9. The Book of Enoch Claims God Will Pick The Righteous And Holy From Out of Hell

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“And in those days shall the earth also give back that which has been entrusted to it, and Sheol also shall give back that which it has received, and hell shall give back that which it owes. And he shall choose the righteous and holy from among them: for the day has drawn nigh that they should be saved.” Enoch Chapter 51:1-2

The Truth:

God is not going to choose righteous and holy people from hell. This is not scriptural. What would righteous and holy people be doing in hell in the first place? The Bible makes it clear that hell is a holding place sinners and those who deny Christ until the final judgment.

The Bible talks about two resurrections. The first resurrection is for the holy and the second resurrection is for the unholy. “They lived, and reigned with Christ for a thousand years [the first ressurection]. The rest of the dead didn’t live until the thousand years were finished…Blessed and holy is he who has part in the first resurrection. Over these, the second death has no power…” (Revelation 20:4-6 WEB)

The following passage explains what happens to those who are part of the second resurrection:

“I saw a great white throne, and Him who is sat on it, from whose face the earth and heaven fled away. There was found no place for them. I saw the dead, the great and small, standing before the throne, and they opened the books. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged out of the things which were written in the books, according to their works. The sea gave up the dead who were in them. They were judged, each one according to his works. Death and Hades [hell] were thrown into the Lake of fire; this is the second death, the Lake of fire.” (Revelation 20:11-14 WEB) -No mention of people escaping from hell. No mention of holy or righteous people coming out of hell.

The Book of Enoch is teaching a dangerous error by saying that those in hell will be chosen so "...that they should be saved.” This is giving false hope to people that those in Hell will have a second chance at salvation. This is not scriptural at all!

“…Fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.” (Matthew 10:28 KJV)

“Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?” (Matthew 23:33 KJV)

This is why the Book of Enoch is dangerous and heretical.

10. The Book of Enoch Claims Angels Built The Ark

"And now the angels are making a wooden building [Ark], and when they have completed that task I will place My hand upon it and preserve it, and there shall come forth from it the seed of life, and a change shall set in so that the earth will not remain without inhabitant." Enoch 67:2

The Truth:

Noah alone was given instructions to build the Ark, not angels.

"Make thee an ark of gopher wood; rooms shalt thou make in the ark, and shalt pitch it within and without with pitch." (Genesis 6:14)

"And this is the fashion which thou shalt make it of: The length of the ark shall be three hundred cubits, the breadth of it fifty cubits, and the height of it thirty cubits." (Genesis 6:15)

"A window shalt thou make to the ark, and in a cubit shalt thou finish it above; and the door of the ark shalt thou set in the side thereof; with lower, second, and third stories shalt thou make it." (Genesis 6:16)

"But with thee will I establish my covenant; and thou shalt come into the ark, thou, and thy sons, and thy wife, and thy sons' wives with thee". (Genesis 6:18)

"Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he [Not the Angels]." (Genesis 6:22)

"By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith." (Hebrews 11:7)

The Book of Hebrews praises the faith and obedience of Noah for preparing the Ark, but the Book of Enoch robs Noah of this virtue, which destroys the example and message of faith spoken about Noah in the Bible.

Book of Enoch is teaching things that are contrary to the Bible.

11. The Book of Enoch Teaches Greek Mythology As Godly Knowledge


"And first there goes forth the great luminary, named the Sun, and his circumference is like the circumference of the heaven, and he is quite filled with illuminating and heating fire. The chariot on which he ascends, the wind drives, and the sun goes down from the heaven and returns through the north in order to reach the east, and is so guided that he comes to that portal and shines in the face of the heaven." Enoch 72:4-5

"And after this law I saw another law dealing with the smaller luminary, which is named the Moon. And her circumference is like the circumference of the heaven, and her chariot in which she rides is driven by the wind, and light is given to her in definite measure." Enoch 73:1-2

The Truth:​

Helios: He was the personification of the Sun in Greek mythology and in Roman mythology, he was named "Sol" Helios/Sol, rode his Sun Chariot across the daytime sky drawn by four fiery steeds.

Selene: She is the personification of the Moon in Greek mythology and in Roman mythology, she was named "Luna." Selene/Luna, rode her Moon Chariot across the sky drawn by two horses.

The Stars: Greek and Roman mythology also view the stars as charioteers riding the night sky, which is also seen in the Book of Enoch. See the Book of Enoch 75:8: "And I saw chariots in the heaven, running in the world, above those portals in which revolve the stars that never set."

None of this is biblical. The Book of Enoch claims this is how the Sun and Moon operate in the sky. The Book of Enoch also claims this information about the Sun and Moon going across the sky in a chariot is knowledge given to Enoch from heaven (See chapters 79, and 80:1). Yet, King Josiah, a righteous king, destroyed the chariot of the sun god.

In 2 Kings 23:11, we see king Josiah eliminating this same form of Sun (Helios) dedication from Israel: "And he took away the horses that the kings of Judah had given to the sun, at the entering in of the house of the LORD, by the chamber of Nathanmelech the chamberlain, which was in the suburbs, and burned the chariots of the sun with fire."

So, why would the angels from heaven teach Enoch these same pagan mythologies of the sun god and moon goddess? Clearly, the Book of Enoch is teaching false doctrines. The writers of the Book of Enoch would like their readers believe that these Sun and Moon entities existed, and to add even more heresy to their text, the writers of the Book of Enoch want their readers to believe that these are all teachings from heaven.

The Book of Enoch teaches idolatry!

12. The Book of Enoch Claims Noah Had Laser Beam Eyes

Look at the entire 106th chapter of the Book of Enoch. This chapter is full of biblical error and very weird events that show the Book of Enoch is a Jewish fable that Paul warned beleivers to stay away from (Titus 1:14). For the sake of brevity, we provide a summary of the context of this chapter, and some quotes followed by commentary.

Chapter 106 talks about the birth of Noah and gives a very strange description of the infant Noah.

“His body was white as snow and red as the blooming of a rose, and the hair of his head and his long locks were white as wool and his eyes beautiful. And when he opened his eyes, he lighted up the whole house like the sun, and the whole house was very bright. And thereupon he arose in the hands of the midwife, opened his mouth, and conversed with the Lord of righteousness.” Enoch Chapter 106:2-3

According to the Book of Enoch, Noah was born with eyes that were like laser beams that illuminated the whole house. This is not a poetic description because verses 4 and 6 prove it was a literal description:

“And his father Lamech was afraid of him and fled, and came to his father Methuselah. And he said unto him: ‘I have begotten a strange son, diverse from and unlike man, and resembling the sons of God of heaven; and his nature is different and he is not like us, and his eyes are as the rays of the sun, and his countenance is glorious. And it seems to me he is not sprung from me but from angels…” Enoch chapter 106:4-6

According to the story from the Book of Enoch, Lamech was frightened of his son and thought the infant Noah was not human. None of this is even hinted at in the Bible. Noah was very human and did not have laser beam eyes.

“Noah was a righteous MAN (not an angel or super-human), blameless among the people of his time. Noah walked with God.” (Genesis 6:9 WEB)

The next passage from chapter 106 in the Book of Enoch is very heretical. It describes how Lamech urged his father Methuselah to go and speak with Enoch (who had been translated into heaven) for answers about Noah.

“And now, my father, I am here to petition thee and implore thee that thou mayest go to Enoch, our father, and learn from him the truth, for his dwelling-place is amongst the angels.” Enoch Chapter 106:7

We then see that Methuselah went to the “ends of the earth” and cried out for Enoch. Enoch then said: “Behold, here am I, my son, wherefore hast thou come to me?” Methuselah gives Enoch a description of the infant Noah and his strange attributes. Enoch follows with a description of the coming flood and how Noah and his future sons will be saved from the destruction.

The Truth:

First, Genesis 5:24 says: “Enoch walked with God, and he was not, for God took him.” Hebrews 11:5 says: “…Enoch was TAKEN AWAY, so that he wouldn’t see death, and HE WAS NOT FOUND, because God translated him…” According to scripture, it would be impossible for Methuselah to go to the “ends of the earth,” and yell for Enoch and for Enoch to come back to earth to give Methuselah the answer he wanted about Noah. This story is clearly a heretical fable.

Second, Enoch was translated 69 years before Noah was born, but the book of Enoch often tells of discussions and interactions between Noah and Enoch (Chapters 65, 106, 107, and more). In fact, Chapter 65 tells the story of how Noah went to the “ends of the earth” and cried out to Enoch and asked Enoch what was going to happen on the earth. Enoch talked to Noah and even took Noah by the hand.

Again, this is unscriptural, because Noah could not have consulted with Enoch since Enoch was translated decades before Noah was born. Remember, Hebrews 11:5 says: “Enoch walked with God, and he was not, for God took him.” He was not, means he wasn't around for people to talk with him.

In addition, the scriptures say it was God himself that informed Noah about the flood and not Enoch. “God said to Noah, ‘An end of all flesh hath come before me, for

What about the Book of Jude quote?

Some say that Jude recognized the Book of Enoch as inspired text because Jude supposedly quotes directly from 1 Enoch. However, Jude never claimed to quote directly from the Book of Enoch, he was quoting what Enoch of Genesis said, not what the Book of Enoch said:

“About these also Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied, saying, ‘Behold, the Lord came with ten thousands of his holy ones, to execute judgment on all, and to convict all the ungodly of all their works of ungodliness which they have done in an ungodly way, and of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against him’." (Jude 1:14-15 WEB) NOTE: No mention of the Book of Enoch.

If Jude were quoting from the Book of Enoch, Jude would have to had sourced two different books within the Book of Enoch, because there is not a single statement in the Book of Enoch that matches the entire statement of the Book of Jude 100%.

“The seventh from Adam” (The Book of Enoch 60: – Book of Parables [Enoch 60:8]) Written 100 BC to 100 AD

“And behold! He cometh with ten thousands of His holy ones to execute judgment upon all, And to destroy all the ungodly: And to convict all flesh of all the works of their ungodliness which they have ungodly committed, and of all the hard things which ungodly sinners have spoken against Him.” (The Book of Enoch 1:9) – Book of the Watchers [Enoch 1:9] Written 300 to 150 BC


Consider the following:

1. Jude never said he was quoting from the Book of Enoch

Jude said “Enoch, the seventh from Adam, prophesied, saying…” and then quoted the Enoch prophecy. We cannot assume Jude quoted directly from the Book of Enoch because Jude never said he quoted from the Book of Enoch. Jude could have quoted from any number of sources besides the Book of Enoch. Oral tradition, or more likely divine inspiration. For example, if Enoch in Genesis gave a prophetic word, then of course, Yeshua would have known about the prophecy. Yeshua (Jesus) could have easily told Jude (his half brother) and the other apostles about the prophecy of Enoch directly. Or, Jude could have received divine inspiration from the Holy Spirit on the prophetic words of Enoch of Genesis.

People should not assume that the Book of Enoch, is the source for the Enoch prophecy quoted by Jude. Even if the prophecy in Jude is a 100% match with the Book of Enoch (which it isn't), this proves nothing except the two books probably got their information from a common source. It does not prove that the Book of Enoch is the source for Jude. With all the errors and paganism in the Book of Enoch why would Jude use it?

Take another look at the passage in Jude and the passage in the Book of Enoch based on two translations. Are they the same message?

Convict vs. Destroy

Jude 1:14-15: "Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints, to execute judgment upon all, and to convince/convict all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him." KJV

Book of Enoch 1:9: "And behold! He cometh with ten thousands of His holy ones to execute judgment upon all, and to destroy all the ungodly. And to convict all flesh of all the works ⌈of their ungodliness⌉ which they have ungodly committed, And of all the hard things which ungodly sinners ⌈have spoken⌉ against Him." (R.H. Charles translation, 1917)

Book of Enoch 2:1 (1:9) "Behold, he comes with ten thousands of his saints, to execute judgment upon them, and destroy the wicked, and reprove all the carnal for everything which the sinful and ungodly have done, and committed against him." (Translated from Ethiopic by Richard Laurence, London, 1883)

Jude says the Lord will "convict" all that are ungodly versus the Book of Enoch that says the Lord will "destroy" all the ungodly.
The English word Convince/Convict comes from the Greek word: "elenxai," which means to expose, rebuke, reprove. Different from destroying someone. Therefore, we can see the message in the Book of Enoch is different from the message in the Book of Jude. This difference is a big deal and shows that Jude is not directly quoting from the Book of Enoch. Since Jude is writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, then that means the message of Jude is the actual and inspired message of Enoch of Genesis, but the message in the Book of Enoch is an incorrect and uninspired message.

The Bible Agrees With The Message of Jude But Debunks The Message In The Book of Enoch

The Book of Jude states that Christ will come to convict/rebuke/reprove the ungodly that remain after the tribulation period. Israel and the nations will be on trial when Christ returns, and other scriptures in the Bible show Jude's message is correct, and the Book of Enoch is wrong.

"And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people..." Isaiah 2:2-4 KJV

"And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off." Micah 4:3 KJV

"And I will bring you out from the people, and will gather you out of the countries wherein ye are scattered, with a mighty hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with fury poured out. And I will bring you into the wilderness of the people, and there will I plead with you face to face. Like as I pleaded with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so will I plead with you, saith the Lord GOD. And I will cause you to pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant: And I will purge out from among you the rebels, and them that transgress against me: I will bring them forth out of the country where they sojourn, and they shall not enter into the land of Israel: and ye shall know that I am the LORD. Ezekiel 20:34-38 KJV

"And it shall come to pass, that he that is left in Zion, and he that remaineth in Jerusalem, shall be called holy, even every one that is written among the living in Jerusalem: When the Lord shall have washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and shall have purged the blood of Jerusalem from the midst thereof by the spirit of judgment, and by the spirit of burning Isaiah 4:3-4 KJV

"I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge." Revelation 20:4 KJV

"For then, in those days and at that time, when I restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem, I will gather all the nations and bring them down to the valley of Jehoshaphat, and I will enter into judgment with them there, on account of My people and My heritage Israel, because they have scattered them among the nations. They have divided My land, and cast lots for My people, and traded boys for prostitutes, and sold girls for wine, and drunk it down." Joel 3:1-3 KJV

NOTE: When Christ rules the earth, ungodly nations and people will be given a choice to serve and embrace righteousness or experience punishment.

"Nations shall come to your light, and kings to the brightness of your rising. For that nation and kingdom that will not serve you shall perish; yes, those nations shall be utterly wasted. The sons of those who afflicted you shall come bending to you; and all those who despised you shall bow themselves down at the soles of your feet; and they shall call you The city of Yahweh, The Zion of the Holy One of Israel." Isaiah 60:3,12, & 14

"All the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the LORD: and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before thee. For the kingdom is the LORD'S: and he is the governor among the nations." Psalm 22:27-28 KJV

"And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain." Zechariah 14:17 KJV - He will rebuke the nation.

"When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory: And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats: And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left. Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: " Matthew 25:31-34, 41 KJV

"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works." Matthew 16:27 KJV

When Jesus returns, he will hold a trial. The people from wicked nations that populate the earth after the tribulation period will be brought before Christ, and he will rebuke them and correct them. If found guilty of rebellion and ungodliness, they will be sent to hell awaiting final judgment after the millennial reign. The Book of Enoch appears to bypass this trial phase and go right to destruction. The Book of Enoch also implies Annihilationism, which is the belief that those who are wicked will be wiped out as if they never existed. Annihilationism is heretical because the Bible teaches the wicked dead will experience eternal torment, not destruction.
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Should We Make A Big Deal About Enoch 1:9 Appearing in the Dead Sea Scrolls?

Advocates for the Book of Enoch brag about Enoch 1:9 being discovered in the Dead Sea Scrolls, because of its supposed association with the Book of Jude. What Book of Enoch advocates don't mention is that the Aramaic version of Enoch 1:9 (4Q204), located in the Dead Sea Scrolls, only contains a few words, which is not enough to make an exact determination of what the Aramaic version of Enoch 1:9 says.11 However, by the few words that can be interpreted from the Enoch 1:9 fragment, it's easy to see the Book of Enoch is not a 100% match with the message found in the Book of Jude.12 This provides additional proof that Jude did not quote the Book of Enoch.


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11. "Enoch 1:9, 4Q204, Plate 199, B-284648." Deadseascrolls.org.il, The Leon Levy Dead Sea Scrolls Digital Library, 1960. <https://www.deadseascrolls.org.il/explore-the-archive/image/B-284648?locale=en_US> Click the link to see the image for yourself (Go to the very top fragment in the photo and blow it up. Then view the top three lines and you will see the portion of Enoch 1:9 found in the Dead Sea Scrolls). That's all you have in the text, but the few letters shown are enough to prove Enoch and Jude are not the same. There are words in the Aramaic not found in the Greek version of Jude.

12. Martinez, Florentino G. and Eibert J.C. Tigchelaar. "The Dead Sea Scrolls Study Edition, 2nd edition." Archive.org, 1999, pg. 413 (of the book) <https://archive.org/details/TheDeadSeaScrollsStudyEditionMartinezTigchelaar1999/page/n437> Click the link to page 413 of the book to see the translation of the fragment. Blow up the text so you can view the brackets [ ]. The words outside the brackets are what is seen on the fragment 15-17. The words inside the brackets are only assumed and not found in the Dead Sea fragment listed in footnote 11.

The Book of Enoch is Not Original

Jude said the real Enoch of Genesis, the 7th from Adam, was the first to prophecy of the Lord is coming with thousands of his holy ones to execute judgment and to convict, which is a message repeated throughout the Bible as seen below in similar scripture passages. Since evidence proves the Book of Enoch was likely written 300 BC to 100 AD, long after all the scriptures listed below, then that means the Book of Enoch is not writing a new revelation, but copying what has already been stated in the Bible.


“ He said, 'Yahweh came from Sinai, And rose from Seir to them. He shone forth from Mount Paran. He came from the ten thousands of holy ones. At his right hand was a fiery law for them. Yes, he loves the people. All his saints are in your hand. They sat down at your feet; [Everyone] shall receive of your words'." (Deuteronomy 33:2-3)

“The chariots of God are tens of thousands and thousands of thousands. The Lord is among them, from Sinai, into the sanctuary.” (Psalm 68:17)

“…Yahweh my God will come, and all the holy ones with you.” (Zechariah 14:5)

"For, behold, the LORD will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire. For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many." (Isaiah 66:15-16)

People often claim the Book of Enoch predicts the second coming of Christ, but that is not true at all. If you read the first chapter in the Book of Enoch, the context says the Lord will return to Mount Sinai (in Arabia), which is very different from the message in the Book of Revelation and Jude. So, the Book of Enoch is not talking about the second coming of Christ but about God the Father descending on Sinai as he did during the days of Moses.

The Book of Enoch and similar books may have been floating around during the Second Temple period, but this does not mean we should adopt them as accurate text or fully inspired writings. As we will see later, the Book of Enoch is full of colorful stories and errors, proving it is nothing more than a fable, which Paul under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit told us to avoid.

“Holding to the faithful word which is according to the teaching, that he may be able to exhort in the sound doctrine, and to convict those who contradict him. For there are also many unruly men, vain talkers and deceivers, especially those of the circumcision, whose mouths must be stopped; men who overthrow whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for dishonest gain's sake. One of them, a prophet of their own, said, ‘Cretans are always liars, evil beasts, and idle gluttons.’ This testimony is true. For this cause, reprove them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith, not paying attention to Jewish fables and commandments of men who turn away from the truth.” (Titus 1:9-14 WEB)

Jewish Fable - The Greek work "Mythos" (fables) can be defined as a story that's pretending to be true or a fable that undermines or attempts to replace the truth. Our ministry designed this page to show you evidence of how the Book of Enoch fits the description of a dangerous myth. Examples will be provided, showing how the Book of Enoch introduces ideas that run counter to the Bible while it pretends to be the legitimate work of Enoch, mentioned in Genesis. We heed the advice of Paul to "...Reprove them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith, not paying attention to Jewish fables..." This teaching is our attempt to stop people from going down a wrong path spiritually, in the hopes we can pull them from this Jewish myth (the Book of Enoch), and bring people back to a sound faith.

The Book of Enoch does not “fill in the gaps” of missing information as some claim, simply because they think the Bible gives an incomplete message on a topic. The word of God warns us about adding to his word.

“Don't you add to his words, lest he reprove you, and you be found a liar.” (Proverbs 30:6)

The canon of Old Testament scripture was confirmed long before Yeshua (Jesus) arrived. Yeshua himself confirmed the canon of Old Testament scripture in Matthew 23:35 and Luke 24:44. In addition, the early church and early historians confirmed the accuracy of Old Testament canon we now have today. Guess what? The Book of Enoch never made it in the Jewish Bible, nor the Septuagint, nor was it in the Catholic, Orthodox, or Protestant Bibles. The Book of Enoch was only accepted by the isolated Ethiopian churches, which severed ties with the majority of Christian churches. Here is a great article that goes into a little more detail about the canon of scripture.

Summary:

1. The only full text of the Book of Enoch comes from the Ethiopian text, which is dated from the 15th-century or later and shows errors, modifications and additions. The Aramaic text found in the Dead Sea Scrolls are not in full agreement with the Ethiopian text and the entire book of Parables is missing, which may indicate this section was a later edition made to the Ethiopian Book of Enoch.

2. People claim there are similarities between the Book of Enoch and certain scriptures in the Bible but often many of these so called similarities prove to be far from the same verbiage and message as the Bible.

3. The Epistle of Jude has a totally different message from the message found in the Book of Enoch, thus proving Jude did not directly quote from the Book of Enoch.

4. The Book of Enoch makes the outrageous claim that human women gave birth to 4,500-foot giants.

5. The Book of Enoch contradicts scripture by saying all sin in the world did not originate with Adam, but from a fallen angel named Azazel.

6. The Book of Enoch claims angels can cleanse the earth of all sin. This is counter to scripture and the message of the Gospel and makes the Book of Enoch heretical.

7. The Book of Enoch states that the human women who had sexual relations with fallen angels and gave birth to giants will also be transformed into mythical creatures known as “sirens,” which is Greek and Roman mythology.

8. The Book of Enoch states that in the last days the children of the holy elect will come down from heaven to be one with the children of men. This is another strange concept that disagrees with scripture.

9. Yeshua (Jesus) stated he was going to heaven to prepare a mansion for the righteous, but the Book of Enoch says sinners must be evicted from the heavenly mansions first.

10. The Bible says Yeshua (Jesus) shed his blood as the final sacrifice, but the Book of Enoch says God will still require a certain number of righteous to shed their blood as an offering required by God.

11. The Bible says those who are in hell will be cast into the lake of fire, but the Book of Enoch says that God will choose the righteous and holy from hell.

12. The Book of Enoch teaches that angels built the Ark, but the scriptures say Noah and his family built the Ark. As a sign of his obedience and faith to God, Noah took the instructions of God and completed the Ark. Angels are never mentioned as the builders of the Ark.

13. The Book of Enoch teaches Greek and Roman mythology, by claiming the Sun and Moon are beings that ride in chariots across the sky. Then the Book of Enoch adds further heresy, by stating this knowledge of the sun, moon,and the cosmos were given from heaven.

14. The Book of Enoch says that Noah’s father was fearful of Noah when he was born because Noah did not appear human and had eyes like laser beams that illuminated the entire house. In addition, the Book of Enoch says that Noah and his grandfather Methuselah were able to speak to Enoch from the edge of the earth and that Enoch appeared when summoned to shared secrets from heaven. Not only does this contradict scripture, but it's also occult teachings.

15. If this was truly God's word and his scripture, then he would have preserved it as he promised to do with his word, yet we don't see the Book of Enoch being preserved. For generations this book was hidden from God's people. "The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever. (Psalms 12:6-7)

16. All of these examples just scratch the surface. The Book of Enoch is filled with biblical contradictions and very strange accounts about the heavens, earth, humans, and angels. The Book of Enoch reflects a lot of pagan beliefs, which clearly shows it’s uninspired. This is why the Book of Enoch was rejected as scripture by both Christians and Jews, with the exception of Jewish and Christian sects in Ethiopia, or a handful of early church leaders. However, those who embrace the Book of Enoch cannot produce evidence to validate its inspiration, but there is ample internal and external evidence to prove the Book of Enoch is a dangerous false teachings.

What are the dangers of using the Book of Enoch?

The Apostle Paul said all scripture is inspired by God and is profitable for establishing doctrines (2 Timothy 3:16), but the Book of Enoch is contrary to scripture and proven to be uninspired. Therefore, we can never use the Book of Enoch for teaching or for doctrine. To the biblically ignorant, the book of Enoch might be appealing, but those who know the scripture will find the Book of Enoch full of idolatry, blasphemy, and heresy.

You can chose to ignore the instructions of the Apostle Paul, and continue to use “Jewish fables” (Titus 1:14) like the Book of Enoch as your proof text for teaching and doctrine, but this means the foundation of your doctrines and beliefs are ungodly, uninspired, and dangerous.

Therefore, our advice is that everyone should keep away from the Book of Enoch and instead of promoting it, believers should REFUTE IT!!!

REFUTEIT.COM

solite3:
Summary:

1. The only full text of the Book of Enoch comes from the Ethiopian text, which is dated from the 15th-century or later and shows errors, modifications and additions. The Aramaic text found in the Dead Sea Scrolls are not in full agreement with the Ethiopian text and the entire book of Parables is missing, which may indicate this section was a later edition made to the Ethiopian Book of Enoch.

2. People claim there are similarities between the Book of Enoch and certain scriptures in the Bible but often many of these so called similarities prove to be far from the same verbiage and message as the Bible.

3. The Epistle of Jude has a totally different message from the message found in the Book of Enoch, thus proving Jude did not directly quote from the Book of Enoch.

4. The Book of Enoch makes the outrageous claim that human women gave birth to 4,500-foot giants.

5. The Book of Enoch contradicts scripture by saying all sin in the world did not originate with Adam, but from a fallen angel named Azazel.

6. The Book of Enoch claims angels can cleanse the earth of all sin. This is counter to scripture and the message of the Gospel and makes the Book of Enoch heretical.

7. The Book of Enoch states that the human women who had sexual relations with fallen angels and gave birth to giants will also be transformed into mythical creatures known as “sirens,” which is Greek and Roman mythology.

8. The Book of Enoch states that in the last days the children of the holy elect will come down from heaven to be one with the children of men. This is another strange concept that disagrees with scripture.

9. Yeshua (Jesus) stated he was going to heaven to prepare a mansion for the righteous, but the Book of Enoch says sinners must be evicted from the heavenly mansions first.

10. The Bible says Yeshua (Jesus) shed his blood as the final sacrifice, but the Book of Enoch says God will still require a certain number of righteous to shed their blood as an offering required by God.

11. The Bible says those who are in hell will be cast into the lake of fire, but the Book of Enoch says that God will choose the righteous and holy from hell.

12. The Book of Enoch teaches that angels built the Ark, but the scriptures say Noah and his family built the Ark. As a sign of his obedience and faith to God, Noah took the instructions of God and completed the Ark. Angels are never mentioned as the builders of the Ark.

13. The Book of Enoch teaches Greek and Roman mythology, by claiming the Sun and Moon are beings that ride in chariots across the sky. Then the Book of Enoch adds further heresy, by stating this knowledge of the sun, moon,and the cosmos were given from heaven.

14. The Book of Enoch says that Noah’s father was fearful of Noah when he was born because Noah did not appear human and had eyes like laser beams that illuminated the entire house. In addition, the Book of Enoch says that Noah and his grandfather Methuselah were able to speak to Enoch from the edge of the earth and that Enoch appeared when summoned to shared secrets from heaven. Not only does this contradict scripture, but it's also occult teachings.

15. If this was truly God's word and his scripture, then he would have preserved it as he promised to do with his word, yet we don't see the Book of Enoch being preserved. For generations this book was hidden from God's people. "The words of the LORD are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times. Thou shalt keep them, O LORD, thou shalt preserve them from this generation for ever. (Psalms 12:6-7)

16. All of these examples just scratch the surface. The Book of Enoch is filled with biblical contradictions and very strange accounts about the heavens, earth, humans, and angels. The Book of Enoch reflects a lot of pagan beliefs, which clearly shows it’s uninspired. This is why the Book of Enoch was rejected as scripture by both Christians and Jews, with the exception of Jewish and Christian sects in Ethiopia, or a handful of early church leaders. However, those who embrace the Book of Enoch cannot produce evidence to validate its inspiration, but there is ample internal and external evidence to prove the Book of Enoch is a dangerous false teachings.

What are the dangers of using the Book of Enoch?

The Apostle Paul said all scripture is inspired by God and is profitable for establishing doctrines (2 Timothy 3:16), but the Book of Enoch is contrary to scripture and proven to be uninspired. Therefore, we can never use the Book of Enoch for teaching or for doctrine. To the biblically ignorant, the book of Enoch might be appealing, but those who know the scripture will find the Book of Enoch full of idolatry, blasphemy, and heresy.

You can chose to ignore the instructions of the Apostle Paul, and continue to use “Jewish fables” (Titus 1:14) like the Book of Enoch as your proof text for teaching and doctrine, but this means the foundation of your doctrines and beliefs are ungodly, uninspired, and dangerous.

Therefore, our advice is that everyone should keep away from the Book of Enoch and instead of promoting it, believers should REFUTE IT!!!

REFUTEIT.COM

My man no one is making the book of Enoch a doctrine . Chill bro.

For the single fact you think the sons of God are descendants of Seth, .

I love that book and I will read it till I get to heaven .

I didnt read all your comments as I will poke holes in every single point raised if I do. But I'd rather not brother.

Please dont read this book if you cant handle it. I wont because of a book make my brother fall .

Me I love the book and wont stop reading it and will even introduce my kids to it

@okcornel this guy mean am ok. See as em flood the thread

gobuchinny:


My man no one is making the book of Enoch a doctrine . Chill bro.

For the single fact you think the sons of God are descendants of Seth, .

I love that book and I will read it till I get to heaven .

I didnt read all your comments as I will poke holes in every single point raised if I do. But I'd rather not brother.

Please dont read this book if you cant handle it. I wont because of a book make my brother fall .

Me I love the book and wont stop reading it and will even introduce my kids to it

@okcornel this guy mean am ok. See as em flood the thread

I’m laughing hard here. For someone to go as far as castigating the Essenes just to invalidate the book of Enoch which was included alongside other scriptures found in the Dead Sea scrolls is so funny.


Now I know that guy copies and pastes stuffs without reading and analysing the details.


Let’s look at the doctrines and lifestyle of the Essenes in the next post from Josephus’ records.

OkCornel:



I’m laughing hard here. For someone to go as far as castigating the Essenes just to invalidate the book of Enoch which was included alongside other scriptures found in the Dead Sea scrolls is so funny.


Now I know that guy copies and pastes stuffs without reading and analysing the details.


Let’s look at the doctrines and lifestyle of the Essenes in the next post from Josephus’ records.

I didnt even bother reading the brothers post. For me iz like a student saying he knows calculux but cant execute BODMAS .

I know I will poke holes into every point highlighted but like I said, I'm not glorifying some book. YESHUA is King and as long as he believes that I'm good .

Everyone should do as they please because weather we read BOE or not it won't be important to please the Master

gobuchinny:


I didnt even bother reading the brothers post. For me iz like a student saying he knows calculux but cant execute BODMAS .

I know I will poke holes into every point highlighted but like I said, I'm not glorifying some book. YESHUA is King and as long as he believes that I'm good .

Everyone should do as they please because weather we read BOE or not it won't be important to please the Master

My main account was banned by the anti-spam bot.

Please look at the lifestyle and doctrine of the Essenes in my next post.

After that, we'll look at the striking similarities between Christianity and some other pagan beliefs.

Then I'll laugh even harder at logic behind using the theory of similarities to condemn the Essenes sect, but at the same time...turn a blind eye to that of Christianity.

If someone can condemn the Essenes on the grounds of similarity to non-Jewish beliefs...I wonder why that same person is hesitant to do same to Christianity.

THE LIFESTYLE AND IDEOLOGY OF THE ESSENES

COPIED FROM : THE WAR OF THE JEWS - BY JOSEPHUS FLAVIUS
Book 2 Chapter 8 v 2-4

2. For there are three philosophical sects among the Jews. The followers of the first of which are the Pharisees; of the second, the Sadducees; and the third sect, which pretends to a severer discipline, are called Essens. These last are Jews by birth, and seem to have a greater affection for one another than the other sects have. These Essens reject pleasures as an evil, but esteem continence, and the conquest over our passions, to be virtue. They neglect wedlock, but choose out other persons children, while they are pliable, and fit for learning, and esteem them to be of their kindred, and form them according to their own manners. They do not absolutely deny the fitness of marriage, and the succession of mankind thereby continued; but they guard against the lascivious behavior of women, and are persuaded that none of them preserve their fidelity to one man.

3. These men are despisers of riches, and so very communicative as raises our admiration. Nor is there any one to be found among them who hath more than another; for it is a law among them, that those who come to them must let what they have be common to the whole order,—insomuch that among them all there is no appearance of poverty, or excess of riches, but every one's possessions are intermingled with every other's possessions; and so there is, as it were, one patrimony among all the brethren. They think that oil is a defilement; and if any one of them be anointed without his own approbation, it is wiped off his body; for they think to be sweaty is a good thing, as they do also to be clothed in white garments. They also have stewards appointed to take care of their common affairs, who every one of them have no separate business for any, but what is for the uses of them all.

4. They have no one certain city, but many of them dwell in every city; and if any of their sect come from other places, what they have lies open for them, just as if it were their own; and they go in to such as they never knew before, as if they had been ever so long acquainted with them. For which reason they carry nothing at all with them when they travel into remote parts, though still they take their weapons with them, for fear of thieves. Accordingly, there is, in every city where they live, one appointed particularly to take care of strangers, and to provide garments and other necessaries for them. But the habit and management of their bodies is such as children use who are in fear of their masters. Nor do they allow of the change of garments or of shoes till be first torn to pieces, or worn out by time. Nor do they either buy or sell any thing to one another; but every one of them gives what he hath to him that wanteth it, and receives from him again in lieu of it what may be convenient for himself; and although there be no requital made, they are fully allowed to take what they want of whomsoever they please.

THE LIFESTYLE AND IDEOLOGY OF THE ESSENES CONT'D

COPIED FROM : THE WAR OF THE JEWS - BY JOSEPHUS FLAVIUS
Book 2 Chapter 8 v 5-6

5. And as for their piety towards God, it is very extraordinary; for before sun-rising they speak not a word about profane matters, but put up certain prayers which they have received from their forefathers, as if they made a supplication for its rising. After this every one of them are sent away by their curators, to exercise some of those arts wherein they are skilled, in which they labor with great diligence till the fifth hour. After which they assemble themselves together again into one place; and when they have clothed themselves in white veils, they then bathe their bodies in cold water. And after this purification is over, they every one meet together in an apartment of their own, into which it is not permitted to any of another sect to enter; while they go, after a pure manner, into the dining-room, as into a certain holy temple, and quietly set themselves down; upon which the baker lays them loaves in order; the cook also brings a single plate of one sort of food, and sets it before every one of them; but a priest says grace before meat; and it is unlawful for any one to taste of the food before grace be said. The same priest, when he hath dined, says grace again after meat; and when they begin, and when they end, they praise God, as he that bestows their food upon them; after which they lay aside their [white] garments, and betake themselves to their labors again till the evening; then they return home to supper, after the same manner; and if there be any strangers there, they sit down with them. Nor is there ever any clamor or disturbance to pollute their house, but they give every one leave to speak in their turn; which silence thus kept in their house appears to foreigners like some tremendous mystery; the cause of which is that perpetual sobriety they exercise, and the same settled measure of meat and drink that is allotted them, and that such as is abundantly sufficient for them.

6. And truly, as for other things, they do nothing but according to the injunctions of their curators; only these two things are done among them at everyone's own free-will, which are to assist those that want it, and to show mercy; for they are permitted of their own accord to afford succor to such as deserve it, when they stand in need of it, and to bestow food on those that are in distress; but they cannot give any thing to their kindred without the curators. They dispense their anger after a just manner, and restrain their passion. They are eminent for fidelity, and are the ministers of peace; whatsoever they say also is firmer than an oath; but swearing is avoided by them, and they esteem it worse than perjury 4 for they say that he who cannot be believed without [swearing by] God is already condemned. They also take great pains in studying the writings of the ancients, and choose out of them what is most for the advantage of their soul and body; and they inquire after such roots and medicinal stones as may cure their distempers.

THE LIFESTYLE AND IDEOLOGY OF THE ESSENES CONT'D

COPIED FROM : THE WAR OF THE JEWS - BY JOSEPHUS FLAVIUS
Book 2 Chapter 8 v 7-8

7. But now if any one hath a mind to come over to their sect, he is not immediately admitted, but he is prescribed the same method of living which they use for a year, while he continues excluded'; and they give him also a small hatchet, and the fore-mentioned girdle, and the white garment. And when he hath given evidence, during that time, that he can observe their continence, he approaches nearer to their way of living, and is made a partaker of the waters of purification; yet is he not even now admitted to live with them; for after this demonstration of his fortitude, his temper is tried two more years; and if he appear to be worthy, they then admit him into their society. And before he is allowed to touch their common food, he is obliged to take tremendous oaths, that, in the first place, he will exercise piety towards God, and then that he will observe justice towards men, and that he will do no harm to any one, either of his own accord, or by the command of others; that he will always hate the wicked, and be assistant to the righteous; that he will ever show fidelity to all men, and especially to those in authority, because no one obtains the government without God's assistance; and that if he be in authority, he will at no time whatever abuse his authority, nor endeavor to outshine his subjects either in his garments, or any other finery; that he will be perpetually a lover of truth, and propose to himself to reprove those that tell lies; that he will keep his hands clear from theft, and his soul from unlawful gains; and that he will neither conceal any thing from those of his own sect, nor discover any of their doctrines to others, no, not though anyone should compel him so to do at the hazard of his life. Moreover, he swears to communicate their doctrines to no one any otherwise than as he received them himself; that he will abstain from robbery, and will equally preserve the books belonging to their sect, and the names of the angels 5 [or messengers]. These are the oaths by which they secure their proselytes to themselves.

8. But for those that are caught in any heinous sins, they cast them out of their society; and he who is thus separated from them does often die after a miserable manner; for as he is bound by the oath he hath taken, and by the customs he hath been engaged in, he is not at liberty to partake of that food that he meets with elsewhere, but is forced to eat grass, and to famish his body with hunger, till he perish; for which reason they receive many of them again when they are at their last gasp, out of compassion to them, as thinking the miseries they have endured till they came to the very brink of death to be a sufficient punishment for the sins they had been guilty of.

THE LIFESTYLE AND IDEOLOGY OF THE ESSENES CONT'D

COPIED FROM : THE WAR OF THE JEWS - BY JOSEPHUS FLAVIUS
Book 2 Chapter 8 v 9-10;

9. But in the judgments they exercise they are most accurate and just, nor do they pass sentence by the votes of a court that is fewer than a hundred. And as to what is once determined by that number, it is unalterable. What they most of all honor, after God himself, is the name of their legislator [Moses], whom if any one blaspheme he is punished capitally. They also think it a good thing to obey their elders, and the major part. Accordingly, if ten of them be sitting together, no one of them will speak while the other nine are against it. They also avoid spitting in the midst of them, or on the right side. Moreover, they are stricter than any other of the Jews in resting from their labors on the seventh day; for they not only get their food ready the day before, that they may not be obliged to kindle a fire on that day, but they will not remove any vessel out of its place, nor go to stool thereon. Nay, on other days they dig a small pit, a foot deep, with a paddle [which kind of hatchet is given them when they are first admitted among them]; and covering themselves round with their garment, that they may not affront the Divine rays of light, they ease themselves into that pit, after which they put the earth that was dug out again into the pit; and even this they do only in the more lonely places, which they choose out for this purpose; and although this easement of the body be natural, yet it is a rule with them to wash themselves after it, as if it were a defilement to them.

10. Now after the time of their preparatory trial is over, they are parted into four classes; and so far are the juniors inferior to the seniors, that if the seniors should be touched by the juniors, they must wash themselves, as if they had intermixed themselves with the company of a foreigner. They are long-lived also, insomuch that many of them live above a hundred years, by means of the simplicity of their diet; nay, as I think, by means of the regular course of life they observe also. They contemn the miseries of life, and are above pain, by the generosity of their mind. And as for death, if it will be for their glory, they esteem it better than living always; and indeed our war with the Romans gave abundant evidence what great souls they had in their trials, wherein, although they were tortured and distorted, burnt and torn to pieces, and went through all kinds of instruments of torment, that they might be forced either to blaspheme their legislator, or to eat what was forbidden them, yet could they not be made to do either of them, no, nor once to flatter their tormentors, or to shed a tear; but they smiled in their very pains, and laughed those to scorn who inflicted the torments upon them, and resigned up their souls with great alacrity, as expecting to receive them again.

Na wa for anti-spam bot

OkCornel2:


My main account was banned by the anti-spam bot.

Please look at the lifestyle and doctrine of the Essenes in my next post.

After that, we'll look at the striking similarities between Christianity and some other pagan beliefs.

Then I'll laugh even harder at logic behind using the theory of similarities to condemn the Essenes sect, but at the same time...turn a blind eye to that of Christianity.

If someone can condemn the Essenes on the grounds of similarity to non-Jewish beliefs...I wonder why that same person is hesitant to do same to Christianity.

I'm with you brother

FINAL PART

NOW BASED ON THE LAST POST, JOSEPHUS COMPARED THE DOCTRINE OF THE ESSENES TO SOME GREEK BELIEFS WHICH AN IGNORANT FELLOW USED TO SLANDER THE ESSENES.

NOW DOES IT MAKE SENSE TO EXAMINE THE SIMILARITIES BETWEEN CHRISTIANITY AND OTHER RELIGIONS & OR PAGAN BELIEFS...AND ON THAT GROUNDS SLANDER CHRISTIANITY?

For a start, let's look at some similarities between Christianity & Bhuddism (which was an established religion prior to Christianity)

And just to add to the ignorant attacks being made on the Ethiopian Orthodox Tewahedo Church because they regard the book of Enoch and other extra books as scriptures.

Take a look at the role the Ethiopian Church played in the reformation;

Influence on the Reformation
David Daniels has suggested that the Ethiopian church has had a stronger impact on the Reformation than most scholars acknowledge. For Martin Luther, who spearheaded the Reformation, Daniels says "the Ethiopian Church conferred legitimacy on Luther’s emerging Protestant vision of a church outside the authority of the Roman Catholic papacy" as it was "an ancient church with direct ties to the apostles". According to Daniels, Martin Luther saw that the Ethiopian Orthodox Church practiced elements of faith including "communion in both kind, vernacular Scriptures, and married clergy" and these practices became customary in the Lutheran churches.

In 1534, a cleric of the Ethiopian Orthodox Church, Michael the Deacon, met with Martin Luther and affirmed the Augsburg Confession as a "good creed".In addition, Martin Luther stated that the Lutheran Mass agreed with that used by the Ethiopian Orthodox Church. As a result, the Lutheran Churches extended full communion with the Ethiopian Orthodox Church.


SOURCES;

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/geneveith/2017/11/how-ethiopia-influenced-the-reformation/

Daniels, David D. (21 October 2017). "Honor the Reformation's African roots". The Commercial Appeal. Retrieved 9 April 2018.

Daniels, David D. (2 November 2017). "Martin Luther and Ethiopian Christianity: Historical Traces". University of Chicago. Retrieved 9 April 2018. Luther expressed his approval of the Church of Ethiopia along with his embrace of Deacon Michael in a letter dated July 4, 1534: “For this reason we ask that good people would demonstrate Christian love also to this [Ethiopian] visitor.” According to Luther, Michael responded positively to his articles of the Christian faith, proclaiming: “This is a good creed, that is, faith” (see Martin Luther, Table-Talk, November 17, 1538 [WA, TR 4:152-153, no. 4126]).

Daniels, David D. (31 October 2017). "Martin Luther's fascination with Ethiopian Christianity". The Christian Century. Retrieved 9 April 2018. Luther extended full fellowship to Deacon Michael and the Ethiopian Church, an invitation Luther withheld from the Bohemian Brethren (the Hussites) and Reformed Churches connected to Ulrich Zwingli.

OkCornel:


Please educate us further, when is the perfect time to answer a fool, and when not to answer a fool? Oh well, I guess that is a totally subjective matter to be swept under the carpet of "wisdom to know the difference"



Per the bolded, please why are you dodging questions on the extra books in the first version of the KJV Bible? Or are those extra books no longer scriptural authority? Same goes for the extra books in the Ethiopian Bible.


Please and please, can you point out where I claimed the 66 books are not inspired? My position has been clear on this thread. GOD'S WORD CANNOT BE LIMITED TO A SET OF BOOKS? An eternal God who has been talking before man invented ink and paper suddenly has all His words limited to 66 books?
Take for example a prophecy/revelation from God concerning Nigeria that comes to pass in our time, is that prophecy/revelation the word of God? Yes or No. Must one cross check and look for where Nigeria is written in the Bible before one concludes the prophecy/revelation is from God?



Please can you point out where I claimed the 66 books are not "inspired"? Are you finding it difficult to understand what I've been saying all this while is GOD'S WORDS CANNOT BE LIMITED TO 66 BOOKS?


Absolutely yes, you cannot rule out the impact of errors made by imperfect men in the course of writing down the words of an perfect God.



Refer to my answer in (c) above. God is perfect, but man is subject to bias, errors and mistakes. The imperfections of man cannot be used as a basis to evaluate whether God is a liar or not.





I was predictably expecting you to use the case of Job to explain the obvious contradiction between 2 Samuel 24:1 and 1 Chronicles 21:1.
Please bear in mind, according to you and the 66 books crew, the 66 books are the inspired and complete words of God. Can you point out where exactly God had a meeting with Satan, authorizing Satan to tempt David?



Per the bolded, please I don't want your assumptions. The 66 books of the Bible is the complete word of God right? Kindly point out where God had a meeting with Satan permitting him to tempt David.

I guess if we use this assumption of yours, perhaps Satan was the one who also hardened Pharoah's heart with God's permission



Did you miss out on the total package Ornan offered to David in both 1 Chronicles 21 v 23 and 2 Samuel 24 v 21-22?

1 Chronicles 21 v 23-25;
23 And Ornan said unto David, Take it to thee, and let my lord the king do that which is good in his eyes: lo, I give thee the oxen also for burnt offerings, and the threshing instruments for wood, and the wheat for the meat offering; I give it all.

2 Samuel 24 v 21-22
21 And Araunah said, Wherefore is my lord the king come to his servant? And David said, To buy the threshingfloor of thee, to build an altar unto the Lord, that the plague may be stayed from the people.
22 And Araunah said unto David, Let my lord the king take and offer up what seemeth good unto him: behold, here be oxen for burnt sacrifice, and threshing instruments and other instruments of the oxen for wood.

Please and please, where in this discussion between David and Araunah a.k.a. Ornan did the seller (Ornan) imply in anyway threshing floor is totally different from the land David bought? Is this your subtle addition into the 66 books representing the complete word of God?




Ah yes... argument ad populum is a fallacy when majority of scholars concludes the book of Enoch was written well before book of Jude, But argument ad populum is not a fallacy when most christians believe only 66 books makes up the complete inspired words of God...
I love the double standards at play here.

Per the bolded, so sticking to the views of a professor via personal e-mails exchanged with inquirers is a more persuasive evidence than researched findings documented on various christian and religious encyclopedias out there? I'm really baffled.




Bros, abeg we all went to school here, stop twisting the obvious.

You clearly claimed I lied when I said you modified your posts to Jamesid29;


https://www.nairaland.com/5450889/why-book-enoch-removed-bible/8#83327413

And same you now turned around to contradict yourself here.

https://www.nairaland.com/5450889/why-book-enoch-removed-bible/9#83328261

Dude, keep on defending your lies here.



^^^^
Just look at another blatant lie here, I asked you this simple question on more than one occasion. Did you modify your posts to Jamesid29? Yes or No?


https://www.nairaland.com/5450889/why-book-enoch-removed-bible/8#83326873


And I still insist, these two posts of yours to Jam.esid29 had next to nothing in them before you pasted a whole lot in there.
https://www.nairaland.com/5450889/why-book-enoch-removed-bible/3#83179902
https://www.nairaland.com/5450889/why-book-enoch-removed-bible/3#83179929

About Proverbs 24:5-6.
Your challenge was to resolve the contradiction, was it not? Well, there is no contradiction between both verses. It was all in your mind.

Extra Books in some translations.
About the extra books you have kept asking about, as I said before, it is not my concern what you want to believe. The only thing that is truly Scripture is whatever has the life of God in it, that is, whatever is inspired by the Lord God. If you can see the quality of life in ancient Greek pagan poetry, then by all means consider it Scripture as well. It's not my problem. For those of us who believe in the Lord Jesus, God Who became Man to die for the sins of the world, there are only 66 books which possess that quality of life. We are content to receive those as the Oracles of God. You don't have to accept them too. The Mormons have a whole other book in addition to the Bible. The Muslims do not even care for the Bible, they have the Qur'an. You don't have to accept the 66 books that Evangelical Protestants accept. You don't have to accept anything at all. If you consider your own self inspired, you could even write your own Scriptures. Believe me, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. It's not my problem.


About the inspiration of the 66 books and inspiration in general.
As for your position on the inspiration of the 66 books, I have seen your answer. You do consider them inspired, but you hold that an inspired book can contradict itself.

Regarding this position then that an inspired work can contradict itself, you claim that the imperfection of men can corrupt a work inspired by God, but this is what the Bible (and you do accept that the 66 books are inspired, remember) says,

[21]...no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.
2 Peter 1:21 NASB

That is, human will is never involved in prophecy. The only sense in which it is is that the prophet has the choice to prophesy, that is, to deliver God's Message, or to not do so (Ezekiel 3:17-21; compare the example of Jonah). But he cannot manufacture, adapt, correct, or in any sense alter that Message for any reason. So, you are wrong. The imperfection of man has nothing to do with the Oracles of God. Therefore, an inspired work can never contradict itself, since it is entirely God's Truth.

Concerning 2 Samuel 24:1 and 1 Chronicles 21:1
I will ask you a question of my own, and if you answer me, I will also give you an answer to your question. Here's my question:

Where does the Bible say that your extra books including your book of Enoch is inspired by God?

Concerning the transaction between David and Araunah/Ornan
This is what the Bible says:
[24]However, the king said to Araunah, "No, but I will surely buy it from you for a price, for I will not offer burnt offerings to the LORD my God which cost me nothing." So David bought the threshing floor and the oxen for fifty shekels of silver.
2 Samuel 24:24 NASB

[25]So David gave Ornan 600 shekels of gold by weight for the site.
1 Chronicles 21:25 NASB

Re: Re: The Matter of Scholarship
1. About argumentum ad populum, it is not my responsibility to satisfy your standards whatever they may be. My argument is simple: things do not become true because the most people believe it. That is principle of reasoning. This principle is why it doesn't impress me that you can appeal to all the scholars in the world, if I can only appeal to one. The question is whether your scholars are right and mine is wrong, or whether mine is right and yours are wrong. That's all. The double standards that you are complaining about don't concern me.

2. About the mode of communication, this again is a travesty of reasoning. Does the mode of communication change the quality of the knowledge passed? If a professor tells his child in the privacy of his home that the earth orbits the sun, is that then an unreliable bit of information because he did not present it to the child in a peer-reviewed article? The professor I quoted simply shared with correspondents in personal emails and in colloquial form information that he has already developed in research and very likely published in multiple scholarly material. He, after all, is a professor. You don't become a professor by conjecturing in personal emails, do you?

Re: Re: Your accusations of me
1. Of course, I claimed you lied. Does the fact that I said that your accusation was a travesty mean that you did not lie? I did provide definitions for the word in my post, and you just claimed that you went to school. What more do you want me to do for you?

2. As I said, your lie was not that you said that I modified my posts to Jamesid29. It was that you claimed that I did so without warning and that I posted copious amounts of information in posts that I had made prior without such information on them. Both were lies. You already admitted to your mistake in the first when you went and saw that I did warn that I edited my second post. But you have maintained your second lie until now.

3. You have the ability and the right to insist on anything you please, but no one can force the truth to become a lie or force the lie to become true. So, insist all you want, but until you can actually prove that I did in fact post copious amounts of text in posts I had previously made without such text in them, you, sir, are a liar, and a vicious one for fighting so hard to impugn my character for no just cause.

OkCornel1:

Good morning sir, hope you don't mind me jumping into the conversation for a bit.
I've been following the thread for a bit and its a bit clear that everyone has strong feelings about status of the book of Enoch.
I don't believe the BoE is scripture for a couple of reasons one being, it was never accepted universally as such at any point in church history. But at the same time we know the book was highly revered and read by the early christain community and a few church fathers did allude to it as scripture or at the very least wanted to give it such a status, so I also do not believe reading the book would lead anyone down the wrong path.(except for someone who is reading it with the wrong agenda).

Based on this, I really do not think we should allow the the status of the book of Enoch to cause such a big divide, as in the grand scheme of things, its status doesn't really change or affect any of the main tenets of the christain faith or it's doctrines.

I would like to suggest probably applying what was written down in scripture by Paul the apostle in 1cor 8: 1-13 about exercising our right to do certain things but not becoming a stumbling block to those whose conscience might be affected. In essence, if so many people feel so strongly about how evil the book is here, I think its just better to let it be and not even defend the book .But when you're amongst other believers who find the book valuable or in someway are open to have just a regular conversation about it, then you can share what you know and learnt with a free mind.

Just a suggestion sir .Have a wonderful Wednesday.