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CultureRe: The Oluyares: The Igbo Aborigines Of Ife Who Still Live There by TerraCotta(m): 9:23pm On Nov 22, 2013
Abagworo: It does have some element of truth going by a lot of issues ecountered in history of most groups that occupy Southern Nigeria. Ife is also Ihe or Uhe.
Hi--I look forward to seeing what the element of truth is. There is no reference to an Eze Chima or Eri in Ife history, mythology, or anthropological works so the OP's initial and follow-up post fails on even the most basic level of honesty. I'm sure the people of Ife are flattered by his desperate need to associate with their well-regarded culture.

The areas where there are suggestions of a relationship between Ile-Ife and Igbo-Ukwu (and Benin, Nupe, Ijebu etc)--basically the use of copper alloys in artwork--is not mentioned by the poster or Prince Oforkaja. They obviously haven't read that widely yet. Also, I'm sure they wouldn't be quick to accept the proposition that Igbo-Ukwu derived its unusual art and culture from Ile-Ife, but there are some art historians who would suggest that.

People like the OP should stop slandering the Olukumi and pulling them into their own twisted and ethnically-motivated fantasies.
CultureRe: A Short History Of Yorubaland With Pictures by TerraCotta(m):
Katsumoto: Yoruba origins has two parts – First, a cosmogonic/mythological one which provides that Olodumare gave the task of creating the world to obatala but Oduduwa ended up completing the task with obatala creating man (American, African, and Old European Mythologies – Yves Bonnefoy); Second, A more realistic historical one in which Oduduwa surreptitiously conquered the Ife area by defeating obatala. Yoruba mythology is no different to Roman or Greek mythology. They are steeped in legend. Oduduwa being a woman, Oduduwa climbing down chains to get to earth are all Yoruba mythological tales. This view was carried orally for centuries until historians started to dig into a more realistic version of Yoruba history.
I agree with your general approach, but I find it inconsistent that you believe Oduduwa's identity as a goddess is just another myth, while Oduduwa's identity as a warrior or immigrant is "realistic". My point is that they are all myths, and the oldest of the recorded myths points to the idea that Oduduwa is the goddess of Earth, worshipped by the Ogboni society. If you like Babatunde Lawal's work, he's a very good source for more about Odudua-as-goddess in his essay "Ejiwapo", on the meaning of twins and duality in Yoruba culture.

I do not believe Oduduwa was Yoruba based on written accounts by Yoruba historians such as Toyin Falola and Isola Olomola. A few books provide that there were small states within Ife – Oke Ora under Oduduwa, Idena under Oreluere, Itapa and Ideta under obatala, Ita Yemoo under Yemoo (obatala’s wife), Igbo Olokun under Olokun (Oduduwa’s wife). It would appear that Oduduwa conquered the other areas because there are separate accounts of revolt against Oreluere and obatala. The battle between Oduduwa and Obatala is staged annually at Ife.
I am fairly certain Toyin Falola and Isola Olomola would disagree with characterizing their work as a validation of the "non-yoruba" variant of Oduduwa's origins. I have both of the books you've cited here at home and having read them several times, I've never come across a claim from either author that "Oduduwa" (whoever he or she may be) was not Yoruba. If you can direct me to a specific page, I'd be happy to check.

Sources
Culture, Politics and Money Among the Yoruba – Toyin Falola
Ife Before Oduduwa (Isola Olomola) an excerpt found in Professor Akijogbin’s The Cradle of a Race

See excerpt from Olodumare, God in Yoruba Belief – Bolaji Idowu

‘It is not certain what his original name was, but it could have been Oduduwa ….. We learn from Oral Tradition that when Oduduwa arrived in Ile Ife, there was already a community of aboriginal people under the leadership of Oreluore. The tradition persists that when Oduduwa arrived with his colonizing party, he at first did not pay any respect to Oreluere or recognize his headship. He was haughty and disdainful in his attitude.’

See also

‘While no one could precisely say what motivate ‘ogboni’ cult or confraternity, to come into being in Ife-Oodaye, but postulations in Yoruba mythology, shed light on the pre-Oduduwa era in the IIe-Ife, when ‘obatala’ and Oreluere were the ruling chieftains of the Aborigine Ife-speaking community. ‘Awo’ ogboni, among so many other ‘Awos’(i.e cults) in Ife then, became so prominent and relevant, more as a pressure group to protest the unceremonious arrival of the great colonial master in history, (i.e.) Oduduwa, just as certian people of today’s Nigeria, first resisted the coming of the British imperialism, so also, the aboriginal Ife people and their particularly leader, obatala; vehemently resisted the unexpected arrival of Oduduwa and his followers into Ile-ife. But when they could not withstand the might and high political network of Oduduwa, these ancient Ife people, resorted to cover activities, by making use of their ogboni group to determine oduduwa’s authority. And in most cases, against oduduwa’s people themselves, who were not their members. Most of these terrorist acts take place during the life time of Queen MOREMI, an Ofa indigene, married to ORANMIYAN, one of the Ife kings at that time.’

http://oloolutof./ogboni-fraternity-the-oyo-perspective/
I find the website you're quoting not really worthy of a scholarly discussion. I do agree with you that there were smaller settlements that coalesced into Ife--traditionally considered to be thirteen, each with a political head using the title "Oba"--and this is well-known and often discussed by Ife historians.

This view of Oduduwa arriving at Ife is re-inforced by Ugbo history which provides that the Ugbo migrated from Ife southwards after losing Ife to Oduduwa. The story of Moremi corroborates this account as the losers resorted to guerilla tactics. I believe you are familiar with the Moremi story. So who was Oduduwa? Where was he really from? I do not believe the Dierk Lange or Sultan Bello accounts because there are far too many inconsistencies in those accounts. The most plausible account to me is the Bini account because 1) It is recorded 2) Why would an established kingdom such as the Bini kingdom accept a complete stranger’s great grandson as king? Oranyan son became king without Oyo conquering Bini.
The Ugbo of present-day Ondo state are unlikely to be the same group of Ugbo from Ife history, but that's more my opinion than anything else so I won't delve into it at this point. The term "Ugbo" and its dialectical variant "Igbo" have a long-established meaning in Yoruba--a bush, a forest, an uncultivated rural area, a grove, a type of bird etc--and the word is common throughout the Yoruba-speaking region. I don't think it would be correct to project present-day ethnonyms far into the past, which is what some folks across the Niger would like to do as well. There's no reason to believe that modern ethnic groups with a similar name are exactly the same as the prehistoric Ugbo of Ife legend.

More interesting to me is the idea that the Bini account is plausible because it is recorded and that they accepted a complete stranger's son. One, as I've mentioned to Physics in earlier discussions, the Bini claim about Ekaladerhan's miraculous escape and ascension to the throne of Ife under a new name was unrecorded until the early 1970s, as far as I'm aware (I am happy to be corrected here). This claim was first made by Aimiuwu in Nigeria Magazine's December 1971 issue. It never appeared in print anywhere before then as far as I've been able to ascertain. The leading indigenous historian of Benin, Jacob Egharevba, never made this claim in any of the editions of his classic "A Short History of Benin", which went through several revisions (some quite substantial) and had the full blessing and cooperation of the Benin court. This is not an ancient claim, as far as I can tell. If Physics is available, he may want to bring up the claim Richard Burton recorded in Benin in the 1860s that they were the source of "civilization" in the Yoruba-speaking area, but there is certainly no reference to Ekaladerhan by Burton and no support for that concept in archaeology. Of course, there is also the clear claim that brasscasting in Benin was derived from Ife sculptural traditions through "Iguegha". Whether you or I should believe this type of "one man cultural transmission" theory of history is another question. I, clearly, do not, which is why I reject the idea in the case of Oduduwa.

On the other hand, the earliest references we have to Benin's relationship with Ife or another polity in its general area (from Duarte Pacheco Pereira and Joao de Barros, two Portuguese writers in the early to mid-1500s) makes it clear that Benin's Obas legitimized their claim to the city's throne by referencing an interior polity and its "Ogane" as their religious and political "holy city" and not the other way round. It is not in dispute that the Ooni of Ife is currently known as the Oghene n'Uhe in Benin.

Where is the historical or archaeological support for the idea that Ife derived any significant part of its culture--it's monarchic traditions, its art corpus, its religion--from Benin? What we have instead are 500-year old references to Benin's religious reverence for a monarch in the Ife area who used a title quite similar to the Ooni's. We also have a royal lineage at Benin that does not use the historical title for an Edo monarch--ogie, ogiso or a variant like ovie in Urhobo. Instead, the title is "Oba", which is patently derived from Yoruba-speaking traditions and is a generic term for "leader" in that area (see the various "Oba" titles of the heads of pre-Ife settlements, or other "oba" titles in the Okun Yoruba area that do not have traditions of political centralization).

Your second point that Benin would have no reason to accept a "complete stranger's son" is equally applicable to Ife. Why would an established political entity with its established art and architectural traditions--here I mean the sculpture in terracotta, stonework, brass, quartz and the paved courtyards and streets--accept a fugitive who had wandered hundreds of miles through the forest and managed to arrive there (bypassing other established polities in the Ondo, Ilesa and Ekiti areas), who did not speak their language? The Benin version does not claim that Ekaladerhan came with an army, since he was expelled from Benin and left in disguise. What motivation then would they have had to suddenly crown this stranger? The story is not a logical one. Whatever the merits of the current Ife version--which claims the Oba of Benin is descended from the son of Oranmiyan--it does not claim a military imposition or a smooth transfer of thrones to an alien people. It presupposes that Benin's citizens must have had some compelling reason to petition "Oduduwa" for a king--they were going through a civil war and there was an interregnum. Ife was the best-known polity in the region and so the court of Benin went to request a ruler. I want to be clear here--I don't believe this story either, but it does try to propose logical reasons for the action by the court of Benin. In the version current with the Oba of Benin, we would have to believe that wandering strangers found in the forest near major cities were regularly crowned kings. This is, of course, unlikely.

Agboniregun was in Ife when Oduduwa arrived there. Oral and written history (Yoruba and Bini) confirms this. Something else to ponder, according to Akinjogbin and other Yoruba historians, there were at least 93 kings before Oduduwa. This fits in well with my belief that there were several Yoruba groups around at the same time as Ife pre-Oduduwa and why the Ijebu have always maintained that they are not from Ife. The Ijebu believe they are originally from Sudan. Being that early civilization started around the Sudan-Nile-Ethiopia corridor before all human sub-groups migrated to different parts of the globe, I am favourably disposed to the Ijebu migration account. And I believe if the Ijebu account is true, then other Yoruba groups also migrated from the Sudan.
I may start sounding repetitive, but we have no proof of a historic "Agboniregun", so the references in oral (and now written) history need to be taken with a grain of salt. The claim of 93 kings before Oduduwa reminds me of the continuously growing number of Ogisos in the Benin tradition, which I have discussed with Physics elsewhere (there is a very good article on this I can recommend for you). Suffice to say that searching for prestige will continuously drive people to claim ever-grander origins without any basis in reality. Where are the connections between Sudan and Ijebu, for instance? The Ijebu don't believe they are originally from Sudan (Obafemi Awolowo would not be likely to agree with that concept, for instance). Rather, the current Awujale of Ijebu--who is a Muslim--has made a claim that links him to other northern Muslim groups. There are, of course, no reasonable linguistic or cultural links between Waddai and Ijebu but I'm sure future historians will have spend as much time debunking this as current ones have spent debunking Sultan Bello's misguided ideas about "Lamrudu", the Middle East and all that.

This is just my view but I am always open to more knowledge if verifiable.
Always great to debate these issues with well-read and civil companions, even if we disagree. I have mentioned his name here so often I feel like I'm being paid to promote the man, but the best references I can give you on the dispassionate investigation of Yoruba culture is Ade Obayemi. I don't agree with everything the man says, but he was a brilliant iconoclastic scholar during the golden age of Yoruba history in the 1970s, and his work is still the most insightful analysis of these issues that I've read. Unfortunately, since he mostly published in Nigeria, his articles are hard to find outside the country. If you have a chance, please read his essay in "Groundwork of Nigerian History" as well as the ones published by the Journal of the Historical Society of Nigeria. They will explain my general views much more eloquently than this post.

I've also mentioned Suzanne Preston Blier's "Art and Risk in Ancient Yoruba: Ife History, Power, and Identity, ca. 1300", which is scheduled to be published next month and will be a major addition to the list of books on this topic. Her most recent essay on Ife art history was just published and is excellent, although she uncritically accepts the idea that Oduduwa was a warrior king.
CultureRe: A Short History Of Yorubaland With Pictures by TerraCotta(m):
MetaPhysical: It is interesting that what you shared here is not in writing and cannot be proven, but you clarified it as your thoughts..or suspicions, given other factors that lend credence to it. Right?
No, that's not right at all. You misunderstood my post. Everything I mentioned can be backed up by a reference to an older source. Whether we agree with that source or not is a legitimate discussion, but there is nothing secret about the sources of information I mentioned. I'll cite them below since I'm guessing you and others may be unfamiliar with them. Keep in mind that I've had to condense these citations by a great deal because there's too much detail to be included on a Nairaland post. I'll start with the history of the settlement of Ife, drawn from the introduction to Reverend Ajayi Crowther's "Vocabulary of the Yoruba Language", the first full Yoruba/English dictionary published in 1852. Readers will note that there is no mention of a figure named Oduduwa:

"It is said by the Yoruba, that fifteen persons were sent from a certain region; and that a sixteenth, whose name was Okkambih, and who was afterwards made King of Yoruba, volunteered to accompany them ... Thus originated the kingdom of Yoruba, which was afterwards called Iffeh; from whence three brothers set out for a further discovery of better countries.

Later in the dictionary, Reverend Crowther defines "Odua, Odudua" as follows:

... Odua, Odudua, a goddess from Ife, said to be the supreme goddess in the world. Heaven and Earth are also called Odudua.--Odudua igba nla meji ade isi (translated: "Heaven and earth are two large calabashes, which being shut can never be opened."

-- From "A Vocabulary of the Yoruba Language" by Bishop Samuel Ajayi Crowther, 1852

Here are some other old references to Odudua as a goddess:

"Odua, or Oduduwa, the universe, [b]or the goddess of Earth and Sky, is located at Ife."

--From Richard Burton, "Abeokuta and the Camaroon Mountains", 1863

"Odudua, or Odua, who has the title of Iya agbe, The mother who receives," is the chief goddess of the Yorubas. The name means "Black One" (dit, to be black; dudit, black), and the negroes consider a smooth, glossy, black skin a great beauty, and far superior to one of the ordinary cigar-colour. She is always represented as a woman sitting down, and nursing a child.

Odudua is the wife of Obatala, but she was coeval with Olorun, and not made by him, as was her husband. Other natives, however, say that she came from Ife, the holy city, in common with most of the other gods, ... The phallus and yoni in juxtaposition are often seen carved on the doors of the temples both of Obatala and Odudua; but this does not seem to have any reference to androgyny, since they are also found similarly depicted in other places which are in no way connected with either of these deities."

From A.B. Ellis, "The Yoruba-Speaking Peoples of the Slave Coast of West Africa", 1894.

There are many other references to the female, primordial nature of Oduduwa but these are fairly easy to find online for yourself. If you're interested in more references in print, I'll cite them from my library when I get a chance at home.

What then is the problem that other thoughts in contradiction of your position must be asked to provide proof, facts and when they dont they are labeled conjectures.
I'm sure we've had this conversation before under your other moniker(s). There is no contradiction in my position. I am able to provide proof (see examples above) but you are not. Informed conjectures are good; that is how knowledge advances. Unfounded speculation is bad; that's guesswork at best or, even worse, propaganda promoted for ethnic, religious or political reasons.

Can you prove your thoughts up there? Im sure not, neither are any facts available specific to the conclusion you surmised. Yet, honestly, it is logical, even though I do not suvscribe to it.

There are many sides to it and each side should erect its theories..but you guys on the indigeneous theory somehow are intimidated by the advocates of the foreign footsteps and it shows in your response. This is the problem I have with you all, not that your theories are not legitimate, your attempt to assert authority on the subject of origin is hugely Eurocentric and unacceptable.
I don't know who the guys on the indigenous theory side are, but I can tell you that your ideas about the Middle Eastern derivation of Yoruba culture have no basis in any research. It has its origins in Sultan Bello's mythic history--influenced by his Islamic faith--that was told to Captain Hugh Clapperton, and it was repeated by Reverend Samuel Johnson in his influential book. You're welcome to continue the guesswork and pseudo-linguistic investigation.
CultureRe: The Oluyares: The Igbo Aborigines Of Ife Who Still Live There by TerraCotta(m): 9:28pm On Nov 21, 2013
Edited--it's just a waste of time. Suffice to say, this is mostly fantasy and has nothing to do with any probable history.
CultureRe: Yoruba Origin, History and Canaanland connection. by TerraCotta(m): 9:09pm On Nov 21, 2013
740megawatts: I get your point here. I just thought about this too....many words from Eastern Yoruba axis that begins with 'U' were transcribed to 'I' in the Western and Central Yoruba axes. For example, Ule/Ile, Ufe/Ife, Ubo/Ibo e.t.c.

Could it be that the Yoruba at the Eastern Axis retained the original essence of Yoruba language? Were these people the most ancient? Did the earliest Yoruba ancestors spread out from this axis into Ife and Oyo? These questions require indepth studies because it appears not much was documented on the Eastern Yoruba peoples in research.
In short, yes. Most Yoruba linguists would agree that central and eastern Yoruba is an older variant than the innovating "western" Yoruba of Oyo.
CultureRe: Ijebu: Jebusites? What A Myth! by TerraCotta(m): 8:47pm On Nov 21, 2013
Jebusites are to Ijebu as Edomites are to Edo, or Orissa in India is to Orisha in Nigeria. There is no cultural, ethnic or religious relationship beyond the coincidence of terms that sound alike. This is not an unusual situation around the world; the human mouth can only produce so many sounds and some of them are bound to be similar.

Carry on.
CultureRe: A Short History Of Yorubaland With Pictures by TerraCotta(m): 8:31pm On Nov 21, 2013
Katsumoto--you've done an excellent job of explaining the objections many people have to this fanciful idea deriving Yoruba culture from Islamic traditions. It is a puzzling and generally meaningless pursuit for non-Muslims, and I think ethical and objective Muslim readers would find it full of holes as well. It doesn't matter how many times you point the fallacies though; people will continue to filter their ancestral origins and cultures through the lens of their imported religion of choice. Thankfully, the vast majority of reputable scholars on Yoruba history and culture do not give any credence to this theory.

One small quibble I had with your statement that "Yoruba did not start with Oduduwa". I've said it on Nairaland and elsewhere several times that the myth of a wandering Oduduwa who landed at Ife from some foreign shores seems likely to be a 20th century invention, possibly inspired by Judeo-Christian/Islamic adherents (similar to some in this thread) who wished to find prestigious Middle Eastern origins for their culture. I don't want the post to be lengthy so I'll keep my references to sources short, but I can provide them for people who are interested. To my knowledge, the overwhelming amount of "historical" references to a male king who settled in Ife from "somewhere else" named Oduduwa and who had 7 or 16 sons (take your pick) that he sent out to the rest of the Yoruba-speaking world are from relatively late 20th century sources. This is not to say that the myth did not exist; there are theatrical combat festivals in Ife which have been interpreted as memorializing the "war" between the Obatala and Oduduwa "factions". I question the interpretations in light of the fact that virtually every reference to Oduduwa/Odua/Oduwa before Reverend Johnson's "History of the Yoruba" depicts Oduduwa as a woman, most often the wife of Obatala, and often another term for "Ile", the earth. In some cases, it appears that mythical combat between light and dark, or between urban civilization and the forest, have been misinterpreted as historical battles between human personae. The name "Oduduwa" is given a fairly straightforward translation in these older sources as well--"Odu Iwa", a cognate term to "Olu Iwa (modern "Oluwa" ) since "Odu" is an older Yoruba term for a chief, a potentate, or a large container, like a calabash. Similarly, these early chroniclers follow Bishop Ajayi Crowther in describing Oduduwa as one half of a calabash, the other being Obatala. The juxtaposition of Obatala (translation: "leader of the white cloth/whiteness" ) and Oduduwa (meaning something like "leader/regent of blackness/existence" ) adds a logical appeal to this myth.

This description is consistent from the earliest recorded references I'm aware of (in Bishop Crowther's 1851 dictionary), through the various other missionaries and expedition reports to R.E. Dennet's "Nigerian Studies". As late as the 1950s, Geoffrey Parrinder was told by the Alaketu and his advisors in that ancient Yoruba kingdom that Oduduwa was a woman. It's not a minor point to stress, since Ketu is often cited as one of the oldest kingdoms derived from Ife. Ketu was also somewhat isolated from the modernizing trends going on Nigerian historiography during the late colonial period, when literate Yoruba scholars were reading Reverend Johnson's book and re-distributing it's point of view as the "official" history of the Yorubas. It is unlikely that the Alaketu (who supplied the information) would have been as aware of Reverend Johnson's book, living as he did in a Francophone town removed from Nigerian political developments which may have shaped 20th-century reinterpretations of Oduduwa's identity. It is why I find the fantastic stories of Oduduwa's "journey" from Mecca, Egypt, northeastern Nigeria--and most recently Benin--to be highly unlikely, and supported by little more than the religious and ethno-political motivations of the day.

Since Reverend Johnson's book got published in 1921, the tide has changed and virtually all modern discussions about Oduduwa center on the idea that "he" was a man and a foreigner of some sort to Ile-Ife. This idea may have its own appeal to modern sensibilities, but it does not seem to be supported in the older documentation. "Yoruba"--if we take that to mean the people who point to Ile-Ife as their cultural homeland and who speak the related dialects of the same language--did start with Oduduwa, since the oldest depictions we have access to suggest that Oduduwa was a mythological Earth mother who gave birth to this culture. These are just my thoughts though--I like to hear other informed perspectives.
PoliticsRe: Flora Shaw (lord Lugard's Wife) Didn't Coin The Name Nigeria. by TerraCotta(m): 4:46am On Nov 21, 2013
PhysicsQED: There is a use of the word "Nigerians" twice in that book by William Cole.

There is also a use of "Nigerian" in another publication that I am aware of: by Richard Burton in 1863, in his article "My Wanderings in West Africa: A Visit to the Renowned Cities of Warri and Benin," while making an observation about the variation in skin color among people in that area:

"The skin is mostly black; some, however, are fair and reddish, a thing everywhere to be observed among Nigerian tribes." - R. Burton, "My Wanderings in West Africa: A Visit to the Renowned Cities of Warri and Benin," Fraser's Magazine 67 (1863)

It's not certain that either Burton or Cole coined that word either, however. The term may already have been in use by then.
You best me to it. The earliest reference I knew of is from Richard Burton's "Abeokuta and The Camaroon Mountains" (also 1863), where he made references to the people living in "the Nigerian valley." It's always been clear to me that Flora Shaw couldn't be credited with coining the term, although I do think Nnenna.1 is right about her suggestion that Shaw was the first to suggest it as the official colonial name for the area.
PoliticsRe: Remarkable Similarities Between Goodluck Ebele Jonathan And Awolowo by TerraCotta(m): 9:39pm On Nov 16, 2013
"The Government confirmed that it would release six prominent political prisoners, confirming a promise made by Colonel Gowon.

The most prominent of the six, all of whom were accused of plotting to overthrow the Nigerian government, is Chief Obafemi Awolowo, a former premier of the Western region ... His deputy, Chief Anthony Enahoro, was also released. The four other prisoners were also members of the Action Group."

--From "Poiltical Break-up Looms in Nigeria as Ibos Challenge Regime", New York Times, August 6, 1966.

I'm sure there are contemporary Nigerian records that say the same thing but it's useful to cite nonpartisan sources where possible. More interestingly, the reporter behind the article is Lloyd Garrison, who was a Biafran partisan and personal friend of Ojukwu and wrote a number of articles supporting Biafra throughout the war. He certainly would have given Ojukwu the credit for releasing Awolowo if that were true. Obviously it is not, and there goes yet another long-lived lie told by Ojukwu and his disciples.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 8:56pm On Nov 16, 2013
oyb: i smell bromance wink

from his profile terracotta is a blast from nl's past - a time when it was a small community run by intellectuals
I almost missed this. A bonafide serial polygamist like TerraCotta?! Walahi, if my wives come swear for you now... cheesy

You're right though. This place used to be a lot different and a little more civil. Maybe I'm just too old for some of this type of stuff (although I'm sure there are several posters wey senior me well-well in these threads).
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 8:35pm On Nov 16, 2013
Prof Corruption: I didn't write to be offensive in any way, sorry if that was implied in my post. I understood your points but my contention was that Awolowo did not even have to give any justification on than this: we do not intend to feed Biafra soldiers. Period.
Fair enough.
PoliticsRe: Remarkable Similarities Between Goodluck Ebele Jonathan And Awolowo by TerraCotta(m): 8:29pm On Nov 16, 2013
[quote author=Katsumoto][/quote]Edited--Katsumoto's photo and caption says it all.
PoliticsRe: Col. Ben Gbulie, One Of The 1966 Coupists Speaks On The Coup And Awo by TerraCotta(m): 8:23pm On Nov 16, 2013
Katsumoto: Apologies for the delay in responding to your post from yesterday.

Ejoor and Gowon both claimed that Ojukwu approached them to execute a coup in 1964. You can read further in Oil, Politics and Violence: Nigeria's Military Coup Culture (by Max Silloun) - Page 36. There were also reports of Victor Banjo plotting. But I can't confirm whether Banjo was working with Ojukwu. But given how they were friends and shared similar strong views about the politics of that era, it wouldn't be inconceivable they worked together.
Thanks--I've sen that reference in Max Siollun's book and in several other places. I believe Siollun's reference for Gowon's claim is the same OAU speech, but I was wondering if there were other trustworthy sources. I'm also aware of Victor Banjo's plans. Wole Soyinka discusses them in "Ibadan" and "You Must Set Forth At Dawn". Banjo supposedly confirmed the plot to Ojukwu during his trial in Biafra as well.

The claim that interests me most is the one that Ojukwu approached Azikiwe in either late 1964 or early 1965 about a coup. I haven't seen that mentioned anywhere other than as rumors, but someone as well-informed as Odia Ofeimun seems to believe it. The New York Times reported rumors of a planned secession in the East in late 1964 as well. Just wondering if anyone knew of more substantial evidence than these vague references.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 7:42pm On Nov 16, 2013
Prof Corruption: @ TerraCotta

You said a whole lot without actually saying anything.
You're welcome to your opinion.

I have two questions for you. Why was Nigeria willing to clear "food" shipments meant for Biafra but nevertheless stopped sending food to Biafra?
I recognize that the post was long but I don't think it was complicated. This should be a fairly straightforward point to comprehend: Nigeria was directly sending food aid to Biafra while the war was going on. As I showed in the post, there was a history of protein deficiency in the area and the region was already dependent on imports from the north for meat and Scandinavia for dried fish.

For humanitarian reasons (intensified by world opinion on the photos and footage showing starving Biafran children), the Nigerian government offered to let international relief agencies fly food and medical supplies into Biafra. There were two conditions: that the flights would be during the day, and that Nigerian and neutral observers would be allowed to inspect them so they were not smuggling arms. This was after the earlier proposal of land corridors for food was rejected by Biafra. The air option was also rejected by Biafra, since Ojukwu needed that channel to continue flying in arms. Instead, Ojukwu claimed that the supplies might be poisoned which is why I included the long paragraph on widespread rumors of poisoned food in Biafra from Dr. Nkpa's article. I can direct you to independent sources--neither Nigerian nor Biafran--that reported these proposals.

Was there a way to ensure such shipment, even when certified to be food but not arms, did not fall into wrong hands?
No, which was Awolowo's point. The threat of malnourishment/starvation and public pressure from the images of starving Biafrans pushed Nigeria to to offer humanitarian compromises of relief agencies handling food deliveries, as long as they were inspected and sent in during the day. This was in June 1969, after several other relief plans had failed. Presumably, the Biafran army wouldn't hijack civilian resources sent by charities, and if they did, it would certainly turn public opinion.

It is a fact that Ojukwu rejected both the land corridor relief idea and daytime air relief as unacceptable. It's also a fact that he claimed Nigerian relief supplies might be poisoned. Nighttime relief flights continued through the war, intermingled with smuggled arms from France and Portugal, but they were insufficient for the population.
PoliticsRe: Col. Ben Gbulie, One Of The 1966 Coupists Speaks On The Coup And Awo by TerraCotta(m): 12:16pm On Nov 16, 2013
PhysicsQED: I haven't come across anything before that substantiates these claims. Maybe there is something out there that corroborates one of these claims, but I certainly haven't come across such information.
Thanks. Pity about the direction this thread took.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 12:14pm On Nov 16, 2013
As I mentioned earlier, we have other sources apart from Ojukwu’s eyewitness testimony that corrupt officials and military men hijacked Biafran relief supplies, as Awolowo and others alleged. An important and overlooked nuance is that Biafra had long lacked adequate sources of protein internally and that a small number of children were already demonstrating signs of protein deficiency before the start of the war. An article written by an American nurse (Evelyn Shellenberger) who worked in Biafra during the height of the war is also instructive:

Protein deficiency is not new to Biafra. During 1966, a normal year in Biafra as far as food supply was concerned, we saw a hundred cases of severe protein deficiency at the Abiriba Joint Hospital. In a study of the serum albumen level in normal Biafran children, we found that the average serum albumen is approximately one gram lower than in the average American child. Thus children in prewar Biafra were already living in a borderline state of protein nutrition with a few showing overt signs of protein deficiency. Why? Biafra has no adequate indigenous supply of protein food. Before the war with Nigeria, the main protein foods-meat, beans, peanuts, and fish-were imported. The meat, beans, and peanuts came from the northern region of Nigeria.
From “Staving off Starvation” by Evelyn Shellenberger in The American Journal of Nursing, Vol. 69, No. 3 (Mar., 1969).

This is a relatively small point, but it demonstrates clearly that there were existing problems with adequate nutrition and that the Eastern region was dependent on imports to feed its population. The blockade worsened the problem of malnutrition in Biafra, but it did not cause them.

Another important point was raised by an eyewitness to the propaganda surrounding the starvation issue. Nwokocha Nkpa, a sociologist at UNN, wrote an article seven years after the war on the rumors of poisoned food supplies that led Ojukwu and Biafra to reject Nigerian relief efforts. This article proposes some extraordinarily enlightening information which, sadly, has been suppressed and ignored by many commentators since the war. I will quote from the article in some detail since it’s important to read about the events exactly as Nkpa describes them. Nkpa says:

Even in official circles, comprised of the well-educated leaders of Biafra, rumors of "poisoned food" were current. John de St. Jorre (1972:246) noted that an offer made by the leaders of the Nigerian Federal Government whereby planes that were illegally carrying food and relief materials to Biafra should first land in Lagos, the capital of Nigeria, to receive official clearance, and then proceed legally to Biafra to discharge their cargos, was turned down by Biafran leaders on the ground that the food would have been poisoned .
He establishes here that the Nigerian side even offered to let illegal food relief fly to Biafra on the condition that they were inspected for arms and other contraband. This request was rejected by Ojukwu and his team on the pretext that they would be poisoned. Looking back over 45 years, it may be difficult for contemporary readers to understand how starving people could have been deceived by the propaganda that their relief supplies meant to end starvation would be poisoned. Nkpa lived and taught in Biafra throughout the war so his firsthand perspective is important. We can turn to an important example from him to see that within Biafra, there was an extraordinary level of paranoia about the security of food from the very beginning of the war.

One wedge-driving rumor that started to circulate on the campus of the University of Nigeria, Nsukka (then renamed University of Biafra) during the second week of June 1967 was that members of the Efik and Ibibio linguistic groups who were employees of the University of Nigeria were not joining the Biafran civil defence organization on the campus and therefore were in sympathy with the Nigerian Federal Government.

By the last week of June, which was also the last week of the academic year, this rumor had undergone the process of leveling and sharpening and produced a version that shocked and saddened the University community, namely, that the breakfast which was prepared for over 3,000 students had been poisoned by the cooks who belong to the Efik and Ibibio linguistic groups. On that Monday morning, June 26, 1967, to the surprise of the cooks and the waiters, several students who had gone to the dining hall to have their breakfast
started to stream out of the dining hall without taking their breakfast.

Others who were still on their way turned back upon being informed of the "poisoned breakfast." By 8:30 A.M. the action of the students and the rumor had spread not only on the campus but also in the city of Nsukka. Because of this rumor, as could be guessed, the food that had been prepared for these students was destroyed. The writer, who is Igbo, invited two Igbo students that day to discuss the "poisoned breakfast." I asked them how it could be possible for the cooks to poison the breakfast in view of the fact that the student body of the university at that time was made up of only members of the Igbo, Efik, and Ibibio speaking people. Would the Efik and Ibibio cooks want students from their own tribes to die? The reply from these two students was that the Efik and Ibibio students had already been given advance information about the plan to put poison in the food and were advised not to eat their breakfast that morning. They went on to say that those Efik and Ibibio students who came to the dining hall that morning never intended to eat the food, but rather to deceive the Igbo-speaking students who were to be exterminated by the poison.”
This early series of rumors and misunderstandings only set the stage for the much broader tragedy of kwashiorkor in the later stages of the war. Nkpa’s testimony again here is indispensable for understanding the Biafran government's decision to reject Nigerian and British aid even after the kwashiorkor epidemic worsened, when it became clearer to the world that a humanitarian tragedy was in the offing:

After the International Red Cross personnel in Biafra had made the gravity of the famine in Biafra known to the world, Britain, one of the countries that was then supplying arms to the Nigerian Federal Government, offered to send some food and drugs to Biafra in June 1968 to help save the lives of the starving population. But the Biafran government turned down the offer. Radio Biafra, commenting on this offer, compared it to the practice of first fattening a goat by feeding it well, and then slaughtering it for food. The Biafran government rejected this offer of food and drugs on the ground that she would not accept relief from a country that was supplying arms to her enemy. A few days after the radio announcement of the rejection of the relief, there began to circulate a rumor that the reason for the rejection of the offer was that the food was poisoned in order to exterminate all the Biafrans. At the early stage of this rumor it was narrated that the Nigerian Federal Government had approached the British Government to ask for advice as how to effect an immediate end to the war, and the British government had then advised that the easiest method would be to send poisoned food to Biafra. At this
stage of the rumor, details were given of the date of arrival in and departure from Biafra of the "sympathetic British national" who travelled by way of Lisbon, Portugal, to leak this news to the Biafran government.

But as this rumor circulated, it underwent the process of leveling, sharpening, and assimilation. The final message was, "I heard that the British had planned to poison us by sending us poisoned food."

To a starving person, food is his immediate need. When a nation is threatened by famine and its government rejects a food offer, it would be more comforting to the common man to believe that the same British government that was supplying arms to his enemies now plans to send him poisoned food than to believe the official reason given for the rejection of the offer.
From “Rumors of Mass Poisoning in Biafra” by Nwokocha K. U. Nkpa in The Public Opinion Quarterly, Vol. 41, No. 3, 1977.

We are indebted to honest writers like Nkpo, who recorded their experiences dispassionately so we have something more substantial to rely on when reading about the history of this period than propaganda. There are several other sources I'd like to refer to that I rarely see mentioned in these types of discussions, but I'll end it here for now. It is the most heartbreaking and demoralizing exercise to read through the documents about this needless war, and to see the images and videos of dying children who had no role in initiating or prolonging the conflict. My sympathies are also with the laypeople of Biafra like Nwokocha Nkpa, who were deliberately misled by elites that have slandered Awolowo, the Nigerian and the British governments as the architects of their misfortune. Over and over, the evidence shows that Biafran authorities rejected repeated offers to help from Britain and even the back-door offers for relief agencies to break the blockade, as long as they agreed to inspections in Lagos.

As a fellow Nigerian and a human being with my own connections to victims of this war, I’ve assembled the quotes and references above to correct the ignorant and prejudiced views about hunger during the civil war and the roles of various participants in either rejecting or hoarding food. There is certainly enough material to vindicate Awolowo's position that food and relief supplies were systematically hijacked by Biafran soldiers and hoarded by the Biafran elite. There is also unquestionable evidence that the Biafran government rejected British and Nigerian offers of humanitarian aid after the kwashiorkor epidemic became well-known. Ojukwu addressed this same issue elsewhere in the Ahiara Declaration, but I'm leaving that portion out in order not lengthen this post even more. I can reproduce it if there's any interest. I welcome corrections, amendments and other feedback but as usual will ignore any comments that don’t address this topic in a civil and constructive manner.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 11:54am On Nov 16, 2013
I've been caught up in other issues but I didn't want to forget about this discussion and especially the quote on starvation in Biafra. The belief that Awolowo sanctioned starvation in order to punish Biafrans is one of the more disturbing and malicious lies told about the man, and I’ve pulled together some less well-known material to clarify the origins of the lie and the surprising effectiveness of its use as propaganda. This will be a detailed response—if you’re looking for snappy chatter and juvenile insults, you may want to hit snooze now.

The most important evidence to absolve Awolowo, Gowon and the British government of the charge that they deliberately starved Biafrans comes from eyewitnesses—medical personnel, journalists and other observers in Biafra at the time. As Awolowo and other contemporary observers noted, the food and supplies sent to Biafra were systematically looted and hoarded by an elite cabal. Their decision to stop sending food was triggered by their realization that ordinary Biafrans would not be fed. Ojukwu's first-hand testimony on this is the most crucial of all. Even more importantly, when it became clear that there were massive humanitarian needs in Biafra, their government refused help from Britain and turned down Nigeria’s suggestion to turn a blind eye to relief flights that contravened the blockade.

Let's start with Awolowo's quote. As is the usual practice of dishonest characters, the poster above selectively edits the passage to fit an agenda. I think it’s crucial to read the full portion so I’ll reproduce it here with some particularly important sections highlighted.

Then, but above all, the ending of the war itself that I’m accused of, accused of starving the Ibos, I did nothing of the sort. You know, shortly after the liberation of these places, Calabar, Enugu and Port Harcort, I decided to pay a visit. There are certain things which I knew which you don’t know, which I don’t want to say here now, when I write my reminisces in the future I will do so. Some of the soldiers were not truthful with us, they didn’t tell us correct stories and so on.

I wanted to be there and see things for myself, bear in mind that Gowon himself did not go there at that time, it was after the war was over that he dorn himself up in various military dresses- Air force dress, Army dress and so on, and went to the war torn areas. But I went and some people tried to frighten me out of my goal by saying that Adekunle was my enemy and he was going to see to it that I never return from the place, so I went.

But when I went what did I see? I saw the kwashiorkor victims. If you see a kwashiorkor victim you’ll never like war to be waged. Terrible sight, in Enugu, in Port Harcourt, not many in Calabar, but mainly in Enugu and Port Harcourt. Then I enquired what happened to the food we are sending to the civilians. We were sending food through the Red cross, and CARITAS to them, but what happen was that the vehicles carrying the food were always ambushed by the soldiers. That’s what I discovered, and the food would then be taken to the soldiers to feed them, and so they were able to continue to fight. And I said that was a very dangerous policy, we didn’t intend the food for soldiers. But who will go behind the line to stop the soldiers from ambushing the vehicles that were carrying the food? And as long as soldiers were fed, the war will continue, and who’ll continue to suffer? and those who didn’t go to the place to see things as I did, you remember that all the big guns, all the soldiers in the Biafran army looked all well fed after the war, its only the mass of the people that suffered kwashiorkor.

You won’t hear of a single lawyer, a single doctor, a single architect, who suffered from kwashiorkor? None of their children either, so they waylaid the foods, they ambush the vehicles and took the foods to their friends and to their collaborators and to their children and the masses were suffering
. So I decided to stop sending the food there. In the process the civilians would suffer, but the soldiers will suffer most.
To summarize his position: Awolowo supported the sending of relief supplies to Biafra until his visit to the war front. He saw victims of kwashiorkor, despite the considerable resources spent in supplying food to those who needed it in the region. Awolowo's justification for the Nigerian government's decision to end food supplies was that corrupt high-level officials, military personnel and the social elite had succeeded in hoarding food and looting supplies meant for ordinary Biafran citizens, who were undeniably suffering from the prolonged war. Importantly, as Awolowo specifies, there was much less evidence of kwashiorkor affecting the wealthy elite of Biafran society, including Ojukwu and his inner circle. This is my understanding based on the visual images of the period and the material I’ve read about the war. This group, in Awolowo's claim, had access to the hoarded supplies, contraband goods and other smuggling channels. I’m open to being corrected if readers have evidence to the contrary.

There is no dispute then, that Nigeria (and by extension, Gowon and Awolowo) had provided food and other relief supplies for noncombatants in Biafra at the beginning of the war. What changed? Gowon, the journalist John De St Jorre, the British government, and the recently declassified American intelligence documents have all repeated the same allegations that Awolowo made in the quote above, as did several other third-parties and independent observers (including Mark Press, the public relations outfit initially hired to promote Biafran propaganda that later turned dissident). We have the good fortune of being able to refer to Ojukwu's thoughts on the issue.

In the detailed Biafran political manifesto called the Ahiara Declaration a few months before the end of the war, Ojukwu himself accuses high-ranking officials, military personnel and the social elite of Biafra of hoarding food, looting supplies and more unspecified corruption. Sounds familiar, right? In order not to paraphrase him, I include his full quote on the issue below (with relevant sections highlighted again):

"We say that Nigerians are corrupt and take bribes, but here in our country we have among us some members of the Police and the Judiciary who are corrupt and who “eat” bribe. We accuse Nigerians of inordinate love of money, ostentatious living and irresponsibility, but here, even while we are engaged in a war of national survival, even while the very life of our nation hangs in the balance, we see some public servants who throw huge parties to entertain their friends; who kill cows to christen their babies. We have members of the Armed Forces who carry on “attack” trade instead of fighting the enemy. We have traders who hoard essential goods and inflate prices thereby increasing the people’s hardship. We have “money-mongers” who aspire to build hundreds of plots on land as yet unreclaimed from the enemy; who plan to buy scores of lorries and buses and to become agents for those very foreign businessmen who have brought their country to grief. We have some civil servants who think of themselves as masters rather than servants of the people. We see doctors who stay idle in their villages while their countrymen and women suffer and die."
"The Ahiara Declaration: The Principles of the Biafran Revolution", Emeka Ojukwu (June, 1969)

This passage has implications for many of the myths, rumors and lies that have circulated about the civil war since its end. It is clear, for instance, that there were profiteering cabals that hoarded money in anticipation for the end of the war, some of whom would go on to claim the 20 pounds in compensation that the government gave to survivors. The focus here is on the accusation of starvation, so we’ll return to that topic.
PoliticsRe: Col. Ben Gbulie, One Of The 1966 Coupists Speaks On The Coup And Awo by TerraCotta(m): 11:05pm On Nov 15, 2013
PhysicsQED: Regarding #5, I think that I mentioned this a long time ago on a thread where me and Katsumoto discussed this coup, but it's already known that multiple members of the federal and regional governments were aware of an imminent coup - that Zik chose to stay away when given the opportunity might mean that he knew that his position as president made it especially unlikely that he would survive such a coup (had it been carried out successfully), but it doesn't mean that he stayed away because he had in-depth, secret knowledge of the particulars of the coup beforehand, or that he had private discussions with the coup plotters beforehand. That would just be guessing/insinuation, but

There are other publications that make the same observation (about government officials being warned about an impending coup), but this one (Max Siollun's book) actually has the relevant material easily available online to be preview: http://books.google.com/books?id=t5Q78sVbLakC&pg=PA39 Scroll down to the section labeled "Unheeded Warnings" and read on from there.

And of course, there is still the possibility that Zik merely stayed away because he wanted an excuse for an extended vacation (although I think this is the least likely possibility). But in any case, there's no real reason to just assume that Zik's absence is evidence of his involvement in any sort of plot.
Physics--Did you see my question about the idea that there was an earlier plot in 1964/1965 that Azikiwe rejected? Odia Ofeimun, who Max Siollun cites as one source for the idea that the coup's goal was to install Awolowo, wrote that some people claimed Ojukwu approached Azikiwe about mounting a coup after the 1964 political crisis, well in advance of the Nzeogwu group's move in 1966. Azikiwe is said to have turned him down. Gowon also claimed that Ojukwu approached him about mounting a coup and that he rejected the idea as well. Finally, David Ejoor claims that there had been a grand conspiracy for a military coup since Independence (a claim I find hard to believe, but I add here in order to have a full catalogue). Do you know if anyone's ever substantiated these rumours or were they just wartime propaganda?
PoliticsRe: Col. Ben Gbulie, One Of The 1966 Coupists Speaks On The Coup And Awo by TerraCotta(m): 9:37pm On Nov 15, 2013
Katsumoto: Thanks cheesy cheesy cheesy
. I meant to respond to the other thread on Awolowo in detail at some point this weekend. One short question for you (and anyone else interested in the subject)--I am interested if you know of any substantiated reference to the idea that Ojukwu had proposed military coups at least twice before secession in 1967 (once during the 1964 crisis, directly to Azikiwe and once in January 1965 to Gowon). There are vague references to this by Odia Ofeimun in his essays last year on Chinua Achebe's book and the forgotten documents on the war, as well as in a speech Gowon gave to the OAU towards the end of the war. The latter could very easily be an example of wartime propaganda, and the former seems to lack any corroboration as well. Do you know anything about this?
PoliticsRe: Col. Ben Gbulie, One Of The 1966 Coupists Speaks On The Coup And Awo by TerraCotta(m): 9:08pm On Nov 15, 2013
Katsumoto, you've put together another well thought-out and impeccably-sourced argument.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 8:00pm On Nov 12, 2013
naijaking1: So sweet!
Awolowo solidarity union--Nairaland Branch.
Are you accepting applications?
Yup--all you have to do is shun myths and baseless rumours, pick up a few books, read and understand Nigerian political history and economy, and I'm fairly confident you'd be an Awolowo admirer too.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 5:37pm On Nov 12, 2013
Katsumoto: @ TerraCotta

You did well. Not more I can add to that.
Thanks. You did a hell of a job disassembling the same type of nonsense in the Awolowo/GEJ thread so I thought I'd relieve the burden here cheesy
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m):
nagoma: I am truly ignorant on this. Can someone enlighten me please? Are we sure this Gunther guy was not mistaking someone for Awolowo?
1.Was awo fond of wearing dark red and gold turban?
No. He would have not worn a turban, so this conversation is somewhat suspicious.

2. Was Awo at any time opposed to republics and in favor of aristocracy?
No, he favored a republic throughout his political career. He explained his basic framework for a federal republic in Path to Nigerian Freedom (published in 1947). He did advocate for traditional authorities to have a role (as in the British parliamentary system's House of Lords and the Ooni Aderemi's role as ceremonial governor of the Western Region), but they were not a substitute for electoral politics or democracy, as Awolowo and Akintola showed as premiers of the same region.

3. What princes was the writer referring to , who fought for independence with politicians and needed to be considered?
Who knows? Ooni Aderemi did advocate for independent as an Action Group patron, and Awolowo was a part of traditional Remo politics through his wife's family (as detailed in the recent biography I mentioned earlier). The quote doesn't give us much information though so this is purely speculative. It wouldn't make any sense to portray Awolowo as a feudalist though.

Slight edit--I don't recall whether he explicitly called for a republic in "Path to Nigerian Freedom". It may have been an evolving political idea that came to fruition by the time he published "The People's Republic". Given his support for some type of integration of traditional government with democracy, he may not have been a strict republican.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 5:13pm On Nov 12, 2013
I have no respect for the author of the post I'm quoting, since he's one of those dishonest ethnic impersonators who have almost ruined this site. I will try to correct some of the more glaring lies in the ill-conceived article above.

tomakint: Some of his lieutenants and associates went to jail for corruption at the end of such probe but the commission of enquiry or military tribunals usually come back with a clean bill of health for him, his policies and administration. So we can repeat with certainty what Gunther wrote about him in the 1950s that “there has never been a breath of scandal about him.”

We cannot say that about many of his associates however, some of whom wined and dined with the military, stole billions out of the treasury. Some were caught with their hands in the jar. Some served deserved prison jail sentence and come out of prison to continue looting the country. I believe Awolowo’s penchant for probity and uprightness contributed in no small measure to the many myths and mystics about him. Every time Nigerians look at the present crop of charlatans ruling our dear country, we long for Papa Awo. We imagined what could have been.
These are the typical worthless accusations made by mediocre minds and charlatans. If "Francis Adewale" (a ridiculous pseudonym--what else has this fictional character written outside of his denigration of Awolowo?) thinks it is important to reference these allegedly corrupt associates of Awolowo, shouldn't it be important to name them? Instead, we have a full article of rambling gossip with not one single corrupt 'associate' identified by name.

We however need to point out that Papa Awo was definitely not like Caesar’s wife, “above board”, many rumors of his alleged “conflict of interest” with Western Nigerian land allocations and business abound.
Another puerile accusation. Earlier, this writer points out that Awolowo was investigated numerous times and was cleared, but then goes on to reference "rumors" about unspecified "conflicts of interest." The attempt to smear Awolowo with the taint of corruption through unnamed associates or vague rumors is obvious and juvenile. Anyone with a critical mind would see through it immediately.

Why did Awolowo started out on an ethnic platform? The mystery will always remains with us. Why a so called intellectual giant should reduce himself to a Yoruba irredentist by giving voice to “Yoruba nationalist and tribal aspirations” will forever remain a puzzle for us. Each time I read about the very beginnings of Awolowo’s politics I shudder. Is Nigeria not worth fighting for.
Another ignorant accusation that shows the author's lack of knowledge about Awolowo's political goals and cultural stance. First, Awolowo was leader of the Nigerian Youth Movement's Western regional branch in Ibadan in 1940, co-founder of the Nigerian Produce Traders Association and the Trade Union Congress of Nigeria (1943), all before the founding of Egbe Omo Oduduwa in London in 1945. Egbe Omo Oduduwa was also explicitly a cultural organization and not a political party (ie The Action Group), so the writer fails to establish his point. More interestingly, the Ibibio Federal Union was formed in 1928, and the Ibo Federal Union (later Ibo State Union) had been in existence since the 1930s. It was the existence of these other pan-ethnic unions that in part inspired the merging of other Yoruba groups into Egbe Omo Oduduwa.

Thanks to the likes of Awolowo, Nigeria remain divided in 2007 as it was in the 1950s even though Germany and Ireland are now part of a united European Union with a commonwealth economic and political behemoth that has brought Ireland out of economic doldrums to one of the most industrialized nation on earth. The allusion to China is in itself laughable. The geographical nexus of the three regions at that time render Awolowo’s metaphor incongruent. This is atypical of Nigeria’s ethnically jaundiced politician from all the regions. They sowed the seeds of discord that has held Nigeria in bondage to date.
Here's where the fictional penman starts to show his true colors. Of course, Awolowo cannot be held responsible for the division in Nigeria by any thoughtful observer.

Welcome primordial ethnic prejudice. I hope folks who think that ethnic’s politics in Nigeria is only a recent creation will now see where it started from. So when in 2002, Chief Bola Ige, one of the ardent followers of Awo, exclaim that the Yoruba race is far more superior than any other ethnic group in Nigeria, we can understand where that is coming from. It has been a miracle that the kind of ethnic holocaust witnessed in Rwanda has not happened in Nigeria, given all these very inflammatory words by Nigerian politicians.
It would be wonderful if this character could quote Bola Ige rather than slandering him as an ethnic supremacist. It is obvious why he doesn't; this is undoubtedly a fraudulent quote.

One of my friends had tried to explain Awo’s appeal to ethnicity to advanced his political agenda on the grounds that Awo never imagined that all the regions will be granted independence at the same time. “In short,” my friend concluded “Awo never thought the North will ever be ready for independence, he therefore opted to rule a part of the whole and thus mortgaged the whole for a part.” My instant retort, is what happened subsequently after October 1, 1960? Why did he not changed? Why did he allowed himself to be anointed the Leader of Yoruba at the height of Nigerian civil war? Why did he promised to lead a breakaway Nigerian if East succeeded in it’s secession? How can you run for the presidency of a nation, when your world view is that some of it’s people are more inferior to another within the same polity! What was going on in his mind in the 1940s when he came back from Great Britain to join Nigeria politics?
More of the same nonsense. Awolowo campaigned with the Action Group in the North throughout the 1950s (with Time Magazine and various Nigerian publications reporting on this at the time) and had a substantial following in the areas that form the current Rivers, Cross River and Akwa Ibom states. He was not anointed leader of the Yoruba during the Civil War--he was unanimously considered the most influential politician in the Western region throughout his politically active life. He also did not "promise to lead a breakaway Nigerian if East succeeded in its secession", whatever that was supposed to mean. It is on record that he led reconciliation meetings to Biafra and publicly urged Ojukwu and his council to remain part of Nigeria until the start of the war.

Setting aside Gunther’s racial prejudice for the time being, it is interesting to learn here for the first time that Awolowo did not take a strong political line against the British until about 1948. Does this explain his distaste for the NCNC politics?
Again, his is demonstrably untrue since Awolowo was a leading member of the Nigerian Youth Movement and active trade unionist and reporter a decade before his return to Nigeria after law school. The author confuses his activities as the head of a new political party (the Action Group) with Awolowo's political activism, which dated back to the 1930s.

I don't often take the time to respond to every slander against Nigeria's best and brightest, but this thread was full of lies and the persistence of Biafra-era propaganda against Obafemi Awolowo needs to be corrected and completely settled. If people are interested in a genuine debate about the man's successes and flaws, I'm sure there are plenty of people who would listen. Flimsy propaganda pieces that can't even explain the basic details of his life, career and political outlook correctly have to be torn apart and dismissed, as I just did with this piece.
PoliticsRe: Awolowo Is Responsible For The Developments In Today's Western States - Clark by TerraCotta(m): 10:23pm On Nov 11, 2013
Ethnic bias has caused such an immense amount of mental rot on some posters that they cannot even read a straightforward comment praising Obafemi Awolowo without "interpreting" it as some sort of veiled insult. Whatever you or I may think of Emeka Ojukwu, he was recognized as an eloquent, well-educated man, and a plain spoken one too. If he called Obafemi Awolowo a "hero" and the "best president Nigeria never had", his meaning should be clear to all but the most dense, hate-filled bigots who cannot stomach the thought that a leading Igbo icon had such high praise for a Yoruba man. It is the most damning evidence that Awolowo's supposed ethnic enmity or rivalry with Igbo politicians is a horrible and baseless lie. When Ojukwu--who is the primary source of information for many of Awolowo's accusers--was asked, he didn't charge Awolowo with the starvation of babies or the genocide of millions because he knew that Awolowo was not responsible for Ojukwu's decisions to refuse food and determination to prolong a conflict he had little hope of winning. The facts may hurt people's pride, but that will never stop them from being true. I would be interested to read any charges from Ojukwu that blamed Awolowo for the way he prosecuted the war in the way that some other biased observers (most recently Chinua Achebe) have.

Regarding the topic, Obafemi Awolowo was a man of impeccable discipline and uncommon intelligence. Nigeria would have been immeasurably improved if he had the opportunity to serve at the central government level, but the former western region and current Yoruba-speaking states were the main beneficiaries of his efforts and they remain forever grateful for his visionary leadership. I learn new things about this accomplished man all the time. Insa Nolte's recent biography is an excellent source of background information about his political development: http://www.amazon.com/Obafemi-Awolowo-Making-Remo-Nationalist/dp/1592217567

With recent revelations like Damola Awolokun's review of CIA documents on the Nigerian civil war, I know it's only a matter of time before Nigerians learn the full truth about that war and the myriad lies that have been told in its wake. Anyone who has a conscience should be able to read the statements and eulogy Ojukwu gave Awolowo and draw an unbiased conclusion. I know that the hardcore tribal warriors won't be swayed either way but I do hope my saner readers will do their research and recognize what a transformational leader this country would have had in Awolowo.
PropertiesRe: d by TerraCotta(m): 2:37am On Nov 03, 2013
sauer: More recently, there is starting to be need to develop African architecture. Home designs seem dogmatically tied to old inheritances from mid-20th century architecture. Nigeria has changed a lot, whether for good or bad; and there is need to African, or Lagos, architecture to evolve with it. Lack of electricity in most homes should warrant building more ventilation systems into homes. Evidently, this is not the case. Adaptable housing on coastal areas like Lagos Island should be a point of interest among Lagos architects. Unfortunately, this is not the case.

My main point in the whole story though, is to emphasize the need to develop an architecture that is more suitable for Africans given our socio-economic conditions. Many architects have already taken the bull by the horn and have dared to do something differently. Even though I can't mention the names of these architects off the top of my head, I have heard of different experiments being carried out lately. And these have signs of genius in them.
It's really encouraging to read these types of ideas from other Nigerians who are passionate about architecture and design. Building contemporary Nigerian homes that are indistinguishable from houses in suburban Texas or Toronto is a sad waste, in many cases. Obviously, people who are paying good money to build their own homes should be able to make them look however they like, but Nigerians don't seem to have much interest and flexibility about the range of options beyond standard-issue structures.

I actually happen to prefer midcentury modern architecture, and the tropical modernism of the 1960s (which is well-preserved on campuses and in a few neighborhoods in Lagos and Ibadan that I know of) is my all-time favorite design period. At the same time, I think current architects should be proposing more innovation than I've seen. Not just design for the sake of something flashy and new (which is fine if that's your thing), but design that incorporates new ideas about ventilation, rainwater and surrounding natural features.

Maybe we can get a good discussion going here about Nigerian architecture? If the OP feels satisfied by the earlier response on chimneys, which I agree with, I'd like to ask why so few new homes have real provisions for gardens? There's lots of concrete and maybe a row of hedges but you rarely see someone who's trying to maintain a good amount of greenery either in the front or back of their home.

My favorite African architectural inspiration is Joe Osae-Addo, who built his home in Ghana using locally sourced wood, a type of cement, clay and Palm kernel blend called pozzoghana (like pozzolano) and (regarding the chimney issue) enough ventilation not to need air conditioning:

https://www.e-architect.co.uk/images/jpgs/america/new_orelans_houses_graftlab270308_construct.jpg
PoliticsRe: Saudi Arabia, Nigeria And Others In Financial Trouble As Australia Discovers Oil by TerraCotta(m): 4:33pm On Nov 01, 2013
I don't know how legitimate this Australian oil claim is (the source looks a little sketchy to me) but the writing has been on the wall for oil-dependent exporter nations for a little while, I think.

This article is from yesterday's Wall Street Journal:


Shell Looks to Sell Nigerian Pipeline
Theft and Vandalism Have Plagued Company's Operations in Niger Delta

By
Sarah Kent,
Benoît Faucon and
Justin Scheck

Oct. 30, 2013 6:14 p.m. ET

Royal Dutch Shell RDSB.LN +1.23% PLC is trying to exit an oil-rich but violent part of Nigeria, say people briefed on the company's plans to sell a leak-prone pipeline and several oil wells there.

In recent weeks, the Anglo-Dutch energy giant has had early talks with Nigeria-based companies over selling them four oil-production blocks and a major pipeline in the southern Niger Delta, say two people with knowledge of the talks. Shell has sent confidential financial information on the assets to at least two dozen suitors, these people say.

Selling the Nembe Creek Trunk Line—which moves oil through the Delta to the Atlantic coast—would be Shell's biggest move yet to exit onshore crude production in a region that has caused problems for decades. Over the past year, the Nembe Creek line has had multiple punctures and closures, and at least one fire.

The resulting environmental cleanups and financial losses have been a drag on profits for Shell, which is set to report its quarterly results Thursday. Now, Shell is trying to get rid of the infrastructure in favor of focusing on potentially less-problematic natural-gas production and offshore oil drilling, say Shell executives and bankers briefed on the company's Nigeria plans.

Shell operates the pipeline and oil blocks with a 30% ownership stake. State-owned Nigeria National Petroleum Corp. owns 55%, Total SA FP.FR -0.91% of France owns 10% and Eni ENI.MI -0.54% SpA of Italy owns 5%.

Since 2010, Shell's Nigeria subsidiary has sold $1.8 billion in Nigeria assets, and it isn't alone among Western oil companies in reducing its onshore presence there. ConocoPhillips Co. COP -1.21% says it is selling its entire Nigerian business, and Chevron Corp. CVX -2.02% is in the process of selling some assets in the country as well.

In June, Shell announced a strategic review of its Niger Delta operations, which it said could result in some divestments, while at the same time announcing that it planned to invest $3.9 billion in other projects onshore in the Delta.

A company spokesman said the strategic review is ongoing, "and therefore we are not in a position to confirm which, if any, blocks may be put up for sale."

Shell could face hurdles to selling its pipeline. The company says it supports the Nigerian government's efforts to have indigenous firms take over onshore oil assets, but Nigeria-based oil firms have had trouble getting financing to buy assets from international companies in recent years. The parties to any sale also would have to figure out how to manage potential liabilities from spills and other environmental damage. Shell could end up retaining liability for years after a divestiture, say people familiar with the matter. The Shell spokesman said the company would comply with applicable laws but commercial arrangements haven't yet been decided.

It isn't clear what the pipeline is worth. Advisers and officials with companies considering buying Shell assets say Shell could get $2 billion or more for the oil fields linked to the pipeline.

Shell can get almost 400,000 barrels of oil a day from its Nigeria installations, but its production has suffered as a result of oil theft and vandalism in recent years. Other companies are also suffering from the unrest in the Delta. Italy's Eni said Wednesday that oil theft in Nigeria contributed to a decline of more than 3% in its oil and gas production in the first nine months of the year. Nigeria's national oil company also said this week that "relentless attacks on major crude arteries" have hurt the country's economy.

The Nembe Creek pipeline has been a particular target, even after Shell invested over $1 billion to rebuild it in 2011. The pipeline was shut for much of this year, taking 150,000 barrels per day offline. It reopened briefly in the fall but was shut again after new oil-theft incidents, which have totaled at least 60 this year on the line, Shell said.

Shell says at least three-quarters of the spills are due to sabotage or puncturing of pipelines by thieves trying to siphon off oil. Others are from maintenance problems or pipeline breakdowns, bringing criticism on Shell from environmental groups and, this month, from a Norwegian government advisory body, which recommended the country's $780 billion oil fund keep a close watch on Shell spills in the Delta.

The United Nations Environment Program in 2011 called Shell's control and maintenance of the infrastructure in the area "inadequate." Shell says it has made progress on addressing the issues raised in the report and is committed to cleaning up all oil spills from its facilities.

Despite Shell's backing of the government's push to see Nigerian companies take over local infrastructure, Jacob Mandi, a former oil thief who used to steal from the Nembe Creek line, says he's not sure that will help things. While having local owners may ease problems, he said, if the owners are unknown to those who live near the pipeline, "they will need to settle the community" by paying money to avoid vandalism.

Maybe the domestic market for refined products will grow aggressively in Nigeria (this is the Dangote strategy, as far as I can see) but the traditional export market is going to shrink with the growth of US shale. China has significant reserves as well.
CultureRe: The Arab Origin Of The Yorubas by TerraCotta(m): 4:15pm On Nov 01, 2013
tpia@:
the ife connection might be a bit of a stretch, since ife is centrally located and not near the river niger.
It's not a stretch at all. Economic trade along the length of the Niger was central to the development (possibly even the establishment) of Ile-Ife. Sometimes the materials I want to reference aren't available online for easy distribution, but you can read supporting material on this here (it's an archeaological essay from a recent book):

http://books.google.com/books?id=CS5tHpdMMa4C&pg=PA58&lpg=PA58&dq=Ile+Ife+Middle+Niger+trade&source=bl&ots=bMjna7Qxm9&sig=n93WLMZ4tc4HskOumE1i0S8KaIQ&hl=en&sa=X&ei=Z79zUpCLBc6gsATu54HABQ&ved=0CCsQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Ile%20Ife%20Middle%20Niger%20trade&f=false

Here's a quick quote in case people aren't able to access the link. "There is direct evidence that the glass beads and the copper products, crucial to the political economy of power in Ile-Ife, were imported from across the Sahara, via the Middle Niger."

I'd add that there's also evidence that at least some of these materials were available for extraction (in the case of copper) and manufacture (in the case of quartz and mica/silica for glass) in the general area, which is an exciting development. This is important because economics and trade are the main stimulus for political development, and following their path is extremely helpful in understanding why cities, political systems, religions and the like develop.

Ile-Ife was not just an arbitrary settlement that developed into the major cosmopolitan center in its region. There were almost certainly geographic advantages and abundant resources (as well as a measure of cultural creativity) that led to its growth. Here's another discussion referencing some of the recent archaeological evidence:

http://books.google.com/books?id=fY0eAAAAQBAJ&pg=PA864&lpg=PA864&dq=Ile+Ife+carnelian&source=bl&ots=EV2cnbTqsd&sig=ZzVMNhcvGjjJ0ZoJfmNEM-HW8Fk&hl=en&sa=X&ei=eMFzUuPLLZWxsAS12oDYBQ&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=Ile%20Ife%20carnelian&f=false

"The production of crafts were very intense after the 10th century AD, and archaeologists have identified an "industrial site" where the manufacture of glass beads, iron and perhaps brass/bronze sculpture took place. This is the Olokun grove, less than 2 km from the palace area."

is there any way to find out if yorubas knew the extent of the niger- where it ended. [i suppose they didnt].

Not yet, as far as I know. There aren't maps and obviously we don't have written records from that time. There may be suggestions in Ifa poetry or myths.

[quote]also, thanks for answering.
My pleasure cheesy--I love this material and it's a great diversion from the day job every once in a while..

9jacrip: Besides I suppose carbon dated artefacts have been found in Ife which pre-dates Muhammed/Islam? For example, the Opa Oranmiyan in Ife far pre-dates Oduduwa/Oranmiyan era, are we going to then say ghosts occupied Ife and built the obelisk?
Interestingly, the earliest evidence of settlements in Ile-Ife are from around 350 BC: http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/hd/ife/hd_ife.htm

That's about 900 years before Muhammed's recorded birth. If there is evidence of pre-Muhammedan Arab immigration, not one single reputable historian has found it. Certainly, the early writers like Reverend Samuel Johnson linked whatever "immigration" they mentioned to a vague war with Islam, but we know now that the dates are impossible and the theory doesn't work.

There's also sensible timeline of political/economic/cultural development--from the founding villages, to the evolution of an Obaship, to consolidation of political power under "Oduduwa" (if he/she existed), to dispersal to the other places that now claim ancestral ties with Ife. This hypothesis has been around since the golden age of Nigerian historical research in the 1970s and has decent evidence to back up the main conclusions, but people prefer to look elsewhere or just make things up as they go along.
CultureRe: Ndigbo And Her 'integrated' Eri/nri Brother by TerraCotta(m): 3:45pm On Nov 01, 2013
ezeagu: The major discoveries were by accident, not by piecing together. The point was that nothing was being done at present in Awka.
You're changing goalposts. Earlier, you wrote:

ezeagu: Every archaeological discovery in Nigeria has been accidental, every single one, and if not for people of European descent the artefacts would be discarded or broken down for reuse.
That's obviously wrong, which is I was pointing it out.

Most of those museums are shut most times of the year, it's a well known fact, and most parks and natural spaces have been overrun by weed or used for trading.
I don't know which ones you're talking about. These broad generalizations aren't helpful. If you live in or vist Lagos, you can go to visit the National Museum from 9 am to 5 pm. It's in very poor shape because of funding issues but it's available for anyone who's interested for about 150 naira: http://premiumtimesng.com/regional/125968-lagos-residents-want-fg-to-upgrade-national-museum.html

There's also the Didi Museum, TerraKulture, Nike Art Center(s) etc:

http://ckdigital.net/didimuseum/
http://www.nikeart.com/
http://home.terrakulture.com/

Parks and natural spaces aren't in short supply either. There's the Lekki Conservation Center (http://www.tripadvisor.com/Attraction_Review-g304026-d2305113-Reviews-Lekki_Conservation_Centre-Lagos_Lagos_State.html) in Lagos, the 100-acre IITA campus in Ibadan (http://inasonki-ng.com/2013/05/01/getaway-iita-ibadan/), and Obudu ranch in Cross River state (http://www.africansunhotels.com/?fuseaction=hotels.info&name=obudu_mountain_resort), off the top of my head.

These are a few of the ones I know of personally and I am sure there are many more. The point is there are working archaeologists and available cultural and natural institutions, if you're interested in attending them. They may not be up to the global standard in some (not all) cases but it would be wrong to say they don't exist.

Apologies for derailing the thread.
PoliticsRe: BREAKING: Iroko Partners Scheme, Retirement Of Staff, Iroking Former Ceo's Reply by TerraCotta(m): 11:08pm On Oct 31, 2013
Interesting--tell us more. Why doesn't the former CEO completely deny the allegation?

iRoko got a lot of international coverage during their expansion. Sad to see the business imploding so quickly.
PropertiesRe: The Magnificent 4 Bedroom Duplex In Port Harcourt by TerraCotta(m): 11:05pm On Oct 31, 2013
The detail you put into your threads is amazing. I feel like I've watched these homes go up every step of the way without once carrying concrete blocks or clearing bush grin Great job. You and Brabus do an admirable job marketing your services.
CultureRe: Ndigbo And Her 'integrated' Eri/nri Brother by TerraCotta(m): 10:53pm On Oct 31, 2013
ChinenyeN: It's unfortunate how archaeology and anthropology are trivialized in Nigeria. In my research, I remember reading how stone tools were uncovered in Ngwa, one of which supposedly dated as far back as 50,000 years. Yet, not one single archaeological dig has occurred since that accidental discovery. Honestly, I believe it would be very interesting to see how far we can go in effectively reconstructing the history of southeastern Nigeria.
I totally agree. Unfortunately, this type of work is usually funded by academia or cultural institutions with major endowments and we don't seem to have many of those active anymore in Nigeria. I hold out hope that some of the major businesses (Dangote? Glo? First Bank?) will incorporate this into their corporate social responsibility plans someday. Funding is a major problem for cultural research anywhere though.

ezeagu: Every archaeological discovery in Nigeria has been accidental, every single one, and if not for people of European descent the artefacts would be discarded or broken down for reuse.
You're wrong, and working Nigerian archaeologists like Professors Ogundiran (http://africana.uncc.edu/people/dr-akin-ogundiran-phd) and Usman (https://sst.clas.asu.edu/aribidesi-usman) are living, working proof. I understand that it's hard to find their work if you're not a professional academic but that doesn't mean it does not exist. There are working Nigerian archaeologists making interesting finds everyday. They might not be the spectacular bronze or brassworks or major architectural works but they're crucial pieces in the puzzle of reconstructing the precolonial past.

It's a cultural thing, it's the same reason Nigerians don't go to museums, preserve old structures/natural spaces and objects, the reason they don't take pictures of scenery or anything that isn't a relative/friends face, or read to their children at night.

Short attention spans, which is why there's absolutely no sign Nigeria was in a heavy war 40 years ago or that it was ever a British colony.
I don't want to dispute your personal experience but other people have had a very different experience--going to the museums in Lagos, Umuahia and Jos, preserving old structures and natural spaces in Ibadan, Calabar, Osogbo, Benin, Kano and Ile-Ife, taking scenic photos etc. It's easy to generalize about how uncultured we are but I don't think it's accurate; if anything, we can see how attached Nigerians are to their cultures here. There's just very little money and education devoted to the field, which is a fairly common problem worldwide.

Radoillo: Some stone tools (celts) were found there in the '30s. Recently I've heard of some metal objects being dug up. Unfortunately though, no one appears interested in following up these findings and doing more systematic 'digging' in the place.
.

I have a good feeling that someone will turn up a milestone find in that area. There are some other under-explored areas in central Nigeria (current Niger and Kogi state), the Ondo-Ekiti area and Kano (although I'm less familiar with that area) that I expect will revolutionize what we know sooner or later.

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