₦airaland Forum

laudate:
Oh, now you acknowledge that the old Mid-west was a neutral zone. Were you not the same person disputing earlier that Ojukwu and Ejoor the former administrator of the old Midwest did not have any agreement that the region would be neutral? Interesting!

Anyway, like I said earlier, you are free to continue disputing the fact that there was a battle at Ore, despite the fact that it has been well documented. I guess if it makes you sleep better at night, what is my own business? Knock yourself out, kid.

Anyway, Murtala Muhammed's team could not make the crossing because of the faulty strategy he used. Eventually another battalion commanded by federal soldiers made a successful crossing, and kicked the Biafran army out of the old Midwest. Are you happy, now?

In war every form of neutrality is truncated the moment you invade another man's land, the Midwest was there for the taking because it was still deemed federal territory at the time, if Nigeria didn't fire the first shot at Ogoja and Garkem, there won't have been a Midwest invasion.
Ore saw no significant battle, Biafran troops stalled there thanks to Victor Banjo who was the worst possible character to even lead an attack of such importance in the first place, it's like asking a demon to lead an army of demons to upstage the devil at the gate of hell...very absurd...in war time and momentum are very important, we lost that by failing to press our advantage and paid the price by buying the Federal side enough time to reorganize and counter attack a force led by a clueless traitor.

We lost the Midwest but Muritala paid the price at Onitsha and Abagana, losing almost 10,000 troops just to capture a town is a pyrrhic way to console yourself as a commanders, little wonder he quit and returned to Lagos a defeated man.

laudate:
You?? You have a far better knowledge of the civil war than I do? Let me guess... you fought on the side of the Biafrans and you have scars to show for it? Or you were on the battlefield at Ore carrying ammunition with your war colleagues? Or you were with Ojukwu inside his bunker planning war strategies? Which one?? because your puerile responses so far have not shown that you have any in-depth knowledge of the war that is not in public domain already.


Guy, I really do not care what 'side,' you prefer to believe. You have not cited any sources to buttress your points. Neither have you brought forth any evidence to support your views. You keep expecting others to spoonfeed you with info, as if you are toddler. Sorry, I don't have time to do that. Go and conduct your research, and kindly get off my mentions since you have nothing to add to the on-going discourse!

Thank you!

go f.v.c.k yourself you Slag, you stay on every thread a damn topic that relates to Biafra or Igbos, if that's not some sickening obsession then I don't know what else it is, your archives are there to see...you are active on about 60% of post about Igbos, you need to die quick already,oniranu.

Talking about citing sources, I'm I supposed to waste my time countering what I have already read from several books already? If I were to cite a quote from Madiebo's book in lieu with my standpoint, what difference will that make to someone like you who insist Alabi Isama's own version has to be right because he was at the war theatre in Ore, Madiebo's book still remains a best seller, go to Amazon and read the thrilling reviews about it from people all over the world, for a book that was written in the late 80's, it's sustains a lot of respect due to the in depth and balanced account of what happened on both sides, you have no right to tell me to get off your mentions, it'd best you stfu and don't respond at all.

laudate:
I have given you an excerpt from a book on the civil war titled Quick Kill in Slow Motion, written by an American, containing input from those on ground during the war, that confirms there was a decisive battle at Ore, in which the Biafran soldiers were routed. You chose to ignore it. I have also made reference to the book 'Tragedy of Victory' published by Godwin Alabi-Isama who was an eyewitness on the battlefield at Ore, but you have chosen to turn a blind eye to it.

Other sources are freely available in public domain, which you can cross-check to get factual accounts about the Ore battle, but you are too lazy to carry out the research. Instead you choose to believe the propaganda in Madiebo's book, that there was no battle at Ore. Ok, if such false stories make you feel better, who am I to stop you from believing them??

The burden of proof is on you, to provide facts to bolster the tales that you believe, isn't it? He who asserts must prove. So feel free to hold on to your shallow assertions that do not hold water. Afterall, the propaganda machine manned by Okokon Ndem on behalf of Biafra is still at work in your soul, and in many of your compatriots till today.

Why should I take Alabi Isama's own version of the Midwest invasion over the quite intriguing version of Achuzia's own in his book titled "Requiem Biafra?" I have cross checked various journals, articles, and correspondents from various creditable databases online and even books written by principal actors on both sides as well more balanced versions from prolific foreign observers who covered the war,and the versions all differ in one form or another...so I'll definitely not settle just so easily for anything I just happen to read from either the Nigerian or Biafran side to be honest.

laudate:
No, you are the slow one who keeps making twisted assertions without provide proof to back them up. And on this thread, everyone can see that you are the one spreading lies. Google is your friend. Even if I paste a whole excerpt on the battle at Garkem here for you to read, you would still disprove them & ignore them like you did with the one on Ore.

So why should I stop you from believing your twisted tales by moonlight??

I have a far better knowledge of the Nigerian civil war that you do, all you did was post a except( could be just some article for academic research and discourse of someone who never witnessed the actual war, but culled his/her version from what was presented as fact by a pro Nigerian standpoint) I have your time today, please debunk my so called lies with actual accounts of both Nigerian and Biafran officers and men who saw action and wrote their own versions of the war.

ImperialYoruba:
The coup did not happen. I agree, why waste time?

I concluded this many posts ago and told you Chukwuma did not kill Pam. Pam killed himself.

Actually a yoruba soldier shot Pam, my uncle was there

ScotsReferendum:
Hope Afonjas are happy that their masters foot soldiers have gone on rampage

Don't mind those roaches, very annoying set of people, behold the government they voted for...sophisticated dunces.

ImperialYoruba:
Beside what has been told about the coup, who amongst us witnessed it? None!

Is there any truth to the fact that Ibos were massacred in North? None! ...except what was told, none of us was there to see it.

Exactly my point, so since none of us here can verify that all those events played out at Pam's residence on the night of the said attack, then why waste our time on irreconcilable versions of what actually happened? you have every right to believe your version while I have a right to believe mine...at the end it's not your prerogative to make me believe your view is the one I have to believe, you can believe that no massacres took place, just the same way I'll take the version that yorubas actively participated in the coup and even praised it's success.

ImperialYoruba:
Name one positive accomplishment Ibo has made for its Eastern region since 1930. No gain! You are today still where you were in 1930, dependent on Yoruba to civilize you!

You haven't even civilized your father who still squats in the antiquated squalor of his mud house in Osogbo, it's Uche who owns his own mansion that you want to civilize? go audition for a comedy strip cause you sure got some jokes in you bud.

Thought BH were "technically " defeated already? This government and lies, anyway let them keep bombing themselves, could care less.

ImperialYoruba:
Around 1930,this was the first appearance of anything called Ibo in Yorubaland. Prior, nobody in Yorubaland knew anything called Ibo. Yorubas that traveled or lived in North knew of people called yanminri, because many of you had migrated and lived there even before 1914 amalgamation. Ajayi Crowther lived amongst you while he was educating you about Jesus,that's about it!

So go into archives and begin to recount Ibo presence in Yorubaland and the truth will be there for you to see.

The first political gathering of Ibo was an organization called Ibo union. This union was not formed in Enugu or Abakaliki or Onitsha....it was formed in Lagos.

The first political party you all voted under was NCNC. This was a party formed in Lagos by Yorubas to oppose colonial rule. You flooded the party and took it over. We donated it to you but you ran it aground due to your lack of political savviness.

Even while we were focused on developing our region your Azikiwe ignored East and was competing with us to develop our land...but he lost the battle.

The bitterness of the loss led to him, as President, leading the referendum in Midwest and eventually carving out Midwest from Western region. That did not stop our growth.

Your coup plotters and their sponsors, Okpara, Azikiwe and Ironsi, sent your boys out to decimate the political and military elites of other tribes. You still could not stop us. We recovered and progressed.

Then your warlord completely abandoned facing his oppressors in North and headed West. You still failed.

During Jonathan tenure you totally turned the Ijaw man against Yoruba and made him believe you are the only people he needed to run Nigeria. You ruined his government for him. This did not stop Yoruba progress,in fact Yorubaland progressed and outperformed the Federal Government in public administration and socio economic development.

In all of this, since 1930, show me one positive accomplishment you have had as a region. None!

You think what I said in that statement you quoted is a joke?

Where do your leaders run to when they get money? Yorubaland. What do they do with the money? Invest it in building structure and trade.
Whats wrong with sinking that money into your land? They cannot because we have hooked them.

Your leaders are operating on remote control and Yorubas are the ones pushing the buttons. You think this is a joke?

Epic trash, you ended up saying much without saying anything worthwhile, can't believe I even read all that balderdash, show me one major indices that proves yorubas are ahead of the Igbos and stop boring me with your conjectures of amala infested nonsense.

ImperialYoruba:
Ahh, we say Chukwuma killed Pam, you said no.

We say ok,no problem....Pam killed himself, you still no gree.

Cant you see your lunacy cant find cure on earth?

I said provide a veritable source that all that conversation happened, isn't that the bone of contention? I know some yorubas are smart but stop disgracing your people here.

ImperialYoruba:
The point I made about the three location dots are corroborated by other writers.

The first dot establishes malice and calculated (premeditation) move to besiege and do harm to the occupants in Pam's house.

The second dot confirmed an execution of the plot.

The third dot is evidence that the plot succeeded.

Perharps all the writers from different witnessing points and narration were all wrong and their accounts are false. Qelvin is the only soul whose account should be accepted.

No problem, we accept your account, Pam killed himself. Now can we hear word?

Dude you make absolutely no sense, please provide a verifiable source to all this so called writers that collaborate the same narrative on this one, including all the conversations that played out...abi you think say this na nollywood script? Won't even bother reading the rest of the gibberish you wrote up there, second dot ko tenth comma ni.

Oga Op have you eaten today?

ImperialYoruba:
Do you know the history of Ibo in Nigerian politics? It started in Yorubaland. Without Yorubaland they are nobody in Nigeria. I cant even begin to count and narrate the accounts, not enough space here to do so.

They have been cornered and tamed politically. The thought was if they were allowed to exist independently and have a control of their homeland their wildness would not find cure and there is high risk they would atart another war. Nobody want to be fighting a war every few years. The solution was to make them dependent. Go and read Awo's doctrines for better understanding on the agenda. The problem we have now is getting regionalism. Once regionalism comes in Ibos would have no choice but to self govern East. Where is the human and infrastructure to do that? None. So they must continue to depend on Yoruba.....and thats where reality will set in for them.

We dont need a relationship with them, we just need to keep our eyes on Awo's doctrines and keep our progress and evolutiin going. Ibo will always be dependent on us and we in turn keep them underfoot for the taste of Lagos.....they want to live and taste Lagos, thats the hook!

Are you insane? Please state one good reason why any Igbo will need to depend on yorubas for anything? We see you guys more or less as unstable set of people who are only good at owambe and filth... And what exactly do you mean by human and infrastructure? Can't you see the more you try to make sense, the more stupid you end up looking...lmfaoooo ode, we come to Lagos because the federal presence is more prominent there with all the seas ports all all situated in Lagos, we come there, take advantage of the opportunities built there by ALL NIGERIANS and return the wealth back to our region while we control a fair share of wealth also in what we've come to know as No man's land, a fact you will either deal with or die trying, you yorubas think you are dealing with fools...there is a reason why Igbos are focused on Lagos so much, we know it's the easiest means to provoke you guys, and we damn love to see yorubas cry when we keep trooping in.

ImperialYoruba:
There is something called crime detection.

The bottom line of crime investigation and detection is connecting dots and building a case, with ot without witness, to get justice.

The first dot is Col. Pam called two people, Ironsi and Maimalari, and reported gun shots and siege at his home by armed soldiers.

The last person Col Pam was seen with was Major Chukwuma when he kidnapped him from home. That's the second dot.

The last dot is the discovery of Pam with bullet holes in his body.

Whatever happened between Chukuma taking him away and then his assassination,we don't know.

Major Chukwuma is responsible for providing that connection we miss. Until he does, the accusation of Pam's death hangs around his neck. He is a criminal....he must clean his name and absolve himself of Pam's death.

Qelvin, can you help him?

Crime detection does not draw it's conclusion on mere speculation, the facts on ground have to be existential, concrete, and on basis of rationality proven to be true. On that note what we read here reeks of someone's statement or report that wasn't even present in all the scenarios that played out,who was present to witness all these events and conversations right from the time Pam's house was besieged and when he was been taken away?

ImperialYoruba:
So what happened to Pam? His body was recovered with bullets in it. How did he die?

You were not there to see how he died yeah? If so then why not tell us in full details how Pam died? if you were asked to swear with your life on behalf of these account of how he died that you just read, would you die?

laudate:
What do you mean by a neutral version? I have asked you to read a book written by a soldier who was at the battlefront in Ore, and also provided the name of the person who led the platoon at Ore. And you are still asking for a 'neutral' source? Oh, you believe the account of Madiebo who was not anywhere near Ore, is far more superior to that of Godwin Alabi-Isama who watched Major Raphael Iluyomade in action, at Ore? Okay, here is another account. let us hope you would believe this one.

Of course every ardent student of history knows Biafrans were unprepared for the war, even the Midwest invasion was a preemptive effort to force the Nigerian troops to the negotiation table and withdraw the bulk of their First infantry Division fighting in Biafra! So there is hardly anything in these report that contradicts my point, you have the burden of proof to provide another account that collaborates Major Iluyomade's so called heroics at Ore so we have no case here, I haven't come across a single report from those that fought in the Midwest that validates any claim of a paltry amount of Federal soldiers holding back the Biafrans at Ore...all I know for a fact is that Biafrans were halted at Ore and saw little or no action till they were asked to withdraw without even a fight.

laudate:
Guy, you want me to keep spoon-feeding you with information, kwa? Google is your friend. Do the research. The agreement between Ojukwu and Ejoor is well known. And the first shot was fired from Garkem, not Garden. That area is within the Middle-Belt or old north-Central region, not the old Midwest region. So why did Ojukwu order an attack on the old Midwest, instead of Garkem??

Provide the source or stop feeding enlightened minds here with lies, you made the claim that Ejoor and Ojukwu had some kind of agreement about not invading the Midwest, so it's also within your prerogative to back that up with some source? And I meant to write Garkem...it was the autocorrect stuff...dude are you this slow? The Federal side fired the first shots on Biafran territory so Biafra had every right to respond in kind my attacking Federal soil, why not go ask Ojukwu in his grave why he decided to invade the Midwest?

raumdeuter:
Thats because some are cry babies and they are playing to get sympathies of the international communities. Th Buafran drew the first blood, commited a lot of atrocities in the mid west

Go and read Nowa Omoiguis records


http://www.dawodu.net/midwest.htm

Biafrans drew the first blood? Interesting which side then fired the first Salvo of shots??

APCmyheart:
LOL Min dhas taken me so many countries, I live in my own houses and have my own business.



Hope when that arrest you for drugs where you are and ready to be killed you will understand better..

Liar oshi, who you dey deceive with your many countries and houses crap

APCmyheart:
LOL and your underdeveloped region is what? No wonder your people are been killed for drug related offenses in different countries.

Karma is a bitch..

That underdeveloped region still trumps your paradise in every strata and index of development possible.

logica:
I have already provided you with a page. If you are really a truth seeker, you can do more digging.

Now ask yourself, why have you never seen footages of Victor Banjo in action till his execution either as still images or video? Even his execution had no press coverage. Then you are wondering why the International Press did not make noise about Biafran atrocities in the Midwest? Come on.

Once again I'm not in any form or way disputing anything you said about Biafran atrocities, all I'm trying to make clear is however way the anonymity of atrocities done by Biafrans is played out, it's true extent can never be compared to the Nigerian side whose record of genocide can almost be compared with the Holocaust.

APCmyheart:
LOL using ratio 1:10 to judge?


hahahhaha well what brain will be in a flat head?

My flat head has earned me a good life here in a better and civilized country, what has your normal head done for you?

oyatz:
Hunger in the southwest and thousands of Igbos are leaving their villages on daily basis for greener pastures in the Southwest in the same ways Mexicans are trooping to the more prosperous USA?

Thousands of Igbos if that number is anything to reckon with, troop to Lagos which is owned by all Nigerians. Any Igbo you find in any other part of the South west was either born there so just extends his business empire of bridging his own quota of one Nigeria, same way thousands of your people are in Port Harcourt doing kabu kabu business.

APCmyheart:
But i have never seen any other tribe have been killed in some part of the world for drug related offense except your tribe.. hahhaa

Thousands of death row inmates from your tribe populate the UK prisons for all kinds of crime ranging from murder, rape, terrorism (Does Adebolajo the famous London butcher ring a bell?) and several other crimes, every tribe get their own speciality of crime...Aboki na terrorism, yoruba ritual killings, and Igbos drug offense..at the end nobody holy pass

logica:
They were in Biafra; but did they follow the Biafran Liberation Forces?

Bros if there were atrocities perpetuated by the Biafrans in the Midwest, then it would surely have been brought to the limelight and widely documented!! I'm not denying the fact that Biafran troops didn't commit inalienable acts on the Midwest civilians, but it would never have been on the same scale with the Federal side whose atrocities sure made lots of heads, including the most apathetic parties turn their attention for once on the real events of the war

APCmyheart:
That was their plan then but God pass them and they pay with their entire region, I believe Ojukwu also know about the plan and thinking they will remain in power, But when Ironsi was overthrow and killed in and Gowon take over, He want to secede from the country with their buafra nonsense and paid with over 3 million lives..


Biafra war was a pay back for their evil..

But what payback are we suffering sef? Nigerian presidency abi wetin? Who presidency epp...all the years wey Aboki don rule, their region is still a bedlam of chronic poverty, disease, and terrorism...surely not the El Dorado anyone would have envisaged from years of presidency...your yoruba people are still basking on stomach infrastructure and might never even smell presidency again cause after Buhari, another Aboki will take over...Obj was your last shot at executive power and we all know he was merely a stooge to appease the North whom he favored more! so when you talk about payback can you be more specific? It's not us suffering from Boko haram or hunger like we see in the South west today.

APCmyheart:
LOL even the world never take you guys serious meaning they also know about your past deed..

The same world that regards your Nigeria as a joke already ?

logica:
Expectedly, the Oyinbos followed the Federal Forces. I would not have expected them to follow the Biafran Liberation Force heading into the Mid-West and enroute to Lagos (as if...). In any case, it took the Midwesterners time to voice out which is typical of most people who have had traumatic experiences; especially when they hear their tormentors moaning about their woes.

Lol...the oyinbos followed the Federal forces, like they weren't any foreign correspondent in Biafra too abi?

Kenzico:
Thats mean Bro!!!

Lol

APCmyheart:
Exactly my brother, Igbo will never rule this country again not in the next 100yrs and they are going no where..

And who are you to decide whether the Igbos will go or not, na you dey hold their destiny?

logica:
...maybe because some people are better at crying out than others.

nice rebuttal, but you still haven't answered my question, definitely the oyinbo people that documented these massacres couldn't have loved the Biafrans more than the Nigerians if both armies committed atrocities.