help atheists and theists alike.

festwiz:
To be honest, this thread achieves nothing.

#peace

Peace √

ScienceWatch:
My conclusion:

It seems your attacks on my person are fueled by my open support and admiration for the incredible work done by WinnerO1 to help atheists and theists alike.

Your "conclusion" is wrong. My attack on your person is fueled by my dislike of your utter and complete stupid ignorance and your abhorrent ungodly immorality.

awesomeJ:
It's not why can't he?
It's "Why won't he"

He won't cos, he doesn't have to.

You think he reckons that much with fools?

Mind you, only fools and apes are convinced by Charles Darwin.

Any man who believes the proposition actually needs help with his mental faculty.

The vast majority of sensible and intelligent people in the world are fools, but you are wise? How arrogant!

The earth rotates to cause day and night,

The earth doesn’t rotate to cause day and night for us. Rather, humanity observed the effect of the earth’s rotation and labeled it “day” and “night”. The earth, like many objects in the universe, was rotating long before we got here, and will continue to rotate after we are gone.

The male reproductive organ is a perfect fit for the females,

No, it is not a perfect fit. Sometimes it’s too big, but more commonly, it's too small. Hence the endless debate about whether ‘size matters'.

The brain detects harmful substances from just smell and taste

1) It only detects some substances, not all. Otherwise it would be almost impossible to poison a rat or any other creature with a brain.
2) Evolution explains this. Our ancestors who could identify and avoid potentially dangerous foods survived, while those who couldn’t died.

Evaporation exists to make for a perfect water cycle,

No.

When plants eject Oxygen, animals take it in and vice versa,

When PDP ejects politicians, APC takes them in and vice versa. This doesn’t mean that someone intentionally designed it to work that way.
Plants came before animals. They used the sun's rays for energy and to build their bodies, and excreted lots of oxygen into the atmosphere.
Animals evolved to use the bodies of plants and the waste product of photosynthesis (oxygen) for their own stuff. They weren’t co-designed.

There exists terminal Velocity in fluids that prevent raindrops from hitting humans with a destructive momentum,

But it doesn’t prevent the raindrops from freezing into hailstones and hitting humans with destructive momentum.

The DNA contains one of the most complex codes

No, DNA is just an organic molecule which self-replicates. We call it ‘code’ because it has a code-like structure, but it’s just a molecule. Sometimes you might see a cloud that’s shaped like a human face in the sky, but you can be certain that it’s not an actual human face.

The summary of your argument for God is “nice things exist, therefore God must have made them”. But what about bad things like Ebola?

budaatum:
Your "conclusion" is wrong. My attack on your person is fueled by my dislike of your utter and complete stupid ignorance and your abhorrent ungodly immorality.

Excellent. Then I will accept your unbiased conclusion, no problem for me.
Thanks for adding loads of adjectives to make your point, I would have missed it completely.
I still think that you left out a few insults that for the sake of clarity. Feel free.

Seun:
The vast majority of sensible and intelligent people in the world are fools, but you are wise? How arrogant!


The earth doesn’t rotate to cause day and night for us. Rather, humanity observed the effect of the earth’s rotation and labeled it “day” and “night”. The earth, like many objects in the universe, was rotating long before we got here, and will continue to rotate after we are gone.


No, it is not a perfect fit. Sometimes it’s too big, but more commonly, it's too small. Hence the endless debate about whether ‘size matters'.


1) It only detects some substances, not all. Otherwise it would be almost impossible to poison a rat or any other creature with a brain.
2) Evolution explains this. Our ancestors who could identify and avoid potentially dangerous foods survived, while those who couldn’t died.


No.


When PDP ejects politicians, APC takes them in and vice versa. This doesn’t mean that someone intentionally designed it to work that way.
Plants came before animals. They used the sun's rays for energy and to build their bodies, and excreted lots of oxygen into the atmosphere.
Animals evolved to use the bodies of plants and the waste product of photosynthesis (oxygen) for their own stuff. They weren’t co-designed.


But it doesn’t prevent the raindrops from freezing into hailstones and hitting humans with destructive momentum.


No, DNA is just an organic molecule with self-replicating ability. We call it ‘code’ because it has a code-like structure, but it’s a just a molecule. Sometimes you might see a cloud that’s shaped like a human face in the sky, but you can be certain that it’s not an actual human face.

The summary of your argument for God is “nice things exist, therefore God must have made them”. But what about bad things like Ebola?

You've only given your own perspectives, and they're mostly filled with ignorance.

1. People who attribute creation to a God outnumber those believing evolution 5 to 1. So it's ignorant of you to say folks believing evolution are a majority.

2. Maybe not for you, but for most people I know, the earth's rotation marks days and nights for us. And you're wrong, the Earth's rotation isn't gonna be forever.

3. Avoid premarital sex, and marry your own wife, you'll find that it fits perfectly. Meanwhile you know you took that out of context. The basic point is a 'hole' rather than anything like else was made for a 'peg'. There's lubrication too. The details involved couldn't just be random.

4. It's funny you don't see how the functionality of plants is majorly centred around human comfort: They breathe out what we need, they yield grains, roots, fruits and sorts which contain the exact nutrients needed for the human diet. If you want to give unnecessary explanations as to why they weren't made for man, suit yourself.

5. Rain is what falls everywhere, so something's been put in place to prevent it from causing unavoidable harm.
Hails. don't happen everywhere. Maybe man could have left some regions of the earth uninhabited.
If people chose to go inhabit Antarctica, would you blame God when they start freezing to death?

6. Apparently, what you said about the DNA is only the little you know about it. Perhaps, like me, you yet should read up. However, Bill Gates was once quoted as saying "The DNA contains more complex information than any software we've ever made"

And I've heard of molecular biologists who got born again just by the amazement they encountered as they advanced in studying genes, DNA and sorts.

7. Why do babies die? why are there incurable diseases? why do people suffer?

These are some of the things you always wanna blame on God. That's where you're wrong.

First you should know that these troubles started and persist due to some humans' actions or inactions.

How did HIV get into man? How about Ebola? Yet it's God you want to blame.

I have an assignment to accomplish, if I should fail, I know that a problem would yet persist in this generation, but I won't, which is why the world will be a better place by the time I'm through.

Take yourself for instance, God has given you one of the brightest minds ever, and rather than seeking what the real purpose is, you're there thinking the best you can do with it is rant anger at Him. if you fail, a problem will yet persist, and you'll keep blaming God.

Since man got on the earth, every of God's interventions, He's had to carry out through men. Most of them fail. Problems persist, You wanna blame Him.

Like I said, 'god' doesn't exist, but that's only the god you picture in your head. The magician, stunt pulling kind of god.

Repent Seun,

Jesus loves you.

Seun, sounds like you're in for a harder time than I've had. Lol!

winner01:
I didn't want to intrude because I can see that my brother @ScienceWatch is having a good time.

But really that seems to be the truth. Lets take a look at Voltaire, a french infidel, who died in 1778
- he said that within 100 years of his time, Christianity would be swept away from existence and pass into the obscurity of history.
-Yet 50 years after his death, the Geneva Bible Society used his house and printing press to produce stacks of Bibles.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/7477203_img20180727183850_jpeg94f5ffa2346816c54b29150573181a01

The corpse just never stays put.


But it isn't

Christianity did not originate in Europe and majority of Europe still seems to be christian.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/7477146_img20180727182425_jpeg2053c2a3609eecf47c44c63015dab45a



PEW researchers seem to think otherwise and 71% Christians sound more like majority than dead.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/7477143_img20180727182441_jpeg61e57974da9f5b512737f5bd26a8ed2d



I don't think Christianity has ever been majority in Israel? Judaism is, and only a small percentage seem to be Christians.



Maybe its not a lie after all. World powers like Russia, Germany, France, Italy, U.S etc still seem to be overwhelmingly christian communities. China has had to consciously put a leash on the growth of Christians by banning online sales of Bible, embargo on Bible importation. Etc.
https://www.nairaland.com/3172960/china-course-worlds-most-christian
www.nairaland.com/attachments/3852846_china2887244b_jpeg70bb797466de6037a5669b505dc48ea2


Our own Nigeria is just 45% Christian with majority being terribly superstitious. That being said, I think you should be grateful to Christianity for the freedom you have.

Christianity is why many of us know about democracy, freedom of speech and religion. Christianity the reason why atheists are outspoken in places like U.S and U.k. Christianity is why you have a voice.

www.nairaland.com/attachments/4097577_1122789810693818964391852365028311777142063n_png_jpeg897da8fe73b10c634aec971b3c6ed8e3

Christianity is even why Nigerians can criticize Buhari's government. Imagine Nigeria was an Islamic country, your voices would have been taken forcefully. The same with almost all of the atheist countries that have ever existed.


For instance, the first ever officially declared atheist nation in the world was Albania under the rule of communist dictator Enver Hoxha (1908-85).

Article 37 of the Albanian Constitution of 1976 stipulated: ‘The State recognizes no religion, and supports atheistic propaganda in order to implant a scientific materialistic outlook in people’ (Vickers 2001).

Article 2, A, constitution of Iraq stipulates: No law that contradicts the established provisions of Islam may be established.

Article 3, constitution of Afghanistan: In Afghanistan, no law can be contrary to the beliefs and provisions of the sacred religion of Islam.

Its easy to say Islam is intolerant, but this is the same as atheism.
I can understand why many of you don't like christianity, but at least you must be thankful for Christianity....

Wow WinnerO1, your ability to convict compulsive liars is very impressive
I thank God that I am on your side.
Have you seen that post where an arrogant atheist bowed and apologized to a brilliant Christian known here as Rekinomtla ?

ScienceWatch:
Excellent. Then I will accept your unbiased conclusion, no problem for me.
Thanks for adding loads of adjectives to make your point, I would have missed it completely.
I still think that you left out a few insults that for the sake of clarity. Feel free

.Lol

vaxx:
So much off the point write up ooh i miss this .i was unable to read your have baked logic. Goal post shifting. But let me educate you a little. Gravity created by the Earths spin is a scientific demonstration to validate the shape of the earth . Gravity would not be evenly distributed if the world wasn't circular.

Too much of goal post shifting here, how do we arrive here. I educated u earlie but will not be doing it again .

You will making unnecessary assumptions when u are desperate to pass a cheap point.

A lot of goal post shifting here. What is this. have you forgotten the topic of discussion ?

Pile of hot trash it is just too much off point, that i do not even know where to begin

Reading wikipedia all alone is a bad habit of learning . Go thru the wikipedia references to get a wider and deeper coverage of the topic., we are talking of a universal negative here. In philosophy they are classified into two. One named posteriori and the other named priori. Let me give an example of posteriori for you.: it is the universal negative that we refer to when we speak about disproving the existence of something. It is something that can be determined through experience.

For example, "GODS don't exist."

In order to prove this negative we would have to consider an infinite amount of evidence, all the swans that existed, all the swans that exist, and all the swans that will exist.
Because we cannot consider this infinite set of evidence, proving the universal negative is impossible. The universal negative that we refer to when we speak about disproving the existence of something is something that can be determined through experience.

This can only be done when the premises is positive .

Educate yourself on non observational evidence. GOD evidence is non observation.

Here comes the invariable question .You see, it is actually quite foolish. First it is asserted, that most of us believe so apart from atheist.Then the fact that everyone believe so, is used to negate what is being said, is that not abuse of logic?

If we all says the same thing, the logical thing to assume is that there must be something to it. Not that everyone says the same thing, so therefore it must be false. How does that make sense? Where is the logic? In fact, you would expect all of us to say basically the same things, because all religions are different cultural expressions of the same Absolute Truth. Surely, the details may vary, but if all religions are differently conditioned expressions of the same truth, you'd expect they would mention the same basic principles.



Gibberish . how do you measure and observe holy book/holy spider. demonstrate it?

You actually making a whole lot off point discussion . All your write up is full of goal post shifting. I my self cannot conceive of no stronger evidence for a God/Creator than everything anyone has ever seen, touched, smelled, tasted, heard, or otherwise experienced. so which balls is more harder than this.

Mmmmmm incredible, educational and deep as usual sir. Thank you for taking from your precious time to share. Tintingz should accept your kind advice when you said, "
Educate yourself on non observational evidence .GOD evidence is non observation."

I may be wrong, but it seems that Tintingz seems unaware that he was going off point while at the same time failing to refocus his mind on how the laws of logic is applied when examining non-observable evidence. Would you agree that there are four atheists here, Tintingz, Johnydon, Hopefullandlord that are on the brink of breaking out of the vicious materialistic Matrix if they can sincerely take your kindly advice to "Educate yourself on non observational evidence ."

Have a blessed Sunday.