Five years down the line and no one still knows the difference.... SMH..

Estharfabian:
You're damn right bout the immaturity part!


I was barely 3 when I met my first Love.... Nigga was cute, Kind and very Romantic! He sacrificed His pencil for me When I had none..


Still can't recall his name tho....

Wow.... Hope you're married now?

yorex2011:
Very good article

Thanks, sorry it's Coming late... Just letting you know that, 3years down the line I still appreciate your comment.

Khd95:
As usual i came to read comments

Hope you've stopped the habit, about three years has passed o...
We all need encouragement from each other from time to time, so your comment will always be appreciated may be not this thread but on any other one that you feel will add value to you.. Thanks.
Prinzfavian

Ever since I left the City....

What happened?

I swear, I didn't read that shiit

Lol, even after two years, I still can't stop laughing at your comment.... Lol.

The phone has been stolen..

PSTEMMA1960:
my brother pls dnt read ur bible upside down.. ones one goes to hell thier is no hope of the person going to the paradise again after the final judgement..

if a man/woman dies, they spirit would be judged immediately, that's first judgement..

if the person live a righteous life while on earth, he/she goes to Abraham bosom, and on the other hand if the person lived a sinful life he or she goes to hell fire..

then on the day of the final judgement, all the people both in hell and Abraham bosom will come out..

and God will now judge everyone one by one for all to see...

then those that came out from abraham bosom will be rewarded according to thier work while on earth, and those that came out from hell will then be trown into the lake of fire..

so don't let anyone deceive u by telling u that there is still hope for anyone that is in hell to later go to heaven..

What is this? Jeez!

aigboeben:

I hail you o! Gospel preached to them that are dead that they might be judged according to men in the flesh ? How can the dead be judged according to men in the flesh, if by your claim they are in the flesh?
By the way your explanation of Hebrews 4vs12 is worse than the change we get from APC

Smiles, Let me try again Boss.
1peter 4:6 is referring to those that are dead spiritually and not those literally dead, because those literally dead are not conscious of anything at all (eccl 9:5)...
Many questions will arise that needs answer if the "dead" as used in that verse is literal,
1. Which "dead" are they? Those that died before Christ or after..? If it was those before Christ, why preach to them since they will still be resurrected for the same reason later on in future? (acts 24:15)
2. There are those dead in Christ too (1thess 4:16), are they among the dead that were preached to? If yes, why? Since they already died faithful and was only waiting to receive their Everlasting reward...
3. Won't the preacher be disobeying God's commandment at deuteronomy 18:11 of not finding anyone among God's people who is a..... Necromancer(someone that inquires or talks to the dead...)?

These are just few of All the questions that beckons for answer if as you claim, the "dead" is literal...

But as I said earlier, ephesians 2:1 helps us to see who these "dead" are... These are those that are dead in their trespasses and sins... In a way spiritually dead. So they needed to be preached to also, so that they can be judged on the same basis as those that are spiritually conscious (those said to be living)....

Before I go further, sorry I didn't ask earlier,
what's your own verdict of both verses, Hebrews 4:12 and 1pet 4:6?

aigboeben:

Was it after he resurrected he preached to the dead according to 1 Peter 4vs6

Lol... Boss...
That verse wasn't even talking about Jesus, but the Christians from the days of the apostles down to our day... The dead there are the spiritually unconscious ones, not literally dead people... And whereas, it was imprisoned spirits Jesus preached too, disobedient ones of old not to the dead... Eph 2:1 puts more light on 1pet 4:6

Thanks Boss.

aigboeben:

Busted! 1 Peter 3vs18-20 says otherwise.

Busted! How? Well I like your sense of humour... Okay to the Bible portion you cited.... 1 Peter 3 vs 18-20...
I don't see anything in that verse that contradicts what I have been saying... Jesus was dead all through the three days... Verses 18...help us see that he was made alive in spirit, Boss this was after the third day and not during the three days of his death as you think...(1cor 15:45)....also read 1 cor 15:20...
So the preaching recorded in verses 19 and 20 of 1 Peter was carried out by Jesus as a spirit after he had been resurrected... Not during his three days in the middle of the earth (Matthew 12:40)...he was sleeping during those periods, just as his friend lazarus whom he himself resurrected did when he was dead for four days... (John 11:11-13)
Thank you Boss.

aigboeben:

Was Jesus active in the 3days he was dead? Why do you all skip this question?

I already did... He wasn't.... No one can be active while dead...
That would have been hypocrisy.

aigboeben:

About the long epistle, ko si wahala! Was Jesus active in the 3 days he was dead( beyond the earthly realm)? Dear you didn't respond to my other questions on Matthew 10vs28 and Hebrews 4vs 12

Lol, Thanks... I've responded, sorry it came in a bit late...
Jesus wasn't alive,he was dead,no part of him was somewhere else...Unconscious of nothing at all.... (matthew 12:40, eccl 9:5)

aigboeben:

But Jesus said TODAY? Beloved, we can't change that. Don't you think Abraham's bosom is a figurative expression of Abraham's location after his death (same place the righteous will be)?
Can you correlate your claim of the body being part of the soul and the statement of Jesus in Matthew 10vs28 in which he placed a demarcation between the soul and the body? I think Hebrews 4vs12 separates the three entities

Now regarding the issue of the Bible chapters and verses you cited....
First, Matthew 10:28: as I said earlier, The soul according to the scriptures basically means:
1. People
2. Animal and
3. The life that an animal or that a person has...
Now looking closely at that Bible book of Matthew 10:28, the 3rd definition of the soul fits in perfectly....
That passage reads:"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell".... Now if as I claim, that the soul is the person himself and not something intangible that is inside of a person, then how is it possible to kill the body and not kill the soul since the soul is the person humself..... Jesus here was talking about resurrection, that his followers should not be afraid of those that would kill them (just as they would later go on to kill him too) just because they are Christ follower because if any of them should loose their life because of him they will preserve it till a later time when they will get it back again (resurrection) - luke 17:33....
He goes on and says... But fear him that can destroy both the body and soul in hell..... Meaning, we should not be afraid of men but God who is the source of life, and can choose to either resurrect us or not when we die...

Hebrews 4:12.... ".... Piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joint and marrow...." To understand the sense in which soul and spirit is used in the context, we need to read it carefully....
This verse is emphasising the powerfulness of the word of God, so powerful and effective that it can bring about the most impossible kind of change in ones life, it can touch the deepest part of your heart and help you make some difficult changes in your life even such as difficult as the dividing of soul and spirit, and joints from marrow...
It doesn't mean the soul and spirit is being inhabited in the body...

aigboeben:

But Jesus said TODAY? Beloved, we can't change that. Don't you think Abraham's bosom is a figurative expression of Abraham's location after his death (same place the righteous will be)?
Can you correlate your claim of the body being part of the soul and the statement of Jesus in Matthew 10vs28 in which he placed a demarcation between the soul and the body? I think Hebrews 4vs12 separates the three entities

Boss, Many translations presents Jesus statement at luke 23:43 in different way, The punctuation shown in the rendering of these words @ luke 23:43 must, of course, depend on the translator’s understanding of the sense of Jesus’ words, since no punctuation was used in the original Greek text. Punctuation in the modern style did not become common until about the ninth century C.E. Whereas many translations place a comma before the word “today” and thereby give the impression that the evildoer entered Paradise that same day, there is nothing in the rest of the Scriptures to support this. Jesus himself was dead and in the tomb until the third day and was then resurrected as “the firstfruits” of the resurrection. (Ac 10:40; 1Co 15:20; Col 1:18) He ascended to heaven 40 days later.—Joh 20:17; Ac 1:1-3, 9.
There fore, The evidence is, therefore, that Jesus’ use of the word “today” was not to give the time of the evildoer’s being in Paradise but, rather, to call attention to the time in which the promise was being made and during which the evildoer had shown a measure of faith in Jesus. It was a day when Jesus had been rejected and condemned by the highest-ranking religious leaders of his own people and was thereafter sentenced to die by Roman authority. He had become an object of scorn and ridicule. So the wrongdoer alongside him had shown a notable quality and commendable heart attitude in not going along with the crowd but, rather, speaking out in Jesus’ behalf and expressing belief in his coming Kingship. Recognizing that the emphasis is correctly placed on the time of the promise’s being made rather than on The evidence is, therefore, that Jesus’ use of the word “today” was not to give the time of the evildoer’s being in Paradise but, rather, to call attention to the time in which the promise was being made and during which the evildoer had shown a measure of faith in Jesus. It was a day when Jesus had been rejected and condemned by the highest-ranking religious leaders of his own people and was thereafter sentenced to die by Roman authority. He had become an object of scorn and ridicule. So the wrongdoer alongside him had shown a notable quality and commendable heart attitude in not going along with the crowd but, rather, speaking out in Jesus’ behalf and expressing belief in his coming Kingship. Recognizing that the emphasis is correctly placed on the time of the promise’s being made rather than on the time of its fulfillment. As to the identification of the Paradise of which Jesus spoke, it is clearly not synonymous with the heavenly Kingdom of Christ. Earlier that day entry into that heavenly Kingdom had been held out as a prospect for Jesus’ faithful disciples but on the basis of their having ‘stuck with him in his trials,’ something the evildoer had never done, his dying alongside Jesus being purely for his own criminal acts. (Lu 22:28-30; 23:40, 41) The evildoer obviously had not been “born again,” of water and spirit, which Jesus showed was a prerequisite to entry into the Kingdom of the heavens. (Joh 3:3-6) Nor was the evildoer one of the ‘conquerors’ that the glorified Christ Jesus stated would be with him on his heavenly throne and that have a share in “the first resurrection.”—Re 3:11, 12, 21; 12:10, 11; 14:1-4; 20:4-6.
Sorry for the long epistle.

aigboeben:

Obviously Abraham's bossom is a physical location, whether you call it parable or not. Jesus is enough history, Abraham is someone we know and was regarded in that account in the light of our knowledge of him . One obvious truth in the account is that there is a clear distinction in location for the just and the unjust after death. Could that location of the just(Abraham's bossom) as seen in the passage be the said Paradise? Jesus told the thief on the cross TODAY you shall be with me in paradise

Yes, there is a clear distinction as per the eternal location of the righteous and unrighteous... The paradise Jesus promised to the thief on when dying is an earthly one, which is yet to come or not existing NOW.... And that's where the likes of Abraham himself and many more faithfuls of old and those of our time will be.
Abraham's bosom isn't a physical location...

aigboeben:

I am enjoying this discuss, but I must be quick to say there is no scriptural proof that paradise is here on Earth, not even the Psalm 37vs11 you quoted( I stand to be corrected) . Where is the location of Abraham's bossom? Like you said the breath of God in Genesis 2vs7 stands for the spirit of man ,that gave man the capacity to relate with this earthly realm. If it is the spirit that made the clay a living being, doesn't the spirit stand more as the real 'force'? Is heaven a soulish realm or a spirit realm?

Heaven is a spirit realm.
Yes, the spirit is the real force.
There is no location for Abraham's bosom, cos it's not a literal place, the truth is Abraham wasn't the only faithful person of that era to have been special enough to have a literal place of his own where people that finds favour with God go to when they die..... We had likes of Abel, Enoch even Noah that existed long before him, so where would such ones have been since obviously Abraham's bosom wouldn't have been existing when they died?.... Brother, Abraham's bosom can also mean Abraham's side... So in a literal sense, lazarus was taken to Abraham's side ( i.e where Abraham was) [luke 16:23], just like the two sides of a team on a pitch, if the score is not even then, there is obviously a "winning side" and a "loosing side".... So everyone on the winning side will be said to be on the winning side and some for the loosing side.... Same way, Abraham's bosom or Abraham's side connotes where Abraham is... So the question is, where is Abraham now?
Where do you think he is now?

aigboeben:

Is his grave Abraham's bossom? What exactly is Abraham's bossom?

Bosom can also refer to the breast or chest part of the body...
What does it mean to be in someone's Bosom? A close look at the 23rd verse of the 13th chapter of the book of John will help us out.... We see there that one of Jesus' favourite disciple was said to be leaning on Jesus' Bosom... Which also means he was closest to him in the manner with which they were sitting...
Now if the account of luke 16:19-31 is to be taking literally, it would mean that those enjoying divine favour could all fit at the bosom of one man, Abraham; and that a mere drop of water would bring relief to one suffering in hades... And all these will lead to contradictions in the Bible but it's an establish fact that the Bible doesn't contradict itself in fact it explains itself....
Take into consideration that the account is a story that has no historical backings... Hence, the principal subjects, such as "the rich man", "lazarus" and "abraham" must have represented some important details that Jesus was trying to pass across in a message to his listeners...
One reasonable question one should ask is, if lazarus went to Abraham's bosom, where was Abraham himself?
The end note is that, that account at luke 16:19-31 is a parable that has a special meaning and should not be taken literally.

aigboeben:

You have not provided answer to my question. Let me add some more :
1)Which part of Man goes to Paradise (if he makes it) after his death?
2) In Genesis 2vs7 what does the breath of God stand for?
3) If indeed as the scriptures have it in Ezekiel , the soul dies then is the soul only useful here on Earth?
4) Is the soul a material or immaterial part of Man?

I already did boss, but I'll answer these ones too...

1). Before we can deduce in what form man will be in paradise, we first need to know the location of this paradise... Is it on earth or in heaven, because if it's heaven... Then flesh and blood can't survive there (1cor 15:50)...automatically, man's form or being has to be spiritual... That is, man will be a spirit....
But according to history, the precious paradise we had wasn't in heaven but here on Earth (gen 2:8, 9, 15)... So it's reasonable to conclude that the location of paradise will be here on Earth (psalms 37:11)....and if that's the case, the form of Man will be the way it is now, A soul, only that we will be perfect just the way Adam was before he sinned.

2). The breath of God there stands for the "spirit", that's why it's said at ecclesiastes 12:7 to return to God who gave it at Genesis 2:7.

3) Well, according to the same scripture, a soul consist of flesh and spirit, and hence can die (Ezekiel 18:4,20)...and flesh and blood can't survive in heaven (1 cor 15:50).... It's logical to say, being a soul is perfect only for earthly conditions.... No wonder why the angels in the past first had to become souls by taking up materialised bodies for them selves before coming down to earth... (Ge 6:1-4, Jude 6).

4). Soul is not a part of Man but man himself.... It's spirit and flesh that is part of Man.

aigboeben:

Good explanation. But is man a soul or a spirit? Because if man is a soul and the soul dies, with what does he face eternity? Remember, what he posseses in eternity is who he really is

Man is a soul who has a spirit inside of him (gen 2:7), Note: that "Soul" here is made up of spirit and flesh... Therefore, Man faces eternity as a soul when he has been resurrected (isaiah 26:19) [Note from that verse that those to be resurrected are coming from the dust, spirits don't inhabit dust only the flesh returns to dust] .. Only Jesus was resurrected as a spirit (1 cor 15:45), every other person that was resurrected in the Bible was raised as a soul, be it lazarus, the widow's son and so on... So in answer to your question, we face eternity as a soul not spirit.

salvation101:
the Bible says the lifr of the flesh is in d blood where did u get soul from.. Soul is a different part of a man... Body is one, soul is one and spirit is one... Flesh is body

Stop getting this wrongly, Soul as used in the Bible has a traditional rendering of the Hebrew word neʹphesh and the Greek word psy·kheʹ. In examining the way these terms are used in the Bible, it becomes evident that they basically refer to
(1) people, (Ge 2:7, Num 31:28, 1 Pe 3:20)
(2) animals, (Ge 1:20, Num 31:28) or
(3) the life that a person or an animal has. (eccl 3:18-20)
In contrast to the way that the term “soul” is used in many religious contexts, the Bible shows that both neʹphesh and psy·kheʹ, in connection with earthly creatures, refer to that which is material, tangible, visible, and mortal. In many translations, these original-language words have most often been rendered, using such terms as “life,” “creature,” “person,” “one’s whole being,”... Ecclesiastes 3:19 helps us to see that Man and animal are same in the sense that they both have one spirit not soul, and both have same outcome when they die... So if a dog doesn't have an immortal soul that goes on living after it has died, how can a man have?...
Man doesn't have a soul, Man is a soul (gen 2:7)
Soul isn't immortal cos It can dies (Ezekiel 18:4,20)

salvation101:
you are dodging my question yet u seek answers from me, be honest at least and answer my question.. Where do you think Abraham is right now? In d grave where his sons buried him or in paradise?

Abraham is in his grave resting,just as those that died before and after him is too (ecclesiastes 9:5),he is awaiting resurrection as promised @John 5:28.... There won't be any reason for resurrecting him, if he is already alive now...

Peacefullove:


Sir, are you telling me if a man dies .. the whole of him dies NOT just ordinary body ?

Yes the whole of him dies.... Eccl 9:5
No other part goes on living after a person dies...
When a man dies his spirit returns to God who gave it at (gen 2:7) and his flesh returns to the dust.... Eccl 12:7.

Man is a soul... and since man dies, it means soul dies... Even the Bible confirms that a soul do dies at ezekiel 18:4,20 and be destroyed @ acts 3:23..... Even animals are referred to as souls (numbers 31:28)
Please reason along, if the soul were to be immortal why do we come across verses of the Bible that uses the term "living soul"... Wouldn't that be repitition of words or tautology... Since the soul is said to always be living... Why the reference to a" living soul"?... So this proves that the soul is not immortal, instead it shows that for a man to die, it's his spirit or breath that needs to be taken out of him (psalm 104:29)... There is no even mention of Man having a soul in that verse, just breathe.
So, don't get it twisted d soul isn't what a man has, it's what a man is... The soul is made up of flesh and spirit (gen 2:7).

Peacefullove:


The whole of Jesus died ! not just body ?

Yes!

Peacefullove:


Explain clearly Sir , Spirit or Body ... which is the Real man ( person ) ?

To understand this, we need to revisit the creation of Adam...
God moulded a lump of clay(dust) into a human form, but it wasn't alive until He breathed into the nostril of this sculpture... After the breathing the Bible says at genesis 2:7 that Adam became a living soul or person.... The question you asked wouldn't even exist if there was no misconception about the soul... Many believe that man do have a soul, yet the Bible explains nothing of such but instead says that man is a soul (genesis 2:7, 1cor 15:45) .... So in the case of Jesus it's just as simple as the Bible puts it, He died... Not until some days later did God raise him up.... It's simple, being dead is the opposite of being alive...
Thanks.

JesusPeople:


Jesus died (body)

Christ ( spirit) defeated satan in hell.

Hmmm Naso, baba d baba.

*Keeps walking*...

Well since its not all Christians that will be saved, it's Okay to say that even those that are not Christians will be saved....because acts 24:15 speaks of the resurrection of both righteous and unrighteous...
Endnote... It's not only Christians that'll be saved, many n9n Christians like Jacob, david, Isaacs and many more will be saved...

I would mind my business, amebo is nor good.

Sad that all these will still be destroyed during the great tribulation.... SMH