₦airaland Forum

Matter can't exist without time and space. So if either space or time are a function of our neurons, so is matter. Do you see where you are heading with vain brainless philosophies?

KeenOne:
Space, like time, does not exist independent of our cognizance and recognition of it.

Like Immanuel Kant posited, "space and time do not exist in and of themselves, but ... are the
product of the way we represent things"

That's what am aksin keenone. Time exists in our mind, space too and of course matter. Even marine invertebrates would mock your wisdom

ooman:
you are made of matter. In fact, you are matter. do you exist independently of your own recognition.

Then subscribe to sense and not idiocy. If existence is a function of perception then those planets that we are yet to discover don't exist

KeenOne:
Stop trolling me, dude.

What about matter?

KeenOne:
Space, like time, does not exist indepeof our cognizance and recognition of it.

Like Immanuel Kant posited, "space and time do not exist in and of themselves, but ... are the
product of the way we represent things"

In many words your morality is a figment of your society collective and historical imagination.
Is this how you make decisions? When faced with a moral issue, can you simply disregard the 'social voices' in your head screaming at you and do what you wanted to do?

plaetton:
Society does not produce values overnight. They are dynamic and evolve over time and generations.
This is why I referred to Social evolution, something that you obviously have trouble grasping.

Yes. Moral values can be socially engineered,. as we have so many instances today.
For example, the tolerance and acceptance of homosexuality in many western societies and the non-acceptance of same in more primitive societies.

You are funny.
Does space exist 'independent of our collective cognizance and recognition of it'?
You need to study elementary physics to appreciate what time is.

KeenOne:
I don't think time is conscious and organizes things based on available number of lives as you stated, its quite the opposite, I believe.


The consciousness embodied in time stems from human consciousness. I don't think time exists independent of our collective cognizance and recognition of it. For example, if live and humanity ceases to exist, needless to say time measurements like centuries, decades, years, months, weeks, days, minutes et al will grind to a halt.


In other words, time is an artificial creation of man meant for measurement.

My broda,
We are asking WHY humans know why what is right from wrong. Is it genetic like say your eye brows?

johnydon22:
lmao..
i av said enough abeg...

You and i and everyother human on earth know the difference between right from wrong... Xo i dont see the need arguing over it anymore... their is nothing that needs saying that have not been said...

Be good bro

This is circular thinking bro.
If society produces morality then why should you DEMAND that society must not produce cannibalism because that is not moral? You seem to have some standards of what moral is /ain't and you expect the society to conform to these. Funny guy

Morality is a product of social evolution. Your morality borrows heavily from society is what you are saying. If/when we evolve to the point of cannibalism, you will happily eat my fried liver

So, where do we separate the actual societal evolved moral values from deviations from the same?
Example. Society has evolved to the point where raping an infant is detestable. A pedophil.e in this environment is clearly deviating from the evolution path. But could he be evolving into the 'next' phase?

frank317:
While I agree that morality could be a product of the society... I never said so in my post. You indicated you wanted to know how we as individuals become morality.

Why should the society start cannibalism? Is cannibalism a moral behaviour?
Today look around you, people in the society act in ways that goes against morality; they steal, molest women, and even kill. Have I happily jumped into it?

Seriously do u think cannibalism is moral? Don't the society condenm stealing?

Existential nihilism would never leave the comfort of a text book any more than Godzilla would leave your LED screen. Look at your life and tell me whether you are living your nihilism or even trying to

KeenOne:
As an existential nihilist, I believe the human life has no value except those we attach to it to give us a sense of purpose

In few words you could have said that your moral compass is a product of the society. If we wake up tomorrow and start cannibalism, you will happily jump in

frank317:
Now u have turned ur own thread to something silly.

All I see here is dumb questions...what is right? What is moralily? What is empathy? ...Seriously? You can as well ask, what is a dog?

To me if someone slaps me I feel pain or if someone steals my phone I feel hurt. Do I need to rush to the bible to know if I should feel hurt/pain or not? No. With that, I already know slapping or stealing from others will hurt or pain them, hence the decision not to do it.

Now some people still hurt others, pastors still cheat on their wives despite knowing it will hurt her. This is because we are faced between trying to satisfy ourselves and others sometimes. Its a tough decision to make sometimes and at the end what matters most prevails, hence some people get hurt.

Do you have an opinion on morality or is it totally beyond you?

At what stage are Boko Haram in this social evolution?
Is religion too a product of social evolution?

plaetton:
I still have no idea what you are talking about , or are trying to talk about.

I have given you a simple answer that morality is product of social evolution, both at the individual level, and at the level of the society, any given society.
In other words, my morality is the product of my social evolution.
My morality is shaped first by the habits and norms of my parents, my community and environment, my education, my philosophical leaning ( in your case, your religion), blended with the common laws of my society.

Then please drop ambiguity

davien:
Don't dodge the question...answer it..

I believe in so many things.
I believe mosquito nets gives me nightmares so I avoid them, never used one in close to a decade

johnydon22:
He is asking you what belief is
Then turns around and borrows another question if good and evil exist...

Is good an entity or evil an entity

The guy just lost it... desperation is on point now

What belief?

Sideshows apart, do good and evil exist?

davien:
Isn't your belief also an authoritarian one?

Do good and evil exist?

johnydon22:
Lmao...me? ...

I just wonder why you are calling devian here...
You no longer have anything to say...so lets wait for them.

Oga this is not a personal issue, we just had a civilized discussion so act like it my bro.

davien, he is bleeding badly

johnydon22:
........................................... Another dumb question....................................
my above posts shall answer that, i do not wish to start typing everything i have typed before, its not necessary.

If you cannot make sense from all i have written above then its a pity ..

Let us wait for people who are reading our discussion in this thread tell us who among us is the shallow one.. shall we

So I hear

davien:
Is the nation an authoritarian one?

Human life is valuable because of EMPATHY. Thus saith johnydon22
Why EMPATHIZE? Is empathy optional?

johnydon22:
Are you out of questions?

Then i invite the religious people around to come and read our discussions so far to see who really is the shallow person... shall we now wait for them to tell who the shallow one is dear one?

That kid is bad news. He executed his own uncle

davien:
vooks what do you think of north korea's leader?

I forgive you for shallowness. davien kindly take him off the ring

johnydon22:
lol i am sure you are out of question... is it not the question i just answered.

Please go up and read all my replies again dear one!

You are running in circles; am human because am human therefore it is only reasonable to conclude that am nothing but human, as in like seriously, what else can I be but human?

Why do you care about humans? Do you have any objective reason for caring?

johnydon22:
Then it boils down to my first answer to you cus I am human

my dear bro why are you still going in circles?

I know the definition of empathy,sympathy and all -athies you can conjure up.
Am aksin WHY do you, a mesh of cells, CARE about another mesh of cells' feelings?

johnydon22:
@the bolded shows you really dont know your English, how can empathy be a who?....nawa ooooo.

Empathy is doing the things you do with consideration to the feelings of others so ask me again why it matters... next time search a word you dont know in the dictionary before asking such dumb question (i.e : Am not calling you dumb)

The society derives morality from empathy.

Right and wrong is encompassed in the dimension of empathy. . . as long as as anything you do hurts no one in anyway. e.g You kissing a girl do not hurt anybody in short in is pleasurable to both of you, so how can it be wrong?

Oh dear!
Isn't it too early for ad hominem?

davien:
johnydon he has a script to follow from answersingenesis...

Hitler was filled with intellect, I hear his IQ was off the charts, who/what determined what 'is good' for him?

I doubt ISIL have the IQ of labradors

johnydon22:
Now i guess you are telling us with someone threatening you with burning in hell, some one like you will never be moral.

That shows you are really mistaking what morality is all about.

[Humans are filled with intellect and are able to discern what is good through our empathy towards others and society.

Oh yes i do all the bad things i want, i steal, i rape and i kill as many as i want and the many i want is 0 (zero).

All this goes against empathy hence i dont engage in any of them.

Now for religious morality it is not really morality.

If you are good because you want to make heaven, it is not really goodness cus you are just doing it for your own gain at the end, we call it selfishness.

If you are good because you want to escape hell, it is not really goodness cus you are just doing it to save your own skin, so for your own good.. we call it selfiness.

Real goodness is doing good for goodness sake.

Being good because you know it is right to be good.

Being good because you want good to happen on earth. that is really goodness in other words morality

Who/what is empathy and why does it matter?
Where does 'society'derive morality from?
Who/what determines 'right'?

johnydon22:
Morality is a product of empathy and the society.

In every animal their is always a basic sense of morality.

So morality is driven from humanity, Humanity is deeply moral and so every human on earth have an intense sense of morality.

Morality means doing what is right no matter what you are told, but religion on the other hands means doing what you are told no matter what is right.

Now next time you ask where our morality stems from, Look within yourself and see where yours stems from, you may think it religion but thats a lie.

Your basic sense of empathy and morality stems only from your humanity...

Calm down and don't get worked up yet.
Am examining where your 'I' leads us; hopeless subjectivity
But why should an atheistic, Darwinism student with majors in materialism be worried about VALUE? It's all survival for the fittest. Bleep VALUES.

Why would he be obligated to follow that script which is biologically manufactured and with zero bearing on his 'reality'?

davien:
Don't be stu.pid,learn the difference between "I value" and "it is valuable when",because I answered the question on where "I" get my values from...and hitler maximized pain and suffering to do that,thus is considered evil....so what you have no point there
You just ignored the bulk of my posts and jumped to a scripted response...
Did hitler follow the former "preservation of life and the cease or reduction of overall unnecessary pain"

And not just on Jesus but Paul the apostle. They say he was a mad man. I have engaged these street evangelists and I can assure you, you would lose your head the next second you uttered the same on Islamic faith. Don't you recall how the whole world rioted when one pope said that Christianity is a faith of REASON? Petty hypocrites

Sometimes I just wonder why this dreaded bully called Allah won't fight her own battles and leaves them to confused mortals instead
Cc midolian

Ifeann:
I have told him several times not to use such language. It annoys me as well because it tends to over shadow the message. .. .. i don't control him. .. it a free world. .islam is not in control. Stop ur silly emotional attachment to Mohammed and intolerance. .. prove the content of his post is a fraud or fact. ...
Salam


Modified. ... Muslims say all manner of things about Jesus that i know are not true. .some Muslims here have used all manner of insulting language... but the teachings of Jesus whom i love forbids me to insult them back or seek retribution... u should learn to do the same.

Thank you for stopping by. Unfortunately this is way above your IQ, but you can stick around and watch

all4naija:
Doesn't it explain that I don't. Please, go f**k yourself, you punk!

So human life is ONLY valuable as long as it increases 'well being and happiness'. And this depends entirely on your judgement

Hitler believed 'well being and happiness' would be achieved if he wiped ALL the Jews. That was the product of his 'evaluations of reality and situation'

davien:
important in what sense?
And I derive my values from evaluations of the facts of reality and of the situation....life is preferable to death....joy pleasurable to pain...and that my actions have an effect on myself and those around me....
So I value the preservation of life and the cease or reduction of overall unnecessary pain,to increase well being and happiness....

Am interested in YOU not phony theories. Now that you know that morality is a figment of your imagination and that of your ancestors, do you act and live like it?

PS: Am focussing on atheism not theism and you are already muddying this discussion by conflating the two. Attacking atheism is not necessarily defending theism

plaetton:
This issue of morality has been thoroughly thrashed on this forum a dozens times.
Morality is product of social evolution.

And please , don't give us that God -centered morality crap.
That's the biggest lie ever sold.

God, or should I say, the Gods themselves, from Zeus, to Horus, to Yahweh, were themselves, the greatest personifications of the grossest forms of immorality.

Am aksin about YOU not some humans
What stops you from being a psychopath?

all4naija:
Some humans do that. You are bringing in psychological aspect to it and it doesn't make you more important to life than savages or brutes in the forest.