Aboki's constitute about 70% of our problems as a nation.

Ileke-IdI:


Oh you must have forgotten the multiple times you kissed my azz on posts that agreed with your ideology.

Is there anything wrong with agreeing with you if you talk sense?
I call it common sense, I don't call it kissing azz.

Onlytruth:

Is there anything wrong with agreeing with you if you talk sense?
I call it common sense, I don't call it kissing azz.

Which takes us back to your question:

Onlytruth:

And YOU ever make sense? lol

So you DO remember.

Ileke-IdI:


Which takes us back to your question:



So you DO remember.

Is that so confusing to you? lol
If you make 1000 comments and I agree with 10, can't you situate my comment?
Nna na wa for dis kain low IQ.

Anyway back to topic.

How can one explain the overdependence on oil by predominantly fundamentalist islamic states (22 arab countries).
Note that modernized Islamic states are different. Turkey is a good example. In order words, for Nigeria to ever develop, Nigeria's Muslims must copy Turkish ones.
Can that EVER happen in Nigeria? Look at our history for a cue.

This article is a pure fact!!
It really suck that some Nigeria living in advance country like USA can ever disagree with this just because they don't like the poster here! I wonder what OPEC countries of Arab and Nigeria inclusive will be like when oil will have no value! That Nigeria is better than any murtherfocker country today in this world is jst because of oil!! and with the way many countries are paying so much in research to find an alternative source of energy to oil, I just cry for country like Nigeria

I agree with the Op,
Especially on the issue of Isha-Allah fatalism as descried below:

As for[b] inshallah-fatalism,[/b] why try very very hard when, in the end, every fiber in your individual or collective being tells you that, in the end, it's all up to Allah, and he will intervene, quite inexplicably and suddenly, whenever he wants. Why try to create or accumulate wealth in societies suffused with Islam which, in any case, are subject to constant upheaval? There is constant jockeying for position in order to obtain more wealth -- such as the oil wealth available, so much more abundant than anything the Arabs themselves could possibly make. And in any case they don't try. They rely on millions of foreign, mostly Infidel, workers.

While there are some similarities between the 'Isha-Allah fatalism' of Islam and "by God's grace" craze of Christians, I believe that educational advantage plays a key role in what follows after these cliches have been expressed. The guy who is fairly educated will probably (in automaton fashion) seeks out some inculcated problem solving techniques which he has been fortunate to acquire, while the illiterate resort to his indoctrination and dogmas, or at best street-wisdom. The result of these choices clearly explains the disparity of distribution of wealth and means between the Northern Muslim and Southern Christians in Nigeria. It is the religion stup!d!

OP raises some great points.

@@@

f1-hater-ileke u are so full of hate; it just unbelieveable

however i can only guess that your only choice left

Groups with such ideology will CAGE creativity and label those with different way of life greedy and insatiable
lust for money.Such differences will make social compatibility among such contending groups difficult and it can
result in crime such as genocide and pogrom against those that are achievement driven.



Good one from OP.

Toaskarity: This article is a pure fact!!
It really suck that some Nigeria living in advance country like USA can ever disagree with this just because they don't like the poster here! I wonder what OPEC countries of Arab and Nigeria inclusive will be like when oil will have no value! That Nigeria is better than any murtherfocker country today in this world is jst because of oil!! and with the way many countries are paying so much in research to find an alternative source of energy to oil, I just cry for country like Nigeria

And that time is coming pretty soon when the demand for crude oil will drop or our oil wells will dry up. When that happens, our dear country Nigeria will be in trouble because we have chosen to stop focusing on developing other resources we have and focus solely on oil. I hate to think what will happen when the oil runs dry or is no longer in demand. Add to the fact that many western nations are closing their borders and making it unnecessarily difficult to obtain their visa. So where then will our people run to when severe poverty and resulting anarchy strikes? We better start diversifying products we export as a country and stop relying heavily on oil now but I know Nigerian ledaers will not listen until it's too late.

K'naan:
What about Iran? I would say Iran is more successful than Lebanon, Malaysia and Indonesia despite all the sanctions. And had the sanctions not been imposed, I would say Iran would be ahead of Turkey comfortably

Iran is not Arab and has never been Arab. They are a totally different people culturally and politically. The issue is probably not as simple as just religion.


@ the opening post

I have said several times in real life and on the internet that without oil, most of the Arab world would look like Yemen. And nobody wants their country to look like Yemen.

Hmm. The part that caught my interest within the article is where it stated, muslim have a mental submission to their leaders if only the leader is a muslim. Sort of gives an explanation of the election attacks, the constant boko haram attacks, born to rule mentality, and the north need to put GEJ head in a platter. Can't say much about the rest of the article but that part so far Nigerian community have proven as fact. I am not sure about Muslim nation. Op raised some interesting points

A religion and culture that promotes indolence and over-reliance on 'God' certainly will produce over meek and submission people, who sees their leaders as God-like. Such people are willing to do whatever he demands - 'God wills it!"

Now I wonder what kind of people the Hausas were culturally and economical prior to the arrival of the quoran and tesbau (?) clutching Fulanis. Perhaps this will give us and idea to what extent 'Islam' have affected their way of life - for good or bad?

I know culturally, in the days of yore, a typical Igbo is rated by the number of yam tubers in his barn. How much christianity or perhaps the civil war or both have influenced this way of live is another viable candidate for research. On the surface, I would say, he (the Igboman) have adapted quickly to the changes brought by Christianity, perhaps much more positively than given credit for.

The way I see it, a new religion can rub of positively or negatively on an existing culture. The Hausa and Igbos present a typical case study for further research!

dasparrow:

And that time is coming pretty soon when the demand for crude oil will drop or our oil wells will dry up. When that happens, our dear country Nigeria will be in trouble because we have chosen to stop focusing on developing other resources we have and focus solely on oil. I hate to think what will happen when the oil runs dry or is no longer in demand. Add to the fact that many western nations are closing their borders and making it unnecessarily difficult to obtain their visa. So where then will our people run to when severe poverty and resulting anarchy strikes? We better start diversifying products we export as a country and stop relying heavily on oil now but I know Nigerian ledaers will not listen until it's too late.

Nigeria will be worse than simalio when the time come, right now even with oil somalio is better than some part talk more of with out! This country have no other on this planet than to divide!

PhysicsQED:

Iran is not Arab and has never been Arab. They are a totally different people culturally and politically. The issue is probably not as simple as just religion.


@ the opening post

I have said several times in real life and on the internet that without oil, most of the Arab world would look like Yemen. And nobody wants their country to look like Yemen.

Read my post again. I was replying to the notion that Islamic nations have failed and those who suppressed Islam has done better. But that doesn’t example why Iran an Islamic nation is on the heels of Turkey and ahead of countries like Lebanon, Malaysia or Indonesia.

Also why only use Yemen as an example. Firstly, it better than a lot of African states than speaks volume.

Also why not use Syria, Egypt, Oman, Tunisia, Morocco or Algeria. All these nations for example, they are not Oil rich but are rather developed and modern relatively.

K'naan:


Read my post again. I was replying to the notion that Islamic nations have failed and those who suppressed Islam has done better. But that doesn’t example why Iran an Islamic nation is on the heels of Turkey and ahead of countries like Lebanon, Malaysia or Indonesia.

Also why only use Yemen as an example. Firstly, it better than a lot of African states than speaks volume.

Also why not use Syria, Egypt, Oman, Tunisia, Morocco or Algeria. All these nations for example, they are not Oil rich but are rather developed and modern relatively.

I'm aware of what your post was responding to, but I doubt that Iran is an appropriate counterexample, since there are significant differences between them and several other countries of the Muslim world that could be relevant. There are possible explanations for why Iran has done better in spite of or regardless of being Muslim. In other words, being Muslim could still be holding them back from reaching their full economic/developmental potential but other cultural and political factors could be making up for that and thus the general slant/argument of the opening article would still be valid. I'm not saying that this is necessarily the case, but we have no way of knowing whether this is or is not true.

Also, I was not really agreeing with the article (although the article is about the member countries of the Arab League, it includes some Muslim countries in its analysis that I would not really consider Arab and it also goes on to attack Islam in general). My comments were not really about Islam, but about Arabs. And what is Oman's economy centered around, if not oil and gas? The other countries you listed are not really Arab or are only partially Arab.

Onlytruth:

Is that so confusing to you? lol
If you make 1000 comments and I agree with 10, can't you situate my comment?
Nna na wa for dis kain low IQ.

Obviously, I'm conversing with a plank wood. Look up the meaning of "ever" when you get the chance. Orange and apple.
See you on our next paralleled ideology.

Probably Gov. James Ibori was a muslim. So all the christians governors from 1999 - 2007 that performed badly, they did so because they were muslims? They failed like their muslim fellow governors.

It was only Gov. Donald Duke that did the obudu ranch, one can proud of. Also chief Bisi Akande performed very well. I wonder why the traditional "leaders" in osun state stood against him for second time.

Most leaders in arab countries are usurpers not real leaders.

PhysicsQED:

Iran is not Arab and has never been Arab. They are a totally different people culturally and politically. The issue is probably not as simple as just religion.

This could be very correct. My friends from Iran always threaten to punch me when I call them Arabs. They say, "dude Iranians are persians. We are actually fought a war with the Arabs in order to retain our identity". Then they go on to explain how the US has the nasty habit of using blanket categorisation.

Also, they explain that the 'average' iranian doesn't really have a care for religion although they believe in God. They tend to be free thinkers (not neccasarily aethists). My understanding on this was that they were like Igbos with their chis. They also made me understand that for the political class, islam only serves as a political tool.


What these guys said might be generalization taken too far, however my observation of the nation seems to be congruent to their assertions.
Maybe that's why you don't hear about beheadings, terrorist attacks, amputations, stoning to death for blasphemy etc in Iran like you would in some 'islamic' jurisdictions (including the Nothern north Nigeria). Despite the warlike stance of the country.

I hate to admit that am almost on the same page with Onlytruth on this.

The facts stated by the OP looks so true in the Nigerian context.

ilugunboy: I hate to admit that am almost on the same page with Onlytruth on this.

The facts stated by the OP looks so true in the Nigerian context.

Thanks for agreeing with me for the first time! Seems I'm ONLY TRUTH afterall.

I would state one more controversial truth: Nigerian presidency should not go to far north for at least 24 years.

Power should move from SS to SE and then SW. If we can find a good educated man from Benue or Kogi, I would vote for him/her too. The key idea here is to ensure that Nigerian presidency is kept far away from extreme form of Islam for THREE two term presidencies, before we elect one from that part.

Nigeria has come a LONG WAY from 1999 thanks to Obasanjo (love him or hate him), and Jonathan (love him or hate him). If we are serious about staying together as one, then CLEAR PROGRESS MUST BE RECORDED from the current to immediate future.

The shortest way to Nigeria's disintegration is to elect a "Sanusi-esque" or "Buhari-esque" or "El rufai-esque" notherner any time soon.

Secessionists (in the south mainly) are looking for a very good reason to secede, and I would support them TOTALLY AND WHOLLY if Nigeria's presidency is returned to the core north anytime sooner.


Here I stand!

Just that the Op and the writer of the article are shallow minds. You write about Islam as if it just started existing in the last hundred years. What about the feats recorded by Islam/Muslims in its 1900 years of existence? Is Islam now limited to what happened in the recent 300 years. All the development and great things they do/did in the western world, is it up to 300 years? the good thing about the muslim world is that we are getting used to your hate and no longer care what you think about us. its your problem. We shall carry on in our way of life not minding whose ox is gored. We shall not judge our morals by your standard - like democracy.

I laugh at Africans who try to convince themselves that they are better because they are christians - just because things are looking rosy in the western world now. They want to associate and feel among but they are not. We all know if China becomes the next big world power, you will convert to Buddhism and start yogaing. One thing you guys have to understand is, the muslims who understand Islam very well, never see your advances or your civilization as greater. We have our strong points and weak points, like you do and we know them.

.

Akanbi_edu: Just that the Op and the writer of the article are shallow minds. You write about Islam as if it just started existing in the last hundred years. What about the feats recorded by Islam/Muslims in its 1900 years of existence? Is Islam now limited to what happened in the recent 300 years. All the development and great things they do/did in the western world, is it up to 300 years? the good thing about the muslim world is that we are getting used to your hate and no longer care what you think about us. its your problem. We shall carry on in our way of life not minding whose ox is gored. We shall not judge our morals by your standard - like democracy.

I laugh at Africans who try to convince themselves that they are better because they are christians - just because things are looking rosy in the western world now. They want to associate and feel among but they are not. We all know if China becomes the next big world power, you will convert to Buddhism and start yogaing. One thing you guys have to understand is, the muslims who understand Islam very well, never see your advances or your civilization as greater. We have our strong points and weak points, like you do and we know them.

How can you claim Islam has been around for 1900 years but then claim to be a Muslim?

Anyway, it is not inconceivable that a religion can be somewhat of a hindrance in making progress in some developmental areas even if it can be a blessing in other areas. That basic idea is not really that radical or new, but it can become controversial to some people when others start naming specific religions and their alleged faults.

The world is pretty much a "what have you done for me lately" sort of place.

If you've not done anything in the past 300 years, then I'm not sure what relevance stuff that you did 500, 1000, years ago is. After all, even Spain and the Netherlands were great powers 300 years ago, no?

Regarding, "just because things are looking rosy...", that is just the nature of humans. We like success and tend to avoid brands associated with failure (like Islam).

And there is nothing wrong with that...one should study and learn from those who are doing well, rather than those who are struggling. Or would you suggest to your own child that he hang out with the weak students at his school rather than associating with the strong ones?

FWIW, Chinese aren't particularly religious.

And I don't think most sensible Africans would attribute their (economic) success to their religion or yoga...but would perhaps be more interested in the economic and/or political systems used to create this success

It's very unfortunate that a thread like this never makes it to the front page. This is one of the reasons many reasonable folks have quit nairaland. Now, you have senseless thread making it to the front page.

@ post, any smart person can see what Islam has done to the middleeast vis-a-vis nigeria. Like somebody rightly said, most middleastern countries without oil will look like Yemen. Now, we can Imagine what Nigeria w'd look like without oil,,,,thanks to the north who have been practising extreem form of Islam.